The casting is part of the resolution of Electrodominance, so if you Chant in response to casting Electrodominance, he indeed won't be able to cast the card.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
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The casting is part of the resolution of Electrodominance, so if you Chant in response to casting Electrodominance, he indeed won't be able to cast the card.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
LLofLifeforce works for both players. So you should be 3-3 vs Gob (mage naming predator) and 3-3 or 1-4 vs Serguei.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal
How does he win vs Gob?Quote:
Originally Posted by dte
T1 A: Mage naming Predator. [A=16] Can't cast Death's Shadow yet (14 life is too high).
T1 G: 1/1 Ooze. Pass [G=18]
T2 A: Still can't cast Shadow. If Mage attacks, Frilled Mystic flashes in to block and kill it, so that's a bad idea. Pass
T2 G: Ooze gets +1 from Leyline. 2/2. Don't attack.
...
T20 G: Ooze is 20/20. Trouble.
Ooze grows +1 per turn from just Leyline, +2 if Predator is out too. Both Ooze and Predator are problems and Mage can only stop 1. That's how I lose to this too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FTW
If gob reveals leyline, play mage (predator), counterflux, veto, then a shadow 9/9.
Gob lay dudes, can let one attack in but is at 1 life. Then mage can block mystic or ooze if any attacks come in.
If no leyline is revealed, mage on predator wins it as well.
Edit: missed the you don't control.
So mage on predator. If G plays ooze, counterflux plus dovin, then shadow 9/9 should do the same.
Interesting, I didn't consider you could still cast counters on uncounterable spells just to burn life. But passing the turn due to Counterflux's "you don't control" could be enough of a difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by dte
T1 A: Mage on Predator. (Can't counterflux or Veto it) Pass. [A=16]
End step flash in Mystic [G=12]. A does Counterflux + Veto [A=6]
T1 G: Attack with Mystic. Mage can't block yet or Predator stops Shadow. Cast Ooze [G=10, A=3]
T2 A: Cast 12/12 Shadow [A=1]. (If Mage attacks, Ooze + Mystic attack through Shadow for lethal)
T2 G: 2/2 Ooze. Pass
Now if Shadow ever attacks, Mystic chumps and 3/3 Ooze attacks back. Mage is forced to block, then G casts Nightveil to stop Shadow while Ooze grows to 20/20.
If Shadow doesn't attack, Ooze grows to 20/20.
G wins.
If A doesn't cast Veto, being ahead 4 life with a smaller Shadow could make enough of a difference for Shadow to race.
But what if G doesn't play Ooze or Mystic? With 0 plays A cannot cast the counters or make a Shadow.
If Meddling Mage ever attacks, G flashes in Frilled Mystic to block & trade. A will get Shadow but G will get Predator + Ooze to win.
So Mage can't attack the empty board.
DL 1-4?
Wow! Never realized that, Thanks for the notice bcz I grab an additional win :DQuote:
Originally Posted by dte
Leyline of Lifeforce, Nightveil Predator, Frilled Mystic, Bloodhall Ooze
vs
Esper charm, Funeral Charm, Funeral Charm, Frilled Mystic
Leyline in play
Upkeep Esper Charm, if you keep non flash creature, I follow with funeral charm discard. If you keep mystic, double funeral charm will kill it and I can play my mystic safely
Leyline in hand
Upkeep I try to make you discard your hand, If you counter with Mystic, I counter with my Own
WW
1. Asthereal (TO): Meddling Mage, Dovin's Veto, Counterflux, Death's Shadow LL
2. Wrath of Pie: Ancient Tomb, Loxodon Smiter, Loxodon Smiter, Bloodline Keeper WW
3. RoosterCocoa: High Market, Nether Spirit, Counterflux, Spell Queller LL
4. PJim: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Electrodominance, Wheel of Fate LL
5. GoblinSmashmaster: Leyline of Lifeforce, Nightveil Predator, Frilled Mystic, Bloodhall Ooze LL
6. alphastryk: Leyline of Sanctity, Dark Ritual, Wheel and Deal, Aura Mutation DD
7. jhhdk: Raven's Crime, Howltooth Hollow, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, Force Spike ME
8. FTW: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Frilled Mystic, Narset's Reversal LL
9. Reeplcheep: Blood Celebrant , Aetherflux Reservoir, Pact of Negation , Cavern Harpy WL
10. mattamort: Esper charm, Funeral Charm, Funeral Charm, Frilled Mystic DD
11. dte: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, esper charm, fork LL
12. silkster: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Atraxa, Praetors' Voice, Abrupt Decay LL
13. Tylert: Nicol Bolas, Dragon God, Orim's chant, Orim's chant, The tabernacle at pendrell vale LL
14. Serguei: Cunning Nightbonder; Spell Queller; Frilled Mystic; Leyline of Lifeforce LL
15. maxx!: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Esper Charm, Mardu Charm LL
16. H: Chancellor of the Dross, Smallpox, Phyrexian Obliterator, Counterspell LL I'll never empty his hand before Phyrexian Obliterator pummels me.
