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I ran similar list i took to SCG Atl classic, with some modifications to sideboard.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...?DeckID=115119
Modified Sideboard:
3 dark confidant
3 surgical
3 decay
2 deluge
1 kgrip
1 needle
1 tabernacle
1 karakas
My 2 loses as EW were to eldrazi with god draws and grixis (pilot that top 8'ed)- I kept a shitty hand (my fault) and drew poorly.
How did the bobs work for you? My MD is very close. Also, with the blood moon change, do we really want abrupt decay over k-grip? With the exception of killing random baleful strix blockers, k-grip is typically better at dealing with problematic stuff like humility/moon/etc.
Maindeck
* 12 Combo lands
* 1 Steppe
* 2 Bayou
* 4 Verdant Catacombs
* 1 Bog
* 2 Basics
* 1 GQ
* 4 Hexmage
* 4 ESG
* 3 Safekeeper
* 4 Tseize
* 4 Duress
* 3 Needle
* 4 Crop Rotation
* 4 Petal
* 4 Sylvan Scrying
* 3 Map (Back and forth between Into)
Sideboard
* 4 Sphere
* 4 Decay
* 1 Factory
* 2 Library
* 1 Karakas
* 1 Needle
* 2 Surgical
Thinking of running turbo depths this weekend for th e SCG open in DC. Couple questions on the deck and sideboard options. Expedition maps vs into the north or a mix what's the reason for one vs the other. 4 x Duress vs inquisition cabal therapy and hymm in the main deck. Lists used to run chalice In the board why did people stop using them? Sphere of resistance just for combo? Thoughts on right of consumption? Thanks in advance
Play Expedition Maps and Duresses.
I stopped playing Chalices to start playing Spheres, then stopped playing Spheres to play Mindbreak Traps.
I don't think Rite of Consumption is needed, since most of the blue matchups are extremely favorable despite the presence of Diabolic Edict. 4-color control and Delver (all varieties) are trivial matchups.
@DNSolver: am I correct that the plan vs. Grixis/BUG/RUG Delver decks is to cut some of the fast mana and trim a discard spell and bring in the Decays and the last Needle (Wasteland, DRS, etc.)? Also, how does the Eldrazi matchup generally play out and how would you suggest boarding?
Against Delver, I like keeping some of the fast mana to pay for Daze / Fluster / Pierce.
Vs Delver:
-1 Duress
-4 ESG / Petal
+4 Abrupt Decay
+1 Needle
Vs Eldrazi:
-3 Sylvan Safekeeper
-1 Steppe
-1 Bog
+4 Decay
+1 Needle
On the draw against Eldrazi you could cut Duress instead if you want to keep some blockers. If you see Karakas or Endbringer you might want to keep Safekeeper.
Eldrazi matchup is pretty favorable, but not trivial. Their principle interaction is Wasteland, then Chalice, then TKS taking searches/hexmage, then Smasher applying pressure. Needle on Wasteland makes the matchup MUCH easier, so hands that have that are excellent. Hexmage removing chalice counters is a fun and fair interaction.
I played a list pretty similar to last year but safekeepers instead of NOTW.
My board was as follows:
3x Mindbreak Trap
2x Surgical
3x Abrupt
3x Tireless Trackers
1x Karakas
1x Dread of Night
1x Pithing Needle
1x Sylvan Library
Trackers were for miracles or any slow play deck and proved to be the deciding factor against the mirror. I didn’t see storm all day and I am wondering if deluge/DoN would be better since D&T is such a bad match up. I feel like I see storm more online and D&T more in paper.
I did see legacy doomsday in a side event and it killed me turn 2 on the play and turn 1 on the draw.
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Thanks, DNSolver. This makes sense and is very helpful.Quote:
Originally Posted by DNSolver
DNSolver thanks for the input. Looks like I'll be ordering traps lol. One other question why the switch to safekeepers over not of this world?
