[Primer] Eldrazi Stompy

[ironclad8690]

It is interesting that you don't bring in Ratchet Bomb for Tempo decks. It has been my bread and butter, killing Tarmos/Flipped Delvers/Pyromancer Tokens/DRS

[Noloam_]

It is interesting that you don't bring in Ratchet Bomb for Tempo decks. It has been my bread and butter, killing Tarmos/Flipped Delvers/Pyromancer Tokens/DRS

rachet bomb also blows up jitte and mimic on 2. i think racing back with uncounterable creatures is a better plan, than walking into pierce or daze turn 2 with a bomb. beside that, what do you cut for the bombs?

[ironclad8690]

I've been cutting the Thorns, haven't been bringing in Needles. I tried the Needle plan yesterday and I was wishing I had more removal instead.

[ang3lfir3]

so I'm here at gpcolumbus and it looks like the meta is lots of s&t and omnitell ... glad to be playing the W/g version ...

any ideas on minor changes to make the matchups more in our favor ?? ....

[ironclad8690]

I think you want more Karaki/Needle effects/Containment Priest for Sneak and Show and more Sphere effects/Rule of Law effects for Omnitell. I wouldn't hedge too hard though.

So guys, after 50 matches with Noloams list, here are my results:

Elves: 1-0
Reanimator: 2-0
Manaless Dredge: 1-0
Enchantress: 1-0
UWR Delver: 1-0
RUG Delver: 1-0
Miracles: 6-1
Ad Nauseam Tendrils: 6-2
Grixis Delver: 2-1
Shardless BUG: 2-1
Grixis Control: 2-1
UR Delver: 1-1
Infect: 1-3
Eldrazi: 1-3
Sneak and Show: 0-2
Belcher: 0-1
BUG Delver: 0-2
Bant: 0-1
Deathblade: 0-2
Junk Stoneblade: 0-2

All that combines to a 56% win percentage. Some instances were variance, such as the Eldrazi matchup, but perhaps some information can be gleaned from this. Not sure if I am going to move forward with this list, especially since Barook is enjoying a ~70% win somehow. Open to tips to improve the matches I am losing.

[Riehu]

Good luck everyone in Prague and Columbus. I'll have my try tomorrow here in Prague.

[Noloam_]

I think you want more Karaki/Needle effects/Containment Priest for Sneak and Show and more Sphere effects/Rule of Law effects for Omnitell. I wouldn't hedge too hard though.

So guys, after 50 matches with Noloams list, here are my results:

Elves: 1-0
Reanimator: 2-0
Manaless Dredge: 1-0
Enchantress: 1-0
UWR Delver: 1-0
RUG Delver: 1-0
Miracles: 6-1
Ad Nauseam Tendrils: 6-2
Grixis Delver: 2-1
Shardless BUG: 2-1
Grixis Control: 2-1
UR Delver: 1-1
Infect: 1-3
Eldrazi: 1-3
Sneak and Show: 0-2
Belcher: 0-1
BUG Delver: 0-2
Bant: 0-1
Deathblade: 0-2
Junk Stoneblade: 0-2

All that combines to a 56% win percentage. Some instances were variance, such as the Eldrazi matchup, but perhaps some information can be gleaned from this. Not sure if I am going to move forward with this list, especially since Barook is enjoying a ~70% win somehow. Open to tips to improve the matches I am losing.

56% percent is very bad. I wonder were it went wrong. Losing that much from eldrazi also seems odd. I always spy playernames on google, to see on what deck they are. If you keep a hand with a lot of thorn/chalice efeect, you are likely to lose game 1 :(. Sneaky show and blade are indeed very bad matches. I am pondering about letting my 1 off macabre go, for 1 endbringer side. Riehu and i think more or less the same about this (@_@)

[Barook]

I wish everbody best of luck. Eventually, the time will come where I'll join in Paper and I'm eager to do that.

That said: Don't fear the enemy, BECOME THE ENEMY THEY SHOULD FEAR! (No, seriously, the Displacer build and my results in the Legacy Challenge completely changed my perspective on pros. In the end, they're just normal people who lose to variance and bad match-ups just like everybody else in Magic; but they are less obvious to play mistakes, so step up your game accordingly. Now go out and kick their ass without fear! Because fear of big names is your biggest enemy on your way to greatness!)

I either expect Eldrazi completely to fail due inexperienced pilots or rock the top 8 due to people in the know of this thread: Eldrazi is going to place in either Top 8 because it plows through the US Top 8 or it fights through a rather shitty EU metagame (lots of D&T, Lands and Aggro Loam is what I expect compared to the US) through raw power.

[Marke]

Land
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cavern of Souls
2 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Mishra's Factory
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Wasteland
Creatures
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Endless One
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
Other
2 Dismember
1 Warping Wail
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Endbringer

Sideboard
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 All Is Dust
1 Faerie Macabre
3 Leyline of the Void
1 Ratchet Bomb
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Wastes
1 Spatial Contortion
1 Warping Wail
1 Pithing Needle


I'm testing this currently.

The maindeck for this deck feels pretty fleshed out, you can swap a bit between what you want main or not, for example you can play a jitte less main and a thorn more but overall doesn't matter too much.
For the sideboard the All is dusts are a must imo, i prefer 2 because I rarely like boarding in the third anyway. The extra thorns and some graveyard interaction are also a must. For graveyard I like leyline the most but I like a faerie too for the surprise factor plus faerie has some fringe usage in the mirror where it's just a creature you can board in instead of a dead card.
For the rest I find the board rough. I like something like Revoker or needle. Not sure which I prefer, I think revoker actually. I like that revoker is also just a dude you can bring in for the mirror. The deck frequently has many dead cards so i like a generic card like Revoker so you have at least something to bring in. For example in the mirror the chalices and thorns are pretty much dead so I want 6 cards I can bring in at least. Against ANT the dismembers, jitte and endbringers are almost dead so I like a different 6 cards too. A card like revoker helps nicely here because even though it's often just a dork with minor upside that is oftne better than some dead cards you have. I also think an extra land is nice in the sideboard, the delver matchup seems to be lost mostly by just being screwed out of mana by them. An extra land is very useful there. And in other cases the extra land is better than a dud card at least. The extra land also let's you adjust a little bit otherwise, it could be a wastes, gemstone caverns or tower of magistrate (not sure I like best for it yet).

Other card I liked for the board not sure worth it though was Tumble Magnet.

[benjiman13]

Is anyone is working on the red splash for vile agregate, obligator and sweep effect?

[jrsthethird]

Is anyone is working on the red splash for vile agregate, obligator and sweep effect?

U/R with Skyspawner! Dooo ittttt!!!!

[sporenfrosch1411]

RW has been pretty good for me so far.
Most choices pretty basic, regarding the color splashes:
4 Displacer, 3 Olbigator
4 Cavern of Souls, 4 Corrupted Crossroads, 1-2 Battlefield Forge, 4 Lotus Petal
Manabase very smooth

[RhoxWarMonk]

An Eldrazi deck on camera right now playing hangerback walker. That's, interesting....

edit: And smokestack/cubicle of worlds... cool brew.

[Noloam_]

5-0'ed today

-miracles
-manaless dredge (i mulled a 7 card hand with macabre, luckily i didnt get punished and kept a hand with 2 cards and a leyline ^^).
-landstill
-rug delver
-colorless eldrazi

finally got some decent hands. Modo gave me very bad hands lately

[darkgh0st]

An Eldrazi deck on camera right now playing hangerback walker. That's, interesting....

edit: And smokestack/cubicle of worlds... cool brew.

I've been working on a white eldrazi dtax brew myself. The idea is that displacer bridges the early game so you can stax.

[ang3lfir3]

currently 3-2 with barook's build ... in columbus

haven't seen any sneak and show myself just yet ...

beat some bant stoneforge brew round one ... then infect and a great grindy game with jund that I won off the back of a warping wail token equipped with a jitte...

lost a close 3 game set to shardless and then got worked over by burn .... (couldn't find a chalice and when I did he had the sts) ...

so far loving the deck weird not having counter spells tho (I came from delver)

[sporenfrosch1411]

Im still having trouble with Shardless, even with Displacers and Obligators.
Whats your plan there? What do you sideboard in / out.
Do you cut the Chalices (since they pretty much just have Brainstorm and Deathrite @1) ?

[Riehu]

Manged to do 7-2 here in Prague so only need 6-0 tomorrow :D

R1 DnT 2-1
R2 Painter 2-1
R3 Storm 2-0
R4 Infect 2-1
R5 UB reanimator 2-1
R6 Aggro Loam 0-2
R7 Shardless 2-1
R8 Shardless 0-2
R9 OmniTell 2-0

Will post possible changes to the deck for live environment later.

[cab0747]

@Barook, I think you are in Europe... but if you are at GP Columbus, I owe you a few drinks. Made day 2 with your oldish GW list.

If you are, let me know. 100% serious about buying you a few drinks.

[ang3lfir3]

I gotta thank you too barook .... this deck is killer .... I nearly day 2'd .... conceeded my last match to a guy playing lantern control in legacy ... went to a draw in turns and I decided to let him have it cuz he was chasing silver ....

amazing deck and with almost no time on the deck I nearly day 2'd .... it's the real deal ... and they are indeed scared of the displacers ...

[Dice_Box]

An Eldrazi deck on camera right now playing hangerback walker. That's, interesting....

edit: And smokestack/cubicle of worlds... cool brew.
I would kill for that list. The player made day two.

Edit:
http://i.imgur.com/tFyzb89.jpg

[Kid]

Made day2 @ GP Prague with Barok's list with a small change (removed a lotus for a World Breaker main) and 1 trinisphere SB (didnt have the 3rd thorn on me :/)

I did 6-3 after being 6-1...

Foodchain : 0-2
Pox : 2-0
Esper Deathblade : 2-0
Omnisneakshow : 2-0
Colorless Eldrazi : 2-0
Storm ANT (Carsten Kotter!!) : 2-0
Aggro Loam : 2-1
Aggro Loam : 1-2
Mono-R Painter : 0-2


Day 2 :

I'm @ 7-3 right now.

Belcher : 2-1

[RhoxWarMonk]

Everyone take a bow!! Great work guys.

http://s33.postimg.org/ca8ll97gv/Untitled.png (http://postimg.org/image/570q5n217/full/)

[Barook]

I'm happy people are enjoying my build and having success with it.

On a different note: A WU build just lost on camera and is now 10-1-1.

[bonkotsu]

At GP Columbus. Made day 2 at x-3 with my list very close to @Barook list

Bye
2-0 jund
2-0 maverick
1-2 shard less
2-1 reanimator
1-2 elves
2-1 mirror
2-0 infect
0-2 lands

I punted against elves pretty hard. I punted vs elves at a legacy iq last week. Goal is not to punt to them today.

Will do a full report later, one scenario I must mention now though:
Game 2 vs reanimator I keep a loose hand of 6 lands, 1 being Karakas, scry saw macabre so screw it play eye and pass. He reanimated stormtide leviathan turn 1. Get a displacer out and keep him tapped down for a good while. Get urborg, cast macabre, win with macabre beats

[Dice_Box]

Dam, the stax build I think has been knocked out of Top 8 contention. More's the pity, it rocks.

[Eldariel]

Dam, the stax build I think has been knocked out of Top 8 contention. More's the pity, it rocks.

He has a highly theoretical chance (at least without seeing his tiebreakers) where he could make it if all the top 6 tables play, and either table 7 or table 8 ends up with a draw. But yeah, chances are he'll fall a game short. That deck is definitely something to consider though; perhaps there's room for further tinkering but it's certainly a great midrange brew.

[Dice_Box]

http://magic.wizards.com/en/events/coverage/gppra16/deck-tech-eldrazi-stacks-valentin-mackl-2016-06-12

He finished 54th, 33 points and 0.6582 breakers.

[sporenfrosch1411]

I strongly doubt the possible gain from "EldraziStax" take since i barely see the upside of mixing those 2 strategys. You somewhat loose the hyper-aggressive Eldrazi Style that just "happens" to throw some disruption along and neither can you pull the full lockdown mode Stax tries to go for.
Maybe i have to test the list, but from reading it, seeing the streamed games as well as the deck tech, i dont think its a reliable strategy and in no way is it belonging into "Eldrazi Stompy" (aka the Tier1 breed).
Anyhow, aside from that rather critical evaluation, i think its a pretty deck and is surely to offer to a lot of fun when you pilot it (i just would not pick it up over EldraziStompy or categorize it in this archetype)
Dont get this wrong - i admire the creativity and love to see someone shipping aside the main stream - i just dont think its even close to being a real contester power-wise.

[Noloam_]

im not a hater. but i think that build looks horrendous

[Barook]

Are any Eldrazi decks still in contention for Top 8 in Columbus?

Edit: Columbus is also Eldrazi-free in the Top 8 (http://magic.wizards.com/en/Columbia%3A%20events/coverage/gpcol16/top-8-decks-2016-06-12)

[darkgh0st]

Barely any Eldrazis in top 32 as well. And when there was, it was colorless... I don't get it. Displacers didn't make it, even though it is very strong.

[MrDieth]

About the staxx drazi player - I think its not a good deck, very meta dependant.

I Went top 32 ( 32'ed to be exact. ) in GP prague with a colorless build.

My matchups where:

Day1

R1 - 0-2 Grixis
R2 - 2-0 Turbo depths
R3 - 2-0 Dark maverick
R4 - 2-1 Grixis
R5 - 2-0 Burn
R6 - 1-2 Aggro Loam
R7 - 2-0 Alluren
R8 - 0-2 Tezzerator / helm combo control thing something
R9 - 2-0 Dredge

Day2

R10 - 2-1 Omnitell
R11 - 2-0 Omnitell
R12 - 2-0 Storm
R13 - 2-0 Grixis
R14 - 2-0 Bug delver
R15 - 2-0 Miracles

It was the second time I played eldrazi in a tournament, and the first time I played a big GP.
So I was rather nervous and made a lot of mistakes.
The first match against grixis was really sad and played really bad because I was nervous. Should be able to win this easily.
The Aggro loam match I Should have drawn We where in time he was at 7 I was at 7, I had an active endbringer. It was his second to last turn, and he passed to my last turn.
I'm happy cause I think I won cause I can tutor up a reality smasher hit him, kill him, or something. details are a bit foggy of board state. Anyway, I take two damage from tomb. And yes, I totally forgot about punishing fire. Stupid.
Cause with the life gains he would have needed to give me I would have just been out of burn rate.
The loss against tezzerator was really nothing to be done against. That deck just crushes drazi.

All in all, I think the colorless build is the best one and a more experienced player in my position would have made top 16 easily and possibly top 8.

[Noloam_]

About the staxx drazi player - I think its not a good deck, very meta dependant.

I Went top 32 ( 32'ed to be exact. ) in GP prague with a colorless build.

My matchups where:

Day1

R1 - 0-2 Grixis
R2 - 2-0 Turbo depths
R3 - 2-0 Dark maverick
R4 - 2-1 Grixis
R5 - 2-0 Burn
R6 - 1-2 Aggro Loam
R7 - 2-0 Alluren
R8 - 0-2 Tezzerator / helm combo control thing something
R9 - 2-0 Dredge

Day2

R10 - 2-1 Omnitell
R11 - 2-0 Omnitell
R12 - 2-0 Storm
R13 - 2-0 Grixis
R14 - 2-0 Bug delver
R15 - 2-0 Miracles

It was the second time I played eldrazi in a tournament, and the first time I played a big GP.
So I was rather nervous and made a lot of mistakes.
The first match against grixis was really sad and played really bad because I was nervous. Should be able to win this easily.
The Aggro loam match I Should have drawn We where in time he was at 7 I was at 7, I had an active endbringer. It was his second to last turn, and he passed to my last turn.
I'm happy cause I think I won cause I can tutor up a reality smasher hit him, kill him, or something. details are a bit foggy of board state. Anyway, I take two damage from tomb. And yes, I totally forgot about punishing fire. Stupid.
Cause with the life gains he would have needed to give me I would have just been out of burn rate.
The loss against tezzerator was really nothing to be done against. That deck just crushes drazi.

All in all, I think the colorless build is the best one and a more experienced player in my position would have made top 16 easily and possibly top 8.

gratz! impressive results, especially against omnitell with 0 thorns main. although i think the manabase looks bad in my opinion, i do like the idea of the warping wails in the sideboard.

[MrDieth]

gratz! impressive results, especially against omnitell with 0 thorns main. although i think the manabase looks bad in my opinion, i do like the idea of the warping wails in the sideboard.

I'm the other guy ^^.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/events/coverage/gppra16/top-9-32-decklists-2016-06-12

The one at the bottom.

So I had revokers, thorn's, wails and endbringer maindeck to combat them.
Combined with a full playset of wastelands makes this matchup much easier then I expected it to be. Cause I thought it was one of drazi's worser matchups.

[sporenfrosch1411]

How good do you all think are Chalice of the Void and Thorn of Amethyst versus Shardless BuG?

+ Chalice@1 hits: Brainstorm, Deathrite
+ Chalice@0 hits: Ancestral Visions (maybe also your own Lotus Petal)
- But they can just Decay the chalice.

+ Thorn virtually adds (1) to Shardless Agent, since your opponent will have to leave a mana open in case he flips a noncreature spell.
+ Thorn adds (1) to play Visions from suspension
- But it also hinders your own Warping Wail (that are crucial versus Baleful Strix, Deathrite Shaman and at countering all those Sorcery's they play)
- It also hinders your All is Dust (which is why i am down to 1 in the SB currently)

What are your thoughts here?
I currently try to just cut the 4 Chalice 4 Displacer and replace them with 4 Needle 2 Spatial 1 Dust 1 Thorn. The idea here beeing to Needle Wasteland/Liliana/Deathrite (in that order), to have extra removal via Spatial for Strix (such a bummer) / Deahtrite and Agents and 1 All is dust to just have a way to reset the board. I would love to also include the 2 Sower+1 Ulamog package, but i dont think Shardless grants you enough time to actually pull that stunt in many games (allthough more often than not boards are stalled). I just would not know what else to cut there


For reference, here is my current list:
4 Endless One
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Eldrazi Obligator

4 Lotus Petal
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Warping Wail
2 Thorn of Amethyst

3 Eye of Ugin
3 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Corrupted Crossroads
1 Battlefield Forge
1 Sea Gate Wreckage

Sideboard
3 Faerie Macabre
4 Pithing Needle
2 Spatial Contortion
1 All is Dust
1 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
1 Ratchet Bomb
2 Oblivion Sower

[Noloam_]

I'm the other guy ^^.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/events/coverage/gppra16/top-9-32-decklists-2016-06-12

The one at the bottom.

So I had revokers, thorn's, wails and endbringer maindeck to combat them.
Combined with a full playset of wastelands makes this matchup much easier then I expected it to be. Cause I thought it was one of drazi's worser matchups.


yes that list makes a lot more sense to me :). i also pondered about the contortion instead of dismember. it seems great vs delver. dont you think it is annoying that you cant kill goyf most of the times ? im quite surprised you 2'-0'ed dredge with only 2 hateslots side.

[MrDieth]

yes that list makes a lot more sense to me :). i also pondered about the contortion instead of dismember. it seems great vs delver. dont you think it is annoying that you cant kill goyf most of the times ? im quite surprised you 2'-0'ed dredge with only 2 hateslots side.

4 hhateslots, 2 faerie and 2 relic.

I won the roll.
Game 1 - I went t1 chalice in the blind on 1. Wich he just scooped against basicly. He had a mull to 6, so he couldnt naturally discard dredgers wich made him really slow.
Game 2 - He goes t1 loothing + led, pop led. some ichorids and narco's. I play a thorn and just race him. Thorn makes it so that he can't go crazy with dread return, therapy's etc.
Dredge isnt really that fast of a deck and with just a bit of desruption you can easily race them.
I also side ratchet bomb in against them so the zombie's cant get out of control.

I really loved the Spatial contortion.
It can't kill goyfs. But when I used it, it was always aimed at a delver's head, wich are a bit more problematic. Against deck who don't have a lot of creatures to remove
you can use it as a pump spell on thought knot, smasher, endless one etc.. So I was never anoyed to have it. And not costing life was such a great bonus cause a lot of my games ended with me being at three or less life.
I would like to have one extra, but I just can't find the room. Suggestions?

[cab0747]

I won't be writing up a tournament reports as I didn't take many notes and I am not sure I could accurately remember all of the details from the games I played over both days. If you have any questions about the list or the matches, let me know. I will do my best to remember the details.

The list I ran and my match-ups are below. Again, big thanks to @Barook:

2 Karakas
4 Eldrazi Mimic
3 Mishra's Factory
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Lotus Petal
4 Endless One
4 Matter Reshaper
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Reality Smasher
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Dismember
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Brushland
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 Warping Wail
3 City of Traitors
3 Cavern of Souls
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Thought-Knot Seer

1 Warping Wail
4 Leyline of the Void
3 All Is Dust
2 World Breaker
1 Eldrazi Displacer
1 Dismember
1 Karakas
2 Thorn of Amethyst


R1 - 2-1 Nic Fit (Jund with B. Wish and Scapeshift)
R2 - 2-0 Miracles
R3 - 0-2 Shardless*
R4 - 0-2 Painter (T1 Moon both games)
R5 - 2-1 Goblins (Won through a Bloom Moon G2)
R6 - 2-1 Lands (Karakas MVP)**
R7 - 2-0 ANT
R8 - 2-1 Dredge
R9 - 0-2 Shardless

R10 - 1-2 Colorless Eldrazi (he drew the big half of his deck, I drew reshapers and mimics)
R11 - 2-1 4c Loam (Karakas MVP again)
R12 - 1-2 Junk Nic Fit (Sigarda is a real thing when you plan on casting All Is Dust)

I dropped at X-5 as I didn't want to put myself in a bad mood, I don't care about the pro point, the rest of my car didn't make D2, and I wanted to get back home in time for the Penguins game.

* The first Shardless match-up I had him at 1 life and his hand was empty in G1 and couldn't find a threat to finish him off. G2 I had a full board (TKS, TKS, 6/6 Endless one). Again, he was empy handed and his only out was Strix into Goyf (REAL big at this point. I think 6/7 or 7/8 because of All Is Dust) and then draw removal the following turn. That's exactly what he did. Yuck.

** I had lost 2 matches in a row at this point and after dropping G1 I had kind of checked out and was on tilt. I let a Gamble and an Exploration through a Chalice on 1 in G2. Luckily, he mulled to a pretty weak 5 and I won anyway.

I did not practice the Shardless match-up nearly as much as I should have. Huge mistake on my part.

[Jon]

I started 6-0 at GP Col with this list. Built it the night before and made changes I didn't like and moved some numbers. Ended up losing to Burn, then D&Tx2, decided to skip day two and just play a pile of feces at the SSS. I'll do a report assuming I ever care to play this deck again.
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160613/3b56deaf62747618407e94f7bc56a8bd.jpg
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160613/b77309c4cece00d8b5e7e69e549c7e45.jpg

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[Noloam_]

4 hhateslots, 2 faerie and 2 relic.

I won the roll.
Game 1 - I went t1 chalice in the blind on 1. Wich he just scooped against basicly. He had a mull to 6, so he couldnt naturally discard dredgers wich made him really slow.
Game 2 - He goes t1 loothing + led, pop led. some ichorids and narco's. I play a thorn and just race him. Thorn makes it so that he can't go crazy with dread return, therapy's etc.
Dredge isnt really that fast of a deck and with just a bit of desruption you can easily race them.
I also side ratchet bomb in against them so the zombie's cant get out of control.

I really loved the Spatial contortion.
It can't kill goyfs. But when I used it, it was always aimed at a delver's head, wich are a bit more problematic. Against deck who don't have a lot of creatures to remove
you can use it as a pump spell on thought knot, smasher, endless one etc.. So I was never anoyed to have it. And not costing life was such a great bonus cause a lot of my games ended with me being at three or less life.
I would like to have one extra, but I just can't find the room. Suggestions?

yes discoballs are great against dredge. i also bring in the bombs, blow up the tokens and make another swing. i am vintage dredge player myself. But leyline seems to me like the best graveyard call by far. maracbre can get needles and discarded and doesnt close the game against manaless dredge.

yes that seems legit. perhaps it is a better call when delver/tempo is more populair than goyf/batterskull. yes the pump upside also seems great! the life issue isnt always a problem for me, because i run 2 urborg.

[MD.Ghost]

Back from GP Prague - Played "Barook" gW Eldrazi (only very small adjustments) and afterall it was not the right deck choice for the GP.

Trial:
2:0 Goblins
2:1 BUG Shardless
1:2 RG Lands

I made a mistake G3 vs Lands which cost me the game (and the following semifinal vs ANT...)

Mainevent:
2:1 Colorless Eldrazi
2:1 Esperblade
2:1 BUG Delver
1:2 4c Delver
2:0 Burn
1:2 Dark Maverick
0:2 Maverick
2:1 Grixis Delver
1:2 BUG Shardless

So no Miracles, Combo and overall not the right matchups for day 2. Deck performed well enough in most cases. I was very unlucky vs Maverick, me at 28 life, my opponent at 3 (!) both side had lands and Jitte on the field but no creatures. I was not able to find stuff for 5 turns which included no Eye (i had a lot of mana) and no Mishra (but all the other lands). My last round (still a chance for day 2) i obviously got the Shardless Matchup and still managed to apply enough pressure. I had my opponent at 1 Life at Game 3 and than he made a huge comeback, i was unable to find All is Dust and died. Fun Fact, my opponent trolled me with Engineered Plague G3 which worked for him (see life)...and my World Breaker (i tried 1 from 2 copies for G3) had to kill 1 Strix and (after he played Toxic Deluge) i played World Breaker again vs Needle (i had 2x Mishra). Meta was full prepared for Eldrazi (regardless of the 15 Players with Eldrazi at Top 100). I think next year, when the dust has settled, Eldrazi can be a much better choice.

