[Deck] Merfolk

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Originally Posted by Finn

I think Jitte sux ass against Zoo. Jitte is far better against Threshold, aggro loam, and other decks that have fewer creatures and fewer spot removal.

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The bold part is the important bit. Jitte is pretty much worthless if you have nothing to equip it to, obviously. But I disagree with the statement 'Jitte sux ass against Zoo'. I have always sided in Jitte against Zoo and have yet to regret it. Yes, I've had problems maintaining a creature on board to carry it, but there are plenty occasions where I do get a creature with Jitte online; once you have a creature equiped with Jitte counters (preferably a lord), you're 60% to winning the game because they can't just bolt down your creature anymore, and annoying pesks like Grim Lavamancers bite the dust.

I must add that Jitte alone ofcourse does not win against Zoo. My sideboard is pretty Zoo orientated because it's a common deck in my meta and pretty much our worst match-up.

After loosing to a zoo deck again, never won a tourny event against a zoo, i was wondering maybe adding more countermagic might help or adding kira the glass spinner in the SB could help in the zoo matchup ?

Im also having a hardtime using jitte against a zoo deck. My lords are almost dead after i cast them.

Once grimlavamancer hits the board and you have no means of bounce or killing it its almost a lost cause.

It's a good thing Zoo is apparently non-existent in my meta based on the comments I keep seeing! (And of course, I'll be matched up against the one Zoo player in the area.)

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Originally Posted by tivadar

EDITEDIT: If you have any amount of ichorid, I'd just drop wipe away entirely and run echoing truth instead. It's just so much better!

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Are you sure? Even dropping Wipe Away completely from the side?

The key cards I use against Zoo are Stifles, Back to Basics and Wastelands. Zoo (especially Domain Zoo) has a weak manabase that's easily disrupted. Once you have this package working against Zoo, it's much easier to keep a creature alive on the board and load him up with a Jitte. Keep in mind: it's still a hard match-up, but very possible to win.

The other way to go is to splash white and run Absolute Law. That ought to make your Jitte stick :smile:.

The thing about Jitte is that all its abilities are very useful against Zoo: whether it is to kill his creatures, safe your creatures from nasty bolts or give extra life against the abundance of direct damage thrown at your face.

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Originally Posted by Skeggi

The key cards I use against Zoo are Stifles, Back to Basics and Wastelands. Zoo (especially Domain Zoo) has a weak manabase that's easily disrupted. Once you have this package working against Zoo, it's much easier to keep a creature alive on the board and load him up with a Jitte. Keep in mind: it's still a hard match-up, but very possible to win.

The other way to go is to splash white and run Absolute Law. That ought to make your Jitte stick :smile:.

The thing about Jitte is that all its abilities are very useful against Zoo: whether it is to kill his creatures, safe your creatures from nasty bolts or give extra life against the abundance of direct damage thrown at your face.

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I removed stifles in my list lol...., but i sided in 4 bebs, 3 back to basics, 4 echoing truth still no sucess..., hmmm stifles yes they are indeed very strong especially when you could draw them early and hit your opponents fetch's. Last time i used stifles against a zoo the 4 copies never came out at the time i needed them (early game). I could stifle my opponets lands mid game but its almost has no effect on him.

Maybe i just have crappy luck against zoo but ever time i could cast a back to basic even with fow backup it still ends up getting destoryed.

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Originally Posted by Skeggi

The key cards I use against Zoo are Stifles, Back to Basics and Wastelands. Zoo (especially Domain Zoo) has a weak manabase that's easily disrupted. Once you have this package working against Zoo, it's much easier to keep a creature alive on the board and load him up with a Jitte. Keep in mind: it's still a hard match-up, but very possible to win.

The other way to go is to splash white and run Absolute Law. That ought to make your Jitte stick :smile:.

The thing about Jitte is that all its abilities are very useful against Zoo: whether it is to kill his creatures, safe your creatures from nasty bolts or give extra life against the abundance of direct damage thrown at your face.

