[Deck] Dragon Control

[The Legacy Weapon]

Introduction

Hi everyone. This deck is something I came up with about a year ago as an attempt to get my wife interested in playing Magic with me. You see, she likes Dragons and asked me if I could build her a deck that revolved around them. I told her it was possible but it might not be that great. She asked me to try anyway and that's how this started. This is a rogue deck. It's never been to any tournaments because I live way the hell out in Oklahoma. I, however, CAN assure you that this deck has been tested and tweaked extensively and it performs well against quite a few of the other "proven" Legacy decks.

Decklist

Land
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Scrubland
4 Badlands
4 Plateau
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
3 Mishra's Factory

Instants and Sorceries
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Damnation
3 Pyroclasm

Enchantments
4 Sneak Attack

Creatures
4 Eternal Dragon
4 Kokusho The Evening Star
4 Yosei The Morning Star
4 Bogardan Hellkite
3 Academy Rector

Sideboard
4 Duress (Maybe Thoughtseize but lifeloss may be an issue.)
3 Cabal Therapy (More Combo aggrovators)
4 Chalice of the Void ( Set this at 1 and watch Threshold squirm.)
4 Tormod's Crypt (When fighting graveyard combo, this usually gets the job done.)

Brief Strategy Discussion
I know. You're probably shaking your head and saying, "Sneak Attack! What the hell are you smoking?!" It was a last resort for me as I had tried almost everything else. I play strictly Legacy so I needed to find something that would help the deck keep up with the others and Sneak Attack does that. In the earlier builds, it would either work or crash and burn due to faster decks such as Goblins. That's when I decided to go control. I needed to make the opponent wait for me so I went heavy on removal. The reason I chose the Dragons listed is for their superior abilities and their colors. If you haven't drawn into a Sneak Attack, you will still be able to hardcast most of them. Also, all of the Dragons have synergy with sneak attack. Hellkite just wants to come into play, and Kokusho/Yosei just wants to go to the yard.

Please understand that I do not think this deck is perfect. I am merely listing it so that I can get some good outside opinions and hopefully some helpful suggestions. This deck can be tough to beat if you aren't ready for it but it does have some glaring weaknesses. For one thing, Wasteland is a bitch. The deck is 3 color so mana denial can seriously hurt. Heavy permission is also hard to combat seeing as this deck's threats are costly. Well, thanks for looking at least.

Card Choices

Lightning Bolt - For one red mana, this is the best of the best. 3 damage to any targetable creature or straight to the dome of the enemy at instant speed. I'm sold.

Swords to Plowshares - If you need me to explain this one, just read some of the other threads and I'm sure you'll find closure.

Damnation - I chose Damnation because I had a playset and my Wraths are in my Aggro Loam deck. I guess it comes down to preference but I think you'll need either 4 Wraths or 4 of these. It's a 4 mana sorcery but "Destroy all creatures. They can't be regenerated." really comes in handy when aggro gets retarded and out of hand.

Pyroclasm - I like to think of this as the 2 mana "miniwrath". It's an easy way to get rid of alot of annoying little guys (Dark Confidant, Meddling Mage, Goblins, Prethreshed Mongeese, Disciple of the Vault, Gaddock Teeg,etc) and kills off Academy Rector at the same time. Nice but questionable.

Sneak Attack - A 4 mana enchantment that drops hasty,flying fat that does bad things at end of turn.

Eternal Dragon - This guy serves several functions. He PLAINScycles! That gets you duals at instant speed. Later on, he can return to your hand to form a Sneak Attack loop that isn't too shabby. Worst case scenario, he's a 5/5 for 5WW.

Yosei The Morning Star - This guy is like a time walk if you sneak him out. I am considering cutting him though.

Kokusho The Evening Star - This guy is nice. He's basically a life gainer for the deck but a good beater like his white cousin. Solid if nothing else.

Bogardan Hellkite - This guy can be versatile. His 5 points of damage can go straight to the opponent's face or you can wreck his board position. Either way it's unpleasant...for the other guy.

Academy Rector - This is basically a Sneak Attack tutor. Just cast it and Lightning Bolt, Pyroclasm, Damnation, chump block, this guy into the graveyard and Sneak Attack is online.

Mishra's Factory - With all the creature supression, this can do alot of damge for you. Don't underestimate this.

[ClearSkies]

This really shouldn't be in Established Deck Forum... since it isn't really an established deck.

It doesn't look like you can get those dragons out early without Sneak Attack.

Why so much Eternal Dragons, and the Legendary ones?

You said you can "assure" us that it perform well against other Legacy decks, but you really havn't said much about that part.

Have you heard of the mana curve? Most of your spells cost at least 4, some are almost uncastable. Your only acceleration is Dark Ritual. What happens when someone Pithing Needle and/or destroys your Sneak Attack?

[The Legacy Weapon]

I wouldn't have posted this if I didn't have confidence in it. The 4 Eternal Dragons are mana fixers. The can also recur during the late game. This deck was designed to be a late game deck much like survival of the fittest decks. Thats why I run so much removal. I realize that it's much easier to not try new things and criticize anyone who does but have an open mind and at least try to suggest an improvement. If I wanted props, I would never have shown this deck to a bunch of people I don't know.

[DragoFireheart]

You don't have NEARLY enough removal to deal with any threats thrown at you. Not for the speed at which you plan your dragons to come out at. Worst, the high casting cost of the dragons will cripple you if you have more than a few in your opening hand.

Unless you can show some tourney results this deck should be in New and Developmental Decks Forum.

[ClearSkies]

I wouldn't have posted this if I didn't have confidence in it. The 4 Eternal Dragons are mana fixers. The can also recur during the late game. This deck was designed to be a late game deck much like survival of the fittest decks. Thats why I run so much removal. I realize that it's much easier to not try new things and criticize anyone who does but have an open mind and at least try to suggest an improvement. If I wanted props, I would never have shown this deck to a bunch of people I don't know.

Improvement? Then, drop some of the dragons. Having so much of the same dragons don't really seem to help at all, especially if you get several in your opening hand. Maybe Seething Song might help?

You can't really compare you deck to Survival of the Fittest decks. They can play their creatures easily. However, you can't easily play your huge dragons at all.

I suppose you can enlightened tutor for Sneak Attack... Ever tried Animated Dead, exhume combining with a discard engine (Cabal Therapy yourself, Putrid Imp) to get your dragons back? With that route, it would be like a regular reanimator type deck.

Pernicious Deed is also a good board sweeper too.

Anyways, the deck doesn't seem to play a good role in control, aggro, or combo.
If you were to take this to a casual multiplayer game, this deck "might" work fine. However, you are in a Legacy forum that is focused on tournaments.

[The Legacy Weapon]

I would suggest trying it out on Magic Workstation, or maybe throwing it together and playtesting it before making any harsh judgements. I can understand why you are skeptical but I've played it alot and it does well. I know it can go at least 50/50 vs Goblins and Meathooks.

[troopatroop]

If you really do want to give her a successful Dragon deck, give her Dragonstorm. That's had professional success.

[Baumeister]

4 Chalice of the Void ( Set this at 2 and watch Threshold squirm.)

You'd probably want to set Chalice at 1 to hinder ******** decks. Most of their cantrips to get to threshold cost one and if you let them cantrip, they can find an answer to Chalice pretty easily.

[The Legacy Weapon]

Good point. I just thought they had more 2cc spells than 1cc.

[Nihil Credo]

The problem is that a large Dragon core does not leave enough space for a well-developed control suite (4 Wraths and StP do not a control deck make).

You have two options: either minimize the number of Dragons in your deck, so you'd be left with something like an inferior control build, or build the deck around some nifty Dragon combo, leaving "play a lot of flying 5/5s" as a backup plan.

