I have a dream about Legacy

[Gheizen64]

Dear WotC, i have a Dream:

Legendary duals land that while not as good as the original would still relieve a lot of stress from tri colors decks in term of money and allow more and more people to actually play the format they enjoy and love

Wasteland and Forces, in new forms, on paper, for us to be able to play with them again, to be able to destroy more and more lands and counter more and more broken spells

All Fetchlands in M15, easing not only our hardships but also those of our Modern brothers, because we may play different, but we all play the same game

A full 10-card cycle of Horizon Canopy, to give aggressive decks a viable and true alternative to duals, and even more duals that are situationally betters than the originals, to make for more different and varied manabases, as difference may be the bane of netdeckers, but the happiness of man

I have a dream about red being the aggressive color again, with blue not the best creature colore anymore, and black back on the spotlight, because of any color we may be, we are all the same and we should all play on the same grounds as never has been done before

Dear WotC, we can make all of those reprints and new prints in sets with limited prints runs, like Modern Master. More than 4 thousand people lined to play Modern Master. That was an excellent idea. There's also no reason to have those sets with only reprints. You can use those as commanders presets, adding some new cards that are viable alternative to duals for example, like one of those i listed before. This would also make easier for you to make something like a Modern Master each year, without the need to reprint the same cards over and over. Just add some new spice. Those cards don't need to be playable, either. They can be a lot of common to make for some fun limited format, without making those cards good in constructed. They may be goofy, memorable, throwbacks to Bouncing Beebles, they may be everything, and they may be with us, and our dollars (or euros) in your wallets.

We don't need to have only a single GP for "Modern Masters" variants. I love limited, it's the only format i play paper magic nowadays. If there was such a GP in Europe, i'd play that in a heartbeat. Make a GP in Europe a couple of week after the one in the US , and you'd get similar attendances. Flights in Europe are cheap, and people play eternal here. Having a weekend in Berlin, to visit and play some Limited? Why not i'd love that. Or in Prague, or in Munich, Varsavia, there are a lot of interesting places, even semi-unknown that have lot of history and museums and things you want to see in Europe. I'd love to have such a GP in a coastal city in Greek for example. Four thousands smelly nerds going to the beach.
Even better, make them twice an year. They wouldn't be "Legacy" GP, but i think they would cater to those audiences a lots. People that want to play with old cards. I'd personally love to play Limited with many old cards, and i know of friends that would love too, as constructed formats are a bit of a mess too follow, but anyone 's up for some booster drafts weekend.

Dear WotC, let us all fulfill our dreams, of full wallets, and happy players.

[Koby]

http://www.priestsforlife.org/africanamerican/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/MLK-I-have-a-dream-speech.jpg

"I have a dream, that a Legacy deck will not defined by the color of its cards, but by the quality of its cantrips."

I'm probably going to hell...

[Gheizen64]

I'm probably going to hell...

Who isn't?

[apple713]

I feel like legendary duals might be the wrong direction. How about...


Flooded Rainforest
Land - Island - Forest
({T}: Add {U} or {G} to your mana pool.)
As Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield, you may Reveal your hand. If you don't, Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield tapped.

[Dice_Box]

I feel like legendary duals might be the wrong direction. How about...


Flooded Rainforest
Land - Island - Forest
({T}: Add {U} or {G} to your mana pool.)
As Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield, you may Reveal your hand. If you don't, Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield tapped.I like it, but something about it feels... I just feel like with Probe now a lot more common than it was that this card's drawback is not as painful as it once was. Still this I think is the right direction.

[(nameless one)]

Honestly I wish they have Snow Duals that have the land types so my piles of Scrying Sheets would actually have value. So I can trade them all off to finish my Fetchlands.

[apple713]

I like it, but something about it feels... I just feel like with Probe now a lot more common than it was that this card's drawback is not as painful as it once was. Still this I think is the right direction.

Information in legacy is very important.