At Sideevent i played Elves, cashed for 1,5 Booster Displays and a 2nd Stoneforge Promo, good enough for all the entrance fee and snacks over the GP.

[bonkotsu]

Day two went poorly

2-1 vs fish
1-2 vs burn
0-2 vs dredge

Burn beat me for a couple of reasons. Me not having a TKS, and him waiting to play his bridge. Next turn I had him dead, he plays a bridge leaving himself at 2 life, could swing under it.

Dredge was strange. Last time I played against dredge I mopped with them. Game 1 was rough, he had a decent start, I hit a chalice on 1 to slow him down but he had enough to keep things going. Game 2 he was able to fight through a jitte, chalice on 0 and 1, a macabre, and two warping wail.

Going to keep on with team squid. I feel like I want to try nev disk in the side. Nothing really I can think of to make the burn match any better. I will say I feel naked without wasteland a lot of the time.

This was my list with some changes
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=103995

-1 crossroads +1 karakas

-2 trinisphere +2 reshaper

-1 wail and something else +2 dismember

sb changes

took out orb and ratchet bomb, added third all is dust, 2 wail, and some other stuff I cant think of right now

[Barook]

So what's the general consensus why Eldrazi underperformed in both GPs? Bad match-ups? People being (too) prepared for it? Something else?

[Jon]

Seemed like a fair amount of Shardless Shithole and I lost to D&T two times so that felt rough as well. I beat Miraclesx2, Shardless, D&T and Lost to D&Tx2 and Burn.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

[iostream]

So what's the general consensus why Eldrazi underperformed in both GPs? Bad match-ups? People being (too) prepared for it? Something else?Yeah, people were just too prepared for it; many players specifically chose decks well-positioned against Eldrazi (e.g. really low Storm representation), and others really shifted their sideboard hate appropriately (e.g. look at Lossett's sideboard). I think we are not helpless, though. I think it's possible that MrDieth was on to something playing Spatial Contortion and Thorn of Amethyst in the maindeck instead of Dismember and Umezawa's Jitte (most people do it the other way around). Tarmogoyf is a lot worse than it used to be, which hurts Dismember's value, and Jitte seemed particularly badly positioned this weekend with all the Shardless, Sneak/Show, and Miracles running around.

I myself played a Wg list similar to Barook's in the main event in Columbus and failed to Day 2 at 5-4. I had 2 byes, beat Sneak Show twice and Shardless once, lost to Sneak Show, Infect, Lands (piloted by Jarvis Yu), and Painter. All my losses except for Lands were close and I definitely could have played better overall; I am no master of this deck for sure. I definitely did not come away from the tournament feeling like I had made a mistake bringing Eldrazi.

[maraxusofkelds]

http://i.imgur.com/12nY7lB.jpg


Top 32 representation of Miracles at Columbo/Prague and their sideboard choices

Lots of blood moon and moat prep. Are there any more enchantment we can run besides just ratchet bomb?

[Noloam_]

http://i.imgur.com/12nY7lB.jpg


Top 32 representation of Miracles at Columbo/Prague and their sideboard choices

Lots of blood moon and moat prep. Are there any more enchantment we can run besides just ratchet bomb?

blood moon is annoying. moat not a big problem. it costs a ton of mana and it will take a while before it hits the table with discoballs + wasteland.

back to basics is way more annoying. its lights out most of the time

all is dust is the best way to deal with it. because most of the times they have some other goodies alongside with the hatepiece

[maraxusofkelds]

blood moon is annoying. moat not a big problem. it costs a ton of mana and it will take a while before it hits the table with discoballs + wasteland.

back to basics is way more annoying. its lights out most of the time

all is dust is the best way to deal with it. because most of the times they have some other goodies alongside with the hatepiece

My big issue with relying on AID to clear those is that it just gives miracles way too long and too many top spins to draw into counterspell or FOW

[MGB]

So have any of you considered playing a white build with 4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben instead of Thorn of Amethyst? And of course, playing Displacer as well?

[Silverflame]

So have any of you considered playing a white build with 4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben instead of Thorn of Amethyst? And of course, playing Displacer as well?

Ari Lax posted a premium article playing a different white build with 5 rounds played.

Creatures (21)

3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

Lands (26)

4 Plains
4 Ancient Tomb
3 Cavern of Souls
3 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Mishra's Factory
4 Wasteland
2 Karakas

Spells (13)

1 Batterskull
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Mox Diamond
1 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Dismember
2 Warping Wail
1 Umezawa's Jitte

Sideboard
2 Pithing Needle
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Containment Priest
2 Rest in Peace
2 Swords to Plowshares
1 Warping Wail
1 Armageddon

[Barook]

http://i.imgur.com/12nY7lB.jpg

Top 32 representation of Miracles at Columbo/Prague and their sideboard choices

Lots of blood moon and moat prep. Are there any more enchantment we can run besides just ratchet bomb?
Enchantments are definitely shaping up to be our main problem - Blood Moon, Moat, especially Back to Basics - with Ensnaring Bridge being problematic, too. In order of importance, it probably goes like:

B2B - Blood Moon - Ensnaring Bridge - Moat (with Moat having answers in both World Breaker and All is Dust)

maraxusofkelds definitely has a point that AiD is too slow when dealing with B2B (and Blood Moon sometimes). Resolving AiD while being able to cast spells is less of a problem, but when you're locked out, it becomes more and more likely that they have a counterspell.

I did a bit of research on answer cards. Thing is, all alternate cost enchantment destruction spells (Abolish, Patrician's Scorn, Reverent Silence) can't be realistically used in the deck, so they're out.

Which leaves us with quality enchantment destruction spells (mainly Disenchant/Naturalize, Seal of Cleansing, Wear/Tear, Krosan Grip, etc.) or creatures (Reclamation Sage or the more narrow War Priest of Thune).

Non-creature spells can't be supported without heavy modifications which I'm not willing to make because they would weaken the deck too much, so those are out, too.

So we're down to creatures. Those can be cast from a Cavern in a pinch (except under Blood Moon) and have synergy with Displacer. Providing a body for beatdown is just an added bonus. War Priest is cheaper and can also be cast from Karakas, easing the mana requirement, but it can't answer equipment or Ensnaring Bridge. Sage is a better "catch-all" solution, but needs a higher green count. Personally, I'm leaning more towards Sage due to greater flexibility, but I'll have to wait and see how those differences play out.

If we go with the creature answer route, more permanent W/G sources become a necessity in the 75, e.g. running a single Mox Diamond over a Lotus Petal (not a fan of that right now, but who knows) or SB Talisman of Unity (which also provide protection against Blood Moon and help a bit vs B2B). I don't want to change the MD too much as the problems only start post-board against said cards. Balancing the SB slots is going to be difficult due to space issues, so there's lots of room to explore.

A last option would be brute-forcing big answers like All is Dust, Ulamog, Karn Liberated and the likes with the help of Grim Monolith (which also acts as filter for Blood Moon, less helpful against B2B). Like this (http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/430988#online), for example.

[bonkotsu]

A mirror match I played against used 8 post lands. Maybe 12, I dont remember seeing any copy lands. He had o-stones main and some other random shenanigans

That being said, I am strongly considering Nevinyrral's Disk in the side. It isn't the greatest of options but being able to wipe away all of the enchantments and artifacts with man land backup isn't a terrible idea.

Top 64 in Prague used skyspawner and some other shenanigans, used Tendo Ice Bridge to help filter mana also.

I am not sure what helps with burn, zuran orb was just bad times in testing.

[Riehu]

Yeah, people were just too prepared for it; many players specifically chose decks well-positioned against Eldrazi (e.g. really low Storm representation), and others really shifted their sideboard hate appropriately (e.g. look at Lossett's sideboard). I think we are not helpless, though. I think it's possible that MrDieth was on to something playing Spatial Contortion and Thorn of Amethyst in the maindeck instead of Dismember and Umezawa's Jitte (most people do it the other way around). Tarmogoyf is a lot worse than it used to be, which hurts Dismember's value, and Jitte seemed particularly badly positioned this weekend with all the Shardless, Sneak/Show, and Miracles running around.

I myself played a Wg list similar to Barook's in the main event in Columbus and failed to Day 2 at 5-4. I had 2 byes, beat Sneak Show twice and Shardless once, lost to Sneak Show, Infect, Lands (piloted by Jarvis Yu), and Painter. All my losses except for Lands were close and I definitely could have played better overall; I am no master of this deck for sure. I definitely did not come away from the tournament feeling like I had made a mistake bringing Eldrazi.

I went 9-3 before I lost interest (played one more and made a mistake against storm costing the game and match and called it a day as I could not make it to top8 / PT invite). Overall I do believe as well that players came prepared and the meta was just too tough.

[MD.Ghost]

I went 9-3 before I lost interest (played one more and made a mistake against storm costing the game and match and called it a day as I could not make it to top8 / PT invite). Overall I do believe as well that players came prepared and the meta was just too tough.

The only good thing for me was, that the GW Build performed stable enough vs Shardless (3:3 in Games, 1:1 in matches) for me. I think without the troll move from my opponent (Round 9, G3) with Engineered Plague i had won both GP Matchups vs Shardless. I also only played 2 All is Dust and Barook is right about it, that this card is very good vs Shardless too. World Breaker was also not bad, mainly vs Strix but has also a huge Body (vs Gofy, but also for a Mimic Pump) and (for the first time in a paper tournament) i managed to bring him back after Toxic Deluge. Overall Shardless BUG is not a good matchup, but the GW Build is prepared enough to put up a good fight.

Other Notes from GP:

Since i run 2x Wastes at Side, i used them vs Lands (he used Ghost Quarter with Wastelands against me and i was glad to have Wastes, which was also good to keep Displacer-Mana up) and vs Burn (Price) for minimal Lands/Mana on the Battlefield. Overall i am still sure i want Ratchet Bomb back (Storm Combo, especially because the GW Build is a bit weaker vs Combo). So i will go back to only 1 World Breaker and have to find another slot (3rd Dismember?).

Dismember was ok, i had one game vs BUG Tempo which results in -12 Life (had to use 2xTomb for 2x Dismember - i won the game with 1 Life!) so this card is still better vs Mirror or a Gofy. I was glad to also had access to 2x Spatial Contortion.

Jitte overperformed at Prague for me. Starting with T2 active Jitte vs Goblins (Trial) and won me several Games vs Delver decks during the Mainevent (i also killed 1 Angler vs Grixis with 5 Jitte Counters^^).

My fastest Game was: T1 Eye into 2x Mimic, T2, Solland, Petal, Smasher and Attack for 15. Sadly i still lost the Matchup (Dark Maverick).

I never managed to get Eye of Ugin online during Trial or GP Mainevent and i had 2 Games which i lost because of it (had all the mana on the field...). I never faced Miracle or any Combo deck. (My friend with Aggro Loam got, Belcher, ANT and TES during the Trial^^)

[darkgh0st]

@Blood Moon, Back to Basics, and Ensnaring Bridge.

For GW builds, I would recommend trying Talisman and Krosan Grip, moving away from Petals.
For Colorless, I'm thinking either the Grim Monolith build or the ones with heavy Thorns maindeck. Then again, Thorn doesn't do a lot vs Shardless.

[Barook]

@Blood Moon, Back to Basics, and Ensnaring Bridge.

For GW builds, I would recommend trying Talisman and Krosan Grip, moving away from Petals.
For Colorless, I'm thinking either the Grim Monolith build or the ones with heavy Thorns maindeck. Then again, Thorn doesn't do a lot vs Shardless.
Replacing Petals with Talisman seems subpar. I've moved away from Talisman towards Petals for very good reason because speed is key. And that change doesn't even increase the number of green sources.

[maraxusofkelds]

There are two ideas I have been floating around that does not require a total overhaul of our core and will be testing at my local 30 man weeklys and on xmage.

1. Sideboard obliviom sower. I run a maindeck world breaker over endbringer and have a second world breaker in the side. I could potentially replace one of the world breakers with oblivion sower. The pros are that it is castable through bloodmoon and gives tons of value in the miracles, lands, and aggro loam matchups. Cons is that it doesnt answer moat nor will you be in that much off a better place if removed and you dont finish the game soon after.

2. Replace some numbers of brushlands, mishras factories, or even a city of traitors for wastes. The pros are that it allows us to completely ignore b2b and bloodmoon while dodging wasteland (a minor concern cuz most wastelands hit our sol lands or caverns if it is a delver variant) and gives us additional play vs ghost quarters and more importantly nic fits. In addition, this is an uncounterable solution to those enchantments as well, which is a big bonus. The cons are that it dilutes the power of our utility lands. Replacing a brushland means we have ro run fewer displacer mains. This is less of a concern for me because I run 2 displacer mains and 1 in sideboard.

The second option might become more of a requirement main deck depending on the prevalence of blood moon decks.

[bcoutlander]

Just a quick post about my GP Columbus experience. I played the colorless version very close to noloam's list

R1- bye
R2- Lose to Dark Maverick 1-2
R3- Lose to Dark Maverick 0-2
R4- Lose to Shardless 1-2
R4- Lose to Merfolk 1-2

It's really hard to say how the deck performed with playing really bad matchups in the first 3 rounds. Moving forward I will probably try the GW as it has more answers for troublesome flyers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Noloam_]

Just a quick post about my GP Columbus experience. I played the colorless version very close to noloam's list

R1- bye
R2- Lose to Dark Maverick 1-2
R3- Lose to Dark Maverick 0-2
R4- Lose to Shardless 1-2
R4- Lose to Merfolk 1-2

It's really hard to say how the deck performed with playing really bad matchups in the first 3 rounds. Moving forward I will probably try the GW as it has more answers for troublesome flyers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

what changes do you make to the list? a friend of mine also encountered a player in Prague, who copied my list. But he cutted the AID's from the sideboard. So his complaints were unreasonable

[the_goat]

GP Prague report

turn1 - aggro loam - i do not remember much...just that g3 was decided by leyline and a nasty topdeck of wasteland (the second out of two) in additional turns to get rid of his maze of ith 1-0
turn2 - elves - unbelieavable - g1 and g3 he wins with double cradle tap for 8 mana and cast behemoth from hand...in g1 i had chalice for 1 and chalice for 2...as he was drawing many cards from visionary-insect synergy. 1-1
turn3 - miracles - i win an incredible g3 against moat thanks to the draw effect of endbringer...by finding AiD and fetching + casting smasher in same turn. 2-1
turn4 - lands - my opponent destroys me with t3 20/20 flier both games - in g2 his first turn was land manabond put all my cards in play with the combo...no comment. 2-2
turn5 - esperblade - my opponent did not deserve to win...he forgot 3 times in 3 games the dark confidant trigger...he chump+attack'd his mystic equipped with jitte into my mishra, post block i activate tower of the magistrate and he reads it...realizing the effect of the tower...we are in a stall situation in my favour...and with no cards in hand...with batterskull no token and jitte unequipped in play...he topdecks TNN...obviously i die horribly in 2 turns...2-3
turn6 - ur delver - i win 3 quick games losing only g2 to double PoP - g1 and g3 chalice for 1 closes the game. 3-3
turn7 - rip/helm combo with land tax and white tutor - nice combo that unfortunately can do nothing against double thorn - my double mimic and smasher attacking for 15 put too much pressure for him to even try to resist. 4-3
turn8 - grixis delver - another opponent not very expert - he forgot to reveal instant to flip delver in g3 - leaving me enough tempo to kill him, i cast TKS and he does not cast brainstorm in response to hide good cards - i take his best card - smasher seals the deal - in g1 i lost due to gurmag angler whil in g2 and g3 leyline was a key card (together with chalice in g2) 5-3
turn9 - hope is still alive - one more win for day 2 - reanimator - i lose die roll - land entomb - petal reanimate griselbrand - i scoop to not let him know what i am playing - g2 i keep a greedy hand after a mulligan to 6 with double leyline and chalice - with TKS - smasher and wasteland...he is not happy about leyline but discards with double thoughtseize both monsters - i struggle to find lands and when i do is too late as he reanimates my monsters and kills me with them. 5-4
no day 2 for my monsters :

[MrDieth]

@the goat.

Isn't 6-3 day two ?

( I went 6-3 into day 2 :) )

[MrDieth]

There are two ideas I have been floating around that does not require a total overhaul of our core and will be testing at my local 30 man weeklys and on xmage.

1. Sideboard obliviom sower. I run a maindeck world breaker over endbringer and have a second world breaker in the side. I could potentially replace one of the world breakers with oblivion sower. The pros are that it is castable through bloodmoon and gives tons of value in the miracles, lands, and aggro loam matchups. Cons is that it doesnt answer moat nor will you be in that much off a better place if removed and you dont finish the game soon after.

2. Replace some numbers of brushlands, mishras factories, or even a city of traitors for wastes. The pros are that it allows us to completely ignore b2b and bloodmoon while dodging wasteland (a minor concern cuz most wastelands hit our sol lands or caverns if it is a delver variant) and gives us additional play vs ghost quarters and more importantly nic fits. In addition, this is an uncounterable solution to those enchantments as well, which is a big bonus. The cons are that it dilutes the power of our utility lands. Replacing a brushland means we have ro run fewer displacer mains. This is less of a concern for me because I run 2 displacer mains and 1 in sideboard.

The second option might become more of a requirement main deck depending on the prevalence of blood moon decks.

The oblivion sower's in the sideboard are really good !
The sowers are really good in the shardles matchup! a matchup wich is rather difficult.

They are also potentially good vs lands and aggro loam decks.
So I play a copy in the side, I want to bring that numberup to three.

[the_goat]

@the goat.

Isn't 6-3 day two ?

( I went 6-3 into day 2 :) )

my bad - i will amend the post - the last match with reanimator i lost 0-2 it should say 5-4...not 6-3

[iostream]

Anyone seen this list yet? http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/430988#online

Seems like a pretty elegant idea to get around Blood Moon and hate permanents in a maindeckable way.

[darkgh0st]

Anyone seen this list yet? http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/430988#online

Seems like a pretty elegant idea to get around Blood Moon and hate permanents in a maindeckable way.

Barook posted that list in the previous page. I am trying it out. My meta isnt as suited for this list though (lots of combo - Snt, Reanimate, dredge)

[iostream]

Barook posted that list in the previous page. I am trying it out. My meta isnt as suited for this list though (lots of combo - Snt, Reanimate, dredge)It certainly seems worse versus Sneak/Show but it's probably just as good versus Reanimator and Dredge, especially if you modify the list slightly to squeeze an extra sphere or two. It seems to be rather worse versus Wasteland decks, but better versus midrange Blade decks. The motivation to me is that (a) the metagame is really fair, so you have to go bigger, and (b) hate permanents are more common, so Ulamog is good.

[Silverflame]

GP Prague report
turn5 - esperblade - my opponent did not deserve to win...he forgot 3 times in 3 games the dark confidant trigger...he chump+attack'd his mystic equipped with jitte into my mishra, post block i activate tower of the magistrate and he reads it...realizing the effect of the tower...we are in a stall situation in my favour...and with no cards in hand...with batterskull no token and jitte unequipped in play...he topdecks TNN...obviously i die horribly in 2 turns...2-3


when that happens, call the judge immediately. Its a mandatory trigger, so at the first occurence, the judge will give a warning and force the trigger to happen, at the second, its a game loss.

[bcoutlander]

what changes do you make to the list? a friend of mine also encountered a player in Prague, who copied my list. But he cutted the AID's from the sideboard. So his complaints were unreasonable

I moved the Jitte's to the sideboard and ran 4 Thorns in the main.


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[Noloam_]

I moved the Jitte's to the sideboard and ran 4 Thorns in the main.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ok that is a good call against combo. you should play 4 wasteland with that build. i also playd 4 thorns before

[drude1]

Hi all,

New to the thread and normally a painter player, but wanted to take a ride on the dark side.
So I have invested into eldrazi on MTGO and so far it's been ridiculous. I am 8-0 in my first 8 matches playing the deck against Infect, Miracles, Dredge, Painter, a restore balance deck, the mirror, shardless and goblins. I've never had this kind of success with a deck before and am obviously hooked. This deck is crazy good but I have a couple questions. Before I get into details though (and admittedly without reading much of the thread) are people cool with discussing a white version of the deck or is there another thread for that? From what I can tell, people are talking about some splashes in the last few pages....

Anyway, I put together a white eldrazi list playing displacers, thalia, and stoneforge. I had a rough match against painter due to blood moon but was lucky enough in game 3 to have a chalice on one and a revoker on Jaya and he had blood moon and ensnaring bridge out. I was able to tick up a ratchet bomb to 3 and win with an alpha strike. I'm just wondering have people found better options in the board against nasty enchantments? Here's my current SB:

1 warping wail (2 in main)
2 ratchet bomb
1 world breaker
1 containment priest
2 tormod's crypt
2 spatial contortion
2 phyrexian revoker
3 thorn of amethyst (don't love these)
1 All is Dust

I'm wondering if it would be worthwhile to play disenchant or something to hit blood moons, back to basics, ensnaring bridge, etc. Or has anyone splashed green for rec sage or krosan grip? Sage seems good since you can displace it for added value. For people who play a w/r deck, what is the red for besides obiigator? Also, does anyone play basics of any kind (plains or wastes) to get around those nasty enchantments? Thanks for any input.

[Stranglebat]

Weighing in on the Get around blood moon, etc. thread, for the decks running leyline of the void or rip would it be worth siding in blight herders to get the scions? I don't think the 2 warping wail and 4 TKS are enough exile effects to main deck it though.

Maybe it's not high impact enough of an effect to warrant though.

[the_goat]

when that happens, call the judge immediately. Its a mandatory trigger, so at the first occurence, the judge will give a warning and force the trigger to happen, at the second, its a game loss.

Now i know...a friend of mine told me the same after this match...

[maraxusofkelds]

Weighing in on the Get around blood moon, etc. thread, for the decks running leyline of the void or rip would it be worth siding in blight herders to get the scions? I don't think the 2 warping wail and 4 TKS are enough exile effects to main deck it though.

Maybe it's not high impact enough of an effect to warrant though.

No it would not. We bring in leyline vs shardless and bug delver (well I do), reanimator and dredge. None of those decks run blood moon. In order to get blight herder to go off, we would have to run 4 leylines vs decks that we do not normally bring in leyline for, and further increase dead draws and useful cards sided out. Ratchet bomb is still more useful comparatively.

[MadRhetoric]

A friend of mine will be using my Wg Eldrazi deck at EE this weekend (a few cards off Barook's list) and I had some questions for you guys with experience as I haven't gotten to play the deck myself yet.

- Are the leylines that necessary against the more fair decks (mainly shardless and BUG delver)? They seem like the most inconsistent sideboard card and being able to cut them for other things would be great. Considering that almost every list plays them, I'm assuming the correct move is to run 4 but wanted to hear people's experiences.
- What are people taking out when sideboarding against Delver decks? I playtested with my friend running Grixis Delver myself and I was having a really tough time figuring out what he should cut in the match-up. I'm going to try and come up with a sideboard plan for him from the (super helpful) previous posts in this thread, but I'm struggling with Delver.

[Barook]

My current thoughts on boarding with the Wx list (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?30500-DTB-Eldrazi-Stompy&p=944846&viewfull=1#post944846)

I don't think Leyline is optimal in more fair matches unless they heavily rely on it. The risk of dead draws is real and rather unpleasant.

[darkgh0st]

I ran this list at my LGS FNM:



Colorless Eldrazi
darkghost


Lands (25)
Spells (12)
Creatures (23)
Sideboard



4 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Eye of Ugin
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
3 Ghost Quarter




4 Chalice of the Void
2 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Warping Wail
3 Dismember




4 Eldrazi Mimic
2 Matter Reshaper
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Endless One
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Endbringer




2 Wastes
2 Pithing Needle
2 Spatial Contortion
2 Sphere of Resistance
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Crucible of Worlds
4 Leyline of the Void
I went 4-0 (8-2):
Elves (2-0)
Storm (2-0)
Infect (2-1)
Infect (2-1)

Few things I took a note of for this list:
- I like the Wastelands here.
- The Ghost Quarter over City of Traitors for this list got me further mana-wise and disruption-wise. I didn't run into any Blood Moon decks so I was not able to use the Wastes tech.
- I ended up liking the Thorns MD as most of my meta is still combo and fair decks.
- I also ended up liking more removals over the Jitte. I'm sure Jitte could have done the trick faster vs Infect and Elves, but I didn't ended up needing it to win. I sometimes find Jitte to be a tempo loss as you end up losing both your creature and equip mana from a removal spell. More removal spells also allowed me to play a semi-control approach vs decks that don't have a lot of pressure.
- This deck probably can't handle TNN blade decks.

[Noloam_]

I ran this list at my LGS FNM:



Colorless Eldrazi
darkghost


Lands (25)
Spells (12)
Creatures (23)
Sideboard



4 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Eye of Ugin
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
3 Ghost Quarter




4 Chalice of the Void
2 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Warping Wail
3 Dismember




4 Eldrazi Mimic
2 Matter Reshaper
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Endless One
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Endbringer




2 Wastes
2 Pithing Needle
2 Spatial Contortion
2 Sphere of Resistance
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Crucible of Worlds
4 Leyline of the Void
I went 4-0 (8-2):
Elves (2-0)
Storm (2-0)
Infect (2-1)
Infect (2-1)

Few things I took a note of for this list:
- I like the Wastelands here.
- The Ghost Quarter over City of Traitors for this list got me further mana-wise and disruption-wise. I didn't run into any Blood Moon decks so I was not able to use the Wastes tech.
- I ended up liking the Thorns MD as most of my meta is still combo and fair decks.
- I also ended up liking more removals over the Jitte. I'm sure Jitte could have done the trick faster vs Infect and Elves, but I didn't ended up needing it to win. I sometimes find Jitte to be a tempo loss as you end up losing both your creature and equip mana from a removal spell. More removal spells also allowed me to play a semi-control approach vs decks that don't have a lot of pressure.
- This deck probably can't handle TNN blade decks.

i believe jitte is as much as an auto-include as reality smasher. It makes the deck pretty darn busted. Your fatties stay alive in combat and get counters. It not only vs elves and infect. it also vs pyromancer, flipped delver, burn and the mirror.

and indeed. tnn blade decks are horrendous for all coloursless builds. im really doubting whether or not displacer can do the trick there.

[Barook]

and indeed. tnn blade decks are horrendous for all coloursless builds. im really doubting whether or not displacer can do the trick there.
Displacer can only stop Batterskull/equipment shenanigans. TNN, especially with equipment, is pretty much game over until you can pull out the big guns after boarding in form of All is Dust/artifact removal.

[LeaPlath]

So, I'm looking at transferring to Eldrazi over from MUD.

I've been looking at lists, and this is the one I've kinda worked out for a local meta.

3 Mishra's for Miracles, and just as another blocker/beater. Being able to block as a 5/5 seems decent. 1 Tower to disable Batterskull/Jitte from opponents, I know we have some stoneblade and D&T running around. Also makes thing interesting versus the fringe MUD/Tezz decks we have.

I feel I want to be able to slam chalice on 1 as much as possible, so spirit guide. Helps versus the storm decks, and the various cantrips deck as well as shutting off the paths etc that ruin my day. Mox Diamond and Spirit guide are here to help with that. Is it worth going 1/1 Elvish to Simian?

I kind of want some kind of SnT hate, but I guess endbringer does that kinda well if I draw it.

Batterskull seems OK for being able to gain life/get big which can be relevant.

Lands
4 x Ancient Tomb
4 x Cavern of Souls
2 x City of Traitors
4 x Eldrazi Temple
3 x Mishra's Factory
3 x Wasteland
1 x Tower of the Magistrates
1 x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 x Eye of Ugin
Creatures
4 x Eldrazi Mimic
1 x Endbringer
4 x Endless One
4 x Matter Reshaper
4 x Reality Smasher
4 x Thought-Knot Seer
2 x Simian Spirit Guide
Spells
4 x Chalice of the Void
1 x Dismember
1 x Mox Diamond
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
2 x Warping Wail
2 x Umezawa's Jitte
Sideboard
1 x Pithing Needle
1 x Ratchet Bomb
1 x Batterskull
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
1 x Endbringer
2 x Dismember
1 x All Is Dust
4 x Leyline of the Void
1 x Warping Wail
1 x Faerie Macabre

[Noloam_]

So, I'm looking at transferring to Eldrazi over from MUD.

I've been looking at lists, and this is the one I've kinda worked out for a local meta.

3 Mishra's for Miracles, and just as another blocker/beater. Being able to block as a 5/5 seems decent. 1 Tower to disable Batterskull/Jitte from opponents, I know we have some stoneblade and D&T running around. Also makes thing interesting versus the fringe MUD/Tezz decks we have.

I feel I want to be able to slam chalice on 1 as much as possible, so spirit guide. Helps versus the storm decks, and the various cantrips deck as well as shutting off the paths etc that ruin my day. Mox Diamond and Spirit guide are here to help with that. Is it worth going 1/1 Elvish to Simian?

I kind of want some kind of SnT hate, but I guess endbringer does that kinda well if I draw it.

Batterskull seems OK for being able to gain life/get big which can be relevant.

Lands
4 x Ancient Tomb
4 x Cavern of Souls
2 x City of Traitors
4 x Eldrazi Temple
3 x Mishra's Factory
3 x Wasteland
1 x Tower of the Magistrates
1 x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 x Eye of Ugin
Creatures
4 x Eldrazi Mimic
1 x Endbringer
4 x Endless One
4 x Matter Reshaper
4 x Reality Smasher
4 x Thought-Knot Seer
2 x Simian Spirit Guide
Spells
4 x Chalice of the Void
1 x Dismember
1 x Mox Diamond
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
2 x Warping Wail
2 x Umezawa's Jitte
Sideboard
1 x Pithing Needle
1 x Ratchet Bomb
1 x Batterskull
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
1 x Endbringer
2 x Dismember
1 x All Is Dust
4 x Leyline of the Void
1 x Warping Wail
1 x Faerie Macabre


i also played mud before i started with eldrazi. this looks like my list.the the mox doesnt make a lot of sense to me. the same goes for the 3 eye's. i believe you can also use the tutor effect with eye, before you are able to cast the batterskull. so there is not need for that in my opinion

[bonkotsu]

Team squid in top 4 on camera right now for EE

[maraxusofkelds]

Am i just retarded or is there no top 8 lists posted anywhere for EE4

[bonkotsu]

Am i just retarded or is there no top 8 lists posted anywhere for EE4

I haven't seen any, it usually takes them a while to post

[metronome2charisma]

Played in EE yesterday. Played a pretty different build played all 9 rounds .Went 5-4 . It sucked .lol. I played ok. I know i made a play mistake that cost me a game so that was awesome. I played oblivion sower, that was sweet. heres my list.

4 x Ancient Tomb
4 x Cavern of Souls
2 x City of Traitors
4 x Eldrazi Temple
3 x Mishra's Factory
1 x Waste
2 x karakas
2 x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 x Eye of Ugin
26
3 x Eldrazi Mimic
2 x Endbringer
4 x Matter Reshaper
4 x Reality Smasher
4 x Thought-Knot Seer
3 x oblivion sower
2 x eldrazi displacer
22
4 x Chalice of the Void
3 x lotus petal
2 x all is dust
2 x Warping Wail
1 x Umezawa's Jitte
12

2 x Ratchet Bomb
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
2 x Dismember
1 x All Is Dust
4 x Leyline of the Void
1 x Warping Wail
1 x world breaker
2 phyrexian revoker.

TBH the deck ran great most of the day minus rd1 where i couldn't draw non-land to save my life.

rd1 grixis delver he wins the roll. both games he goes delver,delver death rite. I draw horribly both game are VERY fast 0-1

rd2 elves. He takes game one i take game two and i make a play mistake in gm 3 to cost me the round. i knew progenitus was a legend forgot he had pro everything not just pro colored spells so the sandbagged karakas did nothing ....yeah. 0-2

rd3 storm - I win game one easily game 2 he makes 14 dudes on turn three. i still get there with blockers and end bringer killing three dudes every attack. cycle. 1-2

rd4 infect both games are cool. oblivion sower gets me mana to warping wail his blocker in game 2,? that was sick. i win 2-0 . 2-2.

rd5 painter. I win game 1 he wins the next 2 with turn 1 painters
i lost 2-3

rd6 twelvepost . Sower was nuts eye was nuts displacer was nuts. i activate eye of ugin 4 times this match .3-3

rd7 infect I win 2 very fast games involving displacer ,jitte and sower and warping wail jitter and displacer. Displacer is an mvp here..4-3

rd8 Bant food chain games went back and forth i win 2-1 5-3

rd9 puishing jund. 3 very close games my opponent top decks like a champ 3 turns in a row and steals game three with wasteland, lilly ,pithing needle.the top decked needle naming factory (i have a jitte ,2 factories and an enbringer) won the game .

I was one of about 15 people to play all day and not money.
tighter play could have yielded better results obvy...If i had an ulamog i would have ran that in place of one all is dust but i didn't . My overall record with the deck is 69-38-3

[bonkotsu]

We had white spaghetti take first for vintage, no power spaghetti take second.

Deck seems to be dominating the vintage scene, TKS is a power house. I think the second place list for the legacy main event was colorless? Cant confirm. Lost to lands in the finals. I have some slots in my side that never really see play, for lands and other matches I have been strongly considering surgical extraction. The lands decks get out of control with loam, if we manage to hit loam they are down to 1 card per turn, if we hit a combo piece they have to slow roll us to get back in the game, even so if we surgical a combo piece what can they do?

I plan on testing some changes at our local store from now until my next event which I think is GenCon.

[metronome2charisma]

We had white spaghetti take first for vintage, no power spaghetti take second.

Deck seems to be dominating the vintage scene, TKS is a power house. I think the second place list for the legacy main event was colorless? Cant confirm. Lost to lands in the finals. I have some slots in my side that never really see play, for lands and other matches I have been strongly considering surgical extraction. The lands decks get out of control with loam, if we manage to hit loam they are down to 1 card per turn, if we hit a combo piece they have to slow roll us to get back in the game, even so if we surgical a combo piece what can they do?

I plan on testing some changes at our local store from now until my next event which I think is GenCon.

Yeah colorless was second place. It looked like a fairly stock list. On the topic of surgical extraction i've heard rumblings from the other players running it in the lands matchup to pretty good success . My problem with running that is that you would need at least 3 in the board, probably 4 and i would want Leyline in a bunch of other match ups where i would also want chalice, like storm,dredge, and reanimated. etc. where i couldn't use surgical if i chalice on 1.i get the allure but i'm not sure if I'm ready to take that leap yet. Leyline has been awesome against lands for me but like i said I've heard others talk about it in a positive light so i mean its free graveyard hate so its obviously good ,i'm just not sure if its better than Leyline thats all,but thats just me . Let us know how the testing goes.

[bonkotsu]

Yeah colorless was second place. It looked like a fairly stock list. On the topic of surgical extraction i've heard rumblings from the other players running it in the lands matchup to pretty good success . My problem with running that is that you would need at least 3 in the board, probably 4 and i would want Leyline in a bunch of other match ups where i would also want chalice, like storm,dredge, and reanimated. etc. where i couldn't use surgical if i chalice on 1.i get the allure but i'm not sure if I'm ready to take that leap yet. Leyline has been awesome against lands for me but like i said I've heard others talk about it in a positive light so i mean its free graveyard hate so its obviously good ,i'm just not sure if its better than Leyline thats all,but thats just me . Let us know how the testing goes.


I moved away from leyline for a few reasons:
1) In multiples as an opener its almost like a Hymn to Tourach on yourself
2) If it ever gets bounced or destroyed, there is almost no chance of recasting it
3) It dies fairly easy with us having to way to protect, if we get another its almost a dead draw

I have been on Macabre for a while and love it since it can't be countered. I am just trying to figure out what spot I would prefer Macabre over surgical.
1) In dredge you can hit all of their bridges or dread returns.
2) Vs burn you could hit all of their price in one go, this isnt an amazing solution but it is an option.
3) Vs lands you can hit out a combo piece, wastelands, or loam all together
4) Vs reanimator it seems less awesome, if they just hold up some piece of counter magic you are screwed vs macabre can hit whatever for free

I also miss wasteland. I have been on the Barook pain train and I feel pretty naked without any wasteland.

[Svyelunite]

[Video/Podcast] Legacy's Allure - Ep.15, Eldrazi Stompy with Harlan Firer

Many people have been asking "where's the Eldrazi episode?" Well, here's to you who welcome our new alien overlords.

Webcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ub6UTvwMEE&feature=youtu.be

Podcast: http://shoutengine.com/LegacysAllure/eldrazi-stompy-with-harlan-firer-20757

Also available on iTunes!

[RhoxWarMonk]

[Video/Podcast] Legacy's Allure - Ep.15, Eldrazi Stompy with Harlan Firer

Many people have been asking "where's the Eldrazi episode?" Well, here's to you who welcome our new alien overlords.

Webcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ub6UTvwMEE&feature=youtu.be

Podcast: http://shoutengine.com/LegacysAllure/eldrazi-stompy-with-harlan-firer-20757

Also available on iTunes!

Love your work Zach, keep it up!

[Barook]

Just picked up a playset of Wastelands (just to be sure to have access to them if I ever needed them) for 35 Tix each on MTGO since the price has kinda stabilized now. Gonna start playing and testing again at the weekend. The last few weeks were rather stressful and didn't leave me time to play.

[razvan]

Went 3-1 at the store tonight.

4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Matter Reshaper
2 World Breaker

4 Chalice of the Void
3 Lotus Petal
3 Warping Wail
2 Spatial Contortion
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Forcefield

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Brushland
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 City of Traitors
2 Eye of Ugin
2 Karakas
2 Mishra's Factory


4 Leyline of the Void
3 Thorn of Amethist
3 All Is Dust
3 Eldrazi Obligator
1 Spatial Contortion
1 Endbringer

Beat Abzan Nic Fit, Punishing Nic Fit, and Mardu Tokens with Goblin Bombardment, losing to Slivers (pretty convincingly).

Reality Smashers are so great. So are World Breakers. Obligators would have been good had I drawn them at any time, and All is Dust continues to be amazing. Never sided in Thorns or Leylines (except 1 vs. Tokens, just in case). Won a game by Spatial Contortion-ning a TKS to deal lethal.

I need to add a third Eye in, as soon as I obtain it. Maybe cut a Lotus Petal, although they are neat. Also, 3 Displacers might be enough?

[ZEROorDIE]

Would you mind breaking down your matches against nic fit? This has been a troublesome match up for me lately although the guy seems to always go t1 veteran Explorer into t2 siege rhino or some such non sense.

Just want to see how others are approaching the match up.

[darkgh0st]

The new Thalia seems like a good addition to the white version, and would probably slow us down a lot if played against...

[iostream]

The new Thalia seems like a good addition to the white version, and would probably slow us down a lot if played against...I agree. New Thalia actually seems to me to be a much better reason to play the "Eldrazi and Taxes" versions of the deck than original Thalia herself. I don't think it can be overstated how much tempo this generates if it manages to stick.

[MD.Ghost]

I agree. New Thalia actually seems to me to be a much better reason to play the "Eldrazi and Taxes" versions of the deck than original Thalia herself. I don't think it can be overstated how much tempo this generates if it manages to stick.

Maybe someone brew a new White Stompy Build with 8 Thalia and the good Eldrazi (Displacer, Seer, Smasher).

Since Eldrazi cant use Chrome Mox, this brew would need Petals or Mox Diamond a) for more white mana and b) speed, because besides Eldrazi Thalia 1+2 are a lot better if you get them online turn 1-2.

I hope we get some good ideas because I dont stupid auf stuff like Mimic or Endless One after all.

[Barook]

Maybe someone brew a new White Stompy Build with 8 Thalia and the good Eldrazi (Displacer, Seer, Smasher).

Since Eldrazi cant use Chrome Mox, this brew would need Petals or Mox Diamond a) for more white mana and b) speed, because besides Eldrazi Thalia 1+2 are a lot better if you get them online turn 1-2.

I hope we get some good ideas because I dont stupid auf stuff like Mimic or Endless One after all.
As my roots are D&T, I'd love to see a hybrid build. The Modern build is kinda meh, but the Vintage build enjoys some success:

http://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/vintage-white-eldrazi#online

Different meta and available cards (no powered mana artifacts, access to 4x Chalice etc.), but it might be a decent starting point.

If the deck wanted to support Mox Diamond, it would need more than 25 lands and probably some MD CoWs, though.

Maybe new Thalia + Winter Orb?

[ZEROorDIE]

As my roots are D&T, I'd love to see a hybrid build. The Modern build is kinda meh, but the Vintage build enjoys some success:

http://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/vintage-white-eldrazi#online

Different meta and available cards (no powered mana artifacts, access to 4x Chalice etc.), but it might be a decent starting point.

If the deck wanted to support Mox Diamond, it would need more than 25 lands and probably some MD CoWs, though.

Maybe new Thalia + Winter Orb?

I've already been contemplating going back to a more staxx-esque build lately (2 tournament coming up, plan on working on some new experiments once those are over) and the new Thalia lines right up with what most prison decks are trying to do. Definitely more lands, likely factory and maybe mutavualt. Will definitely be less eldrazi centric, but this is an exciting spoiler.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

Stax has played 24-25 lands and 4 Diamond for over a decade, I doubt very much that you need more than 25 lands to be effective with diamond. Crucible is good, but more than 25 lands is nonsensical, imho.

[maraxusofkelds]

Would you mind breaking down your matches against nic fit? This has been a troublesome match up for me lately although the guy seems to always go t1 veteran Explorer into t2 siege rhino or some such non sense.

Just want to see how others are approaching the match up.

Warping wail on veterans. Board out chalice if not on the play. Dont atk needlessly into veterans. Thought knots are key (hit pernicious deed and rhinos and green sun zeniths. Try to overwhelm them like v shardless bug. Do not play around deed too much. Late game they either have it or they dont. Their threats are bigger and you dont have time to durdle for top decks.

[Barook]

I wouldn't board out Chalices. They still hurt them alot, even if they die to Deed.

[razvan]

Would you mind breaking down your matches against nic fit? This has been a troublesome match up for me lately although the guy seems to always go t1 veteran Explorer into t2 siege rhino or some such non sense.

Just want to see how others are approaching the match up.
Well, as Barook said, don't board out chalices. As maraxus said, Warping Wail on Veteran Explorers. Don't attack randomly into them either.

As for my matches, I am not quite sure how lucky I have been getting in the 2 rounds. Abrupt Decay not hitting TKS and Reality Smasher is a biggie, and Matter Reshaper is a solid investment. World Breaker and Endbringer have been very solid as well, they are very hard to deal with outside of StP in the Abzan Nic Fit version.

The Punishing Fire version doesn't seem very good against us either. Yes, they can kill Mimics and Reshapers relatively easy, and I did take out Chalice vs. that one, siding in Thorns, Endbringers and All is Dust (took out Mimics too).

The Abzan version I just trimmed Mimics and Displacers and put in All is Dust, that one is very good, it just resets the board.

I also won by Spatial Distortion-ning my attackers, especially TKS and Smasher. A giant growth at a random time is quite good :)

[darkgh0st]

I went 3-1 today for FNM piloting the same list last week.

2-0 vs Lands
2-0 vs Reanimator
0-2 vs mirror (Gerry Thompson's list) lost due to bad draws both games
2-1 vs Miracles

Highlights today were:
- Endbringer stopping Marit Lage
- Metamorph copying a Marit Lage token
- copying an Iona vs Reanimator G1
- copying a Blazing Archon vs Reanimator G2
- Endbringer ending the game in a stalled board of two Blazing Archons
- Mull to 4 and win vs Reanimator (opening with a Leyline as well)
- Ratchet Bomb blowing up Moat and Jace vs Miracles G2 (I still lost due to Humility)
- Wastes avoiding Blood Moon Miracles G3

[Barook]

Call me crazy, but I've never noticed it before: We can, theoretically, run Birthing Pod. I'm well aware that it would cost a shitton of life and some tempo and thus it might be quite terrible, but hear me out while I'm still trying to wrap my head around this discovery:

We do have something like an actual chain:
Mimic --> Displacer or Reshaper (extra value!) --> TKS (probably only sacced for lethal alpha strikes) --> Smasher --> Endbringer (optional)

That alone isn't really mind-blowing. The more interesting aspect is the colorless tutoring for silver bullets aside from Displacer/TKS, e.g. for Reclamation Sage, Phyrexian Metamorph, Wasteland Stranger, etc.

Now the questions are:
a) What can we fetch to make the trouble worth it?
b) How do we stay alive between Ancient Tombs and lots of phyrexian mana payments?
c) Is there any legit 1-drop to bridge the gap?

[razvan]

Hmmm... interesting.

Well, to answer your questions:

a) The high-end chain of Eldrazi is pretty damn strong, although it's hard to envision sacrificing Reality Smasher, and World Breaker triggers on cast. So meh.
b) You can tutor for life gaining cards. I have used Pelakka Wurm in Lands before (with Living Wish).
c) Probably nothing we'd want. We have a ton of creatures, and Endbringer can be cast for one. Also, Hangarback Walker is a solid little thing?

I don't know how good it'll be but it definitely is impactful enough to warrant testing! Also, not to mention that Matter Reshaper sacrifice is neat.

[darkgh0st]

Birthing Pod seems like a different deck on its own. The best 1 drop I can think of for that is Veteran Explorer.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

Anyone plan on trying out the new Thalia? I think it would go amazing in an Eldrazi and Taxes list with SFM. Anyone thought about this at all?

[metronome2charisma]

Call me crazy, but I've never noticed it before: We can, theoretically, run Birthing Pod. I'm well aware that it would cost a shitton of life and some tempo and thus it might be quite terrible, but hear me out while I'm still trying to wrap my head around this discovery:

We do have something like an actual chain:
Mimic --> Displacer or Reshaper (extra value!) --> TKS (probably only sacced for lethal alpha strikes) --> Smasher --> Endbringer (optional)

That alone isn't really mind-blowing. The more interesting aspect is the colorless tutoring for silver bullets aside from Displacer/TKS, e.g. for Reclamation Sage, Phyrexian Metamorph, Wasteland Stranger, etc.

Now the questions are:
a) What can we fetch to make the trouble worth it?
b) How do we stay alive between Ancient Tombs and lots of phyrexian mana payments?
c) Is there any legit 1-drop to bridge the gap?

This was an idea i had months ago and its not really worth it in a pure eldrazi deck. I get the appeal though.

[iostream]

Anyone plan on trying out the new Thalia? I think it would go amazing in an Eldrazi and Taxes list with SFM. Anyone thought about this at all?Here are my thoughts about how new Thalia might fit into some kind of Eldrazi deck. This is longwinded, and all theorycraft, but I think we gotta start somewhere.

First, I'd like to make a couple comments about what we've learned about white splashes from the last few months. The biggest obstruction to "true" (i.e. splashing for more than just Displacer) W/x Eldrazi lists is the mana. Consider Michael Majors's list from GP Columbus. (http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=104145) He doesn't really run enough white sources (14, generously counting each Cavern as a full W source), and the ones he does run came at the expense of the Sol land count, which makes the deck much less explosive and calls into question the basic idea of the deck. Mimic/Endless One/TKS/Smasher is strong because it's an unbeatable curve when you get to make 2 mana a turn. But he has only 11 sol lands instead of 13-14 and surely opens tons of hands where turn 1 Mox Diamond would mess up the later part of the curve out because he has to pitch a Sol Land to it or because his hand simply doesn't contain enough lands. I mention the second thing because I actually saw Mox Diamond screw him over in this way at GP Columbus when he played one of my friends in Day 1.

Honestly, one gets the sense that the Wx versions of the deck are just "Eldrazi with some white cards that fill the curve better than the colorless alternatives", which might be true, but it does so at an unacceptable cost to the consistency of the deck. If one doubts this effect, perhaps one should consider why Colorless Eldrazi is the only version of the deck that ever seems to put up results, in paper or online.

So why might New Thalia actually help this sad situation? It is because it suggests a different, coherent gameplan for Eldrazi and Taxes. Consider the following statements, which at first glance seem to be true (but I have not verified myself from testing):

1) It synergizes very well with Old Thalia, which makes it seems like you're "supposed to" play even more white cards than Majors does.

2) It is a good three-drop, which has always been lacking in Eldrazi. Few people actually love Matter Reshaper, and indeed one of the main motivations for the Wx lists in the first place was to have a less crappy thing to do in that slot.

3) Finally, it "buys tempo" the same way Reality Smasher does. If you're even a little ahead on board, you are going to get damage in. Young Pyromancer tokens, Monastery Mentor tokens, and random creatures your opponent might try to cast in the hopes of slowing you down are always going to be late.

So perhaps what you're supposed to do is stop trying to execute the "unbeatable curve-out" and instead leverage the Thalia pair in order to be more controlling - be more like D+T than Eldrazi. You should run Thought-Knot and Displacer because (a) they are not expensive to cast and (b) they are disruption. Mimic, Endless One, and Reality Smasher are just fat beaters and not on plan.

This is potentially better than D+T because (a) your stuff doesn't just roll over and die to Shrivel effects, (b) you get to play Ancient Tomb and Chalice of the Void and thereby land your taxes earlier and (c) TKS is an extremely powerful Magic card. Also, this is a deck that will not have to pray to get a turn 2 versus ANT like D+T does. It will get to land something good on turn 1.

One observation is that if your curve stops at Thought-Knot Seer, Mox Diamond might actually become amazing. A good analogy for this point is 4-color Loam. It plays 4 Mox Diamonds and 26 lands and it does this with only two Loams and plays lots of games where it never dredges Loam even once. It is ok playing games where it has 2 lands in play and a Mox Diamond. That's because it is not trying to cast things that cost five. In the same way, we should endeavor to build a deck that can run the fast mana and will have nut draws that involve Ancient Tomb, but it's not utterly reliant on it.

I want to mention that the Stoneforge Mystic idea Secretly.A.Bee had fits perfectly into this plan because it gives the deck something powerful to do for not a lot of mana.

To summarize, I hope there is a Legacy equivalent of TKS Workshops in Vintage. You don't run any Eldrazi except for TKS, because that's the best one by far. The rest is all hate.

A grotesque first draft of these ideas is as follows:

3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Thought-Knot Seer

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Dismember

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Karakas
3 Plains
4 Wasteland

[bonkotsu]

Here are my thoughts about how new Thalia might fit into some kind of Eldrazi deck. This is longwinded, and all theorycraft, but I think we gotta start somewhere.

