Kobold Krunch (Turn 1/2 win)

[Weekend Daddy]

Saw this deck on the Wizard boards and I'm trying to ramp it up a bit:

LANDS: 2
1 Taiga
1 Savannah

SPELLS: 58
CREATURES: 36
4 Crimson Kobolds
4 Crookshank Kobolds
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Kobolds Of Kher Keep
4 Orinthopter
4 Shield Sphere
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Tinder Wall
4 Wild Cantor

UTILITY: 22
4 Glimpse Of Nature
4 Land Grant
4 Lotus Petal
4 Summoners Pact
3 Gamble
3 Grapeshot

SIDEBOARD:
4 Pact Of Negation
4 Xantid Swarm

It works in the same sense as Belcher, except you really only need 3 cards for this instead of 5 (Green Mana, Glimpse Of Nature, and a creature to start drawing for Storm and/or Grapeshot).

Summoners Pact upps the creature count to virtually 40. Gamble allows you to search for Glimpse of Nature early on. Sure, it's risky, but it's the best 1 mana from-the-deck-to-your-hand search card you can come across. I am a bit curious if having Gamble is a bit superfluous.

[Nihil Credo]

Chrome Mox is an auto-include.

Also, I haven't tested the deck, but if there's the slightest chance that it can cast Burning Wish, then that one should immediately replace Gamble. It also allows you to go for Empty the Warrens, in truly Belcher-fashion (although this option is only available when you don't use Pact).

Finally, not meant as a flame, but do you know of any reason why this combo engine might be better than Belcher/EtW?

[technogeek5000]

I dont get it... so whats the kill. Grapeshot doesnt seem like it would be enough. Also leyline of the void seems like it has a place in your board.

[noobslayer]

There is more draw, but less powerful mana. Also, Tinder Wall seems really good here. If you are serious about this deck, you need to test it extensively until you find the absolute minimum required number of creatures (similar to the Disciple builds of Flash).

[mikekelley]

How does chalice at 0 not absolutely --

I don't even know what--

this deck?

[Bovinious]

even if Chalice at 0 counters a creature u'd still draw the card for glimpse, but i guess its a problem for petal/pacts sake.

[Weekend Daddy]

Misconceptions already. Here we go:

Chalice at 0 does nothing to the deck. As Glimpse Of Nature says when you PLAY a creature spell, you draw a card. You play Kobolds, it gets countered, but you still draw.
Chalice at 1....different story.

I have thought about Burning Wish, despite that it's WAY less risky than Gamble, I was wary of it costing more than 1. I believe I'll add it.

I won't be able to test the deck until I get back to the states from Afghanistan. So as far as getting the minimum number of creatures, I believe someone else will figure the best answer for that before October. Plus, I don't beleive that Glimpse of Nature stacks: Drawing 2 cards for every creature you cast. Which is why I wanted to start off at a high number. In case you hit a deposit of spells and zero creatures. Many times have I played Solidarity, used Meditate only to draw into 4 lands. Plus, the mass creature count ensures I get a storm count over 20.

As for Chrome Mox, I have also thought about it, but I have no idea what to nix out, I believe this also goes along with I don't know what the minimum amount of creatures I can use effectively.

Tinder Wall looks good, I believe I'll add it instead of Phyrexian Walker

I believe the reason why I find it better than Belcher is that Belcher relies heavilly on drawing the combo from the get go. Where this one really only needs a green mana source, Glimpse Of Nature, and a creature or 2 to get the ball rolling

I think with Burning Wish, I can ramp down the numbers or Grapeshot and start adding Chrome Mox. I'll give it a shot

[Tacosnape]

Why's there a Savannah in this deck?

EDIT: I'm not sure I agree with the inclusion of Burning Wish over Gamble here. Gamble allows you to go off on turn one with incredibly more frequency. Examples include:

Taiga, Gamble, ESG: Play the Taiga, Gamble for the Glimpse, ESG to cast the Glimpse, go off.

Taiga, Gamble, SSG: Play the Taiga, pitch SSG to Gamble for the Glimpse, tap the Taiga to cast Glimpse.

