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Glacial Chams already fits into a land shell. Although Mystic Remora certainly is a powerful interaction as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cire
There's also Phyrexian Unlife.
Edit: And Thing in the Ice. Maybe too slow, but there's also Celestial Convergence.
The first ability is targeted on Crook, as opposed to the Relic.Quote:
Originally Posted by CptHaddock
It's still pretty weak compared to RElic, but it's powerful enough to see play in Standard.
I'm guessing with Thing in the Ice you still have to cast an instant/Sorcery to flip it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
Celestial Covergence is a neat find - but that is still a 7 mana combo that only goes off during your upkeep (? - idk about this, there is no "then" clause" and requires you to have a higher life total.
Unless I'm gravely mistaken, Solemnity does not work with Dark Depths because you never put counters on it, it enters play with these counters already on it...Quote:
Originally Posted by Cire
It would be different if it read: when DD enters play, put 10 counters on it.
You are gravely mistaken. It's no different than why Melira and a persist creature can go infinite with a sac outlet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingo
Doesn't Thing in the Ice require you to remove a counter in order to flip it? It's the 'Then' at the beginning of the last sentence that makes me think this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
Solemnity basically shuts down Counters Company in Modern right? Can't untap with Heritage Druid because adding the counter is part of the cost, plus no way to abuse Walking Ballista since it cannot come into play with counters on it...
This enchantment makes MANY things bonkers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
1. Infinite sac with Undying OR Persist (Redcap, Kitchen Finks, Geralf's Messenger are all wincons)
2. Immune to damage with Delaying Shield, Force Bubble, or similar.
3. No cumulative upkeep costs. (Dystopia, Glacial Chasm, Ancestral Knowledge, Elephant Grass, Energy Storm, Illusionary Terrain, Mind Harness, Mystic Remora, Phyrexian Soulgorger, Sheltering Ancient, Sustaining Spirit, all spring to mind.)
4. Depletion lands
How does Solemnity work with Suspend counters? No effect because they're not in play? (Solemnity does not specify in play though, just says they can't be put on) A R Greater Gargadon might be playable. 1U for the 2/2 flying bouncer? Ith, High Arcanist? Jhoira of the Ghitu?
Nah, they aren't dependent on each other. If they were, the second clause would say, "if you do, then" but it doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew
Hmm, I think it does stop it, but I am not 100% sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew
Oh, and in case anyone wants the actual rule on why DD and Solemnity works it's:
Quote:
121.6. Some spells and abilities refer to counters being put on an object. This refers to putting counters on that object while it’s on the battlefield and also to an object that’s given counters as it enters the battlefield.
It's a card in exile, not a permanent, therefore not affected.Quote:
Originally Posted by morgan_coke
I checked Gatherer for any other details and saw this:Quote:
Originally Posted by H
"4/8/2016 Removing all ice counters from Thing in the Ice some other way will not cause it to transform. You’ll need to cast an instant or sorcery spell and cause its last ability to trigger."
So it is still necessary to cast an instant/sorcery to flip it.
Yeah, I failed to mention that you'd still need to cast something. I was just saying that the transform isn't dependent on removing a counter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew
Boy I hope that white card puts an Enchantress deck back on the map!
Yeah, uh Solemnity seems like a mistake...I can't wait to face the silly maverick decks using Chasm/Depths and Wayfarer/KotR. :confused:
I'm also wondering why Solemnity doesn't hit PWs, seems like they should be tagged by this as well.
To add onto the list of now-sustainable effects Energy Storm, Illusionary Terrain, Infernal Darkness, Ritual of Subdual, Sustaining Spirit, and Wave of Terror.
Tarmogoyf alternatives now include a :3: cost 8/8 and a :1::g: 5/5 trampler.
On the plus side, lands can't gain depletion counters with Solemnity out which makes Ice Age non-basic duals (i.e. Veldt) actually playable....on some budget level. Sorry Tempest, your slow-untap duals are still unplayable.:tongue:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaximumC
Those are 'enters with'. So it's - at minimum- ambiguous.Edit: Apparently not.
Glacial Chasm is the traditional cumulative upkeep option in legacy. Nobody has mentioned Jotun Grunt either.
Solemnity is also strong vs modern affinity.
No, it's not ambiguous. Cards don't enter with counters if you can't put counters on them. See Merlira Pod.Quote:
Originally Posted by rufus
Solemnity prevents infect to both creatures and players right?
Admittedly this card is pretty bad with Wave of Terror :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
Why do you assume that it is different than the interaction with Melira, Sylvok Outcast and persist creatures?Quote:
Originally Posted by rufus
I already cited 121.6 which gives you the correct answer.
It's really not ambiguous.Quote:
121.6. Some spells and abilities refer to counters being put on an object. This refers to putting counters on that object while it’s on the battlefield and also to an object that’s given counters as it enters the battlefield.