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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jain_Mor
Oh awesome, I asked how many times you've cast it in testing or real play and the only time you mentions was 10 years ago :P
Is it actually "great" against shardless? It counters suspended visions but shardless agent can just hit a creature and then it doesn't do anything. I get that it cantrips but there's still a mana investment there.
I am sold on it against various combo decks (buying a turn and digging for answers against elves is legit)
If it actually starts doing work as a counterspell against miracles then I'll really be sold :)
I didn't count the number of games we did...
Was just saying it's been 10 years since the last time I've played with Abeyance in a Legacy deck.
Anyway, the card is "average" to "outstanding" so far. Obviously preventing a miracle spell from being cast is like "saving" the cheerleader !
To be honest we have also considered "Orim's chant" as well but finally elected Abeyance:
- The kick cost could also be handy against aggro deck but requires WW
- 1 CMC is easier than 2 CMC (especially against combo)
- But the fact that Abeyance is at least a cantrip was the edge we were looking for.
So far the card is great against combo & control and almost dead against aggro. But we usually have a not so bad matchup against aggro deck to begin with.
Test it and tell me what you think !
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Yea I like the theory, I was trying something similar previously with hallowed moonlight.. Works against many combo decks and entreat, but I found holding up mana really awkward.
But countering terminus is something moonlight couldn't do, so I will be testing this
Also, who is "we" :P is there a secret Ralf nic fit playgroup, or are you talking about other players on the source?
Edit: this is a question for everyone on MODO, are there any legacy testing clans online? Like is there anywhere I can go to find players to test with / against online?
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fatal
With GSZ around and Therapy self-exiled, it's really quite rare having 4 types in gy - most common in my GBC build:
- Land (enough)
- Creature (enough)
- Sorceries (4 Self-exiling, 4 GSZ - read non)
- Instants (3 MD/a lot of in SB)
- Enchantment (4 MD)
- Artifact (5 MD/where 2 of are creatures)
- Walkers (1-2 MD)
I think it can work in some BUG decks with Hymn to Tourach/Permission decks/Walker decks.
I agree that BUG seems the natural fit here. Strix is an easy way to get another type with artifact and land/creature are easy. So the only real issue is if you can get another type. Sorcery is out because Therapy exilies and GSZ doesn't go to the GY, but Instant is probably doable, moving away from Pulse and towards more instant removal could do it.
Actually, BUG has a big problem with GSZ frequently clashing with it because of the need for Green creatures while BUG really pushes you towards blue. I think this card could fully replace GSZ in BUG builds. Personally, I really like the idea of using this to find Snapcaster/Eternal Witness, casting that, and then getting the tutor back to find something again.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jain_Mor
Yea I like the theory, I was trying something similar previously with hallowed moonlight.. Works against many combo decks and entreat, but I found holding up mana really awkward.
But countering terminus is something moonlight couldn't do, so I will be testing this
Also, who is "we" :P is there a secret Ralf nic fit playgroup, or are you talking about other players on the source?
Edit: this is a question for everyone on MODO, are there any legacy testing clans online? Like is there anywhere I can go to find players to test with / against online?
I don't know of any testing clans, but let's start one.
I have shardless bug and bug delver (hymn version). My username on there is Adelorenzi. I can usually test in the mornings (pacific time)
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
That new Sorin looks pretty neat.
I might have to give my Summoner's Egg build another go. +1 Sorin into Emrakul. EDH..? Nah, welcome to the thunderdome, bitch.
And yes, I know what Erratic Explosion is and that I'm magical christmaslanding ad absurdum. Just let me have this one, ok..?
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
I don't see a problem with Sorin. At 2BW he's obviously busted to hell, but I honestly think they could have pushed him at 5 mana.
+1 is obviously good since you can stack stuff with Tops, and you get more cards. How's about putting Rhino into your hand, then casting it later? Jeez.
-X kills a Jace that's been on the field for one turn. It's no Vraska -3 for sure, but it's also removal. It's a 6-mana nug 6, gain 6 at the very least, and it's future crowd control if you play it into a wiped board. Plus, life gain. Moar lifegains.