The idea behind a possible replacement for duals is that it has to be favorable compared to shocklands, but not so good that the drawback is irrelevant.

shocklands set the bar at 2 life or ETB tapped. Having the opponent gain 2 life would be irrelevant, its one of the reasons swords is so good. Having them gain 4+ life is too good.

One idea that just came to me is

"As Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield, you may pay life equal to the amount of lands you control. If you don't, Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield tapped."

This seems like a decent compromise to shocklands cause the first one would be free, however it parallels the current shocklands too closely.

"you may have your opponent draw a card. If you don't..." card advantage is too important in legacy and these would not see play.

So card advantage and modifying life totals are out of the question.

what other subtle advantages could you give your opponent? Could you give a penalty to your self?

[Megadeus]

Information in legacy is very important.

The idea behind a possible replacement for duals is that it has to be favorable compared to shocklands, but not so good that the drawback is irrelevant.

shocklands set the bar at 2 life or ETB tapped. Having the opponent gain 2 life would be irrelevant, its one of the reasons swords is so good. Having them gain 4+ life is too good.

One idea that just came to me is

"As Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield, you may pay life equal to the amount of lands you control. If you don't, Flooded Rainforest enters the battlefield tapped."

This seems like a decent compromise to shocklands cause the first one would be free, however it parallels the current shocklands too closely.

"you may have your opponent draw a card. If you don't..." card advantage is too important in legacy and these would not see play.

So card advantage and modifying life totals are out of the question.

what other subtle advantages could you give your opponent? Could you give a penalty to your self?

I liked someones idea of having them be both types, but when they ETB, you choose one of the land types and it gains that type and loses the other. Fetchable like duals and Fix your mana in a bit more subtle sort of way

[Dice_Box]

I liked someones idea of having them be both types, but when they ETB, you choose one of the land types and it gains that type and loses the other. Fetchable like duals and Fix your mana in a bit more subtle sort of wayThat could work. That or maybe it taps for one, and the other colour costs a colourless to use?

I also had an idea of a single Colour Fetch in mind. So it could only find Red or it can only find Blue. It would not hurt much in two colour decks and would be cheaper for newer players who want fetches.

[thecrav]

I also had an idea of a single Colour Fetch in mind. So it could only find Red or it can only find Blue. It would not hurt much in two colour decks and would be cheaper for newer players who want fetches.

This is a really cool idea and probably one of the most-doable of the "making legacy cheaper" ideas around.

[Mr. Safety]

Dominaria's Trench
Land

Pay 1 life, tap: search your library for a land that can tap for more than one color of mana.

Find tri-color lands like Seaside Citadel, old fashioned dual lands, or the buddy lands like Dragonskull Summit, all without paying the extra two life for shocklands. The lands don't need to have the basic sub-types. By working around that basic stipulation they open up ANY dual-colored land as a fetchable option.

[thecrav]

Dominaria's Trench
Legendary Land

Pay 1 life, tap: search your library for a land that can tap for more than one color of mana.

Reflecting pool playable in legacy AWW YEA

[Barook]

Having the opponent gain 2 life would be irrelevant, its one of the reasons swords is so good. Having them gain 4+ life is too good.
Fetchable on-demand Punishing Fire triggers? I would play the shit out of that.


I liked someones idea of having them be both types, but when they ETB, you choose one of the land types and it gains that type and loses the other. Fetchable like duals and Fix your mana in a bit more subtle sort of way
That's actually a pretty cool idea. Now make them Wasteland-proof and they could become an actual alternative to duals:


Neo Bayou
Land - Swamp Forest
As Neo Bayou enters the battlefield, choose Swamp or Forest. Neo Bayou becomes a basic land of the chosen type.

Although that might be too good since they're strictly better than basic lands.

