[Deck] Doc Samson (Mono-G Hulk)

[Knuckles29]

Hear is another rogue thing I would like to try and fix. The idea is that Flash HUlk was nearly unstopable outside of Fish, so I would like to simulate that to the best of my ability.

The deck

Engine:
4 Protean Hulk
1 Carrion Feeder
1 Body Snatcher
1 Sylvan Safeguide
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker

The new Flash:
4 Natural Order
3 Summoner's Egg
3 Phyrexian Tower
3 High Market

The Other Stuff
4 Bird of Paradise
4 Llanowar Elf
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Land Grant
4 Living Wish
2 Crop Rotation
1 Boseiju
3 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
3 Summoner's Pact
4 Tinderwall

(I know it is well over 60 cards; that is why I need help)

~Here are the little tricks of the deck~

--Cheating a Hulk in--
Natural Order - we saw it in Secret Force way back when; and it can get Hulk off a turn 1 Elf/Bird

Summoner's Egg - It becomes a Hulk upon death (if you need one, Pact for it)

--Getting a Hulk dead--
Carrion Feeder - you may actually draw into one, and w/ the Bayou, you can play it

Cabal Therapy - Play it early to protect, and have it in the yard to sac the Hulk

High Market/Phyrexian Tower - They eat a Hulk, almost uncounterably

--Other Dumb Tricks--
Land Grant -> Dryad Arbor - It is a green creature and a land, so it can be eaten by Natural Order, or fetched by Pact (I would not recommend that)

Pact -> Tinder Wall - think of it as searching for accel that you can use this turn

Crop Rotation - Not really a trick but I think I should mention that is why there is a 1-of Boseiju

~~Sideboard~~
4x Xantid Swarm
1x Dosan, the Falling Leaf
1x High Market
1x Summoner's Egg
1x Sylvan Safeguard*** (thinking about moving the MD into SB)
1x Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1x Kjeldoran Dead
1x Volrath's Stronghold
1x Academy Ruins
3x Open Slots

So far it isn't bad, not great, but I am not all that vulnerable, that is unless there is targets removal. Wait, what am I talking about, this is Legacy. So I am wondering a few things;
1) Is it feasiable to go on with such an idea? Or is it beyond fragile?
2) What to cut? What would be able to be combined into fewer slots?
3) Other than maindecking Xantid Swarm and Dosan, is there anything that could help me out?

The only answers I really got to this was Duress, City of Solitude, and changing too much around for it to keep speed.

City of Solitude isn't the answer, Dosan would be if anything as he is a green creature.

The Summon's Egg and Natural Order provide enough redundancy I feel they are worth it.

The -Sacrifice Lands- feel like they are needed as uncounterable outlets. Maybe Despotic Scepter (Sp.?) or Claws of Gix??? Slaughter Pact???

Does anyone think going G/U is a better way of thinking?

Any help is appreciated as this is a pet deck that I wanna push into a more competative bracket

[Cavius The Great]

I've built a similiar deck and found that Despotic Scepter could be useful as a sac outlet. And something like Pattern of Rebirth might be better than Summoner's Egg.

[Nihil Credo]

Here's how I'd tweak this deck. Warning: the following is untested.

Removed:

- Summoner's Egg: slows you down tremendously; also vulnerable to Swords to Plowshares, or to any removal/Disenchant in response to its Imprint trigger. Much of the power of Hulk Flash came from its ability to dodge spot removal.
- Dryad Arbor: look this one up under "The danger of cool things". This also leads to the removal of...
- Land Grant: The LAST thing you want to do in this deck is to reveal your hand.
- Crop Rotation and Boseiju: You do not fear countermagic as much as graveyard hate, and sometimes StP.
- Phyrexian Tower #3, High Marker #2-3: The Tower is legendary, and seven sac outlets are plenty (plus in a pinch the Natural Orders work as well)
- Living Wish: slow as crap.
- Lotus Petal: You are not fast enough to use this one. Tinder Wall stays since the 0/3 body can be useful against aggro.

Added:
- Karmic Guide: you missed this piece of the combo ;)
- Simic Sky Swallower and Phantom Nishobas: alternate Natural Order targets. Entire archetypes just plain scoop to one of these guys.
- Blue splash: Mystical Tutor allows to consistently fetch Natural Order, Summoner's Pact, or Cabal Therapy, and Brainstorm puts combo pieces back in your library as well as protecting them from discard.
- Elves of Deep Shadow: Getting Green mana isn't a problem for this deck; getting Black for Therapy and postboard Duress can be.

Engine:
4 Protean Hulk
1 Carrion Feeder
1 Body Snatcher
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Karmic Guide

Backup fatties:
1 Simic Sky Swallower
1 Phantom Nishoba

The new Flash:
4 Natural Order
3 Mystical Tutor
3 Summoner's Pact

Protection:
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Brainstorm

Mana

2 Phyrexian Tower
1 High Market
3 Bayou
2 Tropical Island
2 Forest
3 Wooded Foothills
3 Windswept Heath
4 Chrome Mox

4 Bird of Paradise
2 Llanowar Elves
3 Elves of Deep Shadow

4 Tinder Wall

[Cavius The Great]

What do you need Summoner's Pact for? You don't plan on hardcasting a Protean Hulk, do you? This isn't Hulk Flash, you need ways to cheat it into play...

[Nihil Credo]

Duh. Of course you're right. For some reason, I was thinking Natural Order put a fattie from your hand into play, instead of your library.

So -3 Summoner's Pact, +3 Duress maybe? At least an Echoing Truth needs to be there too. I'm not sure, I'd have to actually try the deck out.

[Knuckles29]

b/c the deck moves at sorcery speed, do you think Defense Grid may be worth a shot??

I will take your advice and slap together a copy and try it out in a week at our Legacy night, provided I can pilot the thing properly by then.

Is the Hulk creatures still the right mix? I know I can't do the Sliver version as by that time Goblins would have blockers. But is there a better mix other than the Kiki-Jiki/Karmic Guide version??

Another random I dea I had for a fatty, the other 2 are still good suggestions and this is in addition, Sabertooth Nishoba. The Pro-Red + Blue is kinda like some really messed up Green Akroma.

[Happy Gilmore]

How about a build that actually works fast enough to be viable. Here is one:

4 Protean Hulk
1 Kiki
1 Karmic Guide
1 Carrion Feeder

4 Cabal Therapy
3 Reanimate
3 Exhume
4 Mystical Tutor
3 Daze
4 Careful Study
4 Intuition
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will

8 Blue Fetchlands
4 Underground Sea
1 Tropical Island
4 Chrome Mox
2 Island
1 Swamp

SB:
2 Simic Sky-swallower
2 Akroma AoR
1 Body Snatcher
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
3 Engineered Plague
3 Duress
3 Pithing Needle

turn 1 win:
land, Chrome mox, careful Study (discarding Hulk+therapy), reanimate= win

You get the idea.

[outsideangel]

3 Reanimate
3 Exhume


The reanimate spells that make you sac the creature seem like they might be a better fit here, don't you think?

[laststepdown]

Claws of Gix? There's also Greater Gargadon, which may be easier to protect as a sac outlet.

[Maveric78f]

I would play Hulk in a GU shell with survival of the fittest, quite a lot of mana acceleration and natural order. Ovinize would be a good card in order to sac hulk the first time or to get rid of annoying creatures.

It can be tried in GB too, but the lack of brainstorm and counterspell may be problematic.

[kicks_422]

Actually, I was thinking of fitting this into a list similar to RGb Survival. The combo would potentially only occupy seven creature spots anyway (1 each of Protean Hulk, Greater Gargadon, Apprentice Necromancer, Anger, Kiki-Jiki, Karmic Guide, Carrion Feeder), and eight with a protection creature (Benevolent Bodyguard/Sylvan Safekeeper) thrown in.

It's something to potentially cut the combo player's throat after burgeoning him with discard, or to break stalemates on the ground. The deck would also play fine like a regular RGb Survival deck, which plays fine even without the namesake card in play. The Hulk combo would be like the third option to winning (first would be abusing Survival, second would be just beating down).

I think my rambling has produced something promising for a change.

[Cavius The Great]

The reanimate spells that make you sac the creature seem like they might be a better fit here, don't you think?

Do you mean Corpse Dance and Shallow Grave?

[nitewolf9]

How about a build that actually works fast enough to be viable. Here is one:

4 Protean Hulk
1 Kiki
1 Karmic Guide
1 Carrion Feeder

4 Cabal Therapy
3 Reanimate
3 Exhume
4 Mystical Tutor
3 Daze
4 Careful Study
4 Intuition
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will

8 Blue Fetchlands
4 Underground Sea
1 Tropical Island
4 Chrome Mox
2 Island
1 Swamp

SB:
2 Simic Sky-swallower
2 Akroma AoR
1 Body Snatcher
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
3 Engineered Plague
3 Duress
3 Pithing Needle

turn 1 win:
land, Chrome mox, careful Study (discarding Hulk+therapy), reanimate= win

You get the idea.

I think the idea of hulk-reanimator is the only way to make this deck fast enough. It's also cool to win in one turn with reanimator, which should be the case for any combo deck.


The idea is that Flash HUlk was nearly unstopable outside of Fish


Fish beating hulk flash, you're so silly.

[Cavius The Great]

I think the deck needs more sac outlets. 4 cabal therapy doesn't seem nearly enough.

[Illissius]

Do you mean Corpse Dance and Shallow Grave?

Necromancy and Footsteps of the Goryo. They ideally require a way to kill at instant speed, though. (Whether Teardop Kami and Bloodshot Cyclops added to the Kiki kill, or the Disciple kill).

kicks_422: Survival has a much more compact combo available with Saffi Eriksdotter, Crypt Champion, Caller of the Claw, optionally Anger. Head over to the Survival thread if you want to read up on it. (Hint: The only thing you actually have to cast is the Champion).

[Happy Gilmore]

I think the deck needs more sac outlets. 4 cabal therapy doesn't seem nearly enough.

if they unban Entomb that would be the card, but without that I still don't think you need it. You have 4x Cabal therapy, 4x Intuition, and 4x careful study to get Hulk in the yard. The other neet thing is that you can go off even if they extripate the hulks lol.

[Knuckles29]

@Happy Gilmore:

For the sake of argument, would Summoner's Pact-> Careful Study be a good idea? I mean it is no additional mana, and you are guareenteed a higher draw rate. That is how my HulkFlash was so nearly unstoppable, Future Sight... that is the set that broke the back.

Anyways, I like the reanimation idea as well. I may need to gauge my meta as I keep hitting this a-hole w/ Landstill that stops my Belcher from going 4-0.

I am thinking Cabal Therapy naming FoWill may actually be the best way in.

Don't Get me wrong, I still like Nihil's list w/ the back-up fat, as that may be the more stable platform.

Anyone test either of these ideas???