First, I'd like to make a couple comments about what we've learned about white splashes from the last few months. The biggest obstruction to "true" (i.e. splashing for more than just Displacer) W/x Eldrazi lists is the mana. Consider Michael Majors's list from GP Columbus. (http://sales.starcitygames.com/deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=104145) He doesn't really run enough white sources (14, generously counting each Cavern as a full W source), and the ones he does run came at the expense of the Sol land count, which makes the deck much less explosive and calls into question the basic idea of the deck. Mimic/Endless One/TKS/Smasher is strong because it's an unbeatable curve when you get to make 2 mana a turn. But he has only 11 sol lands instead of 13-14 and surely opens tons of hands where turn 1 Mox Diamond would mess up the later part of the curve out because he has to pitch a Sol Land to it or because his hand simply doesn't contain enough lands. I mention the second thing because I actually saw Mox Diamond screw him over in this way at GP Columbus when he played one of my friends in Day 1.

Honestly, one gets the sense that the Wx versions of the deck are just "Eldrazi with some white cards that fill the curve better than the colorless alternatives", which might be true, but it does so at an unacceptable cost to the consistency of the deck. If one doubts this effect, perhaps one should consider why Colorless Eldrazi is the only version of the deck that ever seems to put up results, in paper or online.

So why might New Thalia actually help this sad situation? It is because it suggests a different, coherent gameplan for Eldrazi and Taxes. Consider the following statements, which at first glance seem to be true (but I have not verified myself from testing):

1) It synergizes very well with Old Thalia, which makes it seems like you're "supposed to" play even more white cards than Majors does.

2) It is a good three-drop, which has always been lacking in Eldrazi. Few people actually love Matter Reshaper, and indeed one of the main motivations for the Wx lists in the first place was to have a less crappy thing to do in that slot.

3) Finally, it "buys tempo" the same way Reality Smasher does. If you're even a little ahead on board, you are going to get damage in. Young Pyromancer tokens, Monastery Mentor tokens, and random creatures your opponent might try to cast in the hopes of slowing you down are always going to be late.

So perhaps what you're supposed to do is stop trying to execute the "unbeatable curve-out" and instead leverage the Thalia pair in order to be more controlling - be more like D+T than Eldrazi. You should run Thought-Knot and Displacer because (a) they are not expensive to cast and (b) they are disruption. Mimic, Endless One, and Reality Smasher are just fat beaters and not on plan.

This is potentially better than D+T because (a) your stuff doesn't just roll over and die to Shrivel effects, (b) you get to play Ancient Tomb and Chalice of the Void and thereby land your taxes earlier and (c) TKS is an extremely powerful Magic card. Also, this is a deck that will not have to pray to get a turn 2 versus ANT like D+T does. It will get to land something good on turn 1.

One observation is that if your curve stops at Thought-Knot Seer, Mox Diamond might actually become amazing. A good analogy for this point is 4-color Loam. It plays 4 Mox Diamonds and 26 lands and it does this with only two Loams and plays lots of games where it never dredges Loam even once. It is ok playing games where it has 2 lands in play and a Mox Diamond. That's because it is not trying to cast things that cost five. In the same way, we should endeavor to build a deck that can run the fast mana and will have nut draws that involve Ancient Tomb, but it's not utterly reliant on it.

I want to mention that the Stoneforge Mystic idea Secretly.A.Bee had fits perfectly into this plan because it gives the deck something powerful to do for not a lot of mana.

To summarize, I hope there is a Legacy equivalent of TKS Workshops in Vintage. You don't run any Eldrazi except for TKS, because that's the best one by far. The rest is all hate.

A grotesque first draft of these ideas is as follows:

3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Thought-Knot Seer

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Dismember

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Karakas
3 Plains
4 Wasteland

Very good read. Obviously there would be changes and tweaks but it is a start. I have been tinkering with some thoughts on it too and your thought process is very correct. I think it isn't without reason to have maindeck crucible or two. I would probably put in some number of metamorph also, testing with the card has been glorious. Its pretty hard to fit everything you want into maindeck.

[iostream]

Very good read. Obviously there would be changes and tweaks but it is a start. I have been tinkering with some thoughts on it too and your thought process is very correct. I think it isn't without reason to have maindeck crucible or two. I would probably put in some number of metamorph also, testing with the card has been glorious. Its pretty hard to fit everything you want into maindeck.I agree, both Metamorph and Crucible seem like great ideas!

[Cire]

@ iostream: excellent post! My only comment at the moment is that I don't think one should dismiss Smasher that readily. I understand that its not on plan, but it is such an efficent beater that i almost think it doesn't matter. For example vintage white eldrazi still runs it. Even the most recent succesful eldrazi shop vintage list ran it (http://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/vintage-101-eternally-extravagant)

[Secretly.A.Bee]

I agree that Smasher shouldn't be left out. So turn 1 you Ancient Tomb and diamond. Play Thalia 2.0. They play tapped land, say go. Now you can quite literally play out your Eldrazi Temple or any other sol land and cast and swing with Smasher and Thalia on Turn 2 with disruption in play for 8. If it's a TKS, any land gets it cast in that scenario. It's far too powerful to exclude based just on being too high of a "high end" cmc, especially when it acts as disruption when it gets removed.

[iostream]

I agree that Smasher shouldn't be left out. So turn 1 you Ancient Tomb and diamond. Play Thalia 2.0. They play tapped land, say go. Now you can quite literally play out your Eldrazi Temple or any other sol land and cast and swing with Smasher and Thalia on Turn 2 with disruption in play for 8. If it's a TKS, any land gets it cast in that scenario.It's certainly possible that Smasher is good enough to get in there, but with the reduced Sol land count and reliance on Mox Diamond that I'm suggesting, it will certainly be harder to cast. Your situation is the ideal one if you get lucky. Sometimes, you will keep a 3-lander with no Sol lands or only one Sol land and go non-Sol land, Mox Diamond, pitch a land, cast Thalia 1.0 or Chalice. Then you will need to topdeck a land in order to cast Smasher, which may or may not happen, and that's assuming you're not playing against Wastelands!.

I can imagine more than zero is correct since the effect really is strong, but I think if you run the full four, you will find them stranded in your hand pretty often. This is the kind of question that testing should resolve!

[iostream]

@ iostream: excellent post! My only comment at the moment is that I don't think one should dismiss Smasher that readily. I understand that its not on plan, but it is such an efficent beater that i almost think it doesn't matter. For example vintage white eldrazi still runs it. Even the most recent succesful eldrazi shop vintage list ran it (http://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/vintage-101-eternally-extravagant)I should note that I was the 8th place non-TKS Workshop pilot in that tournament, and I didn't run TKS because I found even that too hard to cast. As this illustrates, my approach to mana is extremely conservative. I prefer to cut powerful cards if I'm not 100% sure I can cast them reliably. This is just a playstyle thing and maybe other people are less risk-averse than I am and will make different choices!

[Cire]

I should note that I was the 8th place non-TKS Workshop pilot in that tournament, and I didn't run TKS because I found even that too hard to cast. As this illustrates, my approach to mana is extremely conservative. I prefer to cut powerful cards if I'm not 100% sure I can cast them reliably. This is just a playstyle thing and maybe other people are less risk-averse than I am and will make different choices!

Completely fair - but using that tournaments white Eldrazi list as a base the following mana base apparently worked: 8 white sources, 4 of which were Caverns (and 1 of them was a black lotus :rolleyes:), for 3 Eldrazi Displacers and 9(!) non-Eldrazi cards (of which only 6 shared a creature type). Now obviously we don't have a black lotus - but it seems that even running around 8-10 white sources, including caverns, should be enough to support up to 12 white cards. Compare to your list where you run up to 18(!) white sources for 14 cards. Now obviously risk-aversion is a fair point, but I think that the vintage tournament shows that 18 sources may be past risk aversion and more paranoia. 2 extra cards shouldn't require 8-10 additional mana sources.

Taking your list and building off from it - I would go back to Smasher over SFM, as I think smasher is just a more powerful card and it further reduces the need for white mana. This also opens you up to running up to two metamorphs. Additionally, using the above theory of running less white sources - we can go back to running more Sol lands which only increases your chances of landing turn 2 TKS.

ET - Eldrazi & Thalia

4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Reality Smasher
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Phyrexian Metamorph

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
2 Dismember
2 Umezawa's Jitte

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 Karakas
2 Plains
2 Caves of Koilos
2 City of Traitors
1 Eye of Ugin

Again, just like you - there has been no testing on this - this is pure theory craft at this point.

[metronome2charisma]

Isn't the new thalia legendary? the only version I've seen is in Italian. Here are my thoughts . white sources being of a premium because you obviously want a good amount of sol lands i would play lotus petal over the mox just to keep my land drops. i would imagine the smasher count gong down to 3 just because getting to 5 mana will be slightly harder but i think will be a non issue most games . As was already stated i think metamorph is really good here as is sprit of the labyrinth .

[darkgh0st]

The Eldrazi core is so aggressive and I believe should always be included in the list. I agree Matter Reshaper is still replacable.

I would start with (as my skeleton)
16 Eldrazi core
X Displacer
3/4 old Thalia
3/4 new Thalia
4 Chalice
2 Mox
25 lands

Wastelands are an auto-include for me as well. Now you have a lot of both suppresive and aggressive elements.

I have a liking for Suppression Field as well, but may end up in the SB.

[Cire]

@ darkgh0st: what are you considering Eldrazi Core?

[drude1]

WhT do you mean by new Thalia?

Also, I've been playing a version of this deck online for a while now and have noticed some trends. So far I am undefeated against miracles, death&taxes, and storm; but I haven't won a match against Grixis delver, and that deck is very popular right now. Any recommendations for that MU?


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[Fox]

@Darkgh0st: even with a deck that can power out a turn-2 new Thalia, I can't imagine it would be that good. I can't imagine that this deck loses b/c opponent's nonbasics and creatures ETB untapped. The issue with Matter Reshaper is that it's 3 mana for a 3/2; I imagine that a Metamorph is almost always going to be better at that same cost (and 2 life).

@Barook: Birthing Pod seems like adding more Eye of Ugin but losing non-land slots. The cmc chain is there, but the list would probably need between 6-8x slots for self 2-for-1'ing (Wastelands and Mox Diamond) so that it could run ~2-3 Riftstone Portal due to life concerns.

[iostream]

Completely fair - but using that tournaments white Eldrazi list as a base the following mana base apparently worked: 8 white sources, 4 of which were Caverns (and 1 of them was a black lotus :rolleyes:), for 3 Eldrazi Displacers and 9(!) non-Eldrazi cards (of which only 6 shared a creature type). Now obviously we don't have a black lotus - but it seems that even running around 8-10 white sources, including caverns, should be enough to support up to 12 white cards. Compare to your list where you run up to 18(!) white sources for 14 cards. Now obviously risk-aversion is a fair point, but I think that the vintage tournament shows that 18 sources may be past risk aversion and more paranoia. 2 extra cards shouldn't require 8-10 additional mana sources.

Taking your list and building off from it - I would go back to Smasher over SFM, as I think smasher is just a more powerful card and it further reduces the need for white mana. This also opens you up to running up to two metamorphs. Additionally, using the above theory of running less white sources - we can go back to running more Sol lands which only increases your chances of landing turn 2 TKS.

(/snip)I think it at least is worth mentioning that the mana of Vintage Eldrazi is also really aggressive, and the TMD thread about it (http://themanadrain.com/topic/350/white-eldrazi/24) is chock full of people griping about how hard it is to cast everything. You very well may be right, but I don't think it's unreasonable or paranoid to want so many white sources!

Anyway, enough talk, I'll try to start testing this over the coming week or so and will report back with results when I have them.


I can't imagine that this deck loses b/c opponent's nonbasics and creatures ETB untapped.Perhaps this is a good time to explain a little more why New Thalia is exciting, since my big post on the previous page took this for granted.

Almost every game you lose with Eldrazi is because you somehow fell behind on tempo. I can't emphasize this enough. Stompy decks are a pile of creatures and a few disruptive permanents and that's about it. If you fall behind on board, you are usually dead. You don't have anything like Terminus to bail you out of unfavorable board states. You don't have Deathrite Shaman or burn spells to provide reach in board stalls. Your cards don't get stronger with time like Young Pyromancer. All you have are dudes and spheres. You cannot grind well, and you lack the card selection to play the long game. If you've lost control of combat, you have lost the game.

Think about what Tangle Wire does for Vintage Workshops. Tangle Wire turns quick starts into easy victories, it lets you steal the initiative when you lose the die roll, and it gives you a turn or two to catch up on board if you've fallen behind. We can't run Tangle Wire because we don't have Workshop and we don't run good things to tap (e.g. 10+ sphere effects + low-value Moxen), so we just can't break the symmetry well enough. It is really bad if we have to tap a Sol Land to Tangle Wire - believe me, I really tried to make it work in this deck. But maybe New Thalia does a good impression!

Imagine you slam this on turn 1 or turn 2 on the play against a deck without basics - e.g. any Delver deck, certain Shardless builds. What would have been a turn 2 Tarmogoyf becomes a turn 3 Tarmogoyf because the second land comes into play tapped, and then the Goyf itself comes into play tapped, so it can't interact in combat until turn 4. Or against Death and Taxes, that Wasteland or Port they have on turn 2 might not be good enough anymore to stop TKS from dismantling their hand. And so on.

If you're not old enough to remember how hard it was to fight through a Kismet back in the day (either in the Stasis deck or otherwise), perhaps you might have played against Loxodon Gatekeeper in original Ravnica block draft or Imposing Sovereign in M14 draft; those cards were miserable to play against!

[Noloam_]

Man this topic is going in the wrong direction lelllllllllll

[Cire]

I think it at least is worth mentioning that the mana of Vintage Eldrazi is also really aggressive, and the TMD thread about it (http://themanadrain.com/topic/350/white-eldrazi/24) is chock full of people griping about how hard it is to cast everything. You very well may be right, but I don't think it's unreasonable or paranoid to want so many white sources!

Ah, you're right - testing will show :), sorry I didn't mean to offend, 18 white sources just seemed like a lot.

Also - I don't think this is off topic at all. Really, we are talking about including only 7-11 cards that are largely replacing Matter Reshaper, Mimic and Endless One - all cards that this deck has tried cutting out before.

[bcoutlander]

@Noloam_ you're most recent 5-0 league has been written up on Channel Fireball.

http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/legacy-eldrazi-deck-guide/


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[maraxusofkelds]

http://i.imgur.com/ZnNfHWS.png

This may have potential in eldrazi. Castable under blood moon, flier that is big enough to block serra avengers and delvers, provides mana for world breaker under bloodmoon. The only flip side is that while you will often get your opponent down to 10, your own life total may not reach 10 easily to flip. That and it dies to abrupt decay.

The rest of the spoiled cards so far don't seem like it'll fit legacy eldrazi, esp that god awful 7 mana 3/4 flier with the blue emerge cost.

[wortwelt]

Well as far as I'm informed, you should be able to pay the blue of the Emerge cost with Cavern. Also, sacrificing Matter Reshaper to it sounds fun!

[Julian23]

Thought you guys might be interested: Romario Neto is playing Eldrazi in Season#1 of the Legacy Mediocre League (http://legacymediocreleague.com/).

You can find his decklist (http://s623881501.online.de/romarios-deck) over at the website. This is his Week#3 match vs Tin Fins:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nySTVdGy5ak

All other VODs of the League are on our YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAnZCGszYaNty0d_vbD5PSQ).

[Barook]

I initially dismissed it, but if there's a build that can support enough white, it seems like a pretty interesting board card:

http://mythicspoiler.com/emn/cards/blessedalliance.jpg

Get around Chalice @1, can gain back life, kill an annoying attacker and even set-up blow-outs when you have to race.

[MD.Ghost]

I initially dismissed it, but if there's a build that can support enough white, it seems like a pretty interesting board card:

http://mythicspoiler.com/emn/cards/blessedalliance.jpg

Get around Chalice @1, can gain back life, kill an annoying attacker and even set-up blow-outs when you have to race.

Yes, a card we should keep in mind in a heavy White Build. This deck can "Kicker" it easy enough. What i like is, that you can kill a lot of troublesome dudes (Gofy, TNN, Marit, Angler, Knights, Delver, Smasher etc.) and untap our 4/4er, 5/5er as blockers can also be a blow out.

---------------

I am currently tinker with Thalia 2.0 build and different Splashes etc.

Currently i brew with:

//Lands (25)
4x Ancient Tomb
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x City of Traitors
2x Karakas
4x Brushland
2x Savannah // Horizon Canopy (or 3rd Waste?)
2x Wasteland

//Creatures (22)
3x Stoneforge
3x Thalia 1.0
3x Thalia 2.0
3x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Eldrazi Displacer
2x Containment Priest // Flex Slot can also be Removal or other Stuff

//Other Spells (13)
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Mox Diamond // maybe 3 are enough
2x Sylvan Library
1x Batterskull
1x Jitte
1x Crucible of Worlds

Compared to common Eldrazi Builds you are less explosives, but have (besides Mox) a lot of better Topdecks and card quality. What i like is, that you don't need much mana to play your game, so manadenial isn't a problem for this build. Thalia Duo improves Combo and Creature Matchups and with White and Green you can tinker with a lot of sideboard cards. But it is still only an idea in my mind with minimal playtesting.

-----------------

Hope we get 1-2 more Eldrazi(Spells) for all builds, because otherwise this deck maybe see no updates for the next couple of sets. I mean Wretched Gryff is the right direction (3/4 Flyer, dodges Moon, Moat, deals with Delver, fly over Gofy etc), sadly it is a common so it lacks power (or simply a lower mana cost). So maybe Emerge give us some new options and like Gryff it can be good for colorless too if its printed as a rare/mythic power creep. :tongue:

[Barook]

I'm hoping for a Naturalize Emerge Eldrazi. Maybe we're lucky and it isn't too expensive.

[darkgh0st]

@Wretched Gryff: on an uncommon situation, the Gryff is a 2 to cast through Eye. Matter Reshaper becomes 1cc, then Gryff Emerge being 6, is reduced to 3 by saccing reshaper, then another 2 by Eye, costing only 1 blue.

@Eldrazi core: this was defined by CFB (i think, a popular source at that) which is:
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Endless One
4 Eldrazi Mimic

[Barook]

@Eldrazi core: this was defined by CFB (i think, a popular source at that) which is:
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Endless One
4 Eldrazi Mimic
Except said articles are mainly "paycheck articles" without soul or actual content. E.g. they grabbed noloam's list in the article above and made some generic "Captain Obvious" statements about it.

Now if somebody did an in-depth article with match-ups, sideboard guide, mulligan decisions, etc. - then that would be something worth talking about and refering to.

[darkgh0st]

Except said articles are mainly "paycheck articles" without soul or actual content. E.g. they grabbed noloam's list in the article above and made some generic "Captain Obvious" statements about it.

Now if somebody did an in-depth article with match-ups, sideboard guide, mulligan decisions, etc. - then that would be something worth talking about and refering to.

Yup. I pretty much just skimmed through that article.

Noloam has had a lot of success with his list, and consistently too. Someone mentioned here that they played Noloam's list but didn't have good success. But no one will be able to pilot any list the same.

[Noloam_]

@Noloam_ you're most recent 5-0 league has been written up on Channel Fireball.

http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/legacy-eldrazi-deck-guide/


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yes i know. there have been 3 channel fireball articles about my eldrazi stuff now

[RhoxWarMonk]

I've been play testing this list a little lately and I'm liking it. The Petals and the Thorns can sometimes be awkward but I don't really have a good solution to that unfortunately... I'd do anything for a "white" Spirit Guide /shrugs

Any feedback? I haven't taken it to a major tournament yet, so my playtesting has just been internal. So far though, it's been solid. Displacer is so much better than Reshaper and generally fairly easy to cast on turn 2 as well.

Creatures
4 x Eldrazi Mimic
1 x Endbringer
4 x Endless One
4 x Eldrazi Displacer
4 x Reality Smasher
4 x Thought-Knot Seer

Spells
4 x Chalice of the Void
3 x Lotus Petal
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
2 x Umezawa's Jitte
2 x Dismember
2 x Warping Wail

Lands
4 x Ancient Tomb
4 x Cavern of Souls
3 x City of Traitors
4 x Eldrazi Temple
3 x Eye of Ugin
2 x Mishra's Factory
2 x Karakas
2 x Corrupted Crossroads

Sideboard
1 x Endbringer
2 x Thorn of Amethyst
3 x All Is Dust
4 x Leyline of the Void
2 x World Breaker
2 x Ratchet Bomb
1 x Trinisphere

[Cire]

Latest Emerge card:

Elder Deep-Fiend 8
Creature - Eldrazi Octopus
Flash
Emerge 5UU (you may cast this spell by sacrificing a creature and paying the emerge cost, reduced by that creature's converted mana cost.)
When you cast Elder Deep-Fiend, tap up to four target permanents
5/6

Thoughts: Let's say you go Turn 1 Sol land, Accel into Matter Reshaper . . . the double blue of the Emerge costs prevents you from going turn 2 sac reshaper into EDF. So initial thoughts are that it's pretty bad. I guess if you go turn 1 Sol land --> Chalice whatever, turn 2 Caverns --> Matter Reshaper and then turn 3 --> land that produces U, sac reshaper plus accel --> you can play this at the beginning of opponents step. Then it basically gives you a free turn since you shut off all their lands. In that scenario, it is pretty good! However, that scenario requires that you sac a 3 mana eldrazi or higher . . .


Edit:

okay jsut for fun thinking of how to include this card. Eldrazi Base plus To run the double UU of the Octopus cost we need around 14 sources of Blue mana . . . we have 4 Caverns, we can run 4 Lotus - so that means 6 lands that produce blue. Then additionally we need eldrazi to sac we need at least 8 eldrazi of 3 CMC . . . so matter reshaper and Displacer?

//23 lands
4x Ancient Tomb
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Eldrazi Temple
4x Corrupted Crossroads
3x City of Traitors
2x Eye of Ugin
2x Adarkar Wastes

//23 creatures
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4X Eldrazi Displacer
4X Matter Reshaper
4X Eldrazi Mimic
3X Elder Deep-Fiend

//14 Spells
4x Chalice of the Void
4X Lotus Petal
2 x Umezawa's Jitte
2 x Dismember
2 x Warping Wail

Like every change to this deck that isn't colorless what you're sacrificing is consistency and a landbase with powerful effects. This version gives you access to what could effectively be a time skip on a 5/6 body, for the price of a reshaper/mimic/ displacer.

[urza_insane]

Latest Emerge card:

Elder Deep-Fiend 8
Creature - Eldrazi Octopus
Flash
Emerge 5UU (you may cast this spell by sacrificing a creature and paying the emerge cost, reduced by that creature's converted mana cost.)
When you cast Elder Deep-Fiend, tap up to four target permanents
5/6

Thoughts: Let's say you go Turn 1 Sol land, Accel into Matter Reshaper . . . the double blue of the Emerge costs prevents you from going turn 2 sac reshaper into EDF. So initial thoughts are that it's pretty bad. I guess if you go turn 1 Sol land --> Chalice whatever, turn 2 Caverns --> Matter Reshaper and then turn 3 --> land that produces U, sac reshaper plus accel --> you can play this at the beginning of opponents step. Then it basically gives you a free turn since you shut off all their lands. In that scenario, it is pretty good! However, that scenario requires that you sac a 3 mana eldrazi or higher . . .

Getting to UU reliably seems to be a dealbreaker on this card - but it's still playable as a lategame mirror breaker at 8. It gets through Blood Moon and having a 5/6 body is also a plus. I would consider playing as a 1-of to tutor with Eye.

Edit: It also taps down Merit Lage and Emrakul, buying us a turn. Expensive way to do it, but not irrelevant.

[darkgh0st]

EDF with Grim Monolith and Oblivion Sower?

[MD.Ghost]

Best way for Emerge + Flash is to profit from removal or bad blocks/attacks but UU is the deal breaker here. Since Eldrazi are playable as a Legacy deck i brewed with different builds including 1-2 color splashes. I think double UU is to hard in most cases, unless you are flooded which means you reached "Endgame" where you can also activate Eye of Ugin or cast All is Dust (and afterall it is not a Maindeck card). In this case you can also hardcast Elder Deep-Fiend but i feel, that World Breaker is a better bomb if we talk about Eldrazi creatures with cc7+ that need a Splash.

If you go UW Eldrazi, i think it would be stronger to talk at least about Drowner of Hope (cc6, 7 Power on the field, "haste"ability and works well with Displacer) before we discuss X-Mas wonderland with a perfect curve like T2 Matter Reshaper into T3 Elder Deep-Fiend (including the right Lands for UU) without any disruption etc. The more common alternative is T2 Reshaper into T3 Smasher which should be powerfull enough and is easier to achieve.

I still hope we get a powerfull Emerge card with only one color.

[Noloam_]

the new eldrazi dude is obviously terrible. why even bother talking about it? just compare it with other positbilities

[Cire]

Eternal Scourge 3
Creature - Eldrazi Horror
You may cast Eternal Scourge from exile.
When Eternal Scourge becomes the target of a spell or ability an opponent controls, exile it.
3/3

Competes for the 3 spot with Matter Reshaper - it's easier to cast, its a 3/3, it can come back from STP, but it has sulking.

[MD.Ghost]

Yeah not Bad!

Dodges Swords (Path etc) so it is better vs Miracle, DnT, Maverick etc. It will also work under Moon (bonus vs miracle) and 3/3 is still good enough vs most legacy Creatures!

