[Deck]BUx Reanimator

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

My 4 color list came from Stryfo, so all credit to him. He and I we're testing it before that spike from the pros that one event.

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Fair enough, all credit to where credit is due. Since you are going as deep as this splash might you want to add some extra red cards like faithless looting to the mix?

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Originally Posted by Cpt-Qc

Just a standard list. I meant Collective Brutality, not the abomination that is counterbalance :P

With more instant and less permanent hate being in the meta in the form of surgical/faerie, I feel hapless is not a bad choice. I wouldn't hate having something to bring back when people surgical in response to exhume and It can potentially bin another creature in response if you are lucky. It also makes a fine protection against sac effects and blocks one attack. Also daze is noticeably worse than hapless will ever be if the game goes long.

The problem with Jace is it's so damn slow sometimes and it sucks even more in the face of drs.

Misdirection is just the fifth force for counter wars. Sometimes you get lucky and can use it on ancestral, StP or AD but most of the time it's just a counter. It gets sided out in any fair matchup.

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Fair enough on the point of baby Jace, he is a bit slower. I have worked under the assumption that UB reanimator doesn't worry about reanimating until T4/5. Not that you wouldn't take the T1 if it were handed to you on a silver platter, just that hand sculpting is kind of THE THING that blue does. Between that and black shaping our opponents hand with discard I had the (probably wrong) view that the mindset was of a grind/control with a combo finish.

And that is at least in part why I am on this particular thread asking/stating what may be obvious to the rest of the group, I am trying to learn the archetype more thoroughly beyond my own biases (red T1 or bust).

I like Hapless Researcher because I never want to lack the option to put something into my graveyard whenever I want. I like the safety of opening up land into Hapless, it's so much safer then going straight for the Careful Study or the end their turn Entomb. For those early clutches, being able to spread 3 mana over 2 turns is great, opening Daze proof Reanimate or the more expensive options right on curve. Past that everything is just fun to do. Blocking and sacing to turn off Lifelink never gets old, helping to take the burden off Grave Titan against Liliana is good, and watching my opponent's sink into despair as the lone Elesh Norn suddenly raise an army of mighty Human Wizards to slaughter them is only the best thing ever. But they're not Careful Study, and I'm not advocating comparing them. You use them to dig only in desperation. The real comparison is against Ponder in my opinion. They're both safe T1 plays that set up for a high impact T2. Ponder gets you what you need and doesn't let on to the tricks you're about to pull. But it doesn't actually do anything, and that was the issue I was having most. Since winning off two cards in hand isn't unusual, burning that starting hand size for value isn't the worst thing to do, so I don't feel hard up for cantrips.

I'm comfortable with using the red just for Izzet Charm in the main. The Sulfur Elemental in the side was a recent addition because my regular store is small and there is a guy on D&T that I can never avoid. Plus putting EE on 4. Beyond that I get the most mileage as decoys for Wasteland to keep the Underground Seas safer; which is a pretty inefficient use of a dual land, but my list is for fun first (I mean, we're talking about Reanimator here). I'm always apprehensive about keeping creatures in the graveyard over a turn's time, and overloading on Careful Study effects can put a little too much pressure that will disrupt my ideal rate of play. So for that reason I don't play Faithless Looting. I'm always on the lookout for rogue sideboard cards that red opens up though. You're right that my ideal is a consistent T3 with protection or backup over trying to go under their curve on T1/T2.

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

I like Hapless Researcher because I never want to lack the option to put something into my graveyard whenever I want. I like the safety of opening up land into Hapless, it's so much safer then going straight for the Careful Study or the end their turn Entomb. For those early clutches, being able to spread 3 mana over 2 turns is great, opening Daze proof Reanimate or the more expensive options right on curve. Past that everything is just fun to do. Blocking and sacing to turn off Lifelink never gets old, helping to take the burden off Grave Titan against Liliana is good, and watching my opponent's sink into despair as the lone Elesh Norn suddenly raise an army of mighty Human Wizards to slaughter them is only the best thing ever. But they're not Careful Study, and I'm not advocating comparing them. You use them to dig only in desperation. The real comparison is against Ponder in my opinion. They're both safe T1 plays that set up for a high impact T2. Ponder gets you what you need and doesn't let on to the tricks you're about to pull. But it doesn't actually do anything, and that was the issue I was having most. Since winning off two cards in hand isn't unusual, burning that starting hand size for value isn't the worst thing to do, so I don't feel hard up for cantrips.

