Speculate: What prices will go up and what will go down?

[KobeBryan]

After this new rules change.

my guess for going up.

1. jace
2. vendillion clique
3. jitte
4. thespian stage
5. dark depths

down
1. griselbrand
2. emrukhal

[ivanpei]

I think the primary gainer is Dark Depths, it can be splashed in like every single colour and tutored with Expedition Map which is also colourless.

[UnsungHero]

Flagstones? Mox Opal? Gaeas Cradle? Liliana?

Pretty much legendary that was once bad in multiples will probably go up.

[TommyTopdecker]

IMHO, most of the cards you listed are arguably not much better than they were a few hours ago.

Much better:

1. Depths
2. Stage

Much worse:

1. Phyrexian Metamorph

I don't follow the logic that Jace, Jitte, etc. are much more useful than before. Often times, pwning your opponent's ____ (insert legend here) is preferred over landing your own. Yes, you can get double Jace activations, double Clique triggers, etc... but those usually aren't very strong plays.

[Megadeus]

Good thing I have a Russian Thespians Stage! :cool:

[feline]

Lets watch:
http://ark42.com/mtg/pricehistory.php?q=liliana+of+the+veil&d=0

Current Prices of 10 cards to note in relation to the changes: date ~May 22nd 2013

Liliana of the Veil: 50$
Jace the Mind Sculptor: 150$
Karakas: 120$
Vendilion Clique: 55$
Emrakul: 35$
Griselbrand: 18$
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben: 4$
Gaea's Cradle: 120$
Mox Opal: 30$
Flagstones of Trokair: 7$

Lets see the prices in 3 days / 2 weeks

[KobeBryan]

Lets watch:
http://ark42.com/mtg/pricehistory.php?q=liliana+of+the+veil&d=0

Current Prices of some cards to note in relation to the changes: date ~May 22nd 2013

Liliana of the Veil: 50$
Jace the Mind Sculptor: 150$
Karakas: 120$
Vendilion Clique: 55$
Emrakul: 35$
Griselbrand: 18$
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben: 4$
Gaea's Cradle: 120$
Mox Opal: 30$

Lets see the prices in 3 days / 2 weeks

dont' forget dark depths and thespian stage.

[Pascal3000]

dont' forget dark depths and thespian stage.

Why would those cards care AT ALL about the changes? Dark Depths doesnt get one bit better... Dark Depths werent being legendruled by opponents before and having the ability to replace one DD with another is also not an upside on DD, compared to cradle for example...
Thespian Stage got worse cause you cant kill Academy Ruins and Karakas with it anymore and theres no added upside unless you combine it with cradle, which is just not worth it. Both of these cards arent affected by the changes in the slightest...

[Megadeus]

Why would those cards care AT ALL about the changes? Dark Depths doesnt get one bit better... Dark Depths werent being legendruled by opponents before and having the ability to replace one DD with another is also not an upside on DD, compared to cradle for example...
Thespian Stage got worse cause you cant kill Academy Ruins and Karakas with it anymore and theres no added upside unless you combine it with cradle, which is just not worth it. Both of these cards arent affected by the changes in the slightest...

Thespian Stage + Dark Depths is now a combo that creates a 20/20. That is a reason that the prices of these matter.

[Julian23]

Let's face is: Green now has the best Dark Ritual in the game. 4 Gaea's Cradle in Elves all the way!

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Why would those cards care AT ALL about the changes? Dark Depths doesnt get one bit better... Dark Depths werent being legendruled by opponents before and having the ability to replace one DD with another is also not an upside on DD, compared to cradle for example...
Thespian Stage got worse cause you cant kill Academy Ruins and Karakas with it anymore and theres no added upside unless you combine it with cradle, which is just not worth it. Both of these cards arent affected by the changes in the slightest...

Think about what happens when you use Thespian's Stage to copy Dark Depths. Once you realize what's going on, you'll understand exactly why it's going to go up.

[ivanpei]

Why would those cards care AT ALL about the changes? Dark Depths doesnt get one bit better... Dark Depths werent being legendruled by opponents before and having the ability to replace one DD with another is also not an upside on DD, compared to cradle for example...
Thespian Stage got worse cause you cant kill Academy Ruins and Karakas with it anymore and theres no added upside unless you combine it with cradle, which is just not worth it. Both of these cards arent affected by the changes in the slightest...

Urr, Thespian Stage combos with Dark Depths so make a 20/20. It's basically a colourless land based combo.

