4 Card Blind

3. Wrath of Pie: Mutavault, Swamp, Bitterblossom, Stinkdrinker Bandit

1. Asthereal (TO): Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy LL
2. GoblinSmashmaster: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Gemstone Mine, Barren Glory LL
4. alphastryk: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory, Pact of Negation WW
5. H: Swamp, Molten Slagheap, Avatar of Woe, Augur of Skulls WW
6. Tylert: Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy LL
7. Moosedog: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory LL
8. FTW: Swamp, Duress, Encroach, Vebulid DL
9. silkster: Subterranean Hangar, Rackling, Rain of Tears, Unmask DL

4w2d = 14 points

Should have just gave in to playing Trophy.

H: Swamp, Molten Slagheap, Avatar of Woe, Augur of Skulls

1. Asthereal (TO): Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy
I can't beat Trophy. 0-6

2. GoblinSmashmaster: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Gemstone Mine, Barren Glory
I can discard Glory. 6-0

3. Wrath of Pie: Mutavault, Swamp, Bitterblossom, Stinkdrinker Bandit
I really should have picked something other than Avatar, probably. 0-6

4. alphastryk: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory, Pact of Negation
I think I can win here, since Augur can't really be Pacted and I can make you discard Glory. 6-0

5. H: Bye, myself.

6. Tylert: Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy
Still can't beat Trophy. 0-6

7. Moosedog: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory
I can still discard Glory. 6-0

8. FTW: Swamp, Duress, Encroach, Vebulid
I can't beat Encroach. 0-6

9. silkster: Subterranean Hangar, Rackling, Rain of Tears, Unmask
I think I can win both here, because you must Unmask the Auger, or else I can make you discard the Rackling. If you just do nothing, you can't race, I don't think. Might have to think about this more. Maybe 6-0.

24, which doesn't seem terrible, considering how low-effort I went. Bogardan Hellkite likely would have been better though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie

Should have just gave in to playing Trophy.

---

Or played Sphere of Resistance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by H

9. silkster: Subterranean Hangar, Rackling, Rain of Tears, Unmask
I think I can win both here, because you must Unmask the Auger, or else I can make you discard the Rackling. If you just do nothing, you can't race, I don't think. Might have to think about this more. Maybe 6-0.

---

Keeping Rain of Tears after Augur double discard should force the draw. Bigger question is if Rackling can deal 20 before you cast Avatar of Woe, otherwise silkster chooses that for Unmask and makes you activate Augur for the draw.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie

Keeping Rain of Tears after Augur double discard should force the draw. Bigger question is if Rackling can deal 20 before you cast Avatar of Woe, otherwise silkster chooses that for Unmask and makes you activate Augur for the draw.

---

Hmm, yeah, I mean, I need 7 turns of putting counters, then a turn to cast it and 4 turns to win, unless I chipped in two with Auger somehow. So, if I cast Auger on turn 2, that is casting Avatar on turn 10? Rackling comes down on turn 5 and deals 2 on turn 6, going to 3 damage once I cast the Avatar. So, that is 5 turns at 2 damage, which is 10, but actually it could attack as well. Yeah, I need to model it most probably, but I think I just lose the race.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by H

Hmm, yeah, I mean, I need 7 turns of putting counters, then a turn to cast it and 4 turns to win, unless I chipped in two with Auger somehow. So, if I cast Auger on turn 2, that is casting Avatar on turn 10? Rackling comes down on turn 5 and deals 2 on turn 6, going to 3 damage once I cast the Avatar. So, that is 5 turns at 2 damage, which is 10, but actually it could attack as well. Yeah, I need to model it most probably, but I think I just lose the race.

---

Avatar of Woe doesn't need to race. It has "T: Destroy target gameplan."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTW

Avatar of Woe doesn't need to race. It has "T: Destroy target gameplan."

---

Ha, oh yeah, the whole reason I ran the card, only to forget it, :cool:

I still think I'd need to model it when I have a bit more time, but yeah, then I think the math doesn't work in favor of Rackling.

MoosedogSmashmaster Results for Round "Beat Barren Glory"

1. Asthereal (TO): Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy
Trophy beats Barren Glory 0-6

2. GoblinSmashmaster: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Gemstone Mine, Barren Glory
That's me!

3. Wrath of Pie: Mutavault, Swamp, Bitterblossom, Stinkdrinker Bandit
Bitterblossom didn't get the memo 6-0

4. alphastryk: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory, Pact of Negation
Pact is awkward 4-1

5. H: Swamp, Molten Slagheap, Avatar of Woe, Augur of Skulls
Augur beats Barren Glory 0-6

6. Tylert: Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy
Trophy beats Barren Glory 0-6

7. Moosedog: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory
Barren Glory beats Barren Glory 3-3

8. FTW: Swamp, Duress, Encroach, Vebulid
Duress beats Barren Glory 0-6

9. silkster: Subterranean Hangar, Rackling, Rain of Tears, Unmask
Unmask beats Barren Glory 0-6

Total: 13 points

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTW

I'm surprised no one played
Phyrexian Dreadnought, Vision Charm (Mirage)
Pact of the Titan, Pact of the Titan, Angel's Grace (Time Spiral)
They race Barren Glory.

---

In fact, barren glory is not the best deck and both those decks that race barren glory will lose to discard, land destruction and removal sometimes.
By the way the better barren glory deck could be:
Lotus bloom, lotus bloom, simian spirit guide, barren glory. Guide is an alternate win con vs discard, can be removed from hand freely and pays for taxes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tylert

In fact, barren glory is not the best deck and both those decks that race barren glory will lose to discard, land destruction and removal sometimes.
By the way the better barren glory deck could be:
Lotus bloom, lotus bloom, simian spirit guide, barren glory. Guide is an alternate win con vs discard, can be removed from hand freely and pays for taxes.

---

SSG is better vs discard, although I think Gemstone Mine is better vs taxing effects, as it can be used to pay an extra mana for each of the deck's 3 spells if needed against a sphere, while the SSG can only pay for a single tax.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by alphastryk

SSG is better vs discard, although I think Gemstone Mine is better vs taxing effects, as it can be used to pay an extra mana for each of the deck's 3 spells if needed against a sphere, while the SSG can only pay for a single tax.

---

true :)

Correction to the Assassin's Trophy vs Pact of Negation matches. You can still cast Dreadhorde Invasion on turn 2. Pacting that would lose the game long before Barren Glory comes down. Just don't cast the Assassin's Trophy, and the amassed zombie will win.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTW

I'm surprised that never came up in our block tour. The discard deck for that round was something durdly with Parallax Nexus and slow lands.

---

Mind Swords DID come up in Block Tour. That's actually where I found it. But you might have missed it because it didn't win the round. It didn't even get 50% of the total score. It lost to Fountain of Cho + Blinding Angel. And it lost to Saprazzan Skerry + Avatar of Will. Unfortunately, I talked myself into thinking that Masques storage lands would be popular, but it was actually 2-land decks that were in style. I still think it's a good round for me, but I had the perfect 16-0 (Duress would have gotten me).

I also thought Meddling Mage would be a good play, either with Path to Exile or Stormscape Apprentice, but that's neither here nor there.


Me: silkster: Subterranean Hangar, Rackling, Rain of Tears, Unmask

1. Asthereal (TO): Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy
Discard the only threat to draw. 2 points

2. GoblinSmashmaster: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Gemstone Mine, Barren Glory
Discard wins. 6 points

3. Wrath of Pie: Mutavault, Swamp, Bitterblossom, Stinkdrinker Bandit
Rackling and Mutavault are both 11 turn clocks (since the Bandit stays in hand and protects from damage). But on the draw, I can block. 4 points

4. alphastryk: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory, Pact of Negation
Turn 1 discard is good. 6 points

5. H: Swamp, Molten Slagheap, Avatar of Woe, Augur of Skulls
Avatar comes down turn 9, which is one turn too fast for me to win. I can draw in several ways though. 2 points

6. Tylert: Forest, Swamp, Dreadhorde Invasion, Assassin's Trophy
More draws. 2 points

7. Moosedog: Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Lotus Bloom, Barren Glory
Discard win. 6 points

8. FTW: Swamp, Duress, Encroach, Vebulid
Encroach versus play the land and Unmask the threat. WL, 3 points.

31 is not quite as good as 48 45, but still good. If I had realized how attractive the 2 mana cards of Assassin's Trophy and Bitterblossom/Dreadhorde, I would have been more confident in Mind Swords. I thought people would see the Mind Swords deck in the Block Tour and tech against it, so I was too afraid to play it. Silly me. This would have been a really good round the get the messaging system wrong!

Math against H:
The Rackling upkeep damage can be treated as main phase damage on my turn, since even killing it on upkeep doesn't stop it. When I'm on the play,
5 turns of nothing,
Turn 6 -> 2 dmg
Turn 7 - 6
Turn 8 - 10
Turn 9 - 14 (then Avatar is cast)
Turn 10 - no attack, 3 upkeep damage isn't enough.

So I draw instead.

Looking far into the future, how do people feel about Addle and Agonizing Remorse in the Medallion round? It's always awkward to have discussions about bans when Asthereal has already submitted a deck.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silkster

Correction to the Assassin's Trophy vs Pact of Negation matches. You can still cast Dreadhorde Invasion on turn 2. Pacting that would lose the game long before Barren Glory comes down. Just don't cast the Assassin's Trophy, and the amassed zombie will win.

---

Man, my deck keeps being worse. I'll update.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoblinSmashmaster

MoosedogSmashmaster Results for Round "Beat Barren Glory"



Total: 13 points

---

I believe you're right our games play out the same.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silkster

Mind Swords DID come up in Block Tour. That's actually where I found it. But you might have missed it because it didn't win the round. It lost to Fountain of Cho + Blinding Angel.

