[Deck] Reanimator

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Originally Posted by moseby

I always like to ensure that I can bounce what I need to, My board will include 2-3 pieces of bounce. I prefer wipe away as it precludes your opponent from responding to it.

Honestly if you are worried about Jace or karakas get inkwell or emperial archangel.

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That....those fatties are used for a reason.

I still think that the blue 10mana-man is overrated and mediocre.
elesh norn is a decent target, but not everly awesome.

Because it actually only kills elves better than another target (iona could be to late, but that definately kills elves as well)

Blazing archon wins the fish/iona/early inkwell/sphinx

And goblins have stingscourcher (they should!) and then they just bounce elesh norn, build more goblins and beat the rest of your health down.

Sphinx/akroma/iona are good targets as well.

Elesh Norn is better than Blazing Archon. Archon is easy to remove, and once they kill it, they can swing in with everything for the win. Elesh Norn wipes their board against most aggro decks (Goblins, Merfolk, Elves) so even if they manage to get rid of it, they are still sitting there with an empty board giving you more than enough time to win.

I'm surprised no one is playing Terastodon. It's one of my favorites, it can deal with any annoying permanents like Ensnaring Bridge, Humility or Karakas, or you can simply sac three lands to get yourself 18 points worth of power on the board, which usually wins the game the next turn.

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Originally Posted by Clark Kant

I'm surprised no one is playing Terastodon. It's one of my favorites, it can deal with any annoying permanents like Ensnaring Bridge, Humility or Karakas,

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You need to clear some things up to yourself regarding the rules of the game, since Terastodon can't destroy Humility.

Thats not the point, the point is that it's extremely flexible.

You can even use it to mana screw your opponent by blowing their land, useful vs high tide and control decks.

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Originally Posted by Clark Kant

Thats not the point, the point is that it's extremely flexible.

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Is it that hard to say "my bad"?

A playtest friend and me have been thinking of playing something like this:

4 Sphinx of the Steel Wind

4 Entomb
3 Careful Study

4 Reanimate
4 Exhume

4 Force of Will
4 Mental Misstep
4 Thoughtseize

4 Brainstorm
4 Preordain
2 Personal Tutor
2 Lim-Dul's Vault
1 Turbulent Dreams

4 Underground Sea
4 Polluted Delta
2 Island
2 Swamp
4 Darkslick Shores

The main idea is that we need a critter that seals the game quickly and efficiently. Iona is failing to do so (my area has plenty zoo players with GSZ, Knights of R and Karakas). With the loss of M.Tutor I think we need to be fast and sometimes you cannot choose what you want with careful studies, so we tried to pack only 4 Sphinx and 3 Inkwell Leviathans. I adapted the list after that. The sinergy between Sphinx and M.Misstep is great, it protects her from the most dangerous removal: paths and swords, and the lifeloss can be quickly ignored with the lifelink ability.

Some card choices:
3x Careful and not 4: With only 4 critters, you won't discard them too often and they generate card disadvantage.
4x Thoughtseize: Get rid of a PTE or STP if you don't have a MM, then get online your Sphinx for a happy ending.

We still are testing Preordain over Ponder and must try Dazes again. Also T.Dreams may be cut.

The deck is capable of getting a Sphinx online as soon as turn 2, but in order to protect her, you need that MM or Thoughtseize. We're working to improve the deck just evolving from this point and the same basic idea.

Comments or thoughts?

how about things that Iona randomly stops, storms and combos

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Originally Posted by jcsy

how about things that Iona randomly stops, storms and combos

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You don't want to randomly stop a combo, you want to resiliently win. With Sphinx online, Storm must go off within 2 turns or less. Unanswered, she just need 3 turns to GG and every turn (yours) she will force opp to create a +3 storm account than a turn before. Certainly, Iona could stop Show&tell combos, Spiral tides and screw Painters, but that's why we are still testing this. I just shared it with you and everyone willing to have a try is really welcome, as well as your questions and comments.

My question is: is this path a good choice?

Not enough targets. With this list you may want to run 4 personal tutor.

Based on what I ran into this past weekend at a local tournament. I would run the following dudes

3 Sphinx of the steelwind
1 Iona
1 Blazing archon - Dudes stops everybody.
1 inkwell
1 emperial archangel
1 more dude

I hated Jin Gitaxis, his body is way too small, and simply didnt get things done when I needed him to. I also had Elesh Norn, Plantinum Emperion, and 1 more Iona in the board, Maybe I could move Elesh to the main.