Taiga, Gamble, Petal: You're getting the idea here.

[Gambit]

Seems like Serum Powder would be a good inclusion; as you are trying to mull into the Glimpse

[Weekend Daddy]

Why's there a Savannah in this deck?

EDIT: I'm not sure I agree with the inclusion of Burning Wish over Gamble here. Gamble allows you to go off on turn one with incredibly more frequency. Examples include:

Taiga, Gamble, ESG: Play the Taiga, Gamble for the Glimpse, ESG to cast the Glimpse, go off.

Taiga, Gamble, SSG: Play the Taiga, pitch SSG to Gamble for the Glimpse, tap the Taiga to cast Glimpse.

Taiga, Gamble, Petal: You're getting the idea here.

1) I have an axtra Savannah
2) Not sure what a better dual land to use in a deck that already has a land that covers both bases: Red and Green

[Jak]

Use another Taiga.

[nightshade81]

I remeber a version of this deck running Multani's Presence & Chalice of the Void as an alternatice way to go off.

Another good card is Diabolic Intent.

[outsideangel]

Is there a way to make this deck not lose to Force of Will?

[Maveric78f]

Cabal therapy ?

Here is what I used to play a long time ago. Retract is tech to generate storm, draw and even mana.

// Lands
2 [U] Bayou
2 [U] Tropical Island

// Creatures
4 [SH] Shifting Wall
4 [VI] Phyrexian Marauder
4 [4E] Ornithopter
4 [VI] Phyrexian Walker
4 [AL] Shield Sphere
4 [MR] Frogmite

// Spells
4 [TE] Lotus Petal
4 [MM] Land Grant
2 [MR] Chrome Mox
1 [SH] Mox Diamond
4 [DS] Retract
4 [CHK] Glimpse of Nature
2 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
1 [EX] Culling the Weak
4 [6E] Mystical Tutor
2 [PS] Diabolic Intent
4 [JU] Cabal Therapy

// Sideboard
SB: 3 [SOK] Pithing Needle
SB: 1 [SC] Brain Freeze
SB: 4 [SC] Xantid Swarm
SB: 3 [5E] Hurkyl's Recall
SB: 4 [US] Duress

[Weekend Daddy]

Is there a way to make this deck not lose to Force of Will?


Have 2 green sources and 2 Glimpse Of Nature.

You'll get by that 1 force of will. Doesn't CRET Belcher have the same problem?

[matelml]

No, not always because of Empty the warrens.

[scrumdogg]

No, not always because of Empty the warrens.

That is misleading in a way, as Force of Will at the right time leaves you just short of doing anything useful either way. The difference is that the FoW player must make many more decisions in a Belcher turn than a Glimpse turn. Vs Belcher, you want them to expend significant resources yet fizzle so there is a razor edge between just right & too late. Glimpse has to hit at the beginning of the string of events, making it an easy decision for the FoW player. I'm glad someone is working on this again as it is a fun deck. Consistency has always been the issue and continues to be the issue, for example the correct number & mix of creatures. I like the 8 Spirit Guide plan...but it is difficult to count them toward a creature count since you will so rarely be able to cast more than one. Gamble is interesting but not only holds the chance for self-destruction (pretty much 20% at best) but does nothing to stop the Force of Will problem. Gamble in a deck running something like LftL is gold, as you don't care if it gets discarded, not the case for Glimpse.

[Cavius The Great]

Saw this deck on the Wizard boards and I'm trying to ramp it up a bit:

LANDS: 2
1 Taiga
1 Savannah

SPELLS: 58
CREATURES: 36
4 Crimson Kobolds
4 Crookshank Kobolds
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Kobolds Of Kher Keep
4 Orinthopter
4 Shield Sphere
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Tinder Wall
4 Wild Cantor

UTILITY: 22
4 Glimpse Of Nature
4 Land Grant
4 Lotus Petal
4 Summoners Pact
3 Gamble
3 Grapeshot

SIDEBOARD:
4 Pact Of Negation
4 Xantid Swarm

It works in the same sense as Belcher, except you really only need 3 cards for this instead of 5 (Green Mana, Glimpse Of Nature, and a creature to start drawing for Storm and/or Grapeshot).

