SCG and its not-as-lousy-as-WotC coverage [Archive] - Page 7

Einherjer

01-11-2015, 05:59 PM

Looks like you have the funny link-bug. :D

Here's the link! (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/deckshow.php?&t[C1]=3&start_date=01/10/2015&end_date=01/11/2015&start=1&finish=120&event_ID=20&city=Philadelphia&state=PA)

Greetings

Darkenslight

01-12-2015, 03:12 AM

Huh. It looks like Wasteland is a potent card in the current meta.

Who knew?

Quasim0ff

01-12-2015, 03:53 AM

Brainstorm in the finals!
Well, brainstorm and kird ape are two very different kind of cards..

One is a 2/3, the other makes about 90% of all archetypes playable (and competative).

Would you mind not ranting about it all the time, everywhere please?

nedleeds

01-12-2015, 09:02 AM

Well, brainstorm and kird ape are two very different kind of cards..

One is a 2/3, the other makes about 90% of all archetypes playable (and competative).

Would you mind not ranting about it all the time, everywhere please?

That's hardly a rant. Also you can ignore me. It's a sad format when the commentators act like playing Kird Ape is some great innovation. I guess I'm pleased to see Kird Ape instead of Nimble Mongoose but it's still an 18 land brainstorm deck. #getoffmylawn

Secretly.A.Bee

01-12-2015, 11:49 AM

Umm, Taiga is the innovation here, as Kird Ape has always been marginally playable. Taiga hasn't been playable since Goblins got shut down.

Lemnear

01-12-2015, 12:36 PM

Umm, Taiga is the innovation here, as Kird Ape has always been marginally playable. Taiga hasn't been playable since Goblins got shut down.

It's more interresting that kird has a permanent 3 Toughness unlike Swiftspear or Goblin Guide which seems to be very relevant with Forked Bolt everywhere

ESG

01-13-2015, 03:09 AM

Fuck your boat you delver casting ape.

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/an/49.jpg

Darkenslight

01-13-2015, 06:11 AM

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/an/49.jpg

Indeed.

One thing to note is the eincredible difference between the SCG Philly coverage and the GP Omaha coverage on at almost the same time. The Wizards team was markedly mediocre, and whilse Sullivan and Philipsaren't always on top, they are a damn sight better than Marshall and BDM on the actual nuances of their formats. I'd like it a lot better if Wizards had 'format specialists' for the GP formats in question, because their coverage was poor.

twndomn

01-13-2015, 06:20 AM

Indeed.

One thing to note is the eincredible difference between the SCG Philly coverage and the GP Omaha coverage on at almost the same time. The Wizards team was markedly mediocre, and whilse Sullivan and Philipsaren't always on top, they are a damn sight better than Marshall and BDM on the actual nuances of their formats. I'd like it a lot better if Wizards had 'format specialists' for the GP formats in question, because their coverage was poor.

I would love it if SCG or Wizard ask Chapin to cast Modern. For instance,
http://youtu.be/79fGvA9D6io?t=3m44s

Quasim0ff

01-13-2015, 06:55 AM

That's hardly a rant. Also you can ignore me. It's a sad format when the commentators act like playing Kird Ape is some great innovation. I guess I'm pleased to see Kird Ape instead of Nimble Mongoose but it's still an 18 land brainstorm deck. #getoffmylawn
Sorry, the only thing being spoken the last few days on here, have been a ban on brainstorm.
From my understanding, they were more enjoying Kird Ape, in particular Patrick, due to their (and Kird Ape in generel) history with the card.
Taiga isn't really the innovation. It was played (and needed) in the old 4colour BURG Delver-Deathrite deck.
The innovation is more likely moving away from Pyromancer to tarmogoyf, in this meta.

(nameless one)

01-13-2015, 06:55 AM

Fuck your boat you delver casting ape.

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/an/49.jpg

He puts the fur in fury

nedleeds

01-15-2015, 04:43 PM

Apes riding boats to cast apes. Truly magnificent to behold. At least Skyshroud Elite doesn't get Hydroblasted, since the natural evolution of the inbred format from main deck red blasts is blue blasts to blast the blasts.

