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It smells like vendilion clique, thats all I know. It could have applications and be worth a misers in the 75 it is an evasive disruptive zombie after all. I don't think it competes with sculler more compliments it I could see it main deck even over a blood artist if anything.
Vendillion covers all colors though, so it would work even facing blue, red or black. blood artists are relevant if u play carrion feeders. u have to hardcast 3cmc, and in most games we see 3- 4 lands, so u might be tied up for mana early game/at a crucial point. But it's worth a shot, I'll test it and see if it fits
You couldn't reliably cast Clique. There are 5 sources for blue and I couldn't imagine a board state where you could muster double blue and it wasn't a win more situation.
^I'm stupid. Lifebane is a really bad version of Clique. No flash, conditional exile, and no flying. The benefits of him are not worth running him as well.
I do like Pyromancer. I'm thinking of trying him out, but I'm not sure what I would cut for him. I haven't thought it through thoroughly, but maybe Souls?
young pyromancer sounds exactly the same as lingering souls, except for a major difference: Faithless looting.
You would discard lingering but not so for pyromancer.
Advantage? it creates more bodies, and if u were only playing white for lingering souls, then the deck can cut off white to be black, green and red.
Disadvantages: lack of sync with faithless, the elementals dont fly
It has some synergy with Faithless Looting: when you cast and flash back Faithless Looting with a Young Pyromancer in play, you get 2 free Elemental tokens :)Quote:
Originally Posted by DYman
I havent playtested Young Pyromancer against many decks, but after a few kitchen top games with friends, it feels like a win-more card than a real game changer from lingering souls. The elementals are definitely much more in number than the flying Spirits, but the elementals have no evasion, and they just help as a blocker most of the time.
The problem with this deck is, it cant stay on the defense too long, else the opponent starts building up. sneaking a few points in, 4-6 hits from spirits doesnt sound much, but they are flying and it puts your opponent on the clock, maybe waste removals on the spirits. plus u could block flyers.
But let's not go for the strictly speaking argument. perhaps young pyromancer and lingering souls are two different sides of a coin, and it comes down to personal flavour. My preference goes to lingering, i feel it gives me more options and pressures the opponent better
Pretty much. I'm thinking a deck with Young Pyromancer would require a little different build and Souls may not even be the card to replace for Pyro as the 2 have synergy with each other. I mean, why have 2 tokens when you can have 3? I haven't really been looking at this deck much as work and a little bit of a life change have taken over, but I think he is something that should be considered and dismissed only through testing. The testing that should be done are against the decks that we have trouble with first and then see how it does against our good MUs.Quote:
Originally Posted by DYman
Also, you can't eliminate white by simply removing Souls. I can't tell you how much Sculler has helped me with sniping cards with Cabal or becoming an emergency blocker or last point of damage. Also exiling Emmy is nice.
The Scullers were 'A' class exilers for me, i sac it as it enters the battlefield to exile any card (from his hand) that could bounce from the graveyard.
But lately, my meta is filled with tribal and aggro weenies, and racing against them was hard for me. I had no choice but to cut off Scullers for bigger bodies, like putrid leech. I put in rotting rats to increase the zombie count and get discard, as well as graveyard plays. So the only cards being white were lingering souls.
This deck is hard to pilot, but rewarding when done right. More than anything, its not that the deck wins, its how it wins.
I think that's why I keep coming back to this deck;The challenge to win with it is so appealing to me that I just can't leave it. That and there's zombies, lol.
I was offering up life bane mostly for a misers copy in the board to fight decks like maverick but obviously young pyromancer is all the buzz while not fitting in well with what the deck is trying to accoplish via machine gunning zombies and heavy hand disruption
New toy for this deck:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...8&d=1378353740
I think it's worth considering instead of blood artist if u run that
Am I missing something or does liliana fit better in this shell then any other we get more value out of her +1 and md removal has always been my biggest gripe I feel like our combo matchups are already pretty strong minus reanimator aggro has always felt like the weakest our Ca hangs with control but repeating discard can only help there especially against miracles
Also what are thoughts on punishing fire for repeating removal we are already pushing into green for abrupt decay and to a lesser extent deathrite
for the green splash
http://mythicspoiler.com/ths/cards/reaperofthewild1.jpg
I think if anywhere that card might find a home in nic fit its too high at cmc 4 doesn't win the game is not a zombie and doesn't disrupt the opponent if you want to scry viscera seerer is also a sac outlet and it doeant see play
I don't know about this deck, but i've seen Tymaret played in some standard decklists (obviously proxied for testing) and he's really good. His red ability is mostly what made the difference there.
I am new to this deck and want to share my newest decklist:
1 Mutavault
3 Swamp
1 Badlands
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Marsh Flats
1 Scrubland
1 Undiscovered Paradise
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Bayou
1 Plateau
4 Bloodghast
4 Gravecrawler
1 Tymaret, the Murder King
3 Rotting Rats
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Carrion Feeder
1 Bridge from Below
2 Goblin Bombardment
3 Entomb
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Faithless Looting
3 Lingering Souls
2 Liliana of the Veil
2 Thoughtseize
SB: 1 Darkblast
SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Abrupt Decay
SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
SB: 1 Fleshbag Marauder
SB: 1 Oblivion Ring
SB: 1 Golgari Charm
SB: 1 Perish
I tried many variants (without Carrion Feeder, with Lotleth Troll as a discard outlet which can block and regen, with Vengeful Pharaoh as a Tutorremoval and Lategame Bomb etc.) in the last test week, so the current build and sideboard has still some flexslots. I think Carstens is right with his Theros Article (http://www.starcitygames.com/article...-Ambrosia.html), Entomb deserves some Slots. Tutoring for Ghast, Cabal etc is really good. Also a single Bridge from Below is a good way to overwhelm your opponents with a real zombie horde (sick with any sac outlet, good against non exiling removal). The best thing is, that a Deathrite Shaman canīt remove it and you have another way to get also some defense if needed.
I play Rotting Rats instead of Sculler, because it is also a recurring creature, works well with an sac outlet, discard your also your own stuff (Ghast for free, Souls, Bridge etc.) and can block for one turn. Sculler dies to easy in the current meta full with removal heavy decks (if you count the fair ones) and combo can also use bounce/destroy (chain, decay etc.) to get any good card back. Rats working also if your opponent use leyline to prevent discard effects, so you still can get some cards.
Liliana - current version runs 2 (cut 1 Lingering), because she is very versatile and a permanet way to fight some creatures or discard every turn if your opponent plays combo or control.
Tymaret, the Murder King is nice, but only good if you have the entomb toolbox, because he is to manaintensive in multiplies and you rarely need him. But sometimes he can finish if a game goes long enough, sometimes you can use it to block with token against jitte/batterskull and sac it with him in the yard, sometimes you can save a bloodghast or crawler against white exile removal if you also sac it, sometimes he just only blocks some turns, sometimes he is a zombie to return your crawler to the field. Normally Goblin Bombardement is better, but you donīt need the enchantment in multiplies.
Current Manabase contains some budget lands (Blackcleave Cliffs) which works fine so far but can easly switch to Badlands or more Scrublands.
Deck works good so far, but is hard to master (normally i play elves, so i like interactive creature decks without blue). You need some nice sideboard weapons to fight different decks and maybe alternative win conditions if you cant use your graveyard (Confi, Bitterblossom, Planeswalker or even a big weird Beater like Desecration Demon which only fears Swords to Plowshards).
I think you're missing a large part of the reason Sculler is so good - if you play him and then sacrifice him with his trigger on the stack, you can permanently exile cards, similar to playing Oblivion Ring and bouncing it with its ability on the stack in Death and Taxes.
It's really much better than Rotting Rats outside of a few odd edge cases.
Agreed rotting rats is sculler 5-6 if at all. if you dropped white altogether then yea rat away but I would never cut the scullers altogether. Ill be testing my new list tonight on cockatrice tonight ill post some findings when I can get enough games in, I'm probably taking this or dead guy to dc in november so its crunch time
How are Zombies' combo matchups? I have a local meta infested with combo, am a synergy nut, but combo mirrors are kind of boring. This deck seems to have a lot of fun things going for it, so I'm tempted to try.