[Deck] 8Tezz.dec - UB Tezzeret

[That nice guy]

The best thing about Karn is that you can drop Red, add more artifact lands and 2 opals, add 2 walking ballista over random deluge, and then the deck becomes very smooth. You don't need the bridge as much if you can produce an army. The only issue I'm having in my testing is having blue cards to pitch to force after sidebard, now that I've dropped red.

[gibsonjunkie]

Looking to lock in a 75 before GP Seattle in April, and here's approximately where I'm at:

Maindeck (60 cards) :u::b::r:

1 Academy Ruins
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Badlands
2 Underground Sea
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Volcanic Island
2 Scalding Tarn
2 City of Traitors
2 Spire of Industry
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp

4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation

4 Chalice of the Void
2 Dimir Signet
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Trinisphere
3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Mox Diamond
1 Crucible of Worlds

2 Dack Fayden
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

2 Transmute Artifact
3 Force of Will

Sideboard (15 cards)
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Slaughter Games
1 Blood Moon
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Lodestone Golem
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Force of Will
1 Trinisphere
1 Sorcerous Spyglass

I'm looking to add 2 Wastelands, but I'm not sure how I would re-tool the manabase to accommodate them. I really like the 2 Spires of Industry in this deck, but I feel like they are the most likely candidates. I also go back and forth on Urborg in this list, but fully understand why it should be in the list. I also think my sideboard could use some work, especially in an open meta.Sorry if it's poor form to quote myself, but really could use some input on my 75 for Seattle in 3 weeks, if anyone is willing.

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[Yonthan]

Sorry if it's poor form to quote myself, but really could use some input on my 75 for Seattle in 3 weeks, if anyone is willing.

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1. Is there a reason why you play only 3 Mox Diamond but not the playset?
2. Will you consider to add some Dust Bowl/Wasteland since you are playing crucible?
3. I know Slaugther Games is a nice card against combo, but realistically speaking what would you call in different matchups?

[gibsonjunkie]

1. Is there a reason why you play only 3 Mox Diamond but not the playset?
2. Will you consider to add some Dust Bowl/Wasteland since you are playing crucible?
3. I know Slaugther Games is a nice card against combo, but realistically speaking what would you call in different matchups?

1. Currently I only own 3 copes of Mox Diamond for one thing. Also I've seen several lists run 3 instead of 4. I haven't had much trouble hitting 2 mana on turn one so I haven't overwhelming pressure to buy the fourth yet. Maybe that's just luck bias talking.

2. I asked what people thought I should cut for 2 wastelands because I was having trouble deciding. I was leaning towards cutting the 2 Spire of Industry.

3. Slaughter Games is a sideboard card I've gone really back and forth on. I feel like I'd cut it, but I haven't settled on what should go in its place instead.

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[maCHOOga]

Played an slightly modified list from Peeb's SCG Wooster list for a team event yesterday. My team top8'ed, but my standard and modern plays were running hot. All but one of my matches went to game 3, and I didn't finish any three game match because my teammates just kept winning. Also my opponents tended to drag it out past the realm of no return. Unfortunately we lost in top 8. Here is a couple weird things that happened.

- I saw a ponder, brainstorm and deathrite before I was able to land a chalice. Based on those cards, it seemed like he was on grixis delver so I was fetching basics, played around daze and resolved a tezzerate. I animated my chalice and swung. He untaps Kolaghan's Command to kill Tezz and the Chalice. Is it correct to always plus if you know your not playing against combo?

- Playing against infect, I knew my plan was to try to lock them out of the game or Race. Game 1 I got an ensnaring bridge down and ensured that I was empty handed for a bunch of turns. I got in a situation where I had to play a Padeem, Consul of Innovation and the additional you must draw a card effect stranded me with 1 card in hand, which was just enough for an inkmoth to slide in under the bridge and get me.

- Game 3 of my top 8 match I was on the draw against R/W Death and Taxes. My hand was Dimir Signet, City of Traitors, The Abyss, Island, Swamp, Baleful Strix, Fetchland. Is this a reasonable keep or a trap? They went turn 1 plains pass, I opted for City into Signet with the hope of turn 2 Abyssing them to doom and my team into top4. Their turn 2 was Thalia, which tanked my abyss play. I deployed a baleful strix and drew another strix. Their turn 3 play was Relic Warden exile my signet. From there on out, I was choked on mana as they had double rishidan ports. Shortly a sword of fire and ice showed up and I was toast.

[Sisyphos]

- I saw a ponder, brainstorm and deathrite before I was able to land a chalice. Based on those cards, it seemed like he was on grixis delver so I was fetching basics, played around daze and resolved a tezzerate. I animated my chalice and swung. He untaps Kolaghan's Command to kill Tezz and the Chalice. Is it correct to always plus if you know your not playing against combo? Rule of thumb: Always plus unless you need the blocker or need to kill them fast and never minus on your lockpieces unless you're dead otherwise.


- Playing against infect, I knew my plan was to try to lock them out of the game or Race. Game 1 I got an ensnaring bridge down and ensured that I was empty handed for a bunch of turns. I got in a situation where I had to play a Padeem, Consul of Innovation and the additional you must draw a card effect stranded me with 1 card in hand, which was just enough for an inkmoth to slide in under the bridge and get me. Based on the information you gave, I'd say you just got unlucky. Hiding behind a Bridge is tough against Infect and makes draw effects like Padeem, Strix or even Jace a liability. As it was game 1, there isn't even the question of whether to board out Padeem in the matchup. But speaking from my perspective, I haven't been too impressed with the card. Maybe it's just the metagame I'm usually playing in or bias from a small sample size, but I see him more as a sideboard card to bring in against artifact hate than a maindeck necessity.


- Game 3 of my top 8 match I was on the draw against R/W Death and Taxes. My hand was Dimir Signet, City of Traitors, The Abyss, Island, Swamp, Baleful Strix, Fetchland. Is this a reasonable keep or a trap? They went turn 1 plains pass, I opted for City into Signet with the hope of turn 2 Abyssing them to doom and my team into top4. Their turn 2 was Thalia, which tanked my abyss play. I deployed a baleful strix and drew another strix. Their turn 3 play was Relic Warden exile my signet. From there on out, I was choked on mana as they had double rishidan ports. Shortly a sword of fire and ice showed up and I was toast.
I think the keep was ok, but the line you chose was wrong. You went with the most greedy line and chose the line that gets punished the most by mana denial against a deck whose main focus is to deny the opponents' mana. Leading with City/Signet in hopes of T2 Abyss against DnT on the draw gets disrupted by Thalia, Wasteland and Port (not even counting Revoker or any artifact hate they might have boarded in). The probability of them having one or more of those 12 cards on their T2 is 85% if they kept 7. Just play it slow, the hand has a second line that is totally fine. Going for T2 Strix with 2 basics in play gives you a reasonable blocker to slow them and you can either go for T3 City/Abyss if they have no mana denial or you can reevaluate based on your draws. Sure choosing a line that offers T3 Abyss instead of T2 Abyss in the best case scenario will lose you some matches, but the floor of the T3 Abyss line is so much higher. The line you chose might look more appealing if you had had an Ancient Tomb instead of City but the drawback of City is backbreaking the way you played it.

[a tribe called trest]

1. Currently I only own 3 copes of Mox Diamond for one thing. Also I've seen several lists run 3 instead of 4. I haven't had much trouble hitting 2 mana on turn one so I haven't overwhelming pressure to buy the fourth yet. Maybe that's just luck bias talking.

2. I asked what people thought I should cut for 2 wastelands because I was having trouble deciding. I was leaning towards cutting the 2 Spire of Industry.

3. Slaughter Games is a sideboard card I've gone really back and forth on. I feel like I'd cut it, but I haven't settled on what should go in its place instead.

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How often are you finding Spire of industry to be smoothing out your colored mana requirements? If its not very often, id imagine the occasional free wins wasteland provides would be better.

If you're set on staying with 2 dack fayden, 3 mox diamond is probably defensible since you wont be able discard away excess copies for value as easily.

[Peebs]

- I saw a ponder, brainstorm and deathrite before I was able to land a chalice. Based on those cards, it seemed like he was on grixis delver so I was fetching basics, played around daze and resolved a tezzerate. I animated my chalice and swung. He untaps Kolaghan's Command to kill Tezz and the Chalice. Is it correct to always plus if you know your not playing against combo?

- Playing against infect, I knew my plan was to try to lock them out of the game or Race. Game 1 I got an ensnaring bridge down and ensured that I was empty handed for a bunch of turns. I got in a situation where I had to play a Padeem, Consul of Innovation and the additional you must draw a card effect stranded me with 1 card in hand, which was just enough for an inkmoth to slide in under the bridge and get me.

- Game 3 of my top 8 match I was on the draw against R/W Death and Taxes. My hand was Dimir Signet, City of Traitors, The Abyss, Island, Swamp, Baleful Strix, Fetchland. Is this a reasonable keep or a trap? They went turn 1 plains pass, I opted for City into Signet with the hope of turn 2 Abyssing them to doom and my team into top4. Their turn 2 was Thalia, which tanked my abyss play. I deployed a baleful strix and drew another strix. Their turn 3 play was Relic Warden exile my signet. From there on out, I was choked on mana as they had double rishidan ports. Shortly a sword of fire and ice showed up and I was toast.

1: I almost always plus Tezz against grixis, especially since K Command has seen an uptick in play, for the exact reason that happened to you. That card is a serious beating, and opponents are usually used to playing against a chalice deck.

2: Once you get thopter sword online, Infect can only beat you with Berserk (which they can't cast through chalice) in the face of your "infinite" blockers. Bridge is good, but it's more important to keep a steady supply of blockers, if you have the choice of casting/searching for one or the other.

3: D+T is definitely one of the worst matchups, and The Abyss is a very weird card against them. They can choose a target creature with the trigger, then respond to it by giving it pro-black with Mom, which completely negates what should be an incredibly powerful card against a creature based deck. Chalice is also in a bad spot against the deck with Cavern. Taxes with red seems even worse, with more access to Manic Vandal, etc.
I probably would have mulliganed, looking for a Daretti, bridge, and/or walking ballista.

[gibsonjunkie]

How often are you finding Spire of industry to be smoothing out your colored mana requirements? If its not very often, id imagine the occasional free wins wasteland provides would be better.

If you're set on staying with 2 dack fayden, 3 mox diamond is probably defensible since you wont be able discard away excess copies for value as easily.Spire definitely has helped me hit red, but I feel less worried about that now that I'm off Lotus Petals (budget) and on the Mox Diamonds. I'll get some playtesting in Thursday and report back. Any thoughts on replacing Slaughter Games?

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[kingtk3]

...
2: Once you get thopter sword online, Infect can only beat you with Berserk (which they can't cast through chalice) in the face of your "infinite" blockers. Bridge is good, but it's more important to keep a steady supply of blockers, if you have the choice of casting/searching for one or the other.
...

Blighted Agent disagrees with you.

[Peebs]

Blighted Agent disagrees with you.

If you're letting Blighted Agent beat you through most/all of the things that I mentioned, you weren't winning that game anyway.

[Lavamane]

If you're letting Blighted Agent beat you through most/all of the things that I mentioned, you weren't winning that game anyway.

Blighted Agent costs 2 mana, has 1 power, and cannot be
Blocked. It literally gets past everything you listed.

[Peebs]

Blighted Agent costs 2 mana, has 1 power, and cannot be
Blocked. It literally gets past everything you listed.

And hits for 1 poison per turn. Things that accelerate its 10 turn clock, non-1 CMC pump spells like Become Immense and Invigorate, are at/near the top of your must counter list. You can also kill it with Walking Ballista, Toxic Deluge, or Daretti. The card sidesteps most of the deck's traditional means of stopping creatures, but it's not impossible to beat.

If in those 10 turns you don't find one of the other answers to Agent, then you probably weren't winning that game anyway, as I mentioned before.

You're right though, I should not have said "the only way they can beat you..."

[Fanatix]

Went 3:0 today in a little Store-Tournament. Played quite a stock-list and only changed the manabase slightly.
Have to say I really like the deck. It presents so much hate to the strategies of my meta that I have the feeling I could possibly win against any deck, although it is also possible to lose against anything because sometimes it feels clunky.

//Creatures 4
4 Baleful Strix

//Spells 7
4 Force of Will
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Transmute Artifact

//Planeswalker 8
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
3 Dack Fayden
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

//Artifacts 18
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Dimir Signet
4 Mox Diamond

//Lands 23
1 Academy Ruins
1 Inventors' Fair
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Polluted Delta
2 Island
1 Swamp
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Badlands
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island


//Sideboard
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Engineered Plague
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
1 Misdirection
1 Helm of Obedience
3 Leyline of the Void
1 Trinisphere
1 Lodestone Golem
2 Blood Moon
2 Sorcerous Spyglass


Had three good Match-Ups, at least I would assume.

Round 1 - Lands

Game 1: I have 2 Mox Diamond plus 2 lands in my opening seven, which is perfect against his wastelands. I start with both Diamonds an a chalice on 1, which slows him down. I get to place the combo quite fast and he tries to "race" me with punishing fire after I also played a bridge. After I resolve a chalice on 2 he has no outs and concedes.

Game 2: He draws all his Sideboard-Cards in the early turns and gets me with an 8/7 Tireless Tracker plus 3 (!) Krosan Grip around turn 6 or so.

Game 3: I start with an Leyline otV in Game an an early Bridge. He doesn`t find his removal and I eventually draw my Helm for the combo-win.


I think this MU comes down to him drawing removal for our hate, because we on our own have enough to win.

Boarding:

+2 Blood Moon
+3 Leyline of the Void
+1 Helm of Obedience
+1 Triunisphere
-4 Baleful Strix
-1 Daretti
-1 Toxic Deluge
-1 Tezzeret Agent of Bolas


Round 2 - Elves

Game 1: He starts and gets under the chalice with a Llanowar elves, which cast turn 3 a Natural Order into Craterhoof.

Game 2: I get to start with a chalice on 1 and a bridge, which gives me quite some time until I draw the Thopter-combo. Had to counter the 1-of Reclamation Sage with a FoW, otherwise I could have probably lost.

Game 3: He starts again gets to resolve 3 Elves until my Turn2 chalice. I can clear the board with Toxic Deluge from which he can`t recover. After that I have the Board-control and get the Tezzeret-Ultimate for 26.


Boarding:

+1 Engineered Explosives
+1 Chains of Mephistopheles (wanted to try against Glimpse but didn`t draw it)
+1 Engineered Plague
+1 Trinisphere
+1 Lodestone Golem
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
-4 Baleful Strix
-1 Daretti
-1 Force of Will


Round 3 - 12Post Eldrazi

Game 1: I start and have quite the nuts. At turn 5 I have Thopter-Foundry, Daretti, Dack and Tezzeret in game, which finds me the combo.

Game 2: I start with 2 leylines in play and have the bridge in hand for his Ulamog, Emrakul, whatever. In turn 3 I draw a blood moon from the top and decide that this is probably quite a good card against 2 cloudpost and a Tropical island in play :tongue:. The turn after I find the Helm and it`s combo-time. :cool:

Boarding:
+2 Sourcerous Spyglass
+2 Blood Moon
+1 Helm of Obedience
+3 Leyline of the Void
-2 Chalice of the Void
-4 Baleful Strix
-1 Toxic Deluge
-1 Force of Will



At the moment I think that I will use this list. Although I always boarded the playset strix out I think it is too important in too many games to not include it in the maindeck. Daretti is kind of a "maybe"-card. It can help killing Anglers so I will try him some more.

[gibsonjunkie]

Spire definitely has helped me hit red, but I feel less worried about that now that I'm off Lotus Petals (budget) and on the Mox Diamonds. I'll get some playtesting in Thursday and report back. Any thoughts on replacing Slaughter Games?

Sent from my SM-G920V using TapatalkReporting back late because I suck. Yeah, don't miss the Spires of Industry at all. Wasteland lock is nice, 11/10 would recommend against greedy manabases.

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[JohnDonnerball]

Played three Tournaments over the last two weeks with this list:

//Lands
1 Academy Ruins
4 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island

//Planeswalker
3 Dack Fayden
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

//Artifacts
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Thopter Foundry
3 Dimir Signet
4 Mox Diamond

//Spells
4 Force of Will
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Transmute Artifact

//Creatures
4 Baleful Strix
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
1 Walking Ballista

//Sideboard
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 Engineered Plague
1 Walking Ballista
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Misdirection
1 The Abyss
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Trinisphere

I went 1.Place with 4:0; 3.Place with 4:1 and 10.Place with 4:2
can't really remember every single matchup, and sadly didnt take any notes.
But I remember the games I lost were against BUG Delver, UR Delver and Jund (with 4 decays and 3 K-comands main :mad: )

have only some overall thoughts:

Manabase:
Felt pretty solid and smooth. wasn't sure about the Seat of the Synod but feels good to find it with tezz, to beat for 5 with tezz or to add 2 dmg with tezz.

Planeswalker:
I cutted my 4th Tezzeret for the Daretti, because I often drew another tezz when I already had one in play, so casting another planeswalker when you got already an tezzeret in play feels enormous strong.

Three Dacks are the right amount in my opinion.

Artifacts:
Nothing special here.

Spells:
4 FoW pretty combo heavy meta around here. so just felt right. But I often boarding 1 or 2 copies out agains non combo decks or decks where I didnt want more card disadvantage like BUG Control.

1 Toxic Deluge main and 1 in the board feels pretty good, whipping everything all day!

Creatures:
Padeem is most likely to be kicked out, but I love the face of my opponents when she hits the board and they are just like "Man, wtf are you playing ?!"

