Dragon Shields: quality problems?

[Brushwagg]

Well as the title says, as of late it seems Dragon Shields have had some problems in their quality. The last 2 boxes I bought the sleeves were mis-cut. Some sleeves would be just a little wider then others and it is noticable once you shuffle up. I suggest, if you buy some, open them right at the counter of the store and shuffle the pack(it will become noticable). I've also heard of a couple of different players having the same issue, and some having them split(which doesn't happen normally).

So I thought I would just give people a heads up.

I also E-mailed the company that makes DS to let them know I'm unhappy with their product as of late. It's a real shame since Dragon Shields have been one of the best sleeves I have used.

[Anarky87]

Well as the title says, as of late it seems Dragon Shields have had some problems in their quality. The last 2 boxes I bought the sleeves were mis-cut. Some sleeves would be just a little wider then others and it is noticable once you shuffle up. I suggest, if you buy some, open them right at the counter of the store and shuffle the pack(it will become noticable). I've also heard of a couple of different players having the same issue, and some having them split(which doesn't happen normally).

So I thought I would just give people a heads up.

I also E-mailed the company that makes DS to let them know I'm unhappy with their product as of late. It's a real same since Dragon Shields have been one of the best sleeves I have used.

That's really too bad. I use nothing but Dragon Shields when I play, but I've never had that problem. Yikes. Of course, I haven't bought a box in a LONG ass time. I would hate to know that they are slipping on their quality.

[Zach Tartell]

I also E-mailed the company that makes DS to let them know I'm unhappy with their product as of late. It's a real same since Dragon Shields have been one of the best sleeves I have used.

KMC Matte Black FTW. I buy like two 100-packs everytime we go to stratford. I've got every competitive card I own in them (so I can switch duals and fetches between decks), my enchantress (hardly competitive), and my infinite combo reap/lace casual deck. Yes, I just said "Infinite combo" and "casual" in the same sentence.

[Cavius The Great]

I'm a big fan of the Ultra Pro sleeves. I get the Raven Black and Tsunami Blue because I prefer opaque backs. They're the best damn sleeves I've ever used and I wouldn't buy anything else. The Raven Black and Tsunami Blue are also very easy to slip cards into which is why I prefer them over the other Ultra Pro flavors.

[dre4m]

Personally, I always use Dragon Shields, and I haven't noticed any difference in sizing, though I have not bought a box in the very recent future. How long ago exactly did you notice this problem?

[iOWN]

I'm a big fan of the Ultra Pro sleeves. I get the Raven Black and Tsunami Blue because I prefer opaque backs. They're the best damn sleeves I've ever used and I wouldn't buy anything else. The Raven Black and Tsunami Blue are also very easy to slip cards into which is why I prefer them over the other Ultra Pro flavors.



The thing I hate about Ultra Pro is that the sleeves use silicon or something in them, so every couple of games or so your cards slide to the top and risk being damaged. I've been using Ultra Pro Gallery because they look nice and the inside-backs aren't slippery so your card stays nice in place. The downside is that they shuffle awfully.

Anyone know of sleeves that have the ultimate combination of durability, shuffling well, not damaging your cards in any way, and looking awesome?

[TheMightyQuinn]

I bought a box of black Dragon Shields years ago and they have remained in amazing condition since then. At the Time Spiral prerelease however, I bought another box of DS and the edges were all scratchy and miscut. Very disappointing. I may try buying one more box soon, and if I'm not satisfied, they've probably lost my business for good.

[mikekelley]

I absolutely LOVE the new ultra pro sleeves, with that really really light grit sandpapery back. not really sandpapery, but not really smooth, either. i have had them for months, and no issues whatsoever.

[Cavius The Great]

I absolutely LOVE the new ultra pro sleeves, with that really really light grit sandpapery back. not really sandpapery, but not really smooth, either. i have had them for months, and no issues whatsoever.

Are you referring to the "Official:magic the gathering" sleeves"? I was thinking of getting some but I've been told they're not very good. Convince me otherwise. :wink:


The thing I hate about Ultra Pro is that the sleeves use silicon or something in them, so every couple of games or so your cards slide to the top and risk being damaged. I've been using Ultra Pro Gallery because they look nice and the inside-backs aren't slippery so your card stays nice in place. The downside is that they shuffle awfully.

I've never had this problem. The ones I mentioned are "opaque" and don't have any slippery qualities to them.

[Tacosnape]

For what it's worth, I just picked up several boxes of Dragon Shields (All Red) and all of them were completely fine and awesome.