-9 is probably irrelevant. I would have preferred something else for sure.
Overall, he's worth at least TRYING. Against Miracles he seems insane, especially if you're still on the Carpet plan and are powering him out. Dat card advantage engine sure is sweet.
-Matt
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Also, I still have a hard-on for Garruk Apex Predator, but 7 mana is insane. I'd pay 5 for him, gladly. Even at 1GGBB.
-Matt
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sdematt
Also, I still have a hard-on for Garruk Apex Predator, but 7 mana is insane. I'd pay 5 for him, gladly. Even at 1GGBB.
-Matt
It's always nice to hear what gives another man his hard-on. Thank you for sharing.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Echelon
That new Sorin looks pretty neat.
I might have to give my Summoner's Egg build another go. +1 Sorin into Emrakul. EDH..? Nah, welcome to the thunderdome, bitch.
And yes, I know what
Erratic Explosion is and that I'm magical christmaslanding ad absurdum. Just let me have this one, ok..?
Haha you and that damn egg have a weird relationship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sdematt
Also, I still have a hard-on for Garruk Apex Predator, but 7 mana is insane. I'd pay 5 for him, gladly. Even at 1GGBB.
-Matt
yeah, I wish he weren't so much mana or atleast one of his abilities wasn't borderline useless.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Echelon
It's always nice to hear what gives another man his hard-on. Thank you for sharing.
You gotta know what they like so you can give the best holiday present since most of us live in magical Christmas land.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
I hear matt likes porsche's maybe you can get the whole thread one for christmas ricardo?
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Or getting Siege Rhinos altered into Cobras like in Age of Empires II. ;)
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Navsi
This is actually hard. Deed, Removal (instant/sorc), fetchlands, creatures...the potential is there. The payoff is actually bonkers: you go from basic land to 1 of any land/creature of your choice. That's a tremendous payoff for G w/ the delirium trigger.
I'm conflicted on Sorin. His abilities are like EVERYTHING you could want.
+1: card advantage, possibly close out games off lifeloss
-X: defends himself, removes PWers
Ult: win the game, insult your opponent with the lifeswing
...but he costs a fucking ton of mana. If he's in your list, chances are you'll need him. And if you need him, you'll need 6 mana. I can't see myself relying on a 6 drop. Nic Fit would have to ramp more and more. And if you're ramping as a core strategy, wouldn't you just play Burning Wish --> Scapeshift kill?
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Warden
This is actually hard. Deed, Removal (instant/sorc), fetchlands, creatures...the potential is there. The payoff is actually bonkers: you go from basic land to 1 of any land/creature of your choice. That's a tremendous payoff for G w/ the delirium trigger.
I'm conflicted on Sorin. His abilities are like EVERYTHING you could want.
+1: card advantage, possibly close out games off lifeloss
-X: defends himself, removes PWers
Ult: win the game, insult your opponent with the lifeswing
...but he costs a fucking ton of mana. If he's in your list, chances are you'll need him. And if you need him, you'll need 6 mana. I can't see myself relying on a 6 drop. Nic Fit would have to ramp more and more. And if you're ramping as a core strategy, wouldn't you just play Burning Wish --> Scapeshift kill?
I agree with the traverse part but I disagree with the second half. So often I have the 5 mana to gsz for rhino or 6 for sigarda/rhino around daze.
6 mana is attainable in a non-combo mu setting. I think this card has what we need. Losing to jace feels bad and he deals with that. the added CA off his +1 that ALSO pressures your opponents life is amazing. I will be getting this card as soon as possible online to test. we are a midrange control deck and Sorin looks to be our Grim Ally in the fight against blue decks and they stupid patriarch, Miracles.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Warden
This is actually hard. Deed, Removal (instant/sorc), fetchlands, creatures...the potential is there. The payoff is actually bonkers: you go from basic land to 1 of any land/creature of your choice. That's a tremendous payoff for G w/ the delirium trigger.
I'm conflicted on Sorin. His abilities are like EVERYTHING you could want.