It seems your wife would be more interested in the latter, so I'd recommend the following cards: Academy Rector (to grab Sneak Attack), Survival of the Fittest, Bladewing the fucking Risen, and some sort of sacrifice outlet for Rector. Dracoplasm is a cool one, that also fits thematically and lets your Dragons evade Sneak Attack's drawback.

[Cait_Sith]

Ok, cut the chaff time!

Step 1: Cut Red. If you are playing Dragon Control, you can run a much better with BW then with Red (especially since it creates a great weakness in your mana base for Lands! and some Landstill decks to exploit.)

Step 2: Cut Dark Ritual. It is a card for increasing Tempo at the cost of CA. Control wants to hold onto its CA as long as possible.

Step 3: Cut some win cons. 4 Eternal Dragon plus either 3 Kokusho (I like him more here) or three Yosei will be enough.

Step 4: Cut all the Volrath's Strongholds. There are good with sneak attack, but they essentially attack your own manabase with their Legendary Status. Not good in Control (You don't need the inevitability anyway, if you haven't established it by the time Stronghold becomes useful, you'll never have it.)

That opens up: 18 slots previously given to spells and 8 slots previously give to lands.

Put in:

4x Duress. Since you are running control creatures are not a problem, so paying that two life for Thoughtseize is rarely worth it.

4x Vindicate. Permanent be gone! Even deals with nasty Planeswalkers (if any should rear their heads.)

Then you can just go from here.

[The Legacy Weapon]

Thank you Nihil. I forgot about Acadamy Rector seeing as it used to be banned. If I go with rector, I would most likely want to sub STP for something like Innocent Blood or Diabolic Edict. I can cut down on the dragons I guess. I just thought that I would want Kokusho & Yosei as 4 ofs because they are legendary and all I really care about are their triggers. I never really noticed an overflow of creatures when playing the deck but I did take into consideration what the other guy said about the mana curve. If I cut back on dragons, would I most likely want more disruption? Tutors are too slow from my testing but what would you suggest?

[The Legacy Weapon]

Wow. It's really hard to consider cutting red because Sneak Attack works so well with these dragons.

[xycsoscyx]

Since I have my own casual Sneak Attack deck built, here are some of my thoughts, as well.

Like others have pointed out, RUN ACADEMY RECTOR!!!! I can't stress that enough, she's Sneak Attack 5-8! Since this is Legacy, your additional targets are limited, but after getting out Sneak Attack, you can always sneak another out and get Moat (my build is Vintage format legality, which means I'm running Bargain)! :)

The Tabernacle at Pendral Vale is a god land in this deck, you never have creatures out that you want to pay for, AND it's a sac outlet for Rector. Diamond Valley is another nice card since you can sac Rector to it, AND you can sac Dragons that you've snuck out (getting life off them instead of just losing them at end of turn).

Night's Whisper is infinitely better then Arena, in this deck, you want your cards NOW, flat out. Night's Whisper is 2 and 2 for 2 (2 mana and 2 life for 2 cards), how can you say no to that?

Dark Ritual is great for an early Sneak Attack (or Rector), but are dead draws after that. Consider Rite of Flame instead (still helps get things out early, but also provides Red Mana, which means it's not a total dead draw later), and Simian Spirit Guide (it's free mana, or an easy to cast chump blocker early on). Spirit Guide also helps out in tricking your opponent (oh, you're tapepd out, I'll swing in...RFG Guide and sneak out Tyrant, block, you lose!).

Dragon Tyrant should be a four of, simple as that, he is the house (and the whole town, for that matter).

Another splash card that you should consider is Hoverguard Sweepers, when they come into play, you may return up to two target creatures to their owners hand (and it's a big flyer by itself). Sneaking it out lets you bounce your own dragons to play again next turn, or sweep away your opponents creatures so you can swing in unblocked (target the Sweeper itself and another dragon, or just target two opposing creatures and swing in with them as well).

[The Legacy Weapon]

I changed the opening post to address some of the needed changes as suggested. I am goldfishing the opening list and so far, it's running far more efficiently than before. I am going to cut a few more dragons from the list but not until I find effective spells to replace them. Out of Yosei, Kokusho, and Hellkite, which would be best to cut? Eternal Dragon is out of the question because he fixes the manabase.

[Lemuria]

Since you want your Rectors and your Kokushos/Yoseis to die...the better disruption to this strategy IMO would be Cabal Therapy. I think it's worth to give a try and see the synergy.

[The Legacy Weapon]

Cabal Therapy is very synergetic but I like it better in the sideboard seeing as it sucks ass when you fight oddball decks. I hate missing with it.

[The Legacy Weapon]

What do you guys think about Night's Whisper for card draw? I don't think the life loss would be an issue but if it was, I could always substitute Lightning Helix in place of the Lightning Bolts.

[94teen]

Gamble is a pretty good tutor in your colors if you're looking for ways to find dragons and/or Sneak Attack.

Also, I know this is a dragon-themed deck, but Symbiotic Wurm or Crater Hellion might be worth breaking your theme for, even if it's not for a full set. These give you some threats that either don't die in a single turn, or allow you to sweep the board. Bogardan Hellkite may be, and probably is, better than Crater Hellion, but sometimes you do need a wrath.

I agree with what others have said. Mana Accleration in the form of Rite of Flame, Seething Song, and Simian Spirit Guide are your best bets over stuff like Dark Ritual. However, one card that (I believe) has been missed is Through the Breach. This is additional Sneak Attacks, which will provide you with a little more consistency. Even though they aren't permanent, they will buy you some time. TtB a Yosei or Kokusho and that's another turn or two you have to get control, or just TtB an Academy Rector and get yourself a permanent sneak attack.

Also, Serra Avatar provides random T1 wins if you're interested in going a little more combo and a little less control.

[Wallace]

I think this deck is best played as a Combo/Control Deck. Cut all the Bull Shit and just Play for the mid to late game win. Something like this:

4 Sneak Attack
4 Thoughtseize
4 Duress
4 Intuition
4 Brainstorm
3 Damnation

4 Kokusho, The Evening Star
2 Bogardan Hellkite
1 Yosei The Morning Star
4 Karmic Guide
4 Body Double

4 Volcanic Island
2 Steam Vents
4 Badlands
2 Blood Crypt
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Polluted Delta
1 Island
2 Swamp
1 Volrath's Stronhold

[The Legacy Weapon]

I think using other creatures as Sneak Attack fodder is a very good idea. I only chose dragons because my wife wanted a dragon theme. While these dragons are very potent, I think there may be some better choices for more effective strategy. Why don't we go ahead and open up discussion for better creature choices. I'll recap some previous suggestions

Hovergaurd Sweepers - A decent fattie with a very relevent ability. "When this comes into play, return 2 target creatures to owners hand". This means you can sneak your guys in, put damage on the stack, then sneak in this guy to return the others back to your hand for next turn.

Symbiotic Wurm - An 7/7 beater that gives you 7 1/1 incect tokens when he dies could be decent.

Serra Avatar - Power equal to your life total seems nice but this would suck late game if you were struggling with life.

Any other suggestions would be helpful.

[Wallace]

I used to play a casual Sneak Attack Deck, Karmic Guide is amazing! I comboed it with Altar of Dementia and Pandemonium. Now you have Body Double and Karmic Guide, think about it, sneak out my Hellkite, take 5, attack take 5. End of Oppenents turn sneak out Guide, bring back Hellkite, Take 5...

Well you get the picture. Works great with Eternal Witness too!

[The Legacy Weapon]

That is actually a great idea. The only thing I don't like about it is you have to rely on drawing another creature with it and the deck only runs 16 creatures. Seems like he could end up being a big pain in the ass if all you drew were copies of him. I guess I'll have to test it and see.

[The Legacy Weapon]

Is there a tutor effect that might be helpful in this deck? Maybe something like Infernal Tutor to get a copy of something relevent or if your in topdeck mode and have no hand? Any thoughts?

[GrandAdmiral]

As 94teen mentioned, Through the Breach is good if you really want to push the Sneak Attack route.

This was mentioned in another thread a while ago, but Tsuyoshi Fujita ran an interesting deck using Sneak Attack and Through the Breach in an extended tournament:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/daily/mf32

As for creature suggestions, I'm surprised nobody's mentioned Sundering Titan yet.

[The Legacy Weapon]

Through the Breach seems a little slow but I did read the article you linked. The build he used looked more like a suicide build than a stable one. He probably sees a lot of hands with a ton of accelerants and no threats. He did top 8 though. Sundering Titan would hurt this build more than it would help it. The 3c manabase would fold under it's weight.

[Happy Gilmore]

I've always wanted to play Sneak Attack with Zodiac Dragon and Grozoth (to get multiples). Too bad a playset runs upwards of 400 :frown: .

[The Legacy Weapon]

What if I replaced Kokusho and Yosei for 4 x Kiki Jiki Mirror Breaker and 4 x Sky Hussar? That would create an instant win combo.

[Inimically]

Just a suggestion, I think that a great creature for Sneak Attack would be Protean Hulk, but then it would be like Flash Hulk all over again...cept not as good and you would have to wait until the end of your turn.

[adrieng]

turn one pithing needle naming sneak attack gg?
Your deck loses to combo.And like it has been said in lots of forum
if you lose game one.To win game two and game three you need at least something like 75-25 percent after side...
Even with 15 cards you can t hate all the combo decks .
You need at least 8 cards against ichorid then 10 cards against aluren.
Then you can t beat burn eaven with side.
43 deck lands .....
It s slower than aluren , which is the control combo deck.
Why playing your deck over aluren???
You have no tutor what about playing enlightned tutor??
Really if you want to play combo with sneak attack i do think the best choice is protean hulk .
But i still think this deck will never be competitve.
Sneak attack(4cc) control
whereas survival of the fittest (2cc) don t see play.
You have lot of creatures which doesnt do anything before turn 10 without sneak attack.Cards which are not good on their own sucks.
Good luck!!!

[The Legacy Weapon]

turn one pithing needle naming sneak attack gg?
Your deck loses to combo.And like it has been said in lots of forum
if you lose game one.To win game two and game three you need at least something like 75-25 percent after side...
Even with 15 cards you can t hate all the combo decks .
You need at least 8 cards against ichorid then 10 cards against aluren.
Then you can t beat burn eaven with side.
43 deck lands .....
It s slower than aluren , which is the control combo deck.
Why playing your deck over aluren???
You have no tutor what about playing enlightned tutor??
Really if you want to play combo with sneak attack i do think the best choice is protean hulk .
But i still think this deck will never be competitve.
Sneak attack(4cc) control
whereas survival of the fittest (2cc) don t see play.
You have lot of creatures which doesnt do anything before turn 10 without sneak attack.Cards which are not good on their own sucks.
Good luck!!!


Hey buddy. Thanks for the "constructive criticism." This is a new and developmental deck. I only posted it to get better ideas for it. Thanks for nothing. Anyone can come in and find fault in someone's deck. You got real talent. Please don't post unless you have something helpful to add.

[The Legacy Weapon]

I've been toying around with some other enchantments to run in this as 1 ofs due to the inclusion of Academy Rector and I tried Debtor's Knell. This card is awesome as an alternate route to victory through a Pithing Needled Sneak Attack. You won't normally get anything out of your yard besides Eternal Dragon but I was usually fishing out creatures from my opponent's yard. Any other suggestions for a 1 of enchantment?

[Thehunter820]

I tested out a similar deck, from your build I recommend dropping a few of the dragons though, throwing in some more dark rituals and such, and more removal

You may also want to work in some flamebreak instead of pyroclasm, and drop the damnation cuz 7 board sweeps probly wont be necessary.

I do like this idea though i'd like to see it go somewhere

[ninjabear]

Any other suggestions for a 1 of enchantment?
In the theme of the deck, I've found out that a surprising number of decks simply die to Form of the Dragon. It's a really fast clock while stopping most Aggro dead. Vial Goblins can only kill you via a Siege-Gang Commander (and maybe some Sharpshooter shenanigans); those Empty the Warrens tokens mean nothing to you, and Threshold will probably only be able to win you via a threshed Enforcer (that many versions do not pack anymore).

Beware those Krosan Grip / Disenchant, though.

[The Legacy Weapon]

Thank you. I never even thought of Form of the Dragon. I was actually going to playtest 1 Moat in the deck but I might try this first.

[ninjabear]

I would also consider adding Dragon Mage (if you sneak it through your Sneak Attack, it's an almost guaranteed win next turn), though it's probably just a Win More. Worth a though, at least. Also Dragon Tyrant, who is a house (it alone, with 4 extra red mana, can hit for 20) - that surely puts a smile in your face when it works. Also, Zodiac Dragon gives the same sense of inevitability as Volrath's Stronghold.

Beware Pithing Needle naming Sneak Attack. You have no answer to that, right? Many decks pack a single Pithing main, and others on the side.

Also consider using Ancient Tomb / City of Traitors / Crystal Vein to get your Sneak attack online one turn before - though that would require dropping a color.

The only problem that I see with the deck is that all your "control" element are board controls, with absolutely no stack control (well, Chalices on the side). I suppose you will beat face against aggro, but for combo and control 15 of your cards will be (almost) useless. I think your deck is nice if you plan to find lots of aggro in your meta.

[mercenarybdu]

Isn't the deck kinda expensive as in casting wise?

Although I could see the Sneak Attack engine you have in place but what would happen if that were to be smothered out? Where would you go next?

The early game looks to be of some trouble, but towards the mid and late game this deck could rip but without the proper support it appears to crumble.

But I would like to see you go with a set of Cashseize in the main along with Duress to increaase the chances of assuring that you are in good hands.

[Dark_Cynic87]

Red should be cut.

B/W build with more of a Dragon Stompy outlook would be best.

You should run 2-mana lands (Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Crystal Vein)

Probably need Crucible of Worlds because 2 of those 3 you lose easy. This, however, works to your advantage as you run lots of non-basics anyway, and could definitely use some wasteland protection. You may even play a few yourself if it's a decent meta to play them in.

Control and Stompy varients are doing really well right now with 3sphere and Chalices, with some artifact accelerators (Diamond, Chrome Mox). You can drop a turn 1 3sphere without much problem and set up shop while they stumble.

Here's what will really save your ass, though: Ghostly Prison. That stops a lot of aggressive aggro decks for a couple turns, duplicates dropped turn nasty quickly. Also puts EtW combo out of the game.

You need Vindicates for your every-answer, and even some other SB'ed answers to critters. Smother works well in this Goyf-Nation. A cheaper addition is Oblivion Ring, rather than Vindicates. Or even better, V-cates and 0-Rings. A lot of people have started playing this mix.

Graveyard hate gets an easy choice: Leyline of the Void (SBed, of course). Some people here don't like it as it's a lousy topdeck since it's almost useless at that point, but if you get it in your opening hand (and you can mull for it) it's disgusting.

I don't know for drawing...Phyrexian Arenas? They seem underplayed under Bob's rule, but they seem a better choice for the deck: Acceleration w/out as much pain. However, I'd be careful about playing anything that loses you life when playing Ancient Tomb.

On a sidenote, a good creature to play when you have a decent-size GY is Tombstalker. I know it's not a dragon, but I'd consider it.

I doubt I've helped...

--DC