And my first group of Dragon Shields (All blue) lasted me about a year and a half, including some outdoor play, before they got too dirty to be worth the effort anymore.

[mikekelley]

Are you referring to the "Official:magic the gathering" sleeves"? I was thinking of getting some but I've been told they're not very good. Convince me otherwise. :wink:




I don't have the nerd balls to play with the Magic sleeves. These are just the regular black ones, raven black i guess is what they call it.

[Tacosnape]

I don't have the nerd balls to play with the Magic sleeves.

Quoted for hilarity. Nerd Balls = best term evarr.

[MattH]

My Dragon Shields have been serving me well for two years now. Haven't broken one yet.

[Cavius The Great]

I don't have the nerd balls to play with the Magic sleeves. These are just the regular black ones, raven black i guess is what they call it.

I mentioned those earlier in my last couple posts. I absolutely love the Raven Black sleeves and recommend them to everyone. I also found that Tsunami Blue are the same exact quality except in blue color. Those are the only two Ultra Pro sleeve types that I use.

[cdr]

Working in a game shop, I noticed several cases of Dragon Shields in the past half year or so were of very poor quality, especially red and white ones. Some mangled edges, some mis-cut.

I don't know if whether it was just a few bad batches and they've fixed things by now, or if they're all that way. I'd be cautious about buying them though. If you can, see if any from that same case of sleeves have been opened and had problems.

I Nth the Ultra Pro Raven Black/Tsunami Blue recommendations, although they aren't always easy to get. Ultra Pro also makes some faux-japanese sleeves now which are good quality, but aren't opaque.

Real japanese sleeves will always be the best, though.

[clavio]

I have noticed dragon shields being worse than before. I've had a deck cased in dragon shields for years with no problems (and I'm a fairly abusive shuffler). I bought a box of 100 a few months ago and at least 10 of the sleeves are torn/shot.

[Brushwagg]

Personally, I always use Dragon Shields, and I haven't noticed any difference in sizing, though I have not bought a box in the very recent future. How long ago exactly did you notice this problem?

I have to say it's been like a month or so and I bought 2 boxes. I really wasn't going to say anything until other players in the area were having the same problems. A buddy of mine, who does work in a game store got some black ones not to long ago and he showed me how horribly miscut they were. Not only could you feel the ridges down the side of the deck, you can actually see them.

@Tacosnape:Have you sleeved a deck yet or just shuffled the sleeves? I didn't notice my boxes were bad until I changed the order of the sleeves. I did have the guy at the store open them there, and I looked at them and they looked fine until I shuffled.

Basically I just wanted to give people a heads-up. I'll have to look for those Ultra-Pro ones and try them out. Are they like their non-foil Gallery ones? I really like those alot, but not legal in bigger events. :(

[JACO]

Working in a game shop, I noticed several cases of Dragon Shields in the past half year or so were of very poor quality, especially red and white ones. Some mangled edges, some mis-cut.

I don't know if whether it was just a few bad batches and they've fixed things by now, or if they're all that way. I'd be cautious about buying them though. If you can, see if any from that same case of sleeves have been opened and had problems.
I noticed the same thing, and from the batches that were local to us, it seemed like it was traced to certain batches of certain colors. For example, white Dragon Shields were not curved like they normally are, and all frayed on the edges. The silver Dragon Shields were all cut shorter than normal, but still were all equal in length (all from same pack equal length, I mean). Other than that, Dragon Shields are the best sleeves you can get, and last the longest, with the least amount of tearing. Yes that means better than the KMC whatever color, better than Yannoman/Gunmental/whatever else.

[Shriekmaw]

I just bought a box of Gold Dragon Shield sleeves and noticed that many of them were mis-cut. You could really feel the difference on the sides as they were not nice and smooth like they should be. I usually don't have any problems with dragon shield as I really do like them the best.

I've bought the cheap 4 dollars for a box of 100 Japanese sleeves which work pretty good. They are plain and simple in case your wondering if they are tournament legal. I'm almost to the point where its better just to buy the cheap sleeves if your playing in a lot of big tournaments where you constantly have to get newer sleeves.

[iOWN]

What makes sleeves not tournament legal, other than size?

[cdr]

What makes sleeves not tournament legal, other than size?

The only sleeves that are explicity "not legal" are ones that are extremely reflective - UltraPro Satin Silver, for example.

