Rest in Peace, Painter's Servant, Grindstone

[Water_Wizard]

Would somebody please explain to me how these three cards work together (assuming that all three are in play when Grindstone is activated)?

Do you grind 2 from the Grindstone, but then no more since the original two are exiled?

Thank you!

Rest in Peace, Painter's Servant, Grindstone

[Tylert]

My guess would be that the process goes on as usual.
The milled cards, even if they are exiled still have the same color due to painter servant.
RIP only adds a replacement effect to the fact that the 2 cards are put in the graveyard. it doesn't stop the whole activated ability.

[Megadeus]

My guess would be that the process goes on as usual.
The milled cards, even if they are exiled still have the same color due to painter servant.
RIP only adds a replacement effect to the fact that the 2 cards are put in the graveyard. it doesn't stop the whole activated ability.

This is correct. Had this ruling at an SCG. I asked the judge if RIP stopped me from dying, he said yes, so I cast RIP. Then my opponent activated it and I called the judge and my opponent appealed to the head judge and we got the correct ruling and I died.

[iamajellydonut]

This is correct. Had this ruling at an SCG. I asked the judge if RIP stopped me from dying, he said yes, so I cast RIP. Then my opponent activated it and I called the judge and my opponent appealed to the head judge and we got the correct ruling and I died.

That's low. :(

I almost feel like we need a compilation thread of shitty judge calls.

Anyway, just to elaborate, a comparable example as to why Grindstone still works is Grenzo, Dungeon Warden. If you mill with Grenzo and the card gets exiled with Rest in Peace, the ability still works because it is in no way tied to the graveyard. The graveyard just happens to be where the cards are put when they're milled. In order for Grenzo (or Grindstone) to not work off of Rest in Peace, there would need to be some clause that ties it to the graveyard such as "put it from the graveyard on to the battlefield" (or something). In fact, even if Rest in Peace were instead a Wheel of Sun and Moon, the Grindstone's ability would still work (albeit an infinite loop that would draw the game, but whatever).

[cdr]

Would somebody please explain to me how these three cards work together (assuming that all three are in play when Grindstone is activated)?

Do you grind 2 from the Grindstone, but then no more since the original two are exiled?

Thank you!

Rest in Peace, Painter's Servant, Grindstone

Since Rest in Peace is a replacement effect, it directly modifies Grindstone's ability as it resolves. Grindstone's ability doesn't know that the cards were supposed to go anywhere but exile, and doesn't care - it only cares about the color of the cards.

[Julian23]

This leads me to the question: do you have to inform your opponent that he just got a wrong ruling by the judge?

[cdr]

This leads me to the question: do you have to inform your opponent that he just got a wrong ruling by the judge?

Obviously the moral thing to do is to appeal if a ruling is wrong even if it's in your favor, but no, you're not required to do anything about an incorrect ruling.

[Megadeus]

Obviously the moral thing to do is to appeal if a ruling is wrong even if it's in your favor, but no, you're not required to do anything about an incorrect ruling.

Interesting. Although there is no real way for anyone to prove that you knew the correct ruling.

Fwiw, even if it did stop the grindstone, my opponent had a REB for my RIP. There was no salt from me. I knew I was basically screwed so no hard feelings.

[Shagstaman]

This leads me to the question: do you have to inform your opponent that he just got a wrong ruling by the judge?

I've actually had that come up and I appealed for my opponent... he was shocked but it's the right thing to do (which is not really an opinion if you think about it..)

[T-101]

One of the recent JudgeCasts covered the issue that Julian mentioned.

You DO NOT have to mention an incorrect ruling by a judge. If a judge makes a bad ruling, and you know its wrong, you can legally remain silent. Whether it makes you a scumbag or not is up for debate.

EDIT: The best way to ensure this does not happen against you is to know the rules yourself. There are many excellent judges out there, and I appreciate the work that they do, but there are also lots of folks who are certified judges that do not know how Magic works. I have perused through Comp Rules document, and I listen to JudgeCast. While I have zero interest in becoming a judge, I've found that knowing the rules a whole lot better makes me a better player, and I think it's well worth the time investment.

[Dice_Box]

What do you do if your at a small event and you have no Head Judge to appeal to and you know the call is incorrect?

[Julian23]

You can try to explain yourself to the judge handling the situation but in the end the final call is up to him.

On the bright side, even though it always sucks, having a wrong judge decision at such a small event shouldn't be too worrying. I mean, something like that will not happen at a GP or any other big event.

[cdr]

What do you do if your at a small event and you have no Head Judge to appeal to and you know the call is incorrect?

If you're at a one-judge event, that one judge is the head judge. So the question is what do you do if you think the HJ is wrong, which could happen at any event.

If you disagree with a HJ's ruling, briefly and politely make your case, ideally with a pointer to the appropriate rule that they can look up on their smartphone. HJs have a responsibility to keep your match and the event moving in a timely manner, so don't be surprised if the ruling is reaffirmed.

You can also approach the HJ after your match, where there may be time for a longer discussion of the ruling. Any judge worth anything wants the correct ruling to be made, even if it means they were wrong.

[Malakai]

Things like this get doubly awkward when you're a J2 and the head judge is just the guy who works at the store.

[cdr]

Things like this get doubly awkward when you're a J2 and the head judge is just the guy who works at the store.

Thankfully when you're a judge you should be able to look up the appropriate rule and hopefully the other guy is reasonable, though that's certainly not always the case with a LGS.