[Primer] R/G Lands

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Originally Posted by Alexeezay

Hey guys, I've been playing RGCL with 3 Crop Rotation, 2 Manabond and 35 Lands config for quite a while now.
I love Manabond and would never play less than 2.

Is it better to have 4 Crop and 1 land less to 34 lands? Lately every list I saw had 4 Crop Rotation but I just love Ghost Quarter...

On another note: 2 Primeval Titan SB have been really good for me...the face of your opponents is priceless once they see Titan entering.

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Ghost Quarter is worse then the 4th crop rotation imo. GQ is only really good against decks you can't wasteland out of the game (Miracles and Death & Taxes), playing a long game against miracles is ill advised as they will eventually lock you out of the game and can play around it to a degree, and is win more against Death and Taxes as simply making 20/20s and going to town is good enough (and faster), the games you lose against them are when they get a Mom + Thalia start and get ahead of you with well timed wastelands and ports, in those scenarios, GQ won't do much to help you.

Crop Rotation lets you be more explosive and negate opposing wastelands randomly. it's also basically tinker in this deck and who doesn't want to play effectively 4 Tinkers?

Manabond is sweet.

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Originally Posted by chaosjace

Has anyone tested Burgeoning? I really like it.

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me too...
it might be the only card in magic that gets you a trigger when your opponent plays a land?

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Originally Posted by non-inflammable

me too...
it might be the only card in magic that gets you a trigger when your opponent plays a land?

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I think there's a green three-four wurm that nets plus one plus one counters on opponent land drops. In stronghold? Tempest?

I've noticed Daryl_Ayers has been running only 2 Ports. Does anyone know why he chose to run only two?

edit: Nevermind, found the answer two pages back. Budget choice.

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Originally Posted by gigapatrick

I think there's a green three-four wurm that nets plus one plus one counters on opponent land drops. In stronghold? Tempest?

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https://www.abugames.com/images/prod...urmtempest.jpg

Torpor Orb stops Sword of the Meek, probably way too narrow to even consider though.

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Originally Posted by chaosjace

Torpor Orb stops Sword of the Meek, probably way too narrow to even consider though.

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Way too narrow. Would just run Pithing Needle/Revoker at that point, and that is good in multiple matchups.

As far as Burgeoning goes, what would you take out for it? Why not just play another Manabond at that point? Cards cool, but it seems super situational. If they don't play a land, you have a card that literally does nothing, and easily could be another Manabond, where you can drop way more lands with LFTL.

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Originally Posted by UnsungHero

Way too narrow. Would just run Pithing Needle/Revoker at that point, and that is good in multiple matchups.

As far as Burgeoning goes, what would you take out for it? Why not just play another Manabond at that point? Cards cool, but it seems super situational. If they don't play a land, you have a card that literally does nothing, and easily could be another Manabond, where you can drop way more lands with LFTL.

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I feel like 1 CR or P fire or the 61st card could become a burgeoning. The deck used to run 3 of each at one point. I hope to do some testing with all my crazy theories one day I don't play online but I own the deck so it's harder to organize playing.

Gitrog Toad

Any chance the black version wants this guy? Every time you dredge lands you draw a card - multiple loams, multiple replacement effects, and it starts feeling like actual dredge. Has built in exploration. Discard a land to molten vortex, draw a card. Just seems good. Requires a land sac on upkeep, but you automatically draw a card from it. You can sac your glacial chasm w/ it's trigger on the stack for value.

You can run a Volrath's Stronghold so you don't need to worry about dredging him.
Thoughts?

Shawn

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Originally Posted by SMRiggin

Gitrog Toad

Any chance the black version wants this guy? Every time you dredge lands you draw a card - multiple loams, multiple replacement effects, and it starts feeling like actual dredge. Has built in exploration. Discard a land to molten vortex, draw a card. Just seems good. Requires a land sac on upkeep, but you automatically draw a card from it. You can sac your glacial chasm w/ it's trigger on the stack for value.

You can run a Volrath's Stronghold so you don't need to worry about dredging him.
Thoughts?

Shawn

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I think it would turn your deck into a different beast. It is interesting for sure, but -personally- I'm not going to change my straight RGCL for this.

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Originally Posted by SMRiggin

Gitrog Toad

Any chance the black version wants this guy? Every time you dredge lands you draw a card - multiple loams, multiple replacement effects, and it starts feeling like actual dredge. Has built in exploration. Discard a land to molten vortex, draw a card. Just seems good. Requires a land sac on upkeep, but you automatically draw a card from it. You can sac your glacial chasm w/ it's trigger on the stack for value.

You can run a Volrath's Stronghold so you don't need to worry about dredging him.
Thoughts?

Shawn

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Hey Shawn. Nice to hear from you. You playing Lands now? Or just dropping by?

On Gitrog:

Actually strikes me as a Nic Fit card.

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Originally Posted by gigapatrick

Hey Shawn. Nice to hear from you. You playing Lands now? Or just dropping by?

On Gitrog:

Actually strikes me as a Nic Fit card.

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I am! Splitting time btw Lands and an all-in Red prison variant.

I agree, nic fit is probably a better fit for it than lands, but I could certainly see it out of the board for a grindy game plan or even to out CA the mirror.