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Sorry but that is definitely not my impression. Stifle is the first card I would board against Zoo because it does basically nothing. Also Wasteland and BtB do no good. Why? Because Zoo just needs 1 Land to play 2/3 of its spells and 2 lands to play 95% of the deck. Even if you keep U open for stifling a fetchland or you waste a land they will not be stopped except they kept a shitty 1 Land hand. Also if the opponent is smart enough he will fetch for basics instead of Duals. In addition if you count on the disruption like Stifle / Wasteland you are getting behind because you do nothing to up your own defense so basically you are reducing chances to play a Lord earlier or maybe to play a Cursecatcher Turn 1.

My tip against Zoo with a Mono U version would be to not waste there land until absolutely necessary but keep it to surely get to 3+ Mana. You need to assemble a pumped army as soon as possible or you are toast. BtB is useless against Zoo (due to them having access to basics) so you better play ET or Bouncespells. Counter / Force a 1 Turn Nacatl or Ape because they can get very far before you have a Lord or two out. If you expect a lot of Zoo splash white because Mono U has a really hard time. Even Dreadnaughts or Kira didnt do the trick for me in the past when playing the mono-colored version.

Ive found that Mind Harness is an absolute beating vs zoo.. ive not had problems with that deck since I started siding them.
Drop a Vial on turn 1 let them drop a goyf/figure/whatever, take it from them and watch them freakout having to try to burn their own guy before I beat their head in with it.
If nothing else, it draws out a REB and helps keep your guys on the board.

Echoing truth is really good to stall them out or get lavamancers off the board..

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Originally Posted by Plaguekeeper

Ive found that Mind Harness is an absolute beating vs zoo.. ive not had problems with that deck since I started siding them.
Drop a Vial on turn 1 let them drop a goyf/figure/whatever, take it from them and watch them freakout having to try to burn their own guy before I beat their head in with it.
If nothing else, it draws out a REB and helps keep your guys on the board.

Echoing truth is really good to stall them out or get lavamancers off the board..

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ET just gives you 1 Turn maximum, maybe 2 if you can play it with the right timing. Still all their creatures are bigger than yours initially. Bounce of course is the only thing you have access to in Mono U so it is not that bad but also not that great. Mind Harness I think it is better but then it never really mattered for me in the past. Without Vial it kind of sucks because you cannot get ahead just stall. With Vial out it can be good to gain 1-2 turns especially if you have a Goyf they cannot easily burn. In the end the matchup doesnt improve that much from my experience. So from 25/75 to 30/70 maybe depending of ourse on the hate that Zoo can bring in. I my eyes the most annoying thing that can happen is a Vexing Shusher.

Wake Thrasher seems to not have caught on with the rule change... why is this not a 3-4 of?

More lords also came with M10

In a mono blue build, I've taken to using 10 lords, and split 2 wake thrashers and 2 sovereigns. Its been working out really well for me in testing so far, with thrasher adding a bit of explosiveness and sovereign + thrasher has won more than a few games together.

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Originally Posted by Nekrataal

Sorry but that is definitely not my impression. Stifle is the first card I would board against Zoo because it does basically nothing. Also Wasteland and BtB do no good. Why? Because Zoo just needs 1 Land to play 2/3 of its spells and 2 lands to play 95% of the deck.

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You're probably facing more Naya Zoo than me. Over here it's mostly Domain Zoo, because that actually reaches top 8 around here.

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Originally Posted by Nekrataal

My tip against Zoo with a Mono U version would be to not waste there land until absolutely necessary but keep it to surely get to 3+ Mana. You need to assemble a pumped army as soon as possible or you are toast. BtB is useless against Zoo (due to them having access to basics) so you better play ET or Bouncespells. Counter / Force a 1 Turn Nacatl or Ape because they can get very far before you have a Lord or two out. If you expect a lot of Zoo splash white because Mono U has a really hard time.

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Making a pumped army usually doesn't cut it, because Volcanic Fallout/Firespout + Extra burn on a lord/PtE will wipe your board and you will lose the game. The problem with stuff like Chill and Absolute Law is that Domain Zoo has plenty ways outside red to hurt you really bad. Kira's still die, Dreadnoughts succumb to Pridemages.

Granted, I mostly test against Domain Zoo, because as said, it's more common here (but that's simply because it's a better deck than Naya Zoo in general). Domain Zoo runs no basics and the package I mentioned is extremely effective against them.

