MTGO or a paper deck collecting dust?

[theramblingfool]

I have a completed paper Miracles deck.

I've never played on MTGO before but I've been interested in trying it out. I love Legacy. I enjoy other formats (especially limited) but I really think that I wouldn't have a sustained interest in Magic as a game without the existence of Legacy. The problem is, there is not much of a Legacy community in my area, and the little bit that there is... Well they aren't very great players, so I don't think I get much from playing on the off-chance that I do get to play. I really enjoy Miracles. I've only had the chance to play it at two different events though, an SCGO that I cashed at, and GPNJ where I went 5-2-1 drop. I want to get as good with the deck as I possibly can, but I don't think I can do that with the resources and community I have right now.

I did the math, and I realized that I could sell my whole Miracles deck (with my TCG seller account, relatively low prices for fast turnaround) and after seller fees and the cost of buying the entire deck on MTGO, I would still have almost $1,000 left. Do you think this could be worth it? Are there extremely frequent opportunities to play Legacy on MTGO and is the average play level pretty good? I'll be honest, I could probably also use the money, and being able to still play my favorite deck (possibly more often) while getting a pretty big influx of cash sounds appealing to me. Not owning the deck in paper anymore would be kind of a bummer for me, though. Sometimes I like to goldfish, and I don't like the idea of having to bum a ton of cards off of other players for GPs and the like.

What do you think? Is it worth it? Should I make the switch/sell off my paper deck?

[Undomian]

There are plenty of opportunities to play on MTGO, as nearly every DE fires. My biggest issue with playing on MTGO is that there is a severe lack of variety in the meta. You're going to get a lot of testing in against the 'best deck' on any given day, but playing against Volcanic Island.dec every single round (as it is right now) gets a bit boring after awhile.

[MGB]

I have a completed paper Miracles deck.

I've never played on MTGO before but I've been interested in trying it out. I love Legacy. I enjoy other formats (especially limited) but I really think that I wouldn't have a sustained interest in Magic as a game without the existence of Legacy. The problem is, there is not much of a Legacy community in my area, and the little bit that there is... Well they aren't very great players, so I don't think I get much from playing on the off-chance that I do get to play. I really enjoy Miracles. I've only had the chance to play it at two different events though, an SCGO that I cashed at, and GPNJ where I went 5-2-1 drop. I want to get as good with the deck as I possibly can, but I don't think I can do that with the resources and community I have right now.

I did the math, and I realized that I could sell my whole Miracles deck (with my TCG seller account, relatively low prices for fast turnaround) and after seller fees and the cost of buying the entire deck on MTGO, I would still have almost $1,000 left. Do you think this could be worth it? Are there extremely frequent opportunities to play Legacy on MTGO and is the average play level pretty good? I'll be honest, I could probably also use the money, and being able to still play my favorite deck (possibly more often) while getting a pretty big influx of cash sounds appealing to me. Not owning the deck in paper anymore would be kind of a bummer for me, though. Sometimes I like to goldfish, and I don't like the idea of having to bum a ton of cards off of other players for GPs and the like.

What do you think? Is it worth it? Should I make the switch/sell off my paper deck?

I think you'll regret selling your paper cards eventually. It always happens if you keep playing Magic in some form or another.

If you have surplus cards to unload and want to use that money to invest in MTGO, fine, but don't sell off the core cards that enable you to play the deck you enjoy the most. It will always come back to haunt you. I know I've regretted selling a bunch of old cards I owned (sold them in 2007/2008 for much less) basically ever since I sold them, despite mostly playing online and only playing in the occasional GP/SCG event.

There's no reason you can't keep 1-2 decks lying around and still play MTGO Legacy. Just save up a little bit more money, play some drafts online, and eventually you'll have Miracles built online as well as in paper. You'll feel much better about yourself if you have the deck both in paper and online rather than just online.

[Dragonslayer_90]

I have a completed paper Miracles deck.

I've never played on MTGO before but I've been interested in trying it out. I love Legacy. I enjoy other formats (especially limited) but I really think that I wouldn't have a sustained interest in Magic as a game without the existence of Legacy. The problem is, there is not much of a Legacy community in my area, and the little bit that there is... Well they aren't very great players, so I don't think I get much from playing on the off-chance that I do get to play. I really enjoy Miracles. I've only had the chance to play it at two different events though, an SCGO that I cashed at, and GPNJ where I went 5-2-1 drop. I want to get as good with the deck as I possibly can, but I don't think I can do that with the resources and community I have right now.

I did the math, and I realized that I could sell my whole Miracles deck (with my TCG seller account, relatively low prices for fast turnaround) and after seller fees and the cost of buying the entire deck on MTGO, I would still have almost $1,000 left. Do you think this could be worth it? Are there extremely frequent opportunities to play Legacy on MTGO and is the average play level pretty good? I'll be honest, I could probably also use the money, and being able to still play my favorite deck (possibly more often) while getting a pretty big influx of cash sounds appealing to me. Not owning the deck in paper anymore would be kind of a bummer for me, though. Sometimes I like to goldfish, and I don't like the idea of having to bum a ton of cards off of other players for GPs and the like.