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You actually got to block and sac to a lifelink creature in legacy? I honestly can't remember the last time I saw one such creature! Edit: I'm dumb, I wrote this late at night and when I woke up I remembered there is a certain germ that qualifies.

I want to try them but the main package is black so the only possible cuts are blue. I guess I could also free 1 slot by getting rid of the 3 petals and upping land count to 17 but it seems weird. Otherwise I need to drop all dazes or some amount of ponders. I guess you're in favor of dropping ponders if you have researcher in.

But yeah I understand why you don't like cantrips. Personally what I really like about them is the ability to find relevant sideboard cards in G2-3 so that's why I like 2 ponders at least.

Went 6-1 to make Top 8 of the EE satellite at Bearded Dragon today.

My decklist should be published this weekend, here is what I played against

Miracles 1-2
Burn 2-0
Mono R Sneak and Breach 2-1
Death and Taxes 2-0
Storm 2-1
Sultai Delver 2-0
Death and Taxes 2-0

Top 8 lost to Elves 2-1, he had a karakas in the board to answer Elesh Norn (and naturally drew it)

The D&T matchups were complete Grave Titan blowouts. If anyone else has any questions, I will answer them for you

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Originally Posted by nyrambler

Top 8 lost to Elves 2-1, he had a karakas in the board to answer Elesh Norn (and naturally drew it)

The D&T matchups were complete Grave Titan blowouts. If anyone else has any questions, I will answer them for you

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That's too bad, elves is such a good matchup for us too!

Also I keep Titan in post board since he's not bad but I haven't had much luck with him against DnT. Did it not just get plowed on the spot?

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Originally Posted by Cpt-Qc

That's too bad, elves is such a good matchup for us too!

Also I keep Titan in post board since he's not bad but I haven't had much luck with him against DnT. Did it not just get plowed on the spot?

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What's funny is the first D&T match, after Grave Titan hit, he took a turn off to cast a Phyrexian Revoker... I thoughtseized him and he had a swords (that I took)

He drew it 3 turns after in my win and in match

Hello, everybody!

I've been reading here a bit lately, and I finally managed to complete the deck about a week ago. Took it for a spin today at the local and went 3–1 on my first outing with the deck! I should've taken notes, so this might be a bit patchy and/or inaccurate:

R1: Goblin Charbelcher (2–1)
—G1: I think he kept a slow hand. I landed Iona on Red and he couldn't get to critical mass.
—G2: I mulliganed a hand with countermagic but no lands for a three-lander with a Pithing Needle and no countermagic and lost to a T1, LED-less Charbelcher.
—G3: IIRC, I managed to snipe his combo and play out Jin-Gitaxias. He made Goblins a turn or two later, but I threw down Elesh Norn. He couldn't recover.
R2: Token White Guys (2–1) [NOTE: This seemed like a cool brew, but I forgot to take up the pilot on checking out his list.]
—G1: Kept a bad hand. He beat me down.
—G2: Fast Griselbrand. Force ate Swords. Force ate Path. Griselbrand ate Swords. Iona on white got there.
—G3: Funny how a white creature is so good against white.
R3: Maverick (0–2)
—G1: I think I kept a slower hand here, and I think more experience will be better for this matchup in the future. Opponent landed Old Thalia and Scavenging Ooze, and I didn't quite get there.
—G2: This one was a tad closer, but Scooze did its work.
R4: Grix Delver (2–0)
—G1: Though my opponent managed a quick start, a countermagic battle over reanimation worked out in my favor, and I got there with (I think) a Griselbrand and a Grave Titan. For the record, this was the first time in my life I got to Force a Force by pitching a Force.
—G2: Nearly got Macabre-d out on this one. Fortunately, I managed to rebuild over the next couple of turns. A timely Daze saved me.

I was running fifteen lands, three Lootings, three Dazes, three Petals, two Ponders, and two Show and Tells (maindeck!) on a slightly-modified AnT manabase. I've got a lot of questions, seeing as I've not played the deck much at all until today (babby's first reanimans). Apologies if I'm retreading old ground!