There's been a big increase in Diabolic Edict usage, and Safekeeper gives you an extra creature to sac to Edict while also letting you counter a Plow/Karakas activation on your Marit Lage.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluehen28
Makes sense. Also seen Dryad Arbor in the board in some listsQuote:
Originally Posted by Luiggi
Safekeepers, while not a surprise, can negate multiple pieces of interaction, protect from edict effects, chump block and get in small bits of damage to protect against life gain.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluehen28
They are just better.
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They are not just better in situations involving flying blockers, where you can't steppe and safekeeper through a Plow while you could steppe and Not of This World through one. Further, Safekeeper can be hit by Revoker.
However, Safekeeper just ends the game sometimes if you can clear the way.
Hi All. Just got back from Eternal Weekend in Pittsburgh. I had a great time, though I was disappointed with my showing in the main event. I got to meet some other Depths players from the forum, Thoughtsauce (though we met in Charlotte the week before), HymnYou (though we've met at ATL events), and ComplexPants, who graciously signed one of my Into The Norths :-) Below I'll write my list and how the events went.
Lands:
4x Dark Depths
4x Thespian's Stage
3x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4x Verdant Catacombs
2x Bayou
1x Llanowar Wastes
1x Snow-covered Forest
1x Snow-covered Swamp
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Bojuka Bog
1x Sejiri Steppe
Spells:
4x Lotus Petal
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
4x Vampire Hexmage
2x Sylvan Safekeeper
3x Pithing Needle
2x Gitaxian Probe
4x Thoughtseize
2x Duress
1x Collective Brutality
4x Crop Rotation
4x Sylvan Scrying
2x Into the North
1x Expedition Map
Sideboard:
3x Rite of Consumption
2x Abrupt Decay
2x Sylvan Library
1x Krosan Grip
1x Karakas
1x Boseiju
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Ground Seal
1x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Sphere of Resistance
1x Collective Brutality
Friday, 5 round trial #1:
Round1: UB Reanimator. 2-0. Easy peasy.
Round2: Sneak n Show. 2-0.
Round3: Sneak n Show. 2-1 I believe. I was playing against Jerry Mee of the Leaving a Legacy Podcast. Nice guy. We got deck checked and when they came back they told us they had found a crumpled up Mountain in one of our deck boxes, though they didn't know whose. They didn't give us a warning or violation or anything, but it was a little mystifying. I asked Jerry to autograph the mountain :-) Also, he was not running Blood Moon, which surprised me.
Round4: I can't remember. Maybe Grixis Delver. 2-0 or 2-1.
Round5: Somehow lost to Elves 1-2. Opponent, Zack, played it very well and I had to mulligan to 6 then 5 the games I lost and kept sub-optimal hands. Perhaps I should've mulligan-ed more aggressively for a fast combo. Both games I lost Zack went above 20 then killed me on the crack back.
Ended 4-1
Friday 5 round trial #2:
Round 1: Manaless dredge. 2-1. He got game 1. Game 2 he revealed a Leyline of Sanctity pre-game to stop my discard-time walks, as well as Bojuka bog. I hadn't seen this tech out of dredge before so it threw me. I was able to pull out the next two games though.
Round 2: Sneak n Show. 2-0
Round 3: Grixis Delver 2-0
Round 4: Grixis Delver 2-0
Round 5: I sat down across from Bob Huang. He offered me a split where I got all $270ish of tix but he got the bye and the Revised sealed product that was like the special prize for going 5-0. I already had two byes but I kinda wanted the sealed stuff, so I made us play it out. He was on Grixis Delver, but my deck crapped out on me and I had to keep weak 6 card hands and got punished by not drawing any business. In retrospect, shoulda split :-) Afterwards he told me he was building the Living Wish version of Depths so I traded him a few extra cards I had for the deck.