Looking at this season and last season, it seems we can conclude I am not good with "free" mana.
OTD, I can play bolas with Orim's chant as protection. You exile force spike to Bolas (because it's useless for the combo). then on your turn, I can use my second chant so you can't do anything and on my turn I can bolas you again to exile a piece of the combo and win.Quote:
Originally Posted by jhhdk
OTP it's perhaps a little bit more tricky.
If I orim's chant during your upkeep, you can counter, I can use my second chant. On my turn, I play bolas and you have to exile a piece of the combo. so you don't try to counter.
So, I orim's chant, you do nothing. On my turn, I orim's chant to play bolas, you exile force spike (or you counter, that's the same). then if you discard emrakul to raven's crime and play hollow, I can use bolas on my turn and you have to exile hollow.
WW for me, LL for you.
Leyline of Lifeforce works for both players but for creatures only. The discard spells are counterable.Quote:
Originally Posted by mattamort
Pretty sure what happens here is you try to discard the hand, uncounterable flash Mystic counters something, then your two Mystics trade in combat. I don't see a way for either of you to prevent that.
e.g. Upkeep Esper Charm. Frilled Mystic counters Esper Charm. If you use double Funeral Charm to kill Mystic, your Mystic loses to Ooze & Predator so that's a bad line for you. Instead you would double Funeral Charm to discard the Ooze and Predator, then your Mystics trade.
DD 2-2
4. PJim: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Electrodominance, Wheel of Fate
This felt good in my mind, but probably isn't when most people are playing at instant speed.
1. Asthereal (TO): Meddling Mage, Dovin's Veto, Counterflux, Death's Shadow // 6-0, Mage names Death's Shadow, and wins against a Mage without a +1/+1 counter.
2. Wrath of Pie: Ancient Tomb, Loxodon Smiter, Loxodon Smiter, Bloodline Keeper // 0-6, Either creature wins through Mage
3. RoosterCocoa: High Market, Nether Spirit, Counterflux, Spell Queller // 6-0, I name Nether Spirit, and a 3/3 Mage wins through Spell Queller
5. GoblinSmashmaster: Leyline of Lifeforce, Nightveil Predator, Frilled Mystic, Bloodhall Ooze // 2-2, Mystic has to come down before I Electrodominance, or Mage will lock it out, so we end up with a 3/3 and a 3/2 staring down.
6. alphastryk: Leyline of Sanctity, Dark Ritual, Wheel and Deal, Aura Mutation // 2-2, 3/3 Mage stares down 4 1/1s
7. jhhdk: Raven's Crime, Howltooth Hollow, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, Force Spike // 6-0, Mage names Emrakul
8. FTW: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Frilled Mystic, Narset's Reversal // 0-6, You copy my Summoning to get Mage in first.
9. Reeplcheep: Blood Celebrant , Aetherflux Reservoir, Pact of Negation , Cavern Harpy // 6-0, My deck works as intended for once.
10. mattamort: Esper charm, Funeral Charm, Funeral Charm, Frilled Mystic // 0-6, That's a lot of instant discard.
11. dte: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, esper charm, fork // 0-6, You can Fork my summoning to ensure Lavinia gets in first.
12. silkster: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Atraxa, Praetors' Voice, Abrupt Decay // 0-6, The threat of Atraxa forces bad lines.
13. Tylert: Nicol Bolas, Dragon God, Orim's chant, Orim's chant, The tabernacle at pendrell vale // 1-4, OTD both Chants are needed to lock me out, but they do and Bolas resolves. OTP, if you don't Chant in my upkeep, I play Mage normally and win, so you must. This means you only have one Chant for your turn, which you have to use after I cast Savage Summoning, which allows me to Wheel for the draw. (If Mage is allowed to land in either case, I name Chant, which then ensures Wheel will resolves and Tabernacle wouldn't be a problem)
14. Serguei: Cunning Nightbonder; Spell Queller; Frilled Mystic; Leyline of Lifeforce // 0-6, Can't stop flashy creatures.
15. maxx!: Savage Summoning, Meddling Mage, Esper Charm, Mardu Charm // 0-6, You can force me to try first.
16. H: Chancellor of the Dross, Smallpox, Phyrexian Obliterator, Counterspell // 6-0, The deck works as intended for a second time.
35 points.
I'm disagreeing with Tylert, but I think my line is right.
I agree with PJim
When you're OTD PJim has the option to just main phase cast Meddling Mage normally. To prevent that, you have to upkeep Orim's Chant first. Then on your turn you only have 1 Chant so you can't interrupt both Savage-Mage and Electro-Wheel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
WD 4-1
I think you already posted that. I was going to fill it in, but thanks anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
Yeah, you are right.Quote:
Originally Posted by PJim
That makes me wish I had played 1 orim's chant and 1 silence... it's the second match up where playing orim's chant over silence has costed me points :)
No results yet from Serguei and H, and jhhdk is unsure about these matches as well, afaik.
I did some napkin math and figured out that Serguei wins both unsure matches, which elevates his scores to bannable levels.
So for now things look as follows:
1. Tylert: 66 - 4,4
2. maxx!: 65 - 4,3
3. silkster: 64 - 4,3
3. Serguei: 64 - 4,3
5. FTW: 62 - 4,1
6. dte: 60 - 4
7. GoblinSmashmaster: 48 - 3,2
8. mattamort: 40 - 2,7
9. Wrath of Pie: 36 - 2,4
10. Asthereal (TO): 35 - 2,3
10. PJim: 35 - 2,3
12. RoosterCocoa: 27 - 1,8
13. H: 25 - 1,7
14. alphastryk: 15 - 1
14. jhhdk: 15 - 1
14. Reeplcheep: 15 - 1
With the following bannings:
Abrupt Decay
Atraxa, Praetors' Voice
Cunning Nightbonder
Esper Charm
Frilled Mystic
Leyline of Lifeforce
Mardu Charm
Meddling Mage
Nicolas bolas, dragon-god
Orim's chant
Savage Summoning
Spell Queller
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
I'll allow a few hours for people to comment on my findings. If nobody has improvements on my estimates for these matches, I'll apply these bannings for the bannathon and open round 3 later today.
Do we all agree that next round has very few playable cards?
I mean, with the absence of any mana and cards that were printed at other rarities it looks as if we're gonna all play the same decks...
I was the one who submitted the idea I think, but never really looked into the available cards until today and my original idea was any mythic card could be used... it opens more space.
Sorry for the late rant.
I have been against this for a while. Main argument is that even crap like Delver of Secrets is Mythic in a certain vague set, and deciding which obscure expansions count and which don't is rather complicated.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
I'm willing to go down to must be Mythic in a set and cannot be uncommon or common in another. Gatherer is leading.
Who's in favor of this change? Who's against?
I am against.
I think it would be hard to figure out which cards have exactly these criteria. Illegal decks are no fun.