—The jury seems to be out on Faithless Looting. I'd been pretty torn over whether it's a good card to run, but today it felt great. One of my biggest concerns in pre-match testing was the lack of discard outlets if one runs only Careful Study without Lootings or Researchers. Is there something else that's comparable? With maindeck S&T, is so much discard necessary? I've considered more Ponders, but they felt really slow; and Breakthrough, but I don't like paying 4 just to keep Force and Other Card around. I've seen a list with a similar (though probably better) manabase on MTGTop8 running Dack Fayden.
—I'm only running two basics, Swamp and Island. I've also only got two Underground Seas (with singletons Volc and Badlands). I have to confess that my means dictated my list to some extent, but I'm still curious: does this seem sufficient? I didn't feel choked at all except against Mav, and I think that was more a lack of land generally than it was a lack of specific sources.
—If we're worried about Abrupt Decay against our Animate Dead, why not use Life/Death? Life-loss is bad, but it's efficient and sidesteps other people's stuff, unlike Show and Tell and Exhume. There's some corner-case synergy with Elesh Norn here, too.
—Daze felt really hit-and-miss. I'm not interested in running a fourth because of how situational I found it to be. Is it worth it to keep it in the main? If people have been replacing Daze slots with other control or something else (acceleration? Cantrips?), what's been working?
—Is Dark Ritual pretty much exclusively a component of Tin Fins?
—My sideboard's a disaster. Was putting it together last night for the tournament and the power went out. Figured that between picking through cards by candlelight and drinking everything that might go off, I'd rather do the latter. So what cards have people been using that are totally solid and 100% super-effective (i.e., "60% of the time, it works every time")? I know Abrupt Decay and Echoing Truth sound crucial. Some discards, Pithing Needle, and Massacre also seemed good choices, so I threw those in. Anything specific that's missing?

I'm not expecting definitive or comprehensive answers, but I'd love for people to chime in about what's good and what isn't. Discussions foster innovation, after all. Thank you all in advance!

Congrats nyrambler on the finish. I was there as well to write a report, but my day didn't go well and I finished poorly. Didn't get much useful data either, felt like the deck wasn't shuffled properly. Way too many 1 land solid hands, but no further lands and a few brainstorm locks leads to my death. Just feeling the tempo loss after missing usable top decks for 4 turns in a row knowing by the time you caught back up their hand is stacked with responses is disheartening. It just wasn't running all cylinders this week, not sure why.

Interesting to see so much Reanimator there though, every game I was seated at a table also playing some version. Seemed like there was a chorus of "end of turn Entomb, untap, Reanimate?" at times. Hoping some other reports come out to spur some discussions of the deck in the current environment.

Ronald, you're running both red and blue? What about green?
I agree that just 4 Careful Study isn't enough to put our creatures in the yard. Options beyond that are Faithless, Hapless & Izzet Charm. Collective Brutality and stuff like Heir of Falkenrath work as well, but both their discards are cost based, so the effect can be responded to by messing with your graveyard and just just by countermagic. Brainstorm + Entomb works in a pinch as well. Thoughtseize targeting yourself is the fringe example.
Abrupt Decay on Animate Dead isn't a major priority, we've got so much else to worry about. Most decks only run 1-2 copies after maxing out on Reanimate and Exhume. The life loss isn't nothing, and increasing the number of cards that hit us that hard isn't appealing. I would enjoy seeing you play Life with Elesh Norn out though. I would like that very much.
Daze is always hit or miss. But it's the safest generic card for game 1 when your opponent doesn't know what you're on. After that though, I side mine out for Abrupt Decay immediately in game 2. If we're thinking about bringing in counters from the sideboard, Daze shouldn't be one of them. Stuff like Misdirection and Flusterstorm are better options after you know what your opponent is doing.
If you're just doing the OG 2 color list, it's not unusual to see Dark Ritual somewhere in the list. The only real sideboard strategies then are S&T, bouncing their hate or going superfast with DR.

Most sideboards get built with 2-3 additional creatures that are matchup specific enough to not make it into the main deck. Cards that win on their own, but not against enough of your expected matches to want them game 1. The bulk of the sideboard is anti-hate hate cards. Stuff you bring in to kill the stuff you know they're bringing in. Casting a wide net is good here; people run removal like Abrupt Decay, bounce like Echoing Truth or Chain of Vapor, wipes like Massacre or Engineered Explosives, or just go around it all with Show and Tell. Lastly it gets filled out with some hate cards of your own, usually generic stuff like Pithing Needle, extra discard and sometimes graveyard hate of our own. Faerie Macabre is always a fun one to use and then also reanimate. Can be used to save yourself from Surgical Extraction as well.