Summoners Pact upps the creature count to virtually 40. Gamble allows you to search for Glimpse of Nature early on. Sure, it's risky, but it's the best 1 mana from-the-deck-to-your-hand search card you can come across. I am a bit curious if having Gamble is a bit superfluous.

This decklist seems like it would be really inconsistent. I've messed around with numerous Kobold builds and have had no success. And this build doesn't look any better. You have no draw besides Glimpse of Nature which is bad. Sorry about no constructive criticism I'm just letting you know what's on my mind.

[Weekend Daddy]

What if I add a Multani's Presence + Chalice Of The Void draw engine? Would that make the deck more consistant in drawing?

Chalice @ 0, play all those 0 creature spells and have them countered to draw cards and have a fun ol time.

-3 Gamble
-1 Land Grant
-4 Kobolds

+4 Multani's Presence
+4 Chalice Of The Void

[ReAnimated]

How about a Hunting Pack // Vitalizing Wind + Cordocedent Crossraod as altrenate win conditions?

And why dont u play Gaea's Cradle + Crop Rotation with stuff like Collective Unconscious and possibly Slate of Ancestry just in case you run outta steam with the glimpse........I played this in my kobold build ( Without LED or Petal ) and it helped me alot when Glimpse didn't hit creatures and Emerald Charm is excellent too because you untap your Cradle


I.E - Tap Gaea's Cradle for 10+ , Tap Forest crop ration the Cradle , Tap for 10+ more , Then uptap with charm then u have 30+ mana for the low low price of 2 cards ( and with the draw in this deck this doesn't seem hard to accomplish)

Just my 2cents

[Nydaeli]

Scapegoat is ridiculous tech. Just saying.

[Cavius The Great]

How about a Hunting Pack // Vitalizing Wind + Cordocedent Crossraod as altrenate win conditions?

And why dont u play Gaea's Cradle + Crop Rotation with stuff like Collective Unconscious and possibly Slate of Ancestry just in case you run outta steam with the glimpse........I played this in my kobold build ( Without LED or Petal ) and it helped me alot when Glimpse didn't hit creatures and Emerald Charm is excellent too because you untap your Cradle


I.E - Tap Gaea's Cradle for 10+ , Tap Forest crop ration the Cradle , Tap for 10+ more , Then uptap with charm then u have 30+ mana for the low low price of 2 cards ( and with the draw in this deck this doesn't seem hard to accomplish)

Just my 2cents

Candelabra of Tawnos is alot better at abusing Gaea's Cradle than Emerald Charm. And I agree with Slate of Ancestry, it's a great card when you run out of steam or don't draw a Glimpse but a bunch of Kobolds. I run three in my Kobold deck.

[ebbitten]

How's the consistency? gamble seems a little, risky. Especially with their only being 3 gambles, also FoW/stifle/daze/counterspell if there on the play looks like it could give you serious trouble. Also IMO phyrexian walker>orinothopter. Goblins simply can't get past an early 3 toughness, ever, although they shouldn't usually be giving you trouble.

[Bane of the Living]

So whos interested in my set of Kobolds? Any takers?

[Weekend Daddy]

Here's a bit of a revision, I'm trying to implement freatures of CRET BELCHER. This is a bit of a rough draft, more to come (this is basically ideas I could jot down in a computer tent in which I have 20 minutes to acquire as much info as I can):

27
4 Glimpse Of Nature
4 Burning Wish
4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Lions Eye Daimond
4 Land Grant
3 Empty The Warrens

33
4 Orinthopter
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Shield Sphere
4 Phyrexian Walker
4 Tinder Wall

2 Stomping Ground

-----------
1 Empty The Warrens
1 Demonfire


culling the weak (B sac creature, add BBBB)

[Samshire]

Yeah, you might want some cheap artifact hate in the sideboard. I know that Chalice set to 0 is really hard to cast, but it comes down more often then you would think.