The mythic round is very narrow, and probably with a lot of similar decks, but I would say so be it. It could be interesting to see what a very restrictive cardpool brings.
I also think we should just leave it as it is. In round Chronomaton it turned out we didn't all play Chronomaton nor was it broken or banworthy. The appearance of restrictiveness doesn't guarantee restrictive outcomes.
Some of the amended results hadn't been updated into the spreadsheet yet. I hadn't added mine (waiting on others to post) and it looks like others were missed as well. I updated the spreadsheet with the latest results for everyone. Some scores changed. In particular, the bannings would change.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal
Without Serguei's post or all of jhhdk's results there may be future changes as well.
The opposite is true, there could be some illegal deck because some cards have been reedited as rare in a random set. Does anyone know how to check a card is legal in the format or not? I dont know if it is part of the game, to analyze all the mythics and check if they have not been reedited as a rare, but it is seems rather boring :(.Quote:
Originally Posted by dte
I would be ok for this change obviously.
But I will play it in its original version if the majority decides to.
Fully agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by mattamort
I used "not:reprint r:mythic" in Scryfall: https://scryfall.com/search?q=not%3Areprint+r%3Amythic
I cannot guarantee it is all the, and only the correct cards, but it seemed fine to me.
There are a lot of rares that were reprinted as Mythics. Some in real sets, some only in promotional sets (eg Zendikar treasures, judge foils, DCI promos, Duel Decks, From the Vault). I think it would become very confusing to try to validate which ones should count as Mythics and which ones are illegal, or checking if a card was at BOTH Uncommon and Mythic in different promotions, or miss cards that have always been rare but were printed as Mythic in one obscure promotion years ago, instead of just checking if a card only has a Mythic symbol in Gatherer or Scryfall.
Edit: If it helps anyone's deck construction, the only legal lands are:
-The 5 "lose 3 life" spell lands
-Colorless lands like Mirrorpool, Maze's End
Ahah I had eye of ugin as a legal card because its first printing was mythic :)Quote:
Originally Posted by FTW
damn. this is so fucking annoying :)
I just go on Gatherer and look at the card. If any symbols are not red, illegal. dte's scryfall filter would do the same thing. Personally I find that easier than having to check every single reprint symbol to see if any were uncommon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
Thx for the proposal but It does not work, lotus cobra is in the list.Quote:
Originally Posted by dte
Thanks for catching that!Quote:
Originally Posted by mattamort
After as 99% of the cards are unplayable, you have to verify only very few cards, the 1-3 you deemed to add to your deck aside the 1-3 boltlands you would play.
Thanks. Looks like bannings will now be:Quote:
Originally Posted by FTW
Esper Charm
Frilled Mystic
Mardu Charm
Meddling Mage
Narset's Reversal
Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God
Orim's chant
Savage Summoning
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
Easiest way is to use something like this.Quote:
Originally Posted by mattamort
And like FTW said just check whether there's a symbol that's not red. If so, it's illegal.
If we add mythics that may also rare in other printings, but not uncommon or common, it's the same except in that case everything silver or black is illegal.
For reference these are the mythic land/spell modals. We'll use these if a banned card was submitted:
Agadeem's Awakening
Emeria's Call
Sea Gate Restoration
Shatterskull Smashing
Turntimber Symbiosis
Current vote: 3 against, 1 in favor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal
I’m fine with either “only ever printed as mythic” (what we’re doing now), or “was ever printed as mythic” (allowing stuff like Aether Vial), but I would prefer not to do the “must have been mythic and never been common or uncommon” rule.
is there any mythic that was reprinted as a common or an uncommon card? (or vice versa)?
I'm not even sure about it.
Personnally, “was ever printed as mythic” > “only ever printed as mythic” > "must have been mythic and never been common or uncommon”
Since I am new and never had to build with such a limited card pool and I dont have much time this week, I will not try to convince you. But, as dte mentionned, the # of playable cards is extremely limited and this is not why I usually play to 4CB :D
Dark Ritual, Cabal Ritual and Delver of Secrets are mythic in a weird reprint thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
Which is why I am not doing the "must have ever been printed as Mythic" thing.