Terastadon, sometimes he is good, some times he is bad, some times he is a terrible target. There are very few times I see him and think he is the best target I could have.

I would also strongly consider sundering titan again, as lots of decks are running atleast 3 colours, and I have noticed a significant decrease in the number of stifles out there,possibly due to the prevalence of mental misstep

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Originally Posted by moseby

3 Sphinx of the steelwind
1 Iona
1 Blazing archon - Dudes stops everybody.
1 inkwell
1 emperial archangel
1 more dude

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It has been my experience that running 8 dudes can be too many. I prefer to run 7. But I guess that might be a matter of just player preference. I have been running the following 7:

3 Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite

Yes, I am a JGCA user but you could fold some of those into your sphinx count. Honestly, JGCA really helps many of our poor matches. If you can keep him alive until the end of turn you are set because you should be drawing counter magic and binning more dudes for reanimation. He has worked for me wonderfully. I will say he doesn't single handedly close the game like some of our other threats, but he is a more universal target and thereby gives the deck more consistency. Not many decks can withstand an end of turn two or three discard down to zero. I used to run both Blazing Archon and Empryial Archangel but have found them to both be underwhelming in many matches. I know many people are not sold but Elesh Norn really fills both of these slots. She can keep dudes from attacking you by nuking small dudes and she also makes the ones that don't die easy to pick off while both attacking and defending. I am not sure what further creature I would add as the "1 more dude."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by moseby

I hated Jin Gitaxis, his body is way too small, and simply didnt get things done when I needed him to. I also had Elesh Norn, Plantinum Emperion, and 1 more Iona in the board, Maybe I could move Elesh to the main.

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I can't argue that you get a small body with JGCA. He works out pretty well with Elesh (try main boarding her) in play though. His effect is nuts. You get 7 cards a turn and thereby are going to be able to bin more guys to reanimate. I don't know what to say because I am running it and loving it in nearly every MU.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by moseby

I would also strongly consider sundering titan again, as lots of decks are running atleast 3 colours, and I have noticed a significant decrease in the number of stifles out there,possibly due to the prevalence of mental misstep

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This is a pretty solid idea. I think I would have to agree that many people have removed stifles from decks and he could be a great target these days.

Hello, I've been reading this thread from long ago, and finally I've become a member to discuss. I've been playing reanimator since the banning of Mystical tutor (with very good results), and yesterday I won an 29 people (exams, you know ¬¬) tournament here at my city, and I wanna share experiences with you people.

Here the report (in spanish).

And here the Decklist (and top8).

Comments? :D

@ Alsan

Your list is nearly identical to mine. The notable difference being that I run Thoughtseize over Hapless Researcher. I have Hapless Researchers and have been considering testing them; however, I have not gotten around to it yet. What is your take on this? Why do you prefer Hapless Researcher?

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Originally Posted by Sturtzilla

@ Alsan

Your list is nearly identical to mine. The notable difference being that I run Thoughtseize over Hapless Researcher. I have Hapless Researchers and have been considering testing them; however, I have not gotten around to it yet. What is your take on this? Why do you prefer Hapless Researcher?

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Easy:

1- It's blue.
2- Blocks the first dude of zoo AND lackey.
3- Vs Landstill nullifies the standstill (in minor ways) and hits 2-3 times (the ones that Sphinx does not 6+6+6+2)
4- Digs into your deck as careful 5-7 (we have no preordain nor ponder)
5- Takes removal (Innocent blood, diabolic edict, warren weirding...)
6- Have a Wild Nacatl with Elesh norn is cool xD.
7- It helps dodging sb in the Exhume plays in G2 and G3 (tormod's or relic on battlefield, creature on graveyard, put an Exhume on stack, the opponent removes your graveyard, ok, the old mand sacrifices himself happily to put anothe dude on the graveyard, the Exhume resolves.)
8- Mental misstep > Tseize, in G2 Dispel is better too.
9- I don't wanna play tapped. An untapped Usea is Daze+Entomb+Mental, if tapped, it's only a counterwall, but not a menace.
10- I've one of them foil japanese xD.

First, I'm happy to see you post here as you've been having great results with different reanimator lists.

About Hapless I would add "11- Very good against dredge".

