[SCD]Boros Charm

[alderon666]

This card is a major player in T2. It's modes are all pretty useful, let's look at them:
1) Boros Charm deals 4 damage to target player: wins games.
2) or permanents you control are indestructible this turn: counters Wasteland, Pernicious Deed, combat trick, etc.
3) or target creature gains double strike until end of turn: adds damage if you control a 5+ power creature or can be used as combat trick.

Problems: The top removal in Legacy are Swords to Plowshare/Bolt/Abrupt Decay, and Boros Charm is effective against only 2 of those. It's very marginal against Bolt as it costs only one mana and it's an instant. But it is splendid against Pernicious Deed and other mass removal as the greater mana cost let's you set up your game and leave RW open for the charm.

I'd like to discuss to discuss the useful of the charm in affinity. It solves the old "Destroy all your permanents problem" that cards like Deed posed. While having 2 aggressive modes. Affinity has Cranial Plating that along with double strike can end games very quickly and maybe even the good old Ravager. The 4 damage to the face is okay in any aggresive deck.

What you guys think?

[Barook]

The 4 damage to the face can also be used to kill Planeswalkers. Very useful indeed.

I'm not sure about Affinity, though, as you have run red and white, two rather less stellar colors for the deck.

[alderon666]

Yeah, some UWR with Delver and Geist could be good. It does extra work keeping Geist alive and making it not trade against x/2 creatures.

[DLifshitz]

This card is a major player in T2. It's modes are all pretty useful, let's look at them:
1) Boros Charm deals 4 damage to target player: wins games.
2) or permanents you control are indestructible this turn: counters Wasteland, Pernicious Deed, combat trick, etc.
3) or target creature gains double strike until end of turn: adds damage if you control a 5+ power creature or can be used as combat trick.

What you guys think?

In Legacy, one would play it in order to use the first mode almost all of the time, which implies some sort of Boros Deck Wins shell. The second and third modes are only situationally useful. I'm not an expert on Burn but it seems to me that splashing a second color would make the deck worse by opening you up to Stifle and Wasteland. Burn wants to play as few lands as possible, so that's a serious concern.

[Shawon]

I'm not sure about Affinity, though, as you have run red and white, two rather less stellar colors for the deck.


White is not so bad. I used to shit on white and Stoneforge Mystic in the Affinity thread. I would say that Green is the absolute worst color in Affinity.

@Boros Charm in Affinity:

The problem with Boros Charm is that it does so little for such a restrictive mana cost. It's just a little trick that doesn't really win the game on its own. Look at Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas, which is hands down the best multicolored card available to Affinity. It costs :2::u::b:, but Tezzeret also can single-handedly win games, so it is worth the risk of having trouble to find mana to cast him or play around taxing effects (or Daze).

Furthermore, Affinity has a shaky manabase. It's hard enough to get the single color you want when your manabase is more vulnerable than most Legacy decks. And like Barook said, red isn't really a stellar color in Affinity. Red does give you Galvanic Blast, which by the way seems like a better card than Boros Charm if you're splashing red.

Personally speaking, I find the best solution against Deed is Spell Pierce. It's a extremely versatile card against control decks, and it has obvious applications towards Combo. Even if your opponent knows you have it, it doesn't mean they can easily play around it if your board position is forcing them to make drastic measures with limited mana and time.

I'm lying, clearly the best solution against Deed is Tezzeret making Darksteel Citadel into an INDESTRUCTIBLE 5/5 LAND ARTIFACT CREATURE. TRY DEEDING THAT..... BIIIIIIIAAAAATTCCCH!

[rufus]

...
Furthermore, Affinity has a shaky manabase. It's hard enough to get the single color you want when your manabase is more vulnerable than most Legacy decks. And like Barook said, red isn't really a stellar color in Affinity. Red does give you Galvanic Blast, which by the way seems like a better card than Boros Charm if you're splashing red...

And Shrapnel Blast may also be better.

Of course, Kiln Fiend and Immolating Souleater would both work very nicely with Boros Charm and the various blasts.

[Malchar]

It's nice that the 4 damage kills a liliana of the veil after they give her +1; the inability to do so was one of lightning bolt's biggest failings. I think that all the modes are plenty strong enough, but the main strike against it are the color requirements. I'm not sure if a deck exists which can fully take advantage of it aside from the obvious ones like zoo and burn.

[alderon666]

Yeah, Tezzeret is about the best card in affinity. Don't think it's worth dropping it for the charm.

But I don't feel that the charm is good enough to play on other aggro decks like Zoo or Burn. The indestructable mode is too marginal in a world of Plowshares and Snapcaster and rarely you see a creature with 5+ power. As I said, maybe on UWR Delver. Seems to pretty in line with the whole plan of Delver/Geist/Bolt. I'll suggest in their thread.

[TsumiBand]

What this really means, is someone needs to man up and build a version of Holy Tommy Gun that doesn't suck. NOT TROLLING.

Ok srs though. Would rather see this in 3-color Delver than Affinity, although it would be hilarious to target a 12-power Thopter with the third ability.

Unsrs though, I will now be playing Holy Tommy Gun with Sacred Foundry technology at the next Legacy event I find. :| <--super serious face

[Mr. Safety]

I love it in Zoo, especially in a metagame full of mono-chrome decks thereby making your Price of Progress slots useless.

It's a PW killer (Jace, Lilana), it is efficient damage (4 for 2), and it saves Zoo's 3-color mana-base from being raped. Not usually an issue for Zoo, but it happens.

Is it a 4-of? No, I don't think so. But I like 2 copies, especially since my meta-game is full of mono-chromes.

