[Primer] Maverick 2.0 - GW/x

[Megadeus]

What's your thoughts about delving deeper into Blue? We could use the cantrips to find (and controlling elements to protect) our beaters.

Mom protects your beaters already.

[bakofried]

What's your thoughts about delving deeper into Blue? We could use the cantrips to find (and controlling elements to protect) our beaters.

Get out. (J/K)

In all seriousness, the changes you are suggesting are sufficiently divergent from the Maverick archetype that discussing them here will be unproductive for you and a distraction for the thread. I suggest looking at the various Noble Bug lists floating around for this suggestion

Regarding your prior list, I see no reason to play it over Maverick, 4c Loam, or Turbo Depths. By cutting down on Thalia's and Mothers your % against combo will drop precipitously, despite the fact that CR can be a "gotcha" card. Furthermore, Maverick, Loam, and Depths can do a much better job of protecting a Marit Lage should one be produced.

Crop Rotation in Maverick can be powerful and worthy of inclusion, but not as an all in game plan.

[Fatal]

From my previous post:

Since most people are down on equipment right now, what could we do if we removed the whole package....

This is my first draft:

4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Shalai, Voice of Plenty

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Ranumap Excavator
1 Dryad Arbor

4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Maze of Ith
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Karakas

Sideboard
2 Choke
3 Thoughtsieze
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Sanctum Prelate
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ground Seal

All the white cards have to be killed on sight. I upped the Pridemages to help against DnT and Blood Moon decks.

Sideboard is kind of a mess, but Ground Seal is against opposing DRS decks. Mainboard Thalia's help against a ton of matchups that were previously unfavorable, like elves, and helps keep Delver/Grixis in check while we set up Excavator Recursion.

This is the first draft.. . thoughts?

Too big gap on CMC2 and overgrowth CMC3 It won't work smooth.
We need better replacement for SFM.

Try out trim Thalia 2.0 and put some lotus cobra, or dark confidant.
I also don't like 2 creatures with cmc4. Maybe try some Railler which will combo with lotus cobra.

[bakofried]

So long as True-Name Nemesis is a relevant card, removing the 2 Mystic/1 SoFaI/1 Jitte is likely incorrect. If you're dead set on doing so, I'd recommend including the Depths package, a Sigarda, or a Rogue's Passage to compensate.

[Zulabnar]

So long as True-Name Nemesis is a relevant card, removing the 2 Mystic/1 SoFaI/1 Jitte is likely incorrect. If you're dead set on doing so, I'd recommend including the Depths package, a Sigarda, or a Rogue's Passage to compensate.

i feel the same
TNN is one of the biggest threat around, and sometimes i would like to have a decent answer maindeck

Also i would like to have a card for ETW early turn...

maybe deluge maindeck?

[bakofried]

I've used Deluge as a sideboard card before to some effect, but it's probably unwise to use it in the main. If you really feel that you need a maindeck sweeper (which shouldn't be the case, honestly), maybe move a Zealous Persecution from the side to the main. Likely a poor decision though.

Why do you think you need a maindeck sweeper in the first place?

[Magnaguard100]

I recently top 8d the legacy classic in ATL and people wanted my report so here it is



Legacy top 8 write up

Played in the legacy classic this weekend. Ran punishing maverick and ran really hot this weekend going 6-0-2, and then losing in top 8. Overall really loved the performance of the deck and enjoyed all the card choices. For a look at my decklist you can go to SCGs website. First write up ever and i dont remember everything so bare with me.

Round 1 Eldrazi stompy (2-1)

He opens up with ancient tomb into mimic and i know its going to be a rough road ahead as my hand is ill prepared for eldrazi as my mom does nothing and my p fire is quickly outclassed by tks. I get quickly beaten down and we move to game 2. Game 2 i start off strong by turn 1 fetch into drs, turn 2 waste him p fire his mimic and play a noble. He plays some redhapers but knight quickly holds down the fort with p fire back up. Get a jitte online and he concedes. Game 3 is a grind as he opens on double leyline of the void and turn 1 chalice. Luckly my hand has no 1 drops and i play a normal game of magic. He doesnt have an agressive stary because of all the hate peices that im able build a scary board with jitte and sofi from SFM. I pretty much have the game locked until he top decks all is dust, but i rip gideon off the top and restabalize for the win.

Out

3 mom
1 gaddock teeg

In

1 gideon
1 garruk
1 councils judgement
1 fiery justice

Round 2 Miracles

Game 1 was easy as i play turn 2 library and just bury him with card advantage and double p fire wittling his creatures and jaces down and avoiding terminus all game. Game 2 mom into canonist into teeg quickly beigins the beat down as he cant recover.


Round 3 Lands (Kevin King) 2-0

Knew he was on lands and so played accordingly. Opened up strong with DRS and scryb ranger to eat all his lands and power our a knight and quickly beat him down before he can assmemble mariat lage. Game 2 he warping wails my drs and pfires my ooze but cant deal with my knight. I have to plow the first mariat lage, but am able to blessed alliance the second one so i dont have to go through another 20 life and a 12/12 knight quickly cuts him down

Out

3 pfire
1 teeg
1 voice

In

1 blessed alliance
1 rec sage
2 crop rotation
1 bojuka bog


Round 4 Sneak and Show 2-0

I keep a solid hand of mom noble knight 2 fetches and waste. My opponent on the play goes island double lotus petal show and tell and im like great im gonna get crushed. He puts in grisslebrand and i put in knight. I top deck karakas and cant slam it faster to bounce. He pays 14 life and then grissle goes back to the hand. I swing for 2 and put him to 4. He draws, brainstorms, and then proceeds to discard. I get confused about him wiffing.on 14 cards but consider myself lucky. I play waste attack and after no blocks i waste my karakas for lethal. Game 2 i play super conservitivly always holding up reb. I draw a second one and feel really confidant. I sfm for batterskull and start the beat down. He plays Show and tell and i pyroblast it. He says sure and starts to put it in the yard, but then says he wants to respond, so we call a judge and she says since he said sure both spells are resolves. He gets angry and essentially scoops and shows his hand of double force sneak emrakul and petal. I didnt have the heart to show him my second blast, and double crop rotation to get karakas.

Out

3 pfire
1 voice
3 mom
1 noble
1 drs


In

1 pyroblast
1 reb
2 crop rotation
2 ethersworn canonist
1 teeg
1 rec sage
1 councils judgement

Round 5 UW stoneblade 2-1

Game 1 he gets TNN out quickly and equips.a jitte and ends me fast. Game 2 i choke him and then overwhelm him with guys and he cant recover with no blue lands. Game 3 i waste him and pfire all his guys and he ends up not being able to cast spells and scryb ranger with sofi takes the day.

Out

1 teeg
1 voice
2 plow
1 knight
1 ooze

In

1 blessed alliance
1 councils judgement
1 rec sage
1 reb
1 pyroblast
1 gideon

Round 6 grixis delver 2-1

Games 1 and 2 are uneventful as game 1 he has all the wastes and dazes and runs me over, and game 2 i have all the wastes and removal and run him over.
Game 3 is a slog as he has drs, lavamancer, TNN and angler.to my batterskull. He gets too overzealous thinking he had the win and swings with tnn. The lavamancers me and tries to drs me but there are no spells for him to eat. He gets frustrated as he passed the turn. I untap, equip sofi to batterskull, p fire his drs and swing for 6. He takes it. I shoot the lavamancer and draw. He swings again. I swing back and play drs. My life total is now out od reach and he ends up dying. Super lucky about the punt.

Out

1 teeg
1 pridemage
1 birds

In

1 reb
1 councils judgement
1 fiery justice

Final 2 rounds i double draw into top 8

Top 8 Miralces 0-2 (rematch)

Played the same guy as round 2. My deck does not fire properly and i flood out and get swarmed.by angels after being terminused 3 times. Game 2 is no better. He has all the wraths but i manage to get him to 2, but cant find a pfire due to jace and get ultimated out of the game

Out

1 pfire
4 plow
2 knight
1 noble
1 birds

In

1 teeg
1 choke
1 reb
1 pyroblast
2 canonist
1 garruk
1 gideon
1 rec sage

Overall had a lot of fun. Not running dd/ts was fine. No match up that i really wanted it in and it made my mana much easier to handle. Plateau was actually useful as double white for gideon and councils.judgement was neccesary a couple games. Voice over the 4th mom drew force.really quickly or have people slow down and play on their turn to remove him. SFM and batterskull overperformed all weekend and am glad i had them.

[lavafrogg]

Grats on the finish!

I love the batter skull pick and wish I had the room right now.

I went with a Big Thalia list with 2 SFM and just went 3-0 in a small round robin. It was super competitive with all of the bug legacy players working on decks.

Round 1: BUG Control 2-1

He gets game 1 by going DRS, Strix + Push, Force into Jace in an empty board.

Games 2 and 3 were pretty similar with turn 2 stoneforge getting forced, moms getting pushed and then Thalia’s coming in to put in work. Both games I had 5 power worth of first strike goodness swinging past multiple baleful strixes. Karakas was involved to protect the girls from removal. Game 3 he had an active Jace against a SoFI for several turns as he drew into deathrites to block.


Round 2: Grixis Control 2-1

Game 1 I mull to 5 and get turn 2 hymned.... scoop

Game 2 was super fun with Deathrite vs Deathrite and a SoFI sealing the deal.

Game 3 was an auto concede on a resolved turn 3 Choke. Turn 1 was mom, pushed, turn 2 Thalia, forced.

Round 3: Aluren 2-1

Game 1 Mom shut down several cascades into removal(3 times) while Teeg stopped the Aluren from hitting play

Game 2 he ground me out with Strix damage and DRS

Game 3 he falls behind on the board and has to deluge a 4/4 knight + mom + Jitte, I untap and drop both Thalia’s and he scoops.


He list was super fun and I beat 3 baleful Strix decks in a row. Thalia did not get to disrupt and mana but a 3/2 first strike was huge all night. If I was lucky I would have had turn 2 Heretic several times but Hymn happened.

All in all, really happy with the list and am just fiddling with numbers... 1 or 2 QPM, 2 or 3 SFM... little choices.

[Hanni]

What's your thoughts about delving deeper into Blue? We could use the cantrips to find (and controlling elements to protect) our beaters.

This deck already exists. It's called Bant Deathblade (I call it Noble Blade), and although it's fallen out of favor lately, it's still a fantastic deck with great matchups across the field.

[menloe]

i feel the same
TNN is one of the biggest threat around, and sometimes i would like to have a decent answer maindeck

Also i would like to have a card for ETW early turn...

maybe deluge maindeck?

TNN is a stupid card but it's not something I worry about. A big KotR is usually pretty good against TNN.

I don't think you want Deluge main since you'll eat your board too and then lose as you try to rebuild.

[lavafrogg]

Too big gap on CMC2 and overgrowth CMC3 It won't work smooth.
We need better replacement for SFM.

Try out trim Thalia 2.0 and put some lotus cobra, or dark confidant.
I also don't like 2 creatures with cmc4. Maybe try some Railler which will combo with lotus cobra.

Took feedback and went with this:

White Staples(11)
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar

SFM Package(4)
2 SFM
1 Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

Green Staples(8)
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Knight of the Reliquary

GSZ Targets(6)
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Ranumap Excavator
1 Dryad Arbor

Spells(8)
4 Green Sun’s Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

Lands(23)
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Maze of Ith
1 Gaea’s Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Karakas

Sideboard
3 Thoughtsieze
2 Canonist/containment priest/damping sphere/Prelate
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Choke
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Blessed Alliance

Felt really good and was happy with Big Thalia all night.

Better?

[Yutao]

Just some background info, the event is called Gaming for Gains, ran by Matt N. Basically it's a large legacy tournament where entry is canned food or food donations to be given to the local food pantry/soup kitchen. It's a whole lot of fun and there's a ton of raffle prizes given out.

This is the list I ran with for the event:

Land (24)
1x Bayou
1x Dark Depths
1x Dryad Arbor
1x Forest
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Karakas
1x Plains
2x Savannah
1x Scrubland
1x Thespian's Stage
1x Tropical Island
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Wasteland
4x Windswept Heath

Creature (24)
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Deathrite Shaman
1x Gaddock Teeg
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Leovold, Emissary of Trest
4x Mother of Runes
1x Noble Hierarch
1x Qasali Pridemage
1x Ramunap Excavator
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Scryb Ranger
2x Stoneforge Mystic
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

Sorcery (4)
4x Green Sun's Zenith

Instant (5)
1x Abrupt Decay
4x Swords to Plowshares

Artifact (2)
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Umezawa's Jitte

Enchantment (1)
1x Sylvan Library

Sideboard (15)
1x Abrupt Decay
1x Armageddon (Couldn't find my ravages)
2x Containment Priest
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1x Reclamation Sage
2x Surgical Extraction
3x Thoughtseize
2x Zealous Persecution

Round 1 against Sean on U/B Reanimator
So the earliest memory I have when I was starting out in Legacy was Sean kicking my ass with a t1 Griselbrand and eventually an Iona. I made the call that he's probably on the same deck 3 years later. He keeps an opening hand with close to 3+ cantrips, but I a significant lack of action. I keep a hand of Thalia, QPM, 2x Fetchland, Karakas, GSZ, and Wasteland. No t1 play, but QPM on t2 with T3 Thalia with karakas protection are enough of a clock/disruption. He's stuck on two mana, eventually using a lotus petal to exhume a Grave Titan. An stupidly timely STP off the top takes care of that. He then reanimates my own KOTR which beats me to a tender 6 health. Eventually DRS nibbles his grave away and a Jitte kills my own Knight. He concedes to the GSZ for Leovold.

Board in: 2x Containment Priest, 3x Thoughtseize, 2x Surgical Extration
Board out: 2x Stoneforge, 2x Equipment, 1x Teeg, 1x Excavator, 1x Wasteland

Sean elects to go on the play, fetches a basic, Dark Ritual, Thoughtseize himself, exhumes Tidesprout tyrant after a mulligan to 6. I drop a plains and STPs it. Sean looks a bit glum. I end up with two DRS and a KOTR which is enough to carry me to victory after my Containment Priest gets forced.

2-0 (1-0 in matches)

Round 2 against Kaz on Elves
I've heard rumors that this is traditionally a horrible matchup, but sometimes you just have the nuts. After winning the die roll, I lead off on Bayou, GSZ for dryad arbor. (To beat the elf player you have to become the elf player). T2 I fetch up tropical island for the best elf in the MU, Leovold. He does some shennanigans with bouncing creatures and playing more DRS, but I eventually get a Jitte onto the big friend elf Leovold and he carries his way to the finish line

Board in: 2x Containment Priest, 2x Ethersworn Canonist, 2x Zealous Persecution,
Board out: 1x QPM, 2x Thalia, 3x Mother of Runes

Kaz also elects to go on the play, but my hand has the holy trio of Priest, Canonist, and Persecution. He Thoughtseizes away Persecution, but Canonist forces him to play fair. Eventually SOFI, Priest, and a very large Knight ends up removing all his permanents. Thank god Elves has the most aggressive two color manabase in legacy lol. He played a copy of the 4 mana 5/5 champion an elf, which seems really strong. Too bad her swords were turned to a plowshare.

4-0 (2-0 in matches)

Round 3 against Craig on 3 color Turbo Depths
Craigs list was splashing white for Solemnity and KOTR which I thought was really neat. However an early karakas combined with a t3 Knight stopped all the Turbo in his Depths. Dark depthsed him out of the game after killing two DRS.

Board in: 1x Abrupt Decay, 1x Reclamation Sage, 1x Armageddon, 2x Surgical Extraction
Board out: 4x Mother of Runes, 1x Leovold.

Game 2 he gets a lot scarier with both Library and Crucible of Worlds. Welp, turns out we're locked in for the long game. I nibble away at his health with an active DRS, and a Noble exalting a Ramunap Excavator. Excavator+Wasteland stop him from getting a fast depths after he decays my Knight. Eventually I slam Armageddon into his 5 lands and no creatures while sandbagging two fetches. He concedes to the Geddon.

6-0 (3-0 in matches)

Round 4 against Michael? on Grixis Delver
After skillfully winning the die roll, I resolve DRS into Thalia, into Knight, into Jitte to take out his Delver and DRS (he forced an early STP). I get the perfect game, where my opponent has no lands, no creatures, and 7 cards in hand.

Board in: 1x Abrupt Decay, 2x Zealous Persecution
Board out: 1x Ramunap Excavator, 1x Teeg, 1x QPM

Michael (I think) elects to go on the play and leads off with an early DRS, We trade removal spells for DRS, Delvers, and Mother of Runes. After the dust clears he's left with an Angler and two lands against a 3/3 Knight, 4 lands, and a dryad arbor. He gets me down to 3 with 4 cards in hand and I'm just praying that he has no bolt in his hard. He swings in with his big fish, but jokes on him, one of my lands was a grand theatrical performance, where I'm able to fetch up dark depths with Knight and attempt to create a 20/20 monster. Michael(still 50/50 on this name) freezes and goes in the tank for about 5 minutes before conceding. Sometimes a theatrical performance summoning a cthulu-like entity is good enough.

8-0 (4-0 in matches)

Round 5 against Devon? on Eldrazi
Eldrazi is traditionally a good-ish matchup for Maverick, but apparently I can't draw wastelands at all. He takes game one after winning the die roll, curving chalice into smasher, into jitte, into smasher, while I'm on 3 lands and a scavenging ooze. I'm rather sure there's nothing you can do about that.

Board in: 1x Armageddon, 1x Gideon Ally of Zendikar, 1x Reclamation Sage, 3x Thoughtseize, 1x Decay
Board out: 4x Mother of Runes, 3x Thalia

I end up going for a fast mana hands with active DRS and Noble into a Gideon. His Thought Knot Seer snatches my GSZ, and eventually rips smasher into smasher. I manage to stabalize with a key swords on his Oblivion Sower, while my Knight is holding a jitte. The only issue is that I'm at 3 life. I aggressively Thoughtseize to clear his all is dust, and end step use my DRS to drain him for two. BIG MISTAKE. He savagely rips Walking Ballista off the top and attempts to ping me to death. The combined might of Scryb Ranger, Deathrite Shaman, and Leovold drawing three cards can't get me out of this hold I dug for my self. I completely blanked on ballista being an out he could have and should of used my DRS to gain life instead.

8-2 (4-1 in matches)

Round 6 against Pat on Sneak and Show
Game 1 I keep the god hand of QPM, Thalia, Karakas, 2x Fetch, GSZ, Wasteland. Again, no t1 play, but I'm able to QPM on t2, Thalia on t3 with Karakas to keep her safe (or to stop any emrakuls), and wasteland to keep him at 2 mana sources. He eventually Shows and Tells in an emrakul, but Karakas sends her right back to Pat's hand. Leovold eventually comes down and he concedes to that.

Board in: 2x Containment Priest, 3x Thoughtseize, 1x Reclamation Sage, 2x Canonist
Board out: 2x Stoneforge Mystic, 2x Equipment, 4x Mother of Runes

Game two he's off to a mull to 6, 1 land hand with cantrips, and 2x Leyline of Sanctity. The only issue is that he's brainstorm locked and I have mana dorks to play. He digs his way to three mana and slaps down his science experiment of Emrakul. The only issue is that I have both mana and a KOTR to slap around his 15/15. Knight finds the Karakas, Karakas wins the game.

10-2 (5-1 in matches)

Round 7 against (honestly I don't remember his name so I'm just going to call him Cartman) on Steel Stompy.
He win the die roll and leads off with close to 5 spells on t1. I die on t3.

Board in: 1x Reclamation Sage, 1x Abrupt Decay, 2x Zealous Persecution
Board out: 4x Mother of Runes.

Game two is much more competitive, He has a chalice on 1, but I have a Marit Lage after chumping his 4/4 raveages with a bird. Jitte gets slapped on a Leovold and his able to do some damage to his board after I QPM the Spyglass naming it. I eventually kill off his flying Vault Skirge and ornithopter. Marit Lage is able to swing for victory. I think this is the first time I've used Marit Lage on defense.

Game three is much more of a stomp. Chalice on 1 combined with the new 4 mana Karn creates a lot of early pressure, especially combined with a Ravager. I'm stuck on two lands and 11 health after he swings. He sacks a ton of artifacts to ravager and swings for lethal. I scoop before I realize that by sacing his artifacts he makes his Karn tokens smaller. I was probably dead anyways, but he was very apologetic about it and I was kicking myself for not noticing that.

11-3 (5-2 in matches)

Turns out 5-2 is still good enough for 7th seed into top 8 (I had stupid good breakers)
Quarter Finals MU against Devon? on Eldrazi
In this rematch, he ends up getting a smasher into player, and slapping me with manlands till I die. Same board as last time. I end up going off with Kotr, Wastelands, and DRS. He concedes to Gideon being cast off of the third wasteland. Turns out gideon's pretty good against his board of Urborg+ Eldrazi Mimic. Game three was bit of mess. I mull down to 6 and keep a very loose hand of one land, two swords, two dorks, and a GSZ. He keeps an equally loose 7 with mimic, two lands, removal spells, and Matter Reshaper. STPs takes out two Reshapers, but Mimic beats me down to 8. I thoughtseize away a key Thought knot seer (ironic), and play 4/4 knight. Knight finds wastelands and wastelands are good against opponents on two mana.

13-4 (6-2 in matches)

Semifinals MU against Josh on Mono Red Stompy
In game one, he goes all in on the magus of the moon plan, but top deck Forest lets me cast Birds, Birds lets me cast Swords, DRS, and Knight get really big and he's stuck on mana. He eventually finds a bridge, but QPM off the top takes care of that.

Board in: 1x Armargeddon, 1x Abrupt Decay, 3x Thoughtseize
Board out: 2x Stoneforge, 2x Equipment (61 cards I know)

In game two, we both draw dead for about 6 turns, he had a spy glass naming wasteland, I have 4 wastelands out. Fiery Confluence keeps my board clear, but he ends up top decking Karn to win the game.

In game three, I navigate my way around his blood moons and chalices to the point where I think I'm in a good position. I thoughtseize him and see a hand of Bridge, Bridge, SSG. He's on two lands with a moon out so I make the hard read of not taking a bridge and taking the mana monkey instead. Big mistake, he draws basic mountain and slams bridge. the next turn he plays another bridge. Uh Oh. Sylvan Library Finds me a wealth of lands, but no action. He eventually emblems Koth to win the game.

14-6 (6-3 in matches)

This was enough for a 3rd place finish out of 65 players. Not so bad after all. Hit me up if you guys have any questions or want to criticize my formatting (it's atrocious) and thanks for reading!

[Valleysdai]

With my list on the previous page what are your thoughts on these changes:

-1 abrupt decay
-1 crop rotation
-2 life from the loam

+3 mother of runes
+1 scryb ranger

I'd like to get 1 more mother in but not sure what would be best to cut (debating tracker but his clues are great when I remember the trigger).

Edit:

It was quite a weird maverick/nic fit build (using atraxa, gilded drake, etc). In the mirror match that showed me the power of mother of runes and scryb ranger.

[pettdan]

It was quite a weird maverick/nic fit build (using atraxa, gilded drake, etc). In the mirror match that showed me the power of mother of runes and scryb ranger.

I hear you've played against MOST, or so it seems, you'll find it in the new and developmental decks section.

[Fatal]

Took feedback and went with this:

White Staples(11)
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar

SFM Package(4)
2 SFM
1 Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

Green Staples(8)
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Knight of the Reliquary

GSZ Targets(6)
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Ranumap Excavator
1 Dryad Arbor

Spells(8)
4 Green Sun’s Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

Lands(23)
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Maze of Ith
1 Gaea’s Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Karakas

Sideboard
3 Thoughtsieze
2 Canonist/containment priest/damping sphere/Prelate
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Choke
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Blessed Alliance

Felt really good and was happy with Big Thalia all night.

Better?

Much better Mana curve, not sure does deck can support so many utility lands with so many white/green Mana require. You can always cut maze for one more Mana dork if needed - but before test as much as you can.

[lavafrogg]

Much better Mana curve, not sure does deck can support so many utility lands with so many white/green Mana require. You can always cut maze for one more Mana dork if needed - but before test as much as you can.

The man requirements are all single color and everything can be cast off of basic+savanah.

DRS also helps greatly with mana costs, just like in all of the 4 color decks running around.

I am testing this religiously and will get results back as I go.

[Skizz]

just found some time to write a little bit about GP Birmingham from last Weekend.