Ended 4-1
Saturday main event:
Round 1: bye
Round 2: bye
Round 3: Miracles piloted by Daniel Miller (the guy who lost to Complex Pants on Depths in the finals last year). I scooped it up pretty quick game 1 after having two tokens killed and him getting Jace active. Game 2 I Boseiju - Rite of Consumptioned him and his face dropped; he may have been having flashbacks to last year :-) Game 3 he played very slow and I had to keep pestering him to pick up the pace so we could finish. I think he was trying to figure out how to beat Rite. I had assembled the combo, Rite in hand, and was just waiting for a tutor or Boseiju. 15 turns later I lost after having seen neither. The game took so long with all the miracles shenanigans and some slow play that I could've actually drawn the game by making a token in combat and having him have to Jace-bounce it, but I played for the win and ended up just never drawing what I needed. 2-1
Round 4: Manaless Dredge, quick 2-0. Very favorable matchup for us. 3-1
Round 5: Played Lisa on Lands. She went first. I decided to play out a verdant and pass like a random BUG deck. She set up for a turn 3 combo. I played Bayou and passed. She went to make the token on my end step so I used Crop Rotation and a ESG to copy her Depths in response. Unfortunately she had gamble for Karakas and Loam in hand to bounce my token and swing in. Game 2 Lisa kept a very good hand with double wasteland, ghost quarter, loam, and Grip and just took over the game. I think post-board my build has a good lands matchup but I still have a lot of trouble with a very strong Lands hand like that. I think I need prioritize Needle above everything else just to stop the Waste-you-out plan. I'm frustrated and now 3-2.
Round 6: BUG Midrange. Game 1 I have a fast combo but he Hymns me and hits two pieces and sets me back two turns. By then, he has Strix then lands a Jace. I lose. I am kinda tilted at this point from my losses and I play game two poorly and lose. 3-3
Round 7: Weird quasi-maverick. 2-0. 4-3 overall
Round 8: I forget. 5-3
Round 9: I forget. 6-3
Round 10: Lands. I get wasted out of the game by some really strong hands and never seeing a Needle :-( 0-2. 6-4
Round 11: Elves. 2-1. 7-4. I end up in 82nd place out of 711. Meh. With two byes, that felt like a poor performance. When I was 3-3 I got very frustrated and played poorly--I definitely learned that tilting is a real thing and I need to be a little more Zen when I start losing :-)
Sunday 5k:
Round 1: I misplay in game two and lose to Goblins. 0-1
Round 2: I get completely stomped by Colorless Stax. 0-2
Round 3: I 2-0 BUG stuff. 1-2
Round 4: I 2-0 something, forget what. 2-2
Round 5: I 2-0 merfolk. 3-2
Round 6: Payout is to Top 16, and only like 50 people signed up for the event. I was 20th going into the final round. I think If I won, breakers would be good enough to sneak into Top 16. I play against Dillon on Miracles. Nice guy. He takes Game 1 per usual. I Rite of Consumption him on turn 5 through a Boseiju. Game 3 played out a lot like my game against Daniel Miller. I have everything ready to go and am missing Boseiju. I have tutors in hand, but don't see a green mana until I'm dead :-( 3-3
What I learned: It's nice to dodge DnT for a whole weekend! Lands and Miracles are tough matchups and even though I have a good SB plan, variance and strong opponents can still make post-bard games tough. I may fool around with a Brainstorm BUG version of the deck again to improve the consistency. Against Miracles, I need to use my first tutor in SB games to find Boseiju, as it kept eluding me. Against Lands, Pithing Needle is crucial--even above Ground Seal, Sylvan, and Surgical. It allows us to stabilize and start putting together the Rite combo. Most of all, I think I learned that despite my usually cool and calm demeanor, losing a couple games in a row in a big event can get me pretty frustrated which really affected my play in a few instances. Maybe I need to try meditation? :-) Overall, I did have a great time, picked up some cards with prize tix, and mostly just had a good time meeting other players and the tourney camaraderie that occurs at these events. Also, sometime soon I'll post some pics of my deck. I've been altering it out and have 2/3 of the maindeck done--hoping to finish the 75 by GP Seattle.
