Is there any good coverage from Rome?Quote:
Originally Posted by Togores
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Is there any good coverage from Rome?Quote:
Originally Posted by Togores
MTGQuality does the coverage there but it was laggy yesterday and offline during parts of the Legacy finals.Quote:
Originally Posted by Madsk
So, Pascal won the tournament with Grinding Station which draws more attention to our deck. Nevertheless, very good job winning both Modern and Legacy. I hope to see the Top8/16 lists soon. How was your tournament, Martin? I have seen that you won the trial on Friday.
Plus, cheer up, Rodrigo. I am sure it was just too much of bad luck.
his a menber of thesource? i would love to read a report from him of this MKM series :) and congratz on winning modern and legacy, really impressive !Quote:
Originally Posted by CabalTherapy
@cabaltherapy, i had the exact same thought about that is nice that a ant player wins but on the other hand people probably will be even more concern about stopping this deck ahah
i saw pascal casting burning wish wich i didnīt expect at all by watch the coverage live :p any one knows how many did he use?
surely 1 in side as he always played
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Brainstorm
3 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
1 Rain of Filth
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Duress
1 Empty the Warrens
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
2 Past in Flames
4 Ponder
2 Preordain
2 Tendrils of Agony
// Sideboard
1 Chrome Mox
2 Xantid Swarm
3 Dread of Night
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Ad Nauseam
2 Chain of Vapor
2 Flusterstorm
1 Krosan Grip
In my quest to find out if Empty is worth playing, I ran it maindeck today. Whenever I had it, I could also just kill my opponent with Tendrils. Also not sure about Top vs. Preordain and Xantid Swarm vs. Duress + Flusterstorm. Swarm is probably better against Show and Tell strategies, Top and more Flusterstorm / discard against basically everything else, although Preordain & 2 Past in Flames might actually be the best plan against Team America, considering they all seem to have Null Rod these days.
I'm probably going to stick with maindeck Ad Nauseam for now.
I think you avenged that pretty well. Congrats on the win, what little I could see looked sweet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Togores
Congrats, since august my MD is the same:Quote:
Originally Posted by phazonmutant
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands
1 Island
1 Swamp
4 Polluted Delta
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
3 Lotus Petal
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Thoughtseize
1 Duress
4 Brainstorm
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Ponder
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Grim Tutor
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Empty the Warrens
2 Past in Flames
2 Tendrils of Agony
SB:
3 Pithing Needle
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Tropical Island
1 Krosan Grip
1 Ad Nauseam
2 Massacre
2 Pyroblast
1 Extirpate
1 FLEX Chain of Vapor
1 FLEX Notion Thief
Quote:
Originally Posted by CabalTherapy
just returned from the MKM, very tilting XP...
I wont the Friday trial with a very bad list - I wanted to try out some cards
MD - +Ad Nauseam, +2 Preordain, +LP - GT -2SDT -ToA
SB - 3 XS, Trop, Bayou, 3AD, 3DoN, 2 Slaghter Games, Karakas, Pyroblast?
2:1 Stifle Bug
2:1 U Omnitell
2:1 GBwr Lands w Entomb
2:0 Burn
ID
ID
at this point it's 0:30 in the morning and the Trial is NOT for byes.... read again... a TRIAL THAT IS NOT FOR BYES!
->win by split = 21 euro in boosters, a playmat and neverlasting fame..
BENVENUTI IN ITALIA!
the trial meta is total Bug vs. Miracles war, so I opted to play XS, which was a cardinal mistake for me... so Saturday:
MD = org list
SB = -3PN -Notion Thief - CoV +3XS +Bayou +Karakas (I had really big dillema whether to play 2 Massacre or 3 Don and 3rd AD insted of Grip -something)
2:0 Elves (Lans89 on the source) funny thing he recognized me by my name so he knew what I'm on
2:1 Miracles - lost game 1 despite of my great hand, he always topdecked something so I had to wait a turn and lost to double CB, G2 on the back of XS, G3 won through his CB
1:2 URW Golddigger brew - G1 T1 GP->30 Goblins, G2 he has SE+Snapcaster so I'm forced to make a poor trade and lose thanks to this, G3 I have mana heavy draw and I'm forced to go against a hand of Fow, CS, 2xFlusterstorm, SE, he thinks he has me and plays it pretty losely wasting all his spells and I drain him for 4 but all my draws is lands so I can't punish him... I was kind of down because the MU is pretty winnable imo, but Togores told me this is one of the most tough opps I could face...
