Troll and Cloak (Troll Worship)

[Kanti]

A deck I've been having a lot of fun with. Took the idea from old Flores/Tallowisp Stompy decks of old extended.

Creatures
Mana
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Aether Vial
1 Birds of Paradise
Bears
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 Scavenging Ooze
Beats
4 Troll Ascetic
4 Thrun, the Last Troll
3 Brimaz, King of Oreskos

Spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Unflinching Courage
3 Worship

Lands
4 Treetop Village
4 Horizon Canopy
2 Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers
1 Wooded Bastion
3 Windswept Heath
3 Temple Garden
2 Snow-Covered Forest
1 Snow-Covered Plains

Sideboard
3 Kataki, War's Wage
3 Choke
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Pithing Needle
2 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Spellskite
1 Blind Obedience
1 Master of the Wild Hunt


The basic idea is to get out some dudes and start the beats, and try to assemble your A+B combo (Troll+Cloak/Worship). I've found this deck to have game vs most decks except for Tron of course, unless I'm getting out quick Needles/Revokers. Even then it's tough, though I did manage to go 2-0 (4-0-0) vs UGR Tron today, and beat some RG Tron. It really shines vs U decks, if that's not completely obvious, and is darn good vs Abzan.

Vials are TOO good to drop, and I was at 4 for a long time. 4 might still be correct, but I do like the 1-of Birds as it helps get around Thalia's tax, which is pretty big. Even though the deck is GW I think the deck leaves lots of room for brewing in the sb.

[Phoenix Ignition]

I've seen a list similar to this probably 2 years ago that ran the same plan. I think it was called "blouses" or something, not sure why. It ran blue, which you might want to consider since your mana fixing is pretty great already, and it gives you the ability to drop some Thrun for Geist of Saint Traft, who is the best hexproof creature to throw enchants on (and really improves your speed, you can at least race decks easier), and Spectral Flight which is probably the best enchantment for speeding up your damage.

I've found Negate to be a great sideboard card in general as well for decks like this.

[Kanti]

I've thought about adding Geist, especially since my earlier iterations of the deck ran x4 Tallowisp, and x4 Kami of Ancient Law. My four-drop at that time was Chameloen Colossus to run even more Wisp' triggers. All in all I don't consider Geist good enough to add another splash, especially when I actually like Troll Ascetic more in this deck as regeneration is huge vs red board swepers and creature battles. One of the most solid parts of this deck is the 8 Trolls, as they create tons of virtual CA. So yeah, it's not worth the splash, especially if you consider you'd be losing 4 Horizon Canopies, 4 Treetop Villages, and 2 Okinas. Those cards stack up.

As far as Spectral Flight is concerned, I really would never run that over my Armadillo Cloak's as the effect of Cloak is much stronger in my opinion (trample and lifelink allow you to win the damage race, as you can't get chumped out of the game, and keep gaining huge chunks of life). If I had to gain flying I'd opt for some split between Unflinching Courage and Gift of Orzhova. There have been some cases where I wish I had done that, though a trampling 5/4, or 6/6 usually does the job. I do see how this is good though in a deck that could Daze, Piercem and Waste things. The loss of Daze hurts this strategy of going t3 Troll/Geist with counter back-up. t4 Thrun is always going to land.

The Blouses idea seems cool, though you would be cutting the hatebears, and Worships, for Serum Visions, Spell Snares/Spell Pierce, and something like Mana Leak. I'm not sure I like that as Thalia has great game against the format, and Scooze does a good job at hating out multiple strategies as well (Goyfs, Snapcaster Mages, helps vs Burn).

[Phoenix Ignition]

You're making some really weird cuts to add blue in. You wouldn't need to cut your best cards, you'd cut the worst ones. Regenerate is good, though I think you are overplaying it a bit considering there are two situations where you'd want it, 1 being creature combat (which flying would get around unless you're blocking with your good creatures, which is already a bad situation, and 2 being board sweepers that don't have the Bury wording.

In your current iteration I don't get Vials, and that's the first thing to cut. You're running 4x Thrun, the uncounterable killer of blue decks, who are the only ones you really want vial against. Sure it also adds pseudo haste to trolls on turn 5 or thrun turn 6, but if you have more mana dorks you'd be getting them in play on turn 2 or 3 anyway. Aside from that, you have Thalias who are going to tax counterspells or removal enough to slow an opponent down (and also as you mentioned require more mana dorks since you play things that get taxed as well).

This maindeck seems way more powerful, and yes I have playtested with a quite similar list before:


Creatures
Mana
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Birds of Paradise

Bears
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 Scavenging Ooze
Beats
4 Troll Ascetic
4 Geist of Saint Traft
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Brimaz, King of Oreskos

Spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Unflinching Courage
2 Spectral Flight
3 Worship

Lands
2 Treetop Village
4 Horizon Canopy
1 Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers
4 Windswept Heath
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Breeding Pool
1 Hallowed Fountain
2 Temple Garden
2 Snow-Covered Forest
1 Snow-Covered Plains

This cuts down your number of things that do nothing (vial, redundant copies of legends) while giving you seriously the most powerful creature to put enchantments on, and better sideboard options. I don't know why you'd want so many copies of each legend, it's basically a mulligan to see 2 Thruns in a hand. Geist actually does enough damage that I'd like to have multiples just to trade your 2/2 body for 4 damage (token) sometimes. While not gaining life, Spectral Flight is the most aggressively costed enchantment in modern for pumping out damage. And gaining life isn't always that important, especially with Worship plan.

I cut Treetops not because of adding a 3rd color but because the deck is a creature swarm anyway and you won't want it as your only land turn 1. It is definitely great in certain scenarios but not required in all (the justification for running 4).

I'd probably throw 1 Sword of Fire and Ice in there because powering up mana dorks is awesome in grindy games.

[Kanti]

You talk about redundant copies of legends, but then add 4 Geists. Armadillo Cloak is pretty bad with Geist, so you'd have to cut them for more Spectral Flights, and then you have a totally different deck. Regeneration is vital in playing the offensive when you have a Cloak out, as you can swing with a fatty, get chumped, but gain enough life to not die when your opponents untaps, draws, and swing for a lot. I don't see how opening yourself up to counter-magic, and making your Burn match-up go from goodish to very bad seems "way more powerful".

Vials add to the anti-blue count (from 4-to-7, where in your deck you have 2 anti-blue cards), allow EOT tricks (if you know your opp has board sweepers you can't rush out a Troll as they will untap and Pyroclasm/Anger of the Gods it before you can regenerate), and is many times better at accelerating that a mana-dork. If you don't get the Vials, test them. I'd say if cut the Birds and test the 4 Vials so you can really appreciate their role.

Basically, I'm not sold on adding blue for Geist, or running Geist at all.

Edit: As far as the copies of legends goes, I run 4 Thrun because I always want to draw him and there is no card selection in the deck. I'd rather have x2 Thrun in hand than x0 Thruns in hand. He's the only legend that is bad in multiples as once you land a Thrun the chances of him leaving the battlefield are slim. He's still been by and large the strongest creature in the deck for me, so 4 it is. Running 4 Thalias, and 3 Brimaz makes sense once you realize your opponent has tons of removal in their hands on account of me running 8 Hexproof critters. A mana-dork, Thalia, and Brimaz will almost always be dealt with ASAP by an opponent, and that is when multiples win the battle.

Also, your list really wants that 8th dork, or more like needs it. Running x9 3-drops means you want em badly!

[Sparkii]

I've seen a list similar to this probably 2 years ago that ran the same plan. I think it was called "blouses" or something, not sure why. It ran blue, which you might want to consider since your mana fixing is pretty great already, and it gives you the ability to drop some Thrun for Geist of Saint Traft, who is the best hexproof creature to throw enchants on (and really improves your speed, you can at least race decks easier), and Spectral Flight which is probably the best enchantment for speeding up your damage.

I've found Negate to be a great sideboard card in general as well for decks like this.

Blouses was the legacy hexproof deck that won SCG: Sacramento a few years ago. It's not quite the same deck, or even the same format for that matter. Here he's trying to combo with Worship and a hard to remove creature, instead of playing like boggles.