[Barook]

With the Flagstone change, I can see Dust Bowl rising as well since running 4 Flagstones has become alot better.

And everybody loves "free" (assuming you have 4 mana) Wasteland uses.

[Lemnear]

1. Cradle (It's Not Elves-exclusive)
2. Liliana of the Veil (Even more)
3. Mox Opal (affinity, Storm Combo)
4. Dark Depths (See 5)
5. Thespian's Stage (See 4)
6. Karakas
7. vendilion Clique
8. phantasmal Image (Pure win with/against Cliques/Emrakul/Griselbrand/S&T/Stoneforge-mirror/Geist)

all up

[Humphrey]

I dont expect to see prices change much. But Jitte will be even worse :(

[Spigore]

1. Cradle (It's Not Elves-exclusive)
2. Liliana of the Veil (Even more)
3. Mox Opal (affinity, Storm Combo)
4. Dark Depths (See 5)
5. Thespian's Stage (See 4)
6. Karakas
7. vendilion Clique
8. phantasmal Image (Pure win with/against Cliques/Emrakul/Griselbrand/S&T/Stoneforge-mirror/Geist)

all up

I think these will be the cards which will go up indeed. I honestly don't see these cards double their current value though.

[JanoschEausH]

I don't want to imagine those upcoming ugly Jitte wars. I guess in that respect - Abrupt Decay becomes even more important against any Deck packing SFM.

[bruizar]

Clique is going to go up. It was already on the rise and will rise even more. Gaea's Cradle risks getting banned. Depths / Stage is going to be relevant for MUD. Sol Lands activate Thespian Stage quicker, and Crucible of Worlds mean that you can keep summoning 20/20's regardless of StP. Regular decks can't really afford to run lands that don't tap for mana. That combo might also be relevant for turbo emrakul but I am not knowledgable enough about that deck. What I do know is that Thespian Stage can copy locus, and that it runs expedition map, so splashing a Dark Depths seems to fit the plan of 'get big guy into play quickly'.

[Gheizen64]

Clique is going to go up. It was already on the rise and will rise even more. Gaea's Cradle risks getting banned. Depths / Stage is going to be relevant for MUD. Sol Lands activate Thespian Stage quicker, and Crucible of Worlds mean that you can keep summoning 20/20's regardless of StP. Regular decks can't really afford to run lands that don't tap for mana. That combo might also be relevant for turbo emrakul but I am not knowledgable enough about that deck. What I do know is that Thespian Stage can copy locus, and that it runs expedition map, so splashing a Dark Depths seems to fit the plan of 'get big guy into play quickly'.

That would be unfortunate. Cradle is really one of the most iconic cards... If elves come back in full force i'll dust off my Lava Darts i guess.

Emmy's going to go down a bit. SnT him into a Clone will be the worst thing ever.

[joven]

The Dark Depths combo with Thespian's Stage is heavy!

I currently see mainly the following going up:


Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Liliana of the Veil
Dark Depths
Thespian's Stage
Gaea's Cradle


Phyrexian Metamorph might go down a little bit, but it is already in relatively low prices, so it doesn't matter.

EDIT: Vesuva doesn't work.

[JanoschEausH]

That would be unfortunate. Cradle is really one of the most iconic cards... If elves come back in full force i'll dust off my Lava Darts i guess.

Emmy's going to go down a bit. SnT him into a Clone will be the worst thing ever.

Thats not possible. The Clone can't copy Emrakul if both enter the battlefield through the same SnT.

[Erdvermampfa]

By giving predictions on how these cards might change in price your subtly expressing your consent on how they are inevitably getting more expensive whereby your making it further easier to certain people to legitimate the raise in price by citing the 'increased demand', even though there's no significantly higher demand than before.

Think about it.

[joven]

Emmy's going to go down a bit. SnT him into a Clone will be the worst thing ever.

I guess you mean "into a second Emrakul", which is now worse than before for the SnT player because its opponent gets to attack first, right?

[Barook]

Isn't it a bit early to call Cradle ban-worthy? Sure, it got a major upgrade and is fucking stupid with Crop Rotation, but I would at least wait for actual test results.

Dark Depths combo sounds sexy, but the token still dies to STP, bounce and potentially Edict effects (Jace and Liliana say hi!) and especially Karakas - and all of the latter cards got also a major boost with the rule change.

Edit: Ok, Planeswalkers not so much, since it can be used at instant speed EoT.

[(nameless one)]

I can see Show and Tell going down in price.