1:1 Miracles - this is where it went south, I again lose long G1 despite my great hand, G2 I have a T1 kill but my gutt tells me to wait and this gets very long, I make a first major mistake not drawing from a GP, G3 we start with 2 mins on the clock, again I have a very strong hand but do not find discard and the final turn attempt get's double countered, could have played the turn a little bit better... I'm pretty tilted because I get into Miracles/Lands bracket till the end of the tournament and felt like I'd win the game in next 2-3 turns
0:2 Miracles - G1 I make another mistake with unnecessary Topping now - made 10 Goblins (could have also ToAed for 12 not being an idiot) and lost as he found Terminus thanks to the extra turn I gave him.. obv he had CB glued with it.. G2 I just lose to double CB despite having T1 XS
0:2 Miracles - G1 he starts SDT, I GP him - he has nothing, T2 I go for it, he waits and FoWs pitching FoW...ok... next turn I draw a CR and go for it, he FoWs, his turn he plays CB... well played sir... G2 I just lose to tripple CB... a very good player btw.
2:0 Elves - T2 kill and T3 kill
2:1 Burn - G1 lost, T2 kill, win but no joy...
4:3:1 = 61st
to sum this up 3 wins from the "bye" area yet no byes from friday, tilted by Miracles on Saturday - lost despite having good hands/chances... all 4 had left ~2Terminus 1-2 StP in the deck... they usually won with EtA even postboard... had to face multiple CB each game... SDT felt really good against them but in retrospective much better for them... my opps asking about T1 XS preventing activated/triggered abilities is funny and disappointing at the same time... I think I should have just played my initial list... had to leave today so I couldn't play Vintage, Friday and all combined the weekend leaves sour taste in my mounth..
congrats to mr. Wagner his performance both days was quite impressive (nice g1 in the finals, i think nobody noticed ToA is just for 18), dunno if he haven't won Vitage already =D, It was nice meeting Togores and other guys, the venue was nice but organization still "italian", Rome is a beautiful city but need days not hours of sightseeing
aaand that's it.
edit: wow, congrats Togores!
Anyone with a stock list I can use to get into the archetype? Thanks!
I can't find a link to the results of the MKM Legacy and Vintage tournaments, anyone have that?
I played the same maindeck as here at the Vancouver Spring Classic. This was my sideboard:
4 Abrupt Decay
2 Xantid Swarm
1 Duress
2 Dread of Night (finally in Korean, thanks Matt!)
2 Sensei's Divining Top
2 Chain of Vapor
2 Surgical Extraction
I went a dismal 3-3, precipitated by some suboptimal decisions. I'll lay out the decisions because I think they were reasonably interesting. They streamed me in two feature matches, I'm working on getting the link.
R1 - Miracles 2-0
Game 1 I killed him before he could find enough answers or Counterbalance, nothing special. Game 2 was sweet, you should definitely check it out when I get the link. We Topped back and forth, then Cliqued me. I killed it, then built up. I shoved with a Brainstorm, he Blasted, I played a Ritual, flipped Top drawing the Tendrils, played Cabal Ritual, played Tutor (intending to reveal another Cabal Ritual) and he Counterspelled. Alright, probably just Flusterstorm to go! I played Cabal Ritual and Past in Flames. He Flusterstormed, tapping out. Boom. Tendrils for 20! He shrugged, Forced one, and took lethal. Winning through 4 counterspells in one turn, one hell of a way to start the tournament.
R2 - Strawberry Shortcake 2-0
He was playing a weird build with no recruiters but a bunch of ETutor targets main like Canonist. Didn't matter. He kept a fast hand on the play that would kill turn 2 if he drew a Spirit Guide or a Sol Land. So I played Brainstorm on 1 and found a line to kill turn 1. Drawing Past in Flames was great, of course. Game 2 was uneventful. He tutored a Canonist, I killed it, he died.
R3 - Grixis Control 2-0
Couple of interesting mulligan decisions game 1. My 7 on the draw was 2 lands and fast mana, but no cantrips, disruption, or business. I know what he's on. Keep or mulligan? I end up shipping it. My 6 is Infernal Tutor, Duress, Dark Ritual, Cabal Ritual, LED, Tendrils. I end up keeping it because I know he's playing a slow deck, but I think in retrospect it's wrong because he has discard. It works out though, I draw a land on my 4th draw step and use the two discard spells I drew to fight through his three counterspells. The second game was a normal storm versus control.