So we have this Dude vs a decks with White removal and Reshaper vs BGx decks. Looks not to Bad as Meta slots.

[RhoxWarMonk]

Eternal Scourge 3
Creature - Eldrazi Horror
You may cast Eternal Scourge from exile.
When Eternal Scourge becomes the target of a spell or ability an opponent controls, exile it.
3/3

Competes for the 3 spot with Matter Reshaper - it's easier to cast, its a 3/3, it can come back from STP, but it has sulking.

I really like this... It keeps coming back, no matter what's used. Sure Abrupt Decay it, it'll still go to exile, and we can still recast it.

If nothing else, at least warrants some testing but seems legit.

[Dice_Box]

Dies to combat damage and sweepers only. I like.

[Barook]

Dies to combat damage and sweepers only. I like.
Or sac effects

Can be better or worse than Matter Reshaper, depending on the match-up.

Shame we can't really support Food Chain to combo with it, making Endless Ones really endless. :tongue:

[urza_insane]

Not terrible, but also not clearly better than Reshaper as it doesn't cycle. I do like the cleaner mana cost, but since Reshaper is usually the last card my opponents are worried about, it's not really dodging a whole lot of hypothetical Swords or Abrupt Decays. Also risks a serious tempo loss if the opponent has something that can target repeatedly.

[Barook]

Not terrible, but also not clearly better than Reshaper as it doesn't cycle. I do like the cleaner mana cost, but since Reshaper is usually the last card my opponents are worried about, it's not really dodging a whole lot of hypothetical Swords or Abrupt Decays. Also risks a serious tempo loss if the opponent has something that can target repeatedly.
As for tempo loss, it depends. It's obviously great with Eye of Ugin, as it only costs 1 to recast.

[maraxusofkelds]

It also doesnt die to thalia and hatebears, which is pretty good bonus. If you see alot of bloodmoon decks, this is definitely worth replacing reshapers for. Vs miracles, their only out against this is terminus and entreat angels.

[urza_insane]

I'll bite. I think this is the most relevant card spoiled so far (more than Thalia or Octopi) so let's break things down a bit.

Eternal Scourge Pros:
+Vs Blood Moon
+Vs Swords to Plowshares
+Vs Punishing Fire
+When facing 2 power creatures (Thalia, Snapcaster, Mimic, Shardless, Pyro)
+Vs multiple Blots/Decays/Disfigure
+Casting off Eye + Cavern/Urborg turn 2

Eternal Scourge Cons:
-When facing 3+ power creates (Angler, Goyf, Smasher, TKS, Batterskull, TNN, Knight)
-Vs Strix
-Vs Sweepers (Toxic Deluge, Supreme Verdict)
-Certain cards that target (pyroblast, displacer, infect pump, Forked Bolt)

Anything major missing?

At first glance it's better vs Miracles, slighty worse vs the Mirror, and doesn't make a difference vs Combo. I'm worried it might be marginally weaker vs Grixis and Shardless though, which are matchups I'm more worried about than Miracles. More testing needed.

[Cire]

Next emerge creature up to bat:

Distended Mindbender 8
Creature - Eldrazi Insect
Emerge 5BB (You may cast this spell by sacrificing a creature and paying its emerge cost reduced by that creature's converted mana cost.)
When you cast Distended Mindbender, target opponent reveals his or her hand. You choose from it a nonland card with converted mana cost 3 or less and a card with converted mana cost 4 or greater. That player discards those cards.
8/8

Compared to Eldrazipus - it is in better colors - it can play well with Tomb of Urborg. And now we have another 3 mana eldrazi so you don't need to run two colors with Displacer. It's effect is also better IMO.

Again though - the double color of emerge hurts it a lot, and it is probably not good enough - however it is a cast trigger so even if they counter it - you're not getting two for oned - and it gets you card advantage.

Let's imagine -->

Turn 1 - Sol Land --> Chalice
Turn 2 - Caverns --> Matter Reshaper or New guy
Turn 3 - Tomb --> Sac Reshaper --> Draw a Card --> MindBender (gets countered (asusming you didn't cast Caverns turn 2?) --> Still double Duress. Opponent is down a counter, a card 3 cmc below, a bomb (a card 4 CMC plus), and can't cast 1 mana spells. You still have 3-4 cards in hand. Turn 4 you can cast anything you want.

Turn 1 - Eye of Ugin --> Mimic
Turn 2 - Sol-Land --> TKS
Turn 3 - Tomb --> Sac Mimic for MindBender --> at this point even if it gets countered you basically tripple durressed your opponent and have at least a 4/4 or a 4/4 and a 8/8 out.

I think it deserves some tests :eyebrow:

[MD.Ghost]

And now we have another 3 mana eldrazi so you don't need to run two colors with Displacer. It's effect is also better IMO.


I would still run Displacer, New EMERGE-Drazi would like a BW Manabase. Cavern, Crossroads and some Urborg and Karakas and you can use Displacer, New Anti Combo Bad Boy and even World Breaker at Side :tongue:

Edit: but afterall we don't need more cards vs combo

[Cire]

afterall we don't need more cards vs combo

Yeah the test is always - is this card better against shardless . . . which . . . compared to endbringer it's not really :cry:

[Barook]

http://media.wizards.com/2016/ouhtebrpjwxcnw5_EMN/en_b9k5qhLMYz.png

Mindbender is also a 5/5, not an 8/8. Still waiting for my permanent killer Emerge Eldrazi, but it looks like that chance is already gone with the Overrunner in green.

[Cire]

Oops, sorry I got the P/T wrong :(.

[MD.Ghost]

[IMG]but it looks like that chance is already gone with the Overrunner in green.

Yes (and we have World Breaker already)

BUT maybe we still get Emerge with R for damage and W for exile ;)


Oops, sorry I got the P/T wrong :(.

Yes, would be much better with 8/8 to combat gofy or mirror...

[sporenfrosch1411]

The cost is still pretty hefty in my opinion IF you dont have a reshaper to sac. Endless One is a 0, Mimic is a 2 and both dont provide a bonus when sacced. The other creatures will rarely be a valid sac target..
Also versus many decks you will "just" be hitting a "lower than cmc3". So far i can just view this as a worse Thought-Knot Seer. Also 5/5 is a bit small for all that effort you are going with it...
But maybe i will be proven wrong when someone actually tests this ^_^

[urza_insane]

The cost is still pretty hefty in my opinion IF you dont have a reshaper to sac. Endless One is a 0, Mimic is a 2 and both dont provide a bonus when sacced. The other creatures will rarely be a valid sac target..
Also versus many decks you will "just" be hitting a "lower than cmc3". So far i can just view this as a worse Thought-Knot Seer. Also 5/5 is a bit small for all that effort you are going with it...
But maybe i will be proven wrong when someone actually tests this ^_^

Agreed – this would take Endringer's slot as a 1-of and I don't think it's nearly as versatile. Especially because the discard effect will be pretty useless lategame.

[mariobross]

Can we pay the EMERGE mana cost with colored mana of Cavern of Souls?

[ZEROorDIE]

Yes (and we have World Breaker already)

BUT maybe we still get Emerge with R for damage and W for exile ;)



Yes, would be much better with 8/8 to combat gofy or mirror...

Alternatively, red could end up with destroy/Exile artifact/land and white could be destroy artifact or enchantment.

Any of that would be worth looking at if the mana cost doesn't include RR or WW.

The three drop guy is interesting, but doesn't really give us anything significantly better than what we have.

Still a lot of spoilers to go

[Barook]

Can we pay the EMERGE mana cost with colored mana of Cavern of Souls?
Considering it says "cast" in the reminder text, I think so.

[Barook]

2x Eldrazi in the BoM Top 8:

http://www.bazaar-of-moxen.com/en/urlrw,40/main-legacy-decklists-strasbourg,c335.html?event=19&evt=19

Anton Karlinski already won the last one with Eldrazi, although it was a colorless list back then. Pretty interesting to see him run Displacer, although 4x Displacer with only 8 white sources seem ballsy. But consindering he just took down another tournament, he probably knows his shit.

[Noloam_]

lel Kevin Sauvageon runs my list. #proud

[Barook]

Took the BoM winning list for a spin. Went 2-3 in the league. Can't really say I like it - doesn't really fit my style without All is Dust, Factories, less removal and running Endbringer instead.

Edit: Ugh, another underwhelming round with my Wg List: 0-3 before the drop.

Maybe I'm just incredibly unlucky (and my opponents had a fair share of dumb draws today, especially the Infect opponent you pulled 4x God draws for exacties in two consecutive matches :really:), but I'm losing way more than before. But it isn't just my list, I also tried out noloam's list and the outcome didn't really change. But I can't really point my finger at the exact reason what has changed to adapt my deck yet.

As for the BoM list, is Surgical also used to combat Wasteland?

[urza_insane]

Maybe I'm just incredibly unlucky (and my opponents had a fair share of dumb draws today, especially the Infect opponent you pulled 4x God draws for exacties in two consecutive matches :really:), but I'm losing way more than before. But it isn't just my list, I also tried out noloam's list and the outcome didn't really change. But I can't really point my finger at the exact reason what has changed to adapt my deck yet.

I've noticed the same when playing leagues - gone are the easy days of March/April where going 4-1 was the norm and 5-0 was the goal. My take is that it's simply folks getting better at playing against the deck. It's a known quantity now and people have adapted. Miracles in particular - which I used to consider a bye - can pull out wins unexpectedly with Mentor/Moat/B2B.

Great to see Team Squid put up some results though! And glad at least one of the lists coming from this thread (noloam's colorless build). The first place build is interesting - I was confused at first glance, but I do rather like the light black splash instead of going for World Breaker the more I think about it. Unless I'm facing a lock piece I usually prefer Endbringer. He also dropped Lotus Petal which never felt quite right in my testing - the colorless build is more speed oriented, hence Spirit Guide. With Displacer I prefer more consistent mana sources.

The odder choices are the total lack of Warping Wail, 4 City of Traitors (for a total of 26 land), along with Basilisk Collar and Surgical Extraction in the board - thoughts on those? When does Basilisk come in (aside from Burn)? And Surgical? I would feel a bit naked going up vs Dredge or Reanimator without my Leylines.

[Barook]

Collar is probably for racing (like in the mirror) and for the combo with Endbringer, I assume.

[urza_insane]

Collar is probably for racing (like in the mirror) and for the combo with Endbringer, I assume.

Good call - just noticed he's running a full 4 Endbringer between main and side. Not bad mirror tech.

[razvan]

Basilisk Collar is pretty damn nice, it can be put on so many things too, not just Endbringers. It makes Mimics/TKS/Reshaper be able to take down Goyfs and such, give you life which is an issue sometimes.

It might not be Jitte, but it could have nice applications, and it obviously did (also, some of us only own one Jitte because we didn't get more when they were cheap because we didn't see past the interaction with Stoneforge Mystic) :P.

[iostream]

Karlinski's list is unbelievably greedy. I have no idea how he can play consistent games with so many ways to get screwed over by his own deck - flooding on Eyes, flooding on Cities, 4 Displacer with only 8 white sources, etc.

[Barook]

Karlinski's list is unbelievably greedy. I have no idea how he can play consistent games with so many ways to get screwed over by his own deck - flooding on Eyes, flooding on Cities, 4 Displacer with only 8 white sources, etc.
Well, he did get screwed over in G2 of the semifinals against Colorless Eldrazi by having multiple Displacers, but no white source. And he got lucky G3 by topdecking a Cavern. So there's that.

[urza_insane]

Agreed - more greedy than I would feel comfortable running. I would drop an Eye and City for an additional 2x Caves of Koilos or 2x Lotus Petal.

Also, why do folks run the full sets of both Displacer and Matter Reshaper? I find four 3cmc creatures to be about right for the curve and Matter Reshaper is rarely an exciting draw. Why not drop Reshaper all together in the White builds?

[Silverflame]

Agreed - more greedy than I would feel comfortable running. I would drop an Eye and City for an additional 2x Caves of Koilos or 2x Lotus Petal.

Also, why do folks run the full sets of both Displacer and Matter Reshaper? I find four 3cmc creatures to be about right for the curve and Matter Reshaper is rarely an exciting draw. Why not drop Reshaper all together in the White builds?

Reshaper helps consistency as it can dig for the color or just flip a displacer. It's small, but it's there.

[MD.Ghost]

Reshaper helps consistency as it can dig for the color or just flip a displacer. It's small, but it's there.

And Reshaper is better vs BGx (Shardless anyone? Jund etc.), decks that are good vs Eldrazi. Afterall i still brew with Thalia(s) in a more white heavy build. Thalia(s) aren't so bad vs BGx afterall. Imagine Strix/Gofy EtB tapped (one free attack!) or a Thorn that can attack/block with First Strike + Karakas Protection.

[Cire]

So I tested the new three drop yesterday. . . and I still don't know what to think. At times I loved that it was a 3/3 instead of a 2/2, and that it cost 3 instead of 2C, but other times I really missed the CA. . . and I felt both of these emotions when playing against Shardless. . . don't know yet. . .

[Neofit]

Hi everyone,

I'm Kevin Sauvageon long time lurker here, I gathered precious informations about the deck and techs. I played in the top 4 in BOM Strasbourg this past week-end. First thing first, I would like to thank Noloam, as he stated I mostly play his version with 2 card differing in the sideboard. I followed his work on the deck and each iteration of his build between leagues and tried to understand why he went for each changes.

I picked up the deck 3 weeks ago and tried several builds and especially mana configuration and I ended up liking Noloam's mana base the most. I won't enough say how drawing city of traitors in multiples is awkward and urborg was very good in reducing pain from tombs, dismembers, also helping cast leylines post board and turning eye of ugin into a super shop for eldrazi card.

I'm not used to write report or tell stories but I'll try my best to relate you guys everything I remember from the tournament and also give you some insight about my experience wth the deck.

Here is the list I played :

4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eye of Ugin
3 Mishra's Factory
2 City of Traitors
2 Wasteland
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Endless One
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Matter Reshaper
1 Endbinger
2 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Dismember
2 Warping Wail
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Umezawa's Jitte

Sideboard :
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 All is Dust
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Pithing Needle
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Endbringer
1 Dismember

I had no byes and played 8 round of swiss.
Here is the overall matches and then I'll go in depth with each matches.

R1 1-2 aggro loam
R2 1-0 maverick
R3 2-1 w/r blood moon / nahiri / through the breach / sneak attack / fatties
R4 2-1 UR delver
R5 2-0 miracles
R6 2-1 elves
R7 2-1 jund
R8 2-0 death and taxes
1/4 2-1 UR delver
1/2 1-2 Eldrazi with displacers

Round 1 against Aggro loam with chalice, PF, waste, loam 0-1 1-2

game 1 : I win quickly with an aggresive draw, he played a knight on turn 2 which met a dismember and he died to beat down. 1-0

game 2 : I have turn 2 TKS he shows me 2 decays and 3 lands, he top deck a LotV and she carry the game for him. I know I can come back if I draw a Reality smasher, I draw it the turn after he top deck a 6/6 kinght, liliana ult and I die swiftly. 1-1

game 3 : I mull to 5 and manage to put a great fight, I play a TKS turn 2 and I have an All is Dust in hand, he has a lot of threat, 1 knight, 1 liliana, 1 garruk relentless, 1 Maelstorm pulse. My plan is basically to undo the mulligan by playing All is Dust late game. To achieve that I need a mass of land and not lose my All is Dust, so I took liliana. The game plays out I have Eye, Temple Urborg in play he overloads the board playing into my All is Dust, even attacking me with his knight to put me on a 1 turn clock instead of fetching wastelans and I failed to draw a mana source to cast the All is Dust on time. 1-2

- 4 chalice
- 2 thorn
- 2 SSG
- 1 warping wail
- 1 endless one
- 1 mimic
+2 All is Dust
+2 needle
+4 leyline
+2 endbringer
+1 dismember

Round 2 against Maverick splashing red for blood moon 1-1 1-0

game 1 : I stick a chalice on 1 which seems to cripple him a lot, I play big dumb fatties and he dies with 2 swords to plowshare in hand. 1-0

game 2 : I saw a taiga on his side game 1 which triggered my blood moon radar so I played knowing that moon could come down any time. I keep a hand with mimic, 2 endless one, all is dust which is perfect if he blood moon me. Bingo he landed blood moon turn 3. I still can attack him with my mimic and endless one. Turn 4 he plays ensnaring bridge which suprised me a lot, I know that sucks for me but thankfully I boarded in my 2 bombs and 2 endbringers so I have out to finish him of. We play a waiting game and he struggles to empty his hand thanks to the blood moon. The board is a stall I can't attack through his knight of reliquary with my 2 4/4 endless ones. Meanwhile I am waiting for my 7th land to come off so I can play all is dust and try to alpha him for exactses (8). I cast All is Dust when he had 1 savannah untap wipe his board with him at 4 card in hand. Everythin he owns dies expect bridge and he cast sword targetting a endless one. He falls to 3 card in hand and I can't attack. Then the game continues I fetch all my endbringers with Eye and they all meet death to 3 top deck O-ring and 2 swords. Then I still play dudes to not die to his growing knights 11/11 by the time. He found qasali pridemage and I know at some point he will have to kill his own bridge to try to kill me so decide to sand bag 3 reality smasher in my hand while fetching endless ones with eye to put a great defense and threatening lethal the following turn by playing all 3 smashers in the same turn. In the end he decieded to scoop when time was called. 1-0

-4 chalice
-2 thorn
-2 ssg
-1 warping wail
+2 endbringer
+2 all is dust
+2 ratchet bomb
+2 needle
+1 dismember

Round 3 against R/W brew with nahiri, sneak attack, blood moon, fatties and fast mana. 2-1 2-1

game 1 : He mulls to 5 and plays a lonely plains all game long while I beat him to death. I didn't played TKS so i'm in the dark and I board in like he was playing death and taxes. Though I was unconfident with my boarding since I wondered how D&T can't play a single card with 1 plain out. 1-0
I boarded out chalices, thorns, endless ones...

game 2 : I keap a hand with 2 dismembers, 1 reshaper and 4 lands which is fine against d&t. My opponent plays sandstone needles turn 1 and I know I'm screwed. He plays blood moon turn two and I decide to not scoop and gather more info about his deck to sideboard properly. Then I saw some fatties, nahiri etc. 1-1

game 3 : I sideboarded the right way. I play thorn turn 1 and he plays nothing on his turn not a land even. Then I play TKS and I see his hand with 2 petals, 2 ssg, 1 nahiri and 1 blood moon. I took the blood moon and won easily from there. 2-1

Round 4 against UR delver 3-1 2-1

game 1 : The game was blazing fast. I have the play and keep a hand capable of 2 reshaper turn 2 into smasher turn 3. he goes turn one volc delver. Turn 2 I play 2 reshapers, on his turn he brainstorms upkeep to flip his delver and mock me for 3 then plays a second volc and another delver. On turn 3 I play smasher with cavern and attack him down to 7, he isn't pleased with how the game goes. I asume he is on UR delver because he fetch 2 times for volcanic island which give away that he needs more red mana for red cards. Though at 17 life I feel pretty safe even against a price of progress. He takes his 3rd turn, his 2nd delvler doesn't flip, plays a fetch, plays swiftspear, chain lightning me then moves to combat and bolt + fireblast me for 18 damages. I was a little moved by how I lost a game that seemed to be won. I don't know if I overthought the fact I should have keep a reshaper back for one turn to block a possible huge swiftspear. I cleared my head and focused on the coming game. 0-1

game 2 : I remember killing him swiflty with 2 uncounterable smashers while blocking his ground creature with reshapers and TKS. 1-1

game 3 : The game was extremly tight as far as I remember. In the middle of the game I have an empty board (threats died early to bolts), I have 2 TKS, 1 reshaper, 1 mimic in hand and my board is ancient tomb, temple. I play TKS and see his hand composed of 2 pops, 1 delver, 1 lands. I take a pop, then ship the turn. He plays his delver then on the following turn I draw Eye of Ugin which was HUGE. I play Eye then play my 2nd TKS he responds by brainstorm (huge draw for him also) hiding cards (pop I assume) he dazes me and I'm force to pay with my tomb he reveals me a land so I know there is most likely pop on top and a radom card below it. then I deploy my reshaper and my mimic.
He attacks me with his delver down to 10. He is at 16. I take my turn knowing he only has 1 red source, 2 land in play, 1 flipped devler and a swiftspear, and the dreadful pop in hand. I figure out that I can't play around any spell so I attack with everything thing except the mimic to present lethal next turn no matter what block he makes. Then he extends the hand knowing his top deck (island). 2-1

-2 thorn
-1 endbringer
+2 ratchet bomb
+1 dismember

Round 5 against miracles 2-0 4-1

game 1 : I have the play. he has to play 2 force to counter my 2 chalice and I beat him to death before he can assembles anything threatening. 1-0

game 2 : I keep a very hatefull hand. 2 thorns, 1 chalice, 1 needle and 3 land (one of which is an ancient tomb) on the draw. Hand is slow but I know I will manage to slow him down enough to buy me the time to draw into threats. He counterspells my chalice turn 2, then forces the 2nd chalice I draw turn 3. Turn 4 I play needle, he spin top in response and says resolve. I think for a bit and I name JTMS, which is only way I see me loosing in this position since I have no pressure whatsoever. Then I play double thorn and he is not please with it. The game continues he plays a mentor and I start to draw threats, he plays JTMS to trigger his mentor. I have all is dust and warping wail in hand and I want to get more value out of it so I decide not to play it and start to activate Eye instead for endbringers and such. Here comes a flurry of swords to plowshare. He plays a second mentor and the remaining endbringer ping him while a smasher is beating him down. At one point he plays blood moon and I have a smasher and a warping wail in hand. I figure I have lethal next turn assuming he has no other play (trigger mentor) if I make a scion to provide me diamond mana for smasher next turn (all is dust insn't an option for the time being cos of blood moon and double thorns). I go for it and win on my next turn. 2-0

-4 reshaper
-2 dismember
-2 jitte
-2 ssg
+2 all is dust
+2 ratchet bomb
+2 thorn
+2 enbringer
+2 needle

Round 6 against Elves 2-1 5-1

game 1 : He has the play and go for turn 1 fetch shaman. I have the option to play a threat or dismember the shaman on turn 1, I decide to dismember it to not fall too far behind. On the second turn he played cradle and a lonely elf. I decide to time walk me by wastelanding the cradle. The game continues He plays a value glimpse which I can't do anything about and I start to beat him down. So far I'm please with my decision to prioritise disruption over beats and he finally draws a second cradle and hoofs me out of the game. 0-1

game 2 : I have 2 tough mulligan decisions to make, and I decide to go to 5 cards instead of keeping a middle 6 card hand. I know I need to nut draw him to win. My 5 cards were good but still bad against say a single abrupt decay. I keep endless one, jitte, ssg, ancient tomb, mishra's factory. I curve turn 1 Endless one, turn 2 jitte equip with ssg, turn 3 smasher of the top and he scooped. 1-1

game 3 : The game was very interesting. I had a relatively slow draw but the potential to have an active jitte. He played turn 1 shaman with no fetch then symbiote with pendelhaven. I bluff a warping wail by attacking bodly with 1 endless one into his potentially 2/3 symbiote so I threaten a response to pendelhaven with a warping wail. He decides to not bite the bait and I succesfuly scored a few free points of life which is huge, after combat I play a reshaper and pass. The turn after I play smasher leaving a single mana up (I have dismember in hand and jitte a that point), meanwhile he developpes his board. He plays heritage druid and another deathrite using the not summoning sick one. Then he plays a 3rd deathrite and a garruk relentless which kills my endless one and flips. He passes the turn with pendelhaven untap, symbiote untap and a summoning sick deathrite untapped, 2 deathrites tapped and the druid tapped also.
I have the option to play 2nd smasher and attack with both or play jitte equip smasher and swing with just him at garruk (keeping reshaper at bay) and I have 1 mana up for my dismember in both scenarios. I prefered the jitte one. I attack with just my smasher and before blocks he put onto the stack the symbiote ability bouncing heritage druid targetting his not summoning sick deathrite. I smell an abrupt decay on my jitte coming so in response I dismembered his active tapped deathrite which he was targeting and I killed his garruk and his symbiote wasting a jitte counter in the process because of pendelhaven. He takes his turn replays druid and pass with mana (probably decay), a card in hand and 2 active deathrites. I draw my 2nd jitte which is cool. I play second smasher and I have mishra as a possibilty but it would cost me 2 life from tomb. I have to make complicated math scenario to choose the best attack possible. after thinking I send both smasher and I keep my reshaper back to block and I don't activate my factory with my tomb. He decays the jitte as planned and takes 10 damages down to 1. The turn after he plays a nettle sentinel and I win on the next turn. 2-1

I was pretty please with my play and decision making in this game, my opponent seemed to very well known what he was doing with elves. Fortunately his payoff game 3 was garruk and not natural order.

-1 endbringer
-2 thorn
+1 dismember
+2 ratchet bomb

I hesitated to boarding in all is dust but in the end I convinced myself that I wanted to have the fastest draw possible post board and all is dust doesn't go in that direction, maybe i'm wrong idk maybe you guys can give some insights here.

