MTGO - Tempest Remastered

[Dosferra]

I just noticed http://magic.wizards.com/en/MTGO/articles/archive/magic-online/announcing-tempest-remastered-2015-02-23 and haven't seen anyone here mention it.

Wasteland Remastered will probably have a fairly large impact on the metagame, more players and more Wasteland.dec.

[Barook]

Wasteland went from ~113$ to 63$ since the announcement, but I expect them to rise soon again.

The main problem is that it's literally "Wasteland: The Cash Grab". The EV of this thing will blow hard:

Exodus has City of Traitors and nothing else.
Stronghold has Ensnaring Bridge and Mox Diamond.
Aside from Wasteland, Tempest offers Intuition, Grindstone and Humility as cards of value that are actually played.

The rest of the block is basically worthless shit. I doubt that many packs are going to be opened, especially with Wasteland being highly likely to be a mythic.

[UseLess]

It may be because of silly reserved list stuff, but I really don't get why they don't do this for paper magic as well... I would love to play limited with these kind of sets. It's not even that I care about the prices of wasteland and mox diamond, but just to be able to play with a "best of" of these older sets sounds awesome. And not in the way like we have limited edition modern masters sets, but in the way we have plenty of stock like KTK. I mean, that limited edition shit is so retarded and lame. MM1 was one of the best draft sets I've played but the prices of it were insane. Now they do the same with MM2 but make it even more expensive :/. While MM2 is nice, despite its print size, the 'feel' I have for these sets is just so much more than for the stuff that comes out nowadays. Too bad about the new border, but I'd live with that if we'd ever get something similar.

[Tylert]

It is because of silly reserved list stuff...

Fixed for you.

[Phoenix Ignition]

Awesome! Looking forward to a metagame more like paper magic's where most everyone has access to wastelands. I expect Wasteland will drop below what it's at now during the prime time of pack opening, people loved the VMA drafts just because of what decks you could draft. I probably drafted that one 100 times, with like 70% UG madness. Drafting is better EV than just cracking packs since it's 2 tickets extra to have a chance at 8-4 or 4-3-2-2 prize pool. I got fully powered from just VMA drafts without adding in very much money (though I ditched like 3 Modern decks to fully fill out the rest of the vintage staples).


Too bad about the new border, but I'd live with that if we'd ever get something similar.

This is the best way to do it. New border is hated by most compared to the old one so the cards would have the same functionality without the same appeal. Onslaught fetches dropped some in price when they were reprinted in new border, but for the most part foil oldest set cards rarely drop by much.

[Phelix]

So not only are europeans cut off from using wasteland and ports on magic online.

Those of us that have them, will now see them drop dramatically.

Might be part of some illuminati agenda to screw us over.

[Barook]

So not only are europeans cut off from using wasteland and ports on magic online.

Those of us that have them, will now see them drop dramatically.

Might be part of some illuminati agenda to screw us over.
Why are Europeans cut off Wastelands and Ports? :eyebrow: I'm European and have a playset of both.

Wasteland dropped significantly, but I'm not too worried. It's a card high in demand with probably very little supply getting added for the reasons stated above.

The price of Ports are unaffected, since it's from Masques, not Tempest. If they ever do a promo/reprint, its value is going to get nuked into oblivion, though.

[Julian23]

Why are Europeans cut off Wastelands and Ports? :eyebrow: I'm European and have a playset of both.

Wasteland dropped significantly, but I'm not too worried. It's a card high in demand with probably very little supply getting added for the reasons stated above.

The price of Ports are unaffected, since it's from Masques, not Tempest. If they ever do a promo/reprint, its value is going to get nuked into oblivion, though.

Europeans - and from what I hear US East Coasters as well - have been cut off from playing Legacy on Magic Online if they were foolish enough to prioritize employment over a stupid Daily Event schedule.

[Lejay]

Europeans - and from what I hear US East Coasters as well - have been cut off from playing Legacy on Magic Online if they were foolish enough to prioritize employment over a stupid Daily Event schedule.
Is a reschedule still "officially" considered ?

I'll add to Phelix' conspiracy theory that booster prices severely increased on FRF (even over 4 tickets) and increased noticeably for KTK with the new schedule. I guess legacy wasn't the only constructed format screwed up, and it looks like a political choice favouring limited events and making boosters most likely being bought at their store with the new prices than on the secondary market.

[Barook]

The only thing that did increase was FRF boosters, which could be a demand thing.

KTK are still around 2.5 tix. I wouldn't put it past Wizards to favor Limited events for more gain, but is driving away players for that really a good choice? :really:

Because I can't see alot of Legacy players suddenly starting to play Limited instead when they didn't play it before.

Edit: I've sent an E-mail to magiconlinefeedback@wizards.com regarding the schedule.

[Lejay]

The only thing that did increase was FRF boosters, which could be a demand thing.

KTK are still around 2.5 tix. I wouldn't put it past Wizards to favor Limited events for more gain, but is driving away players for that really a good choice? :really:

Because I can't see alot of Legacy players suddenly starting to play Limited instead when they didn't play it before.
Ktk was between 2.2 and 2.3 before the new schedule, i was checking everyday. I sold several time at 2.66 recently. It seems logical that they don't increase more because a lot of people like me chose to stock ktk packs and sold them when it went up to 2.5. I also know several people with huge stocks still waiting so there is probably a constant flux of players losing patience and feeding the secondary market with ktk. That plus the fact that more events provide ktk / more ktks than frfs explain the difference in the increase ( frf went from 3.10-3.20 to 4.0X )
Another point is wizards cares much more about getting dollars than getting tickets back. This is why you can only pay the 3.99$ packs or the commander decks and so on with your credit card and not tickets.
If they have limited players playing instead of having legacy players play, with bigger attendance, and they get more $ specifically also, it's all win on their bottom line even long term.

The fact they lied giving bullshit reasons for the change tends to prove it's just business optimization.

[Barook]

Another point is wizards cares much more about getting dollars than getting tickets back. This is why you can only pay the 3.99$ packs or the commander decks and so on with your credit card and not tickets.
If they have limited players playing instead of having legacy players play, with bigger attendance, and they get more $ specifically also, it's all win on their bottom line even long term.

The fact they lied giving bullshit reasons for the change tends to prove it's just business optimization.
It certainly does make alot more sense with the context we've been given so far:

- tix are already sold and don't make Wizards money anymore
- if the tweets from big bot chains are any indication, then there's a surplus of tix right now because alot of people are selling out
- cutting down the number of DEs decreases supply of boosters (for tix) while increasing the number of Limited DEs increases their consumption
- more people are forced to buy boosters from the shop, thus increasing Wizards' earnings with MODO

Given the timing of the change and Hasbro being royally pissed at the current financial performance of MTGO, it seems like a way to increase their profit, at least for a short term.

Since they couldn't make a good client even if their lives depended on it, I expect alot more milking (like Tempest Remastered) in the future.

[jmlima]

The only thing that did increase was FRF boosters, which could be a demand thing.

KTK are still around 2.5 tix. I wouldn't put it past Wizards to favor Limited events for more gain, but is driving away players for that really a good choice? :really:

Because I can't see alot of Legacy players suddenly starting to play Limited instead when they didn't play it before.

Edit: I've sent an E-mail to magiconlinefeedback@wizards.com regarding the schedule.

Looking strictly at your potential returns is it my impression or for your casual run-of-the-mill player playing in events, queues, etc is pointless, you are only doing it for the fun?

[Meekrab]

"Promoting" Wasteland to Mythic is so Hasbro.

[lyracian]

For those that play MODO Wasteland Remastered Card Image Gallery
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/card-image-gallery/tempest-remastered-card-image-gallery-2015-03-30
Wasteland is a rare; overall looks good if you want to build a Sliver deck.

[Phoenix Ignition]

Wasteland is a rare

Awesome, can't wait to pick these up and therefore instantly finish like 15 decks. Wasteland being so expensive makes for some really strange and inbred metagames online.

[Jamaican Zombie Legend]

So let me get this straight, Shard Phoenix and Cursed Scroll were (smartly) put at Mythic and Forbid was bumped to Rare but Rolling Thunder, Evincar's Justice, and fucking Capsize are all at Uncommon. Cotdamn, Wizards cannot do balancing to save their lives. I would have nixed those cards entirely from the set for Limited balance purposes or bumped them to Mythic.

Also have to love Mox Diamond, a purely utility card, at Mythic. Stay greedy Wizards!

[Phoenix Ignition]

Yep, people always find something to bitch about. Rule #47 of the internet.

[Barook]

It's nice to see Wasteland at rare. Maybe they realized that nobody woul draft this PoS if the chance to get Wasteland was too low.

