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Lego
11-08-2007, 03:29 AM
This has got to be one of the cooler rules interactions in the past couple of sets:


With any of the Planeswalkers in play, I play Mycosynth Lattice to make it an Artifact. I then play March of the Machines to make it a creature. I Tap my Experiment Kraj to give it a +1/+1 counter. Experiment Kraj now has all the activated abilities of the Planeswalker.

Now, the wonderful part about this combo is that the sorcery speed and once-per-turn restriction of the Planeswalkers' abilities is imposed by the Planeswalker type, not by the abilities. So my newly empowered Experiment Kraj can now gain infinite life, ping my opponent to death, make lots of 3/3 creatures (after untapping my lands a lot) or other fun things, depending on which Planeswalker is in play (I recommend Jace, as he shares a color with the combo, and can instantly win.)

Only 12GGUUUUU to WIN THE GAME! (Although to be fair, it's just 19 generic mana if you play the Lattice first.)
Pinder
11-08-2007, 03:39 AM
Okay, that's a cool interaction and all, but there has to be an easier way to give a creature all the Planeswalker abilities, right? Or at least an easier way to turn a Planeswalker into a creature?

edit - Quicksilver Elemental is probably easier than Kraj, and lets you stay in one color if you go the Jace route, just saying.
Lego
11-08-2007, 03:42 AM
edit - Quicksilver Elemental is probably easier than Kraj, and lets you stay in one color if you go the Jace route, just saying.

I just realized this, and came back to post it. The combo still costs 19, but doesn't require you to pass the turn, and is all in one color :tongue:
ForceofWill
11-08-2007, 04:30 AM
I built a casual deck around this combo last week.
Nihil Credo
11-08-2007, 01:00 PM
Playing this combo seems as fun as explaining it to MWS players would be unfun.
Lego
11-08-2007, 01:10 PM
I built a casual deck around this combo last week.

Was it awesomesauce?
Tacosnape
11-08-2007, 01:18 PM
Mycosynth Lattice + Jace/Chandra + Null Rod + Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale = more fun combo.

Then they have absolutely no way of getting mana or keeping a threat and you can happily Jace-Deck or Chandra-Bomb them to death.

EDIT: Plus my combo can be executed for the much more legacy-playable :9::u::u: or :11::r::r:
Nightmare
11-08-2007, 01:27 PM
Mycosynth Lattice + Jace/Chandra + Null Rod + Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale = more fun combo.

Then they have absolutely no way of getting mana or keeping a threat and you can happily Jace-Deck or Chandra-Bomb them to death.

EDIT: Plus my combo can be executed for the much more legacy-playable :9::u::u: or :11::r::r:Except Lattice + Planeswalker + Null Rod = You can't use the planeswalker anymore...
Jander78
11-08-2007, 02:11 PM
You could use Karn's Touch (http://ww2.wizards.com/gatherer/CardDetails.aspx?&id=19573) over March of the Machines to save two mana!
Lego
11-08-2007, 02:33 PM
You could use Karn's Touch (http://ww2.wizards.com/gatherer/CardDetails.aspx?&id=19573) over March of the Machines to save two mana!

Or Karn, Silver Golem if you want to add two mana to the combo.

Karn's Touch has the advantage of not making all your lands useless, but March of the Machines has the advantage of making all your opponent's lands useless... I guess you're winning when you play it anyway, so Karn's Touch is probably better :tongue:
Illissius
11-08-2007, 02:53 PM
Can you pay the loyalty costs for the abilities when the card doesn't have Loyalty?
Tacosnape
11-08-2007, 02:59 PM
Except Lattice + Planeswalker + Null Rod = You can't use the planeswalker anymore...

Ah hell, good point. Fuck Planeswalkers, then. I'll use Subversion instead.
Jaynel
11-08-2007, 04:18 PM
Or you can do something with tutors and Eureka and win for 2GG. Back it up with counters.
APriestOfGix
11-08-2007, 04:55 PM
Can you pay the loyalty costs for the abilities when the card doesn't have Loyalty?

yes?
C.P.
11-08-2007, 05:02 PM
Ah hell, good point. Fuck Planeswalkers, then. I'll use Subversion instead.

Try Searching 'Legacy Weapon' in the forums. It did not have Tabernacle, but still...:tongue:
Lego
11-08-2007, 05:12 PM
Can you pay the loyalty costs for the abilities when the card doesn't have Loyalty?

Just use the ones that add Loyalty first. Then they'll have Loyalty and you're free to use the other ones :smile: All of the free ones can be used infinitely, except for Jace (assuming your opponent has more cards in library than you)... for him, you'll need to use it until you get to 10 counters, then mill your opponent before using it some more.


Or you can do something with tutors and Eureka and win for 2GG. Back it up with counters.

Seems good in 2HG. Except there are easier combos (that are easier to search for) that you can put into play with Eureka... but none have as much flare as this one.

You can increase the cost of the combo a bit more by replacing Lattice with Memnarch. And then most of the combo can be tutored for with Worldly Tutor/Living Wish. Too bad you can't Tooth and Nail for it :tongue: Memnarch + Karn + Quicksilver Elemental + Jace is only 25 mana.
Finn
11-09-2007, 10:29 AM
Not my area of expertise, but Memnarch + Copy Artifact seems far simpler to me. Is there a problem with counters this way?

I always thought it was cool to copy an activated Mishra's Factory. You get a permanent that is Land, Artifact, Creature, and Enchantment all at once. This uses the same idea gone a different route.
Happy Gilmore
11-09-2007, 10:59 AM
Not my area of expertise, but Memnarch + Copy Artifact seems far simpler to me. Is there a problem with counters this way?

I always thought it was cool to copy an activated Mishra's Factory. You get a permanent that is Land, Artifact, Creature, and Enchantment all at once. This uses the same idea gone a different route.

hmm, that does seem alot more robust. Besides, Memnarch is fairly good on its own. Sounds like a fun tron deck to me.

Jace +Memnarch + Copy Artifact. Deck everyone and draw crap tons of cards!
Nihil Credo
11-09-2007, 11:29 AM
Not my area of expertise, but Memnarch + Copy Artifact seems far simpler to me. Is there a problem with counters this way?

Yes, two. First of all, Planeswalkers have their own version of the Legend rule: two Planeswalkers with the same subtype in play die. Therefore, Copy Artifact would come into play as a second "Artifact Planeswalker - Jace" permanent, and kill your Jace along with itself.

Second, even if you somehow managed to evade this problem (I'm not sure how, since it isn't part of the "legend rule", so Mirror Gallery doesn't help), Copy Artifact would still be a Planeswalker, and thus bound by the "one activation per turn" rule. Experiment Kraaj works because it only copies activated abilities, not the type line.