What do you think? Is it worth it? Should I make the switch/sell off my paper deck?

Hey man. I'm in a similar spot atm. Currently I play legacy mostly once a week. Thankfully my local game store has mostly average to really good players (one of them got 3 or 4 SCG legacy top 8s this year), but playing only once a week feels too little for me. Other than the one I already go to, there aren't really any other local game stores running legacy where I live. I tried filling the void with cockatrice, but it just doesn't do it unless you have people to consistently test with. Playing against random opponents on cockatrice is often infuriating as you'll get really bad players and/or people who rage quit on you. And so I'm making the move to MTGO pretty soon because having access to legacy tournaments pretty much every day multiple times a day is very appealing despite the shitty software. I'm also building Miracles because that's also my current weapon of choice. Towards this end I've downsized my paper collection down to miracles and ANT since those are the two decks I mainly play.

With that said, my advice to you would be to have patience and not sell your paper miracles deck to build one online. I would sell off other cards you don't need for miracles if you have them and just save up or slowly buy miracles online until you have it complete. With the way the secondary market can be you should always keep at least one deck if you intend on continuing to play this format. Until you complete Miracles online you could just play with friends on cocaktrice to test and what not. Heck, if you want I'll test with you. I'm always looking for people to test with. If you interested in doing that PM me. Good luck with everything.

[cab0747]

I am with pretty much everyone else here: Don't sell your paper deck. Miracles isn't terribly expensive to build online. If you have extra cards outside of Miracles, maybe sell those off to get the funds to build it online.

I bought into MTGO since I wasn't playing as much Legacy as I would like on paper. Even though people complain about the client, I have enjoyed my experience and I am very happy I invested.

[apple713]

is it easy to find non DE games for testing on MTGO, or is it really only worth playing if you are in DE's?

oh ya don't ever sell your paper cards...unless maybe you want to buy something amazing with them like a house.

[JDK]

is it easy to find non DE games for testing on MTGO, or is it really only worth playing if you are in DE's?

Yes, it's easy to find games. Tournament practice rooms are decent, but you can also opt for 2- and 8-player tournaments.

[Phoenix Ignition]

Yes, it's easy to find games. Tournament practice rooms are decent, but you can also opt for 2- and 8-player tournaments.

Just be warned that 8 player events rarely fire, unless you're on at peak times (in my experience). 2 player events cost $2.00 and you can find them fairly quickly. The payout isn't even worth $4.00, but the testing is what's valuable.

Ultimately you need to make the decision if it's the right choice, there are many pros and cons. Here are a few important ones.

Cons:
-The client. You'll lose games to misclicks and because of lag. Want to pass priority? Hit Okay. Client lagging? Hit Okay again? Now you skipped your attack phase entirely. Things like this are just part of everyday life.

-The community. Largely no one will ever want to chat, or even read it. One of the fun parts of playing magic in person is meeting cool people with similar interests, if not to be friends then at least to have a decent chat while playing. People on MTGO are going to either ignore you or rage at you for drawing the card you need/ beating them. It can really drain the fun out of tournaments too.

-The servers/other technical issues. Many cards still have bugs that make them unplayable. You can submit bug reports and get your entry fee back, but rarely will you get what you deserved (like the prize for winning). More than not getting your prizes though, it's just frustrating losing when all you need to do is cast the card that's in your hand and it says you have no valid targets. As for server issues, they regularly crash when tons of people are in a big tournament, like a PTQ, and they just restart the entire tournament if that happens, not keeping your place in the tournament.

-Chess timers. This is a pro, but until you get used to the interface you may just bleed time since you don't know what to do quickly. I recommend playing a bunch of practice games until you are no longer taking a long time for basic decisions.

-Inbred metagame. This happens in real life too, but certain cards online are so expensive that if someone were to play legacy, they might all be playing the cheapest deck. Wastelands are like $90 so many people just play decks that don't need them. UR is everywhere right now, for example.

Pros:
-Super easy to play high level. There are free practice rooms where you'll get some decent games, but if you go to the $2 entry 2-person games you'll get a real tournament experience.

-Tournaments are from the comfort of your own home. This is actually the best part if you're doing tournaments, waiting for the next round to start means watching Netflix or making a sandwich.

-Chess-timer style timers. Instead of a shared clock you each get 25:00 to play. This means you don't have to just scoop when your Vintage opponent sets up Voltaic Key + Time Vault, or your storm opponent takes 1 minute for each decision. You just hit F6 (the button to say "I have no responses and don't want priority until next turn") and browse the internet while he either kills you or fizzles. Also, you don't have to worry about slow play, as it's not shared you just automatically win when the opponent runs out of time.

-Any time day or night there are people you can play against for every major format (including legacy). I don't think I've had to wait more than 2 minutes for an opponent in a practice room or 2-player event for at least 6 months. Same goes for Vintage and Modern, if you're into those.

