Living Depths

[Madmankevinx]

So I have been playing 4color Loam and Jund Depths lately and have been really liking the Jund Deck gameplan, but have also really been liking the Burning Wish board in the 4color deck and have been tinkering with a wierd hybrid idea of combining the available gameplans of both decks with a Living Wish board instead of the Burning wish. Its easier to complete the Dark Depths win-con quickly with Living Wish and certainly adds a degree of inevitability to seeing Marit Lage early on. The Jund Depths deck can sometime fall into the situation where it needs to play a control game for multiple turns while trying to find a missing piece. I think Living Wish could help out there. I really don't know if this is just plain worse than Jund Depths and/or 4color Loam, but in a few test games, I was able to win against the current tier 1 decks in testing not only faster than with the other decks, but with less "work" and deciding whether to draw or dredge. I think the decision making in whether to draw or to dredge for most players is the hardest part of playing either Jund Depths or 4color Loam. I'd like to hear all of your thoughts and comments on this idea and here is my current list which is probably by no means the final list if this thing becomes playable for real:

(I am leaving The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale out simply because most people don't own any, but you should have 1 in the main and 1 in the board right now if you have that luxury!)

4 Living Wish
4 Life from the Loam
4 Mox Diamond
4 Smallpox
4 Faithless Looting
4 Entomb
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Crop Rotation
1 Raven's Crime
1 Nether Spirit
2 Dark Depths
1 Maze of Ith

1 Karakas
2 Badlands
1 Savannah
1 Plateau
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Taiga
3 Arid Mesa
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
2 Thespian's Stage

Board:
1 Flametongue Kavu
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Ingot Chewer
1 Shriekmaw
1 Faerie Macabre
1 Wispmare
1 Kor Firewalker
1 Peacekeeper
1 Spirit of the Labyrinth
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Karakas
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Tower of the Magistrate

Like I said, a rough draft, but I think this deck can absolutely be playable and surprise a lot of opponents.

[wortwelt]

4 Living Wish
4 Life from the Loam
4 Mox Diamond
4 Smallpox
4 Faithless Looting
4 Entomb
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Crop Rotation
1 Raven's Crime
1 Nether Spirit
2 Dark Depths
1 Maze of Ith

1 Karakas
2 Badlands
1 Savannah
1 Plateau
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Taiga
3 Arid Mesa
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
2 Thespian's Stage

Board:
1 Flametongue Kavu
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Ingot Chewer
1 Shriekmaw
1 Faerie Macabre
1 Wispmare
1 Kor Firewalker
1 Peacekeeper
1 Spirit of the Labyrinth
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Karakas
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Tower of the Magistrate



Interesting take. I like the "no creatures" approach and Smallpox in particular. Loam is pretty ridiculous at repeatedly putting Marit Lage into play, which is great, since they won't be able to answer it all the time. However, if your goal is to assemble the Combo consistently, why not max out the Crop Rotations and maindeck combo pieces (Crop to 4, Depths and Stage to 3?). I'd also like a Vampire Hexmage in the board at least since it offers a really good answer and additional redundancy especially against Pithing Needle.
I'm also thinking that the Manabase is risky. It's true that you have Loam and Diamond, yet I can't imagine that the deck won't be color screwed at least some of the time.

Disclaimer: I'm playing this list for a few weeks now and it fares really well in our testing, hence my criticism is tainted, obviously!
BG Depths 1.1
2 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Crop Rotation
4 Thoughtseize
4 Deathrite SHaman
4 Dark Confidant
3 Vampire Hexmage
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Living Wish
2 Life from the Loam
2 Liliana of the Veil

3 Dark Depths
4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Thespian's Stage
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Bayou
3 Wasteland

SB
1 Vampire Hexmage
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Sejiri Steppe
1 Bojuka Bog
4 Rite of Consumption
2 Choke
2 Extirpate
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Golgari Charm

[Madmankevinx]

Wow, I can't believe I forgot the Vampire Hexmage! Yikes! Lol there should definitely be one in the board. I've recently been thinking about a Melira there too as I have two infect players now running around town. Honestly, I have not had any problems with mana yet, probably due to the massive decline in Wasteland seeing play.

[nodahero]

Are you expecting a fairly Stoneblade-esq environment?

I have palyed Loam, Jund Depths and the 'ol make 20/20 ASAP deck and yours appears to aim heavily towards that. If that is your goal I think you did a very good rough draft.