Mainboard:
2 Forrest
1 Plains
2 Savannah
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Gaeas Cradle
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs

1 Dryad Arbor
1 Noble Hierarch
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, GoT
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scrybranger
2 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Scavinging Ooze
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Renegade Rallier

4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Abrupt Decay
4 Green Suns Zenith
1 Umezawas Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sylvan Library

Sideboard:
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Containment Priest
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Thoughtseize
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Blessed Alliance
2 Choke

Games: 6/2 Day 1
1. U/R Delver 1:2 Loss
2. Grixis Delver 2:1 Win
3. Lands 2:1 Win
4. Grixis Delver 2:0 Win
5. Jeskai Stoneblade 1:2 Loss
6. Burn 2:0 Win
7. -no Show/bye- Win
8. Grixis Delver 2:0 Win

Games: 3/4 Day 2
9. Turbo Depths 1:2 Loss
10. Elves 0:2 Loss
11. ANT 2:1 Win
12. BR Reanimator 1:2 Loss
13. Nyx Fit 2:1 Win
14. Turbo Depths 2:1 Win
15. Red Prison 0:2 Loss

Overall 9:6

notes on matches:
Match 1: UR Delver - I had the win on board game 2 but throw it away due to my own greed and lost game 3 aswell...
Match 5: Jeskai Stoneblade i lost every game against TNN - didnt find ZP nor Deluge or Blessed Alliance...
Match 7: compensation for match 1 :tongue:
Match 9: Turbo Depths. he had always 2 needles either on Wasteland or on Karakas and at least 1-2 Safekeepers for his Marit Lage (that was too much to handle for me)
Match 10: Elves he had everything to overwhelm me with his doods (killed me game 2 after a ZP whiped 3/4 of his board...
Match 12: BR Reanimator hes on the Play and shows me Sire of Insanity turn 1 - Scoop - game 2 i won with Containment Priest and Surgical Extraction. game 3 he had Canceler and turn 2 Grisselbrand and Grave Titan.
Match 15: Red Prison Shows me Blood Moon Turn 1 on the Play - Scoop - Game two i have Basics but his army of double Rabble Master and Magus of the moon kills me asap.

notes on Maindeck:
straight Forward list - nothing special.
i tested tireless tracker and a voice of resurgance the day before the mainevent but i was not impressed by either of them so i cut them and add one of my 2 Abrupt Decays from SB to MB
then add blessed alliance to SB in that spot - good call!


notes sideboarding:
Abrupt Decay and Reclamation Sage were the most used SB Cards this Weekend.
least used SB Cards were Thoughtseize and Ethersworn Canonist (maybe i can change something here - additional Teeg instead of Canonist and maybe a PW (Giddeon))
Chokes were fine but not impressiv against the blue decks i played against (Grixis Delver)
Zealous Persecution was great!
Toxic was not necessary.
Blessed Alliance would be a great Card against my matchups but i didnt drew it.
Surcical Extraction was good.
Containment Priest did his Job against Reanimator

if you have any questions i will try to anwer them
thanks for reading
Skizz

[Dreadnaught33]

just found some time to write a little bit about GP Birmingham from last Weekend.

Mainboard:
2 Forrest
1 Plains
2 Savannah
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Gaeas Cradle
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs

1 Dryad Arbor
1 Noble Hierarch
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, GoT
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scrybranger
2 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Scavinging Ooze
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Renegade Rallier

4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Abrupt Decay
4 Green Suns Zenith
1 Umezawas Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sylvan Library

Sideboard:
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Containment Priest
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Thoughtseize
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Blessed Alliance
2 Choke

Games: 6/2 Day 1
1. U/R Delver 1:2 Loss
2. Grixis Delver 2:1 Win
3. Lands 2:1 Win
4. Grixis Delver 2:0 Win
5. Jeskai Stoneblade 1:2 Loss
6. Burn 2:0 Win
7. -no Show/bye- Win
8. Grixis Delver 2:0 Win

Games: 3/4 Day 2
9. Turbo Depths 1:2 Loss
10. Elves 0:2 Loss
11. ANT 2:1 Win
12. BR Reanimator 1:2 Loss
13. Nyx Fit 2:1 Win
14. Turbo Depths 2:1 Win
15. Red Prison 0:2 Loss

Overall 9:6

notes on matches:
Match 1: UR Delver - I had the win on board game 2 but throw it away due to my own greed and lost game 3 aswell...
Match 5: Jeskai Stoneblade i lost every game against TNN - didnt find ZP nor Deluge or Blessed Alliance...
Match 7: compensation for match 1 :tongue:
Match 9: Turbo Depths. he had always 2 needles either on Wasteland or on Karakas and at least 1-2 Safekeepers for his Marit Lage (that was too much to handle for me)
Match 10: Elves he had everything to overwhelm me with his doods (killed me game 2 after a ZP whiped 3/4 of his board...
Match 12: BR Reanimator hes on the Play and shows me Sire of Insanity turn 1 - Scoop - game 2 i won with Containment Priest and Surgical Extraction. game 3 he had Canceler and turn 2 Grisselbrand and Grave Titan.
Match 15: Red Prison Shows me Blood Moon Turn 1 on the Play - Scoop - Game two i have Basics but his army of double Rabble Master and Magus of the moon kills me asap.

notes on Maindeck:
straight Forward list - nothing special.
i tested tireless tracker and a voice of resurgance the day before the mainevent but i was not impressed by either of them so i cut them and add one of my 2 Abrupt Decays from SB to MB
then add blessed alliance to SB in that spot - good call!


notes sideboarding:
Abrupt Decay and Reclamation Sage were the most used SB Cards this Weekend.
least used SB Cards were Thoughtseize and Ethersworn Canonist (maybe i can change something here - additional Teeg instead of Canonist and maybe a PW (Giddeon))
Chokes were fine but not impressiv against the blue decks i played against (Grixis Delver)
Zealous Persecution was great!
Toxic was not necessary.
Blessed Alliance would be a great Card against my matchups but i didnt drew it.
Surcical Extraction was good.
Containment Priest did his Job against Reanimator

if you have any questions i will try to anwer them
thanks for reading
Skizz

-Thanks for the notes, all these TR are very helpful. Some questions:

Do you feel like we need containment priest? Powerful card, but limited application. Canonist is good but i can see having second teeg instead of her as you do. I always have to have Gideon myself, he's SUCH A HOUSE vs midrange and control.

Have you tried the Leo splash? I've liked playing him but I always go back and forth about whether or not we need him or if it's too greedy. Seems like you have probably messed with it if you've tested other things.

How was cradle without tracker? I feel like Tracker is always the best sink for that, but like you, I've been a bit unimpressed with tracker in maverick (though i love her in valuetown)

How was Rallier? another three drop i love but I'm too scared to play most of the time.

Thanks!

[Skizz]

-Thanks for the notes, all these TR are very helpful. Some questions:

Do you feel like we need containment priest? Powerful card, but limited application. Canonist is good but i can see having second teeg instead of her as you do. I always have to have Gideon myself, he's SUCH A HOUSE vs midrange and control.

Have you tried the Leo splash? I've liked playing him but I always go back and forth about whether or not we need him or if it's too greedy. Seems like you have probably messed with it if you've tested other things.

How was cradle without tracker? I feel like Tracker is always the best sink for that, but like you, I've been a bit unimpressed with tracker in maverick (though i love her in valuetown)

How was Rallier? another three drop i love but I'm too scared to play most of the time.

Thanks!
@Dreadnaught:
I love containment priest and think its worth 1 spot.
Its good against reanimator as well against dredge.
(I had a game against a dredge player at mkm rome where he cabal therapy blind for containment priest while there would be better cards in my hand (drs/gsz) next turn he played 2 silent gravestones and he told me that priest would be the only card that could beat him... i won either way...)
And there is show and tell sometimes.
When you can protect the priest with mother of runes its gg in these matchups.

I had a giddeon in sb before the mainevent but due to less expierience ive cut him again... but hes still one of my hot card to test more.

Indeed i tryed leo splash as well! It was good and i liked him. But the minimal downside of it is/was that we have to cut a basic forrest for tropical and at the nowadays meta with blood moons everywhere i want i little bit more chances to draw a basic in my opener... i think i will try him again at the next fnm's.

I use cradle for the big turns where you just flood the board with small cratures and equipment and go very far ahead.
Its just worth to play it when you have one around.

When renegade rallier first came out i played a lot with him and was not very impressed... some time later i gave him another chance and now i see him at a equal level to tracker.
Its just great when you can recour thalia,mother,drs,jitte,library,pridemage and all the other good silverbullets again.
I once played against a burn player where he kills 2 times my thalia.. then i got a 3rd from rallier and won because he spend too many resources on killing her.
I think that when i would not play rallier i would play 2nd pridemage in that spot.

[Zulabnar]

just found some time to write a little bit about GP Birmingham from last Weekend.



notes on matches:
Match 1: UR Delver - I had the win on board game 2 but throw it away due to my own greed and lost game 3 aswell...
Match 5: Jeskai Stoneblade i lost every game against TNN - didnt find ZP nor Deluge or Blessed Alliance...
Match 7: compensation for match 1 :tongue:
Match 9: Turbo Depths. he had always 2 needles either on Wasteland or on Karakas and at least 1-2 Safekeepers for his Marit Lage (that was too much to handle for me)
Match 10: Elves he had everything to overwhelm me with his doods (killed me game 2 after a ZP whiped 3/4 of his board...
Match 12: BR Reanimator hes on the Play and shows me Sire of Insanity turn 1 - Scoop - game 2 i won with Containment Priest and Surgical Extraction. game 3 he had Canceler and turn 2 Grisselbrand and Grave Titan.
Match 15: Red Prison Shows me Blood Moon Turn 1 on the Play - Scoop - Game two i have Basics but his army of double Rabble Master and Magus of the moon kills me asap.



Match 1: What do you mean? to many board?
Match 5: TNN -> lost is one of the greatest weekness of this deck
Match 9: That is pretty normal against combo
Match 10: That is pretty normal against combo
Match 12: 1 card scoop is one of the greatest weekness of this deck
Match 15: 1 card scoop is one of the greatest weekness of this deck


This is why this deck is not competitive, 1 card scoop, cannot slow down combo, cannot close the winning game.
Definitely we need to change something in the decklist.

[lavafrogg]

Match 1: What do you mean? to many board?
Match 5: TNN -> lost is one of the greatest weekness of this deck
Match 9: That is pretty normal against combo
Match 10: That is pretty normal against combo
Match 12: 1 card scoop is one of the greatest weekness of this deck
Match 15: 1 card scoop is one of the greatest weekness of this deck


This is why this deck is not competitive, 1 card scoop, cannot slow down combo, cannot close the winning game.
Definitely we need to change something in the decklist.


GW creature.dec does not have much interaction with Turn 0/1 decks and most likely never will and most of these turn 1 losses are crushed just by being on the play as opposed to the draw. A turn 1 sire loses(most likely) to a turn 1 mom or just a swords if you know what they are on. In the latter example, fetching basics stops blood moon from being effective, he just lost in the creature battle... which is not super common just unlucky.

The best we can do is play a Thalia turn 2 and go from there. I have beaten storm, sneak and show, reanimator, and most other fast combo deck with turn 2 Thalia and when she isn't good enough you can ask yourself if you want to play force of will and daze as opposed to Mom and KotR.

The actual take from this report is what happened in the UR Delver and Turbo Depths matchups(both just sound like the opponent had the nuts), as I find both of those very favorable for us. The Stoneblade matchup is pretty even and very draw and list dependent, especially with the number of pridemages/decays you play to keep equipment off the table.

@Skizz what list were you playing?

[Rascalyote]

Match 1: What do you mean? to many board?
Match 5: TNN -> lost is one of the greatest weekness of this deck
Match 9: That is pretty normal against combo
Match 10: That is pretty normal against combo
Match 12: 1 card scoop is one of the greatest weekness of this deck
Match 15: 1 card scoop is one of the greatest weekness of this deck


This is why this deck is not competitive, 1 card scoop, cannot slow down combo, cannot close the winning game.
Definitely we need to change something in the decklist.

Your last point is just so wrong, by your logic no deck without force of will is competitive as every other deck is able to die turn 1 on the draw (and even the force decks when they keep a hand w/o force about half of the time). This deck scoops to 1 card way-less often than other decks, we can beat cards other decks scoop to like bloodmoon, chalice, emrakul, etc. The deck does just fine competitive and so does DNT which suffers the same problems except it also doesn't have access to Thoughtseize and ZP.

Can't slow down combo? Thoughtseize, Thalia, etc etc. Speaking of '1 card scoop' ANT literally scoops to Gaddock Teeg, ANT is still a competitive deck.

We have a lot more outs to Turbo Depths match up than other decks, instead of push/bolt and decay we get to play plow and also have Karakas and Wasteland and Knight to go get them as well as other random garbage like Mother + Scryb Ranger, discard, Pridemage for needle etc. Yeah they have needle/discard/safekeeper, that's what makes the matchup interactive instead of being some Grixis deck and hoping your edict or Strix chump + Jace gets there.

[Skizz]

@Zulabnar:

Match 1: UR Delver: opp was on 4 life while i had double DR on board and some beaters - i could have easily won at my next round.
i was on 6 life.
i just should have used 1 DR to eat the only creature on the GY (Dryad Arbor) to gain 2 life on my turn- but instead i eat inst/sorc to have him lose 2 life on my turn...
he was cut on red but topdecked his only out - a fetchland - fetch, bolt / attack with TNN.. game over :(

Match 12 against UB Reanimator i mulliganed first game and scry'ed a STP on top of Library so first i would lost my hand and then lost STP....
i instantly scoop to this situation to not give him any information at all. was the best i could do. game 2 was an easy win and game 3 he had the nuts!

Match 15 against Red Prison: same situation - hes on the play and shows me blood moon, i draw card for the turn and had no basics / scoop to give no information.

this deck is very competitive - still beats the best deck in the format (grixis delver) - i even dont want the deck to be tier 1 :wink:

@Lavafrogg
Decklist is on the last page at the bottom.

i just wrote about the bad matches because the other were matches where maverick does what it does.

for example against the 3 grixis matches: turn 1 - DRS / turn 2 DRS+Mother / turn 3 whatever (knight/SFM/Thalia-Waste) Scrybranger with Equipment etc.
and had enough removal to kill every thread theyplayed instantly

i beat Lands because of DRS,Mother,Thalia,Knight,Wasteland,Cradle.
(i won last match because of following sitation (he only has an untapped Tabernacle and a horizon canopy at end of his turn. so im pretty safe he doesnt do anything on my turn.
on my upkeep i flashed in Scrybranger, activate Knight - fetch Gaeas Cradle, pay upkeep costs of tabernacle, bounce land->untap knight (waste my own cradle) and beat for 10 (lethal)

Burn does not have enough removal for my thalia and burn into face... at end of game 2 i have 6 nonbasics in hand and only 2 basics on the battlefield to be safe of PoP

against ANT he doesnt have any removal for my hatebears (Thalia and Gaddock Teeg)

nic fit was like hes always going 2+/1 every game with Deed but in the end some small creatures of mine won the beatdown.

Jeskai Stoneblade won on the back of TNN as i mentioned not drawing any -1-1 effects (had him locked under Choke etc./pridemage for batterskull etc.)

[IanCHarding]

Hello everyone i am new-ish to legacy i have played a few different strategies but find i like green creature decks the most. I was wondering if i can get some feedback on this list i put together after reading the primer.

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1109673#paper

Thank you

[Megadeus]

I usually find the depths match-up, like others, to be pretty good. Turn 2 Knight is tough to beat for them. Combine that with the possibility of crucible snake plus plow if they get a nut fast lage and you're fine. Just gotta play tight and not sloppy and the match up is favorable. This and True Name are why I am playing up to 3 blessed alliance in my current stone blade list

[Fatal]

Hello everyone i am new-ish to legacy i have played a few different strategies but find i like green creature decks the most. I was wondering if i can get some feedback on this list i put together after reading the primer.

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1109673#paper

Thank you

Manabase is to greedy and quite unreasonable, you running full SFM package which require land drop each turn to be effective, your list running:
14 green sources
13 white sources
4 colorless sources

basically only 20 lands which gives mana - that's to few, I strongly advice bump +1 land or even +2.

only 3 wastelands which should be your main plan - why only 3 ?

+1 Wasteland, + 1 Savannah/Canopy and deck should work much better.

When you constructing your manabase omit lands which doesn't give mana like:
DD combo or Maze.

Good point is to run Gaea's Cradle when running such a big Equip package - it gives an egde to cast equip (via SFM or normally) and attach in the same turn. It also works miracles with sink like Tireless Tracker.

About SB I would replace 1-2 Concil judgement for some Blessed Alliance, it works very well as a trick, life gain, and untargeting removal.

[IanCHarding]

Manabase is to greedy and quite unreasonable, you running full SFM package which require land drop each turn to be effective, your list running:
14 green sources
13 white sources
4 colorless sources

basically only 20 lands which gives mana - that's to few, I strongly advice bump +1 land or even +2.

only 3 wastelands which should be your main plan - why only 3 ?

+1 Wasteland, + 1 Savannah/Canopy and deck should work much better.

When you constructing your manabase omit lands which doesn't give mana like:
DD combo or Maze.

Good point is to run Gaea's Cradle when running such a big Equip package - it gives an egde to cast equip (via SFM or normally) and attach in the same turn. It also works miracles with sink like Tireless Tracker.

About SB I would replace 1-2 Concil judgement for some Blessed Alliance, it works very well as a trick, life gain, and untargeting removal.


Thank you for the advice i have updated the manabase and cut 1 SFM to add another land to the deck. i did add 1 Blessed Alliance to the SB. our area has a good amount of TNN deck running around so i like having ways to deal with it.
If i didn't want to buy a gaea's cradle do you have a recommendation on a different land to use? while I'm not trying to be 100% "budget" cradle is $400 which is a bit much for the amount of legacy I'd get to play.

Updated list for reference: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1109673#paper

[Fatal]

Thank you for the advice i have updated the manabase and cut 1 SFM to add another land to the deck. i did add 1 Blessed Alliance to the SB. our area has a good amount of TNN deck running around so i like having ways to deal with it.
If i didn't want to buy a gaea's cradle do you have a recommendation on a different land to use? while I'm not trying to be 100% "budget" cradle is $400 which is a bit much for the amount of legacy I'd get to play.

Updated list for reference: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1109673#paper

Unfortunately there is no replacement for Cradle, that's the reason why it's so expensive :-). It gives additional routes with KotR and explosive turn 2-3 if drawn.

I was little inspired by Lavafrogg and try to assamble SFM-less Maverick with huge CA. It's probably won't be competitive until Wizards print answer to TNN in green colors.. but I add Passage to pass-out that problem :-). Here is the list:


// 60 Maindeck
// 26 Creature
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Noble Hierarch
2 Lotus Cobra
4 Tireless Tracker
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Renegade Rallier
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Veteran Explorer
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth

// 4 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares

// 23 Land
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Forest
4 Wasteland
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Savannah
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
4 Windswept Heath
1 Karakas
1 Ghost Quarter

// 7 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Cabal Therapy


// 15 Sideboard
// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage

// 6 Instant
SB: 1 Crop Rotation
SB: 2 Abrupt Decay
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution
SB: 1 Blessed Alliance

// 2 Land
SB: 1 Rogue's Passage
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog

// 3 Planeswalker
SB: 2 Liliana, the Last Hope
SB: 1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar

// 3 Sorcery
SB: 3 Thoughtseize


I mostly focused on landfall engine and land recursion based: Veteran Explorer / Lotus Cobra / Renegade Railler / Knight of the Reliquary / Tireless Tracker / Titania, Protector of Argoth as finisher. Actually Failed due to too few removal MD.

Added also my favorite disruption to make useful from Railler and Dryad - Cabal Therapy. It's little nobo with Thalia..

[Megadeus]

The big thing in favor of cradle to me is that it let's you do the equipment thing quicker, and it let's you get aggressive with Knight finding wasteland but cradle still let's you cast things while you turn all of your other lands into stone rains

[lavafrogg]

Unfortunately there is no replacement for Cradle, that's the reason why it's so expensive :-). It gives additional routes with KotR and explosive turn 2-3 if drawn.

I was little inspired by Lavafrogg and try to assamble SFM-less Maverick with huge CA. It's probably won't be competitive until Wizards print answer to TNN in green colors.. but I add Passage to pass-out that problem :-). Here is the list:


// 60 Maindeck
// 26 Creature
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Noble Hierarch
2 Lotus Cobra
4 Tireless Tracker
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Renegade Rallier
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Veteran Explorer
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth

// 4 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares

// 23 Land
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Forest
4 Wasteland
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Savannah
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
4 Windswept Heath
1 Karakas
1 Ghost Quarter

// 7 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Cabal Therapy


// 15 Sideboard
// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage

// 6 Instant
SB: 1 Crop Rotation
SB: 2 Abrupt Decay
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution
SB: 1 Blessed Alliance

// 2 Land
SB: 1 Rogue's Passage
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog

// 3 Planeswalker
SB: 2 Liliana, the Last Hope
SB: 1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar

// 3 Sorcery
SB: 3 Thoughtseize


I mostly focused on landfall engine and land recursion based: Veteran Explorer / Lotus Cobra / Renegade Railler / Knight of the Reliquary / Tireless Tracker / Titania, Protector of Argoth as finisher. Actually Failed due to too few removal MD.

Added also my favorite disruption to make useful from Railler and Dryad - Cabal Therapy. It's little nobo with Thalia..

Equipment doubling as removal is one of the problems of cutting SFM. I feel like MoR would have made it less of an issue, why did you cut Mom?

I also would stay with he full 4 DRS before any other mana dorks, dude is good.

I love the Tracker/Rallier plan, I am just not sure how to make it viable. I think a deck with 4 crop rotations would work, but that is a little far from Maverick.

No love for Scryb Ranger?

[pettdan]

I was little inspired by Lavafrogg and try to assamble SFM-less Maverick with huge CA. It's probably won't be competitive until Wizards print answer to TNN in green colors.. but I add Passage to pass-out that problem :-).


In my experience, Titania can make TNN look quite silly. So there is that too.


I mostly focused on landfall engine and land recursion based: Veteran Explorer / Lotus Cobra / Renegade Railler / Knight of the Reliquary / Tireless Tracker / Titania, Protector of Argoth as finisher. Actually Failed due to too few removal MD.

Added also my favorite disruption to make useful from Railler and Dryad - Cabal Therapy. It's little nobo with Thalia..

Actually I've thought many times of how to make a low-CMC Nic Fit deck that has a sb-transformation plan into Maverick, but never figured out exactly how or why to do it. ;) Like, I don't want maindeck Cabal Therapies in Maverick, and in Nic Fit I don't want too many Wastelands, not that that is a big problem (they still tap for mana). After a very quick look, just to provide any feedback at all, I would move Veteran and Therapies to the board, skip Thoughtseizes in the board (you have hatebears and therapies, no need to play more interaction with combo than either Nic Fit or Maverick does separately), and like you say, bring in more removal maindeck. Probably 2 Decay. The Cobras seem unnecessary, and with the Ralliers there is so much ramp in the deck... You don't need all that ramp, better to be able to interact. A main advantage of Nic Fit is having access to Pernicious Deed, and you don't have that here so maybe add one copy or two to the board.

[lavafrogg]

I really like the Lotus Cobra/Rallier/Tracker engine, we just need something really good to ramp into. It might be worth exploring further as I still haven’t found a good alternative to SFM and equipment against fair or unfair decks.

[Valleysdai]

I really like the Lotus Cobra/Rallier/Tracker engine, we just need something really good to ramp into. It might be worth exploring further as I still haven’t found a good alternative to SFM and equipment against fair or unfair decks.

What about walking ballista? It's a mana sink and can provide good offence as well as defence

[Fatal]

Equipment doubling as removal is one of the problems of cutting SFM. I feel like MoR would have made it less of an issue, why did you cut Mom?

I also would stay with he full 4 DRS before any other mana dorks, dude is good.

I love the Tracker/Rallier plan, I am just not sure how to make it viable. I think a deck with 4 crop rotations would work, but that is a little far from Maverick.

No love for Scryb Ranger?

MoR, Ooze, Scryb, which I missed most and probably bring back was to make room for new toys.

I like idea for Nic Fit package on sb vet plus cabals on sb. And bringing back Scryb and more Mana dorks from maverick. Deed is nobo this deck boardpresent a lot. We also don't need any more bombs then Titania. Tracker is enough Mana sink.

[lavafrogg]

Would post more but on a bad stretch.

After a 15-2 run I have gone 2-5 in my last 2 this week.

The wife is 6-2 with elves in the same span so that is a positive.

[Valleysdai]

Would post more but on a bad stretch.

After a 15-2 run I have gone 2-5 in my last 2 this week.

The wife is 6-2 with elves in the same span so that is a positive.

Has the meta game been roughly the same since your 15-2 run?

[lavafrogg]

Has the meta game been roughly the same since your 15-2 run?

No, that’s pretty much the issue.

I was beating Delver, Aluren, Depths, BUG.dec and Eldrazi.

I lost to Junk, NicFit, the mirror, elves and a black white homebrew with maindeck deluge and gloom!

My list is tuned for the blue decks in the world....

[Valleysdai]

No, that’s pretty much the issue.

I was beating Delver, Aluren, Depths, BUG.dec and Eldrazi.

I lost to Junk, NicFit, the mirror, elves and a black white homebrew with maindeck deluge and gloom!

My list is tuned for the blue decks in the world....

Are you thinking of any changes to adjust to this new meta? It may be worth having more creature hate main.

What were your wins against?

[oSeabass]

Returning after a long hiatus. Haven’t sleeved up MAV since around the time Renegade Rallier was coming out. I’m looking for a standard “stock” list to start with. I know the deck can be customized a lot for player preference but is the standard shell still the same? DRS, Kotr, Mom, Thalia, hate ish bears (Teeg, Qasali, Scooze, Scryb, etc).

Is Punishing Maverick better positioned well? I’m seeing more Lands Tubro Depths in-line, so I’m thinking Abzan straightforward is best. Didn’t know if any crazy new tech has come up in the last ~5-6 sets or so.

[lavafrogg]

Are you thinking of any changes to adjust to this new meta? It may be worth having more creature hate main.

What were your wins against?

I don’t think it is a new meta, just a bad run. I beat Eldrazi and Miracles, so my list is doing what it is supposed to do. It is just really hard to play at all ends of the spectrum.

I imagine if I was going to play at the same place against the same decks, I would just pickup Punishing Mav or Loam to go over the top of the grind with fires.

[Valleysdai]

Went 4-0 at the local fnm even though I played appallingly.

My matches were:

BW good stuff 2-1
MUD 2-1
Elves 2-0
Lands 2-1

I had traded 2 abrupt decay to a friend so had 2 random cards in the main (lotus cobra and beast within).

The most memorable match was against elves (piloted by one of my good friends):

Game 1: I get turn 2 cobra into fetch t3 new Thalia (keeping fetch uncracked). He cast hoof and swung for 10, I double cropped for DD combo and after the first crop rotation he asked if he was dead haha.

Game 2: he kept decaying my guys, until I only have a deathrite in play with 3 Lands, I play bog leaving 3 untapped, he swings with 2 arbors and a visionary, I cast beast within on my bog and kill the visionary (he was so surprised haha). Then zealous persecutioned him after he GSZ'd for a wirewood symbiote.