This is why I wanted the round replaced.
Too late for that now though, so we'll just have to suffer through the mythic-only experience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
Fyndhorn Elves
Kird Ape
Wall of Blossoms
Dark Ritual
Hymn to Tourach
Cabal Ritual
Delver of Secrets
Ancient Tomb
Lotus Petal
Aether Vial
Ivory Tower
Berserk
Desert
Maze of Ith
Firespout
Dryad Arbor
Cephalid Coliseum
Tectonic Edge
Tolaria West
Spell Pierce
Divert
Swords to Plowshares
Many others. The problem is many old commons and uncommons were reprinted as Mythic in some "From the Vault"-type bonus product, FNM Promos, Judge foils, or other premium foil-only money-grab prints. You could play a Pauper-legal deck!
To me it would be even more confusing to keep track of all the cards that we traditionally think of non-rares that could also be Mythic in some obscure printing. For example, anyone who didn't know Dark Ritual was Mythic would be missing out on a whole bunch of bigger mana decks.
Edit: Goblin Lackey is another uncommon Mythic, so maybe GoblinSmashmaster would disagree.
I think this in Scryfall gets you the legal cards for the current rules. Decided to be nice and shareCode:rarity:m -in:common -in:uncommon -in:rare
Okay, nobody replied anymore, so I'm making a decision:
We'll play the original idea, so only cards that are mythic and nothing else are legal.
Also, for the bannathon, I'm cutting the results off and ban what's currently the top 3.
This means these cards are out:
Esper Charm
Frilled Mystic
Mardu Charm
Meddling Mage
Narset's Reversal
Nicol Bolas, Dragon-God
Orim's chant
Savage Summoning
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
Since everything took a little longer than expected, I'll give you guys a day extra.
That should be enough for the small card pool we have.
I'll be creating my deck, and hope to open the round shortly.
ROUND 3 OF SEASON 10: DEVIANT LEGACY BANNATHON has started.
This round we play Mythic Mayhem: All cards in your deck must be Mythic Rare, and have only been printed as Mythic Rare. Note: basic lands are not legal.
Zendikar Rising mythic modal lands (Agadeem's Awakening, Emeria's Call, Sea Gate Restoration, Shatterskull Smashing, Turntimber Symbiosis) take their place in the rulings for illegal cards.
I have PM'ed myself my deck for round 3, so you can start sending me your decks.
DEADLINE: Thursday the 3rd of June at 11:00AM Central European Time.
(That's my time zone. Pacific Time it'll probably be something like Wednesday night a bit past midnight, so keep that in mind.)
PLEASE NOTE:
The way you send your deck to me matters. Please send it in the way described below, so it doesn't cost me an hour of editing before I can post all the decks.
Please send your deck as follows: Shatterskull Smashing, Shatterskull Smashing, Warren Instigator, Shattergang Brothers.
So with card tags around each card, and not above eachother, and with your Username and 4CB S10R03 in the topic.
Don't forget to keep an eye on the banned list. You'll find it in the second post of the thread, or in our Google Spreadsheet.
After the deadline has passed, I will post all decks on the forum here, and you can start puzzling out your scores.
If you have any questions, please read the first two posts of this thread first. If you can't find the answer there, drop a message here. We'll answer a.s.a.p.
Also, if you've been lurking on this thread and looking to join, you can step in anytime, any round. That's no problem at all. Just send me your deck before the deadline, and I'll add you to the competition. :smile:
I didn’t realize how bad the card pool is.
Are MH2 cards legal? They might make this round slightly less atrocious.
What's MH2?Quote:
Originally Posted by Reeplcheep
But easier: does the card you want to play have another printing that isn't Mythic Rare? Then no, not legal.
Yes, the card pool is incredibly limited. Basics aren't even legal. But we'll make do. I had five possible decks to choose from.
Modern horizons 2, which releases on mtgo tomorrow.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal