Obligatory shitty card creation thread

Tiny Annoying Doodad :1:

Artifact Creature - Doodad

Whenever you shuffle your library, you may have target opponent shuffle his or her library.
Whenever a player shuffles his or her library, Tiny Annoying Doodad deals 1 damage to them.

"I wish I could hate you to death."
1/1

o_O

Deadly Storm of Death :1: :r: :r: :r:

Sorcery

Deadly Storm of Death deals 5 damage to all creatures.



Go go mono red control :laugh:

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Originally Posted by TotallySweet

Tiny Annoying Doodad :1:

Artifact Creature - Doodad

Whenever you shuffle your library, you may have target opponent shuffle his or her library.
Whenever a player shuffles his or her library, Tiny Annoying Doodad deals 1 damage to them.

"I wish I could hate you to death."
1/1

o_O

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Ahahahaha this is freaking sweet! Make it a mythic rare just to spite people even more. This would be such a fun card to build a deck around (along with the other damage-shuffler card). Crappy deck, yes, but so much win.

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Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition

Would certainly make Wild Mongrel playable again... lol...

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No it wouldn't. "Players can't discard cards." is a different statement from "If a player would discard a card, instead they don't." The first stops Wild Mongrel's ability, the second makes Wild Mongrel a Graham's Number/Graham's Number.

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Originally Posted by heroicraptor

No it wouldn't. "Players can't discard cards." is a different statement from "If a player would discard a card, instead they don't." The first stops Wild Mongrel's ability, the second makes Wild Mongrel a Graham's Number/Graham's Number.

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Oops, misread it.

In that case I wouldn't probably run it, for fear of AdN going nuts on me with 4 Black Lotus.

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Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition

Oops, misread it.

In that case I wouldn't probably run it, for fear of AdN going nuts on me with 4 Black Lotus.

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I don't think that works either, since discarding is also part of LED's activation cost. Having it be a mana ability doesn't change the fact that you can't pay the cost for it.

EDIT: "Sacrifice Lion's Eye Diamond, Discard your hand: Add three mana of any one color to your mana pool. Activate this ability only any time you could cast an instant."

So it would be a static ability? Or a replacement effect? If it's a replacement effect LED would still work right?

It's not a replacement, otherwise it would read: If a player would discard a card, he or she doesn't instead.

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Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition

Would certainly make Wild Mongrel playable again... lol...

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I really thought it was sarcasm. I found it funny. I'm sad it wasn't.

And yes, Barook is the best card designer of this thread. I had already noticed it.

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Originally Posted by Maveric78f

And yes, Barook is the best card designer of this thread. I had already noticed it.

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Thanks.

I just realized that the card would also have broken possibilities with blue draw that discards afterwards. Breakthorugh would be basically an Ancestral Recall on steroids.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Thanks.

I just realized that the card would also have broken possibilities with blue draw that discards afterwards. Breakthorugh would be basically an Ancestral Recall on steroids.

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Yeah. Let me take back what I said. You're a bad designer after all ^^.

The wording could be:
Opponents can't discard.
If a spell or ability an opponent controls would cause you to discard a card, instead you don't.

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Originally Posted by Maveric78f

Yeah. Let me take back what I said. You're a bad designer after all ^^.

The wording could be:
Opponents can't discard.
If a spell or ability an opponent controls would cause you to discard a card, instead you don't.

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I don't think it would broken enough to change the effect. Most of those cards aren't good enough for themselves. It would also ruin the entire symmetry thing.

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Originally Posted by quicksilver

It's like llanowar elves, except that it gives 1 mana first turn, 2 mana second turn, 3 mana third turn etc.... While at the same time improving your draws by removing land. If it put it into your hand I would say it would be balanced.

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I actually dont mind if the land (or basic land for balanced purposes) is put into hand. Although if a card like that were to see print, It might enable a new Parfait archetype.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Anti-discard Dude :w::w:
Creature - Human Cleric
Whenever a player discards a card, exile it instead. At the beginning of each player's end step, return those cards to their owner's hand.
2/2

Not sure how to word it exactly, but it should work like this:
Hose discard like Hymn or Thoughtseize on the one hand, but also stuff that requires discard as additional or activation cost (e.g. Survival, LED, etc.).

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Fixed or more broken?

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Originally Posted by TotallySweet

Tiny Annoying Doodad :1:

Artifact Creature - Doodad

Whenever you shuffle your library, you may have target opponent shuffle his or her library.
Whenever a player shuffles his or her library, Tiny Annoying Doodad deals 1 damage to them.

"I wish I could hate you to death."
1/1

o_O

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A card that could break Cosi's Trickster! could...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TotallySweet

Tiny Annoying Doodad :1:

Artifact Creature - Doodad

Whenever you shuffle your library, you may have target opponent shuffle his or her library.
Whenever a player shuffles his or her library, Tiny Annoying Doodad deals 1 damage to them.

"I wish I could hate you to death."
1/1

o_O

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creature ? it should probably be in the rack/vise/doll family.

I mercifully made it a creature so that it would be easier to kill. I mean you can already trinket mage it up...

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Originally Posted by (nameless one)

Anti-discard Dude :w::w:
Creature - Human Cleric
Whenever a player discards a card, exile it instead. At the beginning of each player's end step, return those cards to their owner's hand.
2/2

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More broken and completely misses the point. It should hose discard AND cards that require discard as costs - your card still hoses discard, but makes the latter cards that don't rely on their graveyard even better. E.g. when you discard your dudes to survival, you get also get the discarded creatures back - it would be basically a better Squee. It also breaks Cycling in halfs.

I really don't see why the blue discard-draw is suddenly a problem in a format where you can get two-mana two-card combos that do far more broken things for you.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Anti-discard Dude :w::w:
Creature - Human Cleric
Players can't discard cards.
2/2

Not sure how to word it exactly, but it should work like this:
Hose discard like Hymn or Thoughtseize on the one hand, but also stuff that requires discard as additional or activation cost (e.g. Survival, LED, etc.).

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How about

Eternal Shepherd :w::w:
Legendary Creature - Human Cleric
Whenever target opponent would discard a card, exile it instead. If a spell or ability an opponent controls causes you to discard a card you may return target card from your graveyard to your hand.

At the beginning of your upkeep, if Eternal Shepherd is in your graveyard, you may pay :w::3: to return Eternal Shepherd to your hand.
2/2

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Originally Posted by umbowta

Whenever target opponent would discard a card, exile it instead.

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Whenever an opponent discards a card, exile it instead of putting into it's owner's graveyard.

Is that better?

To the best of my knowledge, "players can't discard cards" works fine as a wording, just like "players can't gain life" (Sulfuric Vortex) or "players can't search their library" (Mindlock Orb).

In all of those cases, effects that cause those actions instead do nothing, and costs involving those actions can't be paid.

For balancing purposes, I'd just add the ability: "Players* can't draw more than one card each turn", unless there is some cheap pseudo-drawing + discard spell I forgot about.

* Could be "you", but the symmetry is more elegant.

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Originally Posted by Nihil Credo

To the best of my knowledge, "players can't discard cards" works fine as a wording, just like "players can't gain life" (Sulfuric Vortex) or "players can't search their library" (Mindlock Orb).

In all of those cases, effects that cause those actions instead do nothing, and costs involving those actions can't be paid.

For balancing purposes, I'd just add the ability: "Players* can't draw more than one card each turn", unless there is some cheap pseudo-drawing + discard spell I forgot about.

* Could be "you", but the symmetry is more elegant.

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So at EOT what do I do with the 8th card in my hand?

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Originally Posted by umbowta

So at EOT what do I do with the 8th card in my hand?

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Not discard it.

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Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition

Not discard it.

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Ya that seems pretty obvious. Clearly this card you make no maximum hand size.

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Originally Posted by johanessen

Whenever an opponent discards a card, exile it instead of putting into it's owner's graveyard.

Is that better?

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No that's not better at all. The act of discarding is part of the activation cost of Survival of the Fittest, which is one of the things we're trying to nerf.

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Originally Posted by Nihil Credo

To the best of my knowledge, "players can't discard cards" works fine as a wording, just like "players can't gain life" (Sulfuric Vortex) or "players can't search their library" (Mindlock Orb).

In all of those cases, effects that cause those actions instead do nothing, and costs involving those actions can't be paid.

For balancing purposes, I'd just add the ability: "Players* can't draw more than one card each turn", unless there is some cheap pseudo-drawing + discard spell I forgot about.

* Could be "you", but the symmetry is more elegant.

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@the bolded portion which I just fully read and comprehended(i'm supposed to be working on a program in CIS lab right now instead of reading the source;-)

Without the second ability, Careful Study and Cephalid Coliseum would be busted in half for sure:smile:

Costs that would cause a player to discard cards can't be paid.
Effects that would cause a player to discard cards don't apply unless they would cause that player to draw cards.

How does that look?

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Originally Posted by Nonex

Costs that would cause a player to discard cards can't be paid.
Effects that would cause a player to discard cards don't apply unless they would cause that player to draw cards.

How does that look?

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Second line looks ambiguous. Does this stop Cephalid Looter from drawing you cards? I don't know if magic cards really check the future for whether you are going to discard after you draw.

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Originally Posted by umbowta

@the bolded portion which I just fully read and comprehended(i'm supposed to be working on a program in CIS lab right now instead of reading the source;-)

Careful Study and Cephalid Coliseum would be busted in half for sure:smile:

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No, they wouldn't. Careful Study would do nothing (you can't draw because you already drew once in your draw step, and you can't discard), and Coliseum would at best cycle if activated during an opponent's turn.

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Costs that would cause a player to discard cards can't be paid.
Effects that would cause a player to discard cards don't apply unless they would cause that player to draw cards.

How does that look?

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Second line would lead to some guru-type questions (eg. what if the effect has a conditional draw) and possibly contradictions too, but it doesn't matter because that text is too cumbersome to see print anyway.

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Originally Posted by Nihil Credo

For balancing purposes, I'd just add the ability: "Players* can't draw more than one card each turn", unless there is some cheap pseudo-drawing + discard spell I forgot about.

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I still have yet to see a blue draw spell that would break the card (e.g. Breakthrough) and doesn't suck on its own in a deck that mustn't rely on the graveyard because you would screw yourself over once the Anti-Discard hits the table. Gaining +2 CA instead +1 CA from stuff like Thirst for Knowledge or turning Merfolk Looter into Archivist doesn't sound exactly broken to me. Making it to a pseudo-Chains of Mephistopheles would be even a buff to it (and self-restriction only is just plain dumb).

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Originally Posted by umbowta

No that's not better at all. The act of discarding is part of the activation cost of Survival of the Fittest, which is one of the things we're trying to nerf.

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Why would you nerf one of the two main aspects the card is intended to hose? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Barook

I still have yet to see a blue draw spell that would break the card (e.g. Breakthrough) and doesn't suck on its own in a deck that mustn't rely on the graveyard because you would screw yourself over once the Anti-Discard hits the table. Gaining +2 CA instead +1 CA from stuff like Thirst for Knowledge or turning Merfolk Looter into Archivist doesn't sound exactly broken to me. Making it to a pseudo-Chains of Mephistopheles would be even a buff to it (and self-restriction only is just plain dumb).

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It makes Telling Time really good.

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Originally Posted by Pastorofmuppets

It makes Telling Time really good.

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http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/cards/15357.jpg

Now you're just trolling.

Edit: A try to fix the 'broken':

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Players can't discard cards.
Spells and abilities which would cause a player to discard can't be played.

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Are there any (static) effects that wouldn't be covered with the second sentence? I think with this (or a similar wording), it would come closer to the original intend of the card.

I just realized that not all effects limit themselves to discard or discard and draw. I guess something like "Effects that would only cause a player to discard cards don't apply" would be more appropiate.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Why would you nerf one of the two main aspects the card is intended to hose? :confused:

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:confused: The card is intended to nerf Survival. If the controller of Survival can't activate it because discard is replaced with exile then Survival has been efectively nerfed...or hosed, whatever word you want to use. They pay green, exile a card, and don't get to search...does that work with the rules? Would the card be exiled or could they even attempt to activate it all with the exile replacment efect in all instances of discard? I'm no Judge.