---

Huh, so it did. I only paid attention to the top 2-3 decks from each Block and completely missed that one in the middle of the pack.

Mind Swords underperformed because of so much Fountain of Cho and Subterranean Hangar, leaving dangerous 2-card hands, while Nether Spirit can't block flying threats. But those Storage lands only saw so much play because it was Masques block, so Mind Swords didn't shine as much as it should. In a bigger meta most storage decks are weak to fast interaction and LD from other blocks.

Quote:

---

I also thought Meddling Mage would be a good play, either with Path to Exile or Stormscape Apprentice.

---

My 2nd choice deck was Meddling Mage + Path to Exile.

I went with Duress because turn 2 Meddling Mage OTD is too slow to stop some early combos (even though none of these saw play):
Angel's Grace + Pact
Ensnaring Bridge + Scalding Tongs
Dreadnought + Vision Charm
Reanimate

Duress also handles Dark Ritual stuff, including Mind Swords. But Mage is better against things like creature ramp.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silkster

Looking far into the future, how do people feel about Addle and Agonizing Remorse in the Medallion round?

---

At that point we need to look at Mesmeric Fiend and Brain Maggot and any other 1B Thoughtseize effect.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTW

At that point we need to look at Mesmeric Fiend and Brain Maggot and any other 1B Thoughtseize effect.

---

Those might be slightly more answerable by removal, but it's worth talking about. I think there are only 5 cards that become one mana discards. I'm okay with banning them: Addle, Agnoizing Remorse, Mesmeric Fiend, Brain Maggot, and Lay Bare the Heart.

Kitesail Freebooter is basically just Duress.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FTW

Mind Swords underperformed because of so much Fountain of Cho and Subterranean Hangar, leaving dangerous 2-card hands, while Nether Spirit can't block flying threats. But those Storage lands only saw so much play because it was Masques block, so Mind Swords didn't shine as much as it should. In a bigger meta most storage decks are weak to fast interaction and LD from other blocks.

---

Absolutely. Mind Swords immediately struck me as the clear fore-runner for the week, but I had to be a dumb-dumb and think too much. Even worse, I somehow glossed over Assassin's Trophy and it didn't make it into my metagame list, which would have given me reason to believe that 2-land decks would be popular.

Preliminary standings for round 9 below.

Notes:
- H had himself winning against silk, but I think silk is correct to chalk up two draws, as he can Unmask the Avatar, after which H needs to use Augur to get rid of the Rackling or he just dies.
- Also, H had himself losing twice to FTW, but in fact OTP he wins as he can drop the non-basic first and be protected from Encroach, after which the Avatar inevitably drops and murders Vebulid.
- Moose hasn't posted his scores yet, so I used his opponent's scores to count his. If his opponents made errors, I'll adjust afterwards.

Rank. Player: score - SP
1. Asthereal (TO): 37 - 4,6
1. Tylert: 37 - 4,6
3. silkster: 32 - 4
4. FTW: 30 - 3,8
5. H: 23 - 2,9
6. Wrath of Pie: 14 - 1,8
7. GoblinSmashmaster: 13 - 1,6
7. Moosedog: 13 - 1,6
9. alphastryk: 2 - 0,3

This means Wrath still holds the lead, but the top-3 is now within 0.3 points of eachother. Exciting stuff!

Standings for the season:
1. Wrath of Pie: 30,1
2. Tylert: 30
3. FTW: 29,8
4. Moosedog: 25,6
5. silkster: 25,2
6. Asthereal (TO): 24,5
7. alphastryk: 21,1
8. H: 16,7
9. GoblinSmashmaster: 16,1

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by silkster

... Mind Swords immediately struck me as the clear fore-runner for the week, but I had to be a dumb-dumb and think too much. Even worse, I somehow glossed over Assassin's Trophy and it didn't make it into my metagame list, which would have given me reason to believe that 2-land decks would be popular.

---

As a wise man once said: "Over-thinking, over-analysing separates the body from the mind."

Anybody opposed to adding Mind Swords to the banned list?

Also, excellent suggestion to look at additional bannings for round 12 before I send myself my deck. :cool:
What do you guys think? Ban all five Thoughtseize-like cards that were suggested?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Asthereal

Notes:
- H had himself winning against silk, but I think silk is correct to chalk up two draws, as he can Unmask the Avatar, after which H needs to use Augur to get rid of the Rackling or he just dies.
- Also, H had himself losing twice to FTW, but in fact OTP he wins as he can drop the non-basic first and be protected from Encroach, after which the Avatar inevitably drops and murders Vebulid.

---

Hmm, yes, I think you are right on both accounts there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Asthereal

Anybody opposed to adding Mind Swords to the banned list?

---

Yes, I was hoping to catch everyone off guard once with Bayou, Young Wolf, Mind Swords, Snuff Out before you realized Mind Swords was conspicuously not banned with the Hymn effects :(

But now the Sacred Cat is out of the bag.