R4 - Shardless BUG 0-2
Wheels came off this round. I kept an ok hand with a couple of Petals, couple of Cabal Rituals, tutor, a land, a Ponder. He opened on Deathrite, and my Ponder found a land, Past in Flames, and Duress. That's a keep, right? That should be enough for threshold and a win next turn, but he cascaded into Hymn, which as of last night he wasn't playing. :frown: Not bad, most combinations would still be lethal. Except he hit both Petals and I couldn't make the colors. Deathrite kept me off Past in Flames. Game 2 I mulliganned and my hand just did nothing.
R5 - TES 1-2
Played against a good TES pilot. Game 1 my hand had an Infernal Tutor, but Probe showed that he had a Probe, 3 Therapies, Chrome Mox, Dark Ritual, Rite of Flame. Inexplicably I kept a Ponder because it had the LED to make the hand lethal...but he obviously discarded my Tutor. He drew the kill first. Game 2 was weird - he drew 7 cantrips and I drew none. Despite that, we ground each other down and I top decked first. Game 3 I had 2 Therapies, a land, Petal, a Surgical, and 2 LEDs. He led on Ponder and LED luckily. I drew a third LED, Therapied and whiffed, seeing a second land, Chrome Mox, Dark Ritual, Infernal Tutor. I guess I wasn't thinking about Ad Nauseam because I thought I was safe with Surgical in hand and passed. He Ad Naused, I decided to let it resolve. He flipped down to 2, and had to pass after I Surgicalled Tutor, but he won next turn with Burning Wish. In retrospect, maybe hitting LED was correct if I let him keep the tutor?
R6 - Miracle Blade 1-2
Game 1 was my first Empty of the day on turn 2. I beat down through Stoneforge and Clique. Game 2 he had everything - Clique, counterspells, Counterbalance. Game 3 he applied early pressure with Batterskull and I just couldn't punch through in time.
Overall the two Past in Flames list seemed strong. I really didn't like the Empty though. I'd like to try Top instead of Preordain like what slosh is doing, Preordain was pretty bad for me. I didn't miss the Ad Nauseam, surprisingly. It was never a viable line in the combo matchup, and the two Past in Flames plan is stronger against Miracles.
Probably because there is none yet...Quote:
Originally Posted by phazonmutant
Naming BW I guess, wow how could you feel safe? =D I'd two 2-1 myself and SE the IT, interesting question is when to do that ...
I glad you found the power of 2Pif but can't say I like you plaing it, too many people and the MKM win drag attention sooner or later 2 PiF will lose some of it's charm once known to the masses... I also disliked preordain // not missing Ad Nauseam is not surprising ;)
I realized I misremembered one of the cards in his hand. He must have had a Duress, not Chrome Mox, because I know he drew Ponder for turn when he went for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sloshthedark
I'd like to see lists when they go up, especially for vintage. Yes, naming Burning Wish. He led on fetch Volcanic into Ponder, so I thought chances were reasonable he had it, and I can KO him if I extract the Wish. I forgot he was on TES, not ANT! That line is just fine against ANT...but yeah big mistake. Indeed, interesting question when to Surgical. Since he kept on Ponder, I think there are a few options that matter. One, he could have left Ad Nauseam on top. In that case he's one short from casting it, but I should still Surgical on my turn. Two, he could have left Burning Wish. He could Empty for like 10, and that might kill me since I have nothing going on, so I should Surgical on my turn again. The other option is he left Tutor, so I should Surgical when he casts Dark Ritual. I think it's probably safer to Surgical on my turn.
Haha we're on totally separate continents! It took years for the SCG grinders to pick up on ANT.
There isn't really one stock list anymore, but this is the basic skeleton:Quote:
Originally Posted by sherko7
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
1 Island
1 Swamp
4 Misty Rainforest / Scalding Tarn
4 Polluted Delta
1 Bayou / Badlands
1 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Duress
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Past in Flames
4 Ponder
1 Tendrils of Agony
This is 55 cards, which leaves five slots. Almost everyone has two more cantrips after that; some go for Sensei's Divining Top, some go for Preordain. Then you add more business. This could mean one Ad Nauseam or another Past in Flames plus up to two additional storm spells, split between Tendrils of Agony and Empty the Warrens. If going for Ad Nauseam, people often go for 2 Preordain, 1 Sensei's Divining Top, 1 Ad Nauseam, 1 Grim Tutor.