Aside from that, it's your responsibility as a player to make sure that your sleeves are not marked. That's why it's usually wise not to play with sleeves that have pictures or patterns on the back, even though they're "legal". Most such sleeves come already marked due to variations on the backs. It takes better quality control than UltraPro and most other companies are willing to invest in to produce unmarked picture sleeves.

[Brushwagg]

I've bought the cheap 4 dollars for a box of 100 Japanese sleeves which work pretty good. They are plain and simple in case your wondering if they are tournament legal. I'm almost to the point where its better just to buy the cheap sleeves if your playing in a lot of big tournaments where you constantly have to get newer sleeves.

I also did the same. The only thing I don't like about them is that they are a little short. Very little "play" at the top, but they are all the same length, and the sides are smooth. When these were out, I'm going to try to find those Ultra Pro ones. I'd rather have to buy more sleeves that are going to be fine then spend more money on ones that might have an issue with them.

[Black and Blue]

The last pack of Silver Dragon Shields I bought were badly miscut. The sides were alright but the problem I had was the varying length of the sleeves. It ranged from barely covering the card at the top to having nearly a full eighth of an inch from the top of the card. They were the fist Dragon Shields I had bought in well over a year and it was quite disappointing since they are the most expensive sleeves you can buy. I've had better luck with the cheaper Ultra-Pros with the matte finish.

Of course YMMV and this is all anecdotal.

[Sea R Hill]

Don't buy MTG - UP "Official Tournament Sleeves", these are totallly crap.
After only one tournament, the edges were withened and a friend of mine had to change 2 sleeves during the tournament.
Plus they shuffle very bad.

I like other Ultra Pro products, and KMC.

[Brushwagg]

Well I feel if, you've bought Dragon Shields and got a bad box you should e-mail the company, not that it would help, but if enough of us e-mail them they and not buy their product, they might take notice.

[Maverick676]

I think a couple people have already mentioned this, but the new ultrapro sleeves with the rough back are the most amazing sleeves ever. They shuffle great and last forever. Right now it is just silly to buy any other sleeves, as they are all absolute garbage compared to the new ultra pros.

[noobslayer]

I've never had any real issues with Dragon Shield. I always buy black, so that I'll have the same color of sleeves, and will never have to worry finding 60/75 sleeves of one specific color.

[The Djinn]

I'm experiencing some problems with Ultra Pro sleeves. I bought 2 packs a couple of weeks ago and they are different sizes. The difference might just be 1 or 2 millimeter, but it's enough to pick them out of the deck. They are Raven Black with the new surface. I had the same problems with the grey sleeves and the artist sleeves with the mammoth on the back.

I don't know whether the sleeves are produced in the same factory for the entire world, but the quality is not what it used to be.

I also have a set of MTG sleeves. I must say I like them. I used them once in a tournament and I use them when playing casual. It's true that the edges are vulnerable, but when handled with care they perform well.

[Shriekmaw]

I think a couple people have already mentioned this, but the new ultrapro sleeves with the rough back are the most amazing sleeves ever. They shuffle great and last forever. Right now it is just silly to buy any other sleeves, as they are all absolute garbage compared to the new ultra pros.



I'm going to have to try the new Ultra Pro sleeves as I was pretty dissatisfied with my last box of dragon shield. I haven't bought Ultra Pros to be used in a constructed tournament since way back when there were the only ones you could buy.

I just hope that the quality of the sleeves will be good.

[calosso]

Pink and purple dragon shields are the best sleeves ever created!!!!!!

[Sims]

KMC Japanese Super Blacks....

Having every deck sleeved in the same sleeves means you've always got extras, and you never really need to worry about unsleeving and resleeving to change fetchlands or duals from one deck to another if you don't own multiple playets.

[Vardaman]

I hope they iron out whatever quality control problems they're having because Dragon Shields used to kick ass. I'll have to take a closer look at the extra box of Gold sleeves I bought 3-4 months ago but haven't used yet.

[Pinder]

Pink and purple dragon shields are the best sleeves ever created!!!!!!

I've been rolling with the pink ones now for quite some time, and never had any problems with them.

Of course, Mav is right about those new ultrapro sleeves. Virtually everything I own is sleeved in them now. If they only made them in pink...

[Brushwagg]

Well I didn't think I was going to get a reply, but surprisingly I did. Here's a copy of the E-mail I got sent back.


Dear Nathaniel

Thank you for contacting us about this. That does sound like the product you have bought does not live up to our standards!

I should very much like to see the products, so that we may investigate further into this matter. Please send everything including packaging.