+1: card advantage, possibly close out games off lifeloss
-X: defends himself, removes PWers
Ult: win the game, insult your opponent with the lifeswing
...but he costs a fucking ton of mana. If he's in your list, chances are you'll need him. And if you need him, you'll need 6 mana. I can't see myself relying on a 6 drop. Nic Fit would have to ramp more and more. And if you're ramping as a core strategy, wouldn't you just play Burning Wish --> Scapeshift kill?
How much mana do you usually spend to pump out a GSZ'd rhino or sigarda? 5/6.
When do I want to board in PWs? Against slow/control matchups, especially miracles.
How reliably do we reach 5-6 mana in those very matchups? Very reliably because we have more time.
Did we need a PW that could win without using the battlefield AT ALL against miracles? Yes.
The card feels very, very interesting to me. Garruk and Elspeth rely on a battlefield; Ajani Mentor (the worst PW of choice, imo) is even more obsolete now with new Sorin. This guy can actually close games alone. So does JTMS, but he is blue. And rhinos aren't blue.
E: Lol Ricardio, you were faster but it seems like we think alike. That worries me, I can't deny that :laugh:
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sdematt
Or getting Siege Rhinos altered into Cobras like in Age of Empires II. ;)
I still think rhinos and tusks should be bebop and rocksteady. sigarda can be april O'Neil thrun as master splinter. explorers as the turtles and deathrites as the foot. or some such nonsense...
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
uncletiggy
I still think rhinos and tusks should be bebop and rocksteady. sigarda can be april O'Neil thrun as master splinter. explorers as the turtles and deathrites as the foot. or some such nonsense...
This makes me want to build Junk Nic Fit over BUG. Bebop and Rocksteady.
I wish I could alter
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Sorin seems pretty busted in control MUs. The only problem i see there is that he ain't a creature so you can't cavern it, but other than that, he win without using the battlefield, is extremely hard to remove for most decks, and can remove most other decks win conditions. Plus he win through almost everything, including things like Bridge, Chasm, Energy Field, Solitary confinement, Stasis locks or whatever you want etc...
That traverse the Unvenwald is good but i wouldn't play more than 1 of it. You have issues getting sorceries in your graveyard early on especially. And you don't want to play Lay of the Land.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rubblekill
How much mana do you usually spend to pump out a GSZ'd rhino or sigarda? 5/6.
When do I want to board in PWs? Against slow/control matchups, especially miracles.
How reliably do we reach 5-6 mana in those very matchups? Very reliably because we have more time.
Did we need a PW that could win without using the battlefield AT ALL against miracles? Yes.
The card feels very, very interesting to me. Garruk and Elspeth rely on a battlefield; Ajani Mentor (the worst PW of choice, imo) is even more obsolete now with new Sorin. This guy can actually close games alone. So does JTMS, but he is blue. And rhinos aren't blue.
E: Lol Ricardio, you were faster but it seems like we think alike. That *EXCITES* me, I can't deny that :laugh:
fixed: you are welcome. haha
Also Mentor is not the worst one, h8r, albeit Garruk and Elspeth are much better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Gheizen64
Sorin seems pretty busted in control MUs. The only problem i see there is that he ain't a creature so you can't cavern it, but other than that, he win without using the battlefield, is extremely hard to remove for most decks, and can remove most other decks win conditions. Plus he win through almost everything, including things like Bridge, Chasm, Energy Field, Solitary confinement, Stasis locks or whatever you want etc...
That traverse the Unvenwald is good but i wouldn't play more than 1 of it. You have issues getting sorceries in your graveyard early on especially. And you don't want to play Lay of the Land.
Sorin is a bomb. We either bait with him for something better or bait for him with something weaker. OR WE JUST THERAPY THAT SOB INTO THE STONE AGE!
Traverse would be a 1 or 2 of that you really only want to resolve with delirium. Otherwise, casters beware. that shit aint good.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
What do you guys think of Traverse the Unvenwald as a one of in the sideboard? As our quasi enlighted tutor for our hatebears and karakas? Maybe we even get to play with some tidehollow skuller or sin collector (or mindslicer in the magical Christmas land)? I mean, post sideboard we get thougtseizes to up our sorcery count and surgicals for instants.