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Congrats nyrambler on the finish. I was there as well to write a report, but my day didn't go well and I finished poorly. Didn't get much useful data either, felt like the deck wasn't shuffled properly. Way too many 1 land solid hands, but no further lands and a few brainstorm locks leads to my death. Just feeling the tempo loss after missing usable top decks for 4 turns in a row knowing by the time you caught back up their hand is stacked with responses is disheartening. It just wasn't running all cylinders this week, not sure why.

Interesting to see so much Reanimator there though, every game I was seated at a table also playing some version. Seemed like there was a chorus of "end of turn Entomb, untap, Reanimate?" at times. Hoping some other reports come out to spur some discussions of the deck in the current environment.

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Thanks... There was another U/B deck that had a win and in on the live stream but got leyline'd by Eldrazi (the Eldrazi deck wound up splitting the finals with Joe Brennan)

There was a couple R/B there as well while I was scouring the area, def at least 5 or 6 flavors of reanimator, in a 102 person field. I was the one in a Brock Lesnar shirt and Rangers hat.

List hasn't gone up yet but here it is:

4 Polluted Delta
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Underground Sea
1 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
2 Swamp

4 Careful Study
4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Force of Will
3 Daze
1 Show and Tell
3 Thoughtseize
4 Entomb
4 Reanimate
4 Exhume
4 Lotus Petal

3 Griselbrand
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Grave Titan
1 Tidespout Tyrant

Sideboard
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Fatal Push
2 Pithing Needle
2 Duress
1 Thoughtseize
1 Massacre
1 Aetherling
1 Sire of Insanity
1 Coffin Purge
1 Show and Tell

PirateKing, thanks for getting back to me!

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Ronald, you're running both red and blue? What about green?

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I've got a Tropical in the maindeck and a Bayou in the sideboard for my Decays. Do people tend to run other green cards? My experience with Xantids and Carpets in Storm was that they were extremely underwhelming, but Storm doesn't pack maindeck countermagic, so maybe I'm not giving those cards a fair shake.

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

I agree that just 4 Careful Study isn't enough to put our creatures in the yard. Options beyond that are Faithless, Hapless & Izzet Charm. Collective Brutality and stuff like Heir of Falkenrath work as well, but both their discards are cost based, so the effect can be responded to by messing with your graveyard and just just by countermagic. Brainstorm + Entomb works in a pinch as well. Thoughtseize targeting yourself is the fringe example.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't it also be a problem if the discard were part of the spell's effect? Can't the opponent, say, Extirpate us after a Looting resolves when we move to cast another spell? Apologies if I'm being dense; it's late/early here.

I really like Izzet Charm as a card: it's versatile, and all three modes do stuff our deck would want it to do. It feels a bit precarious to me, though, because it requires two colors. Have you been using it lately? If so, how's it been performing, and what did it replace in your older lists?

Have you/has anyone tried cards like Putrid Imp? I haven't, but it just occurred to me as another discard outlet with which I'm familiar.

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Abrupt Decay on Animate Dead isn't a major priority, we've got so much else to worry about. Most decks only run 1-2 copies after maxing out on Reanimate and Exhume. The life loss isn't nothing, and increasing the number of cards that hit us that hard isn't appealing. I would enjoy seeing you play Life with Elesh Norn out though. I would like that very much.

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One more reason to play green! :D

Thanks for the feedback re: Animate Dead. I might put one or two back in my main in place of Show and Tell. I'm finding that I cast S&T rather rarely at this juncture. I might need to run a fourth Petal to really get any mileage out of it as anything but Force-fodder.

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Daze is always hit or miss. But it's the safest generic card for game 1 when your opponent doesn't know what you're on. After that though, I side mine out for Abrupt Decay immediately in game 2. If we're thinking about bringing in counters from the sideboard, Daze shouldn't be one of them. Stuff like Misdirection and Flusterstorm are better options after you know what your opponent is doing.
If you're just doing the OG 2 color list, it's not unusual to see Dark Ritual somewhere in the list. The only real sideboard strategies then are S&T, bouncing their hate or going superfast with DR.

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All this sounds pretty much like what I was thinking. Thanks for the info!