Ballista was often simply an removal with some extra steps. Is a real powerhouse agains DnT and won me 2 Games agains Czech Pile alone.

Sideboard:
Changed my second Abyss for an Engineered Plague, and I love it.

Maybe I will change the Misdirection for an Sorcerous Spyglass.


@Fanatix
Cant really understand to board any Strix out, he buys time, he pitches for FoW, he transmute into an combo pice for free or an bridge for one mana.
Or killing angler, and other fatties.....
I often finde myself with an Chalice for one hiding behind an strix, waiting for some Planeswalker or other trouble from my Topdeck.

greetings from Germany
Tobi!

[gibsonjunkie]

Anyone at GP Seattle? I went 4-4 yesterday. Had some very bad topdecks, but was actually happy with my play for the majority of the games. Deck felt great. Mulligans killed me once or twice, too. I mulled to 5 game 3 against BUG control after wiping the floor with them game 2. Brutal.

Having a great time, though!

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[Hellraiser157]

i was at GP seattle and had a great time.

@gibsonjunkie: i think we met at the end of the 7:30 pm legacy event on saturday. u showed me your german'd deck.

here is the list i've used for both days:

// Grixis Tezzeret

// 60 Maindeck
// 19 Artifact
2 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Mox Diamond
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Talisman of Dominance

// 5 Creature
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista

// 1 Enchantment
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid

// 4 Instant
4 Force of Will

// 22 Land
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Academy Ruins
1 Scalding Tarn
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Flooded Strand

// 6 Planeswalker
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden

// 3 Sorcery
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge


// 15 Sideboard
// 7 Artifact
SB: 2 Trinisphere
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

// 3 Creature
SB: 2 Lodestone Golem
SB: 1 Spellskite

// 2 Enchantment
SB: 2 Blood Moon

// 1 Instant
SB: 1 Kozilek's Return

// 1 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

// 1 Sorcery
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge

=========================================================================

The Deck went surprisingly well at the GP. the biggest changes i made compared to my older interations was cutting the lands to 22, reduce the mana rocks and put more active artifacts into the decks. I often had/have the problem of drawing to much air or useless mana rocks later in the game. Mr. Red Hand (Dack Fayden) helps here A LOT!!! His looting ability is always needed!

Card choices Mainboard:
1x Engineered Explosives (DRS (!!!), Delver, Explorations, Pithing Needle, Mentor/Elemental Tokens, CB...)
1x Ratchet Bomb (see EE, but can be transmuted into or can be used to be transmuted, T1 from Sol Land)
1x Spyglass (Wasteland, Jace, DRS, other Walkers)
1X Walking Ballista (won me a couple of games on its own; nice with blood moon out or aether grid)
1x Aethergrid
- the games i drew it, it worked surprisingly well
- saved my ass against goblins
- makes use of mono artifacts (wink wink) in the grind
- 'win more' with thopter sword out
no Daretti in the main. he never does enough for me on the field, but comes in against permant heavy strategies.

Card choices Sideboard:
2x Blood Moon (wins games; against Lands, BUG, Grixis...)
1x Spellskite (instead of Padeem; against Burn, Infect and Decks with targeted artifact hate)
1x Kozilek's Return (instead of whipflare; instant speed is key!)
1x EE (against DRS, Delver, Mother of Runes.....)

=========================================================================

Match Ups Main Event on friday (from memory)

Doomsday: draw (yes, it was a draw)
Lands: win (Blood Moon, Bridge, ThopterSword, Chalice on 1 and 2)
Goblins: win (Bridge, Aethergrid, ThopterSword, Ratchet Bomb)
BUG Control: win (Blood Moon, ThopterSword, Chalice)
NixFit: win (luck and ThoperSword+Aethergrid, Chalice)
Show and Tell: loss (Grissldaddy is a good card)
Grixis Delver: loss (clunky draws)
Miracles: win (ThopterSword, Walkers, Chalice)

Match Ups Side Events (from memory)
Manaless Dredge: draw ( i had all the hate, but nothing to close out G3)
Lands: win
Steel Stompy: loss (interesting matchup, feels tough to beat)
4c Control: win
Grixis Delver: loss
Grixis Delver: win


Thanks for reading.
- Philip

[gibsonjunkie]

i was at GP seattle and had a great time.

@gibsonjunkie: i think we met at the end of the 7:30 pm legacy event on saturday. u showed me your german'd deck.

here is the list i've used for both days:

// Grixis Tezzeret

// 60 Maindeck
// 19 Artifact
2 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Mox Diamond
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Talisman of Dominance

// 5 Creature
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista

// 1 Enchantment
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid

// 4 Instant
4 Force of Will

// 22 Land
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Academy Ruins
1 Scalding Tarn
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Flooded Strand

// 6 Planeswalker
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden

// 3 Sorcery
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge


// 15 Sideboard
// 7 Artifact
SB: 2 Trinisphere
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

// 3 Creature
SB: 2 Lodestone Golem
SB: 1 Spellskite

// 2 Enchantment
SB: 2 Blood Moon

// 1 Instant
SB: 1 Kozilek's Return

// 1 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

// 1 Sorcery
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge

=========================================================================

The Deck went surprisingly well at the GP. the biggest changes i made compared to my older interations was cutting the lands to 22, reduce the mana rocks and put more active artifacts into the decks. I often had/have the problem of drawing to much air or useless mana rocks later in the game. Mr. Red Hand (Dack Fayden) helps here A LOT!!! His looting ability is always needed!

Card choices Mainboard:
1x Engineered Explosives (DRS (!!!), Delver, Explorations, Pithing Needle, Mentor/Elemental Tokens, CB...)
1x Ratchet Bomb (see EE, but can be transmuted into or can be used to be transmuted, T1 from Sol Land)
1x Spyglass (Wasteland, Jace, DRS, other Walkers)
1X Walking Ballista (won me a couple of games on its own; nice with blood moon out or aether grid)
1x Aethergrid
- the games i drew it, it worked surprisingly well
- saved my ass against goblins
- makes use of mono artifacts (wink wink) in the grind
- 'win more' with thopter sword out
no Daretti in the main. he never does enough for me on the field, but comes in against permant heavy strategies.

Card choices Sideboard:
2x Blood Moon (wins games; against Lands, BUG, Grixis...)
1x Spellskite (instead of Padeem; against Burn, Infect and Decks with targeted artifact hate)
1x Kozilek's Return (instead of whipflare; instant speed is key!)
1x EE (against DRS, Delver, Mother of Runes.....)

=========================================================================

Match Ups Main Event on friday (from memory)

Doomsday: draw (yes, it was a draw)
Lands: win (Blood Moon, Bridge, ThopterSword, Chalice on 1 and 2)
Goblins: win (Bridge, Aethergrid, ThopterSword, Ratchet Bomb)
BUG Control: win (Blood Moon, ThopterSword, Chalice)
NixFit: win (luck and ThoperSword+Aethergrid, Chalice)
Show and Tell: loss (Grissldaddy is a good card)
Grixis Delver: loss (clunky draws)
Miracles: win (ThopterSword, Walkers, Chalice)

Match Ups Side Events (from memory)
Manaless Dredge: draw ( i had all the hate, but nothing to close out G3)
Lands: win
Steel Stompy: loss (interesting matchup, feels tough to beat)
4c Control: win
Grixis Delver: loss
Grixis Delver: win


Thanks for reading.
- PhilipYes, that was me! I'll have a writeup ready soonish. I apologize again for not being able to stop and chat longer, I've been battling a sore throat and losing my voice chatting with folks at the GP the past few days.

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[Peebs]

I was chatting with some friends over the weekend about the difficulties with the DnT matchup, and given the reprint of Rishadan Port, the deck is definitely making a comeback in my area. One card that came up was Serrated Arrows. It can be found with Transmute Artifact, unlike Walking Ballista, Daretti, or any hoser enchantments / deluge.
Any strong opinions one way or the other on the card?

[Alexeezay]

I also thought of Contagion Engine but it's probably too costly for Legacy, lol. Still a cute one, proliferates your walkers.

[gibsonjunkie]

What about Meekstone? Deals with all their bigger guys. Batterskull, anything carrying a Sword, Flickerwisp, etc.

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[Peebs]

What about Meekstone? Deals with all their bigger guys. Batterskull, anything carrying a Sword, Flickerwisp, etc.

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I see a couple of things wrong with the card, namely:
-CMC 1 in a deck with Chalice. Transmute Artifact gets around this though
-Batterskull gives vigilance, so it preventing it from untapping doesn't matter
-They can move swords to a different creature after combat to let them untap (or even Karakas + recast for Thalia)

It does prevent big Thalia and Flickerwisp from hitting you more than once though!

Kind of a random thought: with Dack being the norm now, is liquimetal coating starting to look better? Main or SB?

[a tribe called trest]

I was chatting with some friends over the weekend about the difficulties with the DnT matchup, and given the reprint of Rishadan Port, the deck is definitely making a comeback in my area. One card that came up was Serrated Arrows. It can be found with Transmute Artifact, unlike Walking Ballista, Daretti, or any hoser enchantments / deluge.
Any strong opinions one way or the other on the card?

Abrade is really good in that matchup. Plus it passes the important test of killing DRS and Delver, so its not a wasted sideboard slot as strictly a narrow answer to DNT.

[Hellraiser157]

Cards i use against D&T are:

- Toxic Deluge
- Kozilek's Return (colorless and instant)
- Dack Fayden
- Ballista
- Spyglass (shuts off wastelands, vials and equipment)
- Daretti
- Bridge
- Engineered Explosives

[Peebs]

Abrade is really good in that matchup. Plus it passes the important test of killing DRS and Delver, so its not a wasted sideboard slot as strictly a narrow answer to DNT.

I've been so afraid of having this card cast against me that I never realized I could be the one casting it!

[gibsonjunkie]

I see a couple of things wrong with the card, namely:
-CMC 1 in a deck with Chalice. Transmute Artifact gets around this though
-Batterskull gives vigilance, so it preventing it from untapping doesn't matter
-They can move swords to a different creature after combat to let them untap (or even Karakas + recast for Thalia)

It does prevent big Thalia and Flickerwisp from hitting you more than once though!

Kind of a random thought: with Dack being the norm now, is liquimetal coating starting to look better? Main or SB?All definitely relevant points. I wouldn't play the card myself either, just trying to think of things that may fill similar roles.

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[kingtk3]

I think we already have the tools to play against D&T (I can name The Abyss and Engineered plague in addition to what already mentioned), just keep hands that don't die to wasteland + port and have some interaction.

[gibsonjunkie]

I didn't do all that great at GP Seattle, but here's my writeup anyway, in case anyone wanted to read it anyway. https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/comments/8btolf/really_brave_or_really_stupid_playing_grixis/

[Foamy]

I didn't do all that great at GP Seattle, but here's my writeup anyway, in case anyone wanted to read it anyway. https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/comments/8btolf/really_brave_or_really_stupid_playing_grixis/

Nice writeup! When I saw "Round 8, Tomas on No-Show," I thought you encountered a janky Natural Order/Show and Tell deck, hehe.

I've never been much of a fan of keeping Forces in against BUG Control, at least not a full four. I feel like the Dack and Tezzeret would better serve you in the matchup, since they can help you take over the game and BUG doesn't play too many things that I think necessitate the use of a Force. But then again, maybe I'm just bad at this game and don't know how to navigate the matchup.

[Peebs]

I didn't do all that great at GP Seattle, but here's my writeup anyway, in case anyone wanted to read it anyway. https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/comments/8btolf/really_brave_or_really_stupid_playing_grixis/

Great write up!

How has your experience with wasteland and crucible been?

I'm very curious about Ghuirapur aether grid, which I definitely want to jam and help out against DnT.


I played Tezz in a Legacy side event at Hartford and had some discussion with at least two other players about card choices, namely one who was Dack-less and using Jace in his place.
(I also got to pick up an Italian Chains for about $300 in trade-ins from one of the vendors, whereas every other one was at least $450!)

[gibsonjunkie]

Nice writeup! When I saw "Round 8, Tomas on No-Show," I thought you encountered a janky Natural Order/Show and Tell deck, hehe.

I've never been much of a fan of keeping Forces in against BUG Control, at least not a full four. I feel like the Dack and Tezzeret would better serve you in the matchup, since they can help you take over the game and BUG doesn't play too many things that I think necessitate the use of a Force. But then again, maybe I'm just bad at this game and don't know how to navigate the matchup.

Haha I wrote it that way on purpose as something of a joke, actually. :P

RE: Forces against BUG Control, I may have swapped some out. I am bad at keeping track of my sideboarding choices during tourneys and forgot to write them for that round. I want to believe that past-gibsonjunkie would've been smart enough to board some number of them out, but who knows. That guy also thought it was a good idea to play Tezz in a GP. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Someone has to fight the good fight, eh?


Great write up!

How has your experience with wasteland and crucible been?

I'm very curious about Ghuirapur aether grid, which I definitely want to jam and help out against DnT.

I played Tezz in a Legacy side event at Hartford and had some discussion with at least two other players about card choices, namely one who was Dack-less and using Jace in his place.
(I also got to pick up an Italian Chains for about $300 in trade-ins from one of the vendors, whereas every other one was at least $450!)


Well, Bertoncini wasn't a big fan of the Wasteland/Crucible package, I can tell you that for sure! Jokes aside, it's been pretty sweet. I'm a big fan of Crucible in the main even without the Wastelands, at this point. Being able to even re-buy a fetch against opposing Wasteland decks and fetch out my basics was really useful. It generated enough value that I'd like to keep playing it. I found the Wastelands to be super useful. I got some joking comments about "Oh god, what's going to come out of this deck next? I guess at least you aren't playing Wasteland..." followed by me Wastelanding them for their hubris. I'm definitely going to keep playing the package, but I would never play more than 2 Wasteland. That number feels rock solid for me. Sometimes the Crucible does need to come out for games 2/3, though, which is fine. I often find myself struggling with sideboarding correctly in this deck, so it's nice to have a card that is clearly bad in certain matchups to take out.

Ghirapur Aether Grid was a card I didn't really end up bringing in as much as I would've liked. A lot of the matchups it shines in I didn't run into as much, or I didn't draw it. I think the only time I cast it, it met a Force of Will, and I recall it getting Duress'd in a side event or something, as well. It was a bit of a last-minute audible, because I decided to cut the Slaughter Games I had been running in the sideboard previously, because it just didn't do much. I'm inclined to do some more testing with the card before I have a really solid opinion of it. For now, if it's scary enough to meet a Duress or a Force, someone must not want it on the board, which is a good sign in my book.

I'm really jealous of the Chains pickup! That's a great deal! Cheapest I could find in Seattle was still well over $400, and I had already spent upwards of $500 on a set of German Wastelands and some shiny new German duals. I've gone back and forth on Chains. I've got a proxy one I might jam locally in playtesting and see how it does. I never put serious thought into it because it seemed like a more niche piece of tech for Tezz (albeit a really powerful one).

[steelydanno]

Hey all, I just recently jumped on the Grixis Tezzeret train and while I have played in exactly one (1) small local gaming event so far, I'm happy to say the deck went undefeated despite approximately 25 misplays against three decks I almost always lose to (Lands, DnT, Mono Red Sneak Attack). One of my biggest challenges with any new deck is learning how to sideboard, and I wanted to find out the recent strategies of you more experienced players. In most matchups, the real puzzler is figuring out what cards should come out--when do you trim on planeswalkers or foundry combo pieces? Do you ever cut the fast mana cards? Am I wrong for boarding out all 4 copies of FOW when my opponent isn't on Combo? Etc.

A notable exception for me is the Grixis Delver matchup and the BUG/4C Control matchup. It feels like there are a ton of sideboard cards that are pretty effective against them, but there just aren't enough available slots and I can't decide what goes in. I'd be glad to get some advice, of whatever length or level of detail you can spare! Hope to get a meaty report in soon. Although I'm still tinkering around with the list, I'll post where I'm at so far as a frame of reference. Suggestions are of course welcome.

4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista

4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 Dack Fayden
1 Liquimetal Coating (laugh if you want, the Lands player didn't)

3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek

4 Mox Diamond
3 Dimir Signet

4 Chalice of the Void
2 Ensnaring Bridge

4 Force of Will
2 Transmute Artifact

4 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
2 Island
1 Swamp
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Inventor's Fair
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
1 Academy Ruins

SB
3 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 The Abyss
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Trinisphere
1 Walking Ballista
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

Thank you!!

[JohnDonnerball]

Hey steelydanno,

So where to start.... maybe with the Matchups that giving you a hard time.

Death n Taxes, without any Toxic deluge and Engineered Plague this is really a tough battle. The Abyss isn't that good agains them, im still boarding it in.

Lands is a really favored match imo. All you need is a chalice on 1 (it kills nearly all their spells but at least all the mana ramp) and an bridge to be safe form the big bad Token.
After boarding they will bring in Sphere of Resistance which can give you a really hard time if you can´t find an Daretti. Against Land Im boarding the Helm combo in (simply to kill Life from the loam and punishing fire) but also keeping the Sword combo, with thopter sword online you don't have to fear the Token or Pfire.

I only played 1 or 2 matches against Mono Red Sneak Attack and it didn't feel good. Force of Will, Chalice on zero, Sorcerous Spyglass and a fast as possible bridge are the only weapons we have.

I´m totally with you about the Force of Will. I only keep them in agains Combo Decks and Decks which have some single strong cards that will win them the Game.

