The Rack legal in T2 (AKA Why I love Bob now)

[Versus]

Been having trouble finding a place to place Legacy in my area. I have no problem driving 4 hours Upstate to play in an event, but I just wanna play something now and on a regular basis. That FNM thing is rampant and there's a shop within walking distance of my apartment so what the hell. Also if I'm am gonna make a trek I should at least get some time in playing local so I don't travel across the state just to make a silly game play mistakes and bite it in the first round.

I don't wanna play anything called Soggy Pickles or whatever and I don't wanna invest in cards that are gonna rotate out in a month unless they are viable Legacy cards I don't have. So I went about making a deck with some old school flavor. Enter The Rack!

It kinda blows my mind that this is legal in T2. As a matter of fact I had no idea until yesterday as I never really looked at the Time Shifted cards. Of course I wanted to go mono black here full discard and a couple of threats. Wouldn't you know it, GUESS WHO makes an appearance in the Archetype that spashes green???! Yeah, our friend the Goyf. So I grabbed my old Funeral Charms, Racks, Stupors, Hyppys, Ravenous Rats. Bought a couple commons like Cry of Contrition and Auger of Skulls then proxied the Shock lands and Tarmy. Needless to say the deck is fucking sick.

Of course as much as I talk shit about his inclusion in Legacy Sui black I threw in 4 Confidant. Lets just say that even my wife who's been playing for 3 weeks knew enough to burn his ass within two turns!

I dunno if I can handle playing young kids though. I may have to bring a cattle prod or something...

[DeathwingZERO]

Play with headphones on. That way you can blast your music like a dick, and if someone who is actually good plays against you, you can just set one to the side of your ear, so you look like your only half ass paying attention.

If your gonna waste your time playing FNM against kids and n00bs, might as well look like a total egotistical ass when doing it. 8-)

[Versus]

HAHA!! How about I just bring a 48"X36" boom box blasting a Slayer cassette and set it right in the playing area? :laugh:

[DeathwingZERO]

Nah, that'd likely just get you kicked out. But I know a number of people that have played with headphones on, and nobody really gave them any shit for it.

[Versus]

Kicked out??! Everyone likes Slayer!

Seriously, why is it that Rack decks aren't competitive in Legacy? IS everything else just too fast? I thought it was banned then looked again after I saw it in Standard and I was confusing it with Black Vise.

[Nihil Credo]

Before getting Goyf, The Rack decks got murdered by Gruul (and even now they are unfavoured). In Legacy, I'm guessing they'd get murdered by Goblins even with Goyf.

[TheAardvark]

Nah, that'd likely just get you kicked out. But I know a number of people that have played with headphones on, and nobody really gave them any shit for it.

Gadiel does it, so it must be cool.

[Versus]

Mods: If it's not cool to talk about Standard bullshit here, just let me know.

Alright, who wants to help me beat this T2 crowdLOL

I know no one cares about T2, but that's all I got by my house. I learned a lot just playing other people last Friday. Like I said, if I'm gonna drive a couple hours to play Legacy I might as well get some time in JUST playing. Had I driven a distance only to play the way I did on Friday I would be embarrassed to all shit.

Anyway the FNM thing was only 4 rounds. I went 2-2. Here's the problem, I can't fucking sideboard! Never could.

Here's my deck

4 Auger of Skulls
4 Confidant
4 Goyf
3 Mindlash Sliver

4 Smallpox
3 Funeral Charm
3 Cry of Contrition
3 Stupor
3 Terror

3 Call of the Herd
1 Putrefy

4 Rack

3 O-Tombs
3 Llanowar Waste
2 Gemstone Mines
1 Pendelhaven
1 Urborg
3 Treetops
2 Golgari Rot Farm
6 Swamp

SB:

3 Extirpate
3 Darkheart Sliver
3 Seal of Primordum
3 Withered Wretch
2 Putrefy
1 Terror

I played a Seismic Assault/Life from the Loam combo that packed Goyf and some Viper that had Deathtouch or let you cantrip if it went unblocked, a straight green aggro with Groudbreakers, Might of Old Krosa, and some creature that gave the next creature you played a +3/+3, and a Sliver deck.