If you want further match details/deck list I'm more than happy to supply them

[p01ng]

Hey all, put the deck together back in April and played some friendlies for a while to get a feel for the deck. Last week finally took it to the weekly and went 2-1, beating Infect, Turbo Depths, and punting to Tin Fin Depths.

Deck is an absolute blast (Excavator + Wasteland is simply disgusting). I usually play some sort of combo deck, so this is refreshing. Just wanted to throw out my list and see if anyone has any critiques and/or general sideboarding advice.


// Creatures (25)
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Mother of Runes
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar

// Spells (8)
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

// Artifacts (3)
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull

// Enchantments (1)
1 Sylvan Library

// Lands (23)
2 Bayou
1 Forest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Maze of Ith
1 Plains
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath

// Sideboard (15)
2 Surgical Extraction
3 Thoughtseize
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Zealous Persecution
2 Choke
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons

// 75 Cards Total


I started with Stage + DD because, as I said, I love combo, but it was way too clunky drawing one or the other. Maze and Cradle feel way better in majority of situations. Light and Shadow is there because we get a lot of D&T on the weekends, but weeknights we don't so I swap it for a ScOoze, which I liked. Titania seems pretty sick especially with Excavator so I may try that out. Depending on the night/meta I may put Tracker into THC's slot rather than having both; I feel she's a waste of a sideboard slot and should be main if running at all.

[lavafrogg]

Hey all, put the deck together back in April and played some friendlies for a while to get a feel for the deck. Last week finally took it to the weekly and went 2-1, beating Infect, Turbo Depths, and punting to Tin Fin Depths.

Deck is an absolute blast (Excavator + Wasteland is simply disgusting). I usually play some sort of combo deck, so this is refreshing. Just wanted to throw out my list and see if anyone has any critiques and/or general sideboarding advice.


// Creatures (25)
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Mother of Runes
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar

// Spells (8)
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

// Artifacts (3)
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull

// Enchantments (1)
1 Sylvan Library

// Lands (23)
2 Bayou
1 Forest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Maze of Ith
1 Plains
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath

// Sideboard (15)
2 Surgical Extraction
3 Thoughtseize
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Zealous Persecution
2 Choke
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons

// 75 Cards Total


I started with Stage + DD because, as I said, I love combo, but it was way too clunky drawing one or the other. Maze and Cradle feel way better in majority of situations. Light and Shadow is there because we get a lot of D&T on the weekends, but weeknights we don't so I swap it for a ScOoze, which I liked. Titania seems pretty sick especially with Excavator so I may try that out. Depending on the night/meta I may put Tracker into THC's slot rather than having both; I feel she's a waste of a sideboard slot and should be main if running at all.

I am playing 3 THC in this current meta and she is bonkers against the DRS/blue decks.

First strike gets her past Strix and chump blockers, Karakas saves her from removal and her ability is crippling to 8fetch.deck that are everywhere. Kind of like a white blood moon in some aspects, especially with Wasteland+Excavator.

[Valleysdai]

I am playing 3 THC in this current meta and she is bonkers against the DRS/blue decks.

First strike gets her past Strix and chump blockers, Karakas saves her from removal and her ability is crippling to 8fetch.deck that are everywhere. Kind of like a white blood moon in some aspects, especially with Wasteland+Excavator.

Don't forget that she is one of the best main deck threats we have against elves

[Dreadnaught33]

I am playing 3 THC in this current meta and she is bonkers against the DRS/blue decks.

First strike gets her past Strix and chump blockers, Karakas saves her from removal and her ability is crippling to 8fetch.deck that are everywhere. Kind of like a white blood moon in some aspects, especially with Wasteland+Excavator.

i love big thalia but how the heck do you fit 3 in the deck? do you still play any other 3 drops besides knight? (ramunap, tracker, leo..etc) do you cut Stoneforge? Curious how you pull it off honestly.

Different subject- has anyone done serious testing with shalai? She just seems so fun and although costly, powerful.

[Megadeus]

i love big thalia but how the heck do you fit 3 in the deck? do you still play any other 3 drops besides knight? (ramunap, tracker, leo..etc) do you cut Stoneforge? Curious how you pull it off honestly.

Different subject- has anyone done serious testing with shalai? She just seems so fun and although costly, powerful.
I played three to decent success. It was pre excavator though. Card is so good on turn 2 it wins games

[lavafrogg]

i love big thalia but how the heck do you fit 3 in the deck? do you still play any other 3 drops besides knight? (ramunap, tracker, leo..etc) do you cut Stoneforge? Curious how you pull it off honestly.

Different subject- has anyone done serious testing with shalai? She just seems so fun and although costly, powerful.

White Staples(11)
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar

SFM Package(4)
2 SFM
1 Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

Green Staples(8)
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Knight of the Reliquary

GSZ Targets(6)
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Ranumap Excavator
1 Dryad Arbor

Spells(8)
4 Green Sun’s Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

Lands(23)
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Maze of Ith
1 Gaea’s Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas

Sideboard
3 Thoughtsieze
2 Canonist/containment priest/damping sphere/Prelate
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Choke
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Blessed Alliance

Current list.

Ghost Quarter has been in and out for a fetch, but hasn’t really done anything. I love SFM and would play 4 if I had room, the first card I would cut would be the Excavator, as she just does a really good job of shutting the door in games we are ahead, or grinding out games when the opponent has run out of gas(which SFM also does).

[Valleysdai]

...

Ghost Quarter has been in and out for a fetch, but hasn’t really done anything.

For me ghost quart has been huge, there are 3 scenarios that it does well with:

1 - it can be used if your opponent needles/spyglasses wasteland (or if you ran out of wasteland). This allowed me to shut off an opponent and win the match.

2 - it can fix your mana (providing you have some number of basics)

3 - it can grow a knight with a double pump (ghost quarter your own land)

[menloe]

i love big thalia but how the heck do you fit 3 in the deck? do you still play any other 3 drops besides knight? (ramunap, tracker, leo..etc) do you cut Stoneforge? Curious how you pull it off honestly.

Different subject- has anyone done serious testing with shalai? She just seems so fun and although costly, powerful.

I'd feel fine cutting SFM honestly.

[NegatorITA]

https://manastack.com/deck/maverik-18
After a long time away from maverik, this is what I want to try out,
my only concern is if I should drop something in the sideboard for more hate for GY strategies, but I'm unsure how one or two slots can make the difference.:eyebrow:

[Skizz]

yesterday it was time to try some weired shit and i had a lot of fun and sucsess with following list on our playgroup:
of course it needs a bit of fine tuning.. but it was better then expected :tongue:

1 Forrest
1 Plains
3 Savannah
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Tropical Island
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wasteland
1 Karakas
1 Cradle
1 Roges Passage

4 Shaman
3 Hierarch
1 Bird
4 Mother
1 Teeg
2 Pridemage
3 Tracker
3 Thalia Heretic
2 Leovold
1 Steel Leaf Champion
1 Mirri, Weatherlight Duelist
2 Shalai
1 Gisela

4 Zenith
4 StP
1 Crop Rotation

made ONLY preboard games against czech pile 10/0 :eek:, grixis delver 3/0 enchantress 3/5 and 2/1 ub faeries

[Valleysdai]

made ONLY preboard games against czech pile 10/0 :eek:, grixis delver 3/0 enchantress 3/5 and 2/1 ub faeries

Any stand out cards against those decks that you were surprised about?

[Fatal]

Made quite tunned version of SFMless Maverick, including advices from last scratch:

// 60 Maindeck
// 26 Creature
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Noble Hierarch
2 Lotus Cobra
3 Tireless Tracker
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Renegade Rallier
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Scavenging Ooze

// 1 Enchantment
1 Sylvan Library

// 6 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Abrupt Decay

// 23 Land
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Forest
4 Wasteland
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Savannah
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
4 Windswept Heath
1 Karakas
1 Ghost Quarter

// 4 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith


// 15 Sideboard
// 2 Creature
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 1 Veteran Explorer

// 5 Instant
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 Blessed Alliance
SB: 1 Surgical Extraction

// 2 Land
SB: 1 Rogue's Passage
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog

// 2 Planeswalker
SB: 2 Liliana, the Last Hope

// 4 Sorcery
SB: 2 Thoughtseize
SB: 2 Cabal Therapy


Important changes:
Vet/Cabal in SB with Cabal T.Size split. Functional 2 drops back (Scryb + Ooze) to MD, added 2x Abrupt Decay MD. Added an other 5cmc drops since this deck ramp a lot with Cobra / Railler so you fact can GSZ for 5.

SB focused on grindy games. 5 Answers to TNN, can be reassambled if you don't like for example LotH.

Deck is very well equipped vs Moon decks thanks to one Vet in SB and 4 (!) Basics.

[haganbmj]

yesterday it was time to try some weired shit and i had a lot of fun and sucsess with following list on our playgroup:
of course it needs a bit of fine tuning.. but it was better then expected :tongue:

1 Forrest
1 Plains
3 Savannah
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Tropical Island
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wasteland
1 Karakas
1 Cradle
1 Roges Passage

4 Shaman
3 Hierarch
1 Bird
4 Mother
1 Teeg
2 Pridemage
3 Tracker
3 Thalia Heretic
2 Leovold
1 Steel Leaf Champion
1 Mirri, Weatherlight Duelist
2 Shalai
1 Gisela

4 Zenith
4 StP
1 Crop Rotation

made ONLY preboard games against czech pile 10/0 :eek:, grixis delver 3/0 enchantress 3/5 and 2/1 ub faeries

Bizarre list. 8 mana dorks, no thalia guardian, no knight, quad 4-drops. I might have to experiment with that top end you've got there.

[Skizz]

@haganbmj & @valeisdey

normally i play a typical list - but i wanted to test something new (like here - a few cards i would normally not play at tournaments)
also wanted to test more trackers in the spot of knight of the reliquary.

first wanted to play with vial... but in the end GSZ is just what its all about.
"it is some kind of reid duke bug list / but in maverick style..."

- turn 1 Manadork into any of the 3-drops were a must answer for them.
- with 28 creatures i always had enough stuff to blank removal
- missing small thalias not that much in that fun build (played against ANT as well about 6 games preboard - Teeg turn 2 or shalai turn 3 was enough 3/3 in the end)
- board states with leo, shalai and mother of runes were incredible
- steel leaf champion was just a 3 turn clock with muliple exalted effects (and "fly" over strix/drs etc.)
- i have to try mirri against elves/creature decks more - "could" be good...
- the crop rotation, if drawn was always used to get cradle or passage
- shalai is great so far
- Gisela is bananas with exalted (tryed her because miranda keith mentioned it..)

cons so far:
- turn 1 mother of runes was not (so) good because i had to wait 2 turns to be able to get a cc-3 creature on board.
- only 2 pridemage against equipment (have to use them well)
- no equipment for our own
- much 2 thoughness creatures (punishing fire could be a real problem)
- challice on 1 could be a huge problem as well

- dont know how good/bad it is against moon decks - but with that many dorks it can make some work.

maybe bring in 2 Decay in MB instead of Mirri/something else

i have no sideboard figured out yet
would probably contain 2 blessed alliance, celestrial purge, decays, rec sage, persecution, etc...

[Skizz]

@Fatal: great list:smile: (have to get a Titania for my own)
i tested 3 lotus cobras / 2 Rallier some months ago (turn two cobra/rallier/XXX (Leovold) were great but this happens only every 10 games (round about)
lotus cobra is a great card - but in testing i was not 100% on it (unfortunate)

[Fatal]

@Fatal: great list:smile: (have to get a Titania for my own)
i tested 3 lotus cobras / 2 Rallier some months ago (turn two cobra/rallier/XXX (Leovold) were great but this happens only every 10 games (round about)
lotus cobra is a great card - but in testing i was not 100% on it (unfortunate)

Thank You for good word! I was seeking good green 2 CMC drop which force opponent removal similar to SFM, Cobra was good enough if not answered you can chain it turn 2 with some 3CMC drop if you have fetchland, more over if not answered in time it's easy to GSZ for sigarda or Titania which put you a lot ahead and at least it's very good engine with tracker where you pay for clue only 1 Mana.

It's great tempo boost if not answered, but it require also draw engine for Mana to keep gaining ahead that tempo all game.

[Valleysdai]

Thank You for good word! I was seeking good green 2 CMC drop which force opponent removal similar to SFM, Cobra was good enough if not answered you can chain it turn 2 with some 3CMC drop if you have fetchland, more over if not answered in time it's easy to GSZ for sigarda or Titania which put you a lot ahead and at least it's very good engine with tracker where you pay for clue only 1 Mana.

It's great tempo boost if not answered, but it require also draw engine for Mana to keep gaining ahead that tempo all game.

With lotus cobra would you say that it usually flies under the radar of the opponent's removal? I had it once and it does win games (especially with crop rotation).

[Fatal]

Actually Lotus Cobra if you have fetchland is mostly cost effective even if killed right away:
Simply math - you cast it for 2 mana, and regain 1 mana instantly, all removal (except snuff out and conditional submerge) cost not less then 1 mana so it's even.

Update:

played against tuned version of miracles and it was terrible experience. Even with drawing 8 cards from two trackers and ignoring B2B with 4 basics including swamp, I finally couldn't end the game. Couldn't answer Jace, after terminus, protected Teeg was whipped by Council's Judgment, then Sigarda was whipped by second Council's Judgment, after two Supreme Verdicts and another terminuses I started to not having gas. After stream of StP reused with snappy I finally lost.

Game was vs my old friend so we compare decks after. 2CJ, 2 Supreme Verdicts, 3 Terminuses, 4 StP he draw very good but I don't think that creature base deck can win against 4+ wrath effects and 4 point removal with snapcasters. Red splash has pyroblasts which kills Jace very easy, black doesn't have similar. I thinking about Council's Judgment in multiple to resolve this problem.

On the other side of this version became popular we can always pack more chokes on sb which works perfectly after for example verdict. Finally deck with so many dead cards are very soft to combo.

[Valleysdai]

Red splash has pyroblasts which kills Jace very easy, black doesn't have similar. I thinking about Council's Judgment in multiple to resolve this problem.

Black has one answer and green has a few all of which are diverse:

Maelstrom pulse
Beast within
Etc.

Those 2 I've been playtesting and beast within does work because it can be used aggressively and defensively.
Maelstrom pulse is also useful when I've drawn it (hasn't been that often sadly).

[Poron]

Black has To the Slaughter

[Fatal]

Sure we can always use only other 3cmc permanent removal but it's Hugh tempo lost compared to pyroblasts/reb.most time you won't have Mana to cast thread and kill Jace in the same turn.

[Valleysdai]

Sure we can always use only other 3cmc permanent removal but it's Hugh tempo lost compared to pyroblasts/reb.most time you won't have Mana to cast thread and kill Jace in the same turn.

Quite a few lists dont run red. Like mine is dark blue maverick.

Also pyroblast & REB are very situational. Don't get me wrong, I love those effects (I used to play painter and now have Dragon stompy).

[Poron]

Sure we can always use only other 3cmc permanent removal but it's Hugh tempo lost compared to pyroblasts/reb.most time you won't have Mana to cast thread and kill Jace in the same turn.

Jace decks normally don’t have a clock at all so you can lose a turn to get rid of their worst threath.

I also suggest a Thrun against them. Miracle has only 3 cards to remove a Thrun (Terminus) and he keeps on coming back via GSZ

So: Thrun or TtS can be both good answers against Jace decks.

[Fatal]

Jace decks normally don’t have a clock at all so you can lose a turn to get rid of their worst threath.

I also suggest a Thrun against them. Miracle has only 3 cards to remove a Thrun (Terminus) and he keeps on coming back via GSZ

So: Thrun or TtS can be both good answers against Jace decks.

I faced Miracles which has 3 terminus, 2 Verdicts, 2 Council Judgement so Trun is a joke vs them - 7 answers (2 conditional).

[MechTactical]

There’s always song of the dryads + vesuva to get you’re own jace or what not on the board. Though, I imagine one needs crop to reliably get the combo.

[lavafrogg]

Guys I need moral support.

I usually play either Maverick or Aggro Loam in 8 week legacy leagues...

But I have been playing BG slow Depths and RW Taxes lately. The next league starts soon, what should I do?!?!

[Valleysdai]

Guys I need moral support.

I usually play either Maverick or Aggro Loam in 8 week legacy leagues...

But I have been playing BG slow Depths and RW Taxes lately. The next league starts soon, what should I do?!?!

What deck do you feel more comfortable with?

What do you think the meta will be?

[Fatal]

Guys I need moral support.

I usually play either Maverick or Aggro Loam in 8 week legacy leagues...

But I have been playing BG slow Depths and RW Taxes lately. The next league starts soon, what should I do?!?!

Think about meta and odds, if predicted meta is full of lands, D&T and miracles don't play slow depths it's unfavourable. If you predict more 4c and other Bg decks without white try Slow Depths.

Vs miracles Mavericks is still probably best choose from those three decks, second is Aggro loam, but vs that new version with 2 B2B it can be hard, on the other hand you can lock them with fast chalice, which they need to remove with CJ or disenchant.

If predicted meta will be more grixis delver, Aggro loam will be one of the best choose, even after about when they pack Abrade, just have answer vs Angler and everything will be quite easy.

Maverick is still one of the most tuneable deck, so you can adjust it to predicted meta, all thanks to nonlinear. Depths are too linear in my opinion seen too many unwinnable situations, more over slow depths loses the biggest advantage which Turbo depths had - speed which could be useful in matches against combo or semi-combo like burn. I still think R/G lands is best dark depths shell, it has speed thanks to exploration/manabond, good late with loam and cycling lands with punishing engine, and tutors with gamble and crop to answer problems.

That's probably all. Hope I help a little.

[lavafrogg]

Think about meta and odds, if predicted meta is full of lands, D&T and miracles don't play slow depths it's unfavourable. If you predict more 4c and other Bg decks without white try Slow Depths.

Vs miracles Mavericks is still probably best choose from those three decks, second is Aggro loam, but vs that new version with 2 B2B it can be hard, on the other hand you can lock them with fast chalice, which they need to remove with CJ or disenchant.

If predicted meta will be more grixis delver, Aggro loam will be one of the best choose, even after about when they pack Abrade, just have answer vs Angler and everything will be quite easy.

Maverick is still one of the most tuneable deck, so you can adjust it to predicted meta, all thanks to nonlinear. Depths are too linear in my opinion seen too many unwinnable situations, more over slow depths loses the biggest advantage which Turbo depths had - speed which could be useful in matches against combo or semi-combo like burn. I still think R/G lands is best dark depths shell, it has speed thanks to exploration/manabond, good late with loam and cycling lands with punishing engine, and tutors with gamble and crop to answer problems.

That's probably all. Hope I help a little.

You guys are awesome.

Last 2 leagues I have played:

3 Elves
2 DnT
1 Infect
2 Delver
1 storm
2 Depths
3 Grixis
1 Czech
1 UW Stoneblade
1 Merfolk

The meta is fairly fine, his is just what I have been matched up against.

I have played AggroLoam for half and Maverick for half.

The real problem is that I have been trying to play more “real” decks as I have been playing more and more lately. I am super comfortable with Maverick and have been trying to contribute to the community....I’m really just answering my own question.

I guess what I should be asking is: a tier deck of Maverick? Pet deck vs meta....

[Fatal]

You guys are awesome.

Last 2 leagues I have played:

3 Elves
2 DnT
1 Infect
2 Delver
1 storm
2 Depths
3 Grixis
1 Czech
1 UW Stoneblade
1 Merfolk

The meta is fairly fine, his is just what I have been matched up against.

I have played AggroLoam for half and Maverick for half.
[...]

I guess what I should be asking is: a tier deck of Maverick? Pet deck vs meta....
Maverick is probably tier 2/3 deck if we can define tiers it still has 2-3% of meta.

Those delver in meta are in which colors? Does grixis are controls or tempo decks with delvers?
Simple meta analysis


17 total decks.
7 combo decks (1 storm, 3 elves)
9 decks with wasteland ( if grixis are tempo ) - more then half.
2 real slow control with Mass removal MD
3 decks with swords to plowshares
8 decks without removal MD good for Bob
12 creatures decks
3 decks with high artifact density
2 decks + grixis ? With TNN


Aggro loam looks quite pormising in this meta, alternative is Punishing Maverick. Black variant require dedicated hate against elves and D&T.
Not too many StP decks but quite a lot of wasteland decks, so DD isn't best choose. Grixis and 4c run nowadays edict effects.

[lavafrogg]

Maverick is probably tier 2/3 deck if we can define tiers it still has 2-3% of meta.

Those delver in meta are in which colors? Does grixis are controls or tempo decks with delvers?
Simple meta analysis


17 total decks.
7 combo decks (1 storm, 3 elves)
9 decks with wasteland ( if grixis are tempo ) - more then half.
2 real slow control with Mass removal MD
3 decks with swords to plowshares
8 decks without removal MD good for Bob
12 creatures decks
3 decks with high artifact density
2 decks + grixis ? With TNN


Aggro loam looks quite pormising in this meta, alternative is Punishing Maverick. Black variant require dedicated hate against elves and D&T.
Not too many StP decks but quite a lot of wasteland decks, so DD isn't best choose. Grixis and 4c run nowadays edict effects.

I have top 8’d with Aggro Loam in the first season and missed my win and in on the second with maverick. So the meta is open to either strategy. Not a lot of Kologans Commands so SFM is live most of the time.

I am currently between Maverick and Slow Depths at this point. I feel really good about the Depths vs Wasteland matchup, including DnT as they can’t really stop the grind plan.

Punishing Fire does wreck most of the format though..... maybe Punishing Mav is the best choice?

[Rascalyote]

Maverick is probably tier 2/3 deck if we can define tiers it still has 2-3% of meta.

Those delver in meta are in which colors? Does grixis are controls or tempo decks with delvers?
Simple meta analysis


17 total decks.
7 combo decks (1 storm, 3 elves)
9 decks with wasteland ( if grixis are tempo ) - more then half.
2 real slow control with Mass removal MD
3 decks with swords to plowshares
8 decks without removal MD good for Bob
12 creatures decks
3 decks with high artifact density
2 decks + grixis ? With TNN


Aggro loam looks quite pormising in this meta, alternative is Punishing Maverick. Black variant require dedicated hate against elves and D&T.
Not too many StP decks but quite a lot of wasteland decks, so DD isn't best choose. Grixis and 4c run nowadays edict effects.

On your last point- most of the times were getting DD it means we have active knight which would beat both edict and wasteland (take an extra turn to wasteland theirs)

@frog seeing as you are asking this in the maverick thread Id assume you like this the most out of your options, so play that =p

[lavafrogg]

On your last point- most of the times were getting DD it means we have active knight which would beat both edict and wasteland (take an extra turn to wasteland theirs)

@frog seeing as you are asking this in the maverick thread Id assume you like this the most out of your options, so play that =p

Lower “tier” decks have much better random conversation. I am also primarily a Maverick player.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

As soon as Noble Hierarch is reprinted again and doesn't cost a billion dollars, I'll be joining the Maverick Club, as I feel there are potential metagames on the horizon where this is the better choice compared to DnT, where I am currently spending my time.

Is it too greedy to play Leovold? I've seen some lists play it and it seems good, but I have no context.

[Skizz]

@Bee - you can always exchange a Tropical Island for a Forrest and play Leovold.
in the most matchups GSZ x=3 for Kinght is often better than Leovold
but against Decks like Evles or Control and Cantrip-decks Leo is better to GSZ first.

sad thing about the blue splash is there are no good sideboard cards we could use as well to get some value of our blue sources.
at least i did not find any mentionable ones (Meddling Mage, Blueblast, Trygon Predator...)

[Valleysdai]

As soon as Noble Hierarch is reprinted again and doesn't cost a billion dollars, I'll be joining the Maverick Club, as I feel there are potential metagames on the horizon where this is the better choice compared to DnT, where I am currently spending my time.

Is it too greedy to play Leovold? I've seen some lists play it and it seems good, but I have no context.

Hey, as a new maverick player I can happily say that you don't need nobles, birds of paradise is better and can be used for blocking giant 20/20s (all day if you have a few mother of runes out.

I am currently on the blue splash for leovold and he is bonkers. He can shut down so many decks and is slight protection against wasteland effects.

With regards to the lack of blue side board cards I found one that I will be testing out, fumble. It could break the grindiness of the mirror match as well as work against several other decks (dnt, stobeblade, deathblade, etc).

[Secretly.A.Bee]

What's your list look like?

[cheerios]

I just built GWb recently and play tested against grixis delver. Is grixis delver a bad match up? All my creatures just die post board and I just lose to tnn or delver. It also looks like decay is not that good. It can be hard to cast sometimes. Any tips?

[lavafrogg]

I just built GWb recently and play tested against grixis delver. Is grixis delver a bad match up? All my creatures just die post board and I just lose to tnn or delver. It also looks like decay is not that good. It can be hard to cast sometimes. Any tips?

What’s your list?

I feel like most Delver lists are heavily favored for the Maverick player.

[cheerios]

I'm using a stock GWb list but used Last hope instead choke and has 2 persecutions. I'm putting choke back in. Based from experience, delver has too much spot removal for all my creatures. Do you have GWb list?

[Valleysdai]

What's your list look like?

