Scam In Half

With Saw in Half Getting added to MTGO I have been obsessed with tweaking and tuning a deck based around this powerful card.
It basically functions as: A Stifle, A Copy Spell, A Protection Spell, or a Pump Spell. With so many creatures having so much value tied onto them, and the fact that odd numbers round up I feel this card has a lot of potential.
Here is my Mk1 list:

4 Dark Ritual
4 Reanimate
4 Thoughtseize
4 Saw in Half
2 Beseech the mirror

4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Dauthi Voidwalker
4 Opposition Agent
4 Grief
2 Sheoldred the Apocolypse
4 Troll of Khazad-Dum

4 Chrome Mox
2 Mox Diamond
3 Wasteland
12 Swamp/Fetch
//Sideboard
4 Leyline of Singularity
4 Leyline of Lifeforce
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Leyline of Singularity

Hey I’m back after a long break from magic. I’m out of the meta so my comments might be off base.

• Even with 4 cyclers, mox diamond and 15 lands is going to be a bad time.
• Malakir rebirth seems more what this deck wants to do rather, rather than reanimate something that can be plowed
• With no sol lands, why are we playing monoB instead of WB for solitude?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Reeplcheep

Hey I’m back after a long break from magic. I’m out of the meta so my comments might be off base.

• Even with 4 cyclers, mox diamond and 15 lands is going to be a bad time.
• Malakir rebirth seems more what this deck wants to do rather, rather than reanimate something that can be plowed
• With no sol lands, why are we playing monoB instead of WB for solitude?

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1 Missed Chrome Mox

2 That's the same outcome, the reanimation/discard spell gets stuck because the [object] was plowed.

3 Solitude + what? I would need like 13 white cards and other than Solitude I don't see any I like.

Malakir Rebirth comboing with Saw in Half is 4 mana over 1 turn, compared to 4 mana over 2 turns with Reanimate makes it more palatable in game I'd say.
You can Saw in Half your Bowmaster then a few turn later Reanimate it so you're not stuck with needing all the cards and mana at the same time.

I'd also be in favor of more than zero Ancient Tombs, getting Saw in Half online as early as possible to extra-punish removal seems important.

I kind of get the Beseech into Sheoldred as a smart pivot, I'm not sure if going harder into Cut in Half targets is better though. Might be too cute? Opposition Agent does nothing in multiples, Sheoldred is Legendary. Dauthi Voidwalker is only helpful if you're wanting to start playing your opponent's spells, but that seems mid without some sort of Thoughtseize to force the action. They're not just going to give you a Mind's Desire without killing you with it first.

A splash color might be worth it, not sure if White is best though. The little NicFit part of my brain wants to see Veteran Explorer sawed in half and then have all the mana, for reasons. Probably not game winning reasons, but when has that stopped NicFit before?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit

1 Missed Chrome Mox

2 That's the same outcome, the reanimation/discard spell gets stuck because the [object] was plowed.

3 Solitude + what? I would need like 13 white cards and other than Solitude I don't see any I like.

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1. I wasn’t talking about total mana sources, I was talking about lands to discard. It is quite unlikely you have a 7 with 2 lands/trolls, in which case mox diamond is worse than a lotus petal.

2. Presumably troll is to combo with reanimate. Malakir + grief is both cheaper and higher payoff than reanimate + troll. An etb taped land is slightly better than swamp cycling for keeping 7s too.

3. Ephemerate, priest and tide hollow sculler could be considerations. But maybe that is moving the deck too far away.

I like the idea.

I think your biggest obstacle is that Saw in Half costs a lot of mana. The point of scam is to cheat on mana to get the ability and body on turn 1.

If you're spending 2B, you've added a new obstacle: needing enough mana acceleration to still do the thing early. Because for 2BB you could just cast Grief.

Maybe Tomb would help. With Moxes you're annihilating your own hand (after Grief + pitch + enabler), so maybe Petal is better. You could also add Initiative creatures. They're good to power out with acceleration and good to saw in half.

Grief scam already doesn't get blown out by StP because you can resolve the discard before resolving the sacrifice, so you get perfect information and to strip their removal before commiting Malakir/Ephemerate/Reanimate. They could respond to the discard with Swords, exiling Grief, but then you haven't committed Malakir/Ephemerate/Reanimate yet and you still get to discard them, so Grief traded 2-for-2 as the failcase.

Is there room to combine it with Helm combo, a busted use of Beseech?


//Creatures: 17
4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Dauthi Voidwalker
4 Grief
4 Passageway Seer
1 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse

//Enchantments: 4
4 Leyline of the Void

//Artifacts: 1
1 Helm of Obedience

//Spells: 13
4 Thoughtseize
4 Saw in Half
4 Beseech the Mirror
1 Ill-Gotten Gains

//Mana: 25
4 Dark Ritual
4 Chrome Mox
4 Malakir Rebirth
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Vault of Whispers
4 Swamp


If you saw Seer in half, you get 2 more Initiative triggers, then both 1/1 halves get +1/+1 counters at EOT so you end up with 4-power lifelink.

Maybe Opposition Agent instead of Passageway Seer if there are too many 4s.

If you splash red you get a few neat things:
A Sawn DRC is a pair of 4/4s (since they're a 3/3 they cut down to a base power of 2/2 and then get the +2/+2 bonus)
Fury goes from attacking for 6 to 8
You can get two brother's Yamazaki in play immediately as a pair of 3/3 bushido 1 haste!

Good point. Maybe other creatures are better synergy than trying to cram in Helm combo (no synergy with Saw in Half or scam tech).

Fury works well. So would Caves of Chaos Adventurer.

I remember when Saw was first spoiled people wanted to get Baleful Strix for card draw. Nothing ever materialized off a blue splash then, not sure if it's a version you guy's would be interested in pursuing.

If already playing Reanimate, the best draw creature to saw in half is Atraxa.

Makes 2 4/4 flying lifelinks
Draws 8+ cards
Puts Atraxa back in graveyard for future Reanimates

Is that worth an Entomb package and 1-of Atraxa? Atraxa in hand pitches to Grief.

Well you'd get 2 4/4 flying lifelinks then sacrifice one to the Legend rule

EDIT looking at Reanimator for ideas, Archon of Cruelty is a house. Turns 9 damage into 12 after being sawed.

Writing this down here to test tonight:

4 Chrome Mox
4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Grief
2 Baleful Strix
2 Dauthi Voidwalker
2 Opposition Agent
2 Troll of Khazad-dûm
1 Archon of Cruelty
1 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse
4 Dark Ritual
4 Saw in Half
2 Sauron's Ransom
2 Entomb
4 Reanimate
4 Thoughtseize
2 Beseech the Mirror
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Underground Sea
2 Swamp
1 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn

Sideboard
3 Plague Engineer
1 Energy Flux
2 Surgical Extraction
3 Sheoldred's Edict
3 Drown in the Loch
2 Flusterstorm
1 Hurkyl's Recall

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Okay, so went 1-2 with the above.

Match 1 was against a spirit guide initiative list. They had white and red and green Initiative creatures with a Forth Eorlingas top end. Maybe risky keeps but the deck drew extremely poorly. In one game was just holding Archon of Cruelty, Dark Rtiual 2 Saw in Half and 3 Reanimate when they put out an early Rest in Peace. I was flooding out and just hardcast Archon with the aid of the ritual and could Saw in Half next turn but they were sitting on Swords for some time. I felt like I had many opportunities for a Strix or Bowmaster to come out and immediately get sawed to pull me out, but it never happened.

Match 2 was against UWr Control, and it was more of the same as match 1. Either mana screw or mana flood, which means the weak tempo I could put out was easily answered by his counterspells or removal. He was hellbent a number of times but always drew out of it first, stabilizing at 3-4 life before Forth Eorlingas again came down and ended the game.

Match 3 was against Esper Cephalid Breakfast. First game a Thoughtseize showed the way and next turn he scooped to Dauthi Voidwalker. Game 2 I finally did the thing: turn 1 I evoked Grief, stripped a card, then with the sacrifice trigger on the stack Dark Ritual into Saw in Half wreaked his hand. An Opposition Agent robbed him of a Urza's Saga search towards the end, but I'm not sure that would have been enough for him to come back.

Not sure where to go from here. Somehow with the landbase above I got stuck on just black mana in a game where Strix into Saw was in hand and later Sauron's Ransom come but never a blue source. Both Swamps and an Ancient Tomb, any land or a Troll or a Chrome Mox would have let me do anything but I drew another Saw before death. Or like, any black creature? Just bad luck I guess.

Thoughts and feedback appreciated

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit

With Saw in Half Getting added to MTGO I have been obsessed with tweaking and tuning a deck based around this powerful card.
It basically functions as: A Stifle, A Copy Spell, A Protection Spell, or a Pump Spell. With so many creatures having so much value tied onto them, and the fact that odd numbers round up I feel this card has a lot of potential.
Here is my Mk1 list:

4 Dark Ritual
4 Reanimate
4 Thoughtseize
4 Saw in Half
2 Beseech the mirror

4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Dauthi Voidwalker
4 Opposition Agent
4 Grief
2 Sheoldred the Apocolypse
4 Troll of Khazad-Dum

4 Chrome Mox
2 Mox Diamond
3 Wasteland
12 Swamp/Fetch
//Sideboard
4 Leyline of Singularity
4 Leyline of Lifeforce
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Leyline of Singularity

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Cards that I would love to Saw in Half

Priest of Gix
Grave Titan
Caves of Choas Adventurer
Fury
Kroxa
Grief
Opposition Agent
Shelodred
Death’s Shadow (thats been StPed)

Otherwise Animate Dead paired with Ancient Tomb and Oluphant is the better option.
Animate Dead

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Captain Hammer

Cards that I would love to Saw in Half
Shelodred
Death’s Shadow
Animate Dead

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I don't think these are going to work the way you want
Shadow will still get -X/-X but instead of being a 13/13 it's only it's current power (so like, 5/5)
Sheoldreds are legendary
Animate dead keeps the -1 when doing the /2 calculation

Grave Titan was on my list but Archon of Cruelty is just a better creature if given the choice. Unless you're thinking of hardcasting it?
I don't get Opposition Agent in your list of Saw targets. 1 Opposition Agent is the same as 10. It's good in a fair(ish) Dark Ritual deck, but not like specific to Saw in Half.

Ok here's my updated mk2 list. I still want to splash either red for bolt/fury stuff, or blue and just tuck myself in with Force/Brainstorm/Ponder/Daze, but this is mono black:

4 Dauthi Voidwalker
4 Grief
3 Opposition Agent
4 Orcish Bowmasters
2 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse
4 Troll of Khazad-dûm

4 Reanimate
4 Saw in Half
2 Snuff Out
4 Thoughtseize

4 Chrome Mox
4 Dark Ritual

1 Gemstone Caverns
3 Wasteland
13 Swamp

SIDEBOARD:
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Shriekmaw
2 Unmask

Here is mk3 list, I handed to to streamer D00mwake and he went 2-3
https://www.moxfield.com/decks/LZzNLPuvIEC6ah_TFni2SQ

Creatures(25)
4 Dauthi Voidwalker
2 Gorex, the Tombshell
4 Grief
4 Opposition Agent
4 Orcish Bowmasters
2 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse
1
1 Tourach, Dread Cantor
4 Troll of Khazad-dûm
Sorceries(8)
4 Reanimate
4 Thoughtseize
Instants(12)
4 Dark Ritual
4 Saw in Half
2 Sheoldred's Edict
2 Surgical Extraction
Artifacts(4)
4 Lotus Petal
Lands(11)
2 Phyrexian Tower
7 Swamp
2 Wasteland
Sideboard(15)
2 Bontu's Last Reckoning
3 Feed the Swarm
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Shriekmaw

The first two rounds were against aggro decks, goblins and 8 cast affinity, and it didn't go well. This is something I'll have to look into because without fury doing crowd control it's way to easy to get overrun.
The three round was a loss to doomsday settled by the die roll. Half a turn too slow g1 and g3.
Won round 4 vs the traditional UB legacy scam. It didn't even feel close. Just out scamming them at every turn
Won round 5 vs 4c. Absolute pasting

A couple Plague Engineer would really help in those matchups. You can even Saw it to get double Plague effect! Seems better than Bontu.

Scam usually needs some source of card draw for fair matchups, to compensate for the early card disadvantage. Otherwise you run out of resources and they outdraw you. Dimir scam runs Sauron's Ransom. WB scam uses Samwise+Karakas and Recruiter. Maybe you could play Call of the Ring?

Other than card draw, more fair interaction seems good. You can hate on combo (Grief, Thoughtseize, Opposition Agent, Surgical) and cantrips (Bowmasters, Sheoldred) but have very little interaction with fair creatures (2 Edict + Bowmasters). Saw doesn't function as effective removal. Are you really going to Saw a Muxus or Thought Monitor or giant Murktide? I'm not surprised that 2 aggro matches went poorly. Maybe Shriekmaw main over Surgical?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit

Here is mk3 list, I handed to to streamer D00mwake and he went 2-3
https://www.moxfield.com/decks/LZzNLPuvIEC6ah_TFni2SQ

Creatures(25)
4 Dauthi Voidwalker
2 Gorex, the Tombshell
4 Grief
4 Opposition Agent
4 Orcish Bowmasters
2 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse
1
1 Tourach, Dread Cantor
4 Troll of Khazad-dûm
Sorceries(8)
4 Reanimate
4 Thoughtseize
Instants(12)
4 Dark Ritual
4 Saw in Half
2 Sheoldred's Edict
2 Surgical Extraction
Artifacts(4)
4 Lotus Petal
Lands(11)
2 Phyrexian Tower
7 Swamp
2 Wasteland
Sideboard(15)
2 Bontu's Last Reckoning
3 Feed the Swarm
4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Shriekmaw

The first two rounds were against aggro decks, goblins and 8 cast affinity, and it didn't go well. This is something I'll have to look into because without fury doing crowd control it's way to easy to get overrun.
The three round was a loss to doomsday settled by the die roll. Half a turn too slow g1 and g3.
Won round 4 vs the traditional UB legacy scam. It didn't even feel close. Just out scamming them at every turn
Won round 5 vs 4c. Absolute pasting

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Gorex look sweeet.