Secretly.A.Bee

01-19-2015, 12:29 PM

I think that's all she wrote for Kird Ape. I think with treasure cruise gone, he will "ship out" also, heheheh.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

01-24-2015, 11:13 AM

SCG just announced they will putting on GP London in August. Not that it matters much to us, I believe it is a Standard GP.

Secretly.A.Bee

01-24-2015, 11:15 AM

Who cares. This Standard season nonsense is boring me to death. Can't wait for spring.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

lyracian

01-24-2015, 02:19 PM

SCG just announced they will putting on GP London in August. Not that it matters much to us, I believe it is a Standard GP.
It is good news for those of us in England; should make for an interesting event. SCG running an event in England is about as close to an Open series as I am ever going to get . :smile:

Secretly.A.Bee

01-25-2015, 01:31 PM

Power Princess Barbie ads on SCGLive Twitch Channel? Wtf...

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

(nameless one)

01-25-2015, 01:46 PM

Power Princess Barbie ads on SCGLive Twitch Channel? Wtf...

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

That's not from SCG, that's from Twitch.

Barook

01-25-2015, 02:41 PM

That's not from SCG, that's from Twitch.
The miracle of personalized ads. :tongue:

Secretly.A.Bee

01-25-2015, 02:43 PM

Power Princess Barbie ads on SCGLive Twitch Channel? Wtf...

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

That's not from SCG, that's from Twitch.
Yep.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

Tylert

01-26-2015, 04:32 AM

Can anyone give me the deck archetypes that made the top 16 of the Legacy open?
I'm at work and can't check SCG site... I really wanted to see what would the meta look like with the bans :) can't wait to be back at home...

Hopo

01-26-2015, 04:51 AM

Philipp2293

01-26-2015, 04:56 AM

twndomn

01-26-2015, 05:12 AM

SCGQ, not open. Top 8 was very unblue, 2 Lands, Junk, Dredge, MUD, though a Show and Tell deck took it down. Miracles was heavily underrepresented.

I guess this is just random noise and we have to wait for the new (/old) meta to form.

It's not random at all. If you look at SCG Richmond, which is right after GP NJ last year. Location-wise, D.C. is not far from Richmond at all. David Long running land Top 8 last time, got 2nd this time.

ReAnimator

01-26-2015, 12:41 PM

SCGQ, not open. Top 8 was very unblue, 2 Lands, Junk, Dredge, MUD, though a Show and Tell deck took it down. Miracles was heavily underrepresented.

I guess this is just random noise and we have to wait for the new (/old) meta to form.

If you look at the top 32, those five non blue decks were 5 of 7 decks in the whole top 32 that weren't blue. One of those decks had 3 main deck chokes...

So while the top 8 was not super blue, the top 32 was very very very blue.

Also there were 3 miracles decks in the top 32, so it's not like it wasn't there or performed particularly poorly.

Tylert

01-31-2015, 12:22 PM

Whippoorwill

01-31-2015, 04:40 PM

Nice deck in round 2. Eric Hill playing cloud vine... did not see what was the cloud for... I suppose it was for cloud of faeries to have mana open for a second creature.
Seems a bit slow, but refreshing :) (Missing some survival of the fittest thought :))

In that round, Game 1:

He cast Cloud of Faeries, with the untap trigger on the stack he tapped Cradle for mana then untapped it and tapped it again for more mana. He used the mana to GSZ for Craterhoof.

twndomn

01-31-2015, 11:52 PM

Nice deck in round 2. Eric Hill playing cloud vine... did not see what was the cloud for... I suppose it was for cloud of faeries to have mana open for a second creature.
Seems a bit slow, but refreshing :) (Missing some survival of the fittest thought :))

I don't understand this Cloud Vine looking at the deck tech. Your route of winning is creature beats. You run 4 Intuition, your deck immediately gets better if you MD 2 Wonder.