Round 7 against Jund 6-1 2-1

game 1 : I'm on the draw and I have a good draw chalice, tomb, TKS, smasher, Eye, Mimic and a warping wail. I have an interesting decision with my TKS turn 2. He has a dark confident on board, I have a chalice on 1. Bolt isn't an option and thoughtseize also isn't. I TKS and see, liliana, decay, second dark confident and lands. My board will be TKS plus mimic at EOT so I decided to actually take his decay and let him have a liliana cause my mimic protects my TKS from edict he can't top deck bolt cause of chalice and liliana on this board is poor because wahtever he does with it next turn if he plays it I can handle it with either wail his dark confidant and attack or top deck land and play smasher. So I took the aggressive approach and take decay. He takes his turn, his dark confidant flips decay and he draws thinks and he passes. On my turn I fail to draw a land so I use wail on his confidant and swing, he decays chalice and bolts mimic, greats draws from my opponent. He untaps and kill my TKS with his Liliana. I whiff again on land and I get time walked. I ended up drawing a land and play my creatures with mishra's factory liliana protection. He has a single goyf on D and I have him at 3 life. I can just put him at one by suiciding my board so I wait to draw something relevant and he gets out it with a scavenging ooze. 0-1

game 2 : My hand is 5 land 1 reshaper 1 dismember. Post board in this match up my deck is full of gas and I don't want to mull a hand that don't loose to wasteland and can cast everything I draw, plus it is "good" against discardin a unique way. I get both my cards thoughtseized and after this I draw TKS, smasher, reshaper, endbringer and he can't handle the pressure. 1-1

game 3 : My hand is very good, 2 TKS, with 3 sol lands, 1 smasher and All is dust. Both TKS are doing a great job at messing with his plans for the game. He then dump his hand to try to stabilize which plays right into my all is dust. 2-1

-4 chalice
-2 thorn
-1 warping wail
-2 ssg
+2 endbringer
+1 dismember
+2 needle
+2 ratchet bomb

Since I lost in round 1 my tie breakers are trash so i'm force to play out my last round.

Round 8 against Death and taxes 7-1 2-0

game 1 : I have the play. I have the nut draw, eye 2 mimics, 1 endless one turn 1, turn 2 reshaper, turn 3 smasher dead. 1-0

game 2 : I play TKS turn 2, he top decks swords, I play TKS turn 3 and then smasher and he trades with TKS in combat with 2 revokers and dies shortly after. 2-0

Those games were sooo fast, I kept a hand relatively weak to wasteland game 2 but she had a very high potential.

-4 chalice
-2 thorn
-2 endless one

+2 ratchet bomb
+2 all is dust
+2 needle
+1 dismember
+1 endbringer

Top 8 :

Quartefinals against a friend of mine we each know our decklist. UR delver 2-1

game 1 : I manage to stick a chalice on one and I have no cavern and my hand was pretty weak to daze so I decided to take pain 3 times with ancient tomb to play around daze. He managed to play magic in that game with stormchaser mage playing spells into the chalice and a pop for 6 in the game. I take the game at 3 life. 1-0

game 2 : This game was recorded on stream. I have a decent draw without chalice but I have an ancient tomb that I have to use unfortunately. My first endless one meets a bolt and I block a 3/4 swiftspear with my reshaper to hopefully flip a land so I can stop relying on my ancient tomb to cast my spell since my hand has already everything I need. I flip warping wail wich is bad. I'm force to TKS him since I have to window to snap a pop. I see pop, snapcaster, force and delver. I take pop and pass. He takes his turn plays delver and pass. I take my turn think about my plays, I'm contemplating wiling delver but it runs into force and I have no other play. I decieded to play smasher because I have cavern protection and swing with both TKS and smasher to threaten lethal next turn. Unfortunately he drew pop and I died. 1-1

game 3 : We both keep gambling hand. I keep Eldrazi Temple, Mimic, TKS, TKS, Smasher, SSG, Chalice. Since I'm on the play he has to have force to handle my chalice and chalice on one can completly screw like 80% of delver draw for instance if his hand is light on mana and heavy on cantrips. I decided to keep since I have a following play in mimic and my TKSs will take care of his stuff when I will cast them anyway. I go for chalice pitching SSG turn 1 he answers with force pitching ponder. He takes his turn plays swiftspear and probes me seeing TKSx2 Smasher Mimic and he passes. I draw Eye of Ugin turn 2 which is disgusting and play TKS and mimic. I see delver, snap, bolt, stormchaser, brainstorm, price of progress in his hand. I pick brainstorm and pass. He takes his turn miss' on land drop, pass. I TKS him again and smasher finish the job the turn after. 2-1

-2 thorn
-1 endbringer
+2 ratchet bomb
+1 dismember

Semifinals against Eldrazi with displacers. 1-2

game 1 : recorded on stream. I have the play because of standings. I open with Eye into mimic, endless one. I follow with TKS turn 2 and I see his hand with 2 displacers 1 reshaper and no white source so I take the reshaper and beat him to death.

game 2 : I have a descent hand with warping wail, reshaper, TKS, smasher, mishra's factory, cavern and tomb. It bothers me that I have no other sol land but I trust the top of my deck for that plus I have the wasteland to dinie a turn for my opponent and give me another draw to find a sol land. He hesitates to keep his hand and I figures out it was because of his mana, either he has displacer without white mana either low mana sources. He plays temple turn one. I decide to waste it right away. He follows with Eye with mimic and pass while I play tomb and had the option to play ratchet bomb or warping wail targeting mimic. I choose to wail the mimic because I had already my tomb working on my life total and I don't wanted to fall too behing on board. He takes his turn and draws cavern and slams it right away with a displacer. I know now that I have to draw a sol land next turn otherwise I will fall too far behind. I failed to do so and my play was poor, a reshaper and pass. He slams a smasher and then I draw a dismember but it's already too late.
Putting more thought in that game while watching the rebroadcast of the event, I think I should have make a scion with the wail and play TKS turn 4 with tomb and cavern instead of exiling the mimic, with that play I can take a smasher from is hand which is the card i'm most likely afraid to play against the most in my position. 1-1

game 3 : I keep a hand with 4 lands (3 sol land) 2 reshapers and a mimic. I'm in the business to cast some big creatures. We trade mimic in the first combat step and I play double reshaper turn 2. His draw developpes way better than mine I miss on my draw step 2 turn in a row to find action and he plays a smasher then an endbringer and follows by basilic colar on endbringer which completely wrecked my ass. I played out the game to the death enjoing my time on the feature match and then scooped. 1-2

-4 chalice
-2 thorn
-1 warping wail
+2 endbringer
+2 needle (for mostly displacer which is his best card if he can cast it)
+2 ratchet bomb
+1 dismember


All in all the deck was great and there is a lot of plays to it. I was suprise with how the deck perform in the late stage of the game. Endbringer plus Eye of Ugin activation are no jokes. And All is Dust was always very good when I drew it. I discused with the player on the displacer list after our semifinals and he was saying that displacer was very good for him all day long, it solves the problem of knights and goyf that the deck have. Though he admitted, that his mana bases wasn't good enough to support 4 displacers and that playing other white spell in the deck that are not devoid/eldrazi spell is madness.
Seeing the basilic collar tech, I will try it myself, it seems very good against goyfs and creature decks. Surely better than the 3rd dismember.
To put an end to this report, I just put this there : please don't ever play this deck with less than 4 Eye of Ugin. This card is so messed up, capable of generating 6 mana in one turn is insane. It gives you speed and an engine in the late game against grindy match up.

Thank you for reading, hope you enjoyed it !


PS: English isn't my nattive language therefore I'm sorry for the typos and the bad phrasing, there must be plenty of them !

[urza_insane]

Thanks for the great report and welcome to The Source! Glad to have you on board the Eldrazi train - congrats on your finish. How are you feeling about colorless vs the white splash after your run? Would you make any changes? And glad to hear Anton had similar concerns about the number of white sources in his build, I think most of us had the same reaction to that list... :)

[bonkotsu]

Reports from this week

Game night 2-1

Round 1 ` 0-2 Tin Fins
I probably need to mulligan a little more aggressively....

Round 2 ` 2-0 Elves
Game 1 seemed to take forever, we had lots of back and forth but I eventually snuck by with displacers tapping down his dudes and chipping away
Game 2 was brutal, turn 1 displacer, 2 tks, 3 smash, 4 smash GG

Round 3 ` 2-1 Affinity
Game 1 he got me with chip damage and a tezz ult
Game 2 Worldbreaker and Displacer mvp
Game 2 All is dust to whipe his board, Worldbreaker Displacer did mad work


Local IQ 3-2

Round 1 ` 2-0 RUG Delver
Game 1 I lead with a mimic, he counters. Turn 1 I chalice, he lets it resolve. I TKS to see a hand of bolts and stifle, he scoops
Game 2 He starts with a mongoose, I wasteland his trop assuming he got greedy, I was right, no more lands

Round 2 ` 2-1 Elves
Game 1 He got me pretty good, no chalice, slower hand, probably need to mull a little better since I knew what he was on
Game 2 He starts with Arbor, arbor, some little green men, and does an early NO into Progenitus. I all is dust the next turn. GG
Game 3 Chalice on 1, waste his lands, get and early jitte, GG

Round 3 ` 0-2 Elves
Game 1 He gets there pretty quick, no real fight
Game 2 I have a decent board and a warping wail, he goes off and tries to natural order, the turn before I used WW to exile his DRS assuming it would slow down his mana, I was wrong. I got punished

Round 4 ` 0-2 Opps All Dicks
Game 1 I know what he is on, I mull to try to find something interactive, see a hand of turn 1 displacer, turn 2 tks, say screw it and keep, he gets me on his turn 2
Game 2 I board heavy expecting him to go belcher, I mull down to 4 with nothing interactive, keep a turn 2 tks, he belches me next turn
I will note, this deck tilts me hard. It doesn't matter what I am playing, even if I disrupt the combo and get an easy win or if I cant find what I need, I get tilted when I see this deck.

Round 5 ` 2-1 Colorless Eldrazi
Game 1 I got there with displacer tks shenanigans
Game 2 I mull, open with diamond, land, displacer. He dismembers displacer, wastelands my land, I see no action for turns
Game 2 Keep a hand of Displacer, lots of lands, double waste. I waste ever sol land he plays and he draws dead for a while

Ended up being 3 percent from top 8. My punt vs elves kept me from a double draw in. That match I can learn from, The oops player I am just incredibly salty about. Nothing really to take away from the match other than maybe I could run Thorns again or try one of the Thalia builds I want to experiment with.

[Noloam_]

Took the BoM winning list for a spin. Went 2-3 in the league. Can't really say I like it - doesn't really fit my style without All is Dust, Factories, less removal and running Endbringer instead.

Edit: Ugh, another underwhelming round with my Wg List: 0-3 before the drop.

Maybe I'm just incredibly unlucky (and my opponents had a fair share of dumb draws today, especially the Infect opponent you pulled 4x God draws for exacties in two consecutive matches :really:), but I'm losing way more than before. But it isn't just my list, I also tried out noloam's list and the outcome didn't really change. But I can't really point my finger at the exact reason what has changed to adapt my deck yet.

As for the BoM list, is Surgical also used to combat Wasteland?

its not your fault. the deck is just bad atm



@Kevin Sauvageon

well done! thats something to be proud of!

[Wichtelman]

really funny to see the thoughts about anton karlinskis list in this thread if you actually know him and his thoughts + watched him playing or playtested with him... :tongue:

[maraxusofkelds]

really funny to see the thoughts about anton karlinskis list in this thread if you actually know him and his thoughts + watched him playing or playtested with him... :tongue:

He has the same thoughts or what?

[Barook]

really funny to see the thoughts about anton karlinskis list in this thread if you actually know him and his thoughts + watched him playing or playtested with him... :tongue:
Could you go more into detail? The Legacy Festival is coming up this month and I need more input to adapt my list.

[3n70n]

Hi guys,
i'm Anton Karlinski.
after i managed to create an account here and i saw that people are interested in my oppinions on the deck i thought i'd share some of my experinces at BoM an my thoughts on the deck as a hole and some specific card choises.

Since i'm not much into tournament reports this part will be very brief, basically a short roadtrip story, listing my matchups and result then picking a few interesting situations. mostly due to not taking any notes during tournaments and not beeing very good at remembering all the games.
And after that i will go into what i think about the build and some of the harder Machtups.

So for starter's here's the list a ran even though most of you sure have seen it by now:

4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Endless One
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Endbringer
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Dismember
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Eye of Ugin
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Wasteland
2 Karakas
2 Caves of Koilos



Sideboard :
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Basilisk Collar
4 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Dismember
2 Endbringer
2 Pithing Needle


win R1 Gonda, Armel Miracles(75 cards maindeck, think of it what u will)
win R2 Marti, Samuel Eldrazi
win R3 Nadler, Matthias Shardless (i think, though i might be wrong on this one)
win R4 Neumann, Markus D&T
win R5 Müller, Andreas Reanimator
win R6 Kellock, Tom Lands
ID R7 Gutbrod, Johannes Miracles
loss R8 Canali, Pierre Gub Opposition

Quarters Mialaret, Gary Miracles
Semis SAUVAGEON, Kevin Eldrazi
Finals Gutbrod, Johannes Miracles

The day before the tournament itself we drove down so Strassbourg and as we were aproaching the city we remembered that we had not pre registered for the main event. After we had double checked that the online registration was closed we decided to call our friends, who got there to play trials, to ask them to register us just to find out that thier trial had allready been over and they left the site. So we had no choice but to try to head down to the venue and try to get an onsite registration since the event said it would not have any registration on the day of the main event.
When we arrived at the venue we sadly had to find out that it had been closed down for the day, the lights had been shut off and apparently everybody had left. At this point i was quite annoyed and almost ready to had home again. But we decided to meet up with our friend and they told us that the organizers were having dinner in a place nearby, so we hunted them down and they were kind enough to let us register in the morning. That was a great relief. We grabbed something to eat and went back to our appartement.

In the first Round there was nothing really to talk about he didn't seem like an expirienced miracles player and didn't put up much of a fight.
In round 2 we had an interesting Judge call where my TNS traded angainst his Reshaper + Mishras Factory and we both missed the trigger. Then when he saw that we had missed it he called the judge and the Judges(including the headjudge) decided that too much time had passed and he would not get to draw the card, which i still think he should have but the ruling was what it was. A couple turns later i managed to snag his Jitte with another TNS and after assambling Endbringer+ my own Jitte the game was over.

In round five i played Andreas whom i know since hes from a place near Munich and we both knew what the other was playing g1 i won cause he was unable to muster any reanimation target. in g2 he put a Gravetitan into play after forcing my surgical extraction. g3 i went t1 Chalice he simply discarded a Blazing Archon which made me worry sind i didn't have Endbringer nor displacer in hand but he never got to put it into play and i think died on turn 4.

My round 6 was featured on stream. g1 he got locked out with chalice on 1 and 2 + endbringer and slowly but surely died to his Glacial chasm which he copied 3 times with thespian stage. In g2 he was tapping down my lands while beeing beat down by mimics wnd when he played his Tireless Tracker i think he made the mistake of tapping my land once more ,which didn't make a differece since i had city of traitors in hand and could have played any big creature i drew but, cut him off of drawing from his clue token and eating one of the mimics instead of trading with the tracker.

When round 7 came up i was hoping to just draw into top8 but then Pierre showed up at the table appologized and told me that his tiebrackers whould not hold up if he agreed to a draw and that he had to play which then turned out was a good decision on his part :)
in g1 when i played my TNS he showed me 2 Opposition while having 5 creatures in play agains my 4 and in g2 he drew it on the last possible turn after cycling through 2 elvish visionaries.

I was still quite confident that i would be in top8 since my tiebreakers whre quite good but was kinda worried i might have to play Pierre again in the quarters since it didn't seem to be a good MU.

The quarters was not on camara sadly we had quite the game 1 where i was playing 1-2 threats at a time and he was removing them. On turn 3 i played TNS(cavern in play) and he showed me a hand of Brainstorm, Swords to Plowshares, FoW , Snapcaster mage and Monastery Mentor and i had to decide wether i wanted to try and kill him fast by taking the StoP but decided against it and took the mentor which lead to him being unable to muster any offence over the course of the game. so i got to 7 mana + eye of ugin and started searching up Smashers which got killed by Terminus' and the cycle repeated itself untill he had no terminus left anymore at which point we were on to game 2.

The Semis u can see in Kevin Sauvageons report.
I was quite sad to find out that our game 3 had no camera time beacause in this game you get to see the power of endbringer and basilisc collar where i think either of them would have been enough to make the game a blowout but combining them was just absurd.

The Finals is all on tape and where i disagree with the commentators is that this MU is not about putting up the fastes clock possible but its about putting some form of pressure on waiting for them to remove it which they most likely will in some way and then playing another threat. Which is why i went for the Smasher on t3 instead of deploying mimic, i was not planing on comitting any more creatures to the board until he played his terminus which he promptly did :)

This part was way longer than i Thought it would be :)


For the other part of this post:

The list a ran i would describe as one of the possible configurations. What i mean by that is that i basically made it for a specific metagame and to improve some of the supposedly bad matchups and by doing so made it worse in others. The matchups that improved in my opinion are Shardless, mirror, miracles,reanimator, lands to some extent and where it has gotten worse is Storm and Delvers (all color combinations).
If u want to improve those get back on Warping Wails and Thorns
As for the Displacers, i think its wrong to call the deck "white eldrazi" since i only run the 4 Displacers and they are really only a splash.
I am also very aware that 8 white sources is quite greedy but tbh i don't know that i would change that. I played the exact same list at GP Prague (11-4/57th place) and in both tournaments combined i think a had a total of 4 games where i did have displacers in my hand an no way to cast them. Maybe thats just samplesize but since i want all the other lands to be in the deck i think i gonna take the chance to have a few games where its gonna sit in my hand. if u really want more consistensy in your white sources at the cost of less often being able to play Endbringer on t3 or TNS on t2 the sure go ahead and cut 1-2 city of traitors and add painlands.

As for why this improves the MU's i mentioned the reasons are different. Against Reanimator, Show and tell and Lands its quite obviously just the ability of the displaces itself that is a problem for them. In the case of miracles its simply that your threatdensity is improved since your not playing SSG or Warping Wail and hence cen repeat the "play threat and have them kill it"-cycle more often. And againts shardless u get both.

Where i agree with Kevin is that u have to run all 4 Eye of Ugin but we disagree on city of traitors i still think its quite important since all your best draws revolve arround cheating on mana as much as possible. And playing Endbringer on turn 3 is a much different game vs playing it on turn 4 when playing against shardless or Show and tell.

Just one more thing to note abount the mana base. We do run wastelands but they are not there to be used agressively to hinder your opponents development they are mostly there to kill lands that are a real problem like glacial chasm or maze of ith. So unless it seals the game i would most likely not use it to kill duals and such.

So now let's takle some of the Matchups as i see them:

Miracles:

This naturally comes first since i think its still overall the best deck if u can play it correctly and u will encounter it quite a lot, at least in the later stages of tournaments.
Preboard the current lists run at most one way to deal with chalice. if u can get it at some point, doesn't have to be t1, u leave them with only 4 terminus to kill your creatures at this point its ok to take away thier winconditions and winn the long game with eye of ugin + cavern.
Postboard i will tax thier mana with Thorns and try as hard as possible to kill there ability to play Sensei's Divining Top up to the point of playing pithing needle naming top followed by chalice on 1 (which i did in the quarters)
Also stock up on Endbringers and take out mimics since mimics are a weak individual threat and i don't want to commit many threats to the board at any given time.


Shardless:
When i play Shardless i see Tarmogoyf as the biggest problem, if i get to snag one from thier hand i will most likely do it unless i can expoit something in thier draw, and displacer solves that problem for me. Sure Baleful strix is annoying but at the end of the day it simply trades of with one of my guys and soaks up some damage some amount of the time it will even be killed by Endbringer. Liliana is a card to be aware of but they usualy run no more than 2 of those. also if u can keep a mater reshaper arround you're mostly fine againts liliana.
As for sideboarding i mostly Bring n ways to deal with Tarmogoyf. This means more Endbringers, Basilist collar, Dismember and ratchet Bombs. I pull out all the chalices and then strat shaving on endless ones sind they die to Abrupt decay which results in them gaining tempo. If u see disfigure think about removing mimics instead since they are the only thing that can be killed by disfigure.

Death and Taxes:
This one is mostly about mana and some ammount of Batterskull. If u have mana to cast your bis threats they will easily trump your opponents. Some D&T told me one that being on the play is synonymous with winning the game in this MU and the games i've played seem to back up that claim though if u can untap with entbringer in play u will likely be able to tip that balance. I bring ratchet bombs to kill multiple of thier creatures at once or Jitte and pithing needle to combat thier wastelands and ports. i will side out chalice and endless one since they are an easy target for Flickerwisp.

Lands:
If they run strait RG u can lock them out with chalice on 2 and displacer/endbringer. if they have abrupt decay u hope to buy enought time with displaycer/endbringer to cross the finish line. In return the can just lock you out with wasteland and port if the get a head.
This is where u have to use your wastelands visely since using it on something and then being locked out by Glacial Chasm is the worst feeling ever.
As for sideboarding u want to fight thier Loam and wastelands with needles and surgicals und u don't need dismembers oder Jitte.


So much for that i think those are the ones i would consider the hardest matchups though with this specific list you are quite week against storm in preboard games compared to other lists.

Specific cards:
The graveyard removal slot: Leyline vs surgical vs farie macabre
those are the three i consideres for this slot i ran faries for some time bacause i don't have any black mana so whenever leyline is not in my opener it's a dead draw and additionaly farie is not hindered by chalice not by any other counterspell wich makes it the best choice for fighting reanimator. But in the end i settled on the surgicals beacause i wanted to get some more slots for different cards in the board plus surgical is just so much better againts loam strategys and dredge. Also reanimator is less common now than thos loam decks.

Basilisc Collar:
As some of you have correctly pointed out this one is for racing. Be it Burn/ UR delver or in fact the mirror. Additionaly it helps you fight Tarmogoyfs or bigger creatures in general as mentioned above. Also remember the interaction between Trample and deathtouch when u strap this on to a Smasher. Enough of the praise. I put this in the sideboard mainly to break the mirror witch it does but in my experience only when the game lasts more than 4-5 Turns i will need further testing to decide wether the card will stay or not.


Card on the watchlist:
Eternal Scourge
If u don't trust your ability to draw white sources to run displaycer or want you manlands back this will be right up your ally. Getting killed by Quirion rangers and wirewood symbiotes is a real drawback but still this should be a good addition for the pure coloreless deck.

Worldbreaker
If Moat sees more play this might become more valuable in which case i might switch to 3 city 3 bruschland

Emerge-eldrazi:
To be honest i don't think we will be able to cast the good emergers for the emergecost so we will ave to judge them by thier real casting cost. None of them seem appealing to me for 8 to 10 mana right now. Elder Deep-Fiend might be worth a try since flash is quite the good ability.


That is my take on the Eldrazi deck for now

Best Regards

Enton

[maraxusofkelds]

Thanks for posting Anton! Quick question though, how is your experience running 4 eyes without any urborg tombs? I seem to run into duplicates with it being a dead card quite often, which makes me reluctant to run 4 in a white splash version. In addition, it also lets you hardcast your leylines and dismembers.

[3n70n]

Thanks for posting Anton! Quick question though, how is your experience running 4 eyes without any urborg tombs? I seem to run into duplicates with it being a dead card quite often, which makes me reluctant to run 4 in a white splash version. In addition, it also lets you hardcast your leylines and dismembers.

Yes occasionally you will have multiple eye of ugin and it will be a dead card but also sometimes ur opponent will destroy it with wasteland and u will have a second one to replace it with. since its your best land i think u will just have to bite the bullet and have it be a dead draw from time to time.
About Urborg i just think its worse than all the other options the best it can do is upgrade itself to a sol-land by giving your eye the ability to tap for mana and without eye its just a land that doesn't provide u with white or colorless. i will gladly give up the ability to cast dismember without taking damage once every blue moon and not run Urborg in favor of better manasources or for the strait colorless list more manlands

[urza_insane]

Congrats on the finish and thanks for the excellent writeup - great to see Eldrazi take down a big tournament. And great to have both from the Top 8 of BoM in the thread! How do you find the Grixis Delver matchup? That, along with Miracles, seems to be one of the most popular decks these days.

In my testing with the Colorless build mulligan decisions are key - and who plays first makes a big difference. Do you find yourself wishing you had the Wails back as additional removal for Deathrite/Pyro? I've been testing Spatial Contortion in the side which is usually better vs Delver and Miracles than Dismember. It doesn't hit Gurmag, but paying 4 life + Tomb damage can put you in striking distance from Deathrite + Bolt or an early Delver.

[the_falsehate]

Yes occasionally you will have multiple eye of ugin and it will be a dead card but also sometimes ur opponent will destroy it with wasteland and u will have a second one to replace it with. since its your best land i think u will just have to bite the bullet and have it be a dead draw from time to time.
About Urborg i just think its worse than all the other options the best it can do is upgrade itself to a sol-land by giving your eye the ability to tap for mana and without eye its just a land that doesn't provide u with white or colorless. i will gladly give up the ability to cast dismember without taking damage once every blue moon and not run Urborg in favor of better manasources or for the strait colorless list more manlands

I found Urborg useful against Hate Bears and Maverick, where in longer games I can tap Ancient Tomb for black without taking damage, which was relevant in 5 games in my last small tournament. The other guy that did well in the same tourney you won said that 4 Eye of Ugin were important and you're better off with two in hand than none. I've just been playing 3 but I can believe this. I played in a tourney on Monday (July 4th holiday here in the US) and my round 1 opponent was using the same sleeves and accidently left the table with one of my Eldrazi Mimics. I caught this in the card count the nexy round but didn't have a replacement Mimic, so after replacing with an Endbringer from the sideboard I was stunned by how much I noticed a significant decline in the frequency with which I saw Mimics for the remaining rounds. Anyway I thought about that when I read the aforementioned comments and I decided a 4th EoU is in my future, especially since I'm running a 2 City of Traitors and 2 Wasteland split!