-Trade bots. You can get any card you need in seconds, if you want to buy it with Event Tickets. The trade area is run by bots. You can also sell any expensive card for about 80% of its value within seconds to the bots. Want better deals? You could post a trade message and wait for a real person to contact you, but it rarely works better than just taking the hit the bots will give you since they are so efficient.

-Tons of experience before a big tournament. The best part in my opinion is being able to grind tons of games to get your playskill up before a big tournament. If you go without playing for a while you'll usually end up making mistakes everywhere, so if you go to a GP it's great to have MTGO to be able to shake some rust off.


But yeah, it costs a lot and there are some shitty parts. I'm in every format except standard on there and enjoy that I can get bored of magic for 6 months and then come back and play without any real effort on my part. It costs some to buy in, but after that there aren't subscriptions or anything so I can just go online once in a while to play a game and see how the new meta is.

[lyracian]

Personally I play Paper Legacy and Online Pauper. I have thought about selling paper cards but in the end decided I would rather keep them for the occasional opportunity there is to play. Pauper does have a few expensive cards but is, for the most part, super cheap. You can build a decent deck for $20 so I would recommend doing that to try out MTGO and see if you like it. You can see the Pauper metagame here - http://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/pauper#paper

[cogitoergosum]

Personally I play Paper Legacy and Online Pauper. I have thought about selling paper cards but in the end decided I would rather keep them for the occasional opportunity there is to play. Pauper does have a few expensive cards but is, for the most part, super cheap. You can build a decent deck for $20 so I would recommend doing that to try out MTGO and see if you like it. You can see the Pauper metagame here - http://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/pauper#paper

Do you win prizes, i.e. tickets or packs or whatever, playing pauper online?

[deviant]

Do you win prizes, i.e. tickets or packs or whatever, playing pauper online?

Cannot speak for the person in question, but if you meant that do people that go 4-0 or 3-1 get prizes then yes; some people do.

As a relatively active online legacy player I would also advice testing the client before selling your cards and spending ~800+ dollars in a deck. First see if you can put up with the shit V4 throws at you. If you have multiple failed marriages behind you I'm sure you'll find it relatively painless but you have been warned.

[JDK]

-The servers/other technical issues. Many cards still have bugs that make them unplayable.
I have my fair share of hate for the current client, but "many" is exaggerated. I play Legacy regularly on MODO and I have yet to face a card bug. Most of them show up in other formats and there aren't "many".

[Phoenix Ignition]

I have my fair share of hate for the current client, but "many" is exaggerated. I play Legacy regularly on MODO and I have yet to face a card bug. Most of them show up in other formats and there aren't "many".

To divulge my super secret tech, I have a fun Young Pyromancer deck with Burning Wish, and Torrent of Souls doesn't work unless you have a creature card in the graveyard to target, regardless of wanting to use the black half.

Also, there was a known bug being exploited for a few weeks where putting Spirespine on an opponent's tapped creature and then attacking would freeze their ability to do anything, since it was requiring a block. It would run down their timer on the declare blocks step since they were "forced" to block but didn't have the ability to with the tapped creature. It was actually hilarious seeing the decks used to exploit this feature.

I remember there being some bugs with Tangle Wire for a while too but those got ironed out when vintage masters came.

Oh yeah, and Gifts Ungiven didn't work as worded for a long time. The 2 chosen cards would go to their hand instead of graveyard, making that card not work as intended.

[BKclassic]

I would say that bugs typically happen with new cards, older cards typically have the kinks worked out. I have played Canadian Threshold on Magic Online for years and I've never had any problems with bugs.

I would reccomend keeping your paper deck together. It's fun to grind on MODO, but accrueing real value is a slow process. The real value comes in going to a large tournament real life events with large prizes. The skills you develop on MODO will help you make some hay at these events.

[Bobmans]

If you have a paper deck collecting dust your doing it wrong. Shut down your Linux boot and meet real people and play real paper magic instead of spending the same amount of money for a virtual fraud.

[ankharlyn]

If you have a paper deck collecting dust your doing it wrong. Shut down your Linux boot and meet real people and play real paper magic instead of spending the same amount of money for a virtual fraud.

Pretty much how I feel about it. You're "renting" images of the cards and access to their rules enforcement for them, often for the price of *owning* the physical cards (I know the prices vary widely and downward).

[ESG]

The problem is, there is not much of a Legacy community in my area, and the little bit that there is... Well they aren't very great players, so I don't think I get much from playing on the off-chance that I do get to play. I really enjoy Miracles. I've only had the chance to play it at two different events though, an SCGO that I cashed at, and GPNJ where I went 5-2-1 drop. I want to get as good with the deck as I possibly can, but I don't think I can do that with the resources and community I have right now.

Where are you from? Sometimes people are unaware of shops or fellow players in their vicinity. Unless you are in a remote area, it's usually feasible to make connections with other players and at least playtest outside of tournaments.