Other thing i want to ask is: if both sorin and traverse prove to be worth of the board, will it be the time to give STE the love Arianrhod always advocated for?
Enviado de meu XT1225 usando Tapatalk
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ricardio
Haha you and that damn egg have a weird relationship.
...
You gotta know what they like so you can give the best holiday present since most of us live in magical Christmas land.
The Egg and I have a history together. The oldest list I still have dates back to 2007. I believe the initial list is even older. The whole concept started before Summoner's Egg was printed, just after the release of the Onslaught block (so that's like late 2002, early 2003). In the beginning I made do with Nantuko Husk, Pattern of Rebirth and Symbiotic Wurm until I figured out Patterning into Akroma, Angel of Wrath was an easier way to win games. We've had some fun adventures, one of my favorites being this one from a Legacy Monthly last year (vs. BUG Delver):
Me: "Sac Summoner's Egg to Phyrexian Tower. Trigger?"
Opponent: "Sure"
Me: "Alrighty. *flips card underneath the Egg* There's Emrakul"
Me: "Tap 5 more mana (1 land left untapped), cast Elesh Norn?"
Opponent: Scoops.
That turned some heads, lol. It also had someone crying out they didn't know they'd be playing EDH.
As for the second part - now you know what gets me going, lol.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Nothing impressive here, just sharing the feel good vibes :)
So I finally had the opportunity to check out my local legacy scene in Swansea, Wales at their monthly legacy FNM (I think there's about 4 locations in the UK that regurarly host legacy events and I just happened to move to one of them (still not quite the daily events I was used to in Japan.. :/ ))
They had about 20 players and I crushed, it felt good to play with paper cards again.
2-0 Merfolk (Had to cast the same deed 3 times in G1 before it resolved (thank you ewit (thank you Meren and 9 mana))
2-0 Maverick with Titania (Terrifying but deed still wins)
2-0 Shardless (Deed and Meren recurring Thragtusk with a SoFaI to get past Strixes)
2-0 Parfait (Deeded 5 permanents and equipment beats humility, G2 recurring Rec sage with the two towers beats everything and teeg stops him from casting humility to stop it)
Highlight was casting Siege Rhino game 1 against Merfolk, opponents mouth drops, so I decide to announce it loudly to the store "I CAST SIEGE RHINO" everyone turns in confusion and curiosity. My matches always went long so I always had a crowd to watch Rhino victorys.
Now I'm known as "that new guy that wins legacy with siege rhino" though I'm sure we are all used to similar monikers, I'm just happy to have earnt it again so quickly at my new LGS :P
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jain_Mor
Highlight was casting Siege Rhino game 1 against Merfolk, opponents mouth drops, so I decide to announce it loudly to the store "I CAST SIEGE RHINO" everyone turns in confusion and curiosity. My matches always went long so I always had a crowd to watch Rhino victorys.
Now I'm known as "that new guy that wins legacy with siege rhino" though I'm sure we are all used to similar monikers, I'm just happy to have earnt it again so quickly at my new LGS :P
Yeah, that does sound very familiar. Nice job man!
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Hi fellow Nic Fit people!
I know most of you are on the JUNK version of the deck but I fell in love with this beauty:
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Thragtusk
4 GSZ
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Painful Truth
1 Diabolic Intent
3 Punishing Fire
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Pernicious Deed
2 Liliana of the Veil
22lands
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Phyrexian Tower
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Taiga
1 Badlands
2 Bayou
3 Forest
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
Side:
3 Thoughtseize
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Pithing Needle
1 REB
1 Pyroblast
1 Golgari Charm
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Slaughter Games
2 From the Ashes
This is Matt's deck. I only replaced 2 dragons with Titania which has been amazing and Diabolic Intent which is wonderful here. (searches Liliana, Grove...) Then I cut Thrun going down to 60 and I changed sideboard a bit. Blasts and From the Ashes are a real stars here - FtA brings the lands into play untapped which is amazing!
basic comparasion with junk version:
+
Punishing Fire - makes sure we can kill pws, can grind opponent down without a shadow of doubt, good with lili, you can kill your Veteran!
Liliana - discard + kill; more control
Titania - finishes games on the spot, tutorable, the only realy clock
Huntmaster - almost like and plainswalker - with fire and top in the mid/late game he is an engine on his own
Blasts - improve our control and combo matchups
-
cant outrace opponent in the early game (no rhinos)
dont have Path to Exile so Dark Depths is a problem
cant tutor for art/ench removal
no gaddock
no way how to kill a land
I would love to know what is your experience with the deck and if you have any ideas that can help me. I think it is a wonderful deck for everybody that wants to control and grind out your opponent. :-)
Tomáš
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Koplinchen
Hi fellow Nic Fit people!
I know most of you are on the JUNK version of the deck but I fell in love with this beauty:
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Thragtusk
4 GSZ
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Painful Truth
1 Diabolic Intent
3 Punishing Fire
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Pernicious Deed
2 Liliana of the Veil
22lands
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Phyrexian Tower
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Taiga
1 Badlands
2 Bayou
3 Forest
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
Side:
3 Thoughtseize
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Pithing Needle
1 REB
1 Pyroblast
1 Golgari Charm
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Slaughter Games
2 From the Ashes
Tomáš
I have to admit that's the sexiest Jund list I've seen so far, almost makes me want to try it... Except LotV costs a boat load online and for some reason I can't throw my real ones at my laptop screen and have them appear in my modo account -.-
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
This is something that Tomas and I have been working on...well, him working, me answering questions ;) In case you don't realize, Tomas Vlcek is the basically an Eastern European Shonegger, just not as tall ;)
If you really hate Liliana, change it to 1x Garruk Relentless and 1x Painful Truths.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sdematt
This is something that Tomas and I have been working on...well, him working, me answering questions ;) In case you don't realize, Tomas Vlcek is the basically an Eastern European Shonegger, just not as tall ;)
If you really hate Liliana, change it to 1x Garruk Relentless and 1x Painful Truths.
Lol no one in this thread hates lotv? She's just a real expensive date... Maybe some of us can group share..
I guess as a two of she isn't that integral to the deck. I'll check prices of the other cards later, cheers
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jain_Mor
Lol no one in this thread hates lotv? She's just a real expensive date... Maybe some of us can group share..
I guess as a two of she isn't that integral to the deck. I'll check prices of the other cards later, cheers
Liliana is integral to the Jund fire decks. When I played it I played 3. It is a great proactive 3 drop which is something the deck wants when you have the therapy vet starts and with fire it is the best way to control the game. You can replace it as Matt said with some other options but you will be missing one of the main advantages that the deck gets.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
that jund list looks especially weak to removal. When I played punishing jund fit, I ran 2 huntmaster, 1 prime time, 1 broodmate.
You might want to go down on removal since you have pfire and find yourself more threats so you can win the game in real time.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
http://media.wizards.com/2016/aksdjc...ZfmLqEz6Ay.png
Potentially relevant 3-drop for us. Turns landfall into card draw with excess mana, which is something we're interested in. It will need tested for sure, not confidant in how good it is just from reading the card, but I could see it.
If the image goes down:
Tireless Tracker
2g
3/2
Whenever a land enters the battlefield under your control, investigate.
Whenever you sacrifice a Clue, put a +1/+1 counter on ~.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
@Tireless Tracker
The big problem I see with him is that there are already a lot of good midrangey utility 3-drops that compete. Mainly Nissa, Witness, Courser, sometimes Reclamation Sage, KOTR and Wood Elves. I don't know if he gets the nod over Courser for the maindeck.
Maybe in a landfall-focused shell like the one a few pages back with Mina and Denn, Titania and Courser? The deck kind of wants to overextend its board position, so having fuel to rebuild could be good for the deck.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Arianrhod
http://media.wizards.com/2016/aksdjc...ZfmLqEz6Ay.png
Potentially relevant 3-drop for us. Turns landfall into card draw with excess mana, which is something we're interested in. It will need tested for sure, not confidant in how good it is just from reading the card, but I could see it.
If the image goes down:
Tireless Tracker
2g
3/2
Whenever a land enters the battlefield under your control, investigate.
Whenever you sacrifice a Clue, put a +1/+1 counter on ~.
It feels like some kind of weird annihilator protection. I wish it were more aggressively costed. Feels super meh.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ricardio
that jund list looks especially weak to removal. When I played punishing jund fit, I ran 2 huntmaster, 1 prime time, 1 broodmate.
You might want to go down on removal since you have pfire and find yourself more threats so you can win the game in real time.
Thank you for your reply Ricardo. I must say I only got inot time once and it was not my fault all that very much. This decks takes a few more turns to depelate your oppnent resources and then you go for Meren or Titania. Not just Therapy but lili mean that opponent does not have too many answers. And at first your really kill everything he has and THEN you attack. Meren can bring some dead guys back (Phyrexian Tower helps against Swords to Plowshares a lot) and we still have Eternal Witness backup. Titania often does not ca too much about removal as she just wins. I am happy that all the removal makes all the delver/such matchups really really good. (I know its already good but sometimes even my deck dies to unanswered delver which I hate)
I was only thinking about Dryad Arbor but that is probably not worth it, right?
Did you play some special lands with GTitan? Stronghold? Was it worth it?
I think one of the greatest strenghts of this deck is that we are basicaly BG deck and we can work well without red. (3Fires and Huntmaster who comes in via GSZ anyway)
I dont think it is anything new to you but loose horribly to Cataclysm (Jund more than Junk) and so I started to side in 1 Slaughter Games and is has been incredible.
Tomáš
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sdematt
This is something that Tomas and I have been working on...well, him working, me answering questions ;) In case you don't realize, Tomas Vlcek is the basically an Eastern European Shonegger, just not as tall ;).
I am happy with my 189cm. Most men would be. :P
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Koplinchen
Thank you for your reply Ricardo. I must say I only got inot time once and it was not my fault all that very much. This decks takes a few more turns to depelate your oppnent resources and then you go for Meren or Titania. Not just Therapy but lili mean that opponent does not have too many answers. And at first your really kill everything he has and THEN you attack. Meren can bring some dead guys back (Phyrexian Tower helps against Swords to Plowshares a lot) and we still have Eternal Witness backup. Titania often does not ca too much about removal as she just wins. I am happy that all the removal makes all the delver/such matchups really really good. (I know its already good but sometimes even my deck dies to unanswered delver which I hate)
I was only thinking about Dryad Arbor but that is probably not worth it, right?
Did you play some special lands with GTitan? Stronghold? Was it worth it?
I think one of the greatest strenghts of this deck is that we are basicaly BG deck and we can work well without red. (3Fires and Huntmaster who comes in via GSZ anyway)
I dont think it is anything new to you but loose horribly to Cataclysm (Jund more than Junk) and so I started to side in 1 Slaughter Games and is has been incredible.
Tomáš
Arbor seems good with meren and especially with titania imo. You loop a blocker with meren and with tower (or even deed incidentally) and Titania you can do some nice shenanigans. This relates to jund, but to this you should add the other reasons why arbor is nice to have even outside jund: tricks lilianas edict, gives a free desperate outlet to flashback therapy etc.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Koplinchen
Thank you for your reply Ricardo. I must say I only got inot time once and it was not my fault all that very much. This decks takes a few more turns to depelate your oppnent resources and then you go for Meren or Titania. Not just Therapy but lili mean that opponent does not have too many answers. And at first your really kill everything he has and THEN you attack. Meren can bring some dead guys back (Phyrexian Tower helps against Swords to Plowshares a lot) and we still have Eternal Witness backup. Titania often does not ca too much about removal as she just wins. I am happy that all the removal makes all the delver/such matchups really really good. (I know its already good but sometimes even my deck dies to unanswered delver which I hate)
I was only thinking about Dryad Arbor but that is probably not worth it, right?
Did you play some special lands with GTitan? Stronghold? Was it worth it?
I think one of the greatest strenghts of this deck is that we are basicaly BG deck and we can work well without red. (3Fires and Huntmaster who comes in via GSZ anyway)
I dont think it is anything new to you but loose horribly to Cataclysm (Jund more than Junk) and so I started to side in 1 Slaughter Games and is has been incredible.
Tomáš
Titania and Sylvan safekeeper is probably where you wanna be.
I didn't play arbor in my build solely because I didn't have space.
Grave titan is amazing but you cant tutor him so I ran primeval titan alongside thrun, kessig wolf run and stronghold
Huntmaster is amamaamamazing. I just got a foil German signed one for $50 which I consider a steeeeeeeal!
Another card to jam in your sb: Ruination. totally hilarious in a lot of matchups, like a one sided Armageddon.
Loam might be a good place since getting groves wasted is obnoxious.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ricardio
Titania and Sylvan safekeeper is probably where you wanna be.
I didn't play arbor in my build solely because I didn't have space.
Grave titan is amazing but you cant tutor him so I ran primeval titan alongside thrun, kessig wolf run and stronghold
Huntmaster is amamaamamazing. I just got a foil German signed one for $50 which I consider a steeeeeeeal!
Another card to jam in your sb: Ruination. totally hilarious in a lot of matchups, like a one sided Armageddon.
Loam might be a good place since getting groves wasted is obnoxious.
From the Ashes is strictly better Ruination
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
sdematt
From the Ashes is strictly better Ruination
I had no idea that was a card, Matt, if that is in fact your real name.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Arbor compliments Meren. It enables a lot of techy lines. For example; DRS/VetEx in the yard, Untapped PTower or Therapy in hand/yard and you have an untapped fetch. Drop Meren, fetch Arbor, sac it, pass to eot and flip DRS/VetEx. This enables a very quick launch of Merens capability and puts up a blockade.
Also you can get Arbor down more aggresive so you have something to wall immediatly when you get Meren.
Arbor on its end also enables some 'extra' lines on the early turns. T1 GSZ into Arbor enables some added lines. Also it turns fetchlands into Therapy fodder.
That it dies to Deed can be annoying, but Arbor is always there to die for the cause. But the JUND manabase doesnt feel it is able to support Arbor. Running 4 Groves is really important to get Pfire online more effective. Also i found 4 PFire to be the best so it always shows up and gives the ability to play aggresive on removal. But design space kind of forces it to 3.
Liliana is a musthave in JUND since it also adds reach to get rid of creatures out of Decay and Pfire range. On overall i dislike Deluge since that card hit to much of our own. I played 3 and tried 2. Overall the conlusion was that with 2 it didnt show up often enough.
The list you posted Tomas, feels very soft int the high CMC end of the creatures. Imho this is the weakspot of JUND lists.
PrimeTime is still the best option for the deck, but that would require either Two Tower or a Kessig/P.Tower split.
I still swear by Stormbreath Dragon, especially because Haste and Pro White are so much relevant. 2 copies to compensate the loss of GSZable.
Painful Truth's feels somewhat awkward in this lists. I really want to play some but it doesnt feel right. Not sure how others feel about PTruths in JUND.
I am actually suprised not to find at least 1 Kolghan's Command in the 75. It is a really strong card vs StoneBlade decks. And in other case the card is a 2 for 1. Every mode is/can be relevant.
Lastly, Diabolic Intent might not be to effective since the JUND lists are so light on creatures.
I love JUND lists, but i still need and excuse to run it over JUND 4 Rhino. The latter is soo tuned and plays so smooth.
My question is, what draws you to this list?
Good and nice to see more interest into it.
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ricardio
I had no idea that was a card, Matt, if that is in fact your real name.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JYJhWIwGUw
;)
Quote:
I am happy with my 189cm. Most men would be. :P
I'm happy with my 173cm. Sometimes, it's also about the girth and not just the height ;0
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Re: [Primer/Deck] Nic Fit