Other overall boarding thoughts:
I trim on Tezzrets agains every Deck Im expecting Problast from the Sideboard. normally I change them to Daretti and/or Lodestone Golem (simply some other cards they have to handle but not getting killed by an blast)
I also change the combo when I killed him with Thopter Sword or at least giving him a hard time with it. (normally they will board against thopter/sword like crazy and I want give them a lot of dead cards)
When I decide to play both combos I cut 1 or 2 Foundries, cuz it get also killed by pyroblast ( you see I got some really traumatizing experiences with this card) and often they play a surgical extraction on the foundry.
Other cards I cut when simply need space is 1 Signet and/or 1 Mox

Some thoughts about your list:

I would change 1 Dack for 1 Daretti, especially with the Liquimetal Coating you can kill everything.
3 Chains of Mephistopheles are way to much imo. Its a pretty good card for sure but I wouldn't play more than 1 (even that I own 2 copies of it)
I would suggest to play more creature hate, atm I´m playing 1 Toxic Deluge Main and one in the SB. Also I play 1 Engineered Plague in the SB it replaced my second Abyss and im really happy with it, it kills True Name, Mother, empty the warrens, Pyromancer Tokens and even against Enchantress I bring it in to kill Argothian Enchantress and slow them down.


Best wishes
Tobi!

[steelydanno]

Thanks for the advice, Tobi!

I apologize for the awkward sentence, what I meant to say at the start of the post was that I had actually won those matchups. I think DnT is a bit of a 50/50 depending on how fast a start they get and if you can get around their mana denial--Dack owns the lategame if it gets that far. Toxic Deluge is better than Walking Ballista there, but I like that I can find Ballista with Tezzeret. Against Lands, I was giddy at how hard it was to lose--I usually play frickin STANDSTILL and so my win percentage against Marit Lage is approximately 0. Against Mono Red Sneak Attack, I was just plain lucky--he mulliganed at least twice both games and couldn't get enough mana before I got a Bridge down, I later playtested against it a few times and got blown out. I agree it's not a good matchup.

I also agree the 3CHAINZ are probably too much, but I'm overcommitting just so I can see how good it is against all these Brainstorm/Deathrite decks that infest my local meta, and then adjust accordingly. It feels to me like sticking an early one puts them in a really bad position, and they have so few (if any?) ways to get rid of it. Those decks are also the ones full of Pyroblasts, so cutting the FOWs, trimming the foundry combo and maybe a mana rock or two while bringing in Leyline/Helm seems like a good plan.

Going 3 Dack 1 Daretti feels right, and frees up a slot for Engineered Plague in the board, which is probably necessary. As the deck currently stands I have nothing but Ensnaring Bridge to stop TNN. And great against DnT as well.

[a tribe called trest]

Finally arrived at a list I like against the DRS mush meta.

lands 25
4x ancient tomb
1x badlands
2x island
1x karakas
4x polluted delta
3x scalding tarn
1x swamp
1x tundra
2x underground sea
2x volcanic island
4x wasteland

creatures 6
4x baleful strix
2x hazoret the fervent (more on this later)

other 29
4x dack fayden
3x tezzeret agent of bolas
4x thopter foundry
3x sword of the meek
4x mox diamond
2x dimir signet
2x ensnaring bridge
1x crucible of worlds
2x transmute artifact
4x chalice of the void


sideboard 15
3x tormod's crypt
1x flusterstorm
2x disenchant
2x toxic deluge
2x containment priest
3x lodestone golem
2x walking ballista


First thing you may notice is I ended up cutting academy ruins and inventors fair. In this current DRS meta I think they have become a liability. The longer a game goes against pile decks the worse off we are. Those lands reward grindy game states, so I cut them in favor of some more colored sources. The additional colored sources help against opposing Delver wastelands cutting me off mana colors as well.

Second thing you will likely notice is the hazoret's. They have been an absolute machine against pile and delver in game 1's. They can function as both baleful strix 5/6 and dack fayden 5/6 when trying to get under bridges. Post board they are win cons that dont lose to artifact hate or red blasts, which is an enormous attribute. They arent great against edict effects, but edict is an otherwise terrible card against the thopter plan, so it potentially overloads their sideboard efficiency. I actually suspect there's a better deck to be brewed that entirely drops the Tezzeret artifact chalice features in favor of Dack Hazoret pfire cantrip cartel, but that's a conversation for another day.

No force of will has priced me into the white splash and the otherwise super greedy karakas. Force is bad against the aggregate DRS mush, so I cut them and havent looked back. Because of that I need some maindeck outs to show and tell/reanimator, so between the Karakas and bridges I can still steal some game 1s without the card disadvantage. Also is nice to end step bounce an opposing DnT player's Thalia so I can jam without taxes. I was initially on Breya so you could occasionally bounce Breya or hazoret with the karakas against opposing stp, but that was admittedly narrow. Containtment priest is great against Show n tell, reanimator and dredge. Having the 2 natural draw white sources helps the fetchlands and moxes to get them out turn 1.

Cruicble wasteland with bridge gives me the free game 1wins im looking for against Lands. Turbo depths can still combo out before I setup, but if the game goes long im also gonna steal a game 1 with the package in that matchup. If you play against more depths than lands, I would change the sideboard disenchants into abrades, because they have an actual text box against hexmage. It's currently disenchant because of rest in peace/food chain/alluren but again easily swapped.


Basic TLDR is I like this build against the current top of the meta. My basic philosophy is that I want as wide an array of free game 1 wins options against the top of the field as I can get. Every deck that features brainstorm is gonna have a better sideboard against us than we have against them. So maximizing game 1 efficiency is what im looking for. If you are playing against more fringe stuff, you can go +3 force of will and -1 thopter, -1 sword, -1 karakas to support it in the maindeck, with +1 in the board replacing the flusterstorm.

[Peebs]

Howdy all, I played my previous list mostly intact this weekend at SCG Baltimore, but my team dropped when we got our third loss. As for my matchups, I don't remember all of them, but I'll try to relay some interesting interactions over the day

Changes to the deck from last time:
MD: -1 Mox Diamond, +1 Tezz Seeker
SB: -1 Misdirection, +1 Ghirapur Aether Grid

Sneak and Show
I keep a particularly shaky hand that can get me to a turn 2 chalice, but I have a tezz and bridge in hand so I'm not worried all that much. Opponent sees my turn 1 Delta, pass, and opts for a turn 1 show and tell. I slam my bridge to his Griselbrand, and after a few turns the game went my way. Boarded in Chains, The Abyss, and Daretti, but I didn't see nor need them since my turn 1 chalice with Force backup stopped him cold, with his hand full of cantrips and no action. Won with a Tezz ult after several turns.
-Win

Grixis Delver
G1: Chalice is gud kard. Easy game 1
Game 2 I bring in Chains, The Abyss, my second Ballista, and Ghirapur Aether Grid. I land an early Chains with little to back it up, and he casts Jace. I lost to Jace Ult, and we both had a good laugh about the card
Game 3 Aether Grid let me ping his pyromancer and delvers, bridge saved me from Gurmag Angler and TNN, and Grid has solidified itself in my sideboard.
-Win

Eldrazi
G1 I use about 4 cards in my hand to land a Chalice on 1, and my opponent chuckles. Ruh roh. I get run over by mimics and fast reality smashers.
G2 I bring in creature removal package, land an early bridge and The Abyss, clean up from there.
G3 I go for a quick Tezz ult for exactsies from behind bridge, but he pings my Baleful Strix with the pinger dude and survives at 2 life. Immediately lands Revoker on Tezz to slow my progress to a halt. Eventually I land Daretti to kill the revoker and Tezz ult again for way more than lethal this time.
-Win

Death and Taxes
My FAAAAAVORITE matchup. Ha.
G1 DnT does DnT things, quick loss.
G2 I stabilize quickly with ballista and aether grid, win in the air with thopter beats.
G3 I play from behind Thalia which hampers my planeswalkers from coming down on time, and with one more turn I think I would have won, but he eventually found a flickerwisp to remove my bridge for a turn and lethal me.
-Lost

Maverick
This was the only match that an opponent cast Deathrite against me all day; I was shocked.
Maindeck Qasali Pridemage really hurt my disruption, and his combo of Marit Lage and a big Knight of the Reliquary outran my swordless Thopter Foundry eventually.
I had little to go on for how to sideboard, but my teammates both lost before we could finish our match.
-Probably would have lost

There was one more match but I don't remember what it was. I'll keep more detailed notes for a post-Toronto report in 2 weeks.

[Ephemeron]

Has anyone had the chance to jam some games with Karn, Scion of Urza yet? Moon Stompy people seem to be loving Karn and it seems like a natural fit here as well, since Moon stompy is kinda our evil twin legacy deck. It's gotta be an upgrade over the 2x Daretti some people play in Grixis right? Plus it slots well into UB Tezz as well.

[Peebs]

It's gotta be an upgrade over the 2x Daretti some people play in Grixis right?

Daretti is a removal spell most of the time for me, not just pumping out tokens or card advantage. I think Karn has a spot in the deck somewhere, but not necessarily for the purpose you've proposed.

[Ephemeron]

Daretti is a removal spell most of the time for me, not just pumping out tokens or card advantage. I think Karn has a spot in the deck somewhere, but not necessarily for the purpose you've proposed.

I guess I should've expanded on my thoughts a bit more. I agree with you that Daretti is a removal spell most of the time, the problem is that it's a bad removal spell and there are too many decks in the format where it does absolutely nothing (Lands, Miracles, most combo decks and especially storm). As such, I think it's best as a sideboard card if you want it somewhere in the 75. Karn, on the other hand, does things which are more universally applicable against the metagame as a whole (card advantage, beatdown/defense) and thus seems like an ideal card to have in the maindeck. My starting place would be to drop any Darettis I was playing maindeck (which has been 1-2 in the past) and replace them with Karns, even though they serve vastly different purposes.

[nfurno]

Hello folks,
I've been casually playing this deck since i saw Jake playing it at the phili team event and think its pretty amazing. I've since been playing a modern version of this as pretty much the only deck i'll enter into a modern event (before this I was on black green tron, which I top 8'ed the TJ's Titanium Invitational event with). The modern version is extremely consistent and operates mostly at instant speed. I wreck the jeskai, humans, hollow one and mardu pyromancer matchups, and have a fair chance at most of the rest. I'll post the modern list below, but i bring this up because i was wondering if anyone has tested whir of invention in this deck? I know XUUU is very different from UU for your tutor, but the sorcery speed aspect of this has felt really bad. Does anyone have tips for when you cast your transmutes? Do you jam it on 2 if you have the ramp up? Are you waiting for a specific boardstate or time? And I'd love to hear your opinions on whir.

3 X Ensnaring Bridge
4 x Serum Visions
1 x Time Sieve
3 x Sword of the Meek
3 x collective brutality
2 x welding jar
4 x whir of invention
4 x mishra's bauble
4 x pentad prism
1 x grafdiggers cage
1 x relic of progenitus
4 x thopter foundry
3 x mox opal
3 x tezzeret, agent of bolas

Manabase:
2 x misty rainforest
4 x polluted delta
2 x flooded strand
2 x watery grave
2 x breeding pool
2 x underground river
1 x academy ruins
1 x sunken ruins
3 x island
1 x swamp

Sideboard: (this sideboard was what i ran when i expected cheerios to be in the room more than once because of the stupid meta at my LGS, and is decent vs affinity too. other maybe board items include 2x trickbind, 2x mindbreak trap, 2 x damnation, 1 x padeem, 1-2 sorceress spyglass, 2 x spellskite, 1x maelstrom pulse, 1x aether grid, 2 x liliana of the veil)
3 x chalice of the void
3 x abrupt decay
4 x thoughtseize (this needs to go to 3, replacing it with an additional lost legacy)
4 fatal push
1 lost legacy

[Undomian]

I'll post the modern list below, but i bring this up because i was wondering if anyone has tested whir of invention in this deck? I know XUUU is very different from UU for your tutor, but the sorcery speed aspect of this has felt really bad. Does anyone have tips for when you cast your transmutes? Do you jam it on 2 if you have the ramp up? Are you waiting for a specific boardstate or time? And I'd love to hear your opinions on whir.

There's a pretty big difference between UU, sacrifice Baleful Strix to find the other half of Thopter/Sword and 2UUU to do the same (even at instant speed), not to mention that UUU is a lot harder in the Legacy builds due to stuff like Ancient Tomb.

[nfurno]

There's a pretty big difference between UU, sacrifice Baleful Strix to find the other half of Thopter/Sword and 2UUU to do the same (even at instant speed), not to mention that UUU is a lot harder in the Legacy builds due to stuff like Ancient Tomb.

I totally agree, although not having to sac and being able to tap strix and other artifacts to contribute to X is really helpful. Do you have any insights on how/when to transmute?

[Ephemeron]

I totally agree, although not having to sac and being able to tap strix and other artifacts to contribute to X is really helpful. Do you have any insights on how/when to transmute?

Game 1 you're basically going to only Transmute for A) the part of the thopter sword combo you don't currently have; or B) Ensnaring Bridge. In matches where Bridge is good, you basically want it out ASAP so do when you sense you have the best chance to resolve Transmute (i.e., before Griselbrand hits the battlefield). You can wait a bit if you're looking to compete thopter sword if you're not under any pressure and you don't need the artifact you're sacrificing, but if you're getting beaten down by a hoard of Delvers and Elemental tokens you rarely have the luxury of waiting for the perfect moment to cast it.

Sideboard games you're still looking to get those same cards, but you've got more silver bullets depending on what you brought in (i.e., Trinisphere against storm, Helm if you brought in Leylines to fight a graveyard deck, stuff like that).

If you have the choice of getting a silver bullet that will absolutely hose a certain matchup (Bridge against SnS, 3ball against Storm) you should transmute for that first and worry about assembling thopter sword later.

[nfurno]

I've decided to try this deck in Toronto this weekend over my usual Lands list. I've been playing 1-2 events per week for about 3 weeks now and I have a basic handling on it, and your help on what you use transmute for has been really helpful. I'm trying to figure out what I should change from my current list in order to help me combat turbo depths now that many people seem to be on it. I've also had a hard time beating mono red stompy, i seem to run out of answers and while i need to board chalice out in that match, they keep it in on 2. I've also fallen in love with liquimetal coating + dack and had considered moving a liquimetal to the mainboard.
Any thoughts or comments are greatly appreciated!

Based on Starting with Jake's list and modifying things a little based on other results, this is what ive currently been on:

4 Force of will
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge

4 Tezzeret Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Faden
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

4 Baleful Strix
4 mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Thopter Foundry
3 Dimir Signet
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Sword of the meek
1 Time Sieve (i havent gotten this to get unlimited turns even once in testing, its an easy cut)

4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
2 Volcanic island
2 underground Sea
2 island
1 swamp
1 seat of the synod
1 inventor's fair
1 academy ruins


Sideboard:
1 The Abyss
1 Liquimetal Coating
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Engineered Plague
1 Chains of Mephistopoles
2 Misdirection
1 Lodestone Golem
1 Sorceress Spyglass
1 walking Ballista
1 Padeem, Consol of Innovation

[steelydanno]

I like the list, I'm just a few cards off. If you're looking for suggestions on what to replace Time Sieve with, I really recommend Padeem. I've been playing with two main and I've never been sorry to see him (and he gives our color-strained deck a few more bullets for Force of Will). Ditto for maindeck Liquimetal Coating, in addition to the synergy with all of your walkers, with Padeem out you can make him or your lands hexproof as well, which is more relevant than I thought it would be.

My suggested cuts for those cards would be Daretti (to the board) and a Signet, but that's just based on my local meta which reliably favors combo, miracles, and Czech Pile.

[nfurno]

Hello Everyone,
I got to play in GP Toronto this weekend with my team ending 5-2-1. a Draw in round 2 (that our modern player was winning easily if we were not in turns) really hosed us for the day 2 qualification.
Here's how I did with this list:

1 Tezzeret the seeker
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dakc Fayden
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge
3 Baleful Strix
1 Walking ballista
4 Chalice of the void
4 Mox Diamond
3 Dimir Signet
1 Liquimetal Coating
3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
2 ensnaring Bridge
4 Force of Will

1 Swamp
2 island
2 polluted delta
2 scalding tarn
2 underground sea
2 volcanic island
2 city of traitors
1 seat of the synod
1 academy ruins
1 inventors' fair
4 ancient tomb

Sideboard:
1 daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 ghiapur aether grid
1 sorceress spyglass
1 the abyss
4 leyline of the void
1 helm of obedience
1 engineered plague
1 chains of mephistopholes
1 toxic deluge
1 misdirection
1 trinisphere
1 ensnaring bridge


match 1 on the draw vs show and tell, team lost
game 1 turn 2 show and tell into emrakul, forcing my force, no time to get bridge.
game 2 a turn 2 tezzeret + revealing thopter foundry, turn 3 bridge transmute, he intuitions into 3 show and tell, i forced the show and tell and he scooped.
game 3 i boarded in a misdirect, since i saw the wish, then my other teammates had both lost so we ended.

Match 2, on the draw vs storm, i lost, team drew when our modern player ulted liliana last hope vs a jeskai player who had 0 board at turn 5
game 1 he turn 1 probes, duresses me, turn 2 ten goblins, game was over.
game 2 i boarded out 1 bridge 1 tezz for trinisphere and plague, i had a chalice on 1 which worked well for a while, but before i got thopters online i took ten from tombs, fetches and he bounced the chalice, wished into tendrills for a kill. I totally misplayed this one, while transmuting for a win con i should have transmuted for my trinisphere.

Match 3 on the draw vs delver, I won and team won
Game 1 early bridge into tezz, into chalice, into dack into foundry he scooped.
Game 2 brought in daretti chains, abyss, and prob 1 other card, took a ton of damage from early tombs to power out cards, and he got under bridge
Game 3 he got an early DRS going but i got thopters online fast for a win.