My current iteration of the list is:

Lands
4 wasteland
4 windswept heath
1 karakas
1 swamp
1 forest
1 plains
1 scrubland
1 bayou
1 savannah
1 tropical island
1 sejiri steppe
1 marsh flats
1 ghost quarter
1 dark depths
1 verdant catacombs
1 dryad arbor
1 maze of ith
1 thespian stage
1 bojuka bog

Creatures
1 birds of paradise
4 deathrite shaman
4 mother of runes
1 qasali pridemage
1 gaddock teeg
2 Thalia, guardian of thraben
1 scavenging ooze
1 lotus cobra
1 scryb ranger
1 tireless tracker
1 leovold
1 Thalia, heretic cathar
1 ramunap excavator
4 knight of the reliquary

Spells
3 crop rotation
3 green Sun's zenith
3 swords to plowshares
1 sylvan library
1 abrupt decay
1 maelstrom pulse
1 beast within

Sideboard
2 thoughtseize
1 surgical extraction
1 containment priest
3 leyline of the void
1 reclamation sage
1 toxic deluge
2 zealous persecution
1 choke
2 ethersworn canonist
1 sanctum prelate

I am currently testing numbers out and may try 1 fumble in the side

[oSeabass]

My current iteration of the list is:

Lands
4 wasteland
4 windswept heath
1 karakas
1 swamp
1 forest
1 plains
1 scrubland
1 bayou
1 savannah
1 tropical island
1 sejiri steppe
1 marsh flats
1 ghost quarter
1 dark depths
1 verdant catacombs
1 dryad arbor
1 maze of ith
1 thespian stage
1 bojuka bog

Creatures
1 birds of paradise
4 deathrite shaman
4 mother of runes
1 qasali pridemage
1 gaddock teeg
2 Thalia, guardian of thraben
1 scavenging ooze
1 lotus cobra
1 scryb ranger
1 tireless tracker
1 leovold
1 Thalia, heretic cathar
1 ramunap excavator
4 knight of the reliquary

Spells
3 crop rotation
3 green Sun's zenith
3 swords to plowshares
1 sylvan library
1 abrupt decay
1 maelstrom pulse
1 beast within

Sideboard
2 thoughtseize
1 surgical extraction
1 containment priest
3 leyline of the void
1 reclamation sage
1 toxic deluge
2 zealous persecution
1 choke
2 ethersworn canonist
1 sanctum prelate

I am currently testing numbers out and may try 1 fumble in the side

Does stretching into 4 colors for Leovold play nicely with the Dark Depths package, especially with a Maze in there too? I feel like this would be kinda be weak to Wasteland on our colors, unless you have an active BoP or DRS online. If I was playing the mirror against this, I would Wasteland colored mana like crazy and STP any mana source.

[Valleysdai]

Does stretching into 4 colors for Leovold play nicely with the Dark Depths package, especially with a Maze in there too? I feel like this would be kinda be weak to Wasteland on our colors, unless you have an active BoP or DRS online. If I was playing the mirror against this, I would Wasteland colored mana like crazy and STP any mana source.

I run the 3 basics just to protect against wastelands, there are admittedly only 12 coloured sources but I've gone against wasteland decks and because I've got a basic forest, swamp and plains I can cast all cards that I need to.

Crop rotation and ghost quarter help to neutralise the effects of wasteland.

I genuinely haven't found any issue with the 4 coloured mana base alongside the non mana producing lands. Thespian stage can act as another basic.

The only issue I have with my lands is that I keep drawing my sejiri steppe haha.

If you are killing/exiling my dorks it would be more beneficial to me due to there being less removal for my other creatures (especially with active mother of runes).

[delfam]

Thoughts on these two new cards spoiled today:

https://i.redd.it/0p1josxpyy411.png

https://i.redd.it/5lur9g2tyy411.png

The green one seems great vs 4C Leovold. Snapcaster is really the only thing that can block it and that's just a chump. They basically have no way to kill it unless they have Deluge. 5 Damage a turn is a pretty big clock and it's tutorable with GSZ which is nice. 4 CMC is a lot and it's only really good in this 1 matchup but could see some play.

The black one is Zealous Persecution on a stick which is nice, however BB is going to be hard to cast and it not being GSZ is a minus. Probably just worse than Zealous TBH.

[Valleysdai]

Thoughts on these two new cards spoiled today:

https://i.redd.it/0p1josxpyy411.png

https://i.redd.it/5lur9g2tyy411.png

The green one seems great vs 4C Leovold. Snapcaster is really the only thing that can block it and that's just a chump. They basically have no way to kill it unless they have Deluge. 5 Damage a turn is a pretty big clock and it's tutorable with GSZ which is nice. 4 CMC is a lot and it's only really good in this 1 matchup but could see some play.

The black one is Zealous Persecution on a stick which is nice, however BB is going to be hard to cast and it not being GSZ is a minus. Probably just worse than Zealous TBH.



Not sure on the green one. But to me the black one I don't think there is any point considering. If we compare it to zealous persecution it's pro's and con's are:

Pro
- creature
- only opponent's creatures get -1/-1

Cons
- double black
- sorcery speed
- zealous persecution pumps our guys
- no haste

[lavafrogg]

Not sure on the green one. But to me the black one I don't think there is any point considering. If we compare it to zealous persecution it's pro's and con's are:

Pro
- creature
- only opponent's creatures get -1/-1

Cons
- double black
- sorcery speed
- zealous persecution pumps our guys
- no haste

+1 for the vinemare if you are playing SFM+equipment. Might not be better than Thrun but still worth looking at.

[Valleysdai]

+1 for the vinemare if you are playing SFM+equipment. Might not be better than Thrun but still worth looking at.

It could work better with a different equipment package compared to normal (e.g. more sword of X & Y).

Just my opinion as I don't run the equipment package, so I could be way out.

[oSeabass]

Anyone else a little excited by the new 1GG Dinosaur, 2/5. Whenever an opponent activated an ability from a land or creature that isn’t a mans ability, you may draw a card.

Fetchlands, lands dot deck, Depths/Stage, every DRS, SFM, etc.
Seems like a fun one of, also a 2/5 for 3 that is GSZable seems not bad. Probably not as impactful as Leovold at 3, but it makes me think.

[Valleysdai]

Anyone else a little excited by the new 1GG Dinosaur, 2/5. Whenever an opponent activated an ability from a land or creature that isn’t a mans ability, you may draw a card.

Fetchlands, lands dot deck, Depths/Stage, every DRS, SFM, etc.
Seems like a fun one of, also a 2/5 for 3 that is GSZable seems not bad. Probably not as impactful as Leovold at 3, but it makes me think.

I love the look of it and the 5 toughness is relevant in most matchups.

I'm not sure what it would replace, tracker seems to be the closest to it's effect

[oSeabass]

I love the look of it and the 5 toughness is relevant in most matchups.

I'm not sure what it would replace, tracker seems to be the closest to it's effect

Sorry for poor grammar and spelling, phones suck.

Tracker is still probably better. Easier to cast when drawn, harder for opponents to impact the effect, grows big, mana sink for Cradle, plays better with your fetching and KOTR, is human (Cavern?), etc.

Also in Grindy games Tracker is still probably better. This guy is good versus opponent fetched but by turn 3-4 they have a mana base already and they can sit on lands.

Seems bonkers in the mirror match ;)

[lavafrogg]

Dinosaurs aside; DnT now has access to Brightling.... which might be a problem for us in a fair game. Anyone else think this could swing the matchup away from us?

[Rascalyote]

Dinosaurs aside; DnT now has access to Brightling.... which might be a problem for us in a fair game. Anyone else think this could swing the matchup away from us?

Why set the dino aside, that card seems to dumpster Brightling ;3

[Valleysdai]

Dinosaurs aside; DnT now has access to Brightling.... which might be a problem for us in a fair game. Anyone else think this could swing the matchup away from us?

Any ideas how the Dnt players are liking brightling?

Because we have Mother of Runes and it can only get to a 5/1 we can work around it easily enough. It could be annoying to deal with but we got this.

Ironically besides the dino's ability it's P/T are relevant against brightling.

If they are wasting mana on that each turn it is good for us, it will widen the gap between good and bad DnT players for a while. And if they are equipping everything to it we can look at things like fumble, etc.

[lavafrogg]

Any ideas how the Dnt players are liking brightling?

Because we have Mother of Runes and it can only get to a 5/1 we can work around it easily enough. It could be annoying to deal with but we got this.

Ironically besides the dino's ability it's P/T are relevant against brightling.

If they are wasting mana on that each turn it is good for us, it will widen the gap between good and bad DnT players for a while. And if they are equipping everything to it we can look at things like fumble, etc.

Holy poop. I was completely not paying attention to the Brightling vs Dino interaction. rtfc i guess. Do we have room for the Dino? I wish it had some sort of protection....

[Fatal]

Blitining is poor vs us. Maverick vs D&T is resource war mostly (exception is landing MoR which survive), there aren't any DMG on stack so all what they can get is trade or chump block with return. Blow up vial and this operation cost 4 Mana..

[Cpt-Qc]

Adding to this, I'd much rather face Brightling than Mirran Crusader and that's exactly what they are cutting to fit it in (the 3 drop flex slots). If they actually start playing it, the matchup becomes even better because we can still attack through it with MoM and/or block and protection from white to prevent lifegain.

[oSeabass]

I’m trying to see if I can swing GP Richmond and want to sleeve up my favorite deck Maverick. My backup is a complete RUG Delver list but it seems poor in the meta right now instead of like Grixis (no cards for).

In looking over my trimmed down collection (sold a lot of paper cards) I don’t have any cradle, DD, Grove, etc. which of the different land packages would be best for the cheapest amount $. I’m thinking 1 of DD Stage isn’t going to break the bank and a lot of you seem to like that combo.

In what matchups is the land choice you recommend good for? Strengths? Weaknesses? Any sick plays you can think of? Only one I know is the oldie but goodie Maze of Ith KOTR after damage still in combat for “vigilance”.

[bakofried]

I'm a big proponent of Cradle, and to a lesser extent Maze. Cradle lets you crack close games wide open, and doesn't take up as many slots as Stage+Depths (and is good off of a single KotR activation or when naturally drawn). It's often the first land I fetch, as it lets me break the symmetry of fetching Wasteland with Knight.

[Cpt-Qc]

I’m trying to see if I can swing GP Richmond and want to sleeve up my favorite deck Maverick. My backup is a complete RUG Delver list but it seems poor in the meta right now instead of like Grixis (no cards for).

In looking over my trimmed down collection (sold a lot of paper cards) I don’t have any cradle, DD, Grove, etc. which of the different land packages would be best for the cheapest amount $. I’m thinking 1 of DD Stage isn’t going to break the bank and a lot of you seem to like that combo.

In what matchups is the land choice you recommend good for? Strengths? Weaknesses? Any sick plays you can think of? Only one I know is the oldie but goodie Maze of Ith KOTR after damage still in combat for “vigilance”.

DD combo is best for matchups against non-white decks since you don't want to double wasteland + timewalk yourself and get lage plowed. Since there isn't much white atm it's the best it's ever been. Also it's definitely the cheapest of the bunch. The only weakness is you want to make sure opponent has no way to kill Lage or you have too many lands in play.

I performed one of those sick plays just this week vs grixis devler: I'm dead on board in 2 turns to liliana last hope's ultimate which will get 8 zombies next turn, just got a scryb ranger in play + 2 lands and 1 Kotr -> topdeck 3rd land and pass. End step activate kotr twice with ranger and win on the swingback. The combo gives us a chance in games we were not supposed to win.

[Valleysdai]

The combo gives us a chance in games we were not supposed to win.

I can attest to this, the DD combo can win out of nowhere too, I managed to pull off a sick interaction between crop rotation, lotus cobra and the DD combo against elves.

I have new Thalia, cobra, dryad arbor and 2 other lands in play.

They cast a tapped hoof and swung with their other creatures for 10, I'm on 16.

Before blocks I count my mana (several times) to make sure I have enough and do the following:

Tap dryad arbor and a wasteland for mana, sac the wasteland to crop rotation, get stage and add green from cobra, tap another land and sac it to a 2nd crop rotation. Get depths add a green and use the floating to make Marit Lage and win on the crackback.


I am a great believer in the stage combo, it has caused me to win so many games when I was playing UG cloudpost it's insane.

[IanCHarding]

Hello everyone, I want to build Mavrick but I'm not sure what version of the deck i want to focus on. what you all think of the punishing fire version compared to the popular GWb build?


thanks

[SellaNona]

Hello everyone, I want to build Mavrick but I'm not sure what version of the deck i want to focus on. what you all think of the punishing fire version compared to the popular GWb build?


thanks

Punishing has a better matchup into control decks (Delver variants, Czech Pile, etc) or any grindy matchup since they tend to be heavily advantage-based and having a recurrable way to kill deathrites is super nice. GWb tends to be better against combo decks since you get to run Thalia maindeck and targeted discard.

sort of depends on what your local meta looks like, but either choice is fine. I've been on Punishing for a while but that doesn't mean much since I don't really get to play often. However I will say that out of all the variants I've played (straight GW, GWb, Punishing) I've probably enjoyed Punishing the most since Grove and Pfire make grindy matchups where I have to kill a bunch of strix/deathrites/whatever a lot less stressful.


The combo gives us a chance in games we were not supposed to win.

The amount of undeserved wins I've gotten off of stage/depths is absurd.
That being said it can be easy to tunnel vision to lage without realizing it. Can be sort of tricky to differentiate between the times its winmoar and when you really do have to go for it early to close out a game.

[lavafrogg]

I'm still super hyped on a straight GW list with 4/3 Thalia/Big Thalia as major disruption cards. I don't think DD or punishing fires help you in anything but the long/grindy game, when you can win early a lot easier with Maverick... which is at its core an aggro deck.

[Valleysdai]

I'm still super hyped on a straight GW list with 4/3 Thalia/Big Thalia as major disruption cards. I don't think DD or punishing fires help you in anything but the long/grindy game, when you can win early a lot easier with Maverick... which is at its core an aggro deck.

I have found that the synergy with cobra and crop rotation makes the DD package a lot more aggro.

[SellaNona]

I'm still super hyped on a straight GW list with 4/3 Thalia/Big Thalia as major disruption cards. I don't think DD or punishing fires help you in anything but the long/grindy game, when you can win early a lot easier with Maverick... which is at its core an aggro deck.

Decks like Grixis, Miracles, Czech Pile, etc. are going to force you to play the grindy game whether you like it or not

[bakofried]

I'm still super hyped on a straight GW list with 4/3 Thalia/Big Thalia as major disruption cards. I don't think DD or punishing fires help you in anything but the long/grindy game, when you can win early a lot easier with Maverick... which is at its core an aggro deck.

Maverick is as much an aggro deck as Death and Taxes: that is, not at all. Winning with creatures an aggro deck does not make.

Eldrazi Stompy is aggro, Merfolk is aggro, Burn (in its current iteration) is aggro. Grixis and RUG Delver are aggro compared to Maverick. Even combo decks have to race your prison elements before they come down.

Miracles is one of the few match-ups where Maverick actually assumes an aggressive role. Trying to grind that match out is a mistake, as they'll inevitably grind better than you.

[lavafrogg]

Maverick is as much an aggro deck as Death and Taxes: that is, not at all. Winning with creatures an aggro deck does not make.

Eldrazi Stompy is aggro, Merfolk is aggro, Burn (in its current iteration) is aggro. Grixis and RUG Delver are aggro compared to Maverick. Even combo decks have to race your prison elements before they come down.

Miracles is one of the few match-ups where Maverick actually assumes an aggressive role. Trying to grind that match out is a mistake, as they'll inevitably grind better than you.

I completely disagree.

We do not have the Prison elements of DnT. The fact that we can play a little control/prison against the decks that are faster than us is a testimite to the strength of Thalia and Knight. That doesn’t change the fact that in a perfect world we play a turn 2 knight and beat the hell out of the opponent with it.

Most of the time we are playing outlets 1 of silver bullet and hoping we can get there before the opponent finds the answer and kills us.

[bakofried]

Knight is absolutely a lock piece. The default is Knight->chain Wastelands->kill once they can't deploy threats. That may play out differently depending on the board state, but frankly, Knight often isn't a great beater in a world filled with Deathrites.

[SellaNona]

That doesn’t change the fact that in a perfect world we play a turn 2 knight and beat the hell out of the opponent with it.


In a perfect world DRS isn't the fourth most played card in the format.

The best part of Knight is its utility. If it weren't for that we'd just play Goyfs at which point we might as well just play Zoo

[Valleysdai]

Knight is absolutely a lock piece. The default is Knight->chain Wastelands->kill once they can't deploy threats. That may play out differently depending on the board state, but frankly, Knight often isn't a great beater in a world filled with Deathrites.

Also with knight once we have one active against lands we are in the dominant position, only when we get a second active knight can we start beating in with one.

[lavafrogg]

In a perfect world DRS isn't the fourth most played card in the format.

The best part of Knight is its utility. If it weren't for that we'd just play Goyfs at which point we might as well just play Zoo

Mav doesn’t play goyfs because the deck doesn’t put anything except lands in the graveyard.

Maverick is first and foremost an aggressive deck. It could be classified as a midrange deck but the main game plan is to protect a bomb long enough to win the game.

The bomb can be a knight, a teeg, a scooze, SFM, whatever, but the deck is not looking to take games late and lock players down ie DnT or Czech/Miracles.

That being said: you can play the deck however you want and build it shifted either more aggressive or more controlling. If I was playing a more controlling list I would be in an sdematt GSZ rock/junk list with Liliana. Since I think that deck is not well positioned right now I have been going more aggressive with big Thalia and only an excavator as a late game value engine.

I am 16-2 against blue.dec with this configuration with 1 loss being to miracles and the other being a god draw Delver.

[oSeabass]

I am 16-2 against blue.dec with this configuration with 1 loss being to miracles and the other being a god draw Delver.

Care to share an updated list? Big Thalia seems better with more DD combo around.

[lavafrogg]

Care to share an updated list? Big Thalia seems better with more DD combo around.


4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 SFM

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Ranumap Excavator
1 Dryad Arbor

4 Green Sun’s Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Maze of Ith
1 Gaea’s Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas

Sideboard
3 Thoughtsieze
3 Surgical Extraction
1 Bitterblossom
1 Choke
1 Containment Priest
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sylvan Library
1 Tireless Tracker

It has very good game against a lot of problem matchups where they cannot be allowed to free-roll. Fetchlands are a major pain against Thalia and and she can buy valuable time against most matchups.

Having 2 first strikers is huge against all of the baleful strix around as you can attack through anything Czech has and have Karakas protection for both of them against spot removal.

[oSeabass]

It has very good game against a lot of problem matchups where they cannot be allowed to free-roll. Fetchlands are a major pain against Thalia and and she can buy valuable time against most matchups.

Having 2 first strikers is huge against all of the baleful strix around as you can attack through anything Czech has and have Karakas protection for both of them against spot removal.

Looks a lot more like the traditional older GW lists I used to run, just with the black splash for DRS and sideboard stuff. The one thing I question is the Bitterblossom in the board. How well has that worked, what do you bring it in against? Miracles? Grindy matchups?

[lavafrogg]

Looks a lot more like the traditional older GW lists I used to run, just with the black splash for DRS and sideboard stuff. The one thing I question is the Bitterblossom in the board. How well has that worked, what do you bring it in against? Miracles? Grindy matchups?

The Bitterblossom is a new addition from playing Depths.

It gives me 2 very impactful enchantments out of the board in Grindy matchups especially where decays will be taxed and judgements can’t hit everything. I really enjoy forcing decks to have a variety of answers to all of my cards. Bitterblossom is just amazing in the Miracles matchup and helps make terminus not a big deal.

I love the straight GW feel because legacy is currently very combo heavy and you need a way to slow down the combo decks while still punishing the 4c manabases. Getting 1-2 turns off of combo while swinging for 5 with both Thalia’s is all you can ask for, especially with seize out of the board.

[Valleysdai]

What are your tips and tricks when you are playing against miracles? Whenever I play against them they always seem to have the answers and stall out long enough to win.

[delfam]

What are the matchups for Gideon, AOZ and is Bitterblossom just better in the same spot?

I assume any grindy deck like 4c Czech, Punishing Dack, and Miracles. 4 mana is probably too much for Delver but the lifeloss from Blossom is probably bad as well vs them.

I just see Gideon is fairly standard at this point and not sure why Bitterblossom isn't.

[pettdan]

I just see Gideon is fairly standard at this point and not sure why Bitterblossom isn't.

Ive been using Bitterblossom in the sb for the past 3 years, sometimes, even maindecked occasionally, and I think it got better over the past 12 months. It's individual, I'd say, if it's played or not over a planeswalker. Planeswalkers seem to be more popular for sure, but I'm not sure why.

[Seraphix]

I made Top8 at the the Giga-Bites Legacy Quarterly over the weekend. List:

Creature Spells (21)
4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
2x Scavenging Ooze
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
4x Knight of the Reliquary

Noncreature Spells (15)
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Punishing Fire
1x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull

Lands (23)
4x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
2x Savannah
2x Taiga
1x Plateau
1x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
3x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Karakas
3x Wasteland
1x Horizon Canopy

SB: 2x Surgical Extraction
SB: 2x Choke
SB: 2x Crop Rotation
SB: 2x Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1x Bojuka Bog
SB: 1x Reclamation Sage
SB: 1x Voice of Resurgence
SB: 1x Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1x Wear / Tear
SB: 1x Phyrexian Revoker
SB: 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant


There were 91 players so 7 rounds of swiss. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Oops, All Spells! (W 2-1)
Round 2: BUG Control (W 2-1)
Round 3: Grixis Delver (W 2-1)
Round 4: Czech Pile (W 2-0)
Round 5: MUD Post (W 2-0)
Round 6: ID
Round 7: ID
Quarterfinal: Czech Pile (L 0-2)


Both games of the QF were winnable had I played better, but oh well.

[IanCHarding]

I made Top8 at the the Giga-Bites Legacy Quarterly over the weekend. List:

Creature Spells (21)
4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
2x Scavenging Ooze
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
4x Knight of the Reliquary

Noncreature Spells (15)
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Punishing Fire
1x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull

Lands (23)
4x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
2x Savannah
2x Taiga
1x Plateau
1x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
3x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Karakas
3x Wasteland
1x Horizon Canopy

SB: 2x Surgical Extraction
SB: 2x Choke
SB: 2x Crop Rotation
SB: 2x Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1x Bojuka Bog
SB: 1x Reclamation Sage
SB: 1x Voice of Resurgence
SB: 1x Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1x Wear / Tear
SB: 1x Phyrexian Revoker
SB: 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant


There were 91 players so 7 rounds of swiss. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Oops, All Spells! (W 2-1)
Round 2: BUG Control (W 2-1)
Round 3: Grixis Delver (W 2-1)
Round 4: Czech Pile (W 2-0)
Round 5: MUD Post (W 2-0)
Round 6: ID
Round 7: ID
Quarterfinal: Czech Pile (L 0-2)


Both games of the QF were winnable had I played better, but oh well.

congrats on the top8 but i was wondering why the split with noble/bird and why not 4 wasteland?

thanks

[TheoryCraft]

Hey all, long-time Maverick player popping my head in. Been off Legacy for a while since there's less activity/tournaments/FNMs these days. I noticed that for a while Maverick was splashing 4c for Leovold (with decent success), and now suddenly I look and I don't see him in lists any more. What changed? I thought he was a nice addition to the deck to combat Elves - our worst MU by far - and make Blue decks play fair against us.

[lavafrogg]

congrats on the top8 but i was wondering why the split with noble/bird and why not 4 wasteland?

thanks

Noble doesn’t add red and birds fly. The exalted trigger is more important in multiples but sometimes you just need your dork to add red or pick up a sword.

In old school straight GW is was noble all the way, but with she splash for fires red is sometimes needed.

You also mana constrain yourself with the groves package so you usually have to cut utility lands ie wastelands in this case to make room.

I have seen lists with only 2 groves or no other utility lands but a 3/3 split seems nice as well.

[lavafrogg]

What are your tips and tricks when you are playing against miracles? Whenever I play against them they always seem to have the answers and stall out long enough to win.

This is from Julian Knab with his elves list, but the idea is to prey on the fact that Miracles doesn’t actually run that many real cards anymore.

Bring in your black cards with the goal to extract either terminus or swords and they will not have enough actual spells to kill your team. Extract swords Mom+Teeg, Choke, Thoughtsieze, Bitterblossom, Tracker, Library plus equipment and everything else you want to do.

They don’t have a real way to punish us enough or lock us down anymore without Counterbalance. A quick Jace can be an issue but if he doesn’t have removal to find then what can he actually do?

[haganbmj]

I made Top8 at the the Giga-Bites Legacy Quarterly over the weekend.

Congrats on the finish, it was nice to see Maverick do well - I chickened out of playing Maverick in the days leading up to the event.

The recording of your quarterfinals match is going up on Youtube, if it ever finishes "Processing".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaIfYZEj9L4

[menloe]

I made Top8 at the the Giga-Bites Legacy Quarterly over the weekend. List:

Creature Spells (21)
4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
2x Scavenging Ooze
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
4x Knight of the Reliquary

Noncreature Spells (15)
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Punishing Fire
1x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull

Lands (23)
4x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
2x Savannah
2x Taiga
1x Plateau
1x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
3x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Karakas
3x Wasteland
1x Horizon Canopy

SB: 2x Surgical Extraction
SB: 2x Choke
SB: 2x Crop Rotation
SB: 2x Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1x Bojuka Bog
SB: 1x Reclamation Sage
SB: 1x Voice of Resurgence
SB: 1x Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1x Wear / Tear
SB: 1x Phyrexian Revoker
SB: 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant


There were 91 players so 7 rounds of swiss. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Oops, All Spells! (W 2-1)
Round 2: BUG Control (W 2-1)
Round 3: Grixis Delver (W 2-1)
Round 4: Czech Pile (W 2-0)
Round 5: MUD Post (W 2-0)
Round 6: ID
Round 7: ID
Quarterfinal: Czech Pile (L 0-2)


Both games of the QF were winnable had I played better, but oh well.

Nice! I need to get out to the quarterly but am not on Facebook and don't know when anything is happening ever.

[oSeabass]

Started looking at what I am missing to do Maverick possibly for Richmond, and turns out I have no Bayou...

Then I looked at the price of Bayou... (online player mostly now a days)

AAAANNNNNNDDDD I am not going to be playing B splash :(
Looking more, Grove has gotten cheaper so maybe I can do GWr Punishing. Does that still need a Bayou for DRS or is it something I can just swing with BoP, Grove, no DRS, no Noble?

[Valleysdai]

Started looking at what I am missing to do Maverick possibly for Richmond, and turns out I have no Bayou...

Then I looked at the price of Bayou... (online player mostly now a days)

AAAANNNNNNDDDD I am not going to be playing B splash :(
Looking more, Grove has gotten cheaper so maybe I can do GWr Punishing. Does that still need a Bayou for DRS or is it something I can just swing with BoP, Grove, no DRS, no Noble?

What's the rest of your deck like? You can run scrubland, overgrown tomb or basic swamp for the black splash

[Seraphix]

Started looking at what I am missing to do Maverick possibly for Richmond, and turns out I have no Bayou...

Then I looked at the price of Bayou... (online player mostly now a days)

AAAANNNNNNDDDD I am not going to be playing B splash :(
Looking more, Grove has gotten cheaper so maybe I can do GWr Punishing. Does that still need a Bayou for DRS or is it something I can just swing with BoP, Grove, no DRS, no Noble?

You can play Naya with just the 4 Birds. If doing this, make sure you play 3 Equips, and check out :r::r: spells since you'll be able to consistently cast them.

[oSeabass]

You can play Naya with just the 4 Birds. If doing this, make sure you play 3 Equips, and check out :r::r: spells since you'll be able to consistently cast them.

Yea playing Naya is tempting, lets me look into GR fun things to splash for GSZ. Also I don't know WHAT I have, I need to take better inventory to see what I have and what I am missing. If I don't have SFM then it is probably out of the question.

The fallback is RUG Delver, which is... fine... just... not my baby.

[menloe]

...no DRS...

No more forever

[delfam]

So Wasteland gets a lot better now. Those three color decks are losing a mana fixer.

My best guess is the 4c Leovold, Punishing Dack, etc. style decks all need to cut colors. Maybe U/R Delver is not the most popular deck?

Reanimator decks probably get a lot more popular now, so that should be interesting.

Do we just replace DRS with Birds and move on as normal?

[Barook]

So Wasteland gets a lot better now. Those three color decks are losing a mana fixer.

My best guess is the 4c Leovold, Punishing Dack, etc. style decks all need to cut colors. Maybe U/R Delver is not the most popular deck?

Reanimator decks probably get a lot more popular now, so that should be interesting.

Do we just replace DRS with Birds and move on as normal?
KotR als doesn't get nerfed by hungry DRS anymore. That's pretty huge.

[swordoffireandice]

So Wasteland gets a lot better now. Those three color decks are losing a mana fixer.

My best guess is the 4c Leovold, Punishing Dack, etc. style decks all need to cut colors. Maybe U/R Delver is not the most popular deck?

Reanimator decks probably get a lot more popular now, so that should be interesting.

Do we just replace DRS with Birds and move on as normal?

I am playing punishing M. right now...my initial thought was to replace DRS with Birds...

[menloe]

I am playing punishing M. right now...my initial thought was to replace DRS with Birds...

You can replace DRS with BoP or go up to the full four NH. Two out of three colors ain't bad and the trigger is relevant.

Others have tested which of the two dorks is better. My recollection is that NH>BoP, but it's going to be a matter of preference.

[Valleysdai]

You can replace DRS with BoP or go up to the full four NH. Two out of three colors ain't bad and the trigger is relevant.

Others have tested which of the two dorks is better. My recollection is that NH>BoP, but it's going to be a matter of preference.

For me it's going to be 2-3 birds, a lotus cobra and maybe a crop rotation. But the 4th GSZ may be needed to grab scooze

[Stuart]

So Maverick’s probably solid moving forward, but I assume we’re gonna need to load up on grave hate in the board. What do you all like? Some options:
- Bog
- Tormod’s
- Leyline
- RIP
- Surgical
- Scooze

(I’ve been on 4 DRS main, with 3 Surgical and 1 Scooze in the board. I’m personally gonna start by adding 1 Bog and 1 Tormod’s to the board.)

[Valleysdai]

So Maverick’s probably solid moving forward, but I assume we’re gonna need to load up on grave hate in the board. What do you all like? Some options:
- Bog
- Tormod’s
- Leyline
- RIP
- Surgical
- Scooze

(I’ve been on 4 DRS main, with 3 Surgical and 1 Scooze in the board. I’m personally gonna start by adding 1 Bog and 1 Tormod’s to the board.)

Currently I have 4 Drs, 1 scooze, 1 bog main and 3 leyline and 1 surgical side (I will probably leave it as is minus the Drs). My benefit is that I run crops so have instant gy hate when needed.

[menloe]

For me it's going to be 2-3 birds, a lotus cobra and maybe a crop rotation. But the 4th GSZ may be needed to grab scooze

Just bought the three NH I needed to complete the set ($60 each, natch.) Probably 2 BoP and 4 NH for me. Really looking forward to stacking multiple exalt triggers honestly.

[timmyod17]

I'm sure I'm not alone in thinking about the future metagame now that DRS (and probe) is banned. These are my brief initial thoughts:

Losers
Grixis Delver - this deck should be dead after losing up to 8 main deck cards.
4c Pile - no deck can be this greedy with its mana now. Wondering if players might turn to 3-color controlling shells instead.
Elves - a slight hit, as DRS provided some reach and resilience against -1/-1 effects.

Mixed
Maverick - KotR just got way better, but losing our only source of reach hurts
Storm - Loss of probe hurts, but not having to face casual GY hate from DRS somewhat mitigates this
Mono-Red Stompy - fewer decks with t1 mana creature helps, but maybe fewer greedy manabases

Winners
Miracles - I think Miracles will now retake its place as the top deck in Legacy without Pile decks to grind it out so effectively
Lands - Now they can dredge loam, rebuy their lands, and have PFire sit in the GY unmolested forever
Aggro Loam - Same thing as Lands
Dredge, Reanimator - duh, even though DRS was hardly sufficient to combat these stupid decks
Goblins - DRS will no longer just stonewall Lackey

Decks that may become decks again
RUG Delver might come back, as threshold will be way easier to achieve
U/R Delver seems reasonable, though maybe not in a world without Probe
I could see more people picking up something like Bant Stoneblade, with TNN (and less likely Leovold)

Other thoughts
-I think the obvious initial direction for Maverick is just to swap in Nobles. This would make us more of a beatdown deck with exalted triggers.
-Swapping Nobles for DRS is going to make -1/-1 effects hurt way more.
-Cavern of Souls might be a thing for us now.
-It's possible that Stoneforge Mystic gets a lot better in a world with fewer K-Commands in it.
-It's possible we will want to start running a few extra GY hate spots in the side. I've always been partial to RIP, but it felt bad being in a DRS/knight deck.
-That new dino in the upcoming Core set probably isn't good enough for legacy without DRS around, but who knows?
-It could be reasonable to eliminate the black splash entirely without DRS. The mana would get way easier, but the combo matchups would likely suffer .

[Rascalyote]

I'm excited to bust out more exalted beats. I'm not excited about shelling out $600+ on 3 more judge nobles :(. I think I'm gonna still try Runic Armasaur when it comes out even though DRS is gone to give us cards, as a 2/5 is really nice stats esp against all the bolts I think we'll see.

I played a Cavern before DRS but now that I'm playing Dark Depths I'm not sure I have the space to put it back in, this was also probably back when I had 1 Linvala main and 1 SB to beat the mirror match. Ah the good ol' days.

[Manipulato]

Hey guys,
as a BUG player I´m really sad that Shaman got banned because I really liked the deck but at the same time I´m really glad about the fresh wind which goes threw Legacy now. I also really do believe that Maverick can be a good deck again. I played GW Maverick and Punishing Maverick back in the days over 3 years in a row and had a great time in the past but then everything changed with Shamand/AD and so on...

I really want to try these classic GW list back again:

26 Creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg


11 Spells
4 Green Suns Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

1 Batterskull
1 Umezawas Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

23 Lands
4 Savannah
4 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Wasteland
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Maze of Ith


Sideboard:
4 Surgical Extraction
2 Path to Exile
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sylvan Library
2 Choke
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Ramunap Excavator

I think that at least for the first couple of months that BR Reanimator, DnT, RUG/UR Delver and Lands will get a boost and see more play. Maverick is quite good placed in such a metagame I think.

The Sideboard is of course not set in stone because it depends what you wanna fight, control, combo or other creature based MU´s but I think that UW Miracles and some kind of Grixis Control will be widely played in the near future so the package of 2 Gideon 2 Library 2 Choke should be fine then.

I really wanna play the Ramunap Excavator in the MD but I cant find a slot for it. I know many people play 1 Pridemage + 1 Scavenging Ooze and if I would cut the 2nd copie I would have enought space for the snake but I really liked the 2/2 split back in the past because with two copies you naturally draw one from time to time and I dont have to zenith them into play all the time. Especially vs the popular DnT its good to have a 2nd Pridemage or draw him nautrally. Ooze is really important in the opener if you face Reanimator/Lands/Dredge with T1 Land+Noble/Zenith into Arbor and T2 Land+Oooze -> Snag something right now...

Greetings Franz

[Rascalyote]

I've been on Stage + Depths but we'll be seeing less slow piles that can't beat a Marit Lage and more Wasteland so I think I'm gonna drop it for just another land (fetch) and a spell, just make my deck slightly more consistent as people try to attack it's mana base. Speaking of attacking, I wanna try Thalia build. Heretic Cathar seems better now that less people have a mana dork and 3 power first strike is great and beats really hard with hierarchs that we have more of now.

9 Fetch
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Wasteland
-23-

1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sylvan Library (maybe 2nd pridemage over this and go full aggro exalted lol jk)
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith
-11-

4 Noble Hierarch
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Mother of Runes
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Stoneforge Mystic (should prolly just play the 2 again but it's so slow)
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
-26-

2 Choke
2 Canonist
2 Decay
2 Zealous
4 Thoughtseize
3 Surgical
-15-

[Valleysdai]

I'm predicting that there's going to be more miracles decks running about, any of you making changes for that matchup?

[Skizz]

DRS was one of the best cards against miracles.... this matchup ist just soooo BAD!
first idea... more Planeswalkers, more teegs/sanctum prelate - more LUCK :laugh::cry:

[Valleysdai]

DRS was one of the best cards against miracles.... this matchup ist just soooo BAD!
first idea... more Planeswalkers, more teegs/sanctum prelate - more LUCK :laugh::cry:

Yikes, I know that elves sometimes play Nissa, could it be worth running a PW (or any non creature) that attacks them from a different angle?

[menloe]

Yikes, I know that elves sometimes play Nissa, could it be worth running a PW (or any non creature) that attacks them from a different angle?

Running PW in the main is a fine idea. I've played Elspeth, Knight Errant and Garruk Relentless pretty extensively in the past in place of SFM. Garruk beats Jace's face in all day and you get to keep pumping out the pups. It's also important to have two Choke in the sideboard for the match up.

[menloe]

DRS was one of the best cards against miracles.... this matchup ist just soooo BAD!
first idea... more Planeswalkers, more teegs/sanctum prelate - more LUCK :laugh::cry:

More Punishing Fire.

[Dreadnaught33]

For Planeswalkers, Gideon AoZ has been a solid choice for me. A spicy option i love is Kaya, Ghost Assassin. She was a czech pile killer, but solid in any attrition matchup with her -2 draw, they discard. She's super fun and flavorful, and actually over performs most of the time. Her 0 mode on merit lage is so fun too.

[Fatal]

DRS was one of the best cards against miracles.... this matchup ist just soooo BAD!
first idea... more Planeswalkers, more teegs/sanctum prelate - more LUCK :laugh::cry:

As metion before - Punishing Fire is fine same true for pyroblasts, walkers and Choke which is probably best until they have answers.

As for Walkers - Nissa is very good since you can use it to kill opponent Jace for example they EoT terminus, then slam Jace tapping out and they think they're save. Nissa will prove they're far from save :-) - land 5/5 which can attack Jace..

Gaddock route isnt so great as before - Council Judgement is real deal and they pack more and more of them.

[menloe]

As metion before - Punishing Fire is fine same true for pyroblasts, walkers and Choke which is probably best until they have answers.

As for Walkers - Nissa is very good since you can use it to kill opponent Jace for example they EoT terminus, then slam Jace tapping out and they think they're save. Nissa will prove they're far from save :-) - land 5/5 which can attack Jace..

Gaddock route isnt so great as before - Council Judgement is real deal and they pack more and more of them.

I suspect a version of Punishing Maverick with planeswalkers will probably be the safest bet in general but especially RE the Miracles question. As the primer states: "Punishing Fire adds an axis of interaction to the deck that isn't creature-based. Maverick traditionally plays very much into the board, leaving it vulnerable to sweeper effects, particularly against control decks. Punishing Fire allows a Maverick strategy to pressure the opponent's life total or Planeswalkers without committing resources to the board. Its recoverability means even with no cards in hand you are able to interact, and it also requires a different kind of answer from the opposing deck than your creatures do." Terminus and Jace my ass.

And like Fatal says, the red splash gives you mana for Pyroblasts. And you can still run most of the anti-combo, anti-control cards in the sideboard... And there's a better argument for four BoP (vs. four NH) in Pun Mav, so that should be helpful to all you budget-minded kiddos out there.

[Fatal]

I suspect a version of Punishing Maverick with planeswalkers will probably be the safest bet in general but especially RE the Miracles question. As the primer states: "Punishing Fire adds an axis of interaction to the deck that isn't creature-based. Maverick traditionally plays very much into the board, leaving it vulnerable to sweeper effects, particularly against control decks. Punishing Fire allows a Maverick strategy to pressure the opponent's life total or Planeswalkers without committing resources to the board. Its recoverability means even with no cards in hand you are able to interact, and it also requires a different kind of answer from the opposing deck than your creatures do." Terminus and Jace my ass.

And like Fatal says, the red splash gives you mana for Pyroblasts. And you can still run most of the anti-combo, anti-control cards in the sideboard... And there's a better argument for four BoP (vs. four NH) in Pun Mav, so that should be helpful to all you budget-minded kiddos out there.

I will probably try some walkers MD - mostly focused on 3CMC and 4 CMC. I think 2 walkers MD + 2-3 SB +2 Choke should be enough vs Miracles.

Walkers tested by me:

3CMC
Liliana the Last Hope - a beast vs control without creatures - comes fast and quite fast ultimate. Now it will be even better

Domri Rade - very good - similar fast like LotH - but it doesn't have good removal (fightning isn't great, and really get less loyalities when used) - advantage over Liliana you can condionally get CA - which is good, 1/3 mostly after sb since you mostly side-out some creatures and put in removal vs walkers (like pyroblasts) or enchantments like Choke.

Liliana of the Veil - bad in Maverick - you dont want to discard cards, used only with punishing fire to be effective - to break symmetry. Just doesnt fit here.

4CMC
Garruk Rentless - 2/2 tokens is great vs Control also build in removal vs pesky creatures, bad vs any bolt decks

Elspeth, Knight-Errant - enough old and good. Very slow vs Miracles, you can lost with her on table after ultimate - Terminus, StP and Council Judgment laugh on her ultimate,

Gideon Ally of Zendikar - better then Elspeth much faster tempo since it can bump your little dudes - similar good as Garruk but without removal and doesn't die to bolt.

Chandra, Torch of Defiance - probably best Chandra, can protect herself, growth on CA, and it isnt conditional, ultimate wins fast - probably best red walker for Maverick.

Xenagos, the Reveler - good token producer - but it doesn't grow on it. Good advantage - tokens have haste ! Ultimate is just a CA - not always win the game. It doesn't have build in defence.

Next to test:
- Arlinn Kord

5CMC

Nissa, Vital Force - Probably best 5CMC walker in this color - it can be instant CA with build-in regrowth (picking up other walkers), it ultimate really fast and it can kill if not blocker opponent walker - what more you want ?

Garruk, Primal Hunter - this one is probably best token producer - they're really fat - you can also try to CA - but it's risky, ultimate is a win, or opponent has terminus.

[Valleysdai]

Next to test:
- Arlinn Kord



Have you thought of trying Kaya as dreadnaught suggested.

[Rascalyote]

I will probably try some walkers MD - mostly focused on 3CMC and 4 CMC. I think 2 walkers MD + 2-3 SB +2 Choke should be enough vs Miracles.

Walkers tested by me:

3CMC
Liliana the Last Hope - a beast vs control without creatures - comes fast and quite fast ultimate. Now it will be even better

Domri Rade - very good - similar fast like LotH - but it doesn't have good removal (fightning isn't great, and really get less loyalities when used) - advantage over Liliana you can condionally get CA - which is good, 1/3 mostly after sb since you mostly side-out some creatures and put in removal vs walkers (like pyroblasts) or enchantments like Choke.

Liliana of the Veil - bad in Maverick - you dont want to discard cards, used only with punishing fire to be effective - to break symmetry. Just doesnt fit here.

4CMC
Garruk Rentless - 2/2 tokens is great vs Control also build in removal vs pesky creatures, bad vs any bolt decks

Elspeth, Knight-Errant - enough old and good. Very slow vs Miracles, you can lost with her on table after ultimate - Terminus, StP and Council Judgment laugh on her ultimate,

Gideon Ally of Zendikar - better then Elspeth much faster tempo since it can bump your little dudes - similar good as Garruk but without removal and doesn't die to bolt.

Chandra, Torch of Defiance - probably best Chandra, can protect herself, growth on CA, and it isnt conditional, ultimate wins fast - probably best red walker for Maverick.

Xenagos, the Reveler - good token producer - but it doesn't grow on it. Good advantage - tokens have haste ! Ultimate is just a CA - not always win the game. It doesn't have build in defence.

Next to test:
- Arlinn Kord

5CMC

Nissa, Vital Force - Probably best 5CMC walker in this color - it can be instant CA with build-in regrowth (picking up other walkers), it ultimate really fast and it can kill if not blocker opponent walker - what more you want ?

Garruk, Primal Hunter - this one is probably best token producer - they're really fat - you can also try to CA - but it's risky, ultimate is a win, or opponent has terminus.

I find it odd you say Elspeth is the slow one especially vs Miracles. Obviously 1/1's are weaker than 2/2's but her second ability actually kills the opponent or Jace's which is something most other walkers don't do except maybe Gideon (or Nissa but at 5 cmc) but he opens himself up to Plow or getting blocked and Elspeth can crack for more if you target a big creature and she can do it the turn she comes in. Elspeth jumps over Brightling, monks, TNN, chumps etc. I played a lot of Elspeth back in the day in NO Bant, Maverick and even standard, you almost never wanted to ultimate her even against Jund. Elspeth being in play is more powerful than her emblem, I don't see why you'd ever ult her against miracles even some fringe case where you have Sword/Choke and your opponent is holding disenchants and is about to get the mana for them or something just kill them with the Elspeth. Sure you can have elspeth and some dorky guys and then die to entreat but every other walker has that problem where at least Elspeth is a faster clock (I've died so many times with Last Hope emblem in play - not to mention BB is going to be harder now for most lists.) I've always been the odd one out and liked Elspeth more than Gideon in Maverick, I'm also a big fan of Garruk because having the utility to kill a creature can come in handy sometimes and he's easy to cast plus 1/1 death touchers are no joke. Can't really comment on the red walkers as I've only played Bant, GW, or GWB.

[aliveasgo]

Xenagos, the Reveler - good token producer - but it doesn't grow on it. Good advantage - tokens have haste ! Ultimate is just a CA - not always win the game. It doesn't have build in defence.


I've had success with Xenagos against miracles in those instances where it resolved. A hasty 2/2 every turn was typically too much for them to contend with.

[Yutao]

Is new Ajani too slow? Maybe it's just a worse kaya...

[Valleysdai]

Has anyone thought of playing Narset (PW)? She looks like she would be powerful against miracles and her ult is quite easy to get to.

Other thoughts are venser (similar to narset) or ashiok (can mess with their top deck manipulation and make them use their terminuses and brainstorm early).

It seems doable to splash for them because nobles and BoPs can make blue without issue.

[Rascalyote]

Ashiok seems a bit deep, at least Leovold you can zenith for. Also her main utility is for UB decks to take big creatures, don't we just jam our own. I don't think messing with miracles top decks is enough for Ashiok

[Manipulato]

I know you guys talk alot about the punishing version but I personally think I would prefer Dark Maverick. Zealous Persecution + Thoughtseize gives the deck some really strong tools to fight combo on T1 or sweep the board from DnT, Elves or some Bant´ish Stoneblade TNN decks...

I´m not sure what the correct build would be and I just wanted to hear some thoughts about single card choices like Thalia, Heretic Cathar or 4 SFM to 0 and 2 Jitte MD like I saw in many lists the past two years or something. I know that many Maverick pilots cutted the SFM package because of Kolaghans Command but now the card will be played a bit less than before and I way very very pleased with the full package back in the day.

My first list without the Thalia 2.0 and the full SFM package would currently look like this:

26 Creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Qasali-Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg

11 Spells
4 Green Suns Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

1 Batterskull
1 Umezawas Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

23 Lands
2 Savannah
2 Bayou
4 Windswept Heath
2 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marsh Flats
4 Wasteland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Maze of Ith

Sideboard:
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Thoughtseize
3 Zealous Persecution
2 Choke
2 Sylvan Library
2 Ethersworn Canonist


The other version would be completley without the SFM package and just 2 Jitte MD + 3 Thalia 2.0:

25 Creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Qasali-Pridemage
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg

12 Spells
4 Green Suns Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

2 Umezawas Jitte
2 Sylvan Library

23 Lands
2 Savannah
2 Bayou
4 Windswept Heath
2 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marsh Flats
4 Wasteland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Maze of Ith

Sideboard:
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Thoughtseize
3 Zealous Persecution
2 Choke
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar

I think that Thalia 2.0 is actually super strong with 4 Noble Hierarch + 4 Zenith into Arbor on T1, especially now that DS got banned the blue based or BGx decks get slower and she punishes they´re mana base more hard than before. She would also be great vs Elves, Eldrazi and Sneak Show which all should get a little boost within the next weeks/months.

The manabase would not get hurt in comparison to the GW version because I would still play 3 basics and 4 Nobles + I would cut the 2 cavern and add another 2 fetches which make the MB more stable and I could fetch up the basics more constanty vs Blood Moon or PoP decks.
Losing the 2 Cavern from the GW version would be of course weaken the RUG or Miracles MU a little bit because uncounerable dudes are nice.

This is all nothing super new but I would be glad to hear some thoughts/experiences from Dark Maverick players.

Greetings Franz

[Valleysdai]

This is all nothing super new but I would be glad to hear some thoughts/experiences from Dark Maverick players.

Greetings Franz

Hey, I'll post my list that I'm going to be playing in the Welsh Nationals side later tonight (UK), it's still dark Maverick splashing for Leovold. Rather than SFM package Ì go more lands based.

Thalia HC has made my win rate against elves 100% rather than 50% (only had 1 match but she saved me game 1).

Since the DRS ban I've gone up to 4 GSZ and did a few games testing against dredge. I barely missed him, I'll try to keep track in my legacy fnm and Nats to see how often I needed him.

[menloe]

I know you guys talk alot about the punishing version but I personally think I would prefer Dark Maverick. Zealous Persecution + Thoughtseize gives the deck some really strong tools to fight combo on T1 or sweep the board from DnT, Elves or some Bant´ish Stoneblade TNN decks...

To be clear, I think Pun and Dark Mav both are going to be better positioned now than they were last week. I'll keep playing both depending on how I feel week to week. ZP and Thoughtseize are both great cards for the reasons you say and will continue to be the reason to play GWb.

I think Thalia 2.0 is the real deal. I try to run at least one of her in all my decks - she steals games away from Elves, which they never expect, and my in-store rival is an Elves player - and she has good stats. The fact that she messes with opponents' mana is good stuff too, especially in a world where Wasteland is better. (Your reasoning all looks right to me.)

I'm probably more inclined to run multiple Mindcensors now too. Historically, about 75% of my decks have had at least one and I only recently moved away from it. Mindcensor is good against a lot of bad match ups that rely on tutoring - Storm, Reanimator, Elves - and practically every deck fetches, but it feels like I'm the only one who's hyped on the card.

SFM is the first card I cut when trying new things out. To be completely honest, the card is fine, but I'm never that happy to draw one except in instances where I need an equipment to win or lose a game over the next two turns. I'm usually content to just naturally draw my equips, which are 1 Jitte and 1 SoFI. I was never so concerned with KC, just thought she was a little slow.

The paper list I'm running now has Rallier, Sylvan Library + Courser, Tireless Tracker, Gaea's Cradle, 2 SFM + above equips, Ramunap. I want all the good value cards and synergies and really enjoy outdrawing blue decks. I prefer Cradle in a deck that runs Tracker for that reason. I'll add back Thalia 2.0 (probably two) and some Mindcensors, probably cutting the SFM and Rallier. Garruk's in the side for now, but he's been maindeck before and will be again.

FWIW, I prefer your second list. Sylvan Library is never flex.

[menloe]

Is new Ajani too slow? Maybe it's just a worse kaya...

Which new Ajani?

Ajani, Life Coach is not great.

[r497]

Hey guys. I've been reading here for a long time.
After this weeks bannings, there are two lists I put up togheter by reading some of the discussion here and some lists posted here.

First one is Punishing Mav:
Maindeck:
23 Lands
3 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Wooded Foothills
1 Horizon Canopy
2 Savannah
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Karakas
1 Plateau
2 Taiga
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Grove of the Burnwillows

16 Non-creatures
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Sylvan Library
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Punishing Fire
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

21 Creatures
4 Mother of Runes
4 Birds of Paradise
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
4 Knight of the Reliquary

Sideboard:
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Choke
2 Ethersworn Cannonist
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Council's Judgement
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Sanctum Prelate

Here I don't know if the lone SoFaI would work. It's a hedge against TNN decks, but maybe without SFM it's too random. Testing 3 Big Thalia here, since 2mana Thalia with PFire is weird and, as I have liked her a lot in Modern, maybe that works here (as you guys were discussing earlier). Don't know if 3 is the right number, tho.

Next one is straight GW:
Maindeck:
23 Lands
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Horizon Canopy
2 Savannah
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Karakas
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Maze of Ith

12 Non-Creatures
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Sylvan Library
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar

25 Creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Ramunap Excavator
4 Knight of the Reliquary

Sideboard:
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Choke
2 Ethersworn Cannonist
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Faerie Macabre
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Council's Judgement
2 Path to Exile
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Sanctum Prelate

Here I don't know about GQ and the 2nd Canopy. GQ + Excavator seems cute, but maybe not worth it to have another colorless land. I could swap it and the 2nd Canopy for 2 Caverns. I'm not running the lone SoFaI here, with a Gideon instead. Maybe that could work better on the other list also. And I'm running both Thalias as 3of here, but if Heretic Cathar doesn't work out as intended, I'll go back to 4 SFM + 3 Equips shaving 2 more cards.

[Valleysdai]

Here I don't know about GQ and the 2nd Canopy. GQ + Excavator seems cute, but maybe not worth it to have another colorless land. I could swap it and the 2nd Canopy for 2 Caverns. I'm not running the lone SoFaI here, with a Gideon instead. Maybe that could work better on the other list also. And I'm running both Thalias as 3of here, but if Heretic Cathar doesn't work out as intended, I'll go back to 4 SFM + 3 Equips shaving 2 more cards.

Ghost quarter can help you get the coloured mana you need with you running 3 basics. It's also really potent against most decks so acts like another wasteland.

[Manipulato]

Hey guys,

nor reports to share from last weekend or playtesting vs the new metagame so far :frown: ?

My own tournament will be in 2 weeks so till then I have nothing to share but I´m building and goldfishing daily :laugh:

[Yutao]

Hey guys,

nor reports to share from last weekend or playtesting vs the new metagame so far :frown: ?

My own tournament will be in 2 weeks so till then I have nothing to share but I´m building and goldfishing daily :laugh:

I'm playing a blue splash for Leo in Dark Maverick and went 2-0-1 at a weekly. Beat Lands, Beat Grixis Control, Drew with Burn.

Honestly I'm thinking that I cut Leovold and Tropical Island for one of the following

-3rd Stoneforge and Bskull
-3rd Stoneforge and Sword of Light and Shadow
-Bayou and Tireless Tracker
-Bayou and 2nd Scooze in the Main
-Bayou and Mirri Weatherlight Duelist (Card seems interesting)

Playing Leovold on T2 is still very powerful, but it feels like the manabase is a bit too fragile for my liking.

What do you guys think?

[Yutao]

Which new Ajani?

Ajani, Life Coach is not great.

Ajani, Adversay of Tyrants?

Bringing back a Teeg or a Scooze sounds reasonable.

[bakofried]

This Tuesday I played a pretty stock GW Maverick in a local. Just 10 people, nothing huge, but I took 1st with a record of 3-0-1. Played against Miracles R1, which I drew against, but I probably could have won had I not made a few small play errors. R2 I played against Burn, which I beat 2-0. Cradle was crucial both games, letting me hold onto lands while still generating heaps of mana. R3 I played against a Junk pile, which I beat 2-0 with equipment and a leaner curve. R4 I played against BUG Thresh, and was able to win 2-0 mostly because of Sylvan Library and a robust manabase. I don't think I can overstate how nice it feels to have a rock solid manabase.

My sideboard:
4x Mindbreak Trap
1x Garruk Relentless
1x Sanctum Prelate
1x Council's Judgement
1x Reclamation Sage
1x Krosan Grip
2x Blessed Alliance
1x Ethersworn Canonist
3x Tormod's Crypt

[Rascalyote]

Played without deathrites last week and this week at our legacy locals, going 3-1 and 3-0-1. Loss was to miracles and draw was to the same player on miracles again who is a friend and just offered a draw this time because tired.

First week I played this list below and started off 6-0 in games beating Death and Taxes, ANT, Steel Stompy, then getting 2-0'd by miracles.

4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
1 MarshFlats
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
4 Wasteland
2 Forest
1 Plains
-23-

1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith
-10-

4 Noble Hierarch
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Ramunap Excavator
4 Knight of the Reliquary
-27-

2 Choke
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Thoughtseize
3 Surgical Extraction
-15-

So I cut the Stage/Depths for another mana land just to make my deck more consistent (9 fetches is probably too many but I realistically never want to buy another beta dual) and I also played Heretic Cathars just to be all in on my mana denial gameplan. She performed well but I noticed I ran out of cards a lot faster than I wanted to even in the games I won, especially as Nobles/Bird is a lot less of a card than DRS if that makes sense. Bird has been really lackluster, people always say "it holds equipment well" but almost anything holds a sword well and it doesn't hold a Jitte all that well and that's 50% of my equipment =/. I've been more careful about leaning on black in Wasteland matchups so against DNT I decided not to bring in any copies of Thoughtseize which left me going -3 Thalia -1 Teeg +2 Decay +2 Zealous which left a Thalia and a SOFI in my deck which isn't the worst but meh. All this led me to make these changes for the second (this) week:

-3 Heretic Cathar
+1 Sylvan Library
+1 Tireless Tracker
+1 Renegade Rallier (place holder for Runic Armasaur <3)

-1 SB Surgical Extraction
+1 SB Sword of Light and Shadow

Changes worked well, granted haven't needed to cast a Surgical either week (I cast it once against ANT during his draw step to hit Infernal Tutor and his draw was Dark Petition, but he died off the Ad Naus IIRC). This week I beat Pox, TES, and RUG Delver. TES player got unlucky where I mulled to 3 but his hand was so slow he died to my Qasali Pridemage, mother of runes, dryad arbor beats (my mulligan to 4 was 2 lands, birds, jitte which I might've kept if it was a noble lol). Game 2 He thoughtseizes my hand of double thalia, zenith, zealous, pridemage takes the zenith but Thalia comes down and then he's stuck on 1 land plays LED which gets pridemage'd and then I topdeck canonist after so pretty unlucky opponent.

[Fatal]

I will try to update primer after ban, contributors please do the same.

[Valleysdai]

I have found that with DRS replaced by other mana dorks that my mana has become more consistent. This is due to DRS needing lands in gys and no active Drs on the opponent's side.

Because of this I have been testing 2 spicy blue cards in the side for the increased number of dnt type decks.

[Poron]

Blue against DnT? It’s the color that most suffer Taxation

[Rascalyote]

I have found that with DRS replaced by other mana dorks that my mana has become more consistent. This is due to DRS needing lands in gys and no active Drs on the opponent's side.

Because of this I have been testing 2 spicy blue cards in the side for the increased number of dnt type decks.

Fumble/Grip of Phyresis :^)?

[Valleysdai]

Fumble/Grip of Phyresis :^)?

Yeah fumble haha. I believe it's worth testing because it does have other applications (the mirror, Lands, turbo depths, stoneblade, etc).


Blue against DnT? It’s the color that most suffer Taxation

I only have 3 cards in the 75 that have blue in their cost, and are all useful against DnT

[Rascalyote]

Yeah fumble haha. I believe it's worth testing because it does have other applications (the mirror, Lands, turbo depths, stoneblade, etc).



I only have 3 cards in the 75 that have blue in their cost, and are all useful against DnT

Fumble gets awk a bit vs TNN/SOFI/Active mom, but I love the card. Some sweet christmasland tech is if they have a first striker holding Jitte and they swing with some dudes you can let it hit you, Jitte trigger on the stack fumble the guy holding it, put it on another attacker of theirs and own a jitte with 4 counters which is pretty gg vs DNT ;3

[Valleysdai]

Fumble gets awk a bit vs TNN/SOFI/Active mom, but I love the card. Some sweet christmasland tech is if they have a first striker holding Jitte and they swing with some dudes you can let it hit you, Jitte trigger on the stack fumble the guy holding it, put it on another attacker of theirs and own a jitte with 4 counters which is pretty gg vs DNT ;3

It can get awkward but I reckon it's worth it. There's no need to let it hit you because in response they'll gain life or shrink your guy. It can be useful against mom because you block they make it pro blocker (e.g. green) you bounce in response :P

[Rascalyote]

It can get awkward but I reckon it's worth it. There's no need to let it hit you because in response they'll gain life or shrink your guy. It can be useful against mom because you block they make it pro blocker (e.g. green) you bounce in response :P

You gain control of jitte with the ability to add counters on it on the stack.

[Valleysdai]

You gain control of jitte with the ability to add counters on it on the stack.

In response (if they know what fumble does) theyd just use the counters to prevent us being able to use them

[Rascalyote]

In response (if they know what fumble does) theyd just use the counters to prevent us being able to use them

They hit us, there is a trigger on the stack to put counters onto Jitte, with this trigger on the stack cast Fumble, you gain control of jitte, then put the counters on it.

[Valleysdai]

They hit us, there is a trigger on the stack to put counters onto Jitte, with this trigger on the stack cast Fumble, you gain control of jitte, then put the counters on it.

Good thinking, sorry I totally forgot about the ability to react to the trigger haha. I like that play a lot

[Fatal]

I updated Primer after Ban.

As a bonus my actual lists:

1. Heavy SFM package:


// 60 Maindeck
// 3 Artifact
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull

// 22 Creature
1 Tireless Tracker
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Qasali Pridemage
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Renegade Rallier
3 Noble Hierarch
1 Ramunap Excavator

// 1 Enchantment
1 Sylvan Library

// 7 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Punishing Fire

// 23 Land
4 Wasteland
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Plains
1 Karakas
4 Windswept Heath
1 Forest
1 Taiga
1 Plateau
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
3 Wooded Foothills
1 Gaea's Cradle

// 4 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith


// 15 Sideboard
// 2 Enchantment
SB: 2 Choke

// 8 Instant
SB: 1 Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 Ancient Grudge
SB: 2 Pyroblast
SB: 1 Abrupt Decay
SB: 1 Blessed Alliance
SB: 1 Crop Rotation

// 3 Land
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog
SB: 1 Dark Depths
SB: 1 Thespian's Stage

// 2 Planeswalker
SB: 2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance


I removed sweet but conditional cards which sometimes gives an edge - Like Granger Guildmage - which win alone vs some decks for example vs Infect. Added value creature like SFM which can gain advantage since Grixis and K.Commands are in decline.

2. Second version is totally SFMless:


// 60 Maindeck
// 24 Creature
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Tireless Tracker
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Renegade Rallier
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Birds of Paradise

// 1 Enchantment
1 Sylvan Library

// 7 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Punishing Fire

// 24 Land
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Plains
1 Forest
4 Wasteland
1 Bayou
2 Savannah
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
1 Karakas
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Taiga
1 Plateau
1 Ghost Quarter

// 4 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith


// 15 Sideboard
// 3 Creature
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 1 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 Granger Guildmage

// 2 Enchantment
SB: 2 Choke

// 7 Instant
SB: 1 Blessed Alliance
SB: 1 Pyroblast
SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
SB: 1 Crop Rotation
SB: 2 Abrupt Decay
SB: 1 Zealous Persecution

// 1 Land
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog

// 2 Planeswalker
SB: 2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance


Its more focused on Tracker value. Which can outdraw most decks.

[SellaNona]

https://deckstats.net/decks/110808/1045916-gw-maverick/en

Probably will run something like this for a while. Maindeck ratios can still be messed with (not sure how I feel about 3x Mom 3x Stoneforge 2x Cathar mainly) and I'm like 99% certain the manabase isn't going to work but I can't really afford another Savannah so I'd have to run basics or something.

Sideboard is sort of meh, might have to switch things around depending on how much reanimator I end up seeing

[Skizz]

as most discussion now is on discord servers i wanted to share my actual straight-GW list:

2 Forrest
1 Plains
4 Savannah
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Karakas
1 Gaeas Cradle
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
2 Verdant Catacombs

1 Dryad Arbor
1 Birds of Paradies
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
3 Thalia, GoT
2 Pridemage
2 SFM
1 Ooze
1 Scrybranger
1 Teeg
4 Knights
1 Excavator
1 Rallier
1 Aven Mindcensor

4 StP
4 Zenith
1 Library
1 Jitte
1 SoFaI

-----
SB:
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Sanctum Prelate
1 Pithing Needle
2 Choke
2 Path to Exile
1 Krosan Grip
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Giddeon Ally of Zendikar
3 Surgical Extraction

as we have a weired local meta at time i play only 3 Thalia and 1 Aven Mindcensor (which is insane especially in Mirror Matches)
also nearly no delver lists but more prison- and vial/equipment-decks where 2 pridemages main are very useful.
still dont like playing more SFM's + Batterskull.
i think i might test a avacyns pilgrim in the spot of Birds - because only 2 colors and can block goblin lackey.
also conisder to squeeze a maze of ith or roges passage in the deck.

[walked]

There's a Maverick discord? Would you mind posting a link? :)

[Skizz]

https://discord.gg/rgsSje4

[walked]

Asked in the discord too, but:

Specifically in the new meta - what are your thoughts on punishing vs depths vs cradle builds? Moving over from 4c pile and trying to figure out which build to start on

[Valleysdai]

Asked in the discord too, but:

Specifically in the new meta - what are your thoughts on punishing vs depths vs cradle builds? Moving over from 4c pile and trying to figure out which build to start on

I believe that the punishing build could be the best with all of the small creatures and miracles about.

But the chance to win out of nowhere and how I've adapted my deck keeps me firmly in the depths plan.

[Fatal]

Asked in the discord too, but:

Specifically in the new meta - what are your thoughts on punishing vs depths vs cradle builds? Moving over from 4c pile and trying to figure out which build to start on

Meta shift to stifle, RUG is back, Grixis changes to stifle build, this mean that cradle and Darth depths build isn't favorable, probably the best will be punishing fire to recur removal. With miracle rise straight GW or GWb with decay MD and 3cmc walkers MD isn't bad idea.

[The Duck!!]

Currently running this list.

Main Deck (60):
4 noble hierarch
4 knight of the reliquary
4 mother of runes
3 thalia, guardian of thraben
2 stoneforge mystic
1 dryad arbor
1 scavenging ooze
1 scryb ranger
1 gaddock teeg
1 qasali pridemage
1 ramunap excavator
1 renegade rallier
1 tireless tracker
1 sigarda, host of herons
1 umezawa’s jitte
1 sword of fire and ice
1 sylvan library
4 green sun’s zenith
4 swords to plowshares
4 windswept heath
3 verdant catacombs
2 savannah
2 bayou
1 scrubland
4 wasteland
1 horizon canopy
1 karakas
1 ghost quarter
1 bojuka bog
1 gaea’s cradle
1 forest
1 plains

Side Board (15):
2 ethersworn canonist
2 containment priest
1 gideon, ally of zendikar
1 garruk relentless
2 surgical extraction
1 nihil spellbomb
2 zealous persecution
1 liliana, the last hope
2 choke

Meta in my country is very diverse but currently post ban of drs,people use lands, aggro loam, drazi post, dnt and rug delvers.

What do you guys think of the list?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Fatal]

Currently running this list.

Main Deck (60):
4 noble hierarch
4 knight of the reliquary
4 mother of runes
3 thalia, guardian of thraben
2 stoneforge mystic
1 dryad arbor
1 scavenging ooze
1 scryb ranger
1 gaddock teeg
1 qasali pridemage
1 ramunap excavator
1 renegade rallier
1 tireless tracker
1 sigarda, host of herons
1 umezawa’s jitte
1 sword of fire and ice
1 sylvan library
4 green sun’s zenith
4 swords to plowshares
4 windswept heath
3 verdant catacombs
2 savannah
2 bayou
1 scrubland
4 wasteland
1 horizon canopy
1 karakas
1 ghost quarter
1 bojuka bog
1 gaea’s cradle
1 forest
1 plains

Side Board (15):
2 ethersworn canonist
2 containment priest
1 gideon, ally of zendikar
1 garruk relentless
2 surgical extraction
1 nihil spellbomb
2 zealous persecution
1 liliana, the last hope
2 choke

Meta in my country is very diverse but currently post ban of drs,people use lands, aggro loam, drazi post, dnt and rug delvers.

What do you guys think of the list?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not sure about:
- only 3 Thalia MD
- No Thoughtseize / vs Canonist
- Liliana, the Last Hope (without DRS it's hard to get 1BB) / to bad we don't have any other 3 CMC walker, which is useful
- No Sylvan Safekeeper (with Ramunap and Railler MD).

[Megadeus]

If a 3 CMC Walker is what you're looking towards I think Nissa and Ajani Caller of the Pride are options. Nissa making a plant actually isn't the worst to fight edicts, it also can attack with exalted triggers, and the -2 ability is nice especially post board to fight -1-1 effects that have gained some value with noble being the new main mana dork. Ajani also is nice fitting in with exalted them by pumping a single dude which is nice against miracles because it allows you to pressure with a single threat to avoid over extending into sweepers. Also with a fat KOTR out his flying and Double Strike ability can be a one hit KO against an unprepared opponent.

[Rascalyote]

3 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty

4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Sylvan Library
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Garruk Relentless

1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
4 Wasteland
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
2 Forest
1 Plains
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats

1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Choke
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Zealous Persecution
4 Thoughtseize
2 Surgical Extraction

Played a 5 round legacy classic here at Magic Stronghold games in Vancouver using this list. Was unsure on last few slots but they performed (never drew Elspeth all day though). Scryb Ranger was MVP of the day, and Marit Lage had a very strong showing ... flying is just a good ability haha. Sword was good too and I wouldn't want to cut it like those 2 Jitte lists I've seen. Not 100% sure I remember how I sideboarded but should be close.

Rd 1 vs Show and Tell 1-2

Game 1 I smack him with dudes and he doesn't do anything

Game 2 I get hit with Emrakul off sneak and slowly rebuild as Im not really drawing much but he whiffs creatures for like 10 turns in a row but eventually finds one and kills me as I joke about this Dryad Arbor doing 12 more damage.

Game 3 I keep a hand of 3 lands, Teeg, Thalia, Pridemage, Choke. He goes land petal petal show in omni cast emrakul. I got outplayed.


+1 Choke
+2 Canonist
+4 Thoughtseize
+2 Surgical
-1 Shalai
-1 Garruk
-4 Plow
-1 SOFI
-1 Jitte
-1 SFM


0-1

Rd 2 Burn 2-0

Game 1 I land Shalai and get pretty low so decide to block Eidolon when he attacks with it and a guide letting him trade eidolon+ bolt for her (I can't just not play spells and not block for the rest of the game). I drop an ooze and gain a bit of life and he drops vortex so I'm on a clock. I end up getting a 6/6 knight and 6/6 ooze and 12 him when he's at 14 and let him die to vortex.

Game 2 I stick mother plus Shalai. Feel pretty lucky that I see my 1 of Shalai both games vs the matchup it's really strong.

+2 Decay
+2 Canonist (I really don't have a good sideboard for this MU)
-1 Garruk
-1 Tracker
-1 Ramunap
-1 Library

1-1

Rd 3 BUG Delver 2-0

Game 1 I play a Garruk and it rolls him, at one point he has a TNN, a 5/6 goyf and a gurmag to my two healthy wolves and three deathtouch wolves and I have to do math on a garruk ult but I'd lose my Garruk and it'd make goyf a 6/7. It would be lethal if he blocked the deathtouchers but he's already not going to do that. I make more sick wolves, TNN eventually kills garruk in 2 hits, I get scryb ranger and I get to slowly kill him, getting to attack with sick wolves too when his TNN attacks me and then I can untap sick wolf with Ranger.

Game 2 he mulligans to 4 but I almost die to a TNN. He has an Angler to go with it but I have Scryb Ranger + Dryad Arbor fog and a sword on the ranger clocks him faster than TNN clocks me.

I honestly can't remember how I boarded. Choke came in, Zealous didn't come in, I brought in either Decays or Elspeth or both but I forget which. Forget what I cut other than Teeg, really tired forgive me.

2-1

Rd 3 Rector Fit 2-0

Game 1 he's stuck on two lands and a bunch of big drops and I flood like 8 lands none of them utility lands but I have Thalia + Jitte and it just kills him, fun game thanks Thalia, now get out of my deck for game 2 ;3.

Game 2 I thoughtseize him a couple times and then set up an ooze which blanks all his rectors and just kill him with it, feels really good to just attack into active rector, remember kids Zenith OP.

+4 Thoughtseize
+2 Surgical
+1 Elspeth
-4 Thalia
-3 Mother

3 -1

Rd 5 I.D.

Quarters - Death and Taxes 2-0

Game 1 I have Scryb Ranger, Jitte and a bunch of stuff going on and I'm able to outgrind double brightling plus vial on 3 (really annoying btw)

Game 2 he has early Avenger with War and Peace on it putting me to 2 and him to 26. I hail mary Marit Lage while I have mother in play, I then land Scryb Ranger. I can't start attacking yet as he's kinda wide and I have to use my nobles to play creatures and then untap them to represent blockers so he can't sneak in 2 damage. Eventually I'm able to have a wide enough board I can swing with Lage and then vigilance it with Ranger and once he's low enough for 1 hit to kill him we go Mom pro protection on lage, he plows, I untap mom and protect again in response. We did have to dodge Karakas for a couple turns which we did but if he drew it a bit later after we gone wide we weren't just dead as we still had Ranger + Mom which is really hard to deal with.

+3 Zealous
+2 Decay
-4 Thalia
-1 Teeg

#NeverCutDepths. Is the 1 Thalia or 1 Thoughtseize better than the 1 Shalai post board? I doubt it, Shalai flies, don't let the Karakas fear seep in it gets nailed by our wastelands a lot.

Semi's - Miracles 2-0

Game 1 He doesn't really do much outside of a Gideon of the Trails (!) that's ticking up on my big Knight while I'm grinding out cards with Ramunap and eventually that plus Thalia kill Gideon and then he just dies after.

Game 2 I keep Bird, Noble, Zenith, Garruk, and some lands. Turn 2 I think a bit and decide to Zenith for 2 threatening Teeg even though the only action in my hand after is Garruk which I wouldn't be able to cast, he forces it and then next turn I slam Garruk and he can't deal with it, it makes a wolf every turn until the game ends and they devour 2 Jace's before eating him as well. Opponent didn't see a sweeper the whole match.

+1 Elspeth
+1 Choke
+2 Decay
-3 Plow
-1 Ooze

Opponent is on 0 Snapcaster Mages so I cut Ooze, it's a sweet list with Teferi's though.

Split finals, $160 each

[Fatal]

from Eternal Weekend Japan:

25位 Takahashi Naoto
デッキ名：まべ太郎


土地
2《Bayou》
1《ボジューカの沼/Bojuka Bog》
1《ドライアドの東屋/Dryad Arbor》
1《森/Forest》
1《ガイアの揺籃の地/Gaea's Cradle》
1《地平線の梢/Horizon Canopy》
1《カラカス/Karakas》
1《平地/Plains》
3《Savannah》
3《新緑の地下墓地/Verdant Catacombs》
1《ヴォルラスの要塞/Volrath's Stronghold》
3《不毛の大地/Wasteland》
4《吹きさらしの荒野/Windswept Heath》


クリーチャー
2《極楽鳥/Birds of Paradise》
1《ガドック・ティーグ/Gaddock Teeg》
4《聖遺の騎士/Knight of the Reliquary》
3《ルーンの母/Mother of Runes》
2《貴族の教主/Noble Hierarch》
1《クァーサルの群れ魔道士/Qasali Pridemage》
1《ラムナプの採掘者/Ramunap Excavator》
1《漁る軟泥/Scavenging Ooze》
1《スクリブのレインジャー/Scryb Ranger》
2《石鍛冶の神秘家/Stoneforge Mystic》
1《森を護る者/Sylvan Safekeeper》
3《スレイベンの守護者、サリア/Thalia, Guardian of Thraben》
1《不屈の追跡者/Tireless Tracker》


スペル
2《突然の衰微/Abrupt Decay》
4《剣を鍬に/Swords to Plowshares》
4《緑の太陽の頂点/Green Sun's Zenith》
1《森の知恵/Sylvan Library》
1《火と氷の剣/Sword of Fire and Ice》
1《光と影の剣/Sword of Light and Shadow》
1《梅澤の十手/Umezawa's Jitte》


サイドボード
1《封じ込める僧侶/Containment Priest》
1《聖域の僧院長/Sanctum Prelate》
2《外科的摘出/Surgical Extraction》
2《盲信的迫害/Zealous Persecution》
1《議会の採決/Council's Judgment》
3《思考囲い/Thoughtseize》
1《窒息/Choke》
1《忘却の輪/Oblivion Ring》
1《静寂/Serenity》
1《真髄の針/Pithing Needle》
1《ゼンディカーの同盟者、ギデオン/Gideon, Ally of Zendikar》

[boneSANITY]

Hello all, there didn't seem to be a subreddit set up for the deck, so I went ahead and made one: https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGMaverick/

Please feel free to add content there, and discuss the deck. I know for a lot of people (such as myself), Reddit can be a great tool for this kind of stuff. The sub is brand new so... it definitely needs some love and content to get it off the ground.

[Valleysdai]

Had a tournament where I played miracles twice and Omnisneak once.

How do we beat them? I've tried various strategies against miracles and had very little luck.

[Cpt-Qc]

Had a tournament where I played miracles twice and Omnisneak once.

How do we beat them? I've tried various strategies against miracles and had very little luck.

Miracles is bad. Your best best is to thoughtseize/surgical one of their two removal and use your bears to blank the other (surgical stp, cast Teeg // surgical terminus, cast prelate on 1). Or if you can land a timely choke or an equipment and fetch dryad arbor after terminus.

Omni is unwinnable unless they draw poorly.

[specialagentcooper]

Just got back from playing at gp Richmond with GWb Maverick. Very happy with the deck and my finish. Day one I ended with a 6-0-2 record, finished day two at 9-3-3. Got 30 points and my first pro point! Losses were miracles, elves, and sneak and show. I ended up playing against miracles 6 times in 15 rounds ugh. I'll post my list here when I get the chance.

[Fatal]

Just got back from playing at gp Richmond with GWb Maverick. Very happy with the deck and my finish. Day one I ended with a 6-0-2 record, finished day two at 9-3-3. Got 30 points and my first pro point! Losses were miracles, elves, and sneak and show. I ended up playing against miracles 6 times in 15 rounds ugh. I'll post my list here when I get the chance.

Congrats on your finish !

6/15 Miracles looks as very exhausting tournament.

[alvoi]

Hello everyone! I'm new and I'm getting into legacy. I just purchased some duals so I can play a real deck. This is the list I am going to play:

4 mother of runes
4 birds of paradise
4 knight of the reliquary
3 stoneforge mystic
1 scryb ranger
1 qasali pridemage
1 ramunap excavator
1 voice of resurgence
1 scavenging ooze
1 dryad arbor

2 umezawa's jitte
1 batterskull
1 sylvan library

4 green sun's zenith
4 swords to plowshares
4 punishing fire

4 wooded foothills
4 windswept heath
4 wasteland
3 grove of the burnwillows
2 savannah
2 forest
1 plateau
1 taiga
1 plains
1 karakas

Of all this cards I don't have only the wastelands and 1 savannah, so I think I'm at a good point in building the deck. What do you think about it? Do you have any suggestions? Also for the sideboard

Thank you and sorry for my bad english

[Skizz]

welcome @alvoi

your list should be a good start playing, but if you ever can purchase some noble hierarchs, get em!

i see its a budget reason, but if you play 4 birds you should play at least 1 Sword of XY (Fire & Ice) because birds cant attack/block with equipped jitte on them and you never get profit out of that.

also if you have access to Discord https://discord.gg/rgsSje4, your welcome to join us . there is a P.Fire channel where good players discuss that archtype

[alvoi]

welcome @alvoi

your list should be a good start playing, but if you ever can purchase some noble hierarchs, get em!

i see its a budget reason, but if you play 4 birds you should play at least 1 Sword of XY (Fire & Ice) because birds cant attack/block with equipped jitte on them and you never get profit out of that.

also if you have access to Discord https://discord.gg/rgsSje4, your welcome to join us . there is a P.Fire channel where good players discuss that archtype

Thank you!

I know that the birds of paradise are a budget reason, but I think also that we need a lot of red mana. So when I will buy the hierarchs I think I will also add another red source (maybe the second taiga?).

But for now, I think I will play with birds. The sword is a nice idea, which do you think is better? I was thinking about sword of feast and famine because it is also good against combo (making them discard so they have less cards), and combo is one of our worse matchups. What would you remove for the sword? Another equipment? Maybe I can move the batterskull to the sideboard, I think jitte is too powerful and playing 2 copies is good against artifact removal (we don't have any recursion so when a jitte dies the only way to have it again is to have a second copy). What do you think?

For the sideboard, I was thinking about playing: 1 bojuka bog, 2 pyroblast, 1 gaddock teeg, 4 thalia guardian of thraben (so I can switch her with punishing fires in some matchups). But then I don't know what else. Maybe something like manriki-gusari, or the second qasali pridemage?

EDIT: I don't have discord so I think I will just stay here :smile:

Thank you!

[Seraphix]

Hello everyone! I'm new and I'm getting into legacy. I just purchased some duals so I can play a real deck. This is the list I am going to play:

...



Welcome, check out the section of the Primer on Page 1 which focuses on the Punishing Fire version if you haven't already!

[alvoi]

Yeah I read it and it was really nice, thank you!

So, after reading it, I have some cards that I would like to put in the deck (but I don't know what to remove):

— Sword of Feast and Famine (also because Skizz said it). I tried the sword (instead of the batterskull) and it was really nice, even though I think the batterskull is better in some matchups (like control). So, what can I remove for the sword? Now I'm playing with 3 SFM, 2 jittes and 1 batterskull. Could I move to 3 SFM, 2 jittes, 1 batterskull and 1 sword? Or shall I remove the second jitte? I really like it though, it is very useful in a lot of matchups.

— Tireless Tracker. I have played it in modern in the Todd Stevens deck (the one with Ramunap Excavator, Azusa, Courser of Kruphix and so on) and it really shined. I think it would be a nice fit also in maverick, but again: what to remove? Maybe I can get rid of voice, against decks with plow it does nothing; the tracker instead at least cycles (obviously I would play it only before my land drop, so I can take advantage of a clue before the opponent plows/bolts it.

— Gaddock Teeg. I see that everyone plays it in the maindeck. I would rather play it in sideboard, so I will ask you: why do you play it in the maindeck? Is it okay if I play it in sideboard, or shall I play it in maindeck?

— Horizon Canopy. I don't own the card yet but I think in the future I will buy 1-2 copies. It is a really nice land, but our manabase is really tight for now: I can't remove the dual lands (or can I?), neither the fetchlands, the utility lands or the basic lands. So the choice is: I can get rid of 1 Savannah or 1 Wasteland for Horizon Canopy. What would you do? Removing the second savannah would be better for budget reasons, but I cannot think only about budget, I have to think also about the best choices for the deck! So I'm not sure.

I hope you will answer me, sorry if I'm not good at english but I'm italian so in my mind I'm thinking in italian and it is difficult to translate.

[Skizz]

@alvoi:

- regarding Swords X/Y:

best sword is still Sword of Fire and Ice because of the following reasons :
pro Blue: fights through TNN and Strix / pro Red : good against Bolt/Goblins etc (less important)
draw a card : very good CA to get more pressure out of the deck.

next best sword = Sword of Light and Shadow:
pro white: great against Death and Taxes and mirror/ swords to plowshares
pro black: great againts Death Shadow / Angler Fish / Strix / black removal in general
recursiuon gets you back Pridemage etc. / lifegain is "ok" but not relevant at all

feast and famine
pro green and pro black is good against the most creature colours but the effect to untap lands is marginal
make the opponent discard is "ok" but if you use it against combo decks - its way too slow to connect.
dont recommend it at actual meta

==> swap the 2nd jitte for sword fire and ice and test it a few games

(also if you want a good recursion card -> renegade rallier brings you back all CMC2 or less permanents (jitte/Pridemage/wasteland etc.pp)

- regarding Tireless Tracker:
way better than voice of resurgance (would swap it in your deck)
its one of the best CA Engines we have - especially in long grindy games it will push you ahead.

- reg. gaddock teeg:
its a core-hatebear which you should never remove in your maindeck.
imagine you play turn 1 manadork / turn two GSZ for gaddock teeg against a combodeck like ANT - its immediatly game over for them preboard.
also stops jace, terminus, force of will, challice, sneak attack etc.

- reg. horizon canopy
its a good card and you can swap one wasteland for it (punishing fire mostly only plays 3 wasteland)

[alvoi]

Oh, thank you a lot! Following your advices I made this changes:
-1 voice of resurgence
-1 wasteland
-1 jitte
+1 sword of fire&ice
+1 canopy
+1 tracker
+1 gaddock

Now I'm playing with 61 cards (I don't know what to remove) and it's fine I hope.

I'm thinking about swapping the sylvan library for a renegade rallier in the maindeck, and put the library in sideboard. What do you think?

My sideboard for now:
1 bojuka bog
4 thalia guardian of thraben
2 pyroblast
1 umezawa's jitte
1 life from the loam
1 gaddock teeg
1 sylvan library
3 surgical extraction

What would you add to my sideboard? Maybe something else for combo matchups?

Thank you all!

[Skizz]

you could cut 1 fetch land to go back down to 60 cards

i dont know your meta BUT
i would suggest you cut the 1 Jitte and 1 Thalia for 2 ethersworn canonists
normally you dont need life from the loam in general -> you could bring in reclamation sage for additional hate on artifacts/enchantments.

deck should be fine for now. let us know how it works :-)

[KobeBryan]

with Ramump you want knights, wastelands, and horizon

[Zulabnar]

I think that this new card can solve some problems to maverick's and could worth splash black for it.


https://www.cardmarket.com/it/Magic/Products/Singles/Guilds+of+Ravnica/Assassins-Trophy

[KobeBryan]

I think that this new card can solve some problems to maverick's and could worth splash black for it.


https://www.cardmarket.com/it/Magic/Products/Singles/Guilds+of+Ravnica/Assassins-Trophy

That is a killer card for...modern

[Skizz]

great card with a loooot of versatility!
in abzan version it will probably replace abrupt decay

[Gabuts007]

Anybody already tried (play tested) Assasins Trophy MD in GWB Mav?

[Rascalyote]

Knight of Autumn is nuts. RIP pridemage? :(

[KobeBryan]

Knight of Autumn is nuts. RIP pridemage? :(

3 mana.

[alvoi]

3 mana.

Qasali is 3 mana, too.

I think Knight will be better. More versatility is more power

[Rascalyote]

3 mana.

You're right 1GW for a knight is unthinkable

[Qweerios]

... More versatility is more power

Exactly. This is why QPM is still way better.

It's a fine complememt to QPM though.

[Cpt-Qc]

Knight is way more comparable to Rec Sage than it is to pridemage. They do completely different things. I can see them working side by side but not one over the other.

Do you play rec sage? If yes, it should be Knight. -- If not, do you play 2 pridemages? If yes, the second should be knight. Otherwise, stick with pridemage.

[Zulabnar]

hi guys
i know that what i'm writing will seems heresy for lot of You

but in my meta i'm not sure about Mother of runes

i would like to cut this 4x cc1 drop (and 1 is already gone)

what would you like to put in?

this is my list, is small tuning by Kodaira Syouta one (http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=20005&d=329755&f=LE)

23 LANDS
1 Arid Mesa
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Forest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 bayou
1 Maze of Ith
1 Plains
4 Savannah
1 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath

23 CREATURES

1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Ramunap Excavator
2 Renegade Rallier
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Voice of Resurgence

9 INSTANTS and SORC.

2 Council's Judgment
3 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares

5 OTHER SPELLS

1 Garruk Relentless
1 Nissa, Vital Force
1 Sylvan Library
2 Umezawa's Jitte

SIDEBOARD
2 Choke
2 Containment Priest
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Mistcutter hydra
2 Golgari charm
1 Sanctum Prelate
3 Surgical Extraction
1 XXXXX

[Fatal]

If your meta is more combo / mass removal oriented you can easily cut all moms (I use only 1 Sylvan Safekeeper as protection on demand under GSZ), that free slots for more CA creatures like Renegade Railler or Tireless Tracker which is very good and you should consider it MD imo, I'm not a big fan of Voice of Resurgence, I would rather put SFM since it always bring CA.

Soon Black splash will get Decay on Steroids, which would be 4-of probably MD, since it can kill lands and walkers on instant.

Mistcutter hydra ? Vs which deck, It's just cute and totally useless, probably better use Tindermare if you wan't haste, unblockable creature (it can be GSZ).

[Zulabnar]

If your meta is more combo / mass removal oriented you can easily cut all moms (I use only 1 Sylvan Safekeeper as protection on demand under GSZ), that free slots for more CA creatures like Renegade Railler or Tireless Tracker which is very good and you should consider it MD imo, I'm not a big fan of Voice of Resurgence, I would rather put SFM since it always bring CA.

Soon Black splash will get Decay on Steroids, which would be 4-of probably MD, since it can kill lands and walkers on instant.

Mistcutter hydra ? Vs which deck, It's just cute and totally useless, probably better use Tindermare if you wan't haste, unblockable creature (it can be GSZ).


IN my meta i expect lots of combo, eldrazi (mom....), control with big removal.

Mistcutter his my personal choice against hard control (i.e preban UBG control).
it kills jace and every pw because of haste + hexproof is a sort of removal for planeswalker in late game, when you lost your resource and oppo too, he cast pw and you cast this and it's really good.

Tindermare what is? i guess is misspell but i did not understand what you mean (except thundemare lol)

Tireless Tracker: i test it, too slow for my playstile. I always have other to do than sacrifice clues.

Voice: i was skeptical about, but after some playtest i think is fucking good, it does 2 x 1 most of time and i love it. I advice you to test it.

Now i'm thinking of

-3 mom
+1 gsz
+1 wasteland
+1 safekeeper


SFM are nice, but whit decay\trophy i guess it will lose sense.

Maybe with decay+trophy mom could became usefull again.

[Fatal]

IN my meta i expect lots of combo, eldrazi (mom....), control with big removal.

Mistcutter his my personal choice against hard control (i.e preban UBG control).
it kills jace and every pw because of haste + hexproof is a sort of removal for planeswalker in late game, when you lost your resource and oppo too, he cast pw and you cast this and it's really good.

Tindermare what is? i guess is misspell but i did not understand what you mean (except thundemare lol)

Tireless Tracker: i test it, too slow for my playstile. I always have other to do than sacrifice clues.

Voice: i was skeptical about, but after some playtest i think is fucking good, it does 2 x 1 most of time and i love it. I advice you to test it.

Now i'm thinking of

-3 mom
+1 gsz
+1 wasteland
+1 safekeeper


SFM are nice, but whit decay\trophy i guess it will lose sense.

Maybe with decay+trophy mom could became useful again.

Problem with hexprof is too many mass/not targeting removal like Miracles, or good wall, I tested voice and each time was disappointed to small vs tempo against yours / goose, too small against control to be a thread and dies easily to STP if equipped without value, worked in GBw nic fit, but not Maverick. It's green and have x/2 so aren't great against D&T, SFM looks better every time, even if killed right away it's alaways 2 for 1, and it isn't depends on opponent action - that's why SFM > Voice ( and less restrictive cost)

A typo: 3G - 5/5 haste and better unblock which has synergy with scryb ranger.
Timbermare

[Zulabnar]

Problem with hexprof is too many mass/not targeting removal like Miracles, or good wall, I tested voice and each time was disappointed to small vs tempo against yours / goose, too small against control to be a thread and dies easily to STP if equipped without value, worked in GBw nic fit, but not Maverick. It's green and have x/2 so aren't great against D&T, SFM looks better every time, even if killed right away it's alaways 2 for 1, and it isn't depends on opponent action - that's why SFM > Voice ( and less restrictive cost)

A typo: 3G - 5/5 haste and better unblock which has synergy with scryb ranger.
Timbermare

I guess it depends a lot of Metagames.
In mine SFM does not last longer, lighting bolt, stp, decay etc. let me prefer don't run SFM but creatures.
We need a new creature for beating, that's what i hope to find in Ravnica.

Timbermare really has no clue, Hydra is uncounterable, it means that with 4G (timbermare) i have a 4\4 protection from blue that has haste ---> cast attack jace\pw dodging Leovold, Pigeon (strix), tnn and so on.


About the Assasin's trophy i think that SFM will became worse, and maybe Mother will come stronger.

My problem with moms is that on turn 1 if i'm on the play i prefer gsz to dryad or hierarch, on turn 2 i prefer another creature or if i have wasteland now i play mom + wasteland.

[lavafrogg]

Problem with hexprof is too many mass/not targeting removal like Miracles, or good wall, I tested voice and each time was disappointed to small vs tempo against yours / goose, too small against control to be a thread and dies easily to STP if equipped without value, worked in GBw nic fit, but not Maverick. It's green and have x/2 so aren't great against D&T, SFM looks better every time, even if killed right away it's alaways 2 for 1, and it isn't depends on opponent action - that's why SFM > Voice ( and less restrictive cost)

A typo: 3G - 5/5 haste and better unblock which has synergy with scryb ranger.
Timbermare

I’m jumping back in to the Maverick game with my 7 Thalia list again. I had a ton of success in the DRS meta with baleful Strix running around and think she is positioned well right now.

[Zulabnar]

I’m jumping back in to the Maverick game with my 7 Thalia list again. I had a ton of success in the DRS meta with baleful Strix running around and think she is positioned well right now.

CAn You show your list?
Search function doesn't work so well

[lavafrogg]

CAn You show your list?
Search function doesn't work so well

4 Thalia
3 Big Thalia
2 SFM
4 Mom

4 Noble Heirarch
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Pridemage
1 Teeg
1 Scooze
1 Excavator
1 Arbor

4 GSZ
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Jitte
1 SoFI

4 Heath
3 Catacombs
4 Wasteland
2 Forest
2 Plains
3 Savanah
1 Maze of Ith
1 Cradle
1 Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Ghost Quarter

Sideboard:
2 Choke
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Path to Exile
2 Sanctum Prelate
3 Surgical Extraction
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Thrun, the Last Troll

I am really high on Big Thalia again, she hurts all of the combo decks in the format right now(for the most part) and allow us to waste fetch lands and keep other creature decks a turn slower.

I’m also looking at:

3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
3 Stoneforge Mystic

4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Noble Hierarch
1 Bird of Paradise
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Ranumap Excavator
1 Teeg
1 Scooze
1 Arbor

4 Green Suns Zenith

4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Punishing Fire

1 SoFI
1 Jitte
1 Batterskull

4 Heath
3 Catacombs
3 Wasteland
3 Grove of the burnwillows
2 Forest
1 Plains
3 Savanah
1 Maze of Ith
1 Cradle
1 Canopy
1 Karakas

[lavafrogg]

4-0 tonight as follows

2-1 Big Eldrazi
Big Thalia and KotR won games 2 and 3 with a bunch of wastelands and ghost quarters thrown in for good measure.
Game 1 I kept a 2 mom 2 Thalia hand and got wrecked.

2-0 Storm
He mulled to 5 game one and lost to a turn 2 Big Thalia plus Wasteland on his fetches
Game 2 was little Thalia and friends bringing down the house

2-0 Death’s Shadow
I felt super behind both games but just attacked him twice before he died for the win. They deal soooo much damage to themselves that they can’t beat the random assortment of idiots at the end of the game. Game 2 He was at 10 with a Delver and I played a big Thalia. Next turn I hit him with a double exalted Thalia and he couldn’t play any blockers to stop the beats.

2-0 Goblins
Game 1 I had the Swords for the lackey and he proceeded to draw all of his vials while I played big dudes and equipment. Game 2 I went land-GSZ-Arbor and he went Wasteland-tarfire, I followed up with land-Heirarch and he couldn’t keep up.

Love being back on Maverick, Big Thalia is a monster.

[Seraphix]

After scrubbing out on day 1 of the SCG Open this weekend, I placed 10th in the Classic with Punishing Maverick (http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/123975).

Creature Spells (21)
4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Voice of Resurgence
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
4x Knight of the Reliquary

Noncreature Spells (15)
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
3x Punishing Fire
2x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull

Lands (23)
4x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
2x Savannah
2x Taiga
1x Plateau
1x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
3x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Karakas
3x Wasteland
1x Horizon Canopy


SB: 2x Choke
SB: 2x Pyroblast
SB: 2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SB: 2x Crop Rotation
SB: 1x Bojuka Bog
SB: 1x Surgical Extraction
SB: 1x Reclamation Sage
SB: 1x Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1x Council's Judgment
SB: 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant
SB: 1x Nissa Vital Force


There were around 120 players so it was a 7 round event. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Sneak & Show (W 2-0)
Round 2: Omni-Tell (W 2-1)
Round 3: Eldrazi Post (W 2-1)
Round 4: Eldrazi Aggro (W 2-1)
Round 5: UW Delver (W 2-0)
Round 6: ID
Round 7: BR Griselbrand (L 0-2)

Unfortunately I was paired down in the final round and had to play what turned out to be a bad matchup. So it goes.

[lavafrogg]

After scrubbing out on day 1 of the SCG Open this weekend, I placed 10th in the Classic with Punishing Maverick (http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/123975).

Creature Spells (21)
4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Voice of Resurgence
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
4x Knight of the Reliquary

Noncreature Spells (15)
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
3x Punishing Fire
2x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull

Lands (23)
4x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
2x Savannah
2x Taiga
1x Plateau
1x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
3x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Karakas
3x Wasteland
1x Horizon Canopy


SB: 2x Choke
SB: 2x Pyroblast
SB: 2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SB: 2x Crop Rotation
SB: 1x Bojuka Bog
SB: 1x Surgical Extraction
SB: 1x Reclamation Sage
SB: 1x Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1x Council's Judgment
SB: 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant
SB: 1x Nissa Vital Force


There were around 120 players so it was a 7 round event. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Sneak & Show (W 2-0)
Round 2: Omni-Tell (W 2-1)
Round 3: Eldrazi Post (W 2-1)
Round 4: Eldrazi Aggro (W 2-1)
Round 5: UW Delver (W 2-0)
Round 6: ID
Round 7: BR Griselbrand (L 0-2)

Unfortunately I was paired down in the final round and had to play what turned out to be a bad matchup. So it goes.

2-0 and 2-1 against Show and Tell is awesome though! I love the Eldrazi and Delver matchups now as well.

How were the punishing fires outside of the delver round? The other 5 rounds don't have very good fire targets, would you have preferred Thalias main?

[Stuart]

Been pretty checked out of Legacy for a bit, but I need to start thinking about EW. Maverick is on my shortlist of decks to play, and I'm wondering about a few tweaks to my list:
- My sideboard Rec Sage should pretty clearly become Knight of Autumn, right? Outside of being harder to cast vs Blood Moon, this seems like a no-brainer.
- Right now I'm on a singleton Abrupt Decay in the main. As I'm sure every BGx player is asking right now, should that be an Ass Trophy?
- I'm told that Leyline of the Void is on the upswing. Right now, I'm on 1 Scooze and 3 Surgical. How do we feel about turning those into 4 Leyline?

[KobeBryan]

After scrubbing out on day 1 of the SCG Open this weekend, I placed 10th in the Classic with Punishing Maverick (http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/123975).

Creature Spells (21)
4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
3x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Voice of Resurgence
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
4x Knight of the Reliquary

Noncreature Spells (15)
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
3x Punishing Fire
2x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull

Lands (23)
4x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
2x Savannah
2x Taiga
1x Plateau
1x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
3x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Karakas
3x Wasteland
1x Horizon Canopy


SB: 2x Choke
SB: 2x Pyroblast
SB: 2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SB: 2x Crop Rotation
SB: 1x Bojuka Bog
SB: 1x Surgical Extraction
SB: 1x Reclamation Sage
SB: 1x Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1x Council's Judgment
SB: 1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant
SB: 1x Nissa Vital Force


There were around 120 players so it was a 7 round event. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Sneak & Show (W 2-0)
Round 2: Omni-Tell (W 2-1)
Round 3: Eldrazi Post (W 2-1)
Round 4: Eldrazi Aggro (W 2-1)
Round 5: UW Delver (W 2-0)
Round 6: ID
Round 7: BR Griselbrand (L 0-2)

Unfortunately I was paired down in the final round and had to play what turned out to be a bad matchup. So it goes.

No ramunap excavator

[Cpt-Qc]

Been pretty checked out of Legacy for a bit, but I need to start thinking about EW. Maverick is on my shortlist of decks to play, and I'm wondering about a few tweaks to my list:
- My sideboard Rec Sage should pretty clearly become Knight of Autumn, right? Outside of being harder to cast vs Blood Moon, this seems like a no-brainer.
- Right now I'm on a singleton Abrupt Decay in the main. As I'm sure every BGx player is asking right now, should that be an Ass Trophy?
- I'm told that Leyline of the Void is on the upswing. Right now, I'm on 1 Scooze and 3 Surgical. How do we feel about turning those into 4 Leyline?

1: Correct, no reason not to play autumn guy with so many ways to produce G and W off dorks/basics.
2: Still being tested but I doubt we want to give lands to our opponent when we're a mana denial deck.
3: The only reason to be running leyline instead of surgical is if you're playing chalice because then you can't cast it. Surgical is just a better all-around card.

[bomberman32]

Has anyone tried TNN? Making a blue maverick list. Still running the usual maverick package of some number of GSZ and Kotr

[pettdan]

Has anyone tried TNN? Making a blue maverick list. Still running the usual maverick package of some number of GSZ and Kotr

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?16059-Deck-Bant

They play Brainstorm, FoW and Daze rather than some amount of GSZ, Thalia and Mother of Runes. Don't recall seeing anything reminding of it here.

[lavafrogg]

Any new Maverick things floating around?

I am currently on DnT but miss my GW monster every time I sleeve up.

[Rascalyote]

Played in a 6 round Legacy Classic here in Beautiful British Columbia at Magic Stronghold Games, bringing back some of my juicy tech. I present-

Maverick 2. Return of the Maindeck Thoughtseize. Rated R. In theaters Saturday.

3 Thoughtseize
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Sylvan Library
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
15

3 Mother of Runes
3 Noble Hierarch
2 Birds of Paradise
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Ramunap Excavator
-22-

4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Wasteland
-23-

1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Garruk, Relentless
1 Liliana, The Last Hope
1 Knight of Autumn
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Path to Exile
1 Harm's Way
2 Surgical Extraction



First time trying Thoughtseize in the main since DRS left this format. I cut my girl Marit Lage for a basic swamp and more deck slots for these Thoughtseizes, going up to second Bird as well to help cast my spells. I didn't draw Harm's Way all day so I get to play my spicy tech card and not get punished for it being bad ;3. Hymn was insane, as were the walkers over choke. I don't actually own Trophies but Decay was good (played Eldrazi where I'd rather have Trophy but mostly preferred Decay) and the 1 path was nice as well. I wish I had room to maindeck Knight of Autumn or just play more of them in general, but alas slots are tight and I have so many 3 drops.

Here's a quick tournament report, made with love using bad notes and an even worse memory, so some details may be wrong.

Rd 1 Grixis Control

Game 1 he draws both his fish and I don't draw anything for it and I just die. I don't let this get to me though and do my same SB plan of boarding plows and bringing in decays
Game 2 Honestly forget but I win
Game 3 I have an early turn that's Wasteland you, active knight to get BB -> Hymn you hitting land and brainstorm (wow this feels so good not being on the receiving end), play Thalia. He misses his land drop and doesn't have a cantrip now. I set up big board of knight knight thalia mom ranger to his couple strixes and I mom both knights past those and nail him for 18 in one hit.


+1 Elspeth
+1 Garruk
+1 Liliana
+1 Knight of Autumn
+2 Decay
+1 Hymn
-1 Teeg
-1 Pridemage
-2 Thoughtseize
-3 Plow

2-1
1-0

Round 2 Eldrazi

Game 1 he Thoughtknots me turn 2 taking tracker. I peel plow and plow it drawing knight. He has a chalice a couple turns later but I wasteland him 4 times and then kill him with big girls.
Game 2 I keep a hand all in on wastelanding him and only spell is a plow. He turn 1 Spyglasses me and names Wasteland. Oops. I topdeck like a god most of the game and the game goes long. He ends up sowering me but he hits a wasteland that can't be used and 2 useless Verdants. At one point my board is 2 knights and a teeg and he's already had to chump with Endbringer and Sower. I play out a 3rd knight just cuz and he tutors ballista kills Teeg, and turns my board to dust. oops that's a !punt, he thinks about playing endless one for like 2 or something as a blocker because he's at one but decides to hold it to make a huge one next turn. I peel thoughtseize and rip it out of his hand, then peel the 4th Knight turn after. I drew really well this game.

+1 Garruk Relentless
+1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
+1 Knight of Autumn
+2 Abrupt Decay
+1 Path to Exile
+1 Harm's Way (lol)
-3 Mother of Runes
-3 Thalia
-1 SOFI

2-0
2-0

Rd 3 UW Control w/ RIP+Helm+Field

Game 1 Have no interaction and just die to the combo after putting him to 1
Game 2 Grindy control game I don't really remember
Game 3 7 hand has 0 lands. 6 hand has 0 lands. Keep 5 of Thalia, Pridemage, Decay, Scrubland, Bayou. Keep forest on top. I draw Thoughtseize the turn after I play Thalia, would've pref'd that turn 1 but w/e still good as it sees a bunch of lands and Jace and maybe some other spell I can't remember but cya Jace. He taps out for Mentor and I get to decay it on my turn. He plays Energy Field and I Knight of Autumn it and he just eventually dies to some 2/x's beating him down.

+1 Elspeth
+1 Garruk
+1 Liliana
+1 Knight
+2 Decay
+1 Hymn
-4 Plow
-1 Ramunap
-1 Wasteland
-1 Ooze

2-1
3-0

Rd 4 Miracles

Game 1 I thoughtseize him and he has 1 land, BS, 2 plow, CJ, Counterbalance, snapcaster. I take brainstorm and he ends up just top-decking 4 more lands in a row but I win the game eventually by having my early drops plowed, Pridemaging his CB, getting Knight CJ'd, and then resolving SoFI and getting it to eventually equip and then he died
Game 2 I resolve SOFI again and I have Thalia + Karakas. I'm patient and eventually find an opening to resolve Garruk. Makes a wolf every turn, he keeps clearing the board but the woofy boiz don't stop until he's dead, the sword quickens the pace. I had some gas going on in my hand like Liliana -> Knight of Autumn or w/e but he died before we got around to doing that.

+1 Elspeth
+1 Garruk
+1 Liliana
+1 Knight
+2 Decay
+1 Hymn
-4 Plow
-1 Noble
-1 Jitte
-1 Wasteland
2-0
4-0

Draw
Draw

First after swiss

Quarters vs Oops all bolts (UR Delver/Wizard Prowess)

Game 1 I keep a 2 lander with Thoughtseize and Library. I see delver daze bolt and cantrips. Im tempted to take daze to resolve library but I take Delver which slows his clock down a lot. I whiff on a 3rd land for like 6 turns but he whiffs on a threat for quite a while as well so I felt good taking the delver, I can't come back fast enough by the time I got another land.
Game 2 I play a ton of removal and win with big Knights. He punts somewhere in the middle of the game by playing Soul-Scar and is about to playing something else in the same turn but I have canonist and he brain-farted and was like 'oh derp right that's not non-creature it's non-artifact'
Game 3 Close game I end up playing a bunch of removal and a Hymn and have big Knights and Thalia again. His last turn he plays out Soul-Scar and has 1 card in hand. I'm at 6 but I play Knight of Autumn and gain 4 life which pretty much ensures my win at that point.

+1 Knight
+2 Canonist
+2 Decay
+1 Path
+1 Harm's Way
+1 Hymn
-3 Thoughtseize
-1 Library
-1 Pridemage
-1 Teeg
-1 Tracker
-1 Ramunap


We split top 4, I pick up a Masterpiece Liliana.

Shoutout to wolves, Garruk and Hymn thanks for the carry. Heck even Thoughtseize has a moon on it for those boys to howl to. GG's.

[NEELEY]

Any new Maverick things floating around?

I am currently on DnT but miss my GW monster every time I sleeve up.

76% winrate over 100 Matches

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1428944#paper

[Mirrislegend]

76% winrate over 100 Matches

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1428944#paper

I really like your list. Would you mind answering a few questions?

How firm is the Macabre/Surgical split? Have you felt any strong urges to go 4x Surgical, 0x Macabre?

Do you miss Dark Depths + Thespian's Stage or Maze of Ith?

Have you considered Tireless Tracker or Ramunap Excavator? What about Sanctum Prelate or Containment Priest?

Which matchups do you feel are toughest?

[ThediscoPower]

I really like your list. Would you mind answering a few questions?

How firm is the Macabre/Surgical split? Have you felt any strong urges to go 4x Surgical, 0x Macabre?

Do you miss Dark Depths + Thespian's Stage or Maze of Ith?

Have you considered Tireless Tracker or Ramunap Excavator? What about Sanctum Prelate or Containment Priest?

Which matchups do you feel are toughest?

Same questions for me. Plus add that I wanted to know about how palace jailler is performing, and how is that list performing against miracles specifically. I feel the only problem I have online is that matchup and the rest are pretty much manageable with some tweaking.

[NEELEY]

I really like your list. Would you mind answering a few questions?

How firm is the Macabre/Surgical split? Have you felt any strong urges to go 4x Surgical, 0x Macabre?

Do you miss Dark Depths + Thespian's Stage or Maze of Ith?

Have you considered Tireless Tracker or Ramunap Excavator? What about Sanctum Prelate or Containment Priest?

Which matchups do you feel are toughest?

1. I think the diversity is good vs reanimator due to chancellor. Also good vs dredge because of therapy.
2. I don’t play dd/ts. I like my deck to be consistent and want to minimize mulligans.
3. I played both in the jailer slots. Jailer has been very good, it can swing matches that you though we’re over. I
Am playing 2 prelate in the 3rd canonist and path to exile slots. Containment priest is what I’ll probably play at eternal weekend, due to how good it is vs dredge and sneak.
4. Miracles and sneak are my toughest matches.

[Mirrislegend]

1. I think the diversity is good vs reanimator due to chancellor. Also good vs dredge because of therapy.
2. I don’t play dd/ts. I like my deck to be consistent and want to minimize mulligans.
3. I played both in the jailer slots. Jailer has been very good, it can swing matches that you though we’re over. I
Am playing 2 prelate in the 3rd canonist and path to exile slots. Containment priest is what I’ll probably play at eternal weekend, due to how good it is vs dredge and sneak.
4. Miracles and sneak are my toughest matches.

Have you tried a 2nd Teeg in the SB for use vs Miracles? Also, I imagine the Containment Priest, Sanctum Prelates, and Knight of Autumn shore up the game vs Sneak and Show significantly! Is it still rough, after all those additions?

[NEELEY]

Have you tried a 2nd Teeg in the SB for use vs Miracles? Also, I imagine the Containment Priest, Sanctum Prelates, and Knight of Autumn shore up the game vs Sneak and Show significantly! Is it still rough, after all those additions?

I’ve tried 2nd teeg. I lose to miracles and sneak and show about 50% of the time. The match ups are just tough when you play vs GOOD opponents. You are not going to turn the miracles match up in your favor without hurting in other areas. They have terminus and councils judgement. When they draw the right cards we lose.

All together terminus/snap/plow matches up great vs our deck. Hard to flip it in our favor.

[NEELEY]

Same questions for me. Plus add that I wanted to know about how palace jailler is performing, and how is that list performing against miracles specifically. I feel the only problem I have online is that matchup and the rest are pretty much manageable with some tweaking.

Jailer is great and swings match ups In your favor. Miracles is about 50/50 but probabaly more like 60/40 in their favor if they are good players

[ThediscoPower]

Jailer is great and swings match ups In your favor. Miracles is about 50/50 but probabaly more like 60/40 in their favor if they are good players

that's enough to sell me. I'm trying out those jailers tonight! i am probably going to have to cut my second sylvan library, but i think it might be worth it.

[Grobbs]

Hello everyone:

I have been following for a while this thread and appretiate your opinions on the deck. I have been a Maverick player for the time it has existed in Legacy since the GSZ addition, I think I know a lot of tricks with the deck although I am not the best player I could be. Still, I have achieved decent records in some 100-200+ people tournaments and, you won't believe, I have managed to win Miracles a few times without completely adapting the list. With this said, I would like to thank you all for your knowledge.

I am now in need of more advice with my list and sideboard decision making. I am going to play a big tournament in a few days (MKM Series Zaragoza) and want to be able to win at least a 40% of times I face Miracles, which I think will be an important part of the metagame, and a higher rate against Grixis control. Here I paste my list and some of the reasons I based my decisions on. Any help is welcome.

// 2 Artifact
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

// 27 Creature
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Mother of Runes (I prefer 3+Sylvan sk because of the GSZ possibility and summoning sickness)
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Scryb Ranger (MVP, it enables so many tricks I never side her out)
2 Sanctum Prelate (I have been playing 1 for a while, but it is again very good to lock Miracles, Grixis and others in the g1)
1 Renegade Rallier (some situations are circumstantial but normally reanimating a countered or destroyed Thalia, Gaddock, jitte or sideboard piece is game winning)
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Tireless Tracker
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
2 Knight of Autumn (I know Qasali is a decent 2 drop, but I normally save it to be able to destroy sth what makes it cost 3 anyway. KoA is more versatile, better against S&S, D&T and adds some winning rate points vs. Burn thanks to GSZ. I expect a lot of Burns in big Legacy tournaments and it is not a good matchup even fetching basics and Wastelanding in response to PoP. Qasali is a good target for rallier, though, I could accept your reasoning to bring 1 back)
1 Stoneforge Mystic (I have experienced a lot of metagames with and without them and currently feel like playing 0+jitte or the 1+jitte+SoFaI configuration to make opposing Kolaghan's commands worse but still being able to fetch the equipment I want, against Miracles I side her out and only leave the sword, still being able to find it with Enlightened tutor if needed)

// 1 Enchantment
1 Sylvan Library (I feel like 2 are too many)

// 4 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares

// 22 Land + dryad
2 Forest (I fear Blood moon and being able to cast hierarch and GSZ is very important in that situation)
1 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
2 Savannah
1 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Wasteland
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Cavern of Souls (tough decision, but some games naming human is all you need to win)
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Scrubland
1 Bayou (black lands only for sideboard)
1 Maze of Ith (do we really need it now? Still very good against Reanimator, Dark depths and sometimes S&S)

// 4 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith


// 15 Sideboard
// 3 Artifact
SB: 1 Null Rod (matchup defining against Mud, Big eldrazi and D&T)
SB: 1 Pithing Needle (versatile card, normally use it to name walkers, Griselbrand, Sneak attack or fetches in certain game situations)
SB: 1 Damping Sphere (I expect some big-mana decks, maybe not necessary but it is good vs. Storm and feel ok in that pairing without canonist)

// 2 Creature
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg (S&S, Miracles, Elves, big-mana decks and some others, protect it and win)
SB: 1 Containment Priest (surprise! Nobody expects it in this type of decks but for obvious reasons cannot play more than 1)

// 1 Enchantment
SB: 1 Choke (I do not play more than 1 to be able to search for other pieces with E tutor)

// 7 Instant
SB: 1 Enlightened Tutor (I think it has been said, also searches for Sylvan library or Equipment if no other target is decent)
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction (I have always brought them against Miracles to counter a caster, exile StPs or Terminus, but maybe it is only correct to bring the pair when we are on the play)
SB: 1 Blessed Alliance (Burn, Reanimator, S&S, additional removal vs creature-heavy decks, depths, Lands, Tnn, unbelievably good)
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution (my only reason to play black, creature decks are not so bad matchups but you sometimes need a brainless mode against good players, Tnn and Storm tokens too obviously)
SB: 1 Path to Exile (Lands, depths, additional removal)

// 2 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Garruk Relentless (so good, free tokens for only one specific mana, additional removal against few but pesky creatures, if he flips the deathtouch tokens and the sinergy are overwhelming, try sacrificing anything to search for rallier)
SB: 1 Nissa, Vital Force (flexible slot, could be a Council's, a Graf cage or another walker like Gideon but read right here she deserves the spot)

I don't play Thoughtseize because dedicating 2-3 sb slots is a mistake in this deck for me and increasing the number of black sources worsens the mana base unless bringing high-impact cards like Liliana tlh.

Please be constructive, I have tested a lot and based my choices especially on my bad matchups. Thanks!

[Fatal]

Hello everyone:

I have been following for a while this thread and appretiate your opinions on the deck. I have been a Maverick player for the time it has existed in Legacy since the GSZ addition, I think I know a lot of tricks with the deck although I am not the best player I could be. Still, I have achieved decent records in some 100-200+ people tournaments and, you won't believe, I have managed to win Miracles a few times without completely adapting the list. With this said, I would like to thank you all for your knowledge.

I am now in need of more advice with my list and sideboard decision making. I am going to play a big tournament in a few days (MKM Series Zaragoza) and want to be able to win at least a 40% of times I face Miracles, which I think will be an important part of the metagame, and a higher rate against Grixis control. Here I paste my list and some of the reasons I based my decisions on. Any help is welcome.

// 2 Artifact
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

// 27 Creature
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Mother of Runes (I prefer 3+Sylvan sk because of the GSZ possibility and summoning sickness)
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Scryb Ranger (MVP, it enables so many tricks I never side her out)
2 Sanctum Prelate (I have been playing 1 for a while, but it is again very good to lock Miracles, Grixis and others in the g1)
1 Renegade Rallier (some situations are circumstantial but normally reanimating a countered or destroyed Thalia, Gaddock, jitte or sideboard piece is game winning)
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Tireless Tracker
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
2 Knight of Autumn (I know Qasali is a decent 2 drop, but I normally save it to be able to destroy sth what makes it cost 3 anyway. KoA is more versatile, better against S&S, D&T and adds some winning rate points vs. Burn thanks to GSZ. I expect a lot of Burns in big Legacy tournaments and it is not a good matchup even fetching basics and Wastelanding in response to PoP. Qasali is a good target for rallier, though, I could accept your reasoning to bring 1 back)
1 Stoneforge Mystic (I have experienced a lot of metagames with and without them and currently feel like playing 0+jitte or the 1+jitte+SoFaI configuration to make opposing Kolaghan's commands worse but still being able to fetch the equipment I want, against Miracles I side her out and only leave the sword, still being able to find it with Enlightened tutor if needed)

// 1 Enchantment
1 Sylvan Library (I feel like 2 are too many)

// 4 Instant
4 Swords to Plowshares

// 22 Land + dryad
2 Forest (I fear Blood moon and being able to cast hierarch and GSZ is very important in that situation)
1 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
2 Savannah
1 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Wasteland
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Cavern of Souls (tough decision, but some games naming human is all you need to win)
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Scrubland
1 Bayou (black lands only for sideboard)
1 Maze of Ith (do we really need it now? Still very good against Reanimator, Dark depths and sometimes S&S)

// 4 Sorcery
4 Green Sun's Zenith


// 15 Sideboard
// 3 Artifact
SB: 1 Null Rod (matchup defining against Mud, Big eldrazi and D&T)
SB: 1 Pithing Needle (versatile card, normally use it to name walkers, Griselbrand, Sneak attack or fetches in certain game situations)
SB: 1 Damping Sphere (I expect some big-mana decks, maybe not necessary but it is good vs. Storm and feel ok in that pairing without canonist)

// 2 Creature
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg (S&S, Miracles, Elves, big-mana decks and some others, protect it and win)
SB: 1 Containment Priest (surprise! Nobody expects it in this type of decks but for obvious reasons cannot play more than 1)

// 1 Enchantment
SB: 1 Choke (I do not play more than 1 to be able to search for other pieces with E tutor)

// 7 Instant
SB: 1 Enlightened Tutor (I think it has been said, also searches for Sylvan library or Equipment if no other target is decent)
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction (I have always brought them against Miracles to counter a caster, exile StPs or Terminus, but maybe it is only correct to bring the pair when we are on the play)
SB: 1 Blessed Alliance (Burn, Reanimator, S&S, additional removal vs creature-heavy decks, depths, Lands, Tnn, unbelievably good)
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution (my only reason to play black, creature decks are not so bad matchups but you sometimes need a brainless mode against good players, Tnn and Storm tokens too obviously)
SB: 1 Path to Exile (Lands, depths, additional removal)

// 2 Planeswalker
SB: 1 Garruk Relentless (so good, free tokens for only one specific mana, additional removal against few but pesky creatures, if he flips the deathtouch tokens and the sinergy are overwhelming, try sacrificing anything to search for rallier)
SB: 1 Nissa, Vital Force (flexible slot, could be a Council's, a Graf cage or another walker like Gideon but read right here she deserves the spot)

I don't play Thoughtseize because dedicating 2-3 sb slots is a mistake in this deck for me and increasing the number of black sources worsens the mana base unless bringing high-impact cards like Liliana tlh.

Please be constructive, I have tested a lot and based my choices especially on my bad matchups. Thanks!

Let me take a comment on MB:

-1 Knight of Autumn // +1 Qasali Pridemage (can be recurred by Railler and the most important it cost 2, we have such but mana curve actually to focused on 3cmc, and too big hole at 2 cmc)

-1 Sanctum Prelate // + 1 any good thread at 2cmc - can be sfm, maybe another gaddock Teeg or 4th Thalia to more focus on miracle matchup - reason -to smooth mana curve.

-1 Maze of Ith // + 1 Fetchland - you running only 6 fetchland which is quite small (similar to punishing fire builds).

SB:
1 Null Rod - bad call since it blocks your equipments as well, which are key to D&T matchup - better think about some artifact and enchantment removal best would be 2 for 1 or repeatable.

E.Tutor and only 4 targets in SB - not too versile, tutoring against miracles for Choke is bad call (Miracles MU are mostly grind fest), better add additional choke which will be direct advantage.

[Grobbs]

Let me take a comment on MB:

-1 Knight of Autumn // +1 Qasali Pridemage (can be recurred by Railler and the most important it cost 2, we have such but mana curve actually to focused on 3cmc, and too big hole at 2 cmc)

-1 Sanctum Prelate // + 1 any good thread at 2cmc - can be sfm, maybe another gaddock Teeg or 4th Thalia to more focus on miracle matchup - reason -to smooth mana curve.

-1 Maze of Ith // + 1 Fetchland - you running only 6 fetchland which is quite small (similar to punishing fire builds).

SB:
1 Null Rod - bad call since it blocks your equipments as well, which are key to D&T matchup - better think about some artifact and enchantment removal best would be 2 for 1 or repeatable.

E.Tutor and only 4 targets in SB - not too versile, tutoring against miracles for Choke is bad call (Miracles MU are mostly grind fest), better add additional choke which will be direct advantage.

Thanks for the response.

Maybe you are right about the 2nd KoA, which I firstly admitted, and I should not worry so much about Burn to improve other matchups. I will follow your advice with qasali for the curve and the rallier recursion.

On the Sanctum, I haven't had much trouble playing it and I think it is a good metacall. I was almost sold on not playing any Sfm because I think they are so bad now, 2nd Gaddock in the main is a bad idea and I don't feel the 4th Thalia to be necessary but really feels good to complement her with prelate. I will think about any other interesting choices for the 2cmc.

I have used the 6 fetchlands for a while and havent't had trouble with the manabase either with GSZ, hierarch and so on, but instead sometimes I suffer from mana flood. I will test my hands to see if the Maze worsens it so much.

Null rod has overperformed for a while, in the matchups I side it in I normally side out the Sfm and Sofai to just leave the jitte or none. It is in fact really good in the D&T matchup, in my experience more than the equipment in which they trust more than us. I thought about Serenity which can also be searched for with E. tutor, but it has to survive a whole turn and doesn't feel a safe assumption.

About the tutor, sometimes I have played more targets and you may be right with the current building. However, searching for a Choke or another of the fetchable pieces have been really useful. I could think about adding the second Choke now in its place anyway.

[Hanni]

I may just start a new thread in N&D for this, but I figured I'd post this here for now...

Anyway, I saw mention of Weathered Wayfarer in the UW Stoneblade thread, which brought back nostalgia about UW Tempo. Afterwards, it got me thinking about Turbo Depths. After more ideas started flowing, I ended up with a concept in my head of a Dark Depths deck with a GW aggro core.

The list is still rough, and is missing a lot of cards that I wanted to include originally. Space is always so tight when designing decks....

Here's what I ended up with:

GW Maverick Depths

Lands (28)
4 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Flooded Strand
1 Arid Mesa
4 Savannah
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Karakas
1 Seijiri Steppe
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Thespian's Stage
4 Dark Depths
1 Dryad Arbor

Creatures (20)
4 Weathered Wayfarer
4 Mother of Runes
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Noble Hierarch
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Ramunap Excavator

Spells (12)
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Crop Rotation
4 Swords to Plowshares

I wanted more Hierarch's, Mox Diamond, Jitte, Sylvan Library, Horizon Canopy, possibly Solemnity, but there isn't any room. Everything else in the current list just seems more important...

I figure the sideboard needs more hatebears, but I'm not going to worry about the sideboard just yet... I still need to hammer out the maindeck first.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions? Has anything like this been attempted before, that I could look at for reference?

EDIT: Maybe I should cut the Bojuka Bog for Horizon Canopy and put Bog in the sideboard?

[Asthereal]

I'd say: Bog to the board and cut Urborg (doesn't look great in your list as it doesn't make W or G).
Add 1x Hierarch and 1x Canopy and your base is a bit more solid.

Also, I'm not sold yet on the full set of Crop Rotation. They tend to be rather poor in multiples.
On the other hand your list relies rather heavily on lands, so perhaps you need them.
Actually, your list relies so heavily on lands I feel like you could use 3+ Loams in the main deck.

[Fatal]

I may just start a new thread in N&D for this, but I figured I'd post this here for now...

Anyway, I saw mention of Weathered Wayfarer in the UW Stoneblade thread, which brought back nostalgia about UW Tempo. Afterwards, it got me thinking about Turbo Depths. After more ideas started flowing, I ended up with a concept in my head of a Dark Depths deck with a GW aggro core.

The list is still rough, and is missing a lot of cards that I wanted to include originally. Space is always so tight when designing decks....

Here's what I ended up with:

GW Maverick Depths

Lands (28)
4 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Flooded Strand
1 Arid Mesa
4 Savannah
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Karakas
1 Seijiri Steppe
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Thespian's Stage
4 Dark Depths
1 Dryad Arbor

Creatures (20)
4 Weathered Wayfarer
4 Mother of Runes
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Noble Hierarch
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Ramunap Excavator

Spells (12)
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Crop Rotation
4 Swords to Plowshares

I wanted more Hierarch's, Mox Diamond, Jitte, Sylvan Library, Horizon Canopy, possibly Solemnity, but there isn't any room. Everything else in the current list just seems more important...

I figure the sideboard needs more hatebears, but I'm not going to worry about the sideboard just yet... I still need to hammer out the maindeck first.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions? Has anything like this been attempted before, that I could look at for reference?

EDIT: Maybe I should cut the Bojuka Bog for Horizon Canopy and put Bog in the sideboard?

From my experience Wayfarer is great only with Vial, without to many times you will end with just 1/1 dude blocked by own lands and waiting for fetch / opponent land drop to active it.

I played M@verick list before GSZ, and probably biggest problem will be gap on 2 cmc (normal list used SFM in this place), in this case can be used Hexmage drop, which is quite restrictive on color wheels.
Probably the biggest challange will be 3 color manabase (BB Hexmage and 1WB for KotR or Railler). For sure I will use Railler as Excavator split, since it can bring back also Hexmage. Hierarchs to 4.
What can be dropped - 4 knights, 4 MoR - keep only 1-2, they're plan B.

Mox Diamonds can be other route opposite to Vial, Aggro Loam is probably good starting shell.

[Rascalyote]

Finally got into MTGO and played a kinda budget list, 5-0'd my first time playing beating UR Delver x2, Miracles, ANT, Turbo Depths! (Do I crack the chests???)

1 Bayou
3 Savannah
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Plains
4 Marsh Flats
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Dark Depths
1 Karakas
1 Dryad Arbor
-24-

4 Mother of Runes
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia
1 Ooze
1 Ranger
1 Teeg
1 Pridemage
1 Ramunap
1 Knight of Autumn
4 Knight
-24-

4 Plow
1 Jitte
1 Library
1 SOFI
1 Garruk, Relentless
4 Zenith
-12-

SB:

1 Elspeth, KE
1 Knight of Autumn
2 Canonist
1 Path to Exile
2 Decay
2 Zealous
3 Thoughtseize
3 Faerie

Made some mtgo punts as I was getting used to it but core of the deck is still solid. I missed surgical a lot. I missed noble vs miracles and when I had a jitte, otherwise bird was fine. Probably going to just play a 2nd Garruk in the board over the Elspeth because killing creatures has been really relevant and he's easy to cast. My normal list has 3 Verdants over 3 flats, 3 Noble 2 Bird 1 SFM instead of 4 bird 2 SFM, a Canopy over the 3rd Savannah, and Surgicals over fae in the board, it felt really nice not dying to canopy in the two UR matchups though lmao.