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Most sideboards get built with 2-3 additional creatures that are matchup specific enough to not make it into the main deck. Cards that win on their own, but not against enough of your expected matches to want them game 1. The bulk of the sideboard is anti-hate hate cards. Stuff you bring in to kill the stuff you know they're bringing in. Casting a wide net is good here; people run removal like Abrupt Decay, bounce like Echoing Truth or Chain of Vapor, wipes like Massacre or Engineered Explosives, or just go around it all with Show and Tell. Lastly it gets filled out with some hate cards of your own, usually generic stuff like Pithing Needle, extra discard and sometimes graveyard hate of our own. Faerie Macabre is always a fun one to use and then also reanimate. Can be used to save yourself from Surgical Extraction as well.

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Haha, I knew I was forgetting something crucial! Ran out the door and forgot my Archon and Archetype at home.

I'll start tinkering with some added sideboard disruption. Thanks again for all the feedback!

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Originally Posted by nyrambler

I was the one in a Brock Lesnar shirt and Rangers hat.

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:laugh:The Suplex City shirt? We'll have to meet up for beers after the next event around here. Nice list, very classic, good to see you don't have to get super spicy to find success. What were the matchups you brought in Fatal Push? Just DRS based decks or we're you using them to buy time against aggro decks as well?

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Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce

PirateKing, thanks for getting back to me!

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Most often, the graveyard is the least safe place to store our creatures. So being part of the cost gives us an uncounterable way to pitch our creature, but I'm not sure in what situation that would be applicable. I'm just seeing it though the eyes of giving your opponent more options, more information when they have priority. If you cast Collective Brutality and pick two modes, discarding Griselbrand, you pass priority to them with a spell on the stack and a juicy creature in the graveyard. Compare that to casting just Careful Study, all they know is I'd like to draw 2 and discard 2. Maybe I'm digging, maybe I'm binning a creature to go off. They have to decide to counter or not based on less information than Collective Brutality. And if they do counter Careful Study, then I'd feel better not passing the turn with the creature in the graveyard. It's as if I want to advise considering using the Escalate function as a "fringe use" up there with Thoughtseizeing yourself, which sounds totally ass backwards, but in a lot of instances I want to use it, it doesn't work. I can't kill a DRS and bin a creature. I can't rip a Surgical effect out of their hand and bin a creature. Only time it does work is when they're on a single counterspell, you'll get to bin the creature, force them to counter or lose it either way, then the path is clear to reanimate. Which is on par mana-wise with Duress into Careful Study into Reanimate, so I'm fine with that. But all other uses become really expensive for what you're doing. I actually like Collective Brutality better in my Storm lists, opening up lines with Infernal Tutor that would normally be dead without a LED. But then I don't really care what I'm discarding, it's just flak that I can't cast that turn to get Hellbent.

Green is pretty much just to power out Abrupt Decay. I also run that single Pernicious Deed, but other Storm-y sideboard cards like Swarm and Carpet of Flowers don't really get used here. The red for Izzet Charm isn't really a problem, sometimes you do have to be nimble with your fetches and how you tap, but if they weren't red duals they'd be a basic Island and Swamp, so everything would still apply there. Honestly, their main function ends up being pitching to Force and cards to swap out in sideboard games. It's rare that I'm actually casting them, but what keeps bringing me back is whenever I do, it's always super useful. EOT burning their DRS, EOT drawing and discarding to set up the reanimate, or rarest is actually mana leaking someone. But my games do tend to grind, so it's happened before. I'm not so much advocating for them as I am explaining my own preferences.

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

:laugh:The Suplex City shirt? We'll have to meet up for beers after the next event around here. Nice list, very classic, good to see you don't have to get super spicy to find success. What were the matchups you brought in Fatal Push? Just DRS based decks or we're you using them to buy time against aggro decks as well?

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It basically replaced disfigure for me. Obv bring it in vs DRS decks but it's fine against any Delver strategy. Also great against Death and Taxes, Burn... any deck that has a creature that can hinder your process

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Most often, the graveyard is the least safe place to store our creatures. So being part of the cost gives us an uncounterable way to pitch our creature, but I'm not sure in what situation that would be applicable. I'm just seeing it though the eyes of giving your opponent more options, more information when they have priority. If you cast Collective Brutality and pick two modes, discarding Griselbrand, you pass priority to them with a spell on the stack and a juicy creature in the graveyard. Compare that to casting just Careful Study, all they know is I'd like to draw 2 and discard 2. Maybe I'm digging, maybe I'm binning a creature to go off. They have to decide to counter or not based on less information than Collective Brutality. And if they do counter Careful Study, then I'd feel better not passing the turn with the creature in the graveyard. It's as if I want to advise considering using the Escalate function as a "fringe use" up there with Thoughtseizeing yourself, which sounds totally ass backwards, but in a lot of instances I want to use it, it doesn't work. I can't kill a DRS and bin a creature. I can't rip a Surgical effect out of their hand and bin a creature. Only time it does work is when they're on a single counterspell, you'll get to bin the creature, force them to counter or lose it either way, then the path is clear to reanimate. Which is on par mana-wise with Duress into Careful Study into Reanimate, so I'm fine with that. But all other uses become really expensive for what you're doing. I actually like Collective Brutality better in my Storm lists, opening up lines with Infernal Tutor that would normally be dead without a LED. But then I don't really care what I'm discarding, it's just flak that I can't cast that turn to get Hellbent.

Green is pretty much just to power out Abrupt Decay. I also run that single Pernicious Deed, but other Storm-y sideboard cards like Swarm and Carpet of Flowers don't really get used here. The red for Izzet Charm isn't really a problem, sometimes you do have to be nimble with your fetches and how you tap, but if they weren't red duals they'd be a basic Island and Swamp, so everything would still apply there. Honestly, their main function ends up being pitching to Force and cards to swap out in sideboard games. It's rare that I'm actually casting them, but what keeps bringing me back is whenever I do, it's always super useful. EOT burning their DRS, EOT drawing and discarding to set up the reanimate, or rarest is actually mana leaking someone. But my games do tend to grind, so it's happened before. I'm not so much advocating for them as I am explaining my own preferences.

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Ah, ok! Cool stuff! I noticed what you were saying about Deathrite after I posted my last message, but I also think you're right about how/when we show our opponents our gameplan. I'm not running Brutality at the moment, primarily because I don't own it, but also because it looked a tad on the clunky side to me. I'm used to cmc-1 enablers, so it's been an interesting change of pace to be running two-drops with less acceleration than I ran in AnT. That's partially why I was reluctant to try Izzet Charm, but if it hasn't been causing problems, it sounds like it's worth a try.

Regarding other green cards, I think the list I saw with Carpets was a bit idiosyncratic. I guess my personal experience and your info are in concordance. Thanks again!

Regarding Fatal Push, from what I've seen of the card in other decks, it looks like a good thing to have. I've not gotten a ton of mileage out of it as a singleton in other decks, but I think it's definitely an upgrade to Disfigure.

Hiya. I'm thinking of picking up Reanimator on MtGO, but... question. Which variant is better equipped for the current metagame - UB or BR?

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Originally Posted by Zifbox

Hiya. I'm thinking of picking up Reanimator on MtGO, but... question. Which variant is better equipped for the current metagame - UB or BR?

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RB is putting up more results than UB. Doesn't necessarily mean that UB is worse in the meta game, as players who have UBg reanimator have the lands to swap to better placed decks like Noble BUG, BUG delver and Shardless BUG, whereas RB players commonly are locked into using that deck.


EDIT: sorry didn't notice you said MTGO. Ignore what I said!

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Originally Posted by Zifbox

Hiya. I'm thinking of picking up Reanimator on MtGO, but... question. Which variant is better equipped for the current metagame - UB or BR?

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You'd have to enlighten me as to the differences between the metas, but in general, would you say you 1) gotta go fast -or- 2) gotta go blue?

What's the current thinking regarding what creatures to use against Lands at the moment? Nobody plays Lands at the local, but I'm wondering whether there's an accepted go-to for us right now. Been debating between Ashen Rider, Archetype, and Inkwell lately, and I was wondering how they've been treating people.

Hope I'm not retreading old ground again!

Any land-based deck (be it Lands, Post, or Turbo Depths) generally lose on the spot to Tidespout Tyrant.

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Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce

What's the current thinking regarding what creatures to use against Lands at the moment? Nobody plays Lands at the local, but I'm wondering whether there's an accepted go-to for us right now. Been debating between Ashen Rider, Archetype, and Inkwell lately, and I was wondering how they've been treating people.

Hope I'm not retreading old ground again!

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If you run it in the side, Blazing Archon will stop them from winning the game until you find either Inkwell or Tidespout. Inkwell will go through Maze of Ith, assuming they don't have their spaghethti monster out yet.

Thanks for the input, everybody!

A corollary: It seems like the hexproof creatures aren't really played much at this point. I'm wondering whether people feel like they're essential, and in which matchups. I was thinking an Inkwell or an Archetype would be nice against hatebears and Lands, but I don't see a lot of those on the lists that have been placing lately.