Otherwise, I am curious about a lot of your decisions on numbers.

[beez]

I've been running a similar list for a year or so and it is pretty honed and pretty good . It is certainly more defensive than most Depths lists. At the moment I run Chalice and Living Wish rather than Crop Rotation, so I suppose this thread is more appropriate than the all in one.

I have dropped the Sinkholes I ran for a long time for now. With Daze and Treasure Cruise it has been harder to get a lot of value out of it as a one for one. The addition of a couple of Trinispheres has been great - I don't want tax my Lillianas and other 3cc spells any more so I have accepted a bit of slower drop than Sphere of Resistance or make my Loams cost 5 with Nether Void. Of course Sinkhole works great with Trinisphere, but honestly if Trinisphere resolves against those same decks it is pretty crippling on its own.
I've been relying on 4 Loams so I can Smallpox with near impunity earlier, and assure a quick recovery from a token bounce or exile. If they have more than one land out they can't Daze their way out of Smallpox. A Ghost Quarter in the board can help mitigate the Sinkholes by being a Wish target when the only thing keeping you from comboing into Marit Lage is an open basic Plains.
My current bit of spiciness is the Nightmare Void, which can be pitched to Liliana and Smallpox and sometimes Loamed into which is pretty cool. The main purpose is to be assured of clearing the way for a Marit Lage activation.
Treasure Cruise and Young Pyromancer are still a pain in my ass but I'm still doing well with this.

Chalice Loam Pox Depths



1 The Abyss
2 Trinisphere
2 Sylvan Library

4 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void

4 Liliana of the Veil

4 Life from the Loam
4 Living Wish
4 Smallpox
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Hymn to Tourach
1 Nightmare Void


4 Wasteland
3 Dark Depths
3 Thespian's Stage
4 Bayou
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Urborg,Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Swamp
1 Forest

Side
1 Maze of Ith
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Cabal Pit
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Vampire Hexmage
1 Necroplasm
1 Reclaimation Sage
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Faerie Macabre
1 Krosan Grip
2 Engineered Plague
1 Night of Soul's Betrayal

[Chatto]

I've been running a similar list for a year or so and it is pretty honed and pretty good . It is certainly more defensive than most Depths lists. At the moment I run Chalice and Living Wish rather than Crop Rotation, so I suppose this thread is more appropriate than the all in one.

(...)

Chalice Loam Pox Depths



1 The Abyss
2 Trinisphere
2 Sylvan Library

4 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void

4 Liliana of the Veil

4 Life from the Loam
4 Living Wish
4 Smallpox
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Hymn to Tourach
1 Nightmare Void


4 Wasteland
3 Dark Depths
3 Thespian's Stage
4 Bayou
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Urborg,Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Swamp
1 Forest

Side
1 Maze of Ith
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Cabal Pit
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Vampire Hexmage
1 Necroplasm
1 Reclaimation Sage
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Faerie Macabre
1 Krosan Grip
2 Engineered Plague
1 Night of Soul's Betrayal



Nice seeing you still rocking this deck, beez!

Nightmare Void is an interesting choice; something like a catch-all protection for Marit Lage. I suppose you don't really care for this card to resolve until the very last moment? So pitching it to Liliana or Smallpox early on and dredging it back at the right time? And Sinkholes are indeed not that good anymore, but what if you play more taxing cards like Trinisphere? Keeping your opponent of mana could work. I like your list and was trying something similair, except I was thinking about a more Big Pox-strategy.

[beez]

That's how I've been playing with Nightmare Void so far. Itis also good for clearing a hand of counters before resolving a key spell like Living Wish or even Lilliana and Trinisphere and if you need to use it a couple of times it may even dredge your Loams or win con lands into the grave for you.

I don't think I would use Big Pox with Dark Depths, not just for the difficulty of getting BBB but also losing a third of your life when Marit doesnt care about them losing any life previously is a dissynergy. Now if you meant a deck using Big Pox , Trinisphere, Sinkhole, Loam that could be interesting and we can discuss that in Pox thread.

[Chatto]

I don't think I would use Big Pox with Dark Depths, not just for the difficulty of getting BBB but also losing a third of your life when Marit doesnt care about them losing any life previously is a dissynergy. Now if you meant a deck using Big Pox , Trinisphere, Sinkhole, Loam that could be interesting and we can discuss that in Pox thread.

Alright! I had something in mind, perhaps I will post it for discussion and further development :smile: