[Idea] Ichounterid

[Willoe]

Thought Ichorid was optimized? I thought that too, but anyway, I like to experiment a bit and this one deserves its own thread.

Free counters are something we all love. Seriously. which free counters exist?

Force of Will
Pact of Negation
Disrupting Shoal
Daze
Thwart
Foil

Hey, that's 24! We don't need that many. We need 12 to be a so-called counter deck. Force of Will and Daze already pwns, so we take them. What we need is Foil. Yep, Foil. In this build, it's good too.


4 Ichorid
4 Ashen Ghoul
4 Nether Shadow
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Golgari Thug

4 Bridge From Below

4 Deep Analysis
4 Careful Study
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Foil

4 Underground Sea
4 Watery Grave
7 Island
1 Swamp

SB:
4 Chain of Vapor
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Pithing Needle
4 Cabal Therapy

Okay, please don't flame this deck. The main idea is playing some spells and countering some important ones while dredging a bit and returning a bit of creatures from your graveyard to play. Not sure if Bridges are win more. This is only an experiment of adding counterspells to ichorid and thus changing matchup stats.

Yes, you want free counters, because you will most likely empty your mana pool each turn by reanimating ashen ghouls and stuff.

This is only a deck by theory. What I know is that this deck goldfishes much slower than regular ichorid. This deck will most likely beat other combo better with 12 mainboarded counterspells, which of course can be boarded out against certain decks where they aren't necessary. As you can't counter a leyline, you can board some counters out and mulligan for Chain of Vapor.

This might suck incredible ass, but what do you think about the deck? :smile:

[Brehn]

- So you have exactly 4 cards that get your dredgers into the graveyard? *eyebrow*
- 8 dredgers with fewer digging power than usual Ichorid just screams "I'm more inconsistent than Belcher with a Bayou"
- ... and unfortunately, Leyline > Fow.

[Willoe]

I have 8, in fact. 8,'s low and I need to raise it. Good that you made me note it.

I need more dredgers, too. But Grave-Troll isn't synergistic with the deck. Is Shambling Shell better here? :confused:

Leyline > FoW? Depends solely on matchups. I see more decks where FoW is more important than Leyline.

[kicks_422]

What decks does Ichorid need FoW against?

[Willoe]

Hmm, well, this isn't real Ichorid. It's a more controllish build that's meant to kill the opponent more slowly. I know it's nowhere as good, but it's just a test. I'm firing it up at MWS now so I can get a feel of it.

Consider this to be some "real" aggro variant, just with counters and uncounterable creatures. The reason why I'm posting this jank pile is that I don't think that it has been tried before. Was can be tried must be tried in my opinion.

I thought that there were cards that Ichorid feared, too?

Deed, Engineered Explosives, mass removal in particular, graveyard hate i.e. Withered Wretches which are seen maindecked in certain archetypes, Planar Void, and stuff like that. Don't you agree?

I'm by no means an Ichorid expert, but I like testing new deck variants. Hate all you want, but at least give me some constructive feedback :smile:

EDIT:
Okay, after ten goldfishes, I got that feeling that the deck is very clunky and inconsistent.
This was the list I was testing:
// Deck file for Magic Workstation (http://www.magicworkstation.com)

// Lands
4 [U] Underground Sea
8 [B] Island (3)
4 [RAV] Watery Grave

// Creatures
4 [U] Nether Shadow
4 [IA] Ashen Ghoul
4 [TO] Ichorid
4 [RAV] Golgari Thug
4 [RAV] Shambling Shell
4 [RAV] Stinkweed Imp

// Spells
4 [DK] Mind Bomb
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [OD] Careful Study
4 [PY] Foil
4 [NE] Daze

Mind Bomb was because I needed another discard outlet.

Never mind about this thread, the deck sucks. Even though I'd like to include FoW in Ichorid decks, it simply can't be done I think. Sorry for wasting your time xD

Note to self:
(At least one sucker that can realize that his creation sucked ass, note to various other jank deckbuilders on the Source)

[MasterC]

Leyline > FoW? Depends solely on matchups. I see more decks where FoW is more important than Leyline.

I think what he meant was that you can't force a leyline. That's why
leyline > force.

[THEchubbymuffin]

Free counters are not good in ichorid from my point of view, the cards you fear most are, Leyline of the void, Extirpate, and Tormod's crypt. Tormod is the only counterable thing, and we have chalice to shut it down.

[konsultant]

So the whole counter-Ichorid idea is good and all but do you think it is wise to not take the best parts of Ichorid and use them? For instance the dredge + Narcomeoba seems really good not to mention it's the perfect pitch card to Force in your oppening hand. Why not play Dread Returns? So even if you sculpted your hand this deck can't "go off" for the win. Sure the counters help you resolve stuff but honestly I don't think I would care do to the lack of power behind what you are trying to do.

I think you should consider taking normal Ichorid and add Force of Will to it and see where the deck evolve's from there.

[thefreakaccident]

At that point, couldn't you just add unmask... it doesn't cost you a life, and you have more than enough black cards to sustain it...

Am I wrong?

[edgewalker]

Wouldn't you just be better off playing breakfast if you want a graveyard dependent combo-control deck?

[thefreakaccident]

True, but who wants to play breakfast?


I don't see this thread going anywhere productive anymore ...

[Masticor]

Why don`t you play Putrid Imp as additional discarder and flying beatstick?

I also don`t see why adding blue for FOW ad daze is better then playing unmask , cabal therapies and thoughtseize, besides a more stable mana base and loosing careful study. If you want to keep blue in the deck you might consider Wonder as it lets your creatures fly over possible blockers.