Cloud Vine deck tech http://www.starcitygames.com/events/coverage/deck_tech_cloud_vine_with_eric.html

TheArchitect

02-01-2015, 11:02 AM

The day 2 metagame analysis is up, the most played decks are D&T and elves which is refreshing. With 39 different archtypes and a 65% brainstorm prevalence, things look much improved from the last 20k open.

http://www.starcitygames.com/events/coverage/3182_day_2_metagame_breakdown.html

maharis

02-01-2015, 03:01 PM

Omg that kid playing bug vs infect walking into teferis response

Darkenslight

02-01-2015, 03:09 PM

Omg that kid playing bug vs infect walking into teferis response

Who the hell expects Teferi's Response? I've not actually seen it in any lists for a while.

haxorz

02-01-2015, 03:14 PM

Who the hell expects Teferi's Response? I've not actually seen it in any lists for a while.

The BUG delver player saw the Teferi's Response several turns earlier with a Gitaxian Probe. It was a clear misplay to walk into it like that; the commentators were speculating that the BUG delver player didn't understand the card.

maharis

02-01-2015, 03:20 PM

The BUG delver player saw the Teferi's Response several turns earlier with a Gitaxian Probe. It was a clear misplay to walk into it like that; the commentators were speculating that the BUG delver player didn't understand the card.

Right. I know the kid was young but I don't think he was younger than I was when Teferi's Response came out and I've never been confused about what it did.

Granted, round 15, fatigue is a factor.

goblinsplayer

02-01-2015, 04:22 PM

It's also strange, because I've seen that kid play at events, and he seemed to be a solid BUG player.

lordofthepit

02-01-2015, 04:46 PM

Good players sometimes make bad mistakes.

mort-

02-01-2015, 05:01 PM

The BUG player right now is playing so slooooow. Wondering why they didn't issue a warning yet.

haxorz

02-01-2015, 05:43 PM

Every time I see Jim Davis on camera, he's playing really slowly and I agree that he deserves more warnings for slow play. That being said, I think he is a really good player and deck builder.

stnikolauswagne

02-01-2015, 05:51 PM

Also the pile "shuffling" after mulligans. I don't understand why that isn't a thing you get warnings for.

Anyway, decklists and standings are up! http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/deckshow.php?&t%5BC1%5D=3&start_date=01/31/2015&end_date=02/01/2015&start_num=25&start_num=0&limit=25

Quick glance gives us 12 nonblue decks in the top 32, seems pretty good to me.

Meekrab

02-01-2015, 07:26 PM

Doesn't SCG have untimed rounds in the top 8? I'm all for calling a judge to enforce slow play rules but there's no reason to during the Top 8.

Also, 2010-metagame Goblins made day 2... http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=79376

Julian23

02-01-2015, 09:25 PM

Slow Play warnings are not only about making sure the tournament doesn't get delayed. It's also another aspect of the game that helps the better player come out on top, as the better player needs less time to make a decision. At Ovinogeddon my Elves opponent had the (complicated) win on board but didn't see it after 30 seconds of thinking. At that moment you call a judge to protect your interest in the game, regardless of there being a time limit or not.

A couple of months ago someone received a game loss for too many Slow Play warnings during a SCG Top8. He took something like 1 minute to figure out a Liliana of the Veil split. Definitely deserved and a great move to show that Slow Play is not being tolerated. People seem somewhat ok with it because it really got out of hand over the last couple of years and most people aren't even aware that the amount of time they are used to take is actually not acceptable; they just aren't used to people calling a judge for it and thus assume it's ok to tank for a close to a minute.

conboy31

02-01-2015, 10:47 PM

I don't care if Jim Davis wins every scg tournament for the rest of magics existence, but the amount of times he pile shuffles and his pace of play is insufferable. It's incredulous that he goes 15+x rounds without a slow play warning.

maharis

02-01-2015, 10:53 PM

I think pile shuffling while the round clock is running should be illegal. Do it between rounds if you must. Maybe loss of turn is a good sanction?

ubernostrum

02-02-2015, 01:39 AM

Doesn't SCG have untimed rounds in the top 8? I'm all for calling a judge to enforce slow play rules but there's no reason to during the Top 8.

I've been the Head Judge of some half-dozen Opens (and will be HJ of at least one this year, DFW in May), as well as plenty of other things (PTQ, WMCQ, etc., etc.).

Every time I've started a top 8, it's included the announcement "Although these rounds are untimed, you are still expected to play at a reasonable pace, and you can still receive Slow Play penalties." At one Open, I pulled a player aside in between matches, even, to tell him he'd been getting perilously close to earning penalties and ask him to pick up the pace in his next match.

