Baleful Strix and Golgari Charm

[BVB09]

Hi,
I have never underestood exactly how regeneration works, but I have always thought all damage disappeared and the creature became removed for combat and tapped.
But then I read this in an SCG article in which the author says about Abrupt Decay "And you would be surprised at how often you can blow people out in combat by combining the regeneration shield with Baleful Strix."
How does it work?
Thanks

[TsumiBand]

Hi,
I have never underestood exactly how regeneration works, but I have always thought all damage disappeared and the creature became removed for combat and tapped.
But then I read this in an SCG article in which the author says about Abrupt Decay "And you would be surprised at how often you can blow people out in combat by combining the regeneration shield with Baleful Strix."
How does it work?
Thanks

Do you maybe have some context for these comments? I might be a bit thick, but I'm trying to discern how the regen shield is being applied regarding Baleful Strix, or what the virtue of the "blowout" actually is.

If you're asking what I *think* you're asking -- a creature regenerated as a replacement effect to Abrupt Decay's effect should be tapped and removed from combat (if it was even involved in combat in the first place) with all damage removed from it. If this is done before combat damage, Baleful Strix cannot deal combat damage to any creature blocking it or blocked by it (though the creatures involved that have not been removed from combat would still be considered 'blocked' or 'blocking' as appropriate).

So if you have a Baleful Strix with a regeneration shield on it blocking or blocked by a Serra Avenger, and the Strix is forced to regenerate before combat damage, the Serra Avenger will not die as a result of deathtouch because Baleful Strix was no longer 'in combat' to deal its damage.

[Esper3k]

Iirc, the article was just referring to how you get to block a dude with your Strix, Golgari a game to regen it so you kill their guy and still have your Strix around to kill their next guy.

[BVB09]

TsumiBand I meant Glgari charm, I put by mistake Abrupt Decay in the message, sorry.
This is the link:
http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28184_No-Shards-No-Problem.html


Iirc, the article was just referring to how you get to block a dude with your Strix, Golgari a game to regen it so you kill their guy and still have your Strix around to kill their next guy.

This is the situation I was refering to, but is that posible? As TsumiBand said you would have to do it after combat, and at that point Baleful strix is already dead right?

[TsumiBand]

TsumiBand I meant Glgari charm, I put by mistake Abrupt Decay in the message, sorry.
This is the link:
http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28184_No-Shards-No-Problem.html



This is the situation I was refering to, but is that posible? As TsumiBand said you would have to do it after combat, and at that point Baleful strix is already dead right?

The regen won't apply until after the damage has been dealt. In fact, if you wait until after combat damage, it's too late.

That's why the phrase "regeneration shield" is a thing. It's setting up a replacement effect; "If this permanent would be destroyed, instead remove all damage from it, tap it, and remove it from combat." So the game tries to destroy Baleful Strix, and instead you execute the replacement effect.

[BVB09]

The regen won't apply until after the damage has been dealt. In fact, if you wait until after combat damage, it's too late.

That's why the phrase "regeneration shield" is a thing. It's setting up a replacement effect; "If this permanent would be destroyed, instead remove all damage from it, tap it, and remove it from combat." So the game tries to destroy Baleful Strix, and instead you execute the replacement effect.

Ahh I see!! I thought the "remive from combat clause" included that the damage done and received was also removed/prevented.
But great then if it works! :)
Thank you!

[FTW]

Ahh I see!! I thought the "remive from combat clause" included that the damage done and received was also removed/prevented.
But great then if it works! :)
Thank you!

This is no different than in Limited if you had a creature with Deathtouch and cost:Regenerates. You can block, pay the cost to set up a shield after blockers are declared, and your deathtouch creature will kill theirs and regenerate to live another day! This is how Deathtouch and Regeneration always interact. There's nothing fancy about Golgari Charm, other than that it's one of the few Constructed-played regeneration tools. I'm surprised they considered it a "trick".

[BVB09]

This is no different than in Limited if you had a creature with Deathtouch and cost:Regenerates. You can block, pay the cost to set up a shield after blockers are declared, and your deathtouch creature will kill theirs and regenerate to live another day! This is how Deathtouch and Regeneration always interact. There's nothing fancy about Golgari Charm, other than that it's one of the few Constructed-played regeneration tools. I'm surprised they considered it a "trick".

Yes that was the problem, there are very few legacy cards that regenerate, so I haven't faced them many times
Anyway for me it seems a nice trick! Almost 3x1 :P

[TsumiBand]

This is no different than in Limited if you had a creature with Deathtouch and cost:Regenerates. You can block, pay the cost to set up a shield after blockers are declared, and your deathtouch creature will kill theirs and regenerate to live another day! This is how Deathtouch and Regeneration always interact. There's nothing fancy about Golgari Charm, other than that it's one of the few Constructed-played regeneration tools. I'm surprised they considered it a "trick".

Given that regeneration is hardly even a tertiary quality of most playable creatures in most formats, it's probably more of an experience gap than anything. Any format where the best removal spells completely subjugate regeneration (Path/Swords, any Wrath effect with "can't be regen'd", etc) render regeneration a waste of text in the grander scheme of things. Standard formats have seen playable regen due to "bad removal" far more often than Eternal, so it makes some sense IMHO to point out in an article about Legacy tech that regeneration + deathtouch is A Cool Thing.