SCG providence

[maharis]

Omnitell wins and puts 4 more decks in top 16


http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/deckshow.php?&t%5BC1%5D=3&start_date=2015-04-19&end_date=2015-04-19&event_ID=45&city=Providence&state=RI&t_num=1&limit=8&start_num=1&start_num=0&limit=8

[FoolofaTook]

Omnitell wins and puts 4 more decks in top 16


http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/deckshow.php?&t%5BC1%5D=3&start_date=2015-04-19&end_date=2015-04-19&event_ID=45&city=Providence&state=RI&t_num=1&limit=8&start_num=1&start_num=0&limit=8

On the bright side - only 6 blue shell lists in the top 8 and 6 non-blue shell lists in the top 16. Small blessings in a very boring meta in which you really only have to be prepared to face a few dominant archetypes after the early rounds of a tournament.

[ESG]

I await Sdematt's indignation when he sees this one:
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=83411

You thought Dark Maverick as a name was ignorant of history? Well, how about the monstrosity "Abzan Deathblade"? That makes it sound like the deck grew out of Deathblade. I'm having trouble thinking of a name that could be worse than that. Maybe a Khans pairing that was hyphenated.

[twndomn]

It's happening, actually 5 Omni-tell out of top 16. 1st, 6th, 8th, 14th, and 15th.

Omni-tell will be everywhere in the next 6 months.

[iGrok]

I find Omnitell very easy to deal with, personally. I welcome a primarily Omnitell meta. Counter Show & Tell four times, I win. Or, Counter it once & Surgical Extraction from the Board. Surgical has definitely become my GY hatecard of choice, since it also nukes the super-fragile combo decks. If you're playing a blue deck, just accept that Omnitell is a Force-check deck that also requires you to put on some pressure. You need to leave 2 mana open for their pierces starting Turn 3, so you really need a Turn 1 threat + multiple counters, and that's ok. Stop playing Stoneforge and TNN as your only threats - Cards that don't attack before turn 4 aren't actual clocks. This is Legacy, not Modern.

Show and Tell decks in general are well-positioned right now thanks to all the UXx decks getting more and more midrange-y. To beat it you either need to be really fast with a bit of disruption, or accept that you need to be the control deck more often and organize your board accordingly. In a couple months the pendulum will swing again, people will have more hate, and we'll get another 6 months before we start cheating again and it comes back. It's just like dredge, if you're prepared for it, the matchup is trivial, if you aren't, it's horrible.

[btm10]

I find Omnitell very easy to deal with, personally. I welcome a primarily Omnitell meta. Counter Show & Tell four times, I win. Or, Counter it once & Surgical Extraction from the Board. Surgical has definitely become my GY hatecard of choice, since it also nukes the super-fragile combo decks. If you're playing a blue deck, just accept that Omnitell is a Force-check deck that also requires you to put on some pressure. You need to leave 2 mana open for their pierces starting Turn 3, so you really need a Turn 1 threat + multiple counters, and that's ok. Stop playing Stoneforge and TNN as your only threats - Cards that don't attack before turn 4 aren't actual clocks. This is Legacy, not Modern.

Show and Tell decks in general are well-positioned right now thanks to all the UXx decks getting more and more midrange-y. To beat it you either need to be really fast with a bit of disruption, or accept that you need to be the control deck more often and organize your board accordingly. In a couple months the pendulum will swing again, people will have more hate, and we'll get another 6 months before we start cheating again and it comes back. It's just like dredge, if you're prepared for it, the matchup is trivial, if you aren't, it's horrible.

Omni is a bit more robust now than it was pre-Khans, but this basically sums up any meta situation in Legacy that doesn't lead to bannings.

[iGrok]

Omni is a bit more robust now than it was pre-Khans, but this basically sums up any meta situation in Legacy that doesn't lead to bannings.

Agreed, DTT is a strong card and has made it more resilient. But Omni still only runs 4 actual cards that do anything. Stop those 4 Show and Tells, you win. They have to get every single land in their deck into play in order to cast anything else. If you're running Urx, run Counterflux. If you're Bx, run Extirpate and pray to hit Show and Tell with discard. If you're Uwx, Meddling Mages are pretty good and are main-deckable. Rx, REBs are pretty sweet.

Now, Shota Yasooka apparently is already prepared for this. He has a wishable Through the Breach that he's splashing a pair of volcanics for. I've also seen a local player run a Noxious Revival as a wish target.

But even beyond this, if you're in the US, don't put too much stock in the results from Kyoto. The Japanese metagame is very different from the American one.

