[Podcast] The Brainstorm Show episode 12: Legacy Misconceptions and Miracles Crushers

[Patrunkenphat7]

Hey guys, we have posted episode 12 of The Brainstorm Show. We discuss some popular opinions that we perceive as common misconceptions in Legacy, and we also look at 3 decks that have a good matchup against Miracles and are reasonable against the metagame as a whole.

http://www.thebrainstormshow.com/uncategorized/episode-012-legacy-misconceptions-miracles-crushers/

[Lemnear]

It strikes me as odd, if you drop critique on players who copy Infect/LegendMiracles/TES without knowing why the play card X, while its ok to copy & paste T8 lists which still feature the same problem.

[lyracian]

Hey guys, we have posted episode 12 of The Brainstorm Show. We discuss some popular opinions that we perceive as common misconceptions in Legacy, and we also look at 3 decks that have a good matchup against Miracles

You said in the show you thought this was one of your weaker episodes where as I personally preferred it to Episode 11. Last time you spent an hour telling me what the GP Top 8 was without, for me, adding a lot of useful information. This time I found your talk about Doomsday, Brainstorm and anti-miracle decks interesting.

On the Infect deck why only use blue fetches? There are only Tropical Islands to get which means Foothills and Heath is just as good and you might be able to fool someone into thinking you are a different deck.

[lucksack_delver_flip]

It strikes me as odd, if you drop critique on players who copy Infect/LegendMiracles/TES without knowing why the play card X, while its ok to copy & paste T8 lists which still feature the same problem.

Lemnear, not sure which lists you are referring to. Before we ever post a decklist for any archetype, we go through it as a group and build what we believe is the most optimal version of the deck for the current metagame. Could you please be more specific as to where we copied and pasted Top 8 lists and didn't explicitly say they were Top 8 lists?

[lucksack_delver_flip]

You said in the show you thought this was one of your weaker episodes where as I personally preferred it to Episode 11. Last time you spent an hour telling me what the GP Top 8 was without, for me, adding a lot of useful information. This time I found your talk about Doomsday, Brainstorm and anti-miracle decks interesting.

On the Infect deck why only use blue fetches? There are only Tropical Islands to get which means Foothills and Heath is just as good and you might be able to fool someone into thinking you are a different deck.

Thank you for the feedback. I suppose any given episode will be more or less appealing to any given player just based on experience level and interests. As for the Infect deck, that is a good point about the fetches. They could just as easily be green fetches and you would experience no negative consequences as far as fetching your Trops goes. I think this is just a preference thing -- maybe someone finds it more valuable to represent Miracles with a Flooded Strand than Lands with a Wooded Foothills. Obviously, if card access is a constraint, then just go with whatever you have! Thanks for listening and we look forward to hearing from you in the future.

[Goblin Cabdriver]

I agree that this show was better, although they're all pretty decent. No love for g/b decks as anti miracle tech makes me sad though, punishing nic-fit is just a miracles destroyer and dismantles its gameplan completely. Abrupt decay, deed, punishing fire, thrun, dryad arbor, GSZ to bring back terminus'd creatures... All good maindeck disruption and pesky threats against miracles, and then REB and slaughter games out of the side for Jace and entreat. Even veteran explorer is tricky against them, if they've set up the top of their library they often don't want to grab the extra lands. Nic fit might not be tier 1, but I think it's a good choice right now.

Anyways, keep up the good work, I've been enjoying the podcasts!

[Patrunkenphat7]

I agree that this show was better, although they're all pretty decent. No love for g/b decks as anti miracle tech makes me sad though, punishing nic-fit is just a miracles destroyer and dismantles its gameplan completely. Abrupt decay, deed, punishing fire, thrun, dryad arbor, GSZ to bring back terminus'd creatures... All good maindeck disruption and pesky threats against miracles, and then REB and slaughter games out of the side for Jace and entreat. Even veteran explorer is tricky against them, if they've set up the top of their library they often don't want to grab the extra lands. Nic fit might not be tier 1, but I think it's a good choice right now.

Anyways, keep up the good work, I've been enjoying the podcasts!

Thanks, Goblin Cabdriver! I completely agree with you that Nic Fit-style decks are a problem for Miracles, however, we were trying to choose a few decks that have game against OmniTell and URx Delver which also make up significant portions of the metagame. In general I think the 3 decks we chose to discuss have a reasonable gameplan against most tier 1 strategies right now and also happen to be solidly favored against Miracles. Nic Fit can be a good choice but definitely falls into the skewed matchup category that we were trying to avoid due to its terrible combo matchup percentages (sort of like 12-post). You are definitely correct that it is great against Miracles though.

[Lemnear]

Lemnear, not sure which lists you are referring to. Before we ever post a decklist for any archetype, we go through it as a group and build what we believe is the most optimal version of the deck for the current metagame. Could you please be more specific as to where we copied and pasted Top 8 lists and didn't explicitly say they were Top 8 lists?

Thats not what I said. I mentioned, that ranting about the follow-the-leader mentality in terms of Legend Miracles and Joe Lossett is totally off, especially if he has results with it. People copy&paste lists from vocal players and Top 8 lists every week without knowing why they run card X. Making a point out of people who don't question cardchoices or adjust decks to their metagame, to discredit Tom for example is foul play

[lucksack_delver_flip]

Thats not what I said. I mentioned, that ranting about the follow-the-leader mentality in terms of Legend Miracles and Joe Lossett is totally off, especially if he has results with it. People copy&paste lists from vocal players and Top 8 lists every week without knowing why they run card X. Making a point out of people who don't question cardchoices or adjust decks to their metagame, to discredit Tom for example is foul play

Go back and listen to the where we talk about Tom Ross. We mention how successful he has been with the deck and how he has found a winning recipe. We make a point not to discredit any individual player's success because, well, they have been so successful with the decks we mentioned. Not a soul alive can deny the success of those individuals: the results are in the books! What we are trying to say is that we shouldn't automatically give a pass to these lists just because a very talented player is able to put up results with them. No decklist is above critique, especially not those that are being trumpeted by vocal players.

[the driver]

Gotta love stating misconceptions about Doomsday during a conversation intended to dispel misconceptions :). Although the conclusion was fine.

In all seriousness, solid episode gentlemen. Glad the podcast in back on regular schedule.

[Patrunkenphat7]

Gotta love stating misconceptions about Doomsday during a conversation intended to dispel misconceptions :). Although the conclusion was fine.

In all seriousness, solid episode gentlemen. Glad the podcast in back on regular schedule.

Thanks, guessing you're Paul's friend who plays Doomsday in Cville?

[ScottW]

What has happened to this podcast? I thought it improved each episode (for the most part) and was looking forward to more.

[Quasim0ff]

What has happened to this podcast? I thought it improved each episode (for the most part) and was looking forward to more.

I've been wondering too.

It was one of the only shows that appeared regularly. :(

[testing32]

The guy who edited the show went to med school.

[btm10]

I suppose that means we've seen the end of this podcast?

[testing32]

I suppose that means we've seen the end of this podcast?

It didn't sound like Phillip was looking for anyone new to do the editing.

[Bryant Cook]

I'll admit, I was a little bummed that they stopped doing them. Especially after dedicating almost two podcasts to how I'd be better if I played ANT and another on how TES is worse than ANT, only to have me top 8 the Washington, DC Legacy Open!

[Finn]

Bryant, your success with TES is does not count!

I think you are at the point now that Dave Gearhart was at with regards to Solidarity.

[Bryant Cook]

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/b6/b6b8d3b6aab7cda3556eb0ac4530c66e4021034c1a0d0d3201a41278394b77ef.jpg

[btm10]

I disagreed with a lot of their arguments, but it was refreshing to have a Legacy podcast that wasn't afraid to be confrontational. It was, if nothing else, fun to listen to their arguments since they were at least defending their positions.

[Finn]

"Nobody can play solidarity except Gearhart" was so well understood at the time that it became a metaphor for a difficult deck to pilot.

It truly is a shame that the population of this site has so much turnover that an interesting bit of jargon like this gets lost to the ages, but I thought you would appreciate the comparison, as it is a sincere compliment of the highest order!

[Bryant Cook]

"Nobody can play solidarity except Gearhart" was so well understood at the time that it became a metaphor for a difficult deck to pilot.

It truly is a shame that the population of this site has so much turnover that an interesting bit of jargon like this gets lost to the ages, but I thought you would appreciate the comparison, as it is a sincere compliment of the highest order!

Aha, fair enough. Well then, thank you.

Yeah, but you can't expect the majority of the site to appreciate references from 2007. I mean, it's not like Rabid Wombat is the premier deck to beat anymore.

[Finn]

It was more a public nod just to you. Nice work; I read your report.

Freakin' Wombat. (psst...it was never all that good.)