So to answer your question: being untimed has no effect on whether Slow Play is still enforceable/should be enforced. It is always enforceable and should always be enforced :)

twndomn

02-02-2015, 01:57 AM

I've been the Head Judge of some half-dozen Opens (and will be HJ of at least one this year, DFW in May), as well as plenty of other things (PTQ, WMCQ, etc., etc.).

Every time I've started a top 8, it's included the announcement "Although these rounds are untimed, you are still expected to play at a reasonable pace, and you can still receive Slow Play penalties." At one Open, I pulled a player aside in between matches, even, to tell him he'd been getting perilously close to earning penalties and ask him to pick up the pace in his next match.

So to answer your question: being untimed has no effect on whether Slow Play is still enforceable/should be enforced. It is always enforceable and should always be enforced :)

In your opinion, did Jim Davis incur a slow-play warning/penalty in the Top 8 of SCG Indi? In other words, if you were the table judge or head judge at this event, will you issue him one or uphold one?

Bed Decks Palyer

02-02-2015, 02:31 AM

Unending pile shuffling is one of the reasons why I left competitive scene.
The last tournament I played in there was some guy who pile shuffled his deck, riffle shuffled his deck, pile shuffled my deck, riffle shuffled my deck, than took the top three cards of my deck and sent them to the bottom, drawn seven, sent them back, pile shuffled, riffle shuffled, mulled to six. It took him some five minutes of public masturbation until he was done and by this time I was so uninterested in the whole match that I thought that I'll simply leave for the home. All this happening in a context of 5-dollars four rounder, not to mention the fact that I'm talking about an amazingly hot afternoon that I could have spent by the water... (-_-)

mort-

02-02-2015, 04:36 AM

...riffle shuffled my deck...

That would've been the moment where I'd had him stop his shuffling. Verbal warning, then jump over the table ;)

Higgs

02-02-2015, 04:44 AM

What's interesting to me is the lack of Miracles decks in T16s as of late.

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15674
http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15736
http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15862

Barook

02-02-2015, 09:18 AM

What's interesting to me is the lack of Miracles decks in T16s as of late.

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15674
http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15736
http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15862
Maybe people are kinda bored with the deck? Are there any decks that actually prey on Miracles?

Last week we lacked Elves and this week it came back in full force.

Secretly.A.Bee

02-02-2015, 09:34 AM

Mud is rough and early multiple discard spells can be gg with pressure.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

twndomn

02-02-2015, 12:41 PM

What's interesting to me is the lack of Miracles decks in T16s as of late.

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15674
http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15736
http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15862

In terms of speculation, geographically speaking, the number of Miracle players is vastly under-represented in the US, considering how many Legacy players there are and the size of each SCG event in different cities. In contrast, the archtype is well-represented in Europe.

When Ross switched from Elves to Storm, you know TC has done too much damage. Now TC's gone, all the Elves lovers come back with a vengeance.

ubernostrum

02-02-2015, 01:26 PM

In your opinion, did Jim Davis incur a slow-play warning/penalty in the Top 8 of SCG Indi? In other words, if you were the table judge or head judge at this event, will you issue him one or uphold one?

The procedure for Slow Play is first to say something to the player about picking up the pace, then if they don't issue the Warning.

During the mulligans in the finals, I would likely have said something, then seen whether things picked up afterward, because at several points the amount of time being taken was getting into the danger zone.

(I also tend to hammer on Slow Play with the judges assigned to feature-match coverage, since shuffling and mulligans especially tend to drag out forever in the on-camera matches)

TheAardvark

02-02-2015, 05:09 PM

LOLWut

02-02-2015, 05:33 PM

FWIW, per Patrick Sullivan:

The early numbers are in, and while people still love playing Legacy, fewer people watch it than a Standard Open. For people arguing that viewership numbers were different because of, say, Saturday/Sunday splits, that doesn't appear to be the case.

People thought that more people would watch Legacy than Standard if they were on the same day? Or were they saying that the Saturday/Sunday splits gave Standard a boost and Legacy a handicap which amplified the discrepancy? Standard's a behemoth; I don't know anyone who thinks more people are into watching Legacy or any other format.

stnikolauswagne

02-02-2015, 05:47 PM

The people who claim that must be the same "legacy zealots" who are "constantly harassing" Jeff Hoogland (his words, not mine), also known as strawmen.