[twndomn]

Agreed, DTT is a strong card and has made it more resilient. But Omni still only runs 4 actual cards that do anything. Stop those 4 Show and Tells, you win. They have to get every single land in their deck into play in order to cast anything else. If you're running Urx, run Counterflux. If you're Bx, run Extirpate and pray to hit Show and Tell with discard. If you're Uwx, Meddling Mages are pretty good and are main-deckable. Rx, REBs are pretty sweet.

Now, Shota Yasooka apparently is already prepared for this. He has a wishable Through the Breach that he's splashing a pair of volcanics for. I've also seen a local player run a Noxious Revival as a wish target.

But even beyond this, if you're in the US, don't put too much stock in the results from Kyoto. The Japanese metagame is very different from the American one.

You are treating Omni-tell players like kids. If it's that easy, Yuuta Takahashi won't be MD 2 Wastelands Just For Boseiju, as well as SB 2 Canonists for all combos.

[Philipp2293]

But even beyond this, if you're in the US, don't put too much stock in the results from Kyoto. The Japanese metagame is very different from the American one.

Still last nights SCGIQ had plenty of Omnishow lists in top 16.

[iGrok]

You are treating Omni-tell players like kids. If it's that easy, Yuuta Takahashi won't be MD 2 Wastelands Just For Boseiju, as well as SB 2 Canonists for all combos.

I'm not treating Omni-players like kids. I'm saying that non-Omni players dont need to run around like the sky is falling because of omnitell. The format got too midrange-y, so now omnitell gets a couple months to take advantage. Its not the top deck right now, its just that all the DTB have inbred too much. Look at the other decks that made it: Elves and Sneak & Show are combo decks like Omni. 12 Post, Miracles, and MUD all have inevitability. You have RUG Delver, which is pretty quick, and Grixis Control, which has counters, discard, AND Surgicals in the board. The one midrange deck, Junk, not only has heavy discard, but also plays 16 threats (18 if you count Lili). What we don't see is the 2 Stoneforge, 3 TNN, 1 Snapcaster, 2 Clique deck, or the Shardless BUG deck that plays slow and only 8 total cards that actually interact with Omni.

Re: Takahashi, there are fewer boseijus in their lists. I'd chalk up the wastelands to a different metagame.

[iGrok]

Still last nights SCGIQ had plenty of Omnishow lists in top 16.

Yeah, I got my words mixed up, was thinking about Kyoto.

What I meant was, Providence has a weird metagame, as evidenced by Kyoto and the Syracuse/Richmond opens having 2/Top 8, 1/Top16, 1/Top32 respectively.

[Mackan]

It's funny how you guys allways speculate. The irl metagame in legacy is and will allways be a few months behind what you'll find on MTGO. It's simple. Very good players play very much legacy with easy acces to any card they want.

[Quasim0ff]

I find Omnitell very easy to deal with, personally. I welcome a primarily Omnitell meta. Counter Show & Tell four times, I win. Or, Counter it once & Surgical Extraction from the Board. Surgical has definitely become my GY hatecard of choice, since it also nukes the super-fragile combo decks. If you're playing a blue deck, just accept that Omnitell is a Force-check deck that also requires you to put on some pressure. You need to leave 2 mana open for their pierces starting Turn 3, so you really need a Turn 1 threat + multiple counters, and that's ok. Stop playing Stoneforge and TNN as your only threats - Cards that don't attack before turn 4 aren't actual clocks. This is Legacy, not Modern.

Show and Tell decks in general are well-positioned right now thanks to all the UXx decks getting more and more midrange-y. To beat it you either need to be really fast with a bit of disruption, or accept that you need to be the control deck more often and organize your board accordingly. In a couple months the pendulum will swing again, people will have more hate, and we'll get another 6 months before we start cheating again and it comes back. It's just like dredge, if you're prepared for it, the matchup is trivial, if you aren't, it's horrible.

What deck do you play, if you think your Counter-Deck can beat Boseiju > Show and Tell?

[iGrok]

What deck do you play, if you think your Counter-Deck can beat Boseiju > Show and Tell?

I play High Tide and ANT. Most lists don't play boseiju, and those that do play 1-of, maybe 2. If they have Boseiju, I go to game 3 and actually try to win instead. Omnitell is going to get some free wins sometimes, that's the nature of that type of deck (just like Belcher, Oops, or storm variants). But Boseiju > Show and Tell isn't the average scenario, and when it does happen, you can see it a turn in advance.

[ubernostrum]

What deck do you play, if you think your Counter-Deck can beat Boseiju > Show and Tell?

Personally I go with Wasteland, as the GP winner did (though I'm currently running it in a Myth Realized/Keranos Landstill shell with a stronger mana-denial package, not Miracles shell). Ethersworn Canonist also is handy since putting it in off the Show and Tell means they can't combo out and can't cast counterspells or use the wishboard if you go to blow up the Omniscience that turn.