[ghostfire86]

I've got to say that I must side with the alternative deck list provided by Phoenix Ignition:

You're making some really weird cuts to add blue in. You wouldn't need to cut your best cards, you'd cut the worst ones. Regenerate is good, though I think you are overplaying it a bit considering there are two situations where you'd want it, 1 being creature combat (which flying would get around unless you're blocking with your good creatures, which is already a bad situation, and 2 being board sweepers that don't have the Bury wording.

In your current iteration I don't get Vials, and that's the first thing to cut. You're running 4x Thrun, the uncounterable killer of blue decks, who are the only ones you really want vial against. Sure it also adds pseudo haste to trolls on turn 5 or thrun turn 6, but if you have more mana dorks you'd be getting them in play on turn 2 or 3 anyway. Aside from that, you have Thalias who are going to tax counterspells or removal enough to slow an opponent down (and also as you mentioned require more mana dorks since you play things that get taxed as well).

This maindeck seems way more powerful, and yes I have playtested with a quite similar list before:


Creatures
Mana
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Birds of Paradise

Bears
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 Scavenging Ooze
Beats
4 Troll Ascetic
4 Geist of Saint Traft
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Brimaz, King of Oreskos

Spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Unflinching Courage
2 Spectral Flight
3 Worship

Lands
2 Treetop Village
4 Horizon Canopy
1 Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers
4 Windswept Heath
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Breeding Pool
1 Hallowed Fountain
2 Temple Garden
2 Snow-Covered Forest
1 Snow-Covered Plains

This cuts down your number of things that do nothing (vial, redundant copies of legends) while giving you seriously the most powerful creature to put enchantments on, and better sideboard options. I don't know why you'd want so many copies of each legend, it's basically a mulligan to see 2 Thruns in a hand. Geist actually does enough damage that I'd like to have multiples just to trade your 2/2 body for 4 damage (token) sometimes. While not gaining life, Spectral Flight is the most aggressively costed enchantment in modern for pumping out damage. And gaining life isn't always that important, especially with Worship plan.

I cut Treetops not because of adding a 3rd color but because the deck is a creature swarm anyway and you won't want it as your only land turn 1. It is definitely great in certain scenarios but not required in all (the justification for running 4).

I'd probably throw 1 Sword of Fire and Ice in there because powering up mana dorks is awesome in grindy games.

I would however take this a step futher by:
2 unflinching courage
4 spectral flight

1-2 copies of thrun, the last troll and 1 copy of Thalia, Guardian of Thraben could always sit in sideboard for U match-ups when you really need anti-counter. Match-ups against Tron mean that you need speed over caution because once Tron sets in its teeth it is very hard to fight back and hold ground. treetop village while an awesome sleeper does slow down your deck due to 4 copies that all enter tapped.

Otherwise I like the use of Worship in this deck build.

[cherub_daemon]

While remaining agnostic on the question of including blue, it really seems like this should be running Time of Need. It's more Thruns, more Thalias, more Geists, more Brimaz and you could justify running things like singleton Kataki, War's Wage maindeck if you felt like it.

My guess is that you could drop some of your legends for the tutor (nonspecific advice given intentionally) and come out ahead.

[Kanti]

Woah, did not mean to come off snotty. By all means give me specific advice. Seriously though, Phoenix, did not mean to come off in a bad way. If I added blue I think more Spectral Flights would be a must. You are gaining greater speed, but also a greater need for speed. Geist+Cloak is not very good, as he will just get blocked out. Troll+Cloak will either race for a win, or stall out the game to allow you to draw into a bomb. Now, Geist+Flight will race just about anything out of the game. Troll+Flight is not so good. Like the poster above, I think the deck would need to reworked to it's need for speed, as Geist is killer fast, but has the body of a couch potato.

I am also a bit against the splash as even though the deck is only GW it has an absurd numbr of GG costed creature, and my last iteration has Brimaz, which really messes things up with his WW. If I ran more Birds this might be less of a problem, but boy do I love Vial in this format in a deck that runs 26+ creatures. Turning Troll Ascetics into mini-Thruns is nice.

