[DSK] Duskmourn-ing a day without a new set

[H]

https://i.imgur.com/vdouP4o.jpeg

Release: September 27th 2024

No idea why a set is coming out a month after another, but hey, get money!

https://i.imgur.com/mBm48Lh.jpeg

Creatures that come back as enchantments.

https://i.imgur.com/8fVRp62.jpeg

Pseudo-suspend that is non-creature until it loses the counters. Also, Land tokens.

[H]

Mom: We have Doomsday at home.

Doomsday at home:
https://i.imgur.com/vbWBPo0.jpeg

[Zoid]

"Dem kids today like dem stranger things so lets to that."

Considering they are so devoid of any interesting ideas they have to run out of things to steal from given the ever increasing speed of product releases.

[Barook]

"Dem kids today like dem stranger things so lets to that."

Considering they are so devoid of any interesting ideas they have to run out of things to steal from given the ever increasing speed of product releases.
It certainly continues the current trend of fucking stupid ideas like "everybody is a detective" and "everybody is a cowboy".

As for the land toke, it enables full Domain, for what it's worth.

Edit: Doesn't the entire Impending mechanic combo with Solemnity?

[FTW]

I want to see enchantments that come back as Planeswalkers

Or enchantments that turn sideways when modified with a land token (land equivalent of equip), but the enchantment can only "attack" a planeswalker or battle.

[Zoid]

It certainly continues the current trend of fucking stupid ideas like "everybody is a detective" and "everybody is a cowboy".

As for the land toke, it enables full Domain, for what it's worth.

Edit: Doesn't the entire Impending mechanic combo with Solemnity?

It says "last counter removed" so I'd expect it doesn't trigger when it never had any counters on it.
In that case it should also not trigger again if you Stifle that trigger.
Seems like one of the very few things they learn is how to not do Dark Depths again.

[FTW]

Vampire Hexmage still works though, since they are removed.

Copy Enchantment makes a copy with no time counters that doesn't trigger, but it wasn't Impended so it's already a creature anyway.

Estrid's Invocation should remove all time counters and return it as a creature.

[morgan_coke]

"Dem kids today like dem stranger things so lets to that."

Considering they are so devoid of any interesting ideas they have to run out of things to steal from given the ever increasing speed of product releases.

There are only two rules for magic:

1. WOTC will print any amount of product to keep hasbro execs getting their bonuses no matter how badly the rest of the company does.
2. No astral slide effects will ever be on Arena, and any new things like Rift or Drift will not be pushed, even if we break every other mechanic and card type.

[FTW]

3. Stone Rain will never see power creep because even 3-mana basic land LD is unfun for casual & Standard players.

I'm disappointed Hasbro hasn't found a way to make Lands modify Enchantments yet.

Or a Bestow-Walker that can either enter as a planeswalker or enchant a planeswalker to add abilities and loyalty (when that planeswalker dies, create the unbestowed version).

[Pittplayer]

3. Stone Rain will never see power creep because even 3-mana basic land LD is unfun for casual & Standard players.

I'm disappointed Hasbro hasn't found a way to make Lands modify Enchantments yet.

Or a Bestow-Walker that can either enter as a planeswalker or enchant a planeswalker to add abilities and loyalty (when that planeswalker dies, create the unbestowed version).

As a smallpox player the complete lack of any kind of mana efficient land destruction makes me sad. I know some people don't like land destruction, but eternal formats should have every archetype.. control, prison, combo, etc.

[H]

"Dem kids today like dem stranger things so lets to that."

Considering they are so devoid of any interesting ideas they have to run out of things to steal from given the ever increasing speed of product releases.

So what you are saying is you want Core sets back, right? Right? (https://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-set/foundations/)

[Zoid]

So what you are saying is you want Core sets back, right? Right? (https://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-set/foundations/)

Actually and unironically yes.
Then they can stop printing functionally identical cards with minor tweaks which are sometimes related to the set gimmick.
I'm aware that it won't stop them from doing so but it would be nice to not have a 5-10 dual lands, a wrath effect, a Lightning Strike, etc every set because that eats slots and makes standard boring AF.
It would also massively improve the new player experience.

[Purple Blood]

It would also massively improve the new player experience.

How would that improve the purchase of Commander Precons?

[FTW]

I'm aware that it won't stop them from doing so but it would be nice to not have a 5-10 dual lands, a wrath effect, a Lightning Strike, etc every set because that eats slots and makes standard boring AF.

But that's called "design space".

Design space, noun: A strategy that reduces their creative workload by needing to design ~50 fewer unique cards each block. Recycling old cards with trivial changes to print free money.

If Lightning Strike is reprinted in a Core set, players can use their old copies in Standard. If it's replaced by Lightening Stroke, Standard players must all buy the new card, and Commander players get an extra copy to run. Free money.

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

So what you are saying is you want Core sets back, right? Right? (https://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-set/foundations/)

Eventually they’re going to be forced to acknowledge that the old rotation system was basically correct and needed at most slight tweaking; going several years between core sets is actually pretty reasonable.

But this current system of just printing whatever whenever is dogshit

[Zoid]

How would that improve the purchase of Commander Precons?


But that's called "design space".

Design space, noun: A strategy that reduces their creative workload by needing to design ~50 fewer unique cards each block. Recycling old cards with trivial changes to print free money.

If Lightning Strike is reprinted in a Core set, players can use their old copies in Standard. If it's replaced by Lightening Stroke, Standard players must all buy the new card, and Commander players get an extra copy to run. Free money.

*some funny smiley here*

I've been playing with mostly new players recently who also want to play commander.
None of the current products are really suitable for them because everything is so mechanically complex.
A core set would be ideal and would also allow them to build a card pool to build multiple decks from.
Given the rate with which they try to drain their existing player base, the have to look into getting new players.
Just playing on arena isn't good enough to let them learn the game.


Eventually they’re going to be forced to acknowledge that the old rotation system was basically correct and needed at most slight tweaking; going several years between core sets is actually pretty reasonable.

But this current system of just printing whatever whenever is dogshit

You mean like developing mechanics over the course of multiple consecutive sets?

[PirateKing]

Guys, as a Hasbro shareholder, I'd appreciate it if you stopped discussing the health of the game and all that nonsense and just give me money.

[H]

Actually and unironically yes.

Yeah, I actually think that from a "health and sustainability of the game" standpoint, it's the right thing to do. It's why it was done in the first place, really.


Eventually they’re going to be forced to acknowledge that the old rotation system was basically correct and needed at most slight tweaking; going several years between core sets is actually pretty reasonable.

But this current system of just printing whatever whenever is dogshit
Yeah, the "joke" is that Wizards knows this and have even let it on at times, but yeah, I think it is very likely they are totally powerless to really do anything in the face of what is likely corporate mandates from Hasbro.


Guys, as a Hasbro shareholder, I'd appreciate it if you stopped discussing the health of the game and all that nonsense and just give me money.

https://i.imgur.com/hFBpYEw.gif

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

If magic stops making money we might have to up the license fee on Monopoly and we can't have that.

[morgan_coke]

Guys, as a Hasbro shareholder, I'd appreciate it if you stopped discussing the health of the game and all that nonsense and just give me money.

Why in the actual fuck would you own that pile of dogshit propped up solely by the vivsection of MTG? I genuinely do not understand why Hasbro stockholders haven't chased the current management team out with a pack of wild dogs.

[PirateKing]

Why in the actual fuck would you own that pile of dogshit propped up solely by the vivsection of MTG? I genuinely do not understand why Hasbro stockholders haven't chased the current management team out with a pack of wild dogs.

I just bought stock on products I use in my own life, high school me figured if I'm buying from a company I might as well have something to gain from my own solicitations.

But to your point, every opportunity to vote I cast my ballot for Chris Cocks to be eaten alive by feral pigs.

[Wrath of Pie]

If magic stops making money we might have to up the license fee on Monopoly and we can't have that.
But how will everyone get the joy of Monopoly Cheater's Edition?

[Purple Blood]

I've been playing with mostly new players recently who also want to play commander.
None of the current products are really suitable for them because everything is so mechanically complex.
A core set would be ideal and would also allow them to build a card pool to build multiple decks from.
Given the rate with which they try to drain their existing player base, the have to look into getting new players.
Just playing on arena isn't good enough to let them learn the game.

In all seriousness, I think you're definitely correct. Even as someone who has been playing since the 90s, some of these new Standard sets are confusing as hell. Some notable recent ones: Discover/Explore Descend/Fathomless Descent all being in the same Standard set; Disguise/Cloak being in the same Standard set. Just a bunch of word soup that is completely unnecessary and doesn't add anything to gameplay. This is all compounded by the fact that, since Blocks are gone, these mechanics are by-and-large one-offs that are never to be seen from again or at best years later.

The amount of text on each card has gotten so ridiculous that they have been forced to shorten commonly use phrases "enters the battlefield" -> "enters" (more examples). There are even examples of new cards like Amped Raptor where they have to forgo standard templating (normally this type of effect would also include "shuffle the exiled cards back into your library" / "put the exiled cards on the bottom of your library") to fit the text in. This can actually have a huge effect on gameplay e.g. Raptor mills a one-of and now its gone forever.

All of this makes learning the game such a more daunting task than in years past. Core sets could fix that.

[H]

All of this makes learning the game such a more daunting task than in years past. Core sets could fix that.
I'd imagine that the corporate thinking was as follows: expansions make more money than Core sets, so jettison Core sets for more expansions and more profits.

Only to eventually realize that Core sets, while not top sellers actually serve a purpose. Something I imagine numerous people at Wizards itself know.

Even if we give Hasbro corporate more credit than that, the gambit likely was, as always, to sacrifice sustainability and the long-term development for short-term profits. In other words, nothing new, just Wizards propping up the horrendous business model of Hasbro.

[Purple Blood]

I'd imagine that the corporate thinking was as follows: expansions make more money than Core sets, so jettison Core sets for more expansions and more profits.

Only to eventually realize that Core sets, while not top sellers actually serve a purpose. Something I imagine numerous people at Wizards itself know.

Even if we give Hasbro corporate more credit than that, the gambit likely was, as always, to sacrifice sustainability and the long-term development for short-term profits. In other words, nothing new, just Wizards propping up the horrendous business model of Hasbro.

They're probably looking at things from a very cursory level. Likely to just review top line sales of various products and advise/direct to do more of X and less of Y. You would hope they defer to the more knowledgeable people on what might be more important for long term growth but who knows. You would also expect a company of this size to do market research on how to attract new customers; if they aren't doing that I'd be shocked.

All that said and for all their faults, it appears the game is as profitable/popular as ever so they must be doing something correctly even if there is obvious room for improvement.

[rufus]

Vampire Hexmage still works though, since they are removed.

Copy Enchantment makes a copy with no time counters that doesn't trigger, but it wasn't Impended so it's already a creature anyway.

Estrid's Invocation should remove all time counters and return it as a creature.

The "enters the battlefield as a copy" template stuff does copy enters the battlefield triggers.

[H]

The "enters the battlefield as a copy" template stuff does copy enters the battlefield triggers.
Yeah, but if we are talking about an Impending enchantment, wouldn't it be like copying an Evoke creature? The trigger only applies if the alternate cost was paid. I guess we'll see if Impeding works the same way (but I'd guess it probably does).

[Barook]

I really dislike the new "enter" template. I get that WotC wants to cut down on unnecessary words, but in this case, it feels like it's missing something.


As a smallpox player the complete lack of any kind of mana efficient land destruction makes me sad. I know some people don't like land destruction, but eternal formats should have every archetype.. control, prison, combo, etc.
We just got White Orchid Phantom with both Phelia, Exuberant Shepherd and Essence Reliquary to support it, not to mention Ephemerate for the double whammy if you have enough ETB triggers to support it. WOP should be alot better in Legacy than Modern since most decks run barely any or even no basics compared to Modern.

[FTW]

Waiting for them to keyword "exits" for "leaves the battlefield" triggers that are more than dies (exile, return to hand, return to library).

[morgan_coke]

I really dislike the new "enter" template. I get that WotC wants to cut down on unnecessary words, but in this case, it feels like it's missing something.


We just got White Orchid Phantom with both Phelia, Exuberant Shepherd and Essence Reliquary to support it, not to mention Ephemerate for the double whammy if you have enough ETB triggers to support it. WOP should be alot better in Legacy than Modern since most decks run barely any or even no basics compared to Modern.

They couldn't think of anything better than "battlecry" from Hearthstone and just said fuck it, "enters" is good enough.

[rufus]

Yeah, but if we are talking about an Impending enchantment, wouldn't it be like copying an Evoke creature? The trigger only applies if the alternate cost was paid. I guess we'll see if Impeding works the same way (but I'd guess it probably does).

I think I misunderstood. I thought the comment was about the "enters or attacks" trigger.

[Zoid]

They couldn't think of anything better than "battlecry" from Hearthstone and just said fuck it, "enters" is good enough.

Missed opportunity to make it "makes an entrance".

[Wrath of Pie]

Missed opportunity to make it "makes an entrance".

Only green creatures can make a dramatic entrance though

[Zoid]

Spooooooooooooooooohiler season is upon us again, boooooooooooooooohs and ghouls.

So far mostly nonsense but a few interesting bits:

https://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/veteransurvivor.jpghttps://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/demoniccounsel.jpghttps://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/unwantedremake.jpg

[Barook]

Another few cards that might be interesting:

http://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/splitup.jpg http://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/razorkinneedlehead.jpg http://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/thejollyballoonman.jpg http://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/overlordofthemistmoors.jpg

Why Overlord? If you blink it after Impending, it becomes a Grave Titan, although that might be too cute for Legacy.

[Zoid]

More delirium and nonsense:

https://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/patchworkbeastie.jpghttps://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/dragtotheroots.jpghttps://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/meathookmassacreii.jpg

[H]

https://i.imgur.com/vQz6y0m.png

This card seems pretty decent for two mana. Not likely for Legacy, but I'll definitely be putting this in Brawl decks on Arena.

[Zoid]

https://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/unstoppableslasher.jpg

Is mono B stompy a thing and does it need a pretty fast and recurring clock?

[Barook]

http://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/marvinmurderousmimic.jpg

Probably the best card in the set seen so far. Question is what's the best combo for it.

[rufus]

[Marvin, Murderous Mimic]

Probably the best card in the set seen so far. Question is what's the best combo for it.

I doubt there's a legacy playable combo for it. It usually takes abilities from two other cards - e.g. Walking Ballista + Phyrexian Devourer - to turn this kind of copy effect into something game-winning, and three piece combos are only going to be viable if the pieces can stand on their own.

[H]

The Miracle cost on this seems wildly pushed to me:
https://i.imgur.com/TEiAHBJ.jpeg

[morgan_coke]

The Miracle cost on this seems wildly pushed to me:
https://i.imgur.com/TEiAHBJ.jpeg

not really, 1b for a 4/4 lifelink is practically the basic cost at this point, and getting both abilities to trigger off the miracle requires a lot of setup, BS and a reanimation target.

[H]

not really, 1b for a 4/4 lifelink is practically the basic cost at this point, and getting both abilities to trigger off the miracle requires a lot of setup, BS and a reanimation target.
Good point, Triumph is a 5/5 Lifelink for basically the same cost. But the reanimation effect seems kind of good. I guess we'll see.

[dte]

It would have played very well along Grief.

In some hybrid decks, it might make a single fetchable witch's cottage playable, as well as some street wraith. But I doubt it.
It should be kind of good with dragon rage channeler too.

[Tylert]

I doubt there's a legacy playable combo for it. It usually takes abilities from two other cards - e.g. Walking Ballista + Phyrexian Devourer - to turn this kind of copy effect into something game-winning, and three piece combos are only going to be viable if the pieces can stand on their own.

Isn't there a legendary creature with an ability that could combo if we had 2 on the battlefield?

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

You could maybe try to do something with Loyal Retainers but that seems more cute than good

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

not really, 1b for a 4/4 lifelink is practically the basic cost at this point, and getting both abilities to trigger off the miracle requires a lot of setup, BS and a reanimation target.

Triumph sees play and has a wildly lower ceiling while not really being much higher as a floor- a 4/4 lifelinker isn't much worse than a 5/5 actually. They're both big enough to matter against most boards and out of bolt range but die to Dismember and most beefy creatures in the format.

Someone on the reddit thread also pointed out that it actually makes Worldy Tutor pretty good in Reanimator since you can use it to tutor for both cheap reanimation effect and be an Entomb with a surveil trigger on the stack.

[Zoid]

https://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/formlessgenesis.jpg

This seems fairly useful.
Having a retraceable spell with every creature type is bound to cause some shenanigans.

[Reeplcheep]

People played worm harvest way back in the day. 2 cmc less makes it playable I think. Seems decent in loam pox.

[rufus]

Cynical Loner seems like a powerful ability:



Cynical Loner :1::b:

Creature — Human Survivor

Cynical Loner can’t be blocked by Glimmers.

Survival — At the beginning of your second main phase, if Cynical Loner is tapped, you may search your library for a card, put it into your graveyard, then shuffle.


Though, I guess, legacy is rife with "kill me or lose" bodies. A simple thing would be to combine it with Stasis.

[Barook]

http://mythicspoiler.com/dsk/cards/overlordofthebalemurk.jpg

This looks like the best one out of the Overlord cycle. It can do some shenanigans with Vampire Hexmage where can turn it into a creature and get the Hexmage back immediately (either via the ETB or the attack trigger, depending on the order you play those two).