[Deck] UG Controll (Crux)

[Team-Hero]

1 Wooded Foothills
1 Polluted Delta
1 Windswept Heath
1 Flooded Strand
4 Wasteland
1 Dust Bowl
4 Forest
5 Island
4 Tropical Island
--22 Lands--
4 Eternal Witness
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Vexing Sphinx
4 Serra Sphinx
--15 Creatures--
4 Fallow Earth
4 Submerge
4 Force of Will
4 Temporal Spring
4 Brainstorm
3 Fact or Fiction
--23 Other Spells--
---60 Cards Total---

2 Blue Elemental Blast
2 Hydroblast
2 Divert
4 Stifle
3 Echoing Truth
2 Gilded Drake

The Deck's main strategy is to set back the opponent's tempo; giving you enough time to get in some unblocked attacks and end up in a possition of advantage mid/late game.

The deck is designed to beat other decks that run green because of the mainboard submerge.

LANDS:
The choice to run only 4 fetchlands is for the purpose of making sure to have a land drop most every turn. The deck begins to operate at its fullest when it reaches 6 lands. Use the Wastelands and Dustbowl loosely because most likely this deck is packing more 'solid' lands than the opponent's deck; thus giving a land drop advantage over the opponent.

CREATURES:
Tarmogoyf:
Tarmogoyf right now is the best vanilla creature for its casting cost. The deck takes advantage of that by not only dropping him early in the game, but being able to limit the opponent to find blockers and answers for him.
Eternal Witness:
She's mainly used to get back a Submerge or a Temporal Spring and setting the opponent back another turn in which he will draw the same card over again. She's a great attacker when no blockers are present and makes for great tempo. A little trick that I do with her once I reach six lands is to cast an Eternal Witness, get back another Eternal Witness from my graveyard, cast that one, and get back a Submerge and play that for free.
Vexing Sphinx:
Vexing Sphinx has two purposes in this deck. The first purpose is for him to attack and get at least 8 points of unblocked damage in. The second purpose is for him to filter out your hand of cards you do not need and eventually exchange them for cards you do need. After you have attacked with him twice, the next time you have to pay his upkeep let him die and draw three cards off that. This tactic fills up your hand and gives you much tempo over the opponent.
Serra Sphinx:
Serra Sphinx was designed just for this deck. It's amazing to see her in action. She has evasion plus does not give the opponent the chance to counter attack back. Best part of all, she pitches to Force of Will early in the game.

SPELLS:
Most of the spells are designed to set back the opponent enough for the deck to perform mini 'time walks'. Brainstorm and Fact of Fiction are designed to break the game's tempo and give the deck great card advantage. The deck is best played when the player knows his/her percentages. When you dive deep on a draw (whether from Vexing Sphinx, Fact or Fiction, or Brainstorm) the player playing this deck should be counting the probability in his/her mind to find a removal or set back spell.

[outsideangel]

Needs more countermagic. 4x Force is not enough to beat combo reliably. CounterTop could be an interesting addition here as well.

[Team-Hero]

That's what the sideboard is for. 4 Stifles, 3 Echoing Truth, and the Hydro/Blue Blasts are all used against combo. The deck does not perform that bad against the combo matchup. You can always remove the Guilded Drake over a couple of Dazes I guess...

[MattH]

Serra Sphinx is not good. Morphling would be better and Morphling probably isn't good enough either.

[Cavius The Great]

This deck needs Coiling Oracle. It should be almost an auto-include judging from the list.

[Nihil Credo]

This deck needs Coiling Oracle. It should be almost an auto-include judging from the list.
Pay UG: Do Nothing? I disagree. Oracle is only good in a tribal deck, or when you have/want to bounce your own permanents.

[Aggro_zombies]

Pay UG: Do Nothing? I disagree. Oracle is only good in a tribal deck, or when you have/want to bounce your own permanents.
That's not true. It's :u::g: to reduce the number of cards in your library by one, which can be very important when you're trying to play that game-ending card you have hidden away beneath a Shelldock Isle.