I like Time of Need, but it is a bit slow. And nonbos hard with Thalia, even though you suggested cutting Thalia. Toolbox approach would be interetsting though. x4 Time of Need, Thalias, Teegs, Brimaz, Linvala, other saucy legendary creatures. You have given me a great idea to test something akin to an Enlightened Tutor board with x1 Time of Need, and a bunch of silver bullets. Thank you very much sir, you are too kind. At least this deck has got some people talking though, it's a pretty decent idea.

[Phoenix Ignition]

Blouses was the legacy hexproof deck that won SCG: Sacramento a few years ago. It's not quite the same deck, or even the same format for that matter. Here he's trying to combo with Worship and a hard to remove creature, instead of playing like boggles.
Ohhhhh, wow, thanks for the explanation. I totally didn't read anything in here before responding.

...

I've played this deck in Modern. There were a few of us trying to make this version (yes, with worship) probably 2-3 years ago, in the time of Jund. It took on the same name for obvious reasons. Don't really want to look for the thread right now, it's on MTGSal somewhere.

The deck was better in Legacy, largely because Daze is irreplaceable for tempo decks that win like this one. FoW, too, but really Daze. I still think it had a chance to be good in Modern.


Geist+Cloak is not very good, as he will just get blocked out.
Which is the reasoning for having 4. Losing a Geist during combat usually still means hitting the opponent for 4 in the air. Just because you play Geist doesn't mean the deck has to change much other than that. If your metagame requires you to carry that much lifegain with you, by all means run 4 armadillo cloaks.



I am also a bit against the splash as even though the deck is only GW it has an absurd numbr of GG costed creature, and my last iteration has Brimaz, which really messes things up with his WW.
I agree, you can take out Brimaz. As for having GG costs, just run mostly dual lands that have green in them, my manabase is pretty good for that. You definitely want to do that to hit a turn 1 mana dork anyway.


If I ran more Birds this might be less of a problem, but boy do I love Vial in this format in a deck that runs 26+ creatures. Turning Troll Ascetics into mini-Thruns is nice.
Yeah I really just don't get it. You could wait till turn 4 to have a troll out via vial or get one out on turn 2, with extra mana for enchantments/Thalia tax if you played mana dorks instead. I mean it's like you're pre-sideboarded to play against UW control every single game. I've never played with a deck that should be running both vials and mana dorks. Vials are too dead to draw later in this deck, and you can't just keep them on 2 like most decks that use vials well.


I like Time of Need, but it is a bit slow. And nonbos hard with Thalia, even though you suggested cutting Thalia. Toolbox approach would be interetsting though. x4 Time of Need, Thalias, Teegs, Brimaz, Linvala, other saucy legendary creatures. You have given me a great idea to test something akin to an Enlightened Tutor board with x1 Time of Need, and a bunch of silver bullets.
I'm not a fan. There just aren't good enough legends to grab to justify paying the extra mana. Gaddock Teeg is the best but every deck running things they want to resolve that cost more than 3 also plays burn/pyroclasms. Thrun is fine to grab, but usually the decks that you really want him against are also the ones that you get a lot of turns to find him (and they also are the ones with stuff like spell snare).

One suggestion I have is to really write down which matchups you expect to face and which ones each card in your deck is good against. I know Thrun x4 and Vialx4 are amazing against decks with heavy countermagic, but how much do you expect to play against that? How often is a 4/4 going to be unfavorably blocked (or to put it another way, how many tarmogoyfs do you expect to run into)? All of the concerns you mention are valid, and possibly even correct, but we have some very different opinions on the types of games we expect to run into.

[Kanti]

I see blue more than any color in Modern. The number of times I've been hit by a combination of Spell Snare, Mana Leak, and Remand, coupled with Snapcaster+Lightning Bolt, or just Burn on it's own, make me run Vial. The reasoning is that not only does it blank out counterspells but it also blanks out creature removal. These are it's main draws, though it has other niche uses like flashing in creatures EOT to dodge Pyroclasm effects, as by the time you ship it back you have regeneration mana up. I guess thats why I value regeneration as well, as I go up against a stupid amount of Anger of the Gods. Vial isn't bad vs board sweepers either, so thats another +1 for it.