Match 4 on the draw vs 4 color shardless pile, I won and team won
game 1 my turn 2 chalice causes him to double brainstorm into force/force, but i grind out a win at 1 life with a deluge on 2 taking out three creatures and a follow up baleful strix holding him back when i get thopters online. I got liquimetal coating and dack online, letting me take the creeping tarpit that had hit me twice since i had no bridge yet, and my hand was full of planeswalkers so bridge transmute wouldn't have helped.
game 2 go down 1 tezz, 1 signet, bring in misdirect, chains, abyss, another grindy match where he meddling mages on deluge but i have a walking ballista on board sniping his strixes. im waiting to get 8 mana in order to add 2 counters and bring the ballista to 3 in order to dump on mage since he's not really applying pressure, each of his attacks are getting in for 1 or 2. he moves to abrupt decay the ballista end of my turn and i misdirect onto meddling mage, end up making a 5/5 that pounds in every turn so he has to keep a creature up for blocking, i get to 1 life again and he scoops when he's out of blockers, making my ballista counters lethal. That misdirect was a blowout.

Match 5, on the play finally, vs 4 color control (damn). we win the match but i lost my game. This is vs a team with local guy from massachusetts named Tom Smiley, a bantblade player and repeated top 8'er at many high level events. I was glad that i wasn't vs him, he's damn good, he was on bogles in modern. There was a notable issue in the modern match where they both got GRV's because they let my team resolve a thoughtseize thru leyline, it was tucked into the corner of the playmat and the game went on a while so they just forgot it was there. they had gone too far to rewind at that point. My teammember made a giant pile of tokens and topdecked a manamorphose off of a faithless looting to have white for a crackling doom that ate Tom's only creature (which had lifelink) and took 5 permanants off the board to win the match.
game 1 and 2, all i have to say is that mainboard redelemental blast is super metagaming, and having rise // fall act like hymn's 5-8 is bonkers. i dont know what his split was but every game i got forced, REB'ed, k-commanded for break,discard, and hymned into rise//fall into snap/rise//fall and i was able to assemble nothing. miserable game two as well. Thankful my teammates pulled that one through.

Match 6 opponent no-shows

Match 7 on the draw vs elves, i lose this one and team lost the match.
game 1 early chalice holds it down but i take incremental damage from tombs, drs and small attacks. he draws early rec sage on an early bridge and i never find a way to replace it.
I bring in bridge, spyglass, abyss, plague
game 2 same story, i lock it down, he lands an early nissa, he rec sages the bridge lands a scavaging ooze. i plague, he misplays when he exiles the sage to pump a scooze attack realizing nissa could have bought it back. I never find a second bridge or a way to fight back, hand was good for a lock but draws didnt cooperate again.
Saw 0 tezzeret's this game, which sucked.

Match 8, on the play vs dredge (had mana). we were seated next to these guys last round so my teammates knew what they were on and informed me. I won and my team won.
game 1 an early chalice on 1 into early bridge into thopter foundry and he scooped.
game 2 turn 0 leyline, we took a while on this one, he discarded to hand size after his second turn i think, afterwards started playing LED's, i stole them with dack and played liquimetal coating and he scooped. He revealed he brought in Serenity (white + 1 enchantment, at the beginning of your upkeep destroy all artifacts and enchantments). Dont have this card played against you!.

so my team ultimately went 5-2-1, and i get to play legacy maybe 3-4 times a month so i was really proud of this result, and my team was freaking amazing. our mardu pyromancer player is top notch and our standard player and team leader was on the mono green deck and he won vs control matchups that i thought were lost. I really like the deck but i dislike how inconsistent it can be. I'm definitely looking for better ways to assemble the pieces i need and some redundancy like i have in the modern version of the deck. That one draw knocked us out of day 2, so my recommendation is to have your teammates press your opponents on long turns. we had one dude tank for 3 mins, call a judge, get a NO answer, tank for 3 mins and pass doing nothing. an 8 minute turn that did nothing isn't acceptable, so stay on top of this and do NOT get draws due to time.

note: im still trying to figure out if round 6 or 7 was the no-show opponents, cant recall.

Thanks for reading!
Nick Furno

[kingtk3]

Hello Everyone,
I got to play in GP Toronto this weekend with my team ending 5-2-1. a Draw in round 2 (that our modern player was winning easily if we were not in turns) really hosed us for the day 2 qualification.
Here's how I did with this list:

1 Tezzeret the seeker
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dakc Fayden
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge
3 Baleful Strix
1 Walking ballista
4 Chalice of the void
4 Mox Diamond
3 Dimir Signet
1 Liquimetal Coating
3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
2 ensnaring Bridge
4 Force of Will

1 Swamp
2 island
2 polluted delta
2 scalding tarn
2 underground sea
2 volcanic island
2 city of traitors
1 seat of the synod
1 academy ruins
1 inventors' fair
4 ancient tomb

Sideboard:
1 daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 ghiapur aether grid
1 sorceress spyglass
1 the abyss
4 leyline of the void
1 helm of obedience
1 engineered plague
1 chains of mephistopholes
1 toxic deluge
1 misdirection
1 trinisphere
1 ensnaring bridge
...


Nice reading, thank you.

You listed 58 cards, maybe you forgot 2 lands? Playing the full set of Diamonds with only 20 lands seems too inefficient, moreover you play many colorless lands which can be an issue if you don't find or can't play your mana stones.

Moving on the spells, I see the appeal of Liquimetal coating with Dack and Daretti, but I found it pretty luckster: this deck is full of air and I don't like adding another do_nothing_spell_unless_I_have_something_else (like swords and thopters). Did you ever draw it in the wrong moment?

Only 3 baleful strix harm my heart... I'd sooner play 3 Tezz AoB then 3 strix.

For the rest seems a pretty stock list: I still can't find myself playing Fow with such a low Blu pitch count, especially since basically all you would pitch are your business spell and you'll be left with mana stones and maybe a chalice after. But FoW is present in many succesful lists, so it has its merits.

PS: with your mana base, assuming you'r playing 22 lands, I'd switch a Mox for an Izzet signet, in order to have another source of red mana which is not card disadvantage ;)

[bruizar]

Nice reading, thank you.

You listed 58 cards, maybe you forgot 2 lands? Playing the full set of Diamonds with only 20 lands seems too inefficient, moreover you play many colorless lands which can be an issue if you don't find or can't play your mana stones.

Moving on the spells, I see the appeal of Liquimetal coating with Dack and Daretti, but I found it pretty luckster: this deck is full of air and I don't like adding another do_nothing_spell_unless_I_have_something_else (like swords and thopters). Did you ever draw it in the wrong moment?

Only 3 baleful strix harm my heart... I'd sooner play 3 Tezz AoB then 3 strix.

For the rest seems a pretty stock list: I still can't find myself playing Fow with such a low Blu pitch count, especially since basically all you would pitch are your business spell and you'll be left with mana stones and maybe a chalice after. But FoW is present in many succesful lists, so it has its merits.

PS: with your mana base, assuming you'r playing 22 lands, I'd switch a Mox for an Izzet signet, in order to have another source of red mana which is not card disadvantage ;)

i'd play kolaghan's command or abdrade to make use of liquimetal coating more often without slotting additional deadcards

[kingtk3]

i'd play kolaghan's command or abdrade to make use of liquimetal coating more often without slotting additional deadcards

That can make sense. Lately I found myself thinking about adding KCommand and/or Abrade and/or Collective brutality to the deck too (not sure if in the main or in the side), but I didn't find space. I wasn't thinking about Liquimetal coating, just about how good those cards are by themselves, just to be clear :)

How are you thinking to integrate those cards in the deck.

For reference, my last played list is

4 chalice of the void
3 ensnaring bridge
2 sword of the meek
3 thopter foundry
3 dimir signet
3 Mox Diamond
1 Trinisphere
1 Search for Azcanta
2 transmute artifact
2 Toxic Deluge
4 baleful strix
3 Dack fayden
2 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
3 tezzeret, agent of bolas
1 Tezzeret the seeker
3 underground sea
2 Badland
2 volcanic island
2 island
1 swamp
4 polluted delta
1 Scalding tarn
1 bloodstained mire
4 ancient tomb
1 Inventors' Fair
1 academy ruins
1 city of traitors

SIDE
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 chains of mephistopheles
2 slaughter games
2 Sorcerous spyglass
1 Nether Void
1 The Abyss
1 Engineered plague
2 blood moon

[nfurno]

Nice reading, thank you.

You listed 58 cards, maybe you forgot 2 lands? Playing the full set of Diamonds with only 20 lands seems too inefficient, moreover you play many colorless lands which can be an issue if you don't find or can't play your mana stones.

Moving on the spells, I see the appeal of Liquimetal coating with Dack and Daretti, but I found it pretty luckster: this deck is full of air and I don't like adding another do_nothing_spell_unless_I_have_something_else (like swords and thopters). Did you ever draw it in the wrong moment?

Only 3 baleful strix harm my heart... I'd sooner play 3 Tezz AoB then 3 strix.

For the rest seems a pretty stock list: I still can't find myself playing Fow with such a low Blu pitch count, especially since basically all you would pitch are your business spell and you'll be left with mana stones and maybe a chalice after. But FoW is present in many succesful lists, so it has its merits.

PS: with your mana base, assuming you'r playing 22 lands, I'd switch a Mox for an Izzet signet, in order to have another source of red mana which is not card disadvantage ;)

Thank you for your feedback! your points are valid, and I'll consider them for updates to the list. I did miss 2 flooded strand in this list.
The Baleful Strix cut was actually something we did in order to make room for the 4th tezz and third signet. We had a padeem mainboard and cut that as well. We wanted to get the card selection going on T2 as much as possible.
For liquimetal, yes we saw it at times we didnt need it, or didnt have dack or daretti (make your land an artifact and kill it), but with all of the card selection in the deck it wasn't too bad.

[nfurno]

That can make sense. Lately I found myself thinking about adding KCommand and/or Abrade and/or Collective brutality to the deck too (not sure if in the main or in the side), but I didn't find space. I wasn't thinking about Liquimetal coating, just about how good those cards are by themselves, just to be clear :)

How are you thinking to integrate those cards in the deck.

For reference, my last played list is

4 chalice of the void
3 ensnaring bridge
2 sword of the meek
3 thopter foundry
3 dimir signet
3 Mox Diamond
1 Trinisphere
1 Search for Azcanta
2 transmute artifact
2 Toxic Deluge
4 baleful strix
3 Dack fayden
2 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
3 tezzeret, agent of bolas
1 Tezzeret the seeker
3 underground sea
2 Badland
2 volcanic island
2 island
1 swamp
4 polluted delta
1 Scalding tarn
1 bloodstained mire
4 ancient tomb
1 Inventors' Fair
1 academy ruins
1 city of traitors

SIDE
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 chains of mephistopheles
2 slaughter games
2 Sorcerous spyglass
1 Nether Void
1 The Abyss
1 Engineered plague
2 blood moon

Wow this list looks great! how has search for azcanta performed for you, and what are you typically bringing slaughter games in for?

[malfie13]

Hi, all. I am a longtime legacy player, although i usually play MUD or gb pox depths. I tried out tezzerator for 2 weeks, and it was a bunch of fun. I did have a question for you longtime players. Whay dont any lists i fond onlibe run either impulse or intuition. They both seem like they would be good. I tried it out with intuition, and it ran super smoothly. Here was the list i ran to two 3.0.1 weeks. Draws were intentional.

Deck: Legacy Tezzerator 5-23-18.dec

Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard

Creatures:5
1 Walking Ballista
4 Baleful Strix

Spells:33
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Mox Diamond
1 Mox Opal
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
2 Dimir Signet
3 Impulse
1 Sword of the Meek
2 Thopter Foundry
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Dack Fayden
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Toxic Deluge
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Force of Will

Lands:22
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
2 Wasteland

Sideboard:15
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Mindbreak Trap
1 The Abyss
1 Force of Will
1 Misdirection

Considered trickbind, but fought the urge.

[Peebs]

As promised, I kept better notes this GP and have a report of my time in Toronto.

TLDR: I didn't do very well, but had a ton of fun



4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista
3 Mox Diamond
3 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
3 Dack Fayden
4 Force of Will
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge
3 Island
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Academy Ruins

4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 The Abyss
2 Walking Ballista
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Trinisphere
1 Lodestone Golem
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation

After each description, I'll report my personal record, rather than my team's.

Round 1: Lands

G1: Turns 1 and 2 consisted of chalice on 1 and 2, followed shortly by a Tezz to start the chalice beats.
G2: Kept a slow hand, lost to a turbo-depths style opening.
The other two members of my team lost their matches while we were in Game 3, and my opponent didn't wanted to finish the match. I had a leyline of the void so when I got to Helm I'd probably win, but I guess we'll never know.
0-0

Round 2: Lands

G1: Kept a bad hand (this turned out to be a theme throughout the day, maybe I should mulligan more?) and lost to a fast Marit Lage.
G2: This was one of the most fun games I have ever played with this deck! I got all 3 planeswalkers out at the same time, in a great position to win the game next turn, but forgot to cast the ensnaring bridge in my hand, and died before I could get that next turn to Marit Lage. Oh well.

0-1

Round 3: Slivers(!)

G1: My mana was bad, his Aether Vial let him get a fast start and whomped me.
G2: I assembled a very quick Thopter Sword and won from there.
G3: I got down to 5 life before I could find a Toxic Deluge to clear up the board, and had a 1 turn window to dodge Crystalline Sliver before I could land The Abyss and Chalice on 2. Opponent conceded after I got the lock.

1-1

Round 4: Sneak and Show

G1: Opponent's turn 2 show lets me drop my bridge to his Emrakul, and with no MD ways to get rid of it, he conceded.
G2: Lost to a Through the Breach'd Emrakul to clear up my Baleful Strix (and the rest of my permanents) I kept back to block.
G3: Kept a slow hand, lost to a quick Sneak Attack into Emrakul

1-2

Round 5: No show
We're in that part of the bracket now, boys!

Round 6: Lands

G1: I had lots of lock pieces and redundancies and opponent had enough after a bit.
G2: Slow hand, lost to a quick tireless tracker
G3: Double Leyline into Helm activation snatched a victory

2-2

Round 7: Nic Fit

G1: Maindeck Abrupt Decay really sucks, and I lost to a flurry of standard playable beaters.
G2: Lodestone Golem was not enough to protect me this time, and I quickly ran out of pressure while opponent assembled a fearsome force.

2-3

Round 8: Czech Pile

G1: He Forced my first chalice, but my second one stuck and let me Thopter Sword to a loooong victory.
G2: Very close to dying to DRS eating my spells, but with just enough life, I transmuted into Helm for the helm kill.

3-3

If you saw me on Day 1, I had a mask on so I wouldn't cough on anyone. I am still getting over being sick for a while, but that day it was particularly bad.

Overall, I had a ton of fun playing the deck, but I'm not sure the meta is in the right place for it anymore. The blue decks are adapting to Chalice of the Void decks, and even with its resiliency, I'm not sure Tezz is at its best here. That's not going to stop me from jamming it every chance I get, but that's my opinion on where it stands in the meta.

Also I know a couple of people recognized me and said Hi, so I'm sorry if I didn't recognize you as well, but it made me feel funny for my sliver of internet-fame :)

[nfurno]

As promised, I kept better notes this GP and have a report of my time in Toronto.

TLDR: I didn't do very well, but had a ton of fun



4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista
3 Mox Diamond
3 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
3 Dack Fayden
4 Force of Will
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge
3 Island
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Academy Ruins

4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 The Abyss
2 Walking Ballista
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Trinisphere
1 Lodestone Golem
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation

After each description, I'll report my personal record, rather than my team's.

Round 1: Lands

G1: Turns 1 and 2 consisted of chalice on 1 and 2, followed shortly by a Tezz to start the chalice beats.
G2: Kept a slow hand, lost to a turbo-depths style opening.
The other two members of my team lost their matches while we were in Game 3, and my opponent didn't wanted to finish the match. I had a leyline of the void so when I got to Helm I'd probably win, but I guess we'll never know.
0-0

Round 2: Lands

G1: Kept a bad hand (this turned out to be a theme throughout the day, maybe I should mulligan more?) and lost to a fast Marit Lage.
G2: This was one of the most fun games I have ever played with this deck! I got all 3 planeswalkers out at the same time, in a great position to win the game next turn, but forgot to cast the ensnaring bridge in my hand, and died before I could get that next turn to Marit Lage. Oh well.

0-1

Round 3: Slivers(!)

G1: My mana was bad, his Aether Vial let him get a fast start and whomped me.
G2: I assembled a very quick Thopter Sword and won from there.
G3: I got down to 5 life before I could find a Toxic Deluge to clear up the board, and had a 1 turn window to dodge Crystalline Sliver before I could land The Abyss and Chalice on 2. Opponent conceded after I got the lock.

1-1

Round 4: Sneak and Show

G1: Opponent's turn 2 show lets me drop my bridge to his Emrakul, and with no MD ways to get rid of it, he conceded.
G2: Lost to a Through the Breach'd Emrakul to clear up my Baleful Strix (and the rest of my permanents) I kept back to block.
G3: Kept a slow hand, lost to a quick Sneak Attack into Emrakul

1-2

Round 5: No show
We're in that part of the bracket now, boys!

Round 6: Lands

G1: I had lots of lock pieces and redundancies and opponent had enough after a bit.
G2: Slow hand, lost to a quick tireless tracker
G3: Double Leyline into Helm activation snatched a victory

2-2

Round 7: Nic Fit

G1: Maindeck Abrupt Decay really sucks, and I lost to a flurry of standard playable beaters.
G2: Lodestone Golem was not enough to protect me this time, and I quickly ran out of pressure while opponent assembled a fearsome force.

2-3

Round 8: Czech Pile

G1: He Forced my first chalice, but my second one stuck and let me Thopter Sword to a loooong victory.
G2: Very close to dying to DRS eating my spells, but with just enough life, I transmuted into Helm for the helm kill.

3-3

If you saw me on Day 1, I had a mask on so I wouldn't cough on anyone. I am still getting over being sick for a while, but that day it was particularly bad.

Overall, I had a ton of fun playing the deck, but I'm not sure the meta is in the right place for it anymore. The blue decks are adapting to Chalice of the Void decks, and even with its resiliency, I'm not sure Tezz is at its best here. That's not going to stop me from jamming it every chance I get, but that's my opinion on where it stands in the meta.

Also I know a couple of people recognized me and said Hi, so I'm sorry if I didn't recognize you as well, but it made me feel funny for my sliver of internet-fame :)


Thanks for the details on your matches, it was nice to meet you at the event! I have no internet or mtg fame (other than winning states once) so i totally didnt expect that you'd know who i was. i knew you because some of your teammates are friends with my mtg judge friends edgar and matt down here at tj's where we play. By the way, i found a really fun whir list for legacy! painters servant with lots of basics and mainboard back to basics kicked my butt the other night!

[Hellraiser157]

i've been playing the following list for a couple of weeks now and i had some good results with it.
3-1 and a 4-0 in our weekly legacy tournament.

THE RETURN OF THE GRID!

// Grixis_Tezzeret

// 60 Maindeck
// 18 Artifact
3 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Mox Diamond
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sorcerous Spyglass

// 5 Creature
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista

// 1 Enchantment
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid

// 5 Instant
4 Force of Will
1 Fire // Ice

// 22 Land
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Academy Ruins
1 Scalding Tarn
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Flooded Strand
1 Vault of Whispers

// 6 Planeswalker
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden

// 3 Sorcery
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge


// 15 Sideboard
// 7 Artifact
SB: 2 Trinisphere
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

// 3 Creature
SB: 2 Thought-knot Seer
SB: 1 Spellskite

// 2 Enchantment
SB: 2 Blood Moon

// 1 Instant
SB: 1 Kozilek's Return

// 1 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

// 1 Sorcery
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge

===================================================
My main approach was to reduce the number of empty/bad top decks and still keep up the core of the deck.

Card Choices and Numbers:

3x Signets
2x Mox Diamonds
- just 2 Mox Diamonds worked quite well for me, don't need them when the game goes longer, which it normally does. signets are more important, because they can be transmuted easier

1x Ghirapur Aethergrid
- it has been gone from recent Tezzeret Lists for awhile. i figured with so many X/1's in the format right now, this card could be good again.
and i have to say: this enchantment has been great so far. In longer games this card becomes a true threat, while hiding behind a bridge. in combination with thopter sword: 1 mana -> 1 thopter -> 1 life -> 1 damage to any target. Walking Ballista + Grid is also a nice combination.

1x Fire//Ice
- the flex spot. this card is never dead. it deals with cards like Mom, DRS, Delver, Elves, Thalia....pretty nicely.

3x Islands
- very important to get at least 2-3 blue sources out, that can't be wastelanded or blood moon'd

1x Vault of Whispers
- one more artifact for the Grid

2x Thought-Knot Seer (Sideboard)
- my replacement for the lodestone golems. getting rid of a key card, i found, was more important and it can't be bolted.

1x Spellskite (Sideboard)
- protection against Decays, Burn, K-Commands, Echoing Truths.......

2x Blood Moon (Sideboard)
- they don't see it coming. won me a lot of games!

[nfurno]

i've been playing the following list for a couple of weeks now and i had some good results with it.
3-1 and a 4-0 in our weekly legacy tournament.

THE RETURN OF THE GRID!

// Grixis_Tezzeret

// 60 Maindeck
// 18 Artifact
3 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Mox Diamond
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sorcerous Spyglass

// 5 Creature
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista

// 1 Enchantment
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid

// 5 Instant
4 Force of Will
1 Fire // Ice

// 22 Land
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Academy Ruins
1 Scalding Tarn
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Flooded Strand
1 Vault of Whispers

// 6 Planeswalker
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden

// 3 Sorcery
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge


// 15 Sideboard
// 7 Artifact
SB: 2 Trinisphere
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

// 3 Creature
SB: 2 Thought-knot Seer
SB: 1 Spellskite

// 2 Enchantment
SB: 2 Blood Moon

// 1 Instant
SB: 1 Kozilek's Return

// 1 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

// 1 Sorcery
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge

===================================================
My main approach was to reduce the number of empty/bad top decks and still keep up the core of the deck.

Card Choices and Numbers:

3x Signets
2x Mox Diamonds
- just 2 Mox Diamonds worked quite well for me, don't need them when the game goes longer, which it normally does. signets are more important, because they can be transmuted easier

1x Ghirapur Aethergrid
- it has been gone from recent Tezzeret Lists for awhile. i figured with so many X/1's in the format right now, this card could be good again.
and i have to say: this enchantment has been great so far. In longer games this card becomes a true threat, while hiding behind a bridge. in combination with thopter sword: 1 mana -> 1 thopter -> 1 life -> 1 damage to any target. Walking Ballista + Grid is also a nice combination.

1x Fire//Ice
- the flex spot. this card is never dead. it deals with cards like Mom, DRS, Delver, Elves, Thalia....pretty nicely.

3x Islands
- very important to get at least 2-3 blue sources out, that can't be wastelanded or blood moon'd

1x Vault of Whispers
- one more artifact for the Grid

2x Thought-Knot Seer (Sideboard)
- my replacement for the lodestone golems. getting rid of a key card, i found, was more important and it can't be bolted.

1x Spellskite (Sideboard)
- protection against Decays, Burn, K-Commands, Echoing Truths.......

2x Blood Moon (Sideboard)
- they don't see it coming. won me a lot of games!

Looks Great! I'll take this version for a spin next FNM

[Hellraiser157]

Nice. Let us know how it went. :)

[steelydanno]

Hey chums,

Been playing the below list for a couple months now (tweaks here and there of course):

4 Baleful Strix
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
1 Liquimetal Coating

3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden
1 Karn, Scion of Urza

3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek

4 Mox Diamond
2 Dimir Signet

4 Chalice of the Void
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Engineered Explosives

4 Force of Will
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge

4 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
3 Island
1 Swamp
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Academy Ruins
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors

SB
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 The Abyss
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Spellskite
1 Trinisphere
1 Walking Ballista
1 Lodestone Golem
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Blood Moon
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Helm of Obedience

Having great results against almost every deck EXCEPT your favorite and mine, Grixis Delver. I don't know what my win % is against it but it's abysmal. Force Daze Pierce attack for 3.

Looking for help on solving the matchup, especially sideboard plans. What's the best way to go?

[Undomian]

I haven't really posted here in a bit, but I played a local 74-man 10k/Eternal Weekend trial to a 5-2 finish, good for 10th place and a Badlands. I played this, which isn't terribly different from what I've been playing for a long time with the exception of the Badlands, which has been awesome so far.



4 Baleful Strix

2 Transmute Artifact
3 Force of Will

4 Thopter Foundry
3 Sword of the Meek
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Chalice of the Void

4 Dack Fayden
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 Search for Azcanta

4 Mox Diamond
2 Dimir Signet

1 Academy Ruins
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Badlands
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 City of Traitors
1 Dust Bowl
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
3 Volcanic Island

Sideboard:
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1 Force of Will
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
2 The Abyss
2 Toxic Deluge


R1: Death & Taxes (2-0)
R2: Death & Taxes (2-0)
R3: Junk Lands (2-0)
R4: Nyx Fit (1-2) [It's so hard to interact with this deck on an effective level outside of LotV/FoW]
R5: Miracles (1-2) [Mostly lost this one due to tilt misplays from the grindy loss against the Nic Fit deck.]
R6: Miracles (2-0)
R7: Miracles (2-1)

I think I could have probably top 8'd the tournament if it weren't for the Nyx Fit matchup, but since that went so long and I was so tilted by the end of it (mulliganed a bunch and my draws were awful), I wasn't in the right mindset for the next match that kicked me out of contention. Deck's still great though, and with the banning of DRS I only see it getting better.

[Ephemeron]

Having great results against almost every deck EXCEPT your favorite and mine, Grixis Delver. I don't know what my win % is against it but it's abysmal. Force Daze Pierce attack for 3.

Looking for help on solving the matchup, especially sideboard plans. What's the best way to go?

Boy do I have some good news for you!

Seriously though, here's to hoping DRS getting the axe reduces the amount of K Command out there. Can't imagine too many people are gonna be pumped to play Grixis Snapcaster Control without DRS.

[steelydanno]

BOY HOWDY.

Guess it's time for Find/Replace "Goblins"


Boy do I have some good news for you!

Seriously though, here's to hoping DRS getting the axe reduces the amount of K Command out there. Can't imagine too many people are gonna be pumped to play Grixis Snapcaster Control without DRS.

[Ephemeron]

BOY HOWDY.

Guess it's time for Find/Replace "Goblins"

Haha I actually played against goblins at my weekly last Wednesday. Matchup felt pretty good, just watch out for Goblin Sharpshooter. As long as they don't have that, Thopter Sword can overpower them pretty easily. Just load up on Deluge/Whipflare and you'll be fine.

[gibsonjunkie]

Walking Ballista is also great against Goblins. I'd never run a 75 without at least one copy.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[steelydanno]

Wow, that’s a great call.


Walking Ballista is also great against Goblins. I'd never run a 75 without at least one copy.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[nfurno]

Hello Folks!
Any thoughts on the new meta and decklist changes for worcester?
For me, Misdirect is almost better than force of will. I'm running two in the side and it's been keeping the abrupt decays and force of will's in check.
Daze and spell pierce from RUG has been a pain in the ass, and the miracles list running Teferi has been really obnoxious, if they know what cards can't resolve they let everything else that doesn't matter thru.
BUT the leyline helm in the board have been amazing!
I've gotten a second chains because that card is amazing right now.
Bridge has been great and i've not run up against k-command at all, just counter magic.
Any suggestions to help get more of our spells to resolve? red ele blast or pyroblast? Running my own forces only seems to helps vs combo decks, so its a game 1 necessity, but i'm often just boarding them out if their deck isnt practicing a T2/T3 kill.

[Undomian]

Congrats to Jake Farrar for his finish at the open this weekend.


http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/122353

[nfurno]

Congrats to Jake Farrar for his finish at the open this weekend.


http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/122353

Congrats Jake!

[Ellomdian]

Hello Folks!
Any thoughts on the new meta and decklist changes for worcester?

Why, yes, now that you mention it...


For me, Misdirect is almost better than force of will. I'm running two in the side and it's been keeping the abrupt decays and force of will's in check.

I don't know if 'better' is the right word, but it's damn good. I've had 2x in the SB for a long time, and it serves double duty as FoW 5-6 and for pointing sticky spells elsewhere (Hymn, Decay, what have you.)



Daze and spell pierce from RUG has been a pain in the ass, and the miracles list running Teferi has been really obnoxious, if they know what cards can't resolve they let everything else that doesn't matter thru.

This has always been my argument for playing UB, since you can afford to take a turn or 2 to set up mana and play around Daze/Pierce. Unless RUG has an actual clock on board, you don't *have* to do anything, and since most of their permission is Cost-based, you can plan accordingly.



BUT the leyline helm in the board have been amazing!
I've gotten a second chains because that card is amazing right now.
Bridge has been great and i've not run up against k-command at all, just counter magic.

Anytime the format shifts to more graveyard-centric strategies, I think Leyline/Helm is justifiable. I think Chains is cute, but honestly, it's a Luxury card even disregarding availability. And yeah, I'm at 3 Bridges between the main and the SB now.


Any suggestions to help get more of our spells to resolve? red ele blast or pyroblast? Running my own forces only seems to helps vs combo decks, so its a game 1 necessity, but i'm often just boarding them out if their deck isnt practicing a T2/T3 kill. Again, getting key spells to resolve in the current meta is a function of playing around soft permission. If you're taking out FoWs, you should be bringing in Cards that are as impactful if they resolve as the spells you would be Forcing through. UBr is way more mana-tight that UB, but you should always at least consider how to play around Daze even if you can't beat Pierce. I'm even beginning to wonder if it might be worth playing Defense Grids if your control matchup is so poor - I've traditionally felt that the Control Matchup is one of the strengths of the archetype.

-----

As for general thoughts, I think that the DRS banning is indirectly good for Tezz (and Chalice strategies in general) because not having perfect fixing/acceleration incentives stricter manabases, and tighter mana means Stifle is good, and if Stifle is good, Delver decks will trend towards a lower curve, and lower curves run harder into CotV. I played T8 QF against Grixis with Bomat Couriers this weekend (I was playing SnS in a local 32 man cash tourney) and I was surprised at how much less scary that list feels from a Tezz perspective. My only concerns would be that I'm not sure you can afford to play most games now without a clear line, so mulligans become more sensitive.

[nfurno]

Again, getting key spells to resolve in the current meta is a function of playing around soft permission. If you're taking out FoWs, you should be bringing in Cards that are as impactful if they resolve as the spells you would be Forcing through. UBr is way more mana-tight that UB, but you should always at least consider how to play around Daze even if you can't beat Pierce. I'm even beginning to wonder if it might be worth playing Defense Grids if your control matchup is so poor - I've traditionally felt that the Control Matchup is one of the strengths of the archetype.

Thanks for your advice! I was wondering if you knew of any good starting points for a strait up blue black list could be found online?

[Ellomdian]

Thanks for your advice! I was wondering if you knew of any good starting points for a strait up blue black list could be found online?

4 Baleful Strix
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Thopter Foundry
2 Dimir Signet
4 Talisman of Dominance
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Staff of Nin
1 The Abyss

3 Transmute Artifact
1 Damnation
2 Thirst for Knowledge
4 Force of Will

3 Darkslick Shores
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Academy Ruins
1 Seat of the Synod
3 Polluted Delta
3 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Underground Sea
1 Island
1 Swamp

SB
-
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Sorcerers Spyglass
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Lodestone Golem
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Traxos, Scourge of Kroog
2 Sun Droplet
2 Misdirection
1 No Mercy


Traxos is *HILARIOUS* G2 when cards like STP get boarded out. He and his buddies (the Lodestone gang) are awfully good against any kind of control deck that is likely shaving removal, and you're not typically keeping Bridges around for that. Sun Droplets are still there cause burn is everywhere. If you want a stronger anti-graveyard plan, 3-4 Leyline and a Helmet are great board options since you can actually cast Leyline reasonably often.

I've been messing around with Search for Azcanta over TfK in 'testing' (aka fun games where I'm not playing SnS for practice) and I am becoming more interested in it with the influx of decks that are very cold to CotV starts. I think it's quite a bit stronger in the Mox Diamond lists since it's a reasonable T1 play. Honestly, if RUG (and Stifle...) wasn't making a comeback, I might be prepared to let Undomain's UBr list get some reps, but I can't imagine playing in a room with more than 10 people and dodging Delver as much as they can. Maybe something like this?


4 Baleful Strix

3 Search for Azcanta
3 Transmute Artifact
4 Force of Will

2 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Chalice of the Void

1 The Abyss
1 Damnation

3 Dack Fayden
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

4 Mox Diamond
2 Dimir Signet
-
38 Spells

4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
3 Polluted Delta
2 Bloodstained Mire
3 Underground Sea
3 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yagwmoth
1 Academy Ruins
-
22 Lands

[Ellomdian]

Small note, and apologies for the doublepost in my own thread, but I have briefly updated the OP with my current 75, along with a few notes regarding the fact that legacy is different today than it was 4 years ago :P

[Undomian]

I do keep the list in my Google doc reasonably updated if you wanted to put a more recent Grixis list in there too. :wink:

Admittedly, though, I haven't had a ton of opportunities to test new things in the new metagame, so that'll be changing soon enough. That said, RUG Delver is one of the more positive Delver variants, even with the outdated list. MB they straight up can't beat a Bridge, and even sideboard they have a difficult time dealing with most permanents in our deck (assuming you play around their Stifles and similar and can actually cast them).

[CptHaddock]

I do keep the list in my Google doc reasonably updated if you wanted to put a more recent Grixis list in there too. :wink:

Admittedly, though, I haven't had a ton of opportunities to test new things in the new metagame, so that'll be changing soon enough. That said, RUG Delver is one of the more positive Delver variants, even with the outdated list. MB they straight up can't beat a Bridge, and even sideboard they have a difficult time dealing with most permanents in our deck (assuming you play around their Stifles and similar and can actually cast them).

I have been playing your list on MTGO (or atleast a modified version, i'm playing -1 chains, -1 abyss +2 kcommands) with moderate success. The games feel a lot more winnable with DRS out of the format but sometimes they have their delver draws and you just sit there awkwardly figuring out how to not get mana screwed while still casting your spells but that is the life of a 3 color chalice deck.

