[Official] Bitching About Prices, Buyouts and Reprints Thread

You are a planeswalker!

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Originally Posted by Mr.C

Depends on how long people think a couple grand is ok for a Legacy deck.

I can only speak for myself, but Legacy is completely unaffordable to me right now. Mind you, I make a decent living, but 2-3k on a good Legacy deck is nuts.

I've definitely been priced out of the format.

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I'm with you 100%. I can't imagine things continuing as they are forever without some fundamental shift somewhere. If adults like you and I with stable incomes can't afford to play, how is some kid who heard about magic from his buddies supposed to break into the format?

I suppose you could shrug it off and gesture at modern...but things aren't all that much better there, either. Especially not with a fluctuating ban list that sees meteoric rises and falls in card prices depending solely on the whims of the DCI and the ensuing speculation.

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Originally Posted by Davran

I'm with you 100%. I can't imagine things continuing as they are forever without some fundamental shift somewhere. If adults like you and I with stable incomes can't afford to play, how is some kid who heard about magic from his buddies supposed to break into the format?

I suppose you could shrug it off and gesture at modern...but things aren't all that much better there, either. Especially not with a fluctuating ban list that sees meteoric rises and falls in card prices depending solely on the whims of the DCI and the ensuing speculation.

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I also want to bring up that the original intention of type 1.5 was a cheaper alternative to type 1. With that comparison, there is a potential that Modern will be as expensive as Legacy in the near future.

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Originally Posted by (nameless one)

I also want to bring up that the original intention of type 1.5 was a cheaper alternative to type 1. With that comparison, there is a potential that Modern will be as expensive as Legacy in the near future.

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The problem is that Wizards wants to keep the collectors happy - but how can you make cards more accessable if you only reprint them in small numbers to keep the prices stable? :confused:

Aside from that, Wizards really needs to adress the secondary market faster and better - they still haven't reprinted the Onslaught fetches and the Zendikar ones are getting out of hand - price-wise.

You can compare Magic to powerboating, horse owning or collecting vintage cars, but in the end of the day it's a paper card based strategy game with a tournament support. If you consider that you can buy Starcraft for about 50$, an average board game for about 30-50$, or look at other LCG/CCG alternatives (Netrunner, etc.) spending 2-3 grand on a Legacy deck is fucking ridicoulous.

I've sold off my ANT deck when I realised I could buy a brand new PC and legal copies of CS and Warcraft 3 for its price and still have some money left for drinking. Hell I've played Star Wars Minis until it died where the most expensive piece was 50$ and the top-tier squads could be built for 50-150 bucks.

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Originally Posted by Davran

I'm with you 100%. I can't imagine things continuing as they are forever without some fundamental shift somewhere. If adults like you and I with stable incomes can't afford to play, how is some kid who heard about magic from his buddies supposed to break into the format?

I suppose you could shrug it off and gesture at modern...but things aren't all that much better there, either. Especially not with a fluctuating ban list that sees meteoric rises and falls in card prices depending solely on the whims of the DCI and the ensuing speculation.

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I don't think this format is for kids, isnt that what standard is for?

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Originally Posted by Kage

You can compare Magic to powerboating, horse owning or collecting vintage cars, but in the end of the day it's a paper card based strategy game with a tournament support. If you consider that you can buy Starcraft for about 50$, an average board game for about 30-50$, or look at other LCG/CCG alternatives (Netrunner, etc.) spending 2-3 grand on a Legacy deck is fucking ridicoulous.

I've sold off my ANT deck when I realised I could buy a brand new PC and legal copies of CS and Warcraft 3 for its price and still have some money left for drinking. Hell I've played Star Wars Minis until it died where the most expensive piece was 50$ and the top-tier squads could be built for 50-150 bucks.

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And in three years you will throw away the computer that made you play games with fat antisocial people 24/7 and realize that we kept our ANT deck and will be able to pay the down payment on our house with them.

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Originally Posted by useL

And in three years you will throw away the computer that made you play games with fat antisocial people 24/7 and realize that we kept our ANT deck and will be able to pay the down payment on our house with them.

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.........because no fat, anti-social Magic player ever got rid of their cards too soon in the history of Earth, ever.

sent from phone, don't be a dick

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Originally Posted by ESG

I don't disagree, but let's also remember that there's a Pimp Legacy Decks thread (right below this thread, amusingly), and those decks are clearly way more expensive than the average Legacy 75. There are also a lot of different posters in that thread; it's not just nedleeds and sdematt sharing pictures of their finery.

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I don't think any of us consider an English language Rishadan Port to be "pimp". Its price alone puts it above the "weight in gold" metric; and that's sad for a card that's not on the Reserve List. Actually, It's more sad that the price is that high, rather than its lack of reprint. Either way, I think WotC missed a huge opportunity to print it in FTV: Lands.

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Originally Posted by kingsey

I don't think this format is for kids, isnt that what standard is for?

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Arguably, the whole game is for "kids"...but I digress.

As players, it is in our best interests that the game (and the format) continue to grow. If the barrier to entry is so high that even long-time veterans with developed collections are feeling the financial burden something is wrong. We can't have both an exponential increase in card "value" and an increase in new players/interest in the format forever.

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Originally Posted by useL

And in three years you will throw away the computer that made you play games with fat antisocial people 24/7 and realize that we kept our ANT deck and will be able to pay the down payment on our house with them.

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I dunno, I've had my computer since 2008 (spent about $1000 on it then), and still haven't upgraded. I buy stuff mostly on Steam sales, and it's given me countless hours of entertainment vs playing Legacy.

I mean, I get it, people are still buying into the format, but to think that prices will continue to rise at the same pace is foolish and dangerous. Sure, I myself have bought a couple of cars and put a downpayment on a condo with the profits off of cards, but I never bought in with the expectation that prices would rise exponentially. It was pure dumb luck.

Agreed with Mr. C.

I'm curious to see what people think in regards to buying cards. I've always looked at it as a payment towards a hobbie. People don't repair their ATVs with the expectation that they will get the same or more out of it than they put into it. They invest into their enjoyment.

If I end up getting out even or less, I won't end up being surprised. If the market drops quite a bit, it's just the price of the hobby. If it goes up it's lucky. It's just the way hobbies typically work. If you want to get into the collectible aspect of the game, there are definitely specific cards that you can buy in order to get the investment. If you want to play the game, you invest differently.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Aside from that, Wizards really needs to adress the secondary market faster and better - they still haven't reprinted the Onslaught fetches and the Zendikar ones are getting out of hand - price-wise.

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With any luck, the fetchlands will be in the next Standard block. I think there's some good reasons to expect that to be the case; Zendikar was a big hit and had a land theme, so they'll want to do that again, and the "minimum" time between repeating block themes will have elapsed when we get to Huey.

A friend of mine pointed to Courser of Kruphix as a possible hint of another land block coming up. And if they do lands again, they'll want to bring back landfall, and if they do that, then of course the fetchlands come back, hopefully with all 10. So I'm reeeeeeally hoping we'll get fetchlands in the next block.

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Originally Posted by Kayradis

Got bored.
An ounce of Mox Pearl(UNL) is 9002.81$ US
1 once of Mox = 6 onces of Gold.
Just sayin'

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"You'll take out some of the stuff only once or twice a year, so let them shine.

Hips: satin skirt with feathers: Gucci, info on price in boutique.
Top: Tunic with flowery motive, Dolce & Gabana, 1100 dollars.
Feet: leather heels, Dior, 900 dollars.
Sunglasses: Ray-Ban, 300 dollars.
Ring: white gold with plutonium, Swarovski, 2300 dollars
Earrings: foil Tarmogoyfs, Star City Shop, info on price in boutique."



http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...ps06a86e09.jpg

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Originally Posted by Bed Decks Palyer

"You'll take out some of the stuff only once or twice a year, so let them shine.

Hips: satin skirt with feathers: Gucci, info on price in boutique.
Top: Tunic with flowery motive, Dolce & Gabana, 1100 dollars.
Feet: leather heels, Dior, 900 dollars.
Sunglasses: Ray-Ban, 300 dollars.
Ring: white gold with plutonium, Swarovski, 2300 dollars
Earrings: foil Tarmogoyfs, Star City Shop, info on price in boutique."

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Any price and brand information on those boobs? They sure look pretty pimp aswell :tongue:

How much for the lady?


;)

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Originally Posted by Raystar

How much for the lady?


;)

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So instead of singles, you'd rather buy the whole Fat Pack?

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Originally Posted by Bed Decks Palyer

So instead of singles, you'd rather buy the whole Fat Pack?

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If that comes in a fat pack I am up for a case every new set.

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Originally Posted by Raystar

How much for the lady?


;)

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How about let's stop with the casual, 9th-grade-like objectification of women?

any idea why Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir triple in price ? as well as amulet of vigor & vigor (seriously?) ?

to answer myself

those cards were garbage a wild pro tour happens aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand that's not the case anymore ... (still don't get the Vigor, the creature, spike though ...)

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Originally Posted by ryO!

any idea why Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir triple in price ? as well as amulet of vigor, past in flames, azuza, vigor (seriously?), primeval titan ?

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Because the current state of the market makes it child's play to artificially inflate the perceived price of a card.

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Originally Posted by ryO!

any idea why Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir triple in price ? as well as amulet of vigor & vigor (seriously?) ?

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Modern GP. Deck is doing well. Look at "Blue Moon" and the amulet of vigor deck (unless they're the same). Been listening to someone whine all day yesterday about it because he sold his amulets to someone last weekend.

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Originally Posted by ryO!

any idea why Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir triple in price ? as well as amulet of vigor & vigor (seriously?) ?

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Idk why Teferi, but Amulet of Vigor is good in cheap non-Candelabra [your number here]Post.

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Originally Posted by ryO!

any idea why Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir triple in price ? as well as amulet of vigor & vigor (seriously?) ?

to answer myself

those cards were garbage a wild pro tour happens aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand that's not the case anymore ... (still don't get the Vigor, the creature, spike though ...)

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People are idiots and will spend money blindly. If people need to learn an expensive lesson, they should buy into this Teferi hype. Sell sell sell sell sell

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Originally Posted by ryO!

any idea why Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir triple in price ? as well as amulet of vigor & vigor (seriously?) ?

to answer myself

those cards were garbage a wild pro tour happens aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand that's not the case anymore ... (still don't get the Vigor, the creature, spike though ...)

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Matthias Hunt prominently featured a variant of this deck in the Pro Tour and did well with it.

Teferi rose because of some almost Mono-Blue deck that happens to run a splash for Blood Moon (and Spreading Sea for basics) to shit all over Modern's greedy mana bases, with seemingly great effect.

There was a next level blue blood moon deck that played Teferi as like a 1 of that did well, and AMulet was played in a glass cannon combo deck that did well

So, what you're saying is that after I sat on my Amulets of Vigor for years, they spiked not a month later than I have sold them? This is a bad bad day...

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/i...HFGplx7-PRm-sd

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Originally Posted by Bed Decks Palyer

So, what you're saying is that after I sat on my Amulets of Vigor for years, they spiked not a month later than I have sold them? This is a bad bad day...

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/i...HFGplx7-PRm-sd

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They went from 2 to 7 dollars each. That's 20 bucks, unless you were hoarding them.

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Originally Posted by Barook

They went from 2 to 7 dollars each. That's 20 bucks, unless you were hoarding them.

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Yep, I had a playset. I thought I'll use it somewhere, but than a buddy of mine bought them after I never sleeved them for three years. So it's not that painful... :smile:

That's not hoarding. If it is, I'm responsible for fetch and dual spikes across the board... :rolleyes:

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee

That's not hoarding. If it is, I'm responsible for fetch and dual spikes across the board... :rolleyes:

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Of course it isn't hoarding, I was kidding. But I'm still a little bit surprised that the Amulet have gained in value, is it even remotely good? But yes, it has a bit unusual effect, so maybe I should not be surprised at all.

At least Amulet is a 4-of maindeck card, whereas Teferi is a 1-of in the sideboard, lol.

Basically all the stuff that did well at the Pro Tour jumped (Batterskull, Pyro Ascension, Blood Moon, PiF, Azusa, Snapcaster, Goyf, Cryptic etc.)

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Originally Posted by Bed Decks Palyer

Of course it isn't hoarding, I was kidding. But I'm still a little bit surprised that the Amulet have gained in value, is it even remotely good? But yes, it has a bit unusual effect, so maybe I should not be surprised at all.

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Heheh, I know. Me too. Sorry for the confusion.

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Originally Posted by Kage

At least Amulet is a 4-of maindeck card, whereas Teferi is a 1-of in the sideboard, lol.

Basically all the stuff that did well at the Pro Tour jumped (Batterskull, Pyro Ascension, Blood Moon, PiF, Azusa, Snapcaster, Goyf, Cryptic etc.)

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I think in the confused state of the modern metagame, this should be expected until definite archetypes are established.

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Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee

I think in the confused state of the modern metagame, this should be expected until definite archetypes are established.

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Speculators buy out everything that gets hyped in the wake of a GP/PT - it isn't just limited to Legacy.

See: Fist of Suns

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Originally Posted by Barook

Speculators buy out everything that gets hyped in the wake of a GP/PT - it isn't just limited to Legacy.

See: Fist of Suns

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So, Porphyry Nodes are gone. I guess it is easy to buy out a fifty cent card. How much are they going to be when they are back in stock. Barf.

Had a playset in my eBay watchlist for a couple weeks. Figured I would have infinite time to make the purchase.

Nope.

Which decks ran Porphyry Nodes? :confused:

Edit: Okay, the winning deck. It's still strange, though.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Which decks ran Porphyry Nodes? :confused:

Edit: Okay, the winning deck. It's still strange, though.

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Uh o, watch the price of drip of honey spike cause if this stupidity

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Originally Posted by apple713

Uh o, watch the price of drip of honey spike cause if this stupidity

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Are you being sarcastic? I mean, why would that happen? That's green, nodes is white. The applications are different just on color alone.

Edit: Barook, Nodes has been used to off-and-on moderate success in landstill since it's printing.

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Had an interesting discussion at our kitchen table game last night.

How much damage could a single person and $100k do to the magic card market?

I was thinking with the right buy and sell policy a person could maybe double their original investment once per year by manipulating card prices.

A large part of the discussion is I have a friend who is a commodities trader and very good at it, and she was saying that most of what players do with cards based investments/market manipulation would be multiple years of prison time on the commodities market.

She went on to say that with cards the behavior is not only completely legal but with the short run of older stuff could be very profitable to say buy 2000 zendikar fetch lands at avg. $50 each make the price spike by $10 each and flip for a $20k profit.

i went a step further and suggested a mix of legacy staples as a portfolio. Duals, fetches fow led etc. Stuff that if it started disappearing in the market place would cause a panic buy.

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Originally Posted by Dan Turner

How much damage could a single person and $100k do to the magic card market?

I was thinking with the right buy and sell policy a person could maybe double their original investment once per year by manipulating card prices.

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Aka SCG's business model?

I could see this working out very well. Wizards takes years to react to market shortages. Buying out Modern staples might work out even better since that market is even volatile than the Legacy market (and let's be realistic, the demand is bigger). I'd say that the Legacy market is already reaching the upper limit for certain staples, but the ceiling for Modern is still high.

Wizards tries to protect the collectors, but who protects US from the speculators? Edit: That would be an interesting topic by itself.

Legacy is easily attackable if you go for the blue duals since they're the format's Achilles' heel (thanks, Brainstorm and other blue, broken crap!).