Picture this:

Show and Tell Mirror: you resolve a Show and Tell and try to cheat Emrakul on the field. Only that your opponent does the same and cheats his/her own Emrakul. I don't play the deck so I don't know how to pilot against the mirror but if something like that was pulled off, you'd be dead next turn against your opponent's Emrakul and there's nothing you can do about it. Sure you can have an Emrakul face off but you still have to face the annihilator 6.

[raudo]

Just ordered 4 x near mint Dark Depths $15.5 each. Setting up Stage-Depths combo sounds really good and easy in Maverick.

[HPB_Eggo]

On first glance through the list of legendary lands, Gemstone Caverns seems like it might get a tiny price bump. Some Modern decks might enjoy the ability to get two mana from lands on turn one, and the drawback of drawing one while you're going off doesn't really exist because you can still get a mana out of the second one if you haven't played a land for the turn.

Not the most amazing thing ever, but enough to see it get above its current dollar price tag.

I'd also expect to see Vesuva going up. IIRC, it should do the same thing as Stage, without the mana but requiring Depths to already be on the field.

Also also, Wasteland will go up in accordance to the popularity of the Dark Depths combo. If it ends up in every deck, Wasteland will definitely see more play and go up in price.

[ivanpei]

Dark Stage won't be in every deck because Thespian Stage is a colourless land. It's best run in a deck that is mono coloured, dual coloured or even mono brown (MUD). MUD can run 4 Thespian Stage as just random brown lands and play a few copies of Depths with 4X Expedition map as a tutor. The deck needs a huge tweak (dropping Chalice) to make this work and I'm not sure its worth it.

The 2 decks/colour combinations I see doing well with stage is GW Maverick and GB Dark Stage Combo. The combo is stupidly easy to splash into the Mav deck and KOTR already is a built in Tutor. Green also gives you Crop Rotation for the extra tutor power. White gives you Mother of Runes which is a pretty good protection piece. Also, the Mav deck still has a primary plan of hate bears and smashing face. Dark Stage is just a back up plan to break ground stalls or to Auto Win out of nowhere.

GB Dark Stage is a dedicated combo deck with Thoughtseize, Inquistion of Kozilek, Deathrites, Bob, Goyf, Abrupt decay etc. It's GB good stuff but with Crop Rotation, Urborg and Dark Depths/Thespian's Stage. This deck has been around as the default legacy dark depths deck, but now Living Wish & Vampire Hexmage can be dropped because crop rotation is just much better. The deck definitely got stronger with the ruling change.

[bruizar]

Dark Stage won't be in every deck because Thespian Stage is a colourless land. It's best run in a deck that is mono coloured, dual coloured or even mono brown (MUD). MUD can run 4 Thespian Stage as just random brown lands and play a few copies of Depths with 4X Expedition map as a tutor. The deck needs a huge tweak (dropping Chalice) to make this work and I'm not sure its worth it.

The 2 decks/colour combinations I see doing well with stage is GW Maverick and GB Dark Stage Combo. The combo is stupidly easy to splash into the Mav deck and KOTR already is a built in Tutor. Green also gives you Crop Rotation for the extra tutor power. White gives you Mother of Runes which is a pretty good protection piece. Also, the Mav deck still has a primary plan of hate bears and smashing face. Dark Stage is just a back up plan to break ground stalls or to Auto Win out of nowhere.

GB Dark Stage is a dedicated combo deck with Thoughtseize, Inquistion of Kozilek, Deathrites, Bob, Goyf, Abrupt decay etc. It's GB good stuff but with Crop Rotation, Urborg and Dark Depths/Thespian's Stage. This deck has been around as the default legacy dark depths deck, but now Living Wish & Vampire Hexmage can be dropped because crop rotation is just much better. The deck definitely got stronger with the ruling change.

I don't think it needs a huge tweak at all. You can just run 2 or max 3 dark depths, without relying on expedition map. Thespian Stage can copy City of Traitors which is sort of neat.

[apple713]

For those of you who don't play show and tell but are speculating.. This won't effect show and tell. Games that are won in the mirror are won with through the breach and sneak attack because show and tell sucks.

[dontbiteitholmes]

8. phantasmal Image (Pure win with/against Cliques/Emrakul/Griselbrand/S&T/Stoneforge-mirror/Geist)

all up

Stoneforge is not legendary?
The best use of Image before was killing troublesome Legends, I don't see how this ruling makes it any better of a card.

[PirateKing]

Anyone think Notion Thief will spike?

The argument always was that JTMS was the best answer to an opponent's JTMS, but now that that is no longer the case, Notion Thief looks a lot better.

[Lemnear]

Stoneforge is not legendary?
The best use of Image before was killing troublesome Legends, I don't see how this ruling makes it any better of a card.

I was highlighting it's vertisility

[Lord Seth]

Emmy's going to go down a bit. SnT him into a Clone will be the worst thing ever.Only if you have some way to get the Clone into play at Instant speed after they cast Show and Tell (you can't copy Emrakul with the Clone if you put it into play with Show and Tell). Otherwise it's worse. Before they could Show and Tell and you could cast the Clone next turn to destroy it, but now you can cast the clone, get an Emrakul...and still have to deal with a swing from Emrakul before you can attack with your own.

Though if you have an Instant speed way to get the Clone into play (e.g. Aethar Vial), then it is worse for the Show and Tell player because you can untap and attack with your Emrakul clone next turn.

[Megadeus]

Not sure if it has been said yet our not. Mox Opals are 40 and geist of saint traft has already gone up as well

[Tammit67]

I can see Show and Tell going down in price.

Picture this:

Show and Tell Mirror: you resolve a Show and Tell and try to cheat Emrakul on the field. Only that your opponent does the same and cheats his/her own Emrakul. I don't play the deck so I don't know how to pilot against the mirror but if something like that was pulled off, you'd be dead next turn against your opponent's Emrakul and there's nothing you can do about it. Sure you can have an Emrakul face off but you still have to face the annihilator 6.

Time to that mono blue version that doesn't fuck around then. Or just not cast it in the mirror

[TraxDaMax]

Isn't it a bit early to call Cradle ban-worthy? Sure, it got a major upgrade and is fucking stupid with Crop Rotation, but I would at least wait for actual test results.

Dark Depths combo sounds sexy, but the token still dies to STP, bounce and potentially Edict effects (Jace and Liliana say hi!) and especially Karakas - and all of the latter cards got also a major boost with the rule change.

Edit: Ok, Planeswalkers not so much, since it can be used at instant speed EoT.

I agree. Cradle isn't more broke then what is already possible.

[Megadeus]

Cradle at 150 SCG

[JanoschEausH]

Cradle at 150 SCG

No sane person buys from SCG. Why even bother naming their absurd prices?

[danyul]

Because those numbers reflect how people measure the relative value of their cards. You may not agree with the specific numerical value, but regardless of what the number is, when it goes up or down it means something. That meaning, separate from the number, is what we are interested in here. Cmon People!

[bruizar]

No sane person from scg? I find it rather hard to grasp that they employ as many people as they do, and host the number of events they do. The money has to come from someone. Are you implying that most people are not sane? Or are you implying that you're cheap.

[joven]

Because those numbers reflect how people measure the relative value of their cards. You may not agree with the specific numerical value, but regardless of what the number is, when it goes up or down it means something. That meaning, separate from the number, is what we are interested in here. Cmon People!

Hm, isn't this kind of thinking part of the problem, letting SCG dictate prices? Why not just ignore SCG and instead look at the open market? It seems to me that SCG has arbitrarily raised prizes several times in the past well knowing that most prices for top magic cards will stick.

[danyul]

Sure. And people should recycle too. And *everybody* should probably vote. And I should probably go to sleep instead of lurking this forum when I have work tomorrow. You can't beat the Hive Mind. :rimshot:

And yeah, maybe SCG has been manipulative with pricing in the past. I don't know that for sure, but it seems to be the general consensus, whatever that means. BUT, in this specific instance, like 24 hours after everybody on this forum declared "Wow, Cradle is really good now", suddenly the price of Cradle goes up. I would argue that, in this specific instance, that is not price manipulation. That is actually Cradle being better than it was a week ago.

People who hate on SCG forget that this format was a goddamn deserted wasteland before the Open Series came around. I'm not saying that gives SCG a license to be sneaky with prices, if in fact that is what they are doing (and I don't know either way), BUT, you kids should probably quit swatting at the hand that feeds you.

Edit - also, I'm not very smart. I'm a legit dumbass, but isn't the open market kinda like a high stakes poker table? Can't the chip leader kinda bully the players with less capital? You guys love capitalism right? Well, isn't this part of it? Let me remind you that I'm dumb.

[bruizar]

sure. And people should recycle too. And *everybody* should probably vote. And i should probably go to sleep instead of lurking this forum when i have work tomorrow. You can't beat the hive mind. :rimshot:

And yeah, maybe scg has been manipulative with pricing in the past. I don't know that for sure, but it seems to be the general consensus, whatever that means. But, in this specific instance, like 24 hours after everybody on this forum declared "wow, cradle is really good now", suddenly the price of cradle goes up. I would argue that, in this specific instance, that is not price manipulation. That is actually cradle being better than it was a week ago.

People who hate on scg forget that this format was a goddamn deserted wasteland before the open series came around. I'm not saying that gives scg a license to be sneaky with prices, if in fact that is what they are doing (and i don't know either way), but, you kids should probably quit swatting at the hand that feeds you.

Edit - also, i'm not very smart. I'm a legit dumbass, but isn't the open market kinda like a high stakes poker table? Can't the chip leader kinda bully the players with less capital? You guys love capitalism right? Well, isn't this part of it? Let me remind you that i'm dumb.

qft
<3

[Megadeus]

Right. Even thOugh it is obviously a high price, it is a trend setting source. Averages on TCG and ebay have jumped drastically as well

[funyun45]

1) SCG's prices are demonstrably higher than most other reputable vendors'.

2) SCG does a lot to keep Legacy going.

3) SCG prices are indeed relevant to determining the market's evaluation of a card, because SCG is the most visible vendor and, despite 1, people still buy from them (i.e. people are not rational consumers).

4) The truth of 2 and 3 have no impact on the truth of 1, so pointing them out does not make 1 false.

5) People shouldn't get so butthurt over it being pointed out to them that they buy cards at inflated prices.

[Koby]

Fact of the matter is that Cradle has been underpriced for much longer than everyone assumed it was. I remember being able to buy them for $30 no less than 18 months ago. That was an indication that they are indeed:
1) Reserve Listed
2) Provide insane amount of mana with an easy pre-condition
3) Have massive casual appeal

Needless to say, now that everyone realized it's the bee's knees; everyone is going bananas to pick them up. People who knew it was good picked them up long ago.

[MPL]

I haven't been playing Magic in ages and purely by chance discovered the Cradle craze. I do own some, but I have no idea how the MTG cards market works at all, would you say I should hold onto them for a while longer or sell them now? Being short on money would make having some extra really nice.

Sorry for asking this personal question, but people here appear to know what they are talking about.

[Lemnear]

I haven't been playing Magic in ages and purely by chance discovered the Cradle craze. I do own some, but I have no idea how the MTG cards market works at all, would you say I should hold onto them for a while longer or sell them now? Being short on money would make having some extra really nice.

Sorry for asking this personal question, but people here appear to know what they are talking about.

The madness right begun. I expect it to climax in about 6 weeks

[Mr Miagi]

The madness right begun. I expect it to climax in about 6 weeks

The hours is later than you think: https://www.magiccardmarket.eu/Gaeas_Cradle_Judge_Rewards_Promos.c1p17593.prod
trololololo

[Lemnear]

The hours is later than you think: https://www.magiccardmarket.eu/Gaeas_Cradle_Judge_Rewards_Promos.c1p17593.prod
trololololo

Yesterday there were about 9 left. I don't care having 4 Judge foils. May I sell those for 400€ per piece now lol

[nedleeds]

I'd also expect to see Vesuva going up. IIRC, it should do the same thing as Stage, without the mana but requiring Depths to already be on the field.


Good call ... you go buy yourself 100 Vesuvas. Or you could RTFC and save yourself some cash.

[HPB_Eggo]

Good call ... you go buy yourself 100 Vesuvas. Or you could RTFC and save yourself some cash.

Since bashing people for speculation they post after three hours of sleep is totally going to earn you props...

Oh, wait, it's the Internet. Totally will.

More on-topic, I'm starting to think a handful of useful tutor cards are going to see a slight price bump. Crop Rotation, in particular, might see a bump to get over a dollar or so because it can help with chaining Cradles or grabbing DD/Stage.

[Koby]

Since bashing people for speculation they post after three hours of sleep is totally going to earn you props...

Oh, wait, it's the Internet. Totally will.

More on-topic, I'm starting to think a handful of useful tutor cards are going to see a slight price bump. Crop Rotation, in particular, might see a bump to get over a dollar or so because it can help with chaining Cradles or grabbing DD/Stage.

Shit maybe even Knight of the Reliquary, and then you could add fetchlands to make her bigger, and GSZ to find her; and not too long after that you're playing Maverick.
This does not bode well.

[HPB_Eggo]

Shit maybe even Knight of the Reliquary, and then you could add fetchlands to make her bigger, and GSZ to find her; and not too long after that you're playing Maverick.
This does not bode well.

Since Maverick is clearly the only deck interested in tutoring for lands...

Good job reminding me how these forums can be a great source of useful and constructive criticism, though.

[bruizar]

There is already talk of using KOTR in the sideboard of 43 lands.

[Koby]

Since Maverick is clearly the only deck interested in tutoring for lands...

Good job reminding me how these forums can be a great source of useful and constructive criticism, though.

This is a speculation thread. Not a strategy thread. Learn the difference.

[bruizar]

More on-topic, I'm starting to think a handful of useful tutor cards are going to see a slight price bump. Crop Rotation, in particular, might see a bump to get over a dollar or so because it can help with chaining Cradles or grabbing DD/Stage.

@Koby: Is that not speculation?

[Koby]

@Koby: Is that not speculation?

Sure it is. *pats on head* I don't disagree with the line of logic. Not sure what Eggo was expecting as useful criticism to an intuitive train of thought.

[bruizar]

I think he has a very valid point. I have looked at Time of Need, Crop Rotation, Expedition Map, Weathered Wayfarer and Knight of the Reliquary myself. The increase might not be gigantic, but this is the right thread for this. Foil Crop Rotation might see a substantial increase due to increased applications in elves.dec.

[Megadeus]

Foil rotations are 20 right now. I dont know if that is what they have always been at or not tho9ugh. I guess for a niche legacy/edh playable from urzas block its fine?

[nedleeds]

Modern seems to swing card prices, % wise at least as much as Legacy. Especially when a GP or PTQ season rolls through. With the legend rule changes some of the Kamigawa block dragons might actually be worth reanimating and messing with. Yosei in particular. Some others would be Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth. I'd also think Liliana will either be a $100 card by Thanksgiving or get banned in Modern.

[Megadeus]

Modern seems to swing card prices, % wise at least as much as Legacy. Especially when a GP or PTQ season rolls through. With the legend rule changes some of the Kamigawa block dragons might actually be worth reanimating and messing with. Yosei in particular. Some others would be Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth. I'd also think Liliana will either be a $100 card by Thanksgiving or get banned in Modern.

Urborg seems sweet. A WB Pox Zombies deck seems sweet with hard to cast triple black in Geralfs Messenger

[HPB_Eggo]

Sure it is. *pats on head* I don't disagree with the line of logic. Not sure what Eggo was expecting as useful criticism to an intuitive train of thought.

If it was intuitive, there was no need for criticism? Not to mention you weren't criticizing, you were being pointlessly antagonistic in response to an on-topic post containing an idea not already present in the thread.


Foil rotations are 20 right now. I dont know if that is what they have always been at or not though. I guess for a niche legacy/edh playable from urzas block its fine?

Looking around it seems closer to $15, but if memory serves - I bought one for an EDH deck a little over a month ago - that's about where they've been for a while. A bit over $1 for the normal and $20 for the foil seems like it might be in store in the near future, but I'm guessing it will be slower to go up than a lot of the other cards mentioned and won't go up much further than that.

Time lag for price increase on complements and all that jazz.

[Megadeus]

I usually quote SCG prices. Sure sometimes they are horrifically over priced, but as far as the retail area they usually are trend setters. Ebay is just anoying to look at all of the recent sales

[HPB_Eggo]

I usually quote SCG prices. Sure sometimes they are horrifically over priced, but as far as the retail area they usually are trend setters. Ebay is just anoying to look at all of the recent sales

I usually just look at TCGPlayer if I want an overview of prices. Maybe not the best aggregator in the world, but they do a decent enough job.

You are spot on with the SCG prices, but I usually shop around a lot to get lower prices - obviously never from SCG - so I can't be sure if the price has risen recently or no.

[Megadeus]

I don't shop from SCG most of the time. But they are my go to price guys. Also Avacyn Angel of Hope is up to 18... indestructible board is busted in legacy right? :p

[Dan Turner]

I use www.blacklotusproject.com to get a good idea of ebay prices. I find them a little better the MOTL when it comes to price trends and you can see the last 3 years on most cards as well.

I use Star City for trading since it is a price guide our whole group agrees on and it is what local LGS's use for pricing.

I buy from strike zone, troll & toad and star city sometimes. I do a lot of purchases via Amazon since they are closest to ebay averages then most other sites