Against Naya Zoo I'd go for the anti-red package. Againt Domain Zoo I'd prefer the anti-nonbasic package.

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Originally Posted by Skeggi

You're probably facing more Naya Zoo than me. Over here it's mostly Domain Zoo, because that actually reaches top 8 around here.

Making a pumped army usually doesn't cut it, because Volcanic Fallout/Firespout + Extra burn on a lord/PtE will wipe your board and you will lose the game. The problem with stuff like Chill and Absolute Law is that Domain Zoo has plenty ways outside red to hurt you really bad. Kira's still die, Dreadnoughts succumb to Pridemages.

Granted, I mostly test against Domain Zoo, because as said, it's more common here (but that's simply because it's a better deck than Naya Zoo in general). Domain Zoo runs no basics and the package I mentioned is extremely effective against them.

Against Naya Zoo I'd go for the anti-red package. Againt Domain Zoo I'd prefer the anti-nonbasic package.

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Granted, over here it is RGW Zoo exclusively. I never played against nor saw any Domain lately (last 6 month).

@Guy I don't Know: This deck got a few shiny new bonuses from M10. Wake Thrasher got a pretty cool boost with the rules change. And the removal of stacked combat damage in a deck with pretty much zero combat tricks also is a help. And a lot of people are testing out the new lord in the place of Wake Thrasher. We will see if it turns out to be a better option. I have tested my fair share and I am still on the fence on this issue.

Hey guys I run a Merfolk deck and it does fairly well (I place in the top 4 or 5 every time I play it when I lived in a different city) but in the last two tournaments I've been in I lost the final round to Affinity. What are some good anti-Affinity Sideboard cards? My sideboard is currently anti-aggro since my previous metagame was most aggro, but since I've moved, the metagame is slightly different.

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Hey guys I run a Merfolk deck and it does fairly well (I place in the top 4 or 5 every time I play it when I lived in a different city) but in the last two tournaments I've been in I lost the final round to Affinity. What are some good anti-Affinity Sideboard cards? My sideboard is currently anti-aggro since my previous metagame was most aggro, but since I've moved, the metagame is slightly different.

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If you don't want to splash a color, Hurkyl's Recall is probably your best bet.

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Originally Posted by akiratheoni

Hey guys I run a Merfolk deck and it does fairly well (I place in the top 4 or 5 every time I play it when I lived in a different city) but in the last two tournaments I've been in I lost the final round to Affinity. What are some good anti-Affinity Sideboard cards? My sideboard is currently anti-aggro since my previous metagame was most aggro, but since I've moved, the metagame is slightly different.

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Energy Flux is a savage beating against Affinity, but it's kind of narrow. If your meta contains a lot of aggro, Propaganda is almost as good and exponentially less of a niche card.

@ akiratheoni: here's a great quote (from another thread), hope it helps:

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

...And I don't really know how good Affinity is because I hate the deck so so much I refuse to even take the time to test against it. Instead, I carry around a playset of Energy Flux and if I even hear the word Affinity I decide that I'm going to punish everyone who plays it so brutally that they finally give up and get a real deck.

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EDIT: one minute too slow...

I like Energy Flux, although it'll hit your AEther Vials too.

EDIT: Wow, I was beaten on that REAL fast!

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Originally Posted by akiratheoni

Hey guys I run a Merfolk deck and it does fairly well (I place in the top 4 or 5 every time I play it when I lived in a different city) but in the last two tournaments I've been in I lost the final round to Affinity. What are some good anti-Affinity Sideboard cards? My sideboard is currently anti-aggro since my previous metagame was most aggro, but since I've moved, the metagame is slightly different.

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I can see why people would run affinity now that the combat rules have been changed... /sarcasm

But in all seriousness, Energy Flux is a bigger hoser than Hurkyl's Recall, but Hurkyl's recall will serve you better against other decks (chalice, mox) and doesn't punish your vials. I'd choose it over Flux for those reasons.

Also, the other way to deal with affinity is to keep its creatures off the board. However, we're kind of weak at doing this to begin with, so yeah, recall rocks.