I've been playing colorless but after seeing your list I've been testing with 4 Eldrazi Displacers and 1 World Breaker. I'm running 1 Karakas, 1 Brushland, 1 Caves of Koilos and 1 Corrupted Crossroads at the moment because I only own 1 Karakas, but I'm telling my Mates that it's my brilliant strategy to avoid my white mana getting disrupted by Pithing Needle. :rolleyes: (Lol, Cavern of Souls would be the target!!)

Anyway, thanks for the inspiration and I found your comments on the cards and matchups very insightful, especially so after having just played 3 local Legacy tournaments over the holiday weekend.

[darkgh0st]

@the_falsehate: I don't get the part where you say Pithing Needle and disrupt white mana. Pithing Needle doesn't stop mana abilities.

[the_falsehate]

@the_falsehate: I don't get the part where you say Pithing Needle and disrupt white mana. Pithing Needle doesn't stop mana abilities.

You're right, my bad.

[iostream]

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/card-image-gallery/eldritch-moon

Any of those colorless Emerge cards look good to anyone? Maybe the Naturalize guy? I'm pretty disappointed.

[Cire]

http://media.wizards.com/2016/ouhtebrpjwxcnw5_EMN/en_UOizvP0VQD.png

So. . . to compare to world breaker

Pros:

Has 1 more power
Castable through blood moon
Can get it out turn 3-4 by sacrificing another Eldrazi (usually, at least 1 turn faster than worldbreaker)

Cons

Has 2 less thoughness
Costs more to cast normally
No reach
No recursion.
Doesn't destroy lands.
Destroys instead of Exiles

--------------

Edit -

http://media.wizards.com/2016/ouhtebrpjwxcnw5_EMN/en_epVeXMVtSE.png

I sort of like the Lightning Helix emerge guy if you are running urborg. Sacrificing Matter Reshaper or Mimic to get him out turn 3 is easy, and he has 6 power and provides a 6 point swing when he etb. Imagine the following play -

Turn 1 - Eye - Mimic
Turn 2 - Urborg - Accel - sac Mimic --> Maw
Turn 3 - TKS or land + smasher.

Probably not good enough to run - but it seems fun.

[Nocley]

8 mana base for just a naturalize doesnt seem worth it at all, unless we're playing against moat.

Having something like Maw seems okay, but I doubt it's that useful - I'll need to check how many times I need a basically uncounterable helix if that would have won me the game. It's nice to see another almost-playable black emerge, as it justifies trying to go into black eldrazi for that and the discard guy. Maybe going into B/w with displacers, but I'm not sure at all. It definitely plays into the Urborg + Caves of Koilos mana suggestions. I need to get back to testing some of these lists since I dropped off.

For now, Anton's list looks amazing in my local meta, which is great, and I don't even think it's that much weaker against Storm (maybe weaker, but still favored), but I'm not sure how it is online where I'm moving a lot more testing. But lets see what happens with EMN. Though I do wish there was a better place to slot in All is Dusts back, I think that card is amazing.

[maraxusofkelds]

So far I dont think any of the new eldrazi are worth playing except maybe eternal scourge. Mockery of nature gives you a faster way to deal with back2basics and moat, but it doesnt let us solve blood moon.

[Cire]

Really really random thought I had while fooling around with Endless Scourge (slighty better impression than I had with him earlier). What about playing Gemstone Caverns? I know lands are tight . . . but I put 2 proxies in the deck - and ran them instead of waste lands and ran 4 Endless Scourge taking the place of reshaper in the colorless version . . . and well . . . when it worked. . . it worked. Got an endless scourge out my turn 1 and had an essentially a costless mox diamond (statisically 22% of the time). When it didn't work - aka I didn't have it in opening hand . . . it was just a C producing land (statisically 60% of the time). And if I needed it to be a mox diamond, it could be a mox diamond. (the rest. . . so 18% of the time). Now that means it's useless a majority of the time . . . but it was a lot of fun running it. Just a thought. :smile:

[darkgh0st]

A buddy of mine is piloting White Eldrazi at SCG Worchester and is making really high rankings, almost top 8 ranking finish day 1. I'm hoping to see his name on top8 tomorrow.

[Barook]

Another 1-3 drop, losing against Aggro Loam and 2x Grixis Delver. One thing I noticed is that once in each of those matches, I lost one game board to a double Wasteland opening. Maybe we should run more Surgicals and Pithing Needles to fight that, despite the anti-synergy with Chalice? The Online meta seems pretty hostile towards Eldrazi now.

[DisgruntledElk]

A buddy of mine is piloting White Eldrazi at SCG Worchester and is making really high rankings, almost top 8 ranking finish day 1. I'm hoping to see his name on top8 tomorrow.

Any idea what his list is? I'm currently running White Eldrazi myself and I'd be curious to compare lists.

[darkgh0st]

Any idea what his list is? I'm currently running White Eldrazi myself and I'd be curious to compare lists.

I don't know his exact list. It was closest to Barook's build but he tweaked it to include 2 to 3 Eldrazi Obligator SB. The main stayed pretty much the same except Crossroads over Brushlands, Battlefield Forge (i think it was over the 2nd Karakas), and he was still running 3 Cities.

I can't fully recall his sideboard list from last time he showed it to me (about 4 weeks ago):
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3/2 Obligator or another 1 slot
2 World Breaker
2 All is Dust

He didn't make it today, so I'll leave it at that.

[SarcoZQ]

After lurking this thread in my research for a new legacy deck I went to my first paper legacy tournament today. It was rather small at 17 players but I did manage to win it, much thanks to the thoughts and advice in this thread. Particularly helpful was Barook's 3 step advice of opening hands: 1. T1 chalice @1, and/or 2 TKS on T2 and/or 3 Fast eldrazi deployment. None of the three? Mull! So thank you all.

I played a colourless list: http://pastebin.com/2ChUArTj

It's fairly straightforward, maybe apart from a Karakas and double Urborg main. Especially the latter I'm not too sure about but It's sometimes a godsend when facing Griselbrand.

Tourney was 6 round cut to top 4.

Match one was against Infect. 2-1.
I won the first game fairly easily despite throwing away warping wails at an active Pendelhaven (go me!). opponent thaught me a valuable lesson in resolving glistener elves through my Chalice because I said ok and only noticed a couple of seconds later. He was cool about it and I saw it as a way to learn. It came in very helpful at the semis where I faced him again, and he tried it again.
Game 2 he got me turn 3 with invigorate + berserk. I had not much interaction and TKS on 2 did little against a resolved blighted.
Game 3 he got stomped by the T1 Mimic T2 TKS T3 Smasher.

Match Two. Don't know what his deck is called (I'm fairly new to legacy) but it had Knights of the Relinquary, BoP, a Sylvan Libray amongst a couple things.
Easy 2-0. Game one chalice at 1 pretty much won it Game 2 he forgot a trigger on his library and I had a fast development. T4 the second Smasher sealed the deal.

Match Three. Infect. 2-1
The infect player was good. Can't remember much about the match other than that it was very close. I do remember his advice afterwards which was to fight his creatures my turn to lessen the effect of pump spells and to keep the board clean.

Match Four. A miracles home brew with a rest in piece / helm of obedience / energy field(?) combo 2-0
G1 went long. I'm guessing he hadn't faced eldrazi often because he was visibly annoyed with me "searching" Smashers from the bottom of my deck after they'd been terminussed three times in a row.
G2 He got chaliced at 1 T1 and a mimic and reshaper did the work.

Match Five against DnT 2-0
I don't like the matchup. It may be just me but I have some serious trouble beating Batterskull. That card, when resolved gets me. G1 I lost. I had a pretty sweet hand but my double sol lands got wastelanded twice and I never got more than a mimic on board.
G2 I sided in 2xratchet bombs, 2x pithing needles and and All is Dust. To former 2 specifically to battle batterskull. This game went a lot better as I had triple TKS and never really lost control
G3 was great, although my oppo made 2 pretty big mistakes. His first was pithing needle. Now I don't know what exactly you'd try to name to get Eldrazi. Jitte might be target but even then, I only run two. But he called the judge to see if he could name Simian Spirit Guide. Judge said yes. So I subsequently ask the judge if that even does anything. Judge says no. Magic is such a great game sometimes. :D Anyway, his second mistake was when I had a city of traitors and a wasteland and he blinked my wasteland in hopes it would destroy my City of Traitors. I got to exchange some looks with the judge again. He was ahead on board most of the game but a suicide attack with an equipped Jitte on TKS followed next turn by a Jitte equipped smasher which needed to be quadruple blocked cleared the board. A endless one @ 5 finished a revoker @ jitte and killed him the turn after. 5-0 locked for top 4.

Match six against Storm 0-2
Being mainly a limited player I know what some cards do. Faced against storm or any other combo deck for the first time, I tend to make the wrong choices in both mulligans, sideboarding and counter targets. Game 1 he goes of on t3 after I had pressured him. He needed to go off and he did.
Game 2 smame thing. But here a wailed his Git Probe while I (hindsight and all that) should've waited for either an Infernal Tutor or a Rest in Flames(? the red flashback thingie)

Top 4
So I enter the top 4 as top seed and learn you get to choose play or draw when you're the top seed. That's pretty sweet. I choose to be on the play.
Game 1 is against the infect player in my first match of the day. TKS at T2 gets me there.
Game 2 I mull to 5. I have a decision on T3 to either play a TKS or play an endbringer. I opt for the TKS to at least see what he's doing and remove a Invigorate or Become Immense or Berserk. He doesn't have any of those, and it turns out the endrbinger would won me the game 2 turns after.
Game 3 Chaliced for one at T1. He removes the chalice pretty quickly and I take great care to play around daze. After I win the game he shows me 2 dazes and I feel pretty smart.

Finals, against storm.
So I''m not confident even though the Storm player comments my tools (Chalice, Thorn) are great against him. There's just something unnerving about T3 kills with very little interaction. My opening hand is CoTraitors and chalice which is great, and I drop Chalice T1 and a mimic T2. A endless one for 3 T3 is pretty much all it took.
G2 was the same deal. Chalice for one wrecks him and he doesn't draw an answer.


Looking back, I was very lucky in not encountering any hate other than the usual wastelands and a humility (miracles) which didn't get casted because reasons. No Blood Moon, no Ensnaring Bridge no price of progress. I'm not a bad player but I'm also nothing special. My hands where not spectacular before the top four, I did draw very well against the storm player. That said; a deck must be very good if an not-so-experienced pilot can win his first legacy tournament ever with it. I definately know I'm on the radar for next tournament and I do expect dedicated hate slots. Ratchet Bomb feels insufficient.

[gRR!!]

Hey there folks,

Sorry if this has been already addressed, but I have an issue with Basilisk Collar. I understand that Collar is great against Burn, but it also has great dissinergy with the Chalice at 1. Do you side it in nonetheless?

[Noloam_]

Hey there folks,

Sorry if this has been already addressed, but I have an issue with Basilisk Collar. I understand that Collar is great against Burn, but it also has great dissinergy with the Chalice at 1. Do you side it in nonetheless?

i see the same problem. UR and burn have a hard time dealing with chalice. the collar is one mana cheaper than jitte. But jitte seems like a broader card in general. i whould rather run a 3th jitte side, than run the collar

[darkgh0st]

Another 1-3 drop, losing against Aggro Loam and 2x Grixis Delver. One thing I noticed is that once in each of those matches, I lost one game board to a double Wasteland opening. Maybe we should run more Surgicals and Pithing Needles to fight that, despite the anti-synergy with Chalice? The Online meta seems pretty hostile towards Eldrazi now.

Same sentiments from SCG Worcester. What can we do against a turn 1/2 Waste-lock or Blood Moon? Also Miracles using Humility, double Moat, Back to Basics. I'm gna try to stick with colorless version for now and run Grim Monoliths again, with Oblivion Sower to ramp into Ulamog.

[Cire]

Same sentiments from SCG Worcester. What can we do against a turn 1/2 Waste-lock or Blood Moon? Also Miracles using Humility, double Moat, Back to Basics. I'm gna try to stick with colorless version for now and run Grim Monoliths again, with Oblivion Sower to ramp into Ulamog.

Perhaps to go to the less efficent Mox Diamond to deal with wastelock and bloodmoon? Use more Mox/Diamond/SSG and the emerge guy/worldbreaker MD to deal with enchantments? Running Endless Scourge against Blood Moon as it can be cast without colorless?

--

Edit:

Warning - Random Ramblings and Ideas :tongue:

Thinking about the emerge cards - especially with an early Distended Mindbender to deal with above mentioned problematic enchantments, I was looking at the most explosive strategies Eldrazi could do and trying to maximize those - One of those strats that I included in my calculation was a turn 2 Distended Mindbender and/or Elder Deep-Fiend. The others were the traditional Turn 1 chalice at 1 and a TKS or Smasher turn 2.

I went back to that idea I had about Gemstone Caverns. Imagine a Hand like the following: Sol Land + Gemstone Caverns/Mox Diamond + Any Other Card + a 3cmc Eldrazi + a color producing land + Emerge guy.

You can cast that Emerge turn 2. That can either be a double discard or a time skip. Eitherway it seems like a great move?

Running the following cards among your 60 should make the above scenrio plausible every single game (actually I think it should be around %80 of the time) :

4 Cavern of Souls
4 Colorproducing land
4 Gemstone Caverns
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Eye of Ugin

4 Mox Diamond

4 Endless Courge
4 3 CMC Eldrazi
8 Emerge Eldrazi

Including the following - should also make the rest of the scenrios equally plausible:

3 Eye of Ugin
2 City of Traitors
2 Tomb of Yagmoth

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Thought-knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher

And that is 60 cards. What you give up is a whole lot. You give up removal. You give up bluffing with wail. You give up Jitte life gain. You give up factories, wastelands, karakas. You give up mimics and endless ones. . . but . . . you gain the ability to get an emerge guy turn 2. Ha, also the chance for a turn 1 TKS 6% of the time (Sol land + Mox + Gemstone Caverns + TKS + 2 random cards).

However the above could be rectified somewhat: If you only choose one of the emerge guys - which is the smart move - as you don't want 8 emerge guys in the deck anyway - and thus choose a color - you can gain some ability back. For example if you choose to keep 4 Distended mindbender you can run Eldrazi Displacer. Doing that opens up 4 cards in the deck - you can run 2 Dismember and 2 Jitte/warping wail. Doing that also lets you run the following color producing lands: 2 Karakas and 2 Caves of Koilos.

You get a deck that looks like this:

4 Cavern of Souls
4 Gemstone Caverns
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eye of Ugin
2 City of Traitors
2 Tomb of Yagmoth
2 Karakas
2 Caves of Koilos

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
2 Dismember
2 Jitte/Warping Wail

4 Thought-knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Endless Scourge
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Distended Mindbender

A deck that only maximizes the ability to produce powerful turn 2 plays to the exclusion of the usual Aggro Plan or ability to deal with non-creature permenants that already entered the battlefield. However, turn 2 Mindbender could be a way to deal with problematic enchantments.

Edit: Remember this only works if you're going 2nd. If you are going first then percentages are cut in half since the Gemstone is just a random colorless land.

[urza_insane]

Another 1-3 drop, losing against Aggro Loam and 2x Grixis Delver. One thing I noticed is that once in each of those matches, I lost one game board to a double Wasteland opening. Maybe we should run more Surgicals and Pithing Needles to fight that, despite the anti-synergy with Chalice? The Online meta seems pretty hostile towards Eldrazi now.

Same here - had a pretty rough time of it in the Legacy Challenge w/ Colorless losing to Grixis Delver, Shardless BUG, D&T, and Infect. Games felt a bit lopsided w/ multiple games being lost due to mana screw after Wasteland(s). A few play mistakes also cost me.

I'm also feeling like the meta is pretty well prepared online for Eldrazi. I like the Monolith/Ulamog ramp plan, though not sure how consistent/competitive it is. I've had mixed results in testing.

[drude1]

Again, I haven't been playing this deck for a super long time as I'm traditionally a painter player (the enemy?). Having said that, I have been playing A LOT of the deck online recently and have had all of the same problems with Grixis delver along with a lot of hate for this deck recently in the form of blood moon, back to basics, etc. What has worked best for me so far is to go with a heavier white splash with a few interesting inclusions in the SB. I will preface this by saying that my version sometimes has less explosive draws than the traditional colorless builds have. But I tried the colorless version for quite some time, and like many of you, I was getting wrecked. So, I have been playing with 3 basic plains along with 2 mox diamond and 2 karakas (26 total lands). I play 3 Thalia in the main and I play 2 War Priest of Thune and 3 worship in the SB. The war priests are for blood moons and back to basics. They are also decent against counterbalance (as I often name human with one of my caverns anyway) and obviously good against Omnitell. I also play 2 containment priest and 2 ethersworn canonist in the SB so cavern on human comes up a lot.
I've recently been trying worship in the SB against grixis as I have found that they have a hard time dealing with our creatures. They just overwhelm us with theirs. They have really no way to deal with Worship and if it hits the battlefield I haven't lost a game yet. It's sometimes hard to attack through their defenses but I can usually win with endbringer or a well timed ratchet bomb. As a splash benefit, worship has also been really good against burn and dredge as well.
I haven't tried monoliths but those seem reasonable as well. Probably the way to go if you didn't want to splash heavily into white.

[Barook]

Again, I haven't been playing this deck for a super long time as I'm traditionally a painter player (the enemy?). Having said that, I have been playing A LOT of the deck online recently and have had all of the same problems with Grixis delver along with a lot of hate for this deck recently in the form of blood moon, back to basics, etc. What has worked best for me so far is to go with a heavier white splash with a few interesting inclusions in the SB. I will preface this by saying that my version sometimes has less explosive draws than the traditional colorless builds have. But I tried the colorless version for quite some time, and like many of you, I was getting wrecked. So, I have been playing with 3 basic plains along with 2 mox diamond and 2 karakas (26 total lands). I play 3 Thalia in the main and I play 2 War Priest of Thune and 3 worship in the SB. The war priests are for blood moons and back to basics. They are also decent against counterbalance (as I often name human with one of my caverns anyway) and obviously good against Omnitell. I also play 2 containment priest and 2 ethersworn canonist in the SB so cavern on human comes up a lot.
I've recently been trying worship in the SB against grixis as I have found that they have a hard time dealing with our creatures. They just overwhelm us with theirs. They have really no way to deal with Worship and if it hits the battlefield I haven't lost a game yet. It's sometimes hard to attack through their defenses but I can usually win with endbringer or a well timed ratchet bomb. As a splash benefit, worship has also been really good against burn and dredge as well.
I haven't tried monoliths but those seem reasonable as well. Probably the way to go if you didn't want to splash heavily into white.
Can you post your list?

[urza_insane]

Again, I haven't been playing this deck for a super long time as I'm traditionally a painter player (the enemy?). Having said that, I have been playing A LOT of the deck online recently and have had all of the same problems with Grixis delver along with a lot of hate for this deck recently in the form of blood moon, back to basics, etc. What has worked best for me so far is to go with a heavier white splash with a few interesting inclusions in the SB. I will preface this by saying that my version sometimes has less explosive draws than the traditional colorless builds have. But I tried the colorless version for quite some time, and like many of you, I was getting wrecked. So, I have been playing with 3 basic plains along with 2 mox diamond and 2 karakas (26 total lands). I play 3 Thalia in the main and I play 2 War Priest of Thune and 3 worship in the SB. The war priests are for blood moons and back to basics. They are also decent against counterbalance (as I often name human with one of my caverns anyway) and obviously good against Omnitell. I also play 2 containment priest and 2 ethersworn canonist in the SB so cavern on human comes up a lot.
I've recently been trying worship in the SB against grixis as I have found that they have a hard time dealing with our creatures. They just overwhelm us with theirs. They have really no way to deal with Worship and if it hits the battlefield I haven't lost a game yet. It's sometimes hard to attack through their defenses but I can usually win with endbringer or a well timed ratchet bomb. As a splash benefit, worship has also been really good against burn and dredge as well.
I haven't tried monoliths but those seem reasonable as well. Probably the way to go if you didn't want to splash heavily into white.

Doesn't Deathrite get around Worship? Interesting tech, but that seems like a rather fatal flaw.

As for the heavy White splash, I played a round in a league against a similar deck (maybe it was you?) and can vouch for there being some power there. Thalia is obviously solid. But I still don't like Mox Diamond all that much - Wasteland is public enemy #1 and pitching lands just seems bad. Perhaps the basic plains help mitigate that?

[drude1]

Doesn't Deathrite get around Worship? Interesting tech, but that seems like a rather fatal flaw.

As for the heavy White splash, I played a round in a league against a similar deck (maybe it was you?) and can vouch for there being some power there. Thalia is obviously solid. But I still don't like Mox Diamond all that much - Wasteland is public enemy #1 and pitching lands just seems bad. Perhaps the basic plains help mitigate that?

Yes to deathrite:cry:. Thus, if I know that I am on the Worship plan, I try to hold on to some creature removal for whenever he hits the board. I am also currently trying out a small stoneforge package so that I could try basilisk collar main. Vote's not in on that yet.

Obviously yes, the basic plains and the 2 mox diamonds are there to get around wasteland, blood moon, back to basics, etc. Admittedly, drawing a mox diamond late game is usually pretty awful, but they often allow you to drop a turn 1 thalia or stoneforge. And with having 4 copies of Eye of Ugin, it's nice get some utility out of redundant copies. They were also nice when I was running Winter Orb in the SB but I recently switched those to 3sphere. Here is the list I have been running lately:

// Lands
4 [AVR] Cavern of Souls
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
2 [EX] City of Traitors
4 [ROE] Eldrazi Temple
3 [TE] Wasteland
4 [WWK] Eye of Ugin
2 [LG] Karakas
3 [UG] Plains

// Creatures
4 [OGW] Thought-Knot Seer
4 [OGW] Reality Smasher
3 [DKA] Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 [WWK] Stoneforge Mystic
3 [OGW] Eldrazi Displacer
4 [OGW] Eldrazi Mimic
2 [OGW] Endbringer

// Spells
2 [NPH] Dismember
4 [MMA] Chalice of the Void
2 [OGW] Warping Wail
1 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
2 [SH] Mox Diamond
1 [WWK] Basilisk Collar

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [M14] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 2 [M11] War Priest of Thune
SB: 2 [C14] Containment Priest
SB: 2 [RTR] Rest in Peace
SB: 1 [ALA] Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 [ALA] Oblivion Ring
SB: 2 [DS] Trinisphere
SB: 3 [US] Worship
SB: 1 [ROE] All Is Dust

I also switched out one canonist for the O ring when I moved to trinisphere. I found I almost had too much hate for combo in the SB and wanted another "catch-all" removal spell. Also keep going back and forth between World Breaker and 2nd War Priest. Right now it's War Priest because against B2B or a moon, hard to get worldbreaker mana.
Like I said, the 2 x endbringer + stoneforge package was more of an experiment online and not sure I would play it IRL. Would at least maybe cut down to 1 stoneforge from the main. I will say that both endbringer and thalia combo well with the collar though. No matter how big a creature is, thalia + collar always wins.
Certainly open to criticism/suggestions.

[MD.Ghost]

@drude1/White-Builds:

If you go heavy White (with Thalia, Stoneforge, CPriest etc.) Eye of Ugin is not the right land for you. It is already bad that you can't cast any spells (Chalice etc.) with Eye of Ugin and it gets more worse if you also run a huge amount of White Cards. Eye of Ugin itself is very strong for colorless Eldrazi, but unless you smash a couple of Mimics out of it Turn 1 and follow up with 4/4 or 5/5 it is much better to open up with Turn 1 Solland into X. For common white Eldrazi Builds (see Barooks List) 3x Eye of Ugin is a good number, but if you tend to also play stuff like Thalia and all the good white Sideboard-Spells, i would reduce Eye or cut all of them.

Since White Cards like Thalia, Stoneforge, CPriest, RiP are really strong as a Turn 1 play, a build with Mox Diamond would be the best. We cut Mox a while a go, because it wasn't the best idea to pitch all the (Eldrazi)Sollands to Mox. Every heavy White build tends to run Basics or at least more than enough lands that aren't Sollands. In this case, Mox is ok, because you only pitch "1 Mana Lands" for your 1 Mana Mox.

I already brew with a White Shell, including both Thalia(s) and Stoneforge and mix them up with the best Eldrazi (Displacer, Seer, Smasher). The build can't go all in with Mimics into Stuff (i cut all Mimics because they are a bad topdeck and don't work with White Creatures). I really like the latest Basilisk collar tech. With Stoneforge you can still play it with Chalice on the field and with Thalia 1+2 you have nasty First Strikers for the Deathtouch Ability. Overall the White Brews try to play more cards with a higher power level, but will lost some of the fearsome Aggro Starts (like Mimic into Seer into Smasher, but since the meta is well prepared for Eldrazi we can't argue with X-mas wonderland^^)

[drude1]

So, I was playing Matter Reshapers and 2 Eye initially instead of the mimics, but that build felt very slow. The tempo of the deck has picked up surprisingly well with the mimics and I would argue that they work just fine in this build. I also like them way over Reshapers because you don't absolutely need colorless mana to play them so you can play them through a moon, etc. Given that I decided to play 4 mimics, I wanted to keep the 4 X Eye of Ugin. They also obviously help with the 2 X Endbringer and All is Dust in SB. If you look at early builds where people were playing thorns/spheres, you couldn't play those any faster with 4 X Eye either and Thalia has basically just replaced those. Having said that, I could certainly be talked into 3 Eye, as I do agree with your general sentiment and I have had draws where I am faced with eye for mimics on turn one or being able to play Thalia/chalice turn 2. I may also swap out the mimics when the new 3/3 guy comes out. Vote's not in yet. Thanks for the input.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[DisgruntledElk]

Doesn't Deathrite get around Worship? Interesting tech, but that seems like a rather fatal flaw.

As for the heavy White splash, I played a round in a league against a similar deck (maybe it was you?) and can vouch for there being some power there. Thalia is obviously solid. But I still don't like Mox Diamond all that much - Wasteland is public enemy #1 and pitching lands just seems bad. Perhaps the basic plains help mitigate that?

I believe it was me who you played against! You asked me how I liked the deck, right?

Anyway, I'm really liking the white splash, though it still definitely requires some tweaking still. I think Thalia 2.0 will be a huge boon for the deck, and shutting down haste, any creature with less than 4 toughness, and most opposing land bases is pretty insane.

The current list is:

//Creatures: 21
3 Revoker
3 Stoneforge
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Displacer
4 TKS
4 Smasher

//Spells: 13
4 Chalice
2 Warping Wail
2 Dismember
1 Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Lotus Petal
2 Mox Diamond

//Lands: 26
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 City of Traitors
4 Caves of Koilos
2 Cavern of Souls
4 Plains
2 Karakas
3 Wasteland
(I was running the list with 2 Caves, 3 Cavern, and 4 Wasteland, but I am often finding that I just want to be casting my spells, especially post board.)

SB: 15
3 Thorn
2 Disenchant
2 Containment Priest
1 Warping Wail
1 Basilisk Collar
2 Endbringer
1 Needle
3 Rest in Peace

[Barook]

If we go back to playing a heavier white splash Stoneforges, I would definitely recommend running protection Swords to cover all 5 colors. The main reasons I dropped the "Xenoblade" plan initially was the Shardless match still being underwhelming with the old MD build and not enough white sources.

First strikers + Collar definitely sounds intriguing.

[the_falsehate]

To have some flexible answers to search up with EofU I've started running:

26 Creatures
--------------
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Endless One
3 Eldrazi Displacer (W)
1 World Breaker (G)
1 Eldrazi Obligator (R)
4 Matter Reshaper
1 Endbringer


8 Non-Creature Spells
-------------------------
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Dismember

26 Lands
----------
4 Eye of Ugin
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Wasteland
2 Karakas
3 Corrupted Crossroads
1 Brushland

I only own 2 CoT at this stage, but I do have another Wasteland. Am I doing well managing the Wrg splash (mostly white), or is there a much better way?

Also I have 2 Wastes in the sideboard and wonder if they should just be in the main. My sideboard also has 2 All is Dust, which has it's own risks in a build like this but I like it.

[Abantau]

Hi, long time lurker first time poster here on eldrazi thread. Just finished building this deck a week ago with a few play test.

What do you guys think of having a 1-2 bladed pinions in the 75 to battle resolved Moat? Aside from waiting for ratchet bomb tick to 4 counters or waiting to draw all is dust. :smile:

[Noloam_]

i am currently having some debate with a buddy of mine vandrwll, About a more agressive approach of eldrazi. he 5-0'ed with his list (which is even more aggressive than mine). and i also 5-0'ed

ive ran my previous build and cutted 2 thorns for 1 endbringer and 1 spirit guide. I am not seeing a lot of ANT/belcher lately. So i moved the 4 thorns to the side. The spirit guide and endbringer can both be helpfull in some combo matches

my 5-0 matches:

2-0 miracles
2-0 aggro loam
2-0 esper blade
2-0 omnitell
2-1 omnitell

[drude1]

i am currently having some debate with a buddy of mine vandrwll, About a more agressive approach of eldrazi. he 5-0'ed with his list (which is even more aggressive than mine). and i also 5-0'ed

ive ran my previous build and cutted 2 thorns for 1 endbringer and 1 spirit guide. I am not seeing a lot of ANT/belcher lately. So i moved the 4 thorns to the side. The spirit guide and endbringer can both be helpfull in some combo matches

my 5-0 matches:

2-0 miracles
2-0 aggro loam
2-0 esper blade
2-0 omnitell
2-1 omnitell

As a defender of the white builds, I would say that 5-0 against those decks doesn't really address the issues people have been having. first, maybe one of those MUs were running wastelands. No delver MUs. Also, I would never advocate an aggro strategy over a deck playing Thalia against Omnitell. And Miracles is generally a good MU no matter which version you run.
Having said that, I think one could argue that more aggressive strategies may be better against SB hate such as blood moon as you are hoping to get out a lot of beef before their hate lands. Also, out of curiosity, do you find your MU vs combo (ANT, Omnitell) dependent on whether or not you see chalice?


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[Noloam_]

As a defender of the white builds, I would say that 5-0 against those decks doesn't really address the issues people have been having. first, maybe one of those MUs were running wastelands. No delver MUs. Also, I would never advocate an aggro strategy over a deck playing Thalia against Omnitell. And Miracles is generally a good MU no matter which version you run.
Having said that, I think one could argue that more aggressive strategies may be better against SB hate such as blood moon as you are hoping to get out a lot of beef before their hate lands. Also, out of curiosity, do you find your MU vs combo (ANT, Omnitell) dependent on whether or not you see chalice?


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lel. delver is 50/50. rug delver is even better, team america is worse. omnitell is not a good match at all. thalia is not gonna cut it. i dont believe the white version with thalia can preasure people in the way that the colorless build could. stoneblade it THE biggest enemy. i dont know how you beat turn 1 discard, turn 2 stoneforge with fow back up. strix/tnn/stoneforge IS as bad as it gets

against ANT yes. against omnitell you just hope they dont have it. race and pray

[RhoxWarMonk]

lel. delver is 50/50. rug delver is even better, team america is worse. omnitell is not a good match at all. thalia is not gonna cut it. i dont believe the white version with thalia can preasure people in the way that the colorless build could. stoneblade it THE biggest enemy. i dont know how you beat turn 1 discard, turn 2 stoneforge with fow back up. strix/tnn/stoneforge IS as bad as it gets

against ANT yes. against omnitell you just hope they dont have it. race and pray

This is my experience as well, I just can't beat blade decks -- like, at all, unless I have the nut draw. Even in magical Christmasland I still struggle against decks running TNN/Strix/Stoneforge, literally the worst deck against us -- so much worse than Lands or DnT.

That said, I'm 3-0 against Omni and 1-0 against High Tide. I don't find Omni that much of an issue at all but perhaps they just didn't "have it". One time I did counter their S&T with a Warping Wail though, that felt GOOD! :laugh: They didn't even bother with protection (or rather, didn't have it) since they weren't playing around WW.

Are you still on the same list Noloam? The "more aggressive" version your buddy is playing, do you happen to have a link? I couldn't seem to find it on mtgtop8. Cheers!

[DisgruntledElk]

This is my experience as well, I just can't beat blade decks -- like, at all, unless I have the nut draw. Even in magical Christmasland I still struggle against decks running TNN/Strix/Stoneforge, literally the worst deck against us -- so much worse than Lands or DnT.

That said, I'm 3-0 against Omni and 1-0 against High Tide. I don't find Omni that much of an issue at all but perhaps they just didn't "have it". One time I did counter their S&T with a Warping Wail though, that felt GOOD! :laugh: They didn't even bother with protection (or rather, didn't have it) since they weren't playing around WW.

Are you still on the same list Noloam? The "more aggressive" version your buddy is playing, do you happen to have a link? I couldn't seem to find it on mtgtop8. Cheers!

Good evening everyone. I finally read through most of the last 20 pages of the forum, and I have been playing an Eldrazi Taxes list on MODO the past couple weeks, slowly evolving the list. Since it seems I am one of the few running the heavier white manabase, it is slower going on optimizing the deck, but I'd like to think I'm doing alright :P. Here is a list I 5-0'ed with last week http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/mtgo-standings/competitive-legacy-constructed-league-2016-07-09. While I have since cut 1 Cavern, 1 Wasteland, and 1 Mishra's Factory for 3 more Caves of Koilos to improve the white consistency, the deck remains largely the same. This deck has a couple advantages over the typical colorless/splash just for displacer lists I have seen, as well as a couple drawbacks:

Pros:
-Stoneforge Mystic is a huge boon in winning the creature matchups, as well as being able to fetch Basilisk Collar that you are boarding in to beat any aggressive deck, goyfs, or other Eldrazi Decks (especially when coupled with Thalia, is an absolute beating.
-Thalia allows me to have a Thorn on a body, which vastly improves my Delver matchups. By having a disruptive element that they are forced to deal with, it slows them down to a crawl unless they choose to timewalk themselves by bolting her (only if I don't have a Chalice :P). Moreover, I have since been able to cut Thorns entirely, giving me considerably more space in the board.
-Sideboard cards:
-RIP is a beating for Shardless to deal with, which I have otherwise had trouble with.
-Disenchant allows us to actually beat the hate cards people are bringing in in a reasonable fashion.
-Containment Priest, while good in the fair matchups, is just an absolute beating in the cheaty-faced matchups such as Storm, Reanimator, Sneak and Show, and Elves (you guys get the idea)

Moreover, the matchups I am seeing the biggest complaints with from the colorless side have presented me with little challenge. The Delver matchups can still nut draw you, but with Thalia slowing them down and stoneforge tutoring up powerful equipment to nuke their board/race, you are often pretty far ahead. The other matchup that gets a significant upgrade is any blade variant. Between being the faster blade deck thanks to our ridiculously unfair manabase with SFM, you have Revoker and Disenchant to shut off their weapons. I have definitely still lost to CJ into CJ into Verdict into Verdict into Strix plus equipment is rough, but hey, them's the beats.

The main disadvantage you have in the Eldrazi Taxes deck vs typical Colorless Eldrazi is that you don't have the insane aggro starts. That said, the Eldrazi Taxes list has been treating me very well, and once new Thalia comes out (Heretic Cathar), the deck will probably be the better choice.

Anyway, this is just my 2 cents. Just trying to drum up discussion :P

[the_falsehate]

I have definitely still lost to CJ into CJ into Verdict into Verdict into Strix plus equipment is rough, but hey, them's the beats.

CJ is Council's Judgement for anyone like me who was scratching his head. I wonder how many white sources, of course ignoring CoS, would we have to run be able to put CJ in the sideboard for TNN? Unfortunately it's just not practical...

Congrats on the deck. I just got into legacy and actually wanted to play Jeskai Stoneblade but couldn't afford the manabase. (I do have one complete set of the revised duals though.) It's so sweet to see that my Eldrazi list can easily morph into a D&T style deck running SFM without breaking the bank. I'm inspired!!

[maraxusofkelds]

i am currently having some debate with a buddy of mine vandrwll, About a more agressive approach of eldrazi. he 5-0'ed with his list (which is even more aggressive than mine). and i also 5-0'ed

ive ran my previous build and cutted 2 thorns for 1 endbringer and 1 spirit guide. I am not seeing a lot of ANT/belcher lately. So i moved the 4 thorns to the side. The spirit guide and endbringer can both be helpfull in some combo matches

my 5-0 matches:

2-0 miracles
2-0 aggro loam
2-0 esper blade
2-0 omnitell
2-1 omnitell

How did you approach both the esper blade and the aggro loam matchup? Go fast and hope they dont stabilize? What did you sideboard in?

[Noloam_]

This is my experience as well, I just can't beat blade decks -- like, at all, unless I have the nut draw. Even in magical Christmasland I still struggle against decks running TNN/Strix/Stoneforge, literally the worst deck against us -- so much worse than Lands or DnT.

That said, I'm 3-0 against Omni and 1-0 against High Tide. I don't find Omni that much of an issue at all but perhaps they just didn't "have it". One time I did counter their S&T with a Warping Wail though, that felt GOOD! :laugh: They didn't even bother with protection (or rather, didn't have it) since they weren't playing around WW.

Are you still on the same list Noloam? The "more aggressive" version your buddy is playing, do you happen to have a link? I couldn't seem to find it on mtgtop8. Cheers!

Hehehe exactly. It is magical christmassland for sure :). Yes sometimes omnitell does a turn 2 blowout or show and tell something in that you cant deal with.

My list should be on mtggoldfish today. I changed
-2 thorn main
+1 spirit guide
+ endbringer

Side:
-1 discoball (im gonna mis this baby :()
-1 endbringer

+2 thorn

[Noloam_]

How did you approach both the esper blade and the aggro loam matchup? Go fast and hope they dont stabilize? What did you sideboard in?

I approached esper with a lot of prayer :). he kept a hand with 5 land stoneforge and DRS. i had TKS. so i had that going for me. i believe chalice and TKS did the trick game 2. without TKS that match is just terrible.

the aggoloam match is one of the matches were i find Leyline very important. one of the reasons that i will never switch to cage,relic etc. if you keep the Knights small, the punish fires in exile and blank loam. you have a whole different ballgame. i ofcourse cut the 4 chalices, because the lack 1 drops




5-0 today:

grixis delver
omnitell
sneaky show
mavrick
miracles

[garydubs]

I believe it was me who you played against! You asked me how I liked the deck, right?

might of been me!

i've been playing a more aggressive shell online, i liked white for displacer going over the top in the mirror, but crucible locking w/ a full set of wastelands has been good. going to test the baskilisks collars in the board and run more endbreakers, chalice comes out in the mirror anyhow.

[RhoxWarMonk]

might of been me!

i've been playing a more aggressive shell online, i liked white for displacer going over the top in the mirror, but crucible locking w/ a full set of wastelands has been good. going to test the baskilisks collars in the board and run more endbreakers, chalice comes out in the mirror anyhow.

Would you mind posting your current list please?

[garydubs]

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Endless One
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Wasteland
3 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Dismember
2 Warping Wail
2 Endbringer
1 Karakas
2 Crystal Vein
4 Matter Reshaper
2 Mishra's Factory
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 Sphere of Resistance
SB: 4 Leyline of the Void
SB: 1 All Is Dust
SB: 1 Umezawa's Jitte
SB: 2 Endbringer
SB: 2 Basilisk Collar

crystals are a budget call, and the list is always changing, at least one line. on paper is different. I haven't liked the color splashes yet. tend to lose aggression and lose to mana screw. I'm thinking noloam is writer and aggressive and explosive is probably the best way to go, perhaps adding more simians.

[Noloam_]

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Endless One
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Wasteland
3 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Dismember
2 Warping Wail
2 Endbringer
1 Karakas
2 Crystal Vein
4 Matter Reshaper
2 Mishra's Factory
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 Sphere of Resistance
SB: 4 Leyline of the Void
SB: 1 All Is Dust
SB: 1 Umezawa's Jitte
SB: 2 Endbringer
SB: 2 Basilisk Collar

crystals are a budget call, and the list is always changing, at least one line. on paper is different. I haven't liked the color splashes yet. tend to lose aggression and lose to mana screw. I'm thinking noloam is writer and aggressive and explosive is probably the best way to go, perhaps adding more simians.

Why the 1 sphere side instead of thorn? If you are a budget player, just run 4 eyes for sure

i do like the karakas main. i am pondering so much about karakas main. It will buy me another sideboard slot. but the card is akward sometimes mainboard(i have tested it)

[darkgh0st]

Isn't this barook's list?

mtgtop8.com (http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=12990&d=275765&f=LE)

1st/106 players.

[Barook]

Isn't this barook's list?

mtgtop8.com (http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=12990&d=275765&f=LE)

1st/106 players.
It is. Wasn't me, but well, that's nice.

[garydubs]

Why the 1 sphere side instead of thorn? If you are a budget player, just run 4 eyes for sure

i do like the karakas main. i am pondering so much about karakas main. It will buy me another sideboard slot. but the card is akward sometimes mainboard(i have tested it)

almost have grinded out enough tickects for the cities, got them on paper though. i run the sphere so i can have multiple targets for wipe away effects, but i really think if i'm gonna run sphere effects i want a total access to 6 and a full set of wastelands. I like the karakas in the main, it frees up a slot from the side board and it has just won me too many games vs show and tell and reanimator(which i'm running into more of lately) game 1. end bringer has been a total house and he needs more attention. tonight i'm going to bring my list closer to yours and run another league tomorrow.

[bonkotsu]

I tried the Blue/White list from GP Prague for game night this week. Games didn't last long enough to be able to get a decent report.

Round 1 vs ANT
Both games blew out due to chalice and TKS

Round 2 vs Tin Fins
Game 1 I got him with Chalice and TKS followed by a smasher
Game 2 I mull into Revoker, thorn, chalice, double faerie macabre, Easily got there

Round 3 vs UR Prowess
Game 1 I just went faster, nothing special, never got priced
Game 2 This game having Skyspawner as a blocker saved me, thats really the only thing special

Going to test it some more for fun, I have a while before any big events come up. Have been experimenting with various builds. Tried main deck thorn for the first time. Won me games but I wasn't happy playing it, does that make sense?


List for Reference

Creature (26)
3 Endless One
3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Eldrazi Skyspawner
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Drowner of Hope
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger

Instant (2)
2 Warping Wail

Artifact (6)
2 Lotus Petal
4 Chalice of the Void

Land (26)
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Tendo Ice Bridge
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Corrupted Crossroads
3 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Cavern of Souls
60 Cards

Sideboard (15)
1 World Breaker
1 All Is Dust
1 Ratchet Bomb
3 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pithing Needle
3 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Dismember
2x Faerie Macabre
1x Caltrops

[Noloam_]

Yes it makes sense. I also cutted the thorns since a long time. The meta needs another approach

[bonkotsu]

Yes it makes sense. I also cutted the thorns since a long time. The meta needs another approach

Agreed, a Presidential Candidate actually said what we should be doing to the format. We need to make this format great again!

https://youtu.be/rSFZktZNySg?t=6s

[darkgh0st]

i am currently having some debate with a buddy of mine vandrwll, About a more agressive approach of eldrazi. he 5-0'ed with his list (which is even more aggressive than mine). and i also 5-0'ed

Vanderwall's build is crazy aggressive and feels like it floods a lot more than usual. 25 lands and more than 4 guides. I love the Lodestone Golems in the list.

[RhoxWarMonk]

Vanderwall's build is crazy aggressive and feels like it floods a lot more than usual. 25 lands and more than 4 guides. I love the Lodestone Golems in the list.

Do you have a decklist handy? :)

[bluemaroon]

Do you have a decklist handy? :)

http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=13017&d=275956&f=LE

[darkgh0st]

http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=13017&d=275956&f=LE

Thanks for covering that.

There are 2 vanderwall lists posted on that one. I checked mtggoldfish and the list posted there was 1 ESG and 3 Thorns.

[Fred_Bear]

I can't say that I disagree with the uber-aggressive approach. In the play and play-testing I've done online, the more aggressive draws are the ones I win more consistently. If I 'pause' or use a full turn to make a control or delay move, the tempo lost is almost too much to overcome.

I went the other way, too, and I've actually built a prison-type stax (back to the white stax builds I played with years ago) that uses TKS for additional disruption. I think I have more success separating the two strategies - aggressive and disruptive. Both can work, but trying to combine them, I've found, stumbles on itself.

[bonkotsu]

Agreed, a Presidential Candidate actually said what we should be doing to the format. We need to make this format great again!

https://youtu.be/rSFZktZNySg?t=6s

Guess nobody supports Garrison like I do

[maraxusofkelds]

I've been running two cryptolith fragments over the two ratchet bombs in the sideboard, and boy are they putting in work. Not only does it act as a mana source vs bloodmoon and back2basics for your displacers and world breakers, it doubles as a win con by itself. It slow pings while ramping mana. The only issue vs miracles is that your life will be so high from swords that it will never flip. When it flips, it does 4 a turn through the air and gets through gofy and moats and easily finishes the game. It blocks delver if you get into a race situation. The only scenario I wanted ratchet over the fragments have been vs elves. I haven't ran into a scenario yet where miracles drops a bunch of entreats on me that I couldn't clear up with all is dust instead. I've even had an opportunity to kill a griselbrand with it at one point.

[darkgh0st]

@Lodestone Golem: I went and sleeved up 4 Lodestone Golems last FNM, putting them in the SB. He won the games where the opponent just can't remove him. That 1 mana taxing effect made a huge difference between the Elves match up being able to combo off or casting Natural Order, or Infect putting in a lot of poisons. Against Reanimator, he didn't mattered, and against Grixis Delver he just ate a bolt. The hands also didn't feel too akward even if your eldrazis are getting taxed too because of the lots of sol lands in the deck (I ran the full package of City of Traitors, and still sticking at 3 Eyes). I'll be sticking him in my colorless list for now.

Aside from that, I see two other different eldrazi builds moving forward. The white eldrazi is a given, and I'm seeing blue eldrazi as a possibility.

[jimmythegreek]

Against an unknown opponent do you guys always run out a turn one chalice ( burning a simian which could help produce a turn two smasher) or play eye and play two mimics?

[Silverflame]

Against an unknown opponent do you guys always run out a turn one chalice ( burning a simian which could help produce a turn two smasher) or play eye and play two mimics?

I always play safe and go for chalice first if I'm on the play. It is such a blowout against so many decks, that it's hard to justify not playing it. If I'm on the draw, it depends on the land the opponent played. If I see something other than a basic swamp (pox), eldrazi temple/eye or an island, I'd go for chalice, because if it's an island you'll probably eat up a daze and if it's swamp, i'm more worried with 2 mana spells.
Although if you can power 3-4 mimics T1 and thought-knot/Smasher T2, just go for it.

[the_falsehate]

As far as feeling bad, in my experience missing a chance to play Chalice and getting punished feels a lot worse than waiting to get the beats on. What is actually correct is another story and the advice to go for it on the play or evaluate the land played on the draw is quite good.

I won a Null Rod today in a six man pod and had a decision in game 3 of my last match on turn 5 against Miracles whether to try to Chalice on 2 or keep the pressure on with an Endless One to a creature free board. I went for the Endless One and he played Counterbalance the next turn and it felt awful. Awhile later he got a Top in play and there's no way I should have won from there, but I ended up winning an epic through a Back to Basics where I had him at 1 life for about 12 turns. While at 1 life he resolved a Jace and used the zero ability several times but kept getting unlucky and finally he had to start using the +2 ability to try to control my draw. He got Jace to 12, ready to ultimate, putting a land on the bottom of my deck and the next card was a land and I killed him with a hastey Smasher. The win felt like a miracle against Miracles, as I was just waiting to lose, really. It was the last round of a casual and they turned off the clock and I almost conceded like 20 minutes before it was over because people were hanging around to see if I won outright or if the prize pool would be split. I felt like I had about a 1 in 50 shot but I decided to play it out....there's a lesson there as well!

Anyway he was never able to counter a single spell with Counterbalance, but I was beating myself up about it for most of game. The point to the story is that when Chalice gets countered, you're at least drawing out the counter, but sometimes when you don't Chalice it is just too late, so if you're on the fence keep that in mind.

[Noloam_]

i ended 4th on the Legacy festival championship. 6-1 in the swiss

won: Complete set: vintage masters, modern masters 1, modern masters 2, eternal masters

2-0 uw blade
2-0 miracles
2-0 rug delver
2-1 grixis delver
2-0 miralces
1-2 grixis delver
2-0 rug delver

won the quarters 2-0 from storm.

lost the semi's (1-2) from the same grixis dude that i lost from in the swiss. thought i had it, he had nothing and 2 lands on hand. he topdecked strix into draw a card and drew angler :(.

i had medium draws the whole tournament. but o well, im happy with the result

[the_falsehate]

The list that did best at SCG Legacy Classic Columbus ran the new Kozilek!?

[TheEmgee]

Frankly, I have a hard time finding Barook's deck list among these posts. So many pages.

@Barook Will you please repost your deck list or provide your post link so others and I can view it. Can you also include your side tech guide too please.

Thanks.

[Witch_king_of_angmar]

The list that did best at SCG Legacy Classic Columbus ran the new Kozilek!?

Looks cool, he has 3 grim monolith to accelerate, not bad. The new kozilek has always felt promising, but it has been overshadowed by newlamog's ETB. That said, resolving this guy on turn 4 has to be backbreaking.

[Ace/Homebrew]

he has 3 grim monolith to accelerate
They also provide an out to Blood Moon.

[Barook]

Frankly, I have a hard time finding Barook's deck list among these posts. So many pages.

@Barook Will you please repost your deck list or provide your post link so others and I can view it. Can you also include your side tech guide too please.

Thanks.
http://www.mtggoldfish.com/player/_barook_

SB Guide (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?30500-DTB-Eldrazi-Stompy&p=944846&viewfull=1#post944846)

[the_falsehate]

Looks cool, he has 3 grim monolith to accelerate, not bad. The new kozilek has always felt promising, but it has been overshadowed by newlamog's ETB. That said, resolving this guy on turn 4 has to be backbreaking.

I always said someday someone had to break the new Kozilek. I'm not saying this does it, but...dropping a biggie and drawing 7 would feel so great in this deck! (even ignoring the counter ability)


Also the UW Eldrazi by list Marc Camo Forment that took 2nd at MKM in Madrid looks really cool as well. Lots of Eldrazi innovation happening at the moment!