I would suggest keeping the list as simple as possible to get used to it and then try splits and additional cards as you learn.
You should add two copies of Preordain and then either two Tops and Ad Nauseam or one Past in Flames and two Tendrils. Then you practice with those configurations until you get used to the lines and when you feel comfortable with the deck, you can change slots to increase the number of lines you can take. The hardest part about playing storm optimally is probably deciding on how you're going to win the game, so for learning purposes, the 2 Past in Flames 3 Tendrils build is probably the best.
Some videos about Rome:
http://www.twitch.tv/mtgquality/profile/past_broadcasts
hey guys!
I would like to go back to a topic of a few pages ago: Dread of Night vs. Massacre. I would like to post a reply, but didnt' have the time due to university stuff. My opinion is that, in my experience Massacre is awful vs. Death & Taxes, it might sound crazy, but I explain why: in my games vs. D&T, in both test games and tournament ones, my opponents were always able to play without any plains. They have plenty of ways to do it, as long as they have 4 karakas, some horizon canopy, Aether Vial, and some lists also run Flagstones of Trokair. I can assure you that the times where I cast a Massacre for 0 mana were lower than 3 since I play it. I always have to go up to 4 mana, 5 if they have Thalia. Also, I always test against a friend of mine who runs Maverick, and Massacre is rubbish against them, also the match-up is pretty hard as Sylvan Safekeeper + Gaddok is neary unbeatable for us. Maybe it's me but I'm starting to hate Massacre, as it's good only against Meddling Mage decks, to beat D&T I usually just need Chains and DoN. Even just a one of buys me tons of time to find a chain. Don't misunderstand me, I believe that D&T is a good match-up for us, I just find Massacre 95% of the time being a brick in my hand. What are your experiences with it? Do you cast it for free?
@Sloshthedark: it's really sad that you lost so many games vs. Miracles with you having good hands. Unfortunately all of you coming here in Italy for tournaments have to know that you're coming in the land of Miracles. A ton of people play that deck here, a lot of them in a poor way, but we have also some really good players, that you can find at the top tables. That's why I'm trying to improve my game against that deck as much as I can. You'll do better next time! :wink:
Agreed, Massacre is rubbish. It's not enough to beat them, and I don't need that many slots for the matchup. I've been very happy with the plan you describe of Dread of Night + Chain of Vapor. Often playing against them, I use an Infernal Tutor to find the second copy Dread of Night if I don't have the kill in-hand. They can't really disrupt you from there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghiwo
I'll say this much on Massacre - I was playing UWR Delver for top 16 at an SCG Open, and knew my opponent's only out was Massacre to get rid of my Meddling Mage on his tutor. He cast a cantrip with about 4 open lands, I dazed it to return my Tundra and win the game. Good players will know to play around the card, but I think overall it's still very strong. Sure, DoN is better against D&T, but Massacre has dual utility against blade decks as well.
This is definitely a factor for me, on MTGO there are so many Blade decks that I can't really explore Dread of Night as much because it's so hard to justify giving up that utility.Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinH
I don't even think you should bring in Massacre against blade. They don't have so many creatures that a wrath is valuable, they often have misers RiP or Cages, and they can blank it by Daze, Waste, Deathrite, or equipment.
I prefer bringing in Chain over Decay, but I would bring in either before Massacre.
100% agree on don vs Massacre. Also remember that Death&Taxes has both aether vial and aven mindzensor,both instant speed disruption with high impact.
As for the Mkm Tournament, what should i say: Slosh,you dissapoint me :D
You can do better.
yeah it's more of a anti UWx card, but DoN is just anti D+T card, even narrower, when I play In larger tournament I just hope to have U matches and deck will back me up in it's concistecy, there is a lot of "If" for them to have/not have to making acceptable loss when happening w MassacreQuote:
Originally Posted by Ghiwo
facing Miracles is not a problem, i have one of the best Miracles player in my LGS and was expecting to face 2-3 as the last time (btw. my 12post friend met 0 obv.) but losing from high % winning spots is tilting seems like I wasted my luckpool on Friday :D
against UWR it's one of the best cards, decent vs Deathblade depending on their build as I feel Ad Nauseam is very good sometimesQuote:
Originally Posted by phazonmutant
I dissapoint myself even more ;) . I hope you'll do much better next weekQuote:
Originally Posted by sawatarix