[SCD] Gitaxian Probe

Gitaxian Probe {pu}
Sorcery (C)
Look at target player's hand.
Draw a card.

This is a card which really deserves discussion, not just because it might be relevant in situations where we might already run Peek, but because it offers decks with very limited resources the ability to know when the coast is clear. I am thinking that this card is at its best in decks like Belcher where knowing if your opponent has Force of Will, or even is playing Blue is very relevant, and is definitely worth 2 life. It is also much better than Street Wraith in most situations where that card is used. While it certainly doesn't belong in most decks, there has to be some great uses for this.

How exactly does this help belcher, other than being +1 storm over street wraith? Oh they have FOW? How exactly do you change what you do? You can't, belcher just now knows its dead instead of finding it out later that turn when it tries to go off.

I think the probe has much greater applications in decks that have multiple lines of play that are strong. For example, in Team america, if you cast this and see that they have no fetchland... it is much stronger to ponder t1 than it is to hold up mana to stifle the fetchland that isn't there.

It is also a neat combo with cabal therapy.

It might be playable in some ANT builds.

Seeing FoW is the nightmare, but if you peek into a hand with say, Daze or Spell Pierce or something, you can structure your spells in such a way as to play around them, or, if you can't, you at least have the option of passing and hoping they don't draw additional hate as opposed to just going for it and losing.

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Originally Posted by Draener

How exactly does this help belcher, other than being +1 storm over street wraith?
...
It is also a neat combo with cabal therapy.

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You probably never played with Belcher right? Knowing your opponents hand, for free, WHILE adding storm, is fantastic. Belcher may be a pretty straightforward deck, but it has the capacity of fighting trough a little hate too.

Also, I wouldn't call Probe + Therapy a combo. It's more like a nice interaction, or synergy, if you prefer.
Combo is casting and activating Belcher T1, with 1 or less lands in your deck.

Another quasi free spell. For what its worth, we only have 20 life to play with, and these new cards will likely have to compete with fetch lands and thoughtseizes for the life loss allotment space.

Not to sound contradictive, but I do see a fair amount of usefullness in doomsday stacks for this card. There are a few great stacks that this card would improve because it is a spell, increasing storm, as opposed to cycling.

Splitting hairs my friend. Nomenclature does not interest me. My point with belcher, is that it provides marginal benefit for no cost. Obviously, this is strictly better than street wraith... but it's not going to turn belcher into T1 status... or even make it that much better of a deck.

Also, I have a belcher deck sitting at home on my desk as we speak.

This seems like a good replacement for Peek in Spring Tide. As the deck requires to resolve Cloud of Faeries then Snap them back - knowing if this option is viable is very crucial. It also allows you to know whether it's safe to wait a turn or not before committing to the combo turn.

Information is really valuable for some decks. I can see Ooze combo and SI playing this card. Legacy love from Wizards?

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Originally Posted by Draener

How exactly does this help belcher, other than being +1 storm over street wraith?.

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Often with Belcher you have a hand which will go off turn 1 or turn 2 but your opponent leads on, say, Underground Sea, and you have no idea what they are playing. You cannot assume they don't have Force, so you cannot go off. If you Probe and see Force, you can wait to draw Empty or an extra Belcher. If you see a Pierce or Daze you can play around it. If you see nothing, you win. Having these options clear is very helpful.

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Originally Posted by Draener

How exactly does this help belcher, other than being +1 storm over street wraith? Oh they have FOW? How exactly do you change what you do? You can't, belcher just now knows its dead instead of finding it out later that turn when it tries to go off.

I think the probe has much greater applications in decks that have multiple lines of play that are strong. For example, in Team america, if you cast this and see that they have no fetchland... it is much stronger to ponder t1 than it is to hold up mana to stifle the fetchland that isn't there.

It is also a neat combo with cabal therapy.

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Giving you +1 storm makes it infinitely better than Street Wraith. The number of times that Empty the Warrens is a three turn clock vs. a two turn clock is not insignificant, and about half of those times you don't have a Burning Wish to speed it up any; adding two more Goblins to your side of the board is frequently about a 50% increase in win time. If anything, it gives you four more "free" slots, requiring a possible Belcher deckbuilder to only come up with 52 actual cards. Since consistency and bizarrely lopsided hands are the decks real enemies, and to some extent narrow hate cards, I can't see this as a bad thing, although Mental Misstep might need to be included in every deck just because, so it may be a wash.

But regarding your comment about multiple lines of play, yes, this is a huge winner. Those decks usually suffer from the "play A couild wreck them, play B could wreck them, but I have no efficient way of knowing which is right". This solves that problem elegantly, and replaces itself to boot. Having the option to hardcast it mid and late-game to save life is also a pretty sweet deal.

These 1cc [Phyrexian] cards worry the shit out of me. They're basically speeding up eternal formats at the cost of life, and when has that ever been a good deterrent? Life loss is hardly a cost anymore, since games are frequently decided turns 1-3, and certainly 90% of games before life totals hit the single digits.

Life loss is negligible where this card will have the most impact. I see it at it's best in an all-in strategy that will likely auto lose if it whiffs anyhow. Legacy is less about life totals and more about turns. I know that's overgeneralizing the format a bit but for the most part it's true when talking about combo decks. There are going to be far fewer games where you breath a sigh of relief because you get another turn at 1 life than there are where you use this card to full advantage.

very strong card, it can make belcher an 48card deck (wraith, manamorphose)
but i think we have enough combo in legacy atm, no need for pushing them. i hope there will be a good combo hoser for 2life too.

I'd argue that Manamorphose isn't a "filler" card like Wraith/Probe are, since you generally don't want to use it unless you're going off, for considerations of Storm and because you end up with extra mana wasted, which in the case of belcher usually means actual cards wasted. But either way, Belcher's getting to that point where you'll have funny games going off at 8 life (all 12 damage self-inflicted) on the first turn, just from cycling cards. Could be fun.

I think that Probe is probably good enough for Belcher because Belcher does have lines of play that beat Force and knowing whether your opponent has Force, a different counter, or nothing is great for your game plan. If they have Force, basically hoard mana until you have enough to make goblins through Force.

No one is questioning that probe would be a good addition to belcher. At the very least, it is a direct upgrade to street wraith, and could possibly replace something else to give a total of 8 "free" cycle effects. I was simply stating that belcher is probably not the deck that can best take advantage of this card.

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Originally Posted by Humphrey

very strong card, it can make belcher an 48card deck (wraith, manamorphose)
but i think we have enough combo in legacy atm, no need for pushing them. i hope there will be a good combo hoser for 2life too.

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A combo hoser for 2-life would be way overpowered. Mental Misstep is good enough imo.

Awesome with Kiln Fiend. I would also like to reiterate that knowing your opponent's hand and thus being able to predict what they are going to do allows you to play more optimally.

I play the crap out of TES and I bet even Bryant would agree it's added baggage. If you want to see someone's hand to make sure it's ok to go off, you Thoughtseize them. Using both is just diluting the combo. It does beat the crap out of Street Wraith. Glad I never picked up foil Street Wraiths now.