The various Esper blade decks can all play Wasteland, too, and also get access to targeted discard and Extirpate effects, which are -- as noted -- kinda scary for Omnitell since it generally has no backup plan if Show and Tell gets hit with an Extirpate or Surgical Extraction.

Omni is a decent strong deck, and can be rough on an unprepared opponent, but it's far from a "you should just scoop to me, I auto-beat control decks" situation.

[twndomn]

I play High Tide and ANT. Most lists don't play boseiju, and those that do play 1-of, maybe 2. If they have Boseiju, I go to game 3 and actually try to win instead. Omnitell is going to get some free wins sometimes, that's the nature of that type of deck (just like Belcher, Oops, or storm variants). But Boseiju > Show and Tell isn't the average scenario, and when it does happen, you can see it a turn in advance.

I almost did not notice that you get to see it a turn in advance, it's as if I cannot read the card. When pros like SHOTA YASOOKA picks up Omni-tell, they modify and test the deck with Miracles in mind. YP in the SB is there for good reasons, not just against Miracles. Maybe Storm players like you should just test a deck with DTT in it to understand how broken can a deck be, before making another comment about how "average" Boseiju > Show and Tell is or isn't.

[sdematt]

I await Sdematt's indignation when he sees this one:
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=83411

You thought Dark Maverick as a name was ignorant of history? Well, how about the monstrosity "Abzan Deathblade"? That makes it sound like the deck grew out of Deathblade. I'm having trouble thinking of a name that could be worse than that. Maybe a Khans pairing that was hyphenated.

I'm going to burn the world to the ground. Fuck.

Junk? Dark Maverick? The Rock? All acceptable. Abzan Deathblade? Actually go die in a fire.

-Matt

[iGrok]

I almost did not notice that you get to see it a turn in advance, it's as if I cannot read the card. When pros like SHOTA YASOOKA picks up Omni-tell, they modify and test the deck with Miracles in mind. YP in the SB is there for good reasons, not just against Miracles. Maybe Storm players like you should just test a deck with DTT in it to understand how broken can a deck be, before making another comment about how "average" Boseiju > Show and Tell is or isn't.

Boseiju > Show and Tell is really fucking powerful.
It's also really unlikely that T3 Boseiju>Show and Tell>Omniscience>Emrakul happens. Both because many lists aren't running Boseiju, and because if they do its a 1-, maybe 2-of.

Sometimes Omni has the nuts. Sometimes they don't. This is just like any deck. If they play Boseiju T2, they probably can't counterspell anything I do that turn, so its my opening. I don't always get there, but sometimes I do.

Stop putting words in my mouth. Boseiju>Show and Tell is not "average". The "average" Omni hand is not Boseiju>Show and Tell.

P.S. Agreed, Abzan Deathblade is one of the worst names in SCG history. And that includes Tarmotwin featuring 0 Tarmogoyfs.

[Ellomdian]

On the bright side - only 6 blue shell lists... Blah blah blah blah blah

Sorry, I have a habit of not reading anything someone says after the words 'Blue shell.' It's like people complaining that there are a bunch of restricted cards in Vintage lists.


I find Omnitell very easy to deal with, personally. I welcome a primarily Omnitell meta. Counter Show & Tell four times, I win. Or, Counter it once & Surgical Extraction from the Board.

Translation:


Guys! Omni is SUPER easy to beat! You just counter a card every time the cast it! I beat it every time, no problems!

I love this kind of discussion. It's like people calling match-ups in standard anything better than 70/30 - "Oh, I beat that deck every time!"

Guess what? I beat Delver 100% of the time they do no damage to me! It's THAT EASY!


But even beyond this, if you're in the US, don't put too much stock in the results from Kyoto. The Japanese metagame is very different from the American one.

Hear hear. It was a blast to watch the stream (for the most part) but those decks were WEIRD! I am looking forward to trying Mentor in Miracles, but I have no idea if Rain of Filth would work in ANT over here.


I'm going to burn the world to the ground. Fuck.

Junk? Dark Maverick? The Rock? All acceptable. Abzan Deathblade? Actually go die in a fire.

-Matt

First they came for our Cereals, and we did nothing because it was a bit ridiculous at the time.
Then they came for our 3-letter names, and we did nothing, because Branding, yo.
Finally they came and made up whatever names they wanted, and we did nothing, because we all had aneurysms from the nonsense.

[Wilkin]

I'm going to burn the world to the ground. Fuck.

Junk? Dark Maverick? The Rock? All acceptable. Abzan Deathblade? Actually go die in a fire.

-Matt

I had a shred of hope when they originally had my list as Deadguy Ale. It has now been made into Abzan Deathblade. Ugh.

Wow, lots of Omnitell. May have to tweak my 1of sideboard. lol.