Your deck seems right about in between DD and lands (maybe closer to lands) and I dunno if that good. Right now your only wincon is through DD & Thespian so if one of those gets surgical it's over and it will be harder to assemble your combo without the hexmage. Lands usually has the punishing fire as wincon too. The deck is even close to a few other decks that all have established shells so I would try to get closer to one of those too. My personal feeling if you wanna open up extra slots is that you could be good with one less loam and at least one less urborg. That would elimate some lame hands getting multiples of each. I've been experimenting with exploration too, and I dunno if 4 is good there either, whenever I draw a hand with two it kinda sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bam Bam
I play the Dark Depths combo for over a year now and i,m on and off different lists. Recently i have a lot of success with DRS en BOB in the main (2x semi's and 1 time barely miss t8). I,m considering to build a blue variant of the deck for the can trips and counters. It would be nice to have FOW in the main but you need a lot of cards to support for that to. The usual 8 can trips is not enough. The more you shape of our explosive starts to more mid-range we become. Thinking of that, maybe a nice build is to be made for a nice BUG depths mid-range+combo deck.Quote:
Originally Posted by caseyc
I saw someone playing a nice Sultai Loam deck @cardKingdom. Starts at 50 minutes:https://go.twitch.tv/videos/184001822
I cannot find any recent deck lists for this deck but maybe this is something to start from.
I appreciate the general direction you aimed at. I bought into Mox Diamonds pre-hype with the intention to have a much more grindy version of Depths (maybe not “turbo” anymore) available. I don't know whether it's better or not, but this version basically changes Lotus Petals, Spirit Guides (the “turbo”) and 4x land tutor with Moxes, Exploration and Loam while also being able to pack removal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bam Bam
With the current resurgence of Living Wish, wouldn't that be a nice addition to your list? You can easily make room by siding out two combo pieces, maybe a Wasteland or spell for a 2-3 of. It would also solve your on- and off relationship with Vampire Hexmage. With Mox Diamond you could search for the missing combo piece as early as turn 1, have Karakas online game one or you can even search for Tracker.
Also, would Nether Spirit be an option? I know it's kinda Pox tech, but with Entomb it may win some games by stalling the couple of turns you need to take over the game.
The discard in your list seems a lot. Yes, you want to keep the hate of the Turbo version, but have you ever had problems casting them? I ask because you run way more lands that tap for colorless or don't even tap for mana. Without Urborg, I see problems there. Love the Raven's Crime, though!
Last point: How about Molten Vortex? I saw a GBr Lands list on the Lands thread about two weeks ago which included them (or maybe even a 1 of) as a way to grind out in the late game. You arguably only need 1-2 red sources online (Mox and splashing a singleton Taiga?) to get value out of it. That Lands-deck ran Gamble though, so a single Molten Vortex here would likely be too cute.
@DNSolver: any reason why Massacre isn't played in the SB, if Death & Taxes is a not-great matchup? Doesn't seem like it should be that hard to get a Swamp into play, especially with Urborg, so is it because D&T can frequently not have a basic Plains?
Also, any general tips about what role to generally take vs. Delver and what our gameplan should be? E.g., should we be trying to combo as quickly as possible and force them to have the answers or try to play for a longer game? Hold our Abrupt Decays to answer their answers (e.g., if they play their own Pithing Needle, which happened to me a lot last night) or to take out their threats and lengthen the game? Etc.
Correct me if I'm wrong . Lands can be sacked to safekeepers at instant speed in response to multiple swords stifle ect. Swords your token, response Sack a land, response second sword, response Sack a second land would work right?
No you sac one land per turn that you need it. Don't keep sac'ing lands. SS gives shroud till EOT.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluehen28