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Chikenbok
07-26-2012, 12:34 AM
So there have been a plethora of decks put up here in the New and Development forum incorporating either Baleful Strix and of course, the man himself, Delver of Secrets .

In fact there is already a UB 'tempo' list running around the forums running delver, snapcaster, and big boy dreadnaught to blow opponents out of the water with a 12/12. However, the deck I am willing to propose does not rely on 2 for 1 12/12's but rather, 5/5 2cmc flyers, delvers, and baleful strix to hold the board down until the opponent cries him/herself to a game loss.

Unlike Sam Black's list that was running no 'end game' bombs (and, in my opinion did a bit too much durdling, albeit, I do love his MD reanimate), my proposed list attempts to sit and relax, stabalize the board, and resolve either a big flyer, a jace, or a liliana and close the game quickly. Using a similar spell suite as RUG, the deck capitalizes on one for ones (with the added benefit of Strix acting as both a cantrip, a body, and a removal spell) until the opponent runs out of gas, providing us with enough 'reach' to break through.

So -- The list:



//Creatures -- 14
3 Baleful Strix
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Tombstalker
2 Vendilion Clique

//Instants -- 17
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Spell Pierce
2 Spell Snare
2 Ghastly Demise
1 Go for the Throat

//P. Walkers -- 3
2 Jace, the Mind Sculpot
1 Liliana of the Veil

//Sorceries -- 6
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
2 Ponder

//Lands -- 20
1 Creeping Tar Pit
2 Island
1 Swamp
3 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Underground Sea
2 Wasteland

//Sideboard -- 15
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Pithing Needle
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Darkblast
2 Spell Snare
1 Diabolic Edict
2 Flusterstorm
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Perish



Well, that is the list I've been testing, to great success recently against most of the field.

I cut down from 4 Strix to 3 to add another snapcaster mage, and despite what people might think -- while you're only running 2 Tombstalkers the anti-synergy between to the two is almost null. I feel as though the rest of the suite is self explanatory but if anyone has any questions, I'll be quick to answer.

Matchups:

RUG Delver - fetch basics, win the game. Every creature you play (minus Snappy) matches their's, trumps theirs, or is something they can't deal with, without 2 for 1'ing themselves. 4 Spell pierce keeps their cantrips/burn out of our faces and the snares are saved for Goys or Oozes.

UW Blade/Esper Blade - Game has to get out the gate quickly, spell snare shines here as it hits snappy and SFM - their only real threats. Delver rides it to victory most games.

Miracles - I have not done enough testing to be conclusive about it but I'm still not sure how this deck manages to win games in a meta full of spell pierces and hand disruption.

Combo - The deck runs enough hand disruption, a fast enough clock, and enough counterspells to generally give combo players fits, boarding into F.storms and extra beats helps the clock out significantly.

These are the only deck's I've testing against significantly and, I must say, the deck is an absolute blast to play.

Criticism always welcome -- I'd love to develop this deck into a real powerhouse with the help of you sourcers.

Cheers,

--Alex

xfxf
07-26-2012, 05:39 AM
Hi Alex!

Nice deck and nice thread, I'm not much interested in the StifleNaught builds but I really liked Sam Black's Strix list and have been pondering similar ideas. I agree with you that the deck kind of needs a bomb or some mid to late game presence. However I don't think Tombstalker is our guy here. This deck is very reliant on the graveyard and the Snapcaster. I also think that having around 2-3 Unearths is the right way to go because Snapcaster -> Unearth -> Strix = Draw a card is amazing value. Which means you've already Unearthed Strix once (drew a card, probably also killed a guy) and you're doing it again. So Strix becomes card advantage and removal at the same time. Also the Snapcasters gain huge synergy with the rest of the deck. There's also the Unearth -> Snapcaster -> Unearth -> Strix = Value town :)

Going back to the Tombstalkers, since the deck (in my view) relies so heavily on graveyard, recursions and flashbacks removing 5-6 cards from it removes all your goodies and your card advantage. If you watched Sam's videos, in the elves match (if I'm not mistaken) his opponent brings in 4 Faerie Macabres against him and it turns out to be a very effective counter strategy against the whole dynamic of the deck. So I think the deck should focus on that dynamic but yeah it needs some presence on the board after all the little shenanigans.

Also I don't know what can be done about the Merfolks and Goblins matchups.

Edit: For a reference this was the build I tinkered with.


4 Baleful Strix
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Snapcaster Mage
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Gitaxian Probe

3 Force of Will
2 Spell Pierce

4 Cabal Therapy
1 Thoughtseize
1 Inquisition of Kozilek

2 Ghastly Demise
1 Go fo the Throat
2 Unearth


4 Underground Sea
3 Island
2 Swamp
4 Polluted Delta
2 Verdant Catacomb
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Creeping Tar Pit

HPB_Eggo
07-26-2012, 02:09 PM
I actually toyed around with a similar list not too long ago. I made it in an attempt to build a deck that would have a very solid game one against both RUG Delver and Combo. That led to some interesting choices, like MD Extirpates (not good in many matches, but great for denying RUG a color after Wasteland or denying cards to combo), but it did do its job quite well.

I'll edit the list in when I get access to it later.

Koby
07-26-2012, 03:38 PM
I played against Sacher in the SCG Las Vegas open who was piloting this deck. While it has a ton of removal and a good amount of pressure thanks to Delver, it feels that it lacks a true trump for many of the top tiered decks. I can imagine it would have a huge problem with Tribal from Merfolk and Goblins both. It felt as though a resolved Jitte also gives this deck trouble.

I think you can find the archived footage on www.blip.tv/scglive

Chikenbok
07-26-2012, 11:37 PM
I played against Sacher in the SCG Las Vegas open who was piloting this deck. While it has a ton of removal and a good amount of pressure thanks to Delver, it feels that it lacks a true trump for many of the top tiered decks. I can imagine it would have a huge problem with Tribal from Merfolk and Goblins both. It felt as though a resolved Jitte also gives this deck trouble.

I think you can find the archived footage on www.blip.tv/scglive

I saw the performance of Sacher piloting Black's deck but, as mentioned, this deck is able to resolve threats like jace and t.stalker much more efficiently than Black's/Sacher's list. Also (while it might not be my place to say) I believe that AJ had a series of misplays, putting his hand size to 0 against an opponent with an active sylvan library that cost him the games.

Of course, Koby, I take nothing against your play skill and level of playability, I just don't think AJ's list was optimized to its full potential (hence this forum).

I dunno, I'm bloody drunk as hell, going backpacking in the catskills for the weekend, however -- I'd love to come back to some innovation!

represent.

--Alex

kiblast
07-27-2012, 10:52 AM
I guess Ninja of the Deep Hours even if just one of, does crazy things in a deck packed with Snapcaster Mage and Baleful Strix.

Chikenbok
07-28-2012, 11:18 AM
I guess Ninja of the Deep Hours even if just one of, does crazy things in a deck packed with Snapcaster Mage and Baleful Strix.

I'm not sure how many cute combat tricks this deck is trying to pull out of nowhere, as, when it comes to combat almost 70% of our creatures are inferior to our opponents, minus the stalkers, of course.

However, playing with Ninja of the Deep hours would force an opponent to determine whether to trade their 'better' creature with strix, or cross their fingers and hope that we don't have the ninja in hand.

Definitely something worth testing when I get home.

Poron
07-31-2012, 08:38 AM
I love this archtype.
I think Cavern of Souls (naming Wizard) belongs here and Dark Confidant + Grim Lavamancer too

it just leaves Strix out of protection. Overall it opens to red for SB (Sulfur Elemental Red Elemental Blast)

Esper3k
08-03-2012, 03:27 PM
Just brainstorming, but has anyone considered Intuition at all? Seems nasty if you can get Snapcaster, Unearth, Strix, etc. in a little Intuition package.

I'd also love to see Life from the Loam + Volrath's Stronghold + Strix with Intuition to really get the nasty card advantage recursion going.

Poron
08-04-2012, 04:15 AM
I also like a little more aggresive, less controllish, version with Dark Confidant and obviously without Force of WillTombstalker

loses reliability but gains so much explosiveness (Strix, Confidant, Brainstorm). It just smokes..

Chikenbok
08-06-2012, 12:00 AM
Any idea of what a grixis list might look like? Seems quite interesting..

Something starting along the lines of:

3/4 Strix
3/4 Lavamancer
4 Confidant
2/4 Snapcaster Mage


+ Cavern of Souls

Esper3k
08-06-2012, 09:04 AM
I think with Grixis, you'd want to auto include Welder as well? Seems like big cheats with the Strix.

Chikenbok
08-06-2012, 12:41 PM
I think with Grixis, you'd want to auto include Welder as well? Seems like big cheats with the Strix.

I was discussing welder with my cousin last night and we both felt the deck would then have to be built much more around things like artifact lands, mox opals, tops, etc -- the grixis list after some testing last night came out pretty strong. For reference I was running something like:

4 Delver
4 Strix
4 Confidant
3 Lavamancer
2 Snapcaster

4 BS
3 Daze
3 Force
4 Pierce
4 Bolt
4 Fire//Ice -- Forked Bolt
4 Ponder

Lands

Unlike RUG Strix provides a decent out to resolved big boys and the CA engines between confidant, strix, and snappy are kind of unbelievable.

catmint
08-06-2012, 03:56 PM
How about taking the deck into an all flyer aggro direction with strix acting as a beater & a worse Silvergil adept, which helps defending the ground in a race?

Along Delver & Vendilion Clique, Oona's Prowler seems like a potent beater. Jitte and Unearth would be good in such a deck - Problem is that the instant/sorcery count would go down.