In the Seismic deck that I plyed first I just choked. I didn't know what half his cards did. I had to stop to read them and I was just nervous I guess. I didn't SB at all and ended up going 1-2 that round. I would have added in Extirpates and Seals here I guess.

The Green aggro I took 2-0. I just SB'd in the other removal: -2 Sliver, -1 Stupor/ +2 Putrefy, +1 Terror

The Sliver deck had the White +1/+1 Sliver and the mini Goblin Legionnaire Sliver(R sac to cause 1/ W sac to prevent one). I sided in my own Slivers a some more removal. I figured mine would get pumped as well and since I was using Gemstone Mines I could use all his Sliver abilities as well. He beat me 2-0

Anyway... I don't think I'm SB'ing right. The matches don't seem to treat me any better post board. I think that maybe when I SB I just end up throwing in too many cards that I THINK will help and thus destroy the original decks dynamic or not enough cards to actually change anything for the better.

I put Extirpates/Seals in the SB for Combo, Extirpates/Wretches for GY hate, Darkharts agaisnt burn, and more removal, but all in all I didn't really face any of those besides the one Combo deck.

I don't want you to play my matches for me, but what would you have done agaisnt those decks? Maybe I can better idea of what I'm doing wrong and go from there.

Normally if I'm playing Black in Legacy I know exactly what to SB in as all my SB cards are hate towards a certain deck, but will I SB out the right cards to get the the right ones in? Probably not. I guess I just kinda suck now. Maybe I shouldn't be driving anywhere just to get my ass handed to me...

[Nihil Credo]

Mindlash Sliver is terrible. No, worse than that. Just play Ravenous Rats or something. Also, where the fuck is The Rack? It's the single reason to play this archetype.

For reference. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13267292&postcount=15)

Anyway, here's my opinion:

1) Seismic Loam: Playing non-targeted, non-random discard against this deck is pretty damn pointless. Side out that stuff in order to bring in: Extirpate, Withered Wretch, Seal of Primordiuml. Also, no reason not to replace the Putrefy for a Terror.

2) Mono-Green Aggro: You should have also brought in the Darkheart Slivers. MGA runs a lot of pseudo-burn (Groundbreaker and pump).

3) Slivers: what you did seems OK. It's too bad that you lost, because you appear to be pretty favoured in the matchup - unless he packed a large amount of burn.

[Versus]

Mindlash Sliver is terrible. No, worse than that. Just play Ravenous Rats or something. Also, where the fuck is The Rack? It's the single reason to play this archetype.

For reference. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13267292&postcount=15)

Anyway, here's my opinion:

1) Seismic Loam: Playing non-targeted, non-random discard against this deck is pretty damn pointless. Side out that stuff in order to bring in: Extirpate, Withered Wretch, Seal of Primordiuml. Also, no reason not to replace the Putrefy for a Terror.

2) Mono-Green Aggro: You should have also brought in the Darkheart Slivers. MGA runs a lot of pseudo-burn (Groundbreaker and pump).

3) Slivers: what you did seems OK. It's too bad that you lost, because you appear to be pretty favoured in the matchup - unless he packed a large amount of burn.

The Rack is there! I'm running 4. That's the only reason I'm playing the deck as so many cards are TS it feels old school. I been in that thread over at WOTC many times. I basically took Marco's list and changed it up a bit. I perfer to run CoH in the main deck and thought that Darkhearts were better than Gnomes especially running 3 other Slivers Maindeck. I threw in the Mines as another way to feed Goyf. Also I could always use them as Swamps and save the counters if Urborg is out, use them with for opponents Slivers, or return them to my hand with Rot FArm and get 3 new counters.

Mindlash are bad? I figured having 1 drop, and the ability to have the opponent discard 3 cards on turn 2 (paired with Cry) was pretty strong. That combined with having Darkhearts in the SB seemed solid to me. I tested Rats, but then my deck looks like it was pulled off the internet. I tried to be different I guess. Another one of my weaknesses. I'll do something to not look like a netdecker and it'll cost me games I suppose.

Ok:

Seismic Loam: -3 Cry, -3 Slivers (or Rats), -3 Stupor, -2 Putrefy/ +3 Extipate, +3 Seal, +3 Wretch, +2 Terror

Aggro: -3 Mindlash (Rats), -2 Cry, -1 Stupor, -1 Skulls /+3 Darkheart, +2 Terror, +2 Putrefy ???

Dranlu: (This was being played but I didnt match with him) I'm guessing bring the Extirpates for his counters?

You're right, the Sliver guy packed 4 Helix and another burn spell I'm not familiar with. And would you believe he drew a Hit//Run off Confidant in game 2 and still won!

While I'd rather not shell out $40 for Damnations, I'm thinking they would be valuble in the SB as well as Tombstalkers agaisnt opposing Goyfs. Both Chanps from GErmany and Japan are using 2 or 3 in their SB's

[sammiel]

well, since type 2 is about to get dropped on its ass pretty soon, you're gonna have a hard time finding any serious format development. Honestly, I wouldn't shell out any serious money on a T2 deck right now unless A: its playable in other formats or B: you're going to continue playing T2 after Ravnica rotates out.

[Versus]

well, since type 2 is about to get dropped on its ass pretty soon, you're gonna have a hard time finding any serious format development. Honestly, I wouldn't shell out any serious money on a T2 deck right now unless A: its playable in other formats or B: you're going to continue playing T2 after Ravnica rotates out.

Very true. Shelling out the dough for Goyf and Bob was insignificant as they are Legacy staples anyway. The Extirpates and CoH I got pretty cheap and the rest of the deck are commons and Timeshifted cards I already had in my collection. Unless LOR gives Black something to replace Bob, the deck will die and I'll be stuck with buying a bunch of friggin Planeswalkers and dropping more cash for a format I don't give a rats ass about.

[Nihil Credo]

Sorry, I must have missed the Rack in the list :)

Mindlashes mean 2 mana = each player discards a card. Ravenous Rats mean 2 mana = your opponent discards a card. Since you do not lack Cry of Contrition outlets (Augur, Smallpox) and you already have turn 1 plays (tapped Village, Rack, Charm, sometimes Cry) the Rats seem pretty superior.

I don't like Damnation in this deck. How about Deathmarks instead? They're pretty damn good in the format.

Distress is also back in Tenth Edition. It's probably worth trying it out.

Also, I'm not sure this is a strategy worth pursuing, but it seems Black has access to quite a few LD spells right now. Between Smallpox, Rain of Tears, Creeping Mold, and Caustic Rain, that's some pain, especially if accelerated by some Birds or Elves. Rolling Spoils is even better if you can rework your creature base so it does not Wrath you.

[Versus]

Alright, I'll go back to the Rats for this Friday and see how they work for me. Another thing I noticed about the Mindlash though is 2 or 3 times my opp spent an early burn spell on them when I was tapped out. It's got a bit of bluffability to it. Either way the Rats are still viable with Pendelhaven so the change may be for the best.

Deathmarks are great, but I already run 10 removal between main and SB. Terror saved my ass too many times to cut. Cutting Putrefy could work as no one was playing black making Terror superior. The only artifact I remember being played were Chromatic Stars. Green was deffinately the most prevalent creature color.

Funny you should mention LD as I was gonna try that route after Bob rotated out. Distress seems like a very plausable replacement for Cry as well.

I appreciate your help. WotC board has some decent members, but basically threads are just one big circle jerk with people posting up decklists and not actually discussing anything.