[Dice_Box]

Neo Bayou
Land - Swamp Forest
As Neo Bayou enters the battlefield, choose Swamp or Forest. Neo Bayou becomes a basic land of the chosen type.Bad bad idea. The punishment for having a multi coloured land is that you have to deal with Wasteland. Even if the land only taps for one colour, it should never be anything but a non basic. It would simply make the decks that run it too resilient as they could then run a whole bunch of pseudo basics and not be punished for the act. It removes a whole part of the game. I do not like this.

[Megadeus]

I'd like to point out that I did not come up with the idea for that land type, I just read it somewhere (probably on the source). But I do not think that they would be OP, and obviously though they are a tad worse than OG duals, they have their merits. Maybe have a bit of an upside?

Bayou-ish

Forest Swamp

When Bayou-ish CiP Scry 1

As Bayou-ish enters the battlefield choose Swamp or Forest. Bayou-ish loses the chosen land type.


The way Scry Lands should have been done ;)

[apple713]

This is a really cool idea and probably one of the most-doable of the "making legacy cheaper" ideas around.

Fetchlands arnt the barrier to entry... its the dual lands. fetchlands are reprintable and I expect to see the ONS fetches reprinted soon.

One of the easiest ideas is just to employ one of the ideas in existence already. The lands that ETB tapped unless you control 2 or fewer lands are good, but would be great if they were fetchable. I'm not sure why they don't include these subtypes on the lands.

[Dice_Box]

I'd like to point out that I did not come up with the idea for that land type, I just read it somewhere (probably on the source). But I do not think that they would be OP, and obviously though they are a tad worse than OG duals, they have their merits. Maybe have a bit of an upside?

Bayou-ish

Forest Swamp

When Bayou-ish CiP Scry 1

As Bayou-ish enters the battlefield choose Swamp or Forest. Bayou-ish loses the chosen land type.

The way Scry Lands should have been done ;)Why would you not just pull all the basics out of your deck and fill them with this? I mean one of each colour set means 16 for each colour. Say I run mono red burn with all the lands, it would give me shockingly good deck control as each time I drop a land I can make plans.

Good idea, bad execution.

Sent from my mobile, forgive spelling and grammatical errors.

[Megadeus]

Why would you not just pull all the basics out of your deck and fill them with this? I mean one of each colour set means 16 for each colour. Say I run mono red burn with all the lands, it would give me shockingly good deck control as each time I drop a land I can make plans.

Good idea, bad execution.

Sent from my mobile, forgive spelling and grammatical errors.

Fair, but you have the downside of losing to wasteland randomly destoying your mono colored mana base. Also good luck playing Price of Progress in a mono red burn deck with these ;)

[Dice_Box]

You would drop price for something else if this was your plan. Also if you have that level of deck control, would you truly fear Wasteland? I don't think I would. Ever land I play is either deck manipulation of fetches. I don't think wasteland would be a problem at that point.

Sent from my mobile, forgive spelling and grammatical errors.

[Megadeus]

You would drop price for something else if this was your plan. Also if you have that level of deck control, would you truly fear Wasteland? I don't think I would. Ever land I play is either deck manipulation of fetches. I don't think wasteland would be a problem at that point.

Sent from my mobile, forgive spelling and grammatical errors.

That is fair. I could see how it would be OP. I do think some sort of Upside would have to be available though. Otherwise you still have just strictly worse ABU Duals. Which I guess is fine anyway.

[HammafistRoob]

How about the Goblin Guide drawback? Sometimes it's card advantage for your opponent, sometimes it's good information for you. Obviously they would suck super hard against 38land.dec, but a lot of decks are playing 18-22 lands so they seem okay. Probably not better than shocklands though, hmm....

[Stan]

An idea I've had for years, a card that is neither better nor worse than both the shocklands and the duals.

City of Taiga:

land- forest mountain

When this comes into play, you lose two life. Shroud.