Just wanted to see everyone's thoughts since it is a land-centric card and while not a 20/20, it does close reasonably well.

Shawn

I think The Gitrog Monster is falling into the same category as Titania, Protector of Agroth. While awesome effects with our engine, it's just not possible without retooling alot of what makes RG Lands great.

That said I built an EDH for Titania just cause I really wanted to play her after many failed attempts to get her going in RG Lands...I may do the same with Gitrog...

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Originally Posted by djxstream

I think The Gitrog Monster is falling into the same category as Titania, Protector of Agroth. While awesome effects with our engine, it's just not possible without retooling alot of what makes RG Lands great.

That said I built an EDH for Titania just cause I really wanted to play her after many failed attempts to get her going in RG Lands...I may do the same with Gitrog...

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That was my thought initially too. It requires retooling to an extent. I think the big difference w/ Gitrog is it's built in card advantage that is abused by what we do well. It's when a land goes to the GY from anywhere, draw a card. So when you pitch a land to a diamond, draw a card. When you pitch a land to vortex, draw a card. When you dredge loam and hit a land, you get a card. You get a card just from his upkeep sac trigger.

It's probably a win-more card. But I can't help but think about the sheer card draw advantage we would get from it. Especially in a deck like ours which doesn't draw a lot of cards and will get stuck not being able to dredge sometimes because you need to draw a specific answer.

Shawn

To Shawn:

Awesome that lands is your deck now. Last time i saw you in Columbus you were on death and taxes? Maverick? Not saying those aren't good decks but lands is busted good. Feels like I'm cheating every time i play.

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Originally Posted by gigapatrick

To Shawn:

Awesome that lands is your deck now. Last time i saw you in Columbus you were on death and taxes? Maverick? Not saying those aren't good decks but lands is busted good. Feels like I'm cheating every time i play.

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Yeah, I went through a D&T phase, then Junk Depths. Picked up most everything else I needed for RGLands at GP Pittsburgh last fall. Just got the last Taiga I needed recently so I'll be on this for a long while. With all my old black cards (chains, abyss, Nether Void) I'm definitely leaning toward the black splash.

Shawn

@Shawn:

The black splash has much to recommend it.

@all:

Another video set:

Leagues #7

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Originally Posted by gigapatrick

On Quarter:

Have never actually tried it myself, but seems underwhelming compared to a fourth Depths, a seventeenth green source, or a third Thicket effect.

On Miracles:

It is a winnable matchup, but now that we're a known entity, more Miracles players know that Wear/Tear is phenomenal against us. I think we have to be the combo deck against them and win in the first two turns (by the third it becomes much harder). We simply cannot play the long game against them and expect to win. Once they sideboard, they also have game against every relevant thing that we can do. Did you K-Grip Counterbalance? Well, too bad, because they also have Rest in Peace or Surgical Extraction. Did you play Choke and Chalice? Well, they have Wear/Tear. Did you Boil away their Islands? Well, they've got a billion ways to find more. Do you have Boseiju to recur Loam? Well, they just won with Entreat the Angels. Against a good player, I feel like the matchup is heavily in Miracles' favor. Turbo Depths probably has a little bit better game against them, since they can protect their Marit better than we can. When I win against them, it is usually because I have a quick combo hand and a hate permanent on the field. These are the types of hands to keep postboard I would say.

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I like the Ghost Quarter main, I suppose it is is over the 4th fetchland in my version. It is a 5th waste against the BUG delver decks and very good against Eldrazi and Miracles.
I think your approach to Miracles needs to change. Yes game one is hard and making a quick lage is probably the best route. However in the post board games you should be heavily favoured. RIP and Moon can be played around, just don't be greedy and find that basic at the start. Don't bother griping CB. Save it for a hate permanent or Top. The beautiful thing about Loam and Fire is we can just keep jamming it into their CB, and without top they can't always have a 2 on top. We also beat them on card advantage whereas they have better selection. This is another reason to kill top.
My final bit of advice is to realise that removing all of their white sources is our route to victory. GQ kills their 1-2 plains, Wasteland deals with everything else. Use Rishadan Port to keep them off Plow if you're making the witch, or keep them off 4 mana for Jace. We play 4 copies of Stage and DD, remove the white, and draw the combo. (also make lots of copies of Port :wink: )

Hope this helps, ask questions whatever

Sib

@Sib

"However, in postboard games you should be heavily favored."

That just hasn't been my experience. I've heard lots of people say this, including Chris Andersen, but I don't think it's correct. The matchup may improve a little bit postboard, but I don't think it becomes "heavily favored" for us. And of course I agree that we want to Port Miracles off of white if we can and go for the combo when they have no white mana up. However, barring an active Loam recurring Ghost Quarter (which probably won't happen that often in boarded games because of yard hate), this can't really be your plan. Typically, what happens when you try to make that your plan is that you're always a step or two behind your opponent's land drops. We simply don't have enough Ports and Wastelands to keep up with their Tundras and Plains. If you're running Quarter, you've at least got a chance of doing that, and so maybe I'll give that a try in a video series.

Certainly these are not my finest hours. Nonetheless:

Leagues #8