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Originally Posted by Nihil Credo

No, they wouldn't. Careful Study would do nothing (you can't draw because you already drew once in your draw step, and you can't discard), and Coliseum would at best cycle if activated during an opponent's turn.

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You must have replied before I edited my post mere minutes later. see underlined below

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Originally Posted by umbowta

@the bolded portion which I just fully read and comprehended(i'm supposed to be working on a program in CIS lab right now instead of reading the source;-)

Without the second ability, Careful Study and Cephalid Coliseum would be busted in half for sure:smile:

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[EDIT]

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Originally Posted by Barook

Spells and abilities which would cause a player to discard can't be played.

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Ooohh. I think you might have it there.

With Barook's improved wording...and sans the no max handsize thing.

Eternal Shepherd :w::w:
Legendary Creature - Human Cleric

Spells and abilities which would cause a player to discard can't be played.

At the beginning of your upkeep, if Eternal Shepherd is in your graveyard, you may pay :w::3: to return Eternal Shepherd to your hand.
2/2

The way Eternal Shepherd is written right now applies only to effects (by forbidding to pay their costs), while saying nothing about costs that imply discarding. Survival of the Fittest is unaffected.

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Originally Posted by Nonex

The way Eternal Shepherd is written right now applies only to effects (by forbidding to pay their costs), while saying nothing about costs that imply discarding. Survival of the Fittest is unaffected.

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This. You would be still able to to discard cards to pay costs which shouldn't work under the intended use.

Besides, white utility bears don't have recurring abilities, legendary or not.

To update the old thing:

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Noble Mindguard :w::w:
Creature - Human Cleric
Players can't discard cards.
Spells and abilities which would cause a player to discard one or more cards can't be played.
2/2

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I don't think that second ability can be printed under the rules: using the effects of a spell or ability as a condition for playing it leads to trouble. Consider this card:

Ad Hoc
Sorcery
Reveal the top card of your library. Discard cards equal to its converted mana cost.

If the top card of your library has CMC zero, Ad Hoc can be played. If not, it can't. But since the library is not a public zone, this can't be determined until Ad Hoc resolves. There is no way to know if playing Ad Hoc is a legal action.

Something that would definitely work is "Spells or ability with the word 'discard' in their text can't be played", but that's ugly as hell.

The question is how to word it to make it work under the rules. I just added the "one or more cards" to match the wording with other cards. Would the more general wording work?

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Originally Posted by Nihil Credo

Something that would definitely work is "Spells or ability with the word 'discard' in their text can't be played", but that's ugly as hell.

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The problem with this wording is that it even prevents cards like Wild Mongrel from being played.

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Originally Posted by Barook

The question is how to word it to make it work under the rules. I just added the "one or more cards" to match the wording with other cards. Would the more general wording work?

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No, because discarding zero cards does not count as discarding (like a BoP dealing 0 damage does not deal any damage and charge up Jitte), thus Ad Hoc should still be legal to play if and only if the top card has CMC zero.

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The problem with this wording is that it even prevents cards like Wild Mongrel from being played.

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Good point. It would have to be 'Instants, sorceries, and abilities', I guess - wouldn't cover replacement effects like Chains of Mephistopheles, but the first ability takes care of them. Still unprintably ugly, though.

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Originally Posted by Nonex

The way Eternal Shepherd is written right now applies only to effects (by forbidding to pay their costs), while saying nothing about costs that imply discarding. Survival of the Fittest is unaffected.

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Yeah, you're right. I'm out of ideas for that one.

The main question remains if blue draw would be really that powerful to screw over a simple and elegant design.

You could also try to make it simply unattractive by a adding some kind of retarded drawback like:

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If an effect would cause a player to discard a card, each opponent of the effect's controller may draw a card.

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Something like this would open some interesting design space, similar to Aven Mindcensor, too:

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'Insert fancy name here', the Mindguard :w::w:
Legendary Creature - Human Cleric
Flash
Players can't discard cards.
If an effect would cause a player to discard a card, each opponent of the effect's controller may draw a card.
2/2

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This way, it would punish discard spells even more, e.g.:

Opponent: Hymn
You: Response, Mindguard, drawing 2 cards.