The best part of MTGO is all the UWx control, one of the bread and butter matchups of Tezz. :cool:

[BirdsOfParadise]

I have been playing a somewhat different version. In ~2012 I played Tezzerator and made reference to the lists in this thread, but I didn't play this between then and now. Then about a week ago, after messing with green stompy, I had the urge to play deck with a stompy mana base that could generate big card advantage instead of just going aggro. My idea was to use Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas / The Antiquities War / Paradoxical Outcome as the card advantage generators, with Paradoxical Outcome playing off of Mox Opal, mana rocks, Tangle Wire, Baleful Strix, and Trinket Mage. Then a package of Trinket Mage targets would round out the deck. I had partial success with Paradoxical Outcome --- it's fun to draw 5 or 6 cards digging for Force of Will at instant speed when the bounced cards also generate value when you recast them. However, Paradoxical Outcome is negative tempo when you don't have a Vintage mana base, and I gradually shaved copies away in exchange for more stability until I had zero copies left. I could still see one or two copies in the main deck or sideboard, but not 4.

The Antiquities War, however, has been consistently impressive, and I've kept 4 copies in the main deck. Together with Tezzeret, the War gives you 8 ways to dig for artifacts and make them into 5/5s. The Antiquities War is very hard to remove. Most decks don't have ways to remove a 4cc enchantment. Unlike Tezzeret, it cannot be killed in combat, so you can play it and get the ball rolling even when the opponent has an active threat. Once the ball is rolling, the opponent needs to find a solution to a large number of 5/5 attackers; and even if they withstand that attack, The Antiquities War already dug twice, so you're still coming out ahead.

Another advantage of my list is that, in matchups where Chalice is good, there are effectively 8 Chalices. You can run the first Chalice into a Force of Will and get another with Trinket Mage a turn or two later. Since Force of Will is card disadvantage, this is a good chain of events.

Now that I've checked out this thread I can see that current lists have many strengths that mine does not have. For example, I'm not running Thopter/Sword, Leyline/Helm, or Dack/Crucible/Wasteland, and those all look really effective. I just thought I'd share my current list. I have played 19 Bo3 matches and 8 individual games so far --- enough to cut stuff that is obviously failing but not long enough to optimize, especially in the sideboard.

Of those Bo3 matches, only a handful were done with 4 Gemstone Caverns in the sideboard. I added this because I couldn't keep up against aggressive decks when they were on the play. I don't board them in every postboard game on the draw --- in value matchups, I leave them out. Some matchups are more about tempo than value, however, and often your manabase is under attack in those matchups, so the free land drop sometimes works. So far, Gemstone Caverns has helped me get postboard wins against Moon Stompy, UBR Death's Shadow, and Eldrazi Aggro. (I have run into Moon Stompy and Eldrazi Aggro a lot.) I would also try it against Death and Taxes, Merfolk, and Goblins, I think. A lot of these are decks where Chalice comes out, too, so this gives you room to increase your land count, if necessary, against decks that pressure your mana. I'll keep Gemstone Caverns around for now.

This list does have ways to interact with the opponent, so it's not all-in on a short game, but it's definitely less controlling than other lists here and more about getting a big alpha strike with The Antiquities War.
Games that I win: A large majority of games where I either land The Antiquities War or get 2 planeswalker activations off of Tezzeret. As always, Chalice gives free wins.
Games that I lose: Inconsistent openers. The mana base is a mixture that's hard to get right (you need colors, fast mana, and lots of artifacts --- all in the right balance). Fiery Confluence. Aggressive beatdown starts (Rabblemaster, Eldrazi) that prevent Tezzeret from sticking. Tempo/wasteland openings from the opponent are often hard, but those decks are also hosed by Chalice, so maybe it evens out.

My current list (like I said, not optimized, especially not the sideboard):

Maindeck:
4 Chrome Mox
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Underground Sea
3 Mox Opal
3 Underground River
1 Island
1 Jeweled Amulet
1 Vault of Whispers
1 Seat of the Synod

4 Force of Will
1 Tormod's Crypt

1 Engineered Explosives

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Baleful Strix
3 Dimir Signet
1 Talisman of Dominance
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Hangarback Walker

4 Tangle Wire
4 Trinket Mage
1 Thirst for Knowledge

4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 The Antiquities War
1 Traxos, Scourge of Kroog

***

Sideboard:
1 Damping Sphere
1 Cursed Totem
1 Briber’s Purse
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Helm of Possession
1 Tsabo’s Web
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Null Brooch
2 Flusterstorm
4 Gemstone Caverns

[Ellomdian]

...The Antiquities War...

I think my biggest problem with the Sagas (and this was discussed HEAVILY during the preview stage) is that they remove the versatility of Planeswalkers. There are specific actions that have a schedule for the next 2 turns, and that information (especially stapled to an expensive permanent that doesn't dramatically impact the board the turn it comes down) means the initial effect isn't often worth the cost.''

Every time a nifty Enchantment comes out, we try it, and we lose to Delvers and Dazes. Planeswalkers are the most powerful board control thing to do in the 4 Mana slot not just because of the recurring abilities, but because of the option they give you.

Side note, are you choosing not to run Diamonds? They seem like they would typically be better than Opal or Chrome Mox.

[max_sanchez_jr]

So after proxying up the deck and having an absolute blast playing it I’ve decided to buy the rest of the pieces that I need to own the deck. I was wondering how viable the deck is in a more competitive setting? And I was also wondering if The Abyss and Chains of Mephistopheles are an absolute MUST have in the deck? I may pick up an Abyss at a later date but if it’s not necessary then I’m not going to rush into buying one. Thanks for any replies in advance.

[Peebs]

The Legends enchantments have very unique effects, and there's no real substitute for them, but they aren't absolutely essential for the deck to function. They're definitely a nice-to-have, but not a need-to-have.

As far as competitiveness, Chalice decks are usually a good bet in an unknown meta. There's a high likelihood of your opponents playing CMC1 cards, and being able to shut them off some of the most popular cards in the format while protecting your gameplan is a good strategy in Legacy. I always feel like this deck has the tools to beat just about any matchup, and with the amount of tutor and search effects, you have a high chance of seeing the cards that will swing postboard games. The deck rewards you for knowing which lines are relevant against each deck, so practice against the whole format is definitely recommended.

[Ellomdian]

So after proxying up the deck and having an absolute blast playing it I’ve decided to buy the rest of the pieces that I need to own the deck. I was wondering how viable the deck is in a more competitive setting? And I was also wondering if The Abyss and Chains of Mephistopheles are an absolute MUST have in the deck? I may pick up an Abyss at a later date but if it’s not necessary then I’m not going to rush into buying one. Thanks for any replies in advance.

'Pet' cards like Chains or The Abyss are certainly not essential - you have a couple of flexible slots for the effect of your choice. You could run a Damnation in place of The Abyss and never notice it.




...As far as competitiveness, Chalice decks are usually a good bet in an unknown meta. There's a high likelihood of your opponents playing CMC1 cards, and being able to shut them off some of the most popular cards in the format while protecting your gameplan is a good strategy in Legacy.

Quoted for Truthery. Chalice decks tend to be good or bad based on the environment around them, and I like UB tools a hell of a lot more than stuff like the Mono-R Prison build. This deck has a good matchup against Control, a reasonable/even matchup against Delver strategies, and it doesn't auto-scoop to combo. Your weakest matchups are typically The Card Show And Tell, and decks that play assorted green/white value idiots. If you feel the need to cast Brainstorm, this deck isn't for you. If you want to punish those people, it might be up your alley.

[Peebs]

Unmoored Ego looks like an interesting sideboard card for a couple of reasons:

-Shores up matchups against dedicated combo decks
-Easy to get out turn 2
-Pitches to Force
-Can hit lands
-Don't need to wait for a copy to hit the GY to exile them all like Surgical

Most combo decks don't stay on an all-or-nothing plan after sideboarding, but even getting a peek through your opponent's hand and deck is good to plan any future tutor targets. Removing a wincon from some decks could be a finishing blow, though.

[heat_wave]

Surprised myself by making top4 of a local event (35 people), thought I'd share some notes. The credit for the list goes to @Hellraiser157, I only tuned a few slots according to my taste. It was the first time I played the deck vs real opponents, I only did some goldfishing the day before the event. Misplays were abundant, some of my memories might be slightly incorrect - apologies for that.


2 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Mox Diamond
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid
1 Search for Azcanta
4 Force of Will
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Academy Ruins
2 Scalding Tarn
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Vault of Whispers
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge

1 Helm of Obedience
1 Blood Moon
2 Thought-Knot Seer
1 Spellskite
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
4 Leyline of the Void
1 The Abyss
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Engineered Plague
1 Karn, Scion of Urza
1 Unmoored Ego


R1 vs Merfolk 2-1

G1 I cannot really put Foundry to use because of islandwalk. I play Bridge but draw second Force on that turn, putting me to 4 cards, and the opponent alpha strikes for the win. If there was any spell cast, I'd be able to hide under Bridge reasonably long. G2 opp debates countering my Foundry but decides not to, I don't play any islands and assemble an army of thopters; lonely TNN pumped by the lords doesn't get there in time and I successfully race. G3 I don't remember well, but there was a lot of useful permanents on my side of the board (Search, Karn, Dack, smth else) and after some struggle I closed the game with Tezz ultimate.

R2 vs Grixis Control 2-0

G1 was decided by Academy Ruins that gave me inevitability with Chalices and Bridge. Liliana's ulti didn't do much since the zombies couldn't attack, and the thopters were victorious. G2 was misplays galore. I think I had CotV for some early game disruption. I played Padeem which kept drawing me cards, and then Chains of Mephistopheles which hurt me more than my opponent. I also missed one or two activations of Dack when it could have just wrecked the opponent's hand. Still, all my permanents were too much for him.

R3 vs OmniSneak 0-2

G1 I had an early CotV which gave me plenty of time, but I couldn't get enough pressure or find Bridge. Finally, he resolved SnT and put Omniscience into play. I managed to stay alive for 2 turns of being attacked by Griselbrand and Emrakul (with Dack on some 12ish counters), but I couldn't do much else. G2 was pretty much the same, I didn't get many lock pieces, got shown an Omni, then Griselbrand, then my two Transmute Artifacts were countered and that was it.

R4 vs Esper Stoneblade 1-2

G1 I'm lucky to steal Batterskull with Dack and wipe the board with Deluge on the same turn. I proceed to draw Ghirapur Aether Grid, then Sword and Foundry, and the game's over. G2 I keep a very greedy hand and don't get the second colored mana source in time while being hit with hymns and whatnot. G3 the wheels fell off and I was just drawing air staring at Gideon and Liliana which sealed the game.

R5 vs Grixis Delver 2-0

G1 I resolve a Chalice (first was countered) which hinders the opponent enough for me to get time and assemble all I need. G2 Dack's looting helped me immensely, but after the opponent blew up my Chalice (I had a backup one but I pitched it to Transmute Artifact, which in hindsight was a bad play), he was able to shoot down Tezzeret and do some cantripping. Still, Bridge held the ground and finally I got enough artifacts to drain him for 20 with Tezz's ulti.

R6 vs Grixis Control 2-0

G1 IIRC I had Chalice, Foundry and Sword, the Strixes didn't help opponent much, he blocked with 3 to save Jace but I played Spyglass after that and that was it. G2 Padeem helped a lot, drawing me cards and protecting Chalice. Jace hit the table, I cracked Inventors' Fair for Spyglass which got countered. I could Force back but decided not to and proceeded to make tons of thopters instead, using Force to protect Foundry from KCommand.

After that, I happened to be the only lucky 4-2 to make it to top8 (8th place obviously). Every match I played, I was on the draw which might have mattered.

Quarterfinals vs Miracles 2-0

G1 I play Search for Azcanta T1 which gets forced. Then I get Thopter-Sword online early and proceed to win with 3 FoW in hand, meeting no resistance. G2 was very quick: T1 Chains, T2 Dack +1 targeting the opponent, T3 repeat, then Chains ate Celestial purge but the damage had already been done and then Dack drew me all I needed to win.

Semifinals vs Eldrazi Post 0-2

I knew this was going to be tough - the stompy version is much easier to beat. G1 I assembled Thopter-Sword early and could block 3 attackers every turn but I was not advancing my board and then All is Dust hit Foundry. I got low enough on life that playing Tezz didn't help - even if I +1'd into Bridge, I was one mana short, and -1 targeting my Dimir Signet would still make his attack lethal (I needed to block 2 out of 3 creatures). G2 I boarded all I reasonably could, including Blood Moon and Helm combo to try and close the game quickly. I was off to a good start from a mull to 6, but I had no SB gamebreakers. I assembled my combo once again, then Foundry got Dusted, I immediately topdecked another one and that kept me alive a bit longer. I found a Bridge and that protected me from the big attacks, but then Spyglass locked Foundry, Endbringer shot down the thopters and started pinging me, and Walking Ballista could go under the bridge and grow before damage (he had 15ish mana total), and soon it was over.

3rd place decider vs OmniSneak 0-2

G1 was short and brutal (Show-Omni-Emrakul). G2 I boarded heavily but my starting 7 was mediocre. After a mull I got T2 TKS and then Chalice; I had to take Emrakul because his hand had both Show and Sneak, along with Abrade and Ponder. I hit with TKS for two turns, then it was like Show (I put Bridge)-Omni-Griselbrand-draw 7-Intuition (but there were only 2 Emrakuls left, so the 3rd card was Cunning Wish)-Wish-Firemind's Foresight-Release the Ants kill. This is not unwinnable, but you gotta draw pretty much all the hate you can to put up a fight post SB. Again, if this was SnS, Bridges could have helped, but Omni doesn't care.

Got my 2 Snapcasters as a prize and a lot of fun. The deck felt great and absurdly powerful, no one was really prepared for the little thopter guys and it was much more consistent than I expected. I would probably switch Karn in SB for Daretti going forward. Trinisphere would also be good, but I don't know what else to trim for it.

[Hellraiser157]

Hi heat_wave,

great to hear, that u had success with this Grixis Build.
How was the Search for Azcanta for you? I found myself leaving it unflipped most of the time.

Have u tried the new hot tech with Antiquities War?

I'm trying 1-2 Karn, Scion of Urzas in the MB right now.

[korstructure]

I really like this deck and curious who Ark4n is or if anyone has opinions on this:

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1448950#paper
(https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1448950#paper)

4x Antiquities War and 4x Karn, Scion of Urza


Would love to hear some opinions! Also, is there a Discord for the handful of us interested? Thanks in advance!

[kombatkiwi]

I'm also interested in this variant of the deck
I'm curious about the Ensnaring Bridges which seem awkward with AQWar and Karn
I think the deck should probably try to play 1 Academy Ruins because it's very good with Baleful Strix and EE

[malfie13]

Hi all you tezz fans. I usually play mud, and recently did well at ew with the enemy (I sorry). I had a couple of questions. Why not chains or meph mb, and a second sb (assuming you own or proxy test them)? Why not run impulse to dig faster and harder? Has daretti (BR) fallen out of favor? Thanks, all.

[Peebs]

Hi all you tezz fans. I usually play mud, and recently did well at ew with the enemy (I sorry). I had a couple of questions. Why not chains or meph mb, and a second sb (assuming you own or proxy test them)? Why not run impulse to dig faster and harder? Has daretti (BR) fallen out of favor? Thanks, all.

Hi there!
To answer your questions:

Chains can be pretty clunky in the MD, and sometimes it's just plain dead against some decks, which makes it an excellent SB card. MD slots are usually pretty tight as it is, anyway.

Impulse seems alright, but you've already got Tezz, Dack, Antiquities War, and/or Karn to dig for threats/answers, and more often than not, the deck is looking to play at sorcery speed with Force as its only real card that gets played during the opponent's turn.

I'm a huge fan of BR Daretti, but lately, many decks are eschewing red entirely, opting for the more consistent UB (or even mono-U) version. Up to personal preference and card availability, I suppose; splashing a third color can warp your manabase and makes the deck more susceptible to Wasteland.


Separate topic to avoid double-posting: I came across this 5-0 list on the Wizards site that appears similar to mine, but with some notable changes:

ITOKEN (5-0)

1 Dack Fayden
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 Baleful Strix
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Transmute Artifact
3 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Dimir Signet
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Mox Diamond
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Thopter Foundry
2 Monastery Siege
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Sunken Ruins
2 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
3 Wasteland


1 Force of Will
1 Arcane Laboratory
1 Back to Basics
2 Flusterstorm
1 Guardian Beast
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 The Abyss
2 Unmoored Ego

I bolded some of the more interesting choices, and would love to hear others' opinions on them.

Maindeck:
-Daretti main is interesting as a solid creature or Pithing Needle / Spyglass removal tool, but I'm not sure it's better than another Dack. I usually prefer to leave mine on the SB and bring it in against creature-based matchups.
-Crucible of Worlds + Wasteland is a solid consideration, but it seems more at home in a UB version where the mana may be more consistent and can support increased colorless lands.
-2 Maindeck Monastery Sieges is fascinating to me, but which mode usually gets chosen? If it's Khans, again I think I might rather have Dack to double the cards seen. If it's Dragons, that seems like a decent protection plan. Also solid against discard spells, but those are usually played turn 1, and this won't come down until turn 2 at the earliest without a dream opening hand.

Sideboard:
-Arcane Laboratory is good against storm variants (and for winning counter wars), but dies to similar cards that would also take care of Chalice or Trinisphere. It also might get awkward with keeping our hand size low with Ensnaring Bridge.
-Back to Basics in a deck with such a high number of nonbasic lands seems counter-intuitive. I feel that the Crucible-Wasteland combo does a better job of handling nonbasics.
-Is Guardian Beast better than Padeem? One prois that it doesn't get countered by REB/Pyroblast, but other than that, I'm not sure what the advantage is. I haven't seen many Shatterstorms running around in lists.
-Liliana, the Last Hope is a great idea, given how successful it's been in traditional Grixis Control decks, and I don't think the double black is going to be difficult to manage.
-Unmoored Ego is game-ending against some decks, but I'm curious to know what the most common choices are against the field.

[frogger42]

ITOKEN (5-0)

1 Dack Fayden
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 Baleful Strix
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Transmute Artifact
3 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Dimir Signet
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Mox Diamond
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Sword of the Meek
2 Thopter Foundry
2 Monastery Siege
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
2 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Sunken Ruins
2 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
3 Wasteland


1 Force of Will
1 Arcane Laboratory
1 Back to Basics
2 Flusterstorm
1 Guardian Beast
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 The Abyss
2 Unmoored Ego


A few things that I really don't like about this list. Really don't like.
-16 Blue cards MD. T1 FoW is unlikely to go off. I love the option of playing Chalice + FoW for the win, especially since so many gamebreaking spells (Show and Tell, Natural Order) get around Chalice anyway. The one-two punch
-22 lands is super low, considering you run Mox Diamond, and considering a lot of 3 drops, 4 drops, Transmute Artifact. Prison decks are very mana-hungry because the curve starts at 2 and goes up to 4,5 sometimes.
-4 Sol Lands, 3 Diamonds. It's tough enough getting T1 Chalice on the play when you run 8 Sol Lands and 4 Moxen. This looks very wrong to me. I don't see any reason to run Chalice in this deck, or Sol Lands, even.
-Last thing: this deck is a million 1x and 2x cards. It's impossibly inconsistent. The strategy you rely on here is that you draw the one out the turn you need it. Cantrips get around this, but again, you don't run Brainstorm/Ponder et al.

I am really not a fan of this deck. I smell a significant amount of luck for a 5-0. Card choices look fun, but I wouldn't run this for more than 4 rounds. My $.02

[Kaono]

-Is Guardian Beast better than Padeem? One prois that it doesn't get countered by REB/Pyroblast, but other than that, I'm not sure what the advantage is. I haven't seen many Shatterstorms running around in lists.

It gets style points, that's for sure. Other pros are it protects against stuff like Pernicious Deed, can't be Karakas'd, blocks better, and in other lists would work more favorably with cards like Spellskite. Karakas/REB proof probably is the most relevant. I've definitely had my Padeem Karakas'd at inopportune moments.

[malfie13]

Thanks for the pointers. I haven't played this archetype since antiquities war was a thing. I'll definitely have to try it out.

[NickDoom]

I don't have transmute artifact but i use 2 whir of invention. UB is good or try UBr version with dack fayden

[Ellomdian]

I don't have transmute artifact but i use 2 whir of invention. UB is good or try UBr version with dack fayden
I'd have to assume that the UBr version is going to be more powerful with Whir - the UB version doesn't have nearly as many cheap artifacts (ahem, Mox Diamond...) sitting around.

[NickDoom]

I'd have to assume that the UBr version is going to be more powerful with Whir - the UB version doesn't have nearly as many cheap artifacts (ahem, Mox Diamond...) sitting around.

i have mox diamond... in the last week i bought dack fayden and some stuff but de transmute is very expensive

[UnOrthodox Bird]

...


2 Dimir Signet
3 Thopter Foundry
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Sword of the Meek
3 Mox Diamond
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid
1 Search for Azcanta
4 Force of Will
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Academy Ruins
2 Scalding Tarn
1 City of Traitors
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Vault of Whispers
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Dack Fayden
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Toxic Deluge

1 Helm of Obedience
1 Blood Moon
2 Thought-Knot Seer
1 Spellskite
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
4 Leyline of the Void
1 The Abyss
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Engineered Plague
1 Karn, Scion of Urza
1 Unmoored Ego


...

Hello All!

I am rather new to the deck and playing something incredibly similar to the above list, but I am reaching out to ask if anybody with experience on the deck could possibly give some tips for general sideboarding? Specifically for some of the cards here but mainly for what you are aiming to trim. I saw a post on reddit a few months back that kind of gave loose advice of trim chalice versus chalice and force versus control decks, but I am unsure if that rings true and what else I could expect to trim during certain matchups.

Any and all advice you are willing to give will go a long way! Thank you all so much in advance!

[Peebs]

Hello and welcome!

As you've probably already experienced, knowing when your Chalices are dead is a critical part of playing the deck; it's often the first card to come out in the matches where it's not needed. Beyond that, I'll trim a Signet, Deluge, some Thopter Sword pieces, Forces, and sometimes Dack(s) to make room for more impactful SB cards.

Remember that Chalice is your trigger to remember, and sometimes with a very cluttered battlefield it can be easy to forget that it's there. Also, make sure you don't have both Padeem and The Abyss on the battlefield at the same time!

[heat_wave]

Hello All!

I am rather new to the deck and playing something incredibly similar to the above list, but I am reaching out to ask if anybody with experience on the deck could possibly give some tips for general sideboarding? Specifically for some of the cards here but mainly for what you are aiming to trim. I saw a post on reddit a few months back that kind of gave loose advice of trim chalice versus chalice and force versus control decks, but I am unsure if that rings true and what else I could expect to trim during certain matchups.

Any and all advice you are willing to give will go a long way! Thank you all so much in advance!

Hi! There's better players than me, but since you quoted my post, I'll try to recall my sideboarding decisions from that time (haven't played magic since), hope that helps. I usually sideboard ad hoc, without side-in and side-out slots written down by matchup.

Control (UW): side-out removal/sweepers, 1-2 strixen, bridges. It's unlikely they'll keep the swords in, which is a good reason to side-in TKS and Padeem along with Chains and Karn. Add a Spellskite if you want an extra body and protection for important permanents. Because there's not enough to side out, I prefer to keep some Forces.
Control (Grixis): pretty much the same as above.

Combo (graveyard): side-out ballista, grid, probably explosives, search, 1-2 planeswalkers; in go the leylines and whatever disruption looks best.

Combo (other): again, removal/sweepers are less necessary, and you can add TKS, Unmoored Ego and Chains, or Blood Moon vs land-based combo. There's not too much disruption in this build, and the deck is obviously not as consistent as xerox decks, so given enough time, they'll combo you out. With that in mind, you can add leyline-helm combo and try to get lucky. Use your judgment on that one.

Chalice decks: drop chalices for sure; ballista, grid and maybe explosives vs big eldrazi, add disruption. The Abyss shines vs eldrazi.

Aggro: trim Azcanta, spyglass (if you expect no meaningful targets), some forces and walkers, add plague, abyss and TKS/Karn.


This is a bit messy, but in general I'm reluctant to drop all forces (except matchups like D&T where it's atrocious), I keep some Strixen as cantrip/wall/pitch to transmute, cut some of the thopter-sword combo if I expect graveyard hate, hardly ever cut mana sources, and try to switch gears post board if I know that opponent is not expecting this.


Edit: @Peebs is right; also, having Padeem and Chains on board is also very awkward.

[UnOrthodox Bird]

Sounds good! Thank you all so much! This deck is very out of my usual fashion (I play a lot of Doomsday/Bizarro Stormy and, more recently, 4c Phoenix), but it has always been something I thought was super rad. Got my last few cards in the mail recently and am excited to take them for a spin soon!

[Captain Hammer]

The newest addition to the deck... https://i.redd.it/wcdfm98ixgp21.png

[kombatkiwi]

IMO 6 mana is too much for this
The plus ability is nice but if you plus twice it does the same amount of lifeloss as one AOB plus and then next turn ulting it.
The -3 isn't very good and the ult is irrelevant because you should have already won after plussing it twice (it's also not even very good because it can't hit any of your other Tez/Karn or Antiquities War)
I think this Tezzeret is worse than both AOB and Artifice Master

The new Karn on the other hand might actually be playable
Karn, the Great Creator {4}
Activated abilities of artifacts your opponents control cannot be activated.
+1: Until your next turn up to one target noncreature artifact becomes an artifact creature with power and toughness equal to its converted manacost
-2: Choose an artifact card that you own in exile or outside the game, reveal it and add it to your hand

Unfortunately the +1 is worse at attacking than both Tez AOB (always make the artifact 5/5) or Karn Scion (make X/X construct token). It's nice that it kills LED/Mox but those cards are already disabled by the passive effect.
The wish effect might be really good though. You can add bullets like Bridge, Trinisphere, a value/wincondition type of card (e.g. Staff of Nin). Someone on discord even suggested Mycosynth Lattice which combines with the Null Rod passive to basically be an I-win button. If you are playing Thopter/Sword it can help you to assemble that combo. (You can even play the combo only in the sideboard and you get both pieces by using -2 twice).

You can also get e.g. Painter Grindstone combo this way but that would better as its own deck obviously because you can't cast Grindstone through your own Chalice on 1

[Foamy]

I had actually just come to the thread to talk about the new Karn!

Wishing for silver bullets seems like an effect worth considering, although since Karn doesn't have a whole lot of utility outside of that, I don't know how worthwhile it will be to have him take up a slot in the deck. Animating a random Signet or something isn't really worth running a 4-mana planeswalker for, so his one-sided Null Rod passive and his Wish ability will have to be exceptionally relevant to warrant inclusion.

If this card was any better, I would probably be worried about running into it in tournament, given how vulnerable the deck is to Null Rod.

I also agree on all fronts about Tezzeret; he's too expensive, his passive is mostly irrelevant (unless you wanna cast 0-mana Karns or something, but then you could have had Karn in play for several turns by the time you could play Tezzeret), and his -3 and ultimate aren't worth it. Half of an Agent of Bolas ultimate on a +2 and getting discounts on future planeswalkers seem sweet, but ultimately not good enough to justify running this guy.

Are Karn, Scion of Urza, Padeem, and The Antiquities War being played with decent success?

[kombatkiwi]

Thinking about the new Karn, if it's play pattern is mostly going to be the following:

Turn 1: Put a card into your hand
Turn 2: Win the game if your Karn is still alive

Is it just a worse version of Tez AOB in this deck? The play pattern is basically the same, in most matchups Karn's Null Rod ability doesn't do anything by itself and Karn's loyalty abilities are arguably worse than Tezzerets.
Creator -2 can be better than Tezzeret +1 look at top 5, but it does affect your sideboard construction in a pretty awkward way I think

Edit:
Thinking about the new Karn, if it's play pattern is mostly going to be the following:

Turn 1: Put a card into your hand
Turn 2: Win the game if your Karn is still alive

Is it just a worse version of Tez AOB in this deck? The play pattern is basically the same, in most matchups Karn's Null Rod ability doesn't do anything by itself and Karn's loyalty abilities are arguably worse than Tezzerets.
Creator -2 can be better than Tezzeret +1 look at top 5, but it does affect your sideboard construction in a pretty awkward way I think.

Edit:

The list that I'm working with would be something like the following:

4 Seat of the Synod
4 Vault of Whispers
4 Darksteel Citadel
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Academy Ruins
2 Island (or 1 island 1 Glimmervoid split, etc)
4 Mox Opal
4 Dimir Signet
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Force of Will
4 Thoughtcast
4 Baleful Strix
4 The Antiquities War

The above 48 cards feel pretty core to the deck. Then I think you want at least 2 Ensnaring Bridge. 1 EE Also seems like a slot that has a pretty high upside.

Some extra 0-drop artifacts can also help with activating Metalcraft on turn 1 and ramping affinity into Thoughtcast (e.g. Mox, Vault, WeldingJar/Bauble -> Chalice). Serum Powder is another possible option as this kind of 'consistency tool'. Maybe you're supposed to just play Lotus Petal.

I have liked Etherium Astrolabe as a fun-of (some people have also tried Artificier's Intuition in this "slot" that lets you cycle redundant chalices or moxes but I like the Astrolabe because it has slightly better synergy with Ensnaring Bridge, AWar, and Karn SOU). I feel like this effect is more necessary than it might appear because you have 20 lands but 28 mana sources and you can flood if the opponent is interacting with you.

Then in the remaining slots it seems like the choice is between Walking Ballista, the various Karns/Tezzerets, and Sai Master Thopterist.

So as a starting point, only to get an idea of how strong the different cards are, I would begin by testing the following insipid mess:

2 Bridge
1 EE
1 Astrolabe
1 Sai
1 Ballista
1 Lotus Petal
1 Welding Jar
1 Karn Scion of Urza
2 Tyler the Creator
1 Tezzeret Agent of Bolas

I would try to keep in mind whether these 0 drops are worse than baubles or how to possibly incorporate serum powders.

I think the sideboard looks something like:
KARN PACK:
1 Staff of Nin or other value bomb (Trading Post or something? Mindslaver would be funny but probably too narrow/slow)
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Artifact Ramp (Likely there will be times where you have only 4 mana for Karn and need a boost to get up to 6 mana for ending the game with Mycosynth Lattice on the following turn, so you want access to a Grim Monolith or a KCI or possibly even a Lion's Eye Diamond, I'm not sure if there is any better card for this purpose. Too bad Karn is colorless so it doesn't work with Mox Amber. Maybe the answer is Thran Temporal Gateway, which takes an extra turn but makes the Lattice uncounterable)
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Ensnaring Bridge

Other possible considerations:
Zuran Orb
Jester's Cap
Trinisphere
Spellskite?
1 Blue Artifact as a FoW Enabler (MINDLOCK ORB LOL)
Defense Grid (Probably too slow)

Not sure what non-artifacts to put, but other lists commonly seem to play Deluge, Leyline, Flusterstorm, Padeem.
The idea of using the new Karn with 3 Painter/Grindstone main and 1 of each in the board is also quite interesting but that belongs in a different thread because it's not a Chalice deck

[schweinefettmann]

So i'm a solidarity and painter player who realised that the painter build i'm going for looks suspiciously close to these tezzerator builds i've been seeing pottering around. Naturally, i figured i'd give the deck a spin.

I can also see that y'all tezzerator players are also experimenting with the new karn; it seems like it's really going to affect the meta pretty hard.

I've a few questions though. chalice is the main lock piece; but are there others that should be used? My mono blue painter list runs trinispheres, chalices and wasteland/crucible with 3 diamonds, 3 opals and 25 lands. The idea is to try to lock everything down as far as possible, then win with painter/stone (using tezz seeker, whir of invention to get the missing piece). Would something like that work in the tezzerator shell? The issue with that style of stompy i've seen is that it's very fragile in my meta, and it doesn't shut down opposing decks fast enough. Being more PW-centric and less creature-dependant means that it's less fragile, and i think the value they give would help in a longer game.

Also, is there a reason you don't run muddle the mixture? it finds both halves of the thopter/sword, and can also be used as a counter. Is it too slow/limiting?

I was trying to come up with a list for cockatrice before i commit to paper (i've been putting off geting transmute artefacts, but those seem very good!):

LANDS 25
1 Academy Ruins
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
3 Island
4 Polluted Delta
4 Seat of the Synod
2 Swamp
1 steam vents
4 wasteland

CREATURES 5
4 Baleful Strix
1 Walking Ballista

SPELLS 7
4 Force of Will
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Transmute Artifact

OTHER 23
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Dack Fayden
3 Dimir Signet
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Crucible of Worlds
4 Mox Diamond
2 Sword of the Meek
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Thopter Foundry

It's been running alright, i think. I wanna find space for the antiquities war, and i've been wondering if i should pump up the number of dack faydon and a single liquimetal coating. I suspect liquimetal coating is just cute, but the thought of being able to steal an opposing jace seems fun. Also am considering trying to find space for some number of flusterstorm and maybe a trinisphere.

So far, the build above seems ok, but a tad too slow. the more 'stock' tezzerator lists I've seen are much quicker.

[malfie13]

Hi guys. Was brewing around with this archetype again. Went 2v2 at a local legacy event this past weekend. Lost a close 1-2 to eldrazi, and a less close 2.0 vs delver which was unfortunate, and beat a bye homebrew and miracles. Felt good minus the misplays. I based the deck off a mono blue antiquities war deck that seemed a bit budget that topped a 70 person event in Europe mixed with some classic tezz elements. What would you change for the current meta? I have a wide open meta usually, although I have 2 miracles players so there is that. Thanks!



Deck: Legacy Tezzerator 4-12-19.dec

Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard

Creatures:13
3 Ornithopter
3 Baleful Strix
4 Vault Skirge
2 Sai, Master Thopterist
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation

Artifacts:18
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Darksteel Citadel
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Mox Opal
3 Seat of the Synod
2 Cranial Plating
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Talisman of Dominance
1 Ensnaring Bridge

Sorceries:6
2 Transmute Artifact
4 Thoughtcast

Instants:3
3 Force of Will

Enchantments:2
2 The Antiquities War

Others:4
2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

Lands:14
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ancient Tomb
1 Blinkmoth Nexus
1 City of Traitors
1 Inkmoth Nexus
2 Island
2 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea

Sideboard:15
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Will
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Engineered Plague
1 The Abyss

[schweinefettmann]

Hi guys. Was brewing around with this archetype again. Went 2v2 at a local legacy event this past weekend. Lost a close 1-2 to eldrazi, and a less close 2.0 vs delver which was unfortunate, and beat a bye homebrew and miracles. Felt good minus the misplays. I based the deck off a mono blue antiquities war deck that seemed a bit budget that topped a 70 person event in Europe mixed with some classic tezz elements. What would you change for the current meta? I have a wide open meta usually, although I have 2 miracles players so there is that. Thanks!