Combine this with a massive reprinting of Wasteland (not on the reserve list), and you have a land that can be fetched, gives you mana immediately, but costs you life. Trade that off with protection against a good hatecard that everybody will be using. It doesn't obsolete shocklands, because with those things you have the option not to lose life. It doesn't obsolete the duals for obvious reasons. But they'd deliberately get tons of wastelands out with a reprint to make the lives of people who only use duals miserable. In essence, they'd sacrifice wasteland to prolong the life of the format.

[catmint]

These duals are very elegant. It would be very interesting to see how the format would develop given you can play more color intensive with the drawback of getting shocked. Getting rid of basics in 3color good stuff but unfortunately these land would not solve the reserved list issues legacy has.

[Stan]

True, but part of the reason why the original duals are so good is that there is no better alternative for them. If you spam the market with wastelands and then create good wasteland-proof duals, you'd at least slow down the price increase of the originals. It's worth a shot, if nothing else.

[Dice_Box]

Had a thought:


Forested Hilltop
Forest
{t}: Add one {G} to your mana pool
{t}, Sacrifice ~, pay one life: You may search your library for a Basic Mountain.

Not quite a dual land, but still effective at the task and I think more printable than a card that loses half its colour when it enters play.

[HammafistRoob]

I'm pretty sure the shroud duals would be better than the OG duals. Either that or Wasteland becomes wayyyy worse so people stop playing it.

DiceBox, those would be fucking sick with KotR. EOT sac this forest, grab Foothills, crack it, grab ~, crack it grab basic. I just thinned my library of 3 lands and pumped my Knight 3 times.

[Megadeus]

It would make Steppe Lynx and probably Lotus Cobra INSANE

[Lord_Mcdonalds]

I'm probably going to hell...

I would be immensely disappointed in this forum if someone didn't instantly respond with that

[Humphrey]

please, not another card creation thread again....


Legendary Duals: I dont see them soon. But maybe they finally decide to give non-basics a land type..

Id really like to see Wasteland and Force reprint in the next FTV or MMA-like edition. But I guess, theyre going for Judge Foils first. Im pretty sure theyll do it in the next 2/3 years. At least on MTGO we will see them. (Masters Edition)

Fetchlands, well. Theyre overpriced due to speculation market. Pretty sure theyll see a reprint too in the next 2/3 years.
Look how WotC is pushing casual formats like EDH.


Horizon Canopy cycle - I dont mind.

Red - They fucked up. Snapcaster would´ve been the perfect red CC2 drop. Misstep. too. Delver, well..
Maro/RnD are very biased towards blue for sure. They should fire that guy, in my opinion that guy lost track long time ago..
Ive still hope for an anti extra-draw hatebear though. Aka Chains of Mephistopheles on a stick.

Black at least is actually is on its rise atm. With DRS and Bob being a very succesful addition to tierdecks like Canadian, Esper, Maverick.. Id like to see some (eternal) land destruction in that color. (kinda card creation, lol. A Thoughtseize which targets non-basic lands too)



My dream, I know its kinda getting old: Brainstorm finally gets the banhammer. Or the Misstep colorshift / hatebear in red..

[Koby]

Black at least is actually is on its rise atm. With DRS and Bob being a very succesful addition to tierdecks like Canadian, Esper, Maverick.. Id like to see some (eternal) land destruction in that color. (kinda card creation, lol. A Thoughtseize which targets non-basic lands too)


Encroach...

[phazonmutant]

Black at least is actually is on its rise atm. With DRS and Bob being a very succesful addition to tierdecks like Canadian, Esper, Maverick.. Id like to see some (eternal) land destruction in that color. (kinda card creation, lol. A Thoughtseize which targets non-basic lands too)

Encroach...

I'm pretty sure he's talking about Coercion.

[Humphrey]

As I said. Nothing narrow like Encroach and Coercrion at CC1 would be OP. It needs the every card exept basic lands clause.

[Gheizen64]

Reveal at random and discard if it's not a basic land seems more likely than simply targeted discard at B even better than Thoughtseize. Maybe a "discard target non-basic permanent" since it doesn't hit instant and sorceries could be likely but still...