I would have 2 questions for you :

1) You're running a 11 discards / 9 reanimate / 12 creature shell (I count Entomb as a creature). Theoretically, with 32 slots for the combo, a 11 / 10 / 11 shell would be more optimal. I see Toni ran a 10 / 10 / 12, cutting 1 Hapless. Did you try all these combinations and feel the 11/9/12 was the most appropriate?

2) Hasn't been Show and tell difficult to cast with 16 lands?

Thanks

Thank you :D

I agree with the eleventh term, is very very good against dredge. Now, answers:

1- I've been testing the 11/10/11 combination, but was 4 entomb 4 fatties 3 Jin, and had games where I couldn't find the Jin-gitaxias with careful or hapless, so I returned to the 11/9/12. Besides, I prefer having more ways to put the creature in the graveyard than to reanimate it, because a hand with 2-3 reanimation spells and none creatures or discards, is worse than one with 2-3 discards and none reanimation, 'cause the discards dig the deck to find the reanimate.

2- Yes. I didn't cast S&T in whole tournament, it is a slot that I'm still testing. It's only against Leylines of the void or Zoo, to avoid Faerie Macabre, but I don't think is the best way.

We're testing 2 changes (now that I have them foil xD): -1 Daze MD +1 Misdirection, -1 EE Sb +1 Misdirection. It is very good against Hymn to tourach and Inquisition of kozilek, it is the fifth Fow, the fifth Misstep against Swords, and sometimes redirects reanimate (as the exhume play I told before, but with many more cards and targets).

First of all, congrats again, Alsan!

I wasn't sold to Jin-Gitaxias at first glance, but now I see it clearly. It's the same idea/purpose I was aiming at: an almost-automatic choice to seal games, plus you only need to protect it for half a turn. Then fill your hand with protection and empty opp's. Your list is the (perfect) development of that simple idea. Far better from what my teammates and me were thinking about.

Did you miss any MD bouncer or utility?

Thanks again! (I'm in the break to lunch, so I can answer quickly, haha)

I dind't miss neither a bouncer or utility MD, 'cause only Leyline of void avoids the counterwall, no one plays Tormod's maindeck and Jin-Gitaxias solves many problems. Maybe Terastodon has to be maindeck to fight a turn 1 Karakas, but Iona is really good against monocolored decks, Sphinx wins all zoo/goblins/elves/random aggro games, Archon stops merfolks/emrakul/Ichorid/stoneforge decks, and inkwell races emrakul and blasts countertop decks, although is the less important.

Do you think we could cut Inkwell MD to Terastodon, and win Emrakul with Blazing archon, 2-3 fatties +3 elephants at time and only one alpha-strike?

Thanks for the answers.

About the creatures, I would another Sphinx before the Terastodon. Sphinx is pretty overwhelming in the current metagame :
- As you stated it is good against zoo, goblins, elves, random aggro
- It's also good against Team America / BUG control (it's go for the throat-proof as you mentionned it in your report)
- It is karakas-proof
- Not that bad against dredge / TES-Empty the warrens

I would run a 4 Jin, 2-3 Sphinx, 1 Archon, 0-1 Iona MD with Terastodon, Iona (1-2), Archon and maybe 1 more Sphinx SB. I do like the idea of reducing variance towards creatures.

Could you put a decklist of how would you play the deck? I promise to test everything :D (and like the reducing variance of creatures, that's because 4x Jin).

(Anyway, love the throat-proof, haha, we play T2 a lot and always ask if the creature we're gonna kill has throat or not before GftT it)

My latest list is close to yours with the following changes :
- 1 Daze
- 1 Creature
+1 Land
+ 1 Animate dead

I'm running a 3 Iona, 3 Sphinx, 1 Archon creature package. I wasn't sold on Jin, however with all the hype around it I will try it.

The additional land serves my SB plan, as I usually side in 3 Show and Tell + 3 Thoughtseize / Duress for 3 Hapless + 2 Animate dead + 1 Exhume (keeping that way a 11/11/11 Discard/Reanimate/creature).
I do like Show and tell as it dodges graveyard hate. Plus, as entomb it's 2 pieces of the combo in 1 card.
However it might be way less powerful with Jin as a Jin on turn 3 or 4 seems not that good.

Also, if you want to test many things :
- even if Hapless is great, a UBr shell running Firestorm as discard outlet #9-11 might be worth the investment of a third color : have you already tried it?
- White splash was for Enlightened tutor?