[DTB] Blade Control

Here is what I'm currently considering:

Creatures 16
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 True Name Nemesis
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Baleful Strix

Spells 23

4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Force of Will
3 Thoughtseize
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
1 Inquisition Kozilek
1 Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sofi
1 Vindicate
1 EE

Lands 21
4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
3 Tundra
3 Underground Sea
1 Scrubland
1 Tropical Island
1 Karakas
1 Academy Ruins
1 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp

I know this looks a lot like deathblade, which I hate, but I really like the idea of DRS for the obvious reasons such as ramp and additional clock.
I have not played much since the