On a more serious note, it seems like Temporal Spring would be superior in almost every way to Fallow Earth because of the former card's utility. So why do you run both? Land destruction is very overrated in the present format. I'd rather run Plow Under or Stunted Growth in place of Fallow Earth, as those two are generally more painful for the opponent to deal with. And the deck does need more countermagic. I'd suggest cutting down on the number of creatures for more counters and more versatile removal. The deck isn't really control so much as it is aggro-control in a different way than Thresh - you don't really have any way to ensure a favorable board position or sculpt a desirable late game state for yourself.

[TheDarkshineKnight]

Serra Sphinx is not good. Morphling would be better and Morphling probably isn't good enough either.

Didn't everyone realize that Morphling was shit a couple of years back?

Methinks Meloku is a decent win condition, though.

[hi-val]

Well hello good sir! Allow me to introduce my friend, Memory Lapse. You and her will probably get along quite well : )

[Cait_Sith]

Didn't everyone realize that Morphling was shit a couple of years back?

Methinks Meloku is a decent win condition, though.

One is immune to Swords to Plowshares. One is not. Meloku rocks with stuff like Fastbond and Exploration, so you have an army of 1/1s. Otherwise Morphling is better.

Edit: Memory Lapse? I swear, its an atrocious card...

And this is an atrocious control deck. It is like a bad Thresh. What you need is some nice Control elements and a good wincon.

You could use Crucible/Dust/Wasteland/Exploration to great effect here, and then have Meloku come pounding in.

Run 8 Counterspells at least (if not 10). Since you are going to cut your wincons down to 3 Melokus, that opens up 18 slots, so use 6 of those.

In those last 12 slots add in 3-4 Crucible, 4 Exploration, and some more draw. I am ALMOST tempted to say Compulsive Research, but the fact it is a Sorcery makes me cry.

Also, if you are going for Tempo, switch stuff around for MD Echoing Truth. It can just randomly win games by setting your opponent back 3+ turns.

Also, SB some Elephant Grass. They can hold off Ichorid and Breakfast for some time (until you can find better ways of stopping them).

[MattH]

Predict would be pretty hot. :D

[Team-Hero]

I tried to use Morphling in this deck and he didn't work. He was too mana dependant to be functionable where as Serra Sphinx just came down and started beating face the next turn.

The Fallow Earth is not a type of LD, it is a type of card that puts the opponent's draw/land drop back 1 turn.

On the counter magic aspect, I have tried to run a couple of mana leaks and counterspell but they were just not that good in this deck as the bounce was.

I have played this deck at my local tournaments and it runs pretty good. I think someone else should give it a shot at least once and see how it works out for them.

[Tacosnape]

I hate to keep asking this same question in every deck that pops up in New&Developmental, but what happens if you lose the die roll? The success of this deck seems to depend heavily on going first.

[kirdape3]

Memory Lapse is absolutely batshit insane. Thanks, you did nothing with the mana you invested and have a shot of doing nothing again next turn.

[Team-Hero]

I hate to keep asking this same question in every deck that pops up in New&Developmental, but what happens if you lose the die roll? The success of this deck seems to depend heavily on going first.

This is why you have Submerge and Force of Will. Those two cards should be played for free most of the time when it is your turn to go. Also, you will be on the draw, thus your opponent will draw less... which this deck takes advantage of that. The deck just has to play around drawing first rather than playing first if that is the situation.

[Team-Hero]

I have updated the deck with a new card from the most Lorwyn set.

-4 Fallow Earth

+3 Whirlpool Whelm
+1 ?

I am playtesting Iwamori of the Open Fist, Kodama of the North Tree, Gigapede, Morphling, Looter il-kor, Ohran Viper, or Somnophore.

[mattkru]

What about Trygon Predator? It's a flying weapon against Counterbalance, Jitte, Affinity, SoFaI, Chrome Mox Diamond, Stax, SotF,...

[Media314r8]

1 Wooded Foothills

The deck begins to operate at its fullest when it reaches 6 lands.

A little trick that I do with her once I reach six lands is to cast an Eternal Witness, get back another Eternal Witness from my graveyard, cast that one, and get back a Submerge and play that for free.

Serra Sphinx was designed just for this deck. It's amazing to see her in action. She has evasion plus does not give the opponent the chance to counter attack back. Best part of all, she pitches to Force of Will early in the game.

WOW... I lost it at "a little trick that I do once I reach six lands (including GGGG of course!)..." LULZ. This isnt 43 land: GTFO and post in the casual forums. I'm tired of hearing about what new player would do with (insert some number between 5 and 12) lands in play (and actually RESOLVING everything) in legacy. For christ's sake, if you have six lands in play, you should have finished the game, and your opponent's allready at his house coveting his new trophy... and you are on turn 45 of your now-finished game. Mods, please move this to a casual or general discussion forum.

Serra sphynx was a bomb in TS block limited. Looter il-kor belongs in a deck with goyf, not sphynx.

[Team-Hero]

WOW... I lost it at "a little trick that I do once I reach six lands (including GGGG of course!)..." LULZ. This isnt 43 land: GTFO and post in the casual forums. I'm tired of hearing about what new player would do with (insert some number between 5 and 12) lands in play (and actually RESOLVING everything) in legacy. For christ's sake, if you have six lands in play, you should have finished the game, and your opponent's allready at his house coveting his new trophy... and you are on turn 45 of your now-finished game. Mods, please move this to a casual or general discussion forum.

Serra sphynx was a bomb in TS block limited. Looter il-kor belongs in a deck with goyf, not sphynx.

I have won a couple of tournaments with this deck already. I am sure that nobody in the Legacy community has used this deck other than me. I would appreciate if you would test the deck out before making irrational assumptions. I believe this deck to be an innovation against the norm and against what the meta is currently standing on.

The deck has worked out for me very well and I strongly believe that it could also work for someone else if they would try it out. Until then, I will continue to post new ideas and changes to the deck; not for the sake of posting to the community, but for the sake of recording and publishing.

[Team-Hero]

What about Trygon Predator? It's a flying weapon against Counterbalance, Jitte, Affinity, SoFaI, Chrome Mox Diamond, Stax, SotF,...

I am considering adding two Trygon Predator to the sideboard rather than the drakes. Your right, he is a house against some decks.

[Team-Hero]

So I changed the deck a little.

-1 Dust Bowl
-2 Forest
-4 Eternal Witness

+2 Fetchland
+2 Jitte
+1 Petrified Field
+1 Kira, Glass Spinner
+1 Teferi

I added more blue to the deck for FoW. In addition, Jitte works really good with Goyf and the Serra Sphinx. Kira and Teferi are just there to test; see how they do. Petrified field works better than Dust Bowl because it can get me a fetchland or another Wasteland.

[Team-Hero]

This right here is the new updated list. I am testing out the Overburdens.

4 Wasteland
2 Tropical Island
3 Forest
1 Petrefied Field
6 Island
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta

-- 22 Lands --

4 Tarmogoyf
4 Serra Sphinx
3 Vexing Sphinx
1 Kira, Great Glass-Spinner

-- 12 Creatures --

3 Overburden

-- 3 Enchantments --

4 Force Of Will
4 Submerge
4 Whirlpool Whelm
4 Temporal Spring
4 Brainstorm
3 Fact Or Fiction

-- 23 Spells --

---- 60 Cards ----

I have not completely tuned out the sideboard yet but this is what I have so far.

3 Echoing Truth
3 Gilded Drake
1 Engineered Explosives
4 Stifle
1 Propaganda
2 Krosan Grip
1 Tormod's Crypt

[Cait_Sith]

Lets us start from the beginning.

1) 22 = NO in a Control deck. 24 is the bare minimum. I would accept 23 is you ran 4 Search for Tomorrow and 4 Kodama's Reach. Otherwise, 24. Even worse is that, of these lands, 6 don't produce mana and 5 are likely to be sacrificed.

2) Fact or Fiction is your ONLY means of generating CA or even VCA. This is bad in any deck that doesn't run a lot of dudes running at top speed toward your face. You'll run out of steam long before they run out of abuse. That is more true given that your deck runs a grand total of 4 removal spells (Force of Will).

3) You are running big dudes in a deck with bad tempo. This is simply a BAAAAAD plan.

I suggest you cut out ALL the creatures and the enchantments, then run less expensive dudes.

Sea Drake, Serendib Efreet, and Trygon Predator are excellent places to start with. I would also recommend Drifter il-Dal for some hand scultping (plus Goyf pwering). Oh yea, keep Goyf, he is good.

[raharu]

Looter il-kor
Fixed :tongue:

[Aggro_zombies]

Mercy Killing? Turns dangerous things into easily Engineered Explosives-able things.

[Team-Hero]

So I went 2-1-2 tonight in my local tournament. I only lost to Ichorid.

Match one was against mono black discard. I go 2-0 against him. Game one he played Phyrexian Arena (which ended up killing him) and two Racks. I manage to defend until the arena killed him. I would of attacked but he had Ensaring Bridge at 0 most of the time. I had a Serra Sphinx with a Jitte and a Kira on my side. I managed to use two Fact or Fictions and get the bigger piles most of the time. I would bounce his bridge on top of his library and swing in, cutting his life down faster. I don't remember the second game, but I controlled it.

Match two was against 4 Color Landstill. I go 1-1 against him, drawing due to time. Game one he wrecks me with card advantage and landbeats. Game two I play most of my threats but they still get countered. I managed to get a Primal Order down. He loses to the Primal Order. Game 3 was about the same as game two. I managed to get a Primal Order to stick but he eventually uses Deed to remove it away. We go to turn and we draw.

Match three was against GB Dredge Control. I go 1-1 against him, drawing due to time. Game one he Damnations, Edicts, and Deathclouds everything I play. I lose. Game two I counter his graveyard with a pair of Crypts and manage to beat in with Serra Sphix and Primal Order. Game three went to time. We didn't get to do much.

Match four was against Ichorid. I go 0-2 against him. He gets his combo off and beats me on turn 2-3, there isn't much I could of done even with my sideboards.

Match five was against GR Aggro/Burn. I go 2-1 against him. I lose game one because his Vexing Shusher counters and Apes beat my face. I couldn't stabalize on time. Game two, I sideboard out my Brainstorms and sideboard in four Chalice of the Void. My turn two I play a Chalice with one counter on it. His turn one he managed to slip by a Kird Ape and on his second turn he plays a Vexing Shusher. He begins to pay 1 extra mana for all his 1 casting cost spells and that slowed him down enough for me to stabalize. I Submerge, Whirpool Whelm, and Temporal Spring his Shusher multiple times while had Wastelanded his Tiga. His Apes (two of them) were 1/1 for a long time. I am brought down to 1 life and I manage to get a Serra Sphinx with a Jitte and come back for the win. Game 3 was about the same as game two except that I stabalized right away, took control, and dominated the game.

Shelldock Isle was really bad. I tested it and it didn't help one bit in any match or game. The sideborded Primal Order was amazing. It won me a couple of games, I was really pleased in how it played. I did not get a chance to swing with the Morphling the whole night. The one time he came down, I got Chainers Edict.

4 Wasteland
2 Tropical Island
3 Forest
1 Petrefied Field
5 Island
1 Shelldock Isle
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta

-- 22 Lands --

4 Tarmogoyf
4 Serra Sphinx
3 Vexing Sphinx
1 Kira, Great Glass-Spinner
1 Morphling

-- 13 Creatures --

2 Umezawa's Jitte

-- 2 Artifacts --

4 Force Of Will
4 Submerge
4 Whirlpool Whelm
4 Temporal Spring
4 Brainstorm
3 Fact Or Fiction

-- 23 Spells --

---- 60 Cards ----