Having said that, I think it is not fair at all to ignore the point that Patrick is making, if Viewership numbers are important to SCG then 3/4 standard opens might indeed be the way to go. Obviously a risky move if we end up with a bad standard like the last one, but maybe the new rotation structure stops that.

Lord Seth

02-02-2015, 06:11 PM

Maybe people are kinda bored with the deck? Are there any decks that actually prey on Miracles?12-Post destroys Miracles, though it also doesn't see much play.

In general, decks with higher mana costs are good against Miracles, because the CounterTop combo is less effective.

twndomn

02-02-2015, 06:50 PM

Having said that, I think it is not fair at all to ignore the point that Patrick is making, if Viewership numbers are important to SCG then 3/4 standard opens might indeed be the way to go. Obviously a risky move if we end up with a bad standard like the last one, but maybe the new rotation structure stops that.

This post has so many... loaded statements, not even funny.

First of all, viewership number has various factors. What is the validity when you look at a SCG event viewership number when it's also on the same weekend as the Superbowl? I don't think the viewership between Magic and Superbowl is mutually exclusive, you can like both. That's only one factor, what about the weather? When you are trapped in a polar vortex, what other forms of entertainment do you have?

A good standard or a bad standard is purely subjective. Say we paraphrase to healthiness, as subjective as it sound, the healthiness of Standard is still decided by WotC, not by SCG. You seem to be confused by the two entities. The new rotation structure is Not targeted toward GP circuit or SCG circuit, it's WotC trying to fix the flaw of uneven-3-sets-in-one-block problem.

Julian23

02-02-2015, 07:13 PM

[...] the healthiness of Standard is still decided by WotC, not by SCG. You seem to be confused by the two entities. [...]

Because I despise polemics: stnikolauswagne made no statement that makes him seemed confused about what WotC and SCG are.

Lord Seth

02-02-2015, 07:21 PM

This post has so many... loaded statements, not even funny.

First of all, viewership number has various factors. What is the validity when you look at a SCG event viewership number when it's also on the same weekend as the Superbowl? I don't think the viewership between Magic and Superbowl is mutually exclusive, you can like both. That's only one factor, what about the weather? When you are trapped in a polar vortex, what other forms of entertainment do you have?Sure, it's the same weekend as the Superbowl... but the Superbowl didn't start until Sunday evening. I can't remember if the SCG tournament was still going on at that point, but even if it was, the majority of the tournament had no conflict with the Super Bowl.

Phoenix Ignition

02-02-2015, 08:48 PM

Sure, it's the same weekend as the Superbowl... but the Superbowl didn't start until Sunday evening. I can't remember if the SCG tournament was still going on at that point, but even if it was, the majority of the tournament had no conflict with the Super Bowl.

I, like I assume many others, really only remember or care about watching the last few rounds + top 8 of the tournament. Surely that is common, since you get to see the people/decks that are doing best performing. Same with any tournament at all, more people watch the last matches. Having that line up with Superbowl Sunday would definitely do damage.

TheAardvark

02-02-2015, 11:42 PM

Sure, it's the same weekend as the Superbowl... but the Superbowl didn't start until Sunday evening. I can't remember if the SCG tournament was still going on at that point, but even if it was, the majority of the tournament had no conflict with the Super Bowl.

The game and the Finals of the tournament started within minutes of each other.

Personally, I try to watch as much as possible on both days (although I won't with Modern; zero interest), but I don't know if that is common or not.

The Doctor

02-03-2015, 07:54 PM

Sure, it's the same weekend as the Superbowl... but the Superbowl didn't start until Sunday evening. I can't remember if the SCG tournament was still going on at that point, but even if it was, the majority of the tournament had no conflict with the Super Bowl.As stated by others, the later rounds are the rounds I tend to watch. In addition to that, the Superbowl started Sunday evening, but Superbowl "stuff" started before that. Pregame, Superbowl parties, etc. No one can pretend that the Superbowl didn't have at least some effect on viewership this weekend.