Considering that a Wasteland is generated by every ~ 20th player on average, that should increase the supply of Wastelands quite a bit. But then again, it's the bottleneck of the format right now, so demand is going to be skyhigh.

[iamajellydonut]

but Rolling Thunder, Evincar's Justice, and fucking Capsize are all at Uncommon. Cotdamn, Wizards cannot do balancing to save their lives. I would have nixed those cards entirely from the set for Limited balance purposes or bumped them to Mythic.

They were all commons originally, so Wizards does acknowledge your bitching to a certain degree, but I don't understand why you want them eliminated from the format. Do you even limited, bro?

[H]

That visual spoiler just reminded me how much I like some of the Tempest-era art. I love that Disenchant, Counterspell and Dark Ritual. I wish they would print those with that art in foil.

I don't even like drafting and I'm not going to lie; I want to draft this.

[Quasim0ff]

So let me get this straight, Shard Phoenix and Cursed Scroll were (smartly) put at Mythic and Forbid was bumped to Rare but Rolling Thunder, Evincar's Justice, and fucking Capsize are all at Uncommon. Cotdamn, Wizards cannot do balancing to save their lives. I would have nixed those cards entirely from the set for Limited balance purposes or bumped them to Mythic.

Also have to love Mox Diamond, a purely utility card, at Mythic. Stay greedy Wizards!
Hi,

You seem to fail to understand how limited works. Try it.

[iamajellydonut]

I don't even like drafting and I'm not going to lie; I want to draft this.

It's 100% worth drafting. Cleaning house a few years back, our local store did a few throwback drafts with whatever boxes were around (Coldsnap, Masques tournament packs, Stronghold, Unhinged...) and Tempest was one of them. Only times I've ever gotten to draft it.

[btm10]

Tempest block was a fantastic draft environment. There were some super busted cards like Equilibrium (which wasn't reprinted), but it's a rare and the format is still great. Unfortunately, Kor Chant is no longer an overpowered removal spell.

[apple713]

That visual spoiler just reminded me how much I like some of the Tempest-era art. I love that Disenchant, Counterspell and Dark Ritual. I wish they would print those with that art in foil.

I don't even like drafting and I'm not going to lie; I want to draft this.

its not the same with these terrible borders. I guess everyone that plays mtgo is used to them by now tho.

[H]

its not the same with these terrible borders. I guess everyone that plays mtgo is used to them by now tho.

I know that it is heresy to say this, but I like foils with the new boarder. I really don't like foils with the old boarder.

Thing is, I think that Dark Ritual art would look sick as a new foil, I was so sad it wasn't the FTV:20 art.

[iamajellydonut]

... Dark Ritual ... so sad ... FTV:20 art.

We were all pretty disappointed with this one.

[H]

We were all pretty disappointed with this one.

The only solace would be that at least it wasn't the Judge foil art, because I don't even know wtf that is, but it's bad.

[Jamaican Zombie Legend]

Hi,

You seem to fail to understand how limited works. Try it.

No, I understand perfectly well how Limited works. Repeatable/scalable removal tends to be busted, hence why Shard Phoenix and Cursed Scroll are sequestered away at Mythic. That's smart.

But placing cards like Rolling Thunder and Capsize at Uncommon is totally silly (Evincar's Justice is worrisome, but probably a little less overpowered than the other two). Both of them are insanely bomby in the lategame and none too shabby beforehand. Plus, playing behind a player with six lands and Capsize is utterly miserable, a similar experience to a turn-two Invisible Stalker or Pack Rat in their respective draft formats. Those kind of cards shouldn't exist in draft formats, and there is zero excuse for this kind of mistake when "remastering" a block that's almost two decades old.

[dunk]

Wtf are you talking about? Capsize with buyback costs 6 mana in a format full of 2 drops. No matter how coherent your plan is, a couple of things need to go right to turn Capsize into a busted card, like Evincar's Justice that you mentioned as well. Also, look at all the other cards blue is getting - it's mostly chaff. Capsize was a common in the original Tempest and definitely less worrysome or game changing like Justice or Thunder could be. There is also always the option to just blow up/ sac your guy to counter Capsize... 6 mana is a ton of mana for such a marginal effect, really.

[Meekrab]

It's nice to see Wasteland at rare.
Yep.

Also boo hoo, Black and Red have some decent cards in a limited format.