[Final Fortune]

White is not so bad. I used to shit on white and Stoneforge Mystic in the Affinity thread. I would say that Green is the absolute worst color in Affinity.

!

IDK about that, Tarmogoyf and especially Sylvan Library are pretty decent in Affinity fwiw.

[Shawon]

IDK about that, Tarmogoyf and especially Sylvan Library are pretty decent in Affinity fwiw.

Certainly good cards in Jund or UGx Tempo, but not in Affinity. If you want to discuss this further, we can continue this discussion in the Affinity thread.

[Mr. Safety]

Master of Etherium and Arcbound Ravager are the Goyfs for Affinity...at least they used to be.

[wcm8]

This card helps push Boros towards being an actual deck. It's obviously a lot better in Modern, but the card's utility makes it a useful choice in Legacy as well.

[twndomn]

Team Italia is about the only place.

You use it to protect your SFM/Batterskull/DC, 4 damages FTW. Double Strike is almost never relevant, unless you intend to kill a Goyf with a DC blocking.

[Zombie]

Gain extra life with Batterskull?

[alderon666]

Too bad Terminus is the "big bad wolf" mass removal of the format. Otherwise it could be good in goblins. Double strike your unblocked Piledriver also sounds fun.

[nedleeds]

Instead of name dropping existing decks you could ... you know ... make a new deck with boros charm in it :really:

[alderon666]

Instead of name dropping existing decks you could ... you know ... make a new deck with boros charm in it :really:

Boros Charm is not a card you build a deck around. Unless you plan on going off with Reckoner on Legacy.... LOL!

We all can see it's a powerful card, but I think that the final veredict is that it's not good/useful enough for Legacy.

[Malakai]

In goblins it gives you:

Much needed reach.
The ability to save your guys when attacking into larger creatures, e.g. vs. Jund.
Turn 2 doublestrike your Goblin Lackey.


Card does work. White was pretty much already the best splash color for Goblins, too. (go go gadget Thalia).

[TsumiBand]

In goblins it gives you:

Much needed reach.
The ability to save your guys when attacking into larger creatures, e.g. vs. Jund.
Turn 2 doublestrike your Goblin Lackey.


Card does work. White was pretty much already the best splash color for Goblins, too. (go go gadget Thalia).

Doesn't Legion Loyalist take care of a lot of this incidentally though, without requiring a splash and working with the already-present Goblin synergy?

Reach; attained via first-strike and trample, plus the effect of either multiple Lords and/or just controlling a Piledriver.
Guy-saving; again, first-strike + power will make this a non-issue, except where the blocker has its own first strike. But saving Goblins from damage in an alpha strike was never THAT critical in my experience, especially if SCG is in play. Krenko can CYA a little bit in this regard too; Goblins are dying? Fuck it, make more.
It definitely does not do double-strike. But double-strike is generally just a Cool Thing. Although I see the benefit of a double-striking Lackey/Piledriver.

At any rate, it feels like the new one-drop Goblin just does a lot of these things already, even if in a roundabout way, although if we're talking like Pernicious Deed effects and whatnot, obviously Boros Charm is going to stop that outright.

[nedleeds]

Boros Charm is not a card you build a deck around. Unless you plan on going off with Reckoner on Legacy.... LOL!

We all can see it's a powerful card, but I think that the final veredict is that it's not good/useful enough for Legacy.

It has been the last 2 weeks ... but whatever ... I mean the jury has spoken and the verdict is in :confused:

[slikwilly]

Instead of name dropping existing decks you could ... you know ... make a new deck with boros charm in it :really:

I wouldn't suggest taking this deck to an Open w/o some serious work to shore up combo matchups, but I posted a deck (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?25490-Suit-up!) over in the New & Developmental section and have been doing well with it locally. Boros Charm is half the reason I built it. The deck is basically Boros Stoneblade. Having a ton of maindeck removal (4 STP, 4 Lightning Bolt, 1 Galvanic Blast) is very good against all the "fair" decks, then land a Stoneforge and beat them up w/ a Batterskull.

The thread is Suit Up! (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?25490-Suit-up!)

[Malakai]

Doesn't Legion Loyalist take care of a lot of this incidentally though, without requiring a splash and working with the already-present Goblin synergy?

Reach; attained via first-strike and trample, plus the effect of either multiple Lords and/or just controlling a Piledriver.
Guy-saving; again, first-strike + power will make this a non-issue, except where the blocker has its own first strike. But saving Goblins from damage in an alpha strike was never THAT critical in my experience, especially if SCG is in play. Krenko can CYA a little bit in this regard too; Goblins are dying? Fuck it, make more.
It definitely does not do double-strike. But double-strike is generally just a Cool Thing. Although I see the benefit of a double-striking Lackey/Piledriver.

At any rate, it feels like the new one-drop Goblin just does a lot of these things already, even if in a roundabout way, although if we're talking like Pernicious Deed effects and whatnot, obviously Boros Charm is going to stop that outright.

This is a joke, right? You are trolling me?
First strike and trample are not reach. They're not even close to being reach.
How does this guy save your stuff from Supreme Verdict, or Deed, or Bolt, or Abrupt Decay? Boros Charm can even save a land or a vial if that's what you need.
Double-strike on a lackey on turn 2 is going to win most games. It won't happen often, but the nice thing about that is the card has two other relevant abilities. And, as you mentioned, double-striking a Piledriver is some good.

Legion Loyalist seems like a fine inclusion in the deck, but it does completely different things.

Do I think the card is an auto-include? Not by a long shot. But I definitely think it is good enough for goblins players to at least test.