Deck: Legacy Tezzerator 4-12-19.dec

Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard

Creatures:13
3 Ornithopter
3 Baleful Strix
4 Vault Skirge
2 Sai, Master Thopterist
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation

Artifacts:18
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Darksteel Citadel
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Mox Opal
3 Seat of the Synod
2 Cranial Plating
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Talisman of Dominance
1 Ensnaring Bridge

Sorceries:6
2 Transmute Artifact
4 Thoughtcast

Instants:3
3 Force of Will

Enchantments:2
2 The Antiquities War

Others:4
2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

Lands:14
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ancient Tomb
1 Blinkmoth Nexus
1 City of Traitors
1 Inkmoth Nexus
2 Island
2 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea

Sideboard:15
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Will
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Engineered Plague
1 The Abyss

2 chains and an abyss!
I've some questions actually, 1 blinkmoth and 1 inkmoth? is there a way for you to do a poison kill at some point? or was it just because you couldn't find extra copies of them for your list?

I'd question your 3-of chalice of the void. against some decks, it's almost a free win. having only 3 means that you're lowering the chances of actually winning for free. Overall though, I'm liking how this looks. Im trying to get myself into tezzerator too, since I feel like painter is sort of what i'm looking for, but i like the idea of being even more control that what it lets me be. Is there a reason you have a 2/2 split between tez and urza? I imagine that tezzeret is a house, and can close games out (depending on how full your board looks).

Also, that one force on the board. what's that for? if you need force, isn't it worth just having all 4 in MD anyways?

[Undomian]

I've kind of fallen off of Magic for the past few months, but I'll be damned if this isn't exciting:
http://mythicspoiler.com/war/cards/blastzone.jpg

This thing has the potential to be a huge player in the format, I think. It is unfortunately very good against the builds of this deck that I like to play, but I can see a UB build with more high-drops (maybe even that new Karn!) and the inclusion of Crucible/Wasteland/this land being great.

In other spoilers, I could definitely see myself registering a copy of new Bolas in my SB for some laughs. It actually seems like it'd be okay in some grindy matchups, even if it does get blasted every possible way.

[schweinefettmann]

I've kind of fallen off of Magic for the past few months, but I'll be damned if this isn't exciting:
http://mythicspoiler.com/war/cards/blastzone.jpg

This thing has the potential to be a huge player in the format, I think. It is unfortunately very good against the builds of this deck that I like to play, but I can see a UB build with more high-drops (maybe even that new Karn!) and the inclusion of Crucible/Wasteland/this land being great.

In other spoilers, I could definitely see myself registering a copy of new Bolas in my SB for some laughs. It actually seems like it'd be okay in some grindy matchups, even if it does get blasted every possible way.

What do you have that’s cmc=1? I thought tezzerator builds were basically devoid of anything cmc 1 cuz of chalice?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[malfie13]

2 chains and an abyss!
I've some questions actually, 1 blinkmoth and 1 inkmoth? is there a way for you to do a poison kill at some point? or was it just because you couldn't find extra copies of them for your list?

I'd question your 3-of chalice of the void. against some decks, it's almost a free win. having only 3 means that you're lowering the chances of actually winning for free. Overall though, I'm liking how this looks. Im trying to get myself into tezzerator too, since I feel like painter is sort of what i'm looking for, but i like the idea of being even more control that what it lets me be. Is there a reason you have a 2/2 split between tez and urza? I imagine that tezzeret is a house, and can close games out (depending on how full your board looks).

Also, that one force on the board. what's that for? if you need force, isn't it worth just having all 4 in MD anyways?


Fair Question:

1) Yes. Cranial Plating plus inkmoth plus no actual answer is death. Becomes a must answer.

2) Chalice is a terrible topdeck. I did go up to 4, and tried it, but I really hate tding it. It's fine bc of Antiquities War and Tezz making it live, but other than a redundant chalce on 1 that may drain or swing it doesn't do anything else bc I can't chqalice on 2 or 0 without messing myself up. I also play MUD where 4 chalices is much better, bc I can chalice on 2 and zero with more imunity.

3) Tezz is so solid with Chains and Bridge. I have seen lists with no Tezzes for Antiquities War kills, only. I feel like it takes you off one avenue of victory an means you can more easilly die to other decks that you should be able to answer. Just my limited experience.

4) Force of Will is card disadvantage. I even cut it vs most fair decks. It is basically there to hedge on cray cray combo decks. I'd bring in the fourth for those, too. Otherwise fluster and taxes are just better.

[malfie13]

Explosive Zone is so good. I am already going to be running it in MUD, and it seems like a good fit in tezz too. Also can be pumped into killing other CMCs as applicable.

[frogger42]

Hi guys. Was brewing around with this archetype again. Went 2v2 at a local legacy event this past weekend. Lost a close 1-2 to eldrazi, and a less close 2.0 vs delver which was unfortunate, and beat a bye homebrew and miracles. Felt good minus the misplays. I based the deck off a mono blue antiquities war deck that seemed a bit budget that topped a 70 person event in Europe mixed with some classic tezz elements. What would you change for the current meta? I have a wide open meta usually, although I have 2 miracles players so there is that. Thanks!



Deck: Legacy Tezzerator 4-12-19.dec

Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard

Creatures:13
3 Ornithopter
3 Baleful Strix
4 Vault Skirge
2 Sai, Master Thopterist
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation

Artifacts:18
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Darksteel Citadel
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Mox Opal
3 Seat of the Synod
2 Cranial Plating
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Talisman of Dominance
1 Ensnaring Bridge

Sorceries:6
2 Transmute Artifact
4 Thoughtcast

Instants:3
3 Force of Will

Enchantments:2
2 The Antiquities War

Others:4
2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

Lands:14
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ancient Tomb
1 Blinkmoth Nexus
1 City of Traitors
1 Inkmoth Nexus
2 Island
2 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
2 Underground Sea

Sideboard:15
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Lodestone Golem
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Will
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Engineered Plague
1 The Abyss

Hey Malfie,
This looks like it's super super low on colored mana sources. You have 13 U sources, 9 B sources. I think RUG delver runs 14 U sources at a minimum, and that's so you can run all the cantrips, not UB colored spells. I'd look at lists that run UB spells, like Grixis, and run more colored sources than they do - you don't have access to cantrips to find your lands. On top of that, I'd only commit to Ux or Bx spells, like Antiquities War and The Abyss, because those are the only spells you can reliably cast.

My $.02 - an Affinity manabase can't really support UB spells in it. It's incredibly wonky and unreliable. It makes you play sub-par cards, like mana rocks, so you can play good spells like Tezz AoB. I've played with this archetype a lot, and I've kept putting it away because the manabase is so unstable, esp with Chalice locking you off of Springleaf Drum and maybe other options.

And my understanding is Whir of Invention at UUU is out of the question. (For other lists where I see it in there.)

[malfie13]

Hey Malfie,
This looks like it's super super low on colored mana sources. You have 13 U sources, 9 B sources. I think RUG delver runs 14 U sources at a minimum, and that's so you can run all the cantrips, not UB colored spells. I'd look at lists that run UB spells, like Grixis, and run more colored sources than they do - you don't have access to cantrips to find your lands. On top of that, I'd only commit to Ux or Bx spells, like Antiquities War and The Abyss, because those are the only spells you can reliably cast.

My $.02 - an Affinity manabase can't really support UB spells in it. It's incredibly wonky and unreliable. It makes you play sub-par cards, like mana rocks, so you can play good spells like Tezz AoB. I've played with this archetype a lot, and I've kept putting it away because the manabase is so unstable, esp with Chalice locking you off of Springleaf Drum and maybe other options.

And my understanding is Whir of Invention at UUU is out of the question. (For other lists where I see it in there.)

I wouldnt ever whir, no. I try to keep majority spells at 1 color mana symbol in identity. So u, b, or ub. It's best. I've been enjoying this deck, but it feels very weird to run chalice to only put on one, never zero or two, as I'm majority either a stoneblade or mud player, lol. Mud I chalice bwtaeveah. Stoneblade I'm not really an fan or hater of chalice. My initial 2c. That said. The deck is pretty boss, but yea. I could see going forward taking out a couple of sol lands for some mixture of ping rainbow lands

[Mr. Safety]

I haven't played this deck but isn't Karn, the Great Creator, scientifically speaking, 'fucking insane' for this deck?

[bruizar]

I haven't played this deck but isn't Karn, the Great Creator, scientifically speaking, 'fucking insane' for this deck?

I believe 'fucking insane' is the consensus within the scientific community, although more studies are needed.

[Foamy]

What do you have that’s cmc=1? I thought tezzerator builds were basically devoid of anything cmc 1 cuz of chalice?

Blast Zone on 1 doesn't do anything against this deck

Blast Zone on 2 does everything against this deck

(Blast Zone on 3 or 4 kinda suck for us too, depending on what we have)

[schweinefettmann]

so i've been thinking more about the tezzerator deck. I think there's potential for a UB PW-heavy artefacts deck with things like the new karn, tezzerets, new narset, and things like howling mine, mycosynth lattice, anvil of bogardan as wincons, draw engines, and so on. I don't think there's space in painter, but possibly in tezzerator. Being creature-less also means that we're a lot less likely to get blown out by terminus and all that rubbish.

Also, new saheeli would churn out massive numbers of 1/1s that we can use as an alternate wincon too.

maybe it's also worth splashing red for daretti. But I'm a bit wary being so greedy with mana.

[Ellomdian]

So i'm a solidarity and painter player who realised that the painter build i'm going for looks suspiciously close to these tezzerator builds i've been seeing pottering around. Naturally, i figured i'd give the deck a spin.

Welcome fellow Board Control player!



I can also see that y'all tezzerator players are also experimenting with the new karn; it seems like it's really going to affect the meta pretty hard.


I've been running 1 TinyKarn as a wishboard engine. I'm down to 1 Bridge main since he represents one for a slight delay. Being able to have access to 1 Sword and 1 Foundry in the board is also great.



I've a few questions though. chalice is the main lock piece; but are there others that should be used?


You've cracked open one of the core discussions about how this style of deck should be played. The 3-color variants (mostly utilizing Mox Diamond) will typically run either a crucible package or occasionally more diverse lock pieces. The straight UB deck is less explosive, so it typically can't get locks on the ground before they are behind, so it can afford to defer to more expensive reactive answers like Damnation or The Abyss. I've argued before that true 'Stax'-style prison control is borderline unplayable in modern Legacy since it fumbles if it ever gets behind and answers are so efficient now.



Also, is there a reason you don't run muddle the mixture? it finds both halves of the thopter/sword, and can also be used as a counter. Is it too slow/limiting?


It's too slow. Transmute Artifact is insane, and I've frequently argued that even something like Whir is too slow. This deck will occasionally just whoopsie-doodle Thopter/Sword turn 2.



(i've been putting off geting transmute artefacts, but those seem very good!):


Much like Tabernacle, it's an old card that does a specific thing very, very well. At least Drop of Honey got a functional reprint - WotC has mostly learned their lesson with printing Tinker-esque effects. You don't *need* an Abyss or Chains to play the deck, but I genuinely believe that not having at least 2 Transmutes is just not taking advantage of some of the power level of the format.


I think there's potential for a UB PW-heavy artefacts deck with things like the new karn, tezzerets, new narset, and things like howling mine, mycosynth lattice, anvil of bogardan as wincons, draw engines, and so on. I don't think there's space in painter, but possibly in tezzerator. Being creature-less also means that we're a lot less likely to get blown out by terminus and all that rubbish.

Also, new saheeli would churn out massive numbers of 1/1s that we can use as an alternate wincon too.

maybe it's also worth splashing red for daretti. But I'm a bit wary being so greedy with mana.

There's been a Turbo-Narset list formenting in the back of my head for a while now (spoiler alert it includes Stasis), and Anvil is a natural match. But I think you're wholly abandoning the 4-CMC engine, and I honestly don't even know if you run Sol Lands anymore if you aren't trying to make 2 on 1 and 4 on 2 - if you aren't trying to win with Thopter Sword, Tezz becomes much less attractive, and I don't know if you want such a mana-intensive wincon, Stasis or no.

[NickDoom]

Hello guys. I try to use this list. Any ideas ???

Mainboard [60]

4x Baleful Strix
3x Tribute Mage
2x Walking Ballista

4x Thoughtcast

4x Force of Will
2x Spell Pierce

2x Karn, Scion of Urza
4x Karn, the Great Creator
1x Tezzeret, Artifice Master

4x Chalice of the Void
2x Dimir Signet
3x Lotus Petal
3x Mox Opal
1x Sword of the Meek
2x Thopter Foundry

4x Ancient Tomb
2x Cavern of Souls
2x City of Traitors
2x Glimmervoid
1x Inventors' Fair
3x Island
4x Seat of the Synod
1x Vault of Whispers


Sideboard [15]

1x Walking Ballista
1x Sai, Master Thopterist
2x Padeem, Consul of Innovation

2x Toxic Deluge

2x Flusterstorm

1x Ensnaring Bridge
1x Mycosynth Lattice
1x Sorcerous Spyglass
1x Thopter Foundry
2x Tormod's Crypt
1x Sword of the Meek

[Ellomdian]

Hello guys. I try to use this list. Any ideas ???

I don't like most board control lists that reach with cards like Lotus petal, because it's too easy to cleanly answer most all-ins in the format right now. If you're not trying to kill them the turn you are saccing petal, you're going to be so behind.

Honestly, you might get better feedback on a thread more focused on the Turbo-Karn idea (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?33021-Urza-stompy-Because-he-s-awesome).

[non-inflammable]

i posted in the POX thread after someone mentioned contamination.
then someone said UB Tezz can slot in contamination so i'd like the hivemind here to massage out a list.

before anyone posts about this being subpar, i do not "need" to win the match, i need to get a contamination lock.
if you have a suggestion other than UB Tezz for contamination, PM me...

i've read for about a day and picked a few lists and this is what i'd like to start with:


4 baleful strix

4 tezzeret, agent of bolas

4 bitterblossom
4 contamination

4 chalice of the void
1 crucible of worlds
1 ensnaring bridge
2 sword of the meek
3 thopter foundry

2 talisman of dominance
3 Mox Diamond

4 force of will
1 transmute artifact


23 Lands

4 underground sea
4 polluted delta
1 island
1 swamp
4 ancient tomb
1 academy ruins
2 city of traitors
2 wasteland
2 urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
2 mishra's factory


are there any large holes in my list for trying to get and keep a contamination lock?

i've played ophiomancer in a stax list and it was a superstar, still considering it.
i'm also considering one reassembling skeleton, as well
trading post would be funny for making goats, too.


i ran this pretty pile, but sadly, the bitterblossoms and contaminations were the weakest cards.

https://i.imgur.com/utMmj5d.jpg

[Foamy]

This thread hasn't had too much activity lately, but I'd like to get people's input about a few cards that have been printed this year.

Karn, the Great Creator is going to be really awful to play against, since our deck is so vulnerable to Null Rod effects, and the card has gained a decent amount of popularity with Bomberman resurfacing and plenty of colorless decks already slotting it in with minimal effort. If we want to run Karn ourselves, which maindeck slots should we sacrifice in order to incorporate him? Gaining access to a wishboard of our own will also be super helpful, but do we trim numbers on cards that we would wish for with Karn anyway?

Collector Ouphe might not be super popular, but it's another Null Rod effect and I feel like it significantly worsens our matchup against green creature decks in sideboarded games, especially if they have access to Green Sun's Zenith. If Karn causes other artifact-based decks to grow in popularity, then I can see this guy appearing in more and more green sideboards.

Goblin Engineer could possibly be worth considering if we go for a Grixis build, finding Thopter Sword pieces, Ensnaring Bridge, Trinisphere, and other important artifacts.

Tribute Mage can also find either half of the Thopter Sword combo, along with other artifacts like Signets, Sorcerous Spyglass, etc.

Saheeli, Sublime Artificer doesn't seem too amazing for our deck, but Narset, Parter of Veils might be worth running. We already know how great her static ability is, and since we tend to have so many 1- and 2-ofs in our deck (along with silver bullet sideboard cards), I feel like we can get a lot of mileage out of her -2.

Tezzeret, Master of the Bridge is disappointing because I want him to be better, but overall not good enough. I wish he had a cost like 7UB and had affinity for artifacts himself.

Urza, Lord High Artificer might be really really great, but he might also be win-more. He obviously interacts very favorably with the Thopter Sword combo, but is the floor of the card good enough to warrant inclusion? I'm tempted to run a 4-drop that comes with a Karnstruct token and generates card advantage throughout the game, but given how tight the decklists for this archetype are, I don't know if it's the right call.

Emry, Lurker of the Loch seems like a neat recursion engine, but again, our slots are so tight that we might not be able to justify running her.

[malfie13]

Not sure if people dont use this site or if theres a discord someone could point me to, but I've been feeling like the proper answer to the meta is a deck that has disruption, countermagic and hate, so I reinterpreted this deck, a bit. I'd love to hear the take of more experienced players. Let me know what you think!

Deck: Legacy Yorion Tezzerator 5-4-20.dec

Counts : 80 main / 15 sideboard

Creatures:10
4 Baleful Strix
2 Emry, Lurker of the Loch
1 Lodestone Golem
3 Urza, Lord High Artificer

Artifacts:22
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mishra's Bauble
4 Mox Opal
1 Seat of the Synod
2 Ichor Wellspring
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Sword of the Meek
2 Thopter Foundry
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Trading Post

Sorceries:5
3 Transmute Artifact
2 Toxic Deluge

Instants:12
4 Impulse
2 Force of Negation
2 Intuition
4 Force of Will

Others:8
4 Karn, the Great Creator
4 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

Lands:23
1 Academy Ruins
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Flooded Strand
3 Island
1 Misty Rainforest
2 Mystic Sanctuary
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
2 Swamp
3 Underground Sea

Sideboard:15
1 Lodestone Golem
1 Yorion, Sky Nomad
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Damping Sphere
1 Liquimetal Coating
1 Thopter Foundry
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Helm of Obedience
2 Blink of an Eye
4 Leyline of the Void