Please send the faulty products by regular mail** to:

Arcane Tinmen

Kystvejen 27 st. mf.

8000 Aarhus

Denmark

** We will only cover the postage costs for regular mail - please do not use registered mail or similar services.



We will then investigate into the matter – and of course we will find some way to reimburse you for both the sleeves and the postage.



I apologize for the inconvenience and also thank you for your help in this.

Yours sincerely

Michael Nielsen

Arcane Tinmen



Well I'm going to send them, and maybe something will come of it. Hell I wasn't looking to get any money back or anything, I just wanted to let them know that their quaility was slipping. But if I got a reponse maybe other people should try to E-mail them also. I wasn't a jerk at all in my first E-mail, I was respectful, and just wanted to give them a heads up.

[cdr]

On the subject of sleeves in tournaments: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=judge/article/20070416a

[Brushwagg]

Hey thanks for that heads up Akki. Very interesting.

[Versus]

Another old thread!

When I played, UP was all there was and they were kickass. I still have decks sleeved in UP from 2000 and they are in great shape. When I came back to playing a few months ago I notced that UP are thin as fuck now. I HATE the sandpapery ones. The corners catch on each other when you side shuffle. It seems to me that every color feels different then the other? Also I noticed that there is quite a bit of flap on the UP sleeves now where as back in the day the card fit perfectly.

I bought a pack of DS sheilds the other day and they are the quality that UP used to be, but now I'm noticing they curl the cards ever so slightly similar to how a foil card bows in the middle.

Does anyone have any experience with the Ultra Pro Japanese sleeves? Are those better quality? Does "Japanese Card Sleeves" mean something other than being made in Japan?

[Sims]

Yeah this was another insane necro, but i'll roll...

http://www.cardkingdom.com/images/kmc_black.jpg

Great sleeves, the KMC Japanese sleeves are pretty much the only sleeves I use and the only reason to ever order from Card Kingdom. 5.95 per 100 pack and you can buy like 2 or 3 packs with relatively inexpensive shipping. It's something like 9.90 after shipping for 1 pack, like 15 bucks for 2, 23 for 3, and 30ish for 4 packs of 100.... not bad relatively speaking price wise, but anyone who used them can speak for quality (I know a good amount of Albany can, we used super blacks for-ev-er.)

[Versus]

What's the backs of those like? Like I said the sandpaper ones I can't stand, but I also hate the crazy glossy ones that fly out of your hands when you shuffle.

[Jaynel]

KMC Matte Black FTW.

QFT. These things are amazing. They're really slick and they haven't scratched up much at all.

[Sims]

What's the backs of those like? Like I said the sandpaper ones I can't stand, but I also hate the crazy glossy ones that fly out of your hands when you shuffle.


They will be slippery the first time you sleeve up, but if you sleeve up a deck and then shuffle up and play a few casual or playtesting games it won't be long before they'll stop being so damn slippery. They do get scuffed, what sleeves don't, but they're very even in wear. I've played tournaments with a deck that's been in the same KMC Super Blacks for 2-3 years and they are a little worn and scuffed but not enough to warrant new sleeves (ruled via the judge).

[Nightmare]

If you get KMC Matte Black instead of SuperBlack, they come with a matte finish, which is like the best thing ever. They aren't slippery (straight from the pack), and they are some of the most forgiving sleeves ever as far as shuffling wear goes. For tournament play, it's pretty much the only kind of sleeve I'll use.

[Versus]

KMC it is then! I'll order some online. Thanks guys.

[Bahamuth]

Does anyone know any European stores that sell these KMC sleeves? I don't seem to be able to find them...

If there's one in The Netherlands you know of, that would be even better.

[Bardo]

Let me also throw in an endorsement for KMC sleeves. They're the only ones I use and can take a beating.

My all-time favorite are the old Yanoman Gunmetal sleeves, but I haven't been able to find any at a good price or the right quality (they way they were sold about 3 years ago).

These days, KMC are the best I know.

[Versus]

So I called a place right down the street from where I work and they actually had KMC's in stock!

The didn't have any black, but I picked up these (http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/dragonballzcentral_1977_1114861530). Much nicer than UP and not as thick as DS. DS made me feel like I was shuffling a deck of toploaders!

Thanks again for the suggestions everyone.

[gustoh]

I had a huge altercation with Dragon Shield sleeves back at GP: Madison a few years back.

I was playing a Vintage side event and during a game 3 match my opponent called me out for having a marked sleeve. Granted these were brand new sleeves I said there was no way possible that the sleeves could be marked. A judge came by and lord behold the sleeve had a crease running down the side on the back of the sleeve.

Ever since then I've purchased about two boxes of Dragon Shields and I've noticed a few sleeves being miscut as well as the same crease in the back of a few sleeves as well...

They were awesome at first but now I can't get myself to purchase another box of Dragon Shields.

LT...

[Wallace]

Wow this is strange to hear, I have bought 4 case's of dragon shields, not boxs, cases. I have never had a problem with them and will buy nothing but Dragon Shields. My 450 + card type 4 stack is in Red Dragon Shields and with all the play that it gets I still have no problems.

[ClearSkies]

Yea, I often get like 1 bent/creased sleeve like every 1-2 boxes.

They are still my favorite sleeves though. I like how the sleeves are a bit longer than the MTG cards itself.

[DeathwingZERO]

I'll still go between KMC and Dragon Shields. Both last for a very long time, and if you aren't shuffling like a 5 year old, rarely ever split.

I almost always get KMC over Dragon Shields though, just because I'm getting 100 sleeves for a few bucks less, meaning if I stick with the same color I can sleeve 3-4 decks for half the price.

But I will say that my "New Pink" Dragon Shields are very sexy. I also find it both strange and amusing that people will complement me on having them. It's kinda like the same feeling you'd expect to get having someone in the jail showers asking if you worked out.

[APriestOfGix]

I have used EVERYTHING!


Here are my results:

DS: They live forever, my friends call then the death sleeves (they smell funny from getting coated in "something" in my backpack once) because they smell like death, and yet have avoided it themselves. However they pick up dirt on the covers (even pre-spill) and can get dirty really fast. Also they bend my cards, because they are curved.

Ultra-Pro (Dark Blue): Best sleeve i have ever OWNED. They are the best things i have, and out of the 75, i have chipped 1 cornnor in like 3 years since i picked them up for regionals. Slippery at first, but they chill out and are good. They also picked up dirt, but it's been 3 years so hey...

Ultra-Pro (MtG): SHIT! I though they were the best, but i now have a deck of (SERIOUSLY) 59 split cards! EVERY card in my main deck has had the cornors split, and these i have had for maybe 6 months. DO NOT GET! GOOD FOR 1 TOURNY ONLY!!!

Deck Guard: Ok, they are not all cut correctly, but fine for playtesting, i want tourny sleeves though so i have to give them a thumbs down.

KMC Matte: I had a friend that swears by these, and when i used them at the last tourny they are like mini card sleeve gods. I like them so much, i just made an order for 3 packs (300 total) so that i never have to buy sleeves again!

Other: I have no idea what they are, but i have some gold sleeves (i'm 99.9% sure they are KMC) that have done very well. My problem with colored sleeves is they pick up dirt marks, and you get these funny lumps of black dirt, that is a pain to clean off every card. Had for around 2 years, and have not split one.


So in conclusion, i would have to say that KMC Matte are sex, Ultra-Pro (Dark Blue, and from what i hear Black) are 1337, DS's are good if you can find the ones NOT sold in the paper box, and everything else is the $2 whore i rent out to people i want to have AIDS.

[Brushwagg]

Holy Necro. But to add something here. I'm trying out Red DS right now and they seem fine. I will not be buying any Black DS ever again, and I'm going to look into getting some KMC mat sleves.

[cdr]

I bought two packs of Ultra Pros at GP Daytona, since those were the only halfway decent sleeves the dealers were selling. They were the blue ones without a color name.

One pack was horribly frayed at the bottom, completely unusable. To make things even better, the dealer outright refused to give me a refund for the defective product. I had to pay him $1.50 to get a new pack (and I wouldn't have except for the fact that if I didn't the other pack I had would be useless).

[APriestOfGix]

the dealer outright refused to give me a refund for the defective product. I had to pay him $1.50 to get a new pack

That is against the law, you can sue his ass for that, for what ever the 1st place prize of the tournament was, cause he is losing you business by doing that...

[Phantom]

Can anyone give me a website where I can purchase these? Or is eBay a good idea? Note: I am drunk.

[APriestOfGix]

http://www.coolstuffinc.com/main_supplies.php?viewType=Card%20Sleeves&info1=Card%20Sleeves

[Versus]

DS are really nice, I won't deny that, but no one feels they are too thick?