The speed lost is worth the resilience gained. I am pre-boarding vs U decks, not UW decks. Any U based deck is in trouble vs a t1-t2 Vial. The deck in general is slow, so I don't mind the speed lost, especially seeing as I still run 5 dorks so I can still dish out quick beats and cast Worship (added the 5th dork and reworked the mana-base a little for Brimaz, I wish there was a good green legendary at 1GG).

I get that's why you run 4 Geists, but losing a Geist+Cloak to hit someone for 4 is not what I want to be doing. I could cut Cloaks, but I built this deck to beat up on U decks, R decks, and have game vs Junk. Admittetly Cloak isn't a heavy hitter vs Junk, but it will let my Trolls race Siege Rhinos, and does a lot of work when the deck has resolved a Worship by turning on Horizon Canopy and preventing getting blown out by any other form of lifeloss.

edit: Good idea, I'll write a write up tonight, and my sideboarding strategies, though those are always 2-3 cards liquid.

[Jakobian]

I recently decided to try porting Blouses to Modern, and here's the list I ran for the first time at my LGS weekly modern event this Tuesday. I ended up splitting 1st/2nd prize with my friend Patrick after going 3-0 into the 4th round. I beat Merfolk, RG Tron, and mono white flickerwisp/resto angel and blade splicer. The list is fairly polished already because I tested it on cockatrice vs a couple of other modern decks. Cryptic command is amazing because it can help you tap down your opponent's dudes during their attack step, then swing in for lethal on the next turn. Sword of feast and famine is essentially more copies of spectral flight, and it also allows for untapping lands to have mana open for cryptic command or other stuff. I won 2 games with vapor snag (literally dealing the last point of damage with it).

One thing that was in the original legacy deck list that I have not tried is Psionic Blast. I think unstable mutation isn't as viable in modern either, as you really need to stick evasion on one of your hexproof dudes.


4 Noble Hierarch
4 Serum Visions
4 Geist of Saint Traft
4 Troll Ascetic
3 Spectral Flight
4 Path to Exile
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
3 Breeding Pool
2 Hallowed Fountain
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Forest
1 Plains
3 Island
3 Flooded Strand
3 Cryptic Command
1 Temple Garden
3 Vedalken Shackles
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Qasali Pridemage
2 Sword of Feast and Famine
2 Birds of Paradise
1 Negate
2 Vapor Snag
1 Eiganjo Castle
SB: 1 Sundering Growth
SB: 1 Vendilion Clique
SB: 3 Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 2 Unflinching Courage
SB: 2 Rest in Peace
SB: 1 Stony Silence
SB: 1 Negate
SB: 1 Dispel
SB: 1 Worship
SB: 1 Krosan Grip
SB: 1 Kataki, War's Wage

[kinda]

I think +2 birds should be tried to increase your turn 2 geist/troll/shackles. -1 dryad arbor, -1 serum visions?

[Jakobian]

I have modified the list a little bit based on play testing. It seems like shackles is less relevant against the broad field. I also upped the birds count to 4. I went 4-1 in the weekly modern event last night, beating a homebrew super friends, shapeshift, mono green tooth and nail, lost to junk anafenza combo, then won to junk anafenza combo (same list, different opponent) Elspeth is on the chopping block, might replace with a different sword of some sort. I am also considering replacing vapor snag with simic charm. From the sideboard I am considering cutting vendilion clique and replacing it with another negate. Another consideration is running kor fire Walker instead of leylines. The list is as follows:


4 Noble Hierarch
4 Serum Visions
4 Geist of Saint Traft
4 Troll Ascetic
3 Spectral Flight
4 Path to Exile
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
3 Breeding Pool
2 Hallowed Fountain
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Forest
1 Plains
3 Island
3 Flooded Strand
3 Cryptic Command
1 Temple Garden
2 Unflinching Courage
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Qasali Pridemage
2 Sword of Feast and Famine
4 Birds of Paradise
1 Negate
2 Vapor Snag
1 Eiganjo Castle
SB: 1 Sundering Growth
SB: 1 Vendilion Clique
SB: 3 Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 2 Vedalken Shackles
SB: 2 Rest in Peace
SB: 1 Stony Silence
SB: 1 Negate
SB: 1 Dispel
SB: 1 Worship
SB: 1 Creeping corrosion
SB: 1 Kataki, War's Wage