What's the correct number of Dredgers a list should have? I run 12, and I have been having trouble chaining my Dredges...
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What's the correct number of Dredgers a list should have? I run 12, and I have been having trouble chaining my Dredges...
Not in my area. I did not play Dredge for about 1,5 years but I will play it next Saturday in a bigger event. My list will be:Quote:
Originally Posted by joemauer
4 LED
4 Faithless Looting
3 Breakthrough
2 Careful Study
4 GG Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
3 Golgari Thug
4 Putrid Imp
3 Ichorid
4 Narcomoeba
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 FK Zealot
4 Bridge from Below
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Dread Return
4 Gemstone Mine
4 City of Brass
4 Cephalid Coliseum
1 Undiscovered Paradise
I'm not shure about the amount of draw spells needed (Looting, Study, Breakthrough). Last time I' ve played this deck was before Looting was printed.
I'll be playing Dredge at the Open tomorrow, should be fun expecting a lot of RUG and Stoneblade
Most list I've ran across has 11 dredgers. 4 stink 4 troll and 3 thugQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Froggy
Went 3/2 at a local tournament today. lost to a mono black rogue deck and stifle naught.
Good luck! Unfortunately I won't be able to make it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizzeler
Massive update to the primer including information, videos, articles and how to fight hate! (More to come soon.)
My next week's article is going to be an all-out Dredge piece!
Great! Perhaps the primer should briefly mention the "fearless" strategy in the "dredge hit men" section, as a part of the deck's history. Something like:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood
"Fearless" Dredge
For a time, some players (for example Richard Feldman) advocated playing no anti-hate cards in the sideboard, on the basis that (i) bringing in anti-hate dilutes the deck and you can generally win through hate and (ii) the chance of actually running into Leyline of the Void, which you can't win through, is low. This approach has lost support since (i) the printing of Faithless Looting, which makes it more feasible to draw into anti-hate cards and (ii) the printing of Grafdigger's Cage and Rest in Peace, which makes the chance of running into Leyline-level hate much higher.
This makes it a bit easier to understand the lack of anti-hate in some of the older decklists linked at the start of the article.
Maybe there's a bit more room for Cabal Therapy usage discussion. I don't recall where I read it first, but I think a reasonable rule of thumb is "name the worst possible thing that the opponent could feasibly have in their hand and do something with next turn." This tries to avoid the worst possible outcome, and probably means you get another turn, where you might dredge into another therapy, or more brokenness.
That said, these are just suggestions and the primer's looking great.
I believe this was 4eak's advice.Quote:
Originally Posted by sconnell
I've been running 3 therapies as of late and I don't miss the 4th ever. I also wanna say that in my current meta I need to switch up the two artifact hate cards for two ray's.
HAHAHA, I love the way people are arguing that Rest in Peace is the best graveyard hate ever printed. That Dredge is hosed big time, as well as Maverick and other graveyard dependant archtypes.
I've been playing Quadlaser for some months now, and every time I've faced Rest in Peace, either it came down when I had a strong board position (a.k.a 4+ Zombies), or it didn't show up at all. Hopefully people will not stop playing it, since a turn 2 hate isn't going to harm Dredge (maybe on the play).
My latest list:
4 Gemstone Mine
4 City of Brass
4 Cephalid Coliseum
2 Tarnished Citadel
4 Narcomoeba
3 Ichorid
3 Putrid Imp
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Golgari Thug
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Bridge from Below
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Careful Study
4 Breakthrough
4 Faithless Looting
SB: 4 Nature's Claim
SB: 3 Ashen Ghoul
SB: 3 Firestorm
SB: 2 Ancient Grudge
SB: 1 Putrid Imp
SB: 1 Undiscovered Paradise
SB: 1 Ray of Revelation (haven't casted in 3 months, maybe switching for the Firestorm#4)
Seems fine. Haven't fizzeled chain dredging in a good while, and Surgical is my dog. Tormod's and Bojuka Bog gives me a little struggle when I keep slow hands, but they're managable.
People do tend to assume that the sky is falling every time a good new anti-graveyard hate gets printed. I can't imagine they would print a piece of graveyard hate so powerful that nobody would ever play dredge again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandalize
Really good dredge hate would need to:
(i) be cheap - so you have a chance at actually using it before dredge can kill you or therapy it away
(ii) affect the whole graveyard
(iii) affect future dredges and not just the current GY - otherwise dredge can just recover and start dredging again
(iic) affect other decks - because sideboard slots are a limited resource. Ideally, it would be maindeckable.
(v) be accessible - ie the card is tutorable or has some mechanism for accessing it early
(vi) affect stuff in play - to deal with the "4 zombies already in play" type situation
(vii) be resilient - and not easily removed by cards dredge plays or can board in
I don't think (vi) or (vii) will ever actually happen with a card that does many of those other things, so it's probably not realistic to expect a cheap anti-GY card with (v) or (vi).
All anti-GY hate cards are missing some of the above. For example, Leyline of the Void is arguably the cheapest and most accessible piece of hate, but it's very narrow. Tormod's/Bog are wraths, which you can often play around and recover from quickly.
I think you're underrating RiP in u/w, which can be a difficult matchup for dredge. RiP main means you don't have the usual game 1 advantage. Between Enlightening Tutor, Top, Brainstorm and fetches, they have a number of ways to get to RiP early. Force of Will means they have a chance at disrupting your early plays. They also probably have Terminus, which can clean up any stuff you do have in play, locking up the game if they do have RiP. That said, this is just one deck - and it looks like the more miracle-focused u/w decks are becoming more popular than the ones that play RiP.
4 LED
4 Faithless Looting
3 Breakthrough
2 Careful Study
4 GG Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
3 Golgari Thug
1 Darkblast
4 Putrid Imp
3 Ichorid
4 Narcomoeba
1 FK Zealot
4 Bridge from Below
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Dread Return
4 Gemstone Mine
4 City of Brass
4 Cephalid Coliseum
1 Undiscovered Paradise
4 Nature's Claim
4 Ancient Grudge
1 Rey of Revelation
1 Contagion
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Terestadon
1 Ancestor's Chosen
2 Tarnished Citadel
I went 5-1-1 with this list in a 74 players-tournament yesterday.
1. Round: BG goodstuff 2:0
2. Round: Bant 2:1
3. Round: Reanimator 2:1
4. Round: Canadian 2:1
5. Round: 4c goodstuff 0:2
6. Round: Nic Fit 2:1
7. Round: ID
Quarterfinals: Storm 2:1
Semi-finals: Canadian 1:2
List was very stable, only thing I would change the FKZ with the Iona. She is mightier than FKZ.
Got a Revised Tropical Island.
New article about Dredge is up!
Thanks!
Nice one
I m a control player at heart but have been eager to try some sort of combo deck for a while. your first article on manaless dredge pushed me over the edge : cheap combo deck with a totally weird mechanic i love it ;)
Thkx m8
Awesome article Hollywood! Great read!
Thanks, man.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Froggy
It really was just a refresher and more like an introduction for newer players that want to try it out.
Right now, 12. If they print another good one, pretty sure it becomes 16.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Froggy
My 12th right now is Darkblast, and its been pretty sweet. No you won't swords my ichorid, I'm getting tokens dammit. (Among other things)Quote:
Originally Posted by Anusien