I sleeved up my deck in the KMCs. I love the way they shuffle. No corners snagging on each other and they are glossy enough to slide, but not enough to end up on the kitchen floor while shuffling in the living room.

Interesting how the texture of the colored plastic is different on the inside of the sleeve. It seems to have a "grip" to it that keeps the card from slidding up

[andrew77]

DS are really nice, I won't deny that, but no one feels they are too thick?

I sleeved up my deck in the KMCs. I love the way they shuffle. No corners snagging on each other and they are glossy enough to slide, but not enough to end up on the kitchen floor while shuffling in the living room.

Interesting how the texture of the colored plastic is different on the inside of the sleeve. It seems to have a "grip" to it that keeps the card from slidding up

I agree that DS are thick, but imo that makes them a perfect choice for my legacy and vintage decks. I don't want any beta duals of power 9 pieces getting damaged.

I have had some problems with DS though. Every so often I get a pack of severely miscut sleeves, and I have also gotten some packs that contained marked sleeves. This seems to happen at least in one in 10 packs which is pretty annoying. Otherwise, the sleeves are absolutely great. They last forever, don't break, shuffle well and look nice as hell.

[Bryant Cook]

Matrix Green Ultra Pros FTW. I've had them for about 7 months, not a single sleeve has torn. This is amazing, because I love to goldfish TES. This means those sleeves have been beaten and shuffled to hell. They still look decent too, no bent corners, no frayed edges, just like how they came out of the package. I have 500 of these.

[Adan]

KMC Matte Black FTW. I buy like two 100-packs everytime we go to stratford. I've got every competitive card I own in them (so I can switch duals and fetches between decks), my enchantress (hardly competitive), and my infinite combo reap/lace casual deck. Yes, I just said "Infinite combo" and "casual" in the same sentence.

KMC Mat Black are the ownz, agreed! But putting all your cards into them to switch around is a waste of money, because the sleeves then are all worn off differently. If a judge is strict with you, you will get trouble then. But the sleeves are very good, I also use them.

[Shriekmaw]

Matrix Green Ultra Pros FTW. I've had them for about 7 months, not a single sleeve has torn. This is amazing, because I love to goldfish TES. This means those sleeves have been beaten and shuffled to hell. They still look decent too, no bent corners, no frayed edges, just like how they came out of the package. I have 500 of these.


Lately, I've kind of given up on Dragon Shields all together and went with Ultra Pros. I've been very happy with them, a lot better in quality then the Dragon Shields I've been using for a long time. Another nice fact about these sleeves are that they are a lot cheaper than Dragon Shields. I believe they are like 3 dollars for a 50 count and the quality is amazing at that price for them.

[APriestOfGix]

Best company is KMC hands down. The KMC's i have (found the packing the gold ones ARE KMC) have been played for 2 years on concrete, and grass (playing at school), and none have split, they are hardly scuffed (i know WTF) and look amazing still. They have picked up a little grit, about as much as my three year old Ultra Pro's but still look amazing. My only problem with them is i lost many of them a while ago, so i only have 60 left, and it makes it kinda hard to then have a side board, cause you have to switch covers, and that can be a bitch.

The KMC's see about 4 hours of play a day, on rought surfaces (i don't use a play mat) so i know they are solid.

My rating would have to go as follows:

Buy:
KMC (any)
Ultra-Pro (Black and Dark Blue)

If you want:
Dragon Shield (any but black, the black ones split like Nightmares hair when he uses the blowdryer on it)

DON'T BUY!:
Ultra-Pro (MtG)
Deck Guard (Cards are not all the same height, 100% chance you will not get a even cut pack)

[Brushwagg]

The thing I dislike about Ultra-Pro is the whole having to buy 2 packs to sleeve a deck. They use to sell 100 count count boxes back in the 90's and where alot thicker too. Anyone else notice that on certain colors you can make out the back of your card?

[APriestOfGix]

Thats the ONLY plus to the MtG Ultra-Pro's, that they come in packs of 80.

[Versus]

I forgot that the UP textured sleeves are pretty nice actually. The have an "alligator skin" type thing going on. The only issue I can see with DCI play would be a thin layer over the colored plastic that creates the hologramish effect you see below. Otherwise, they work great. Definately the best UP (other than Matrix Green) that I've played with.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v241/KSC2-303/UPtex.jpg

[cdr]

There are several problems with textured sleeves and especially hologram sleeves as far as tournament play - there's usually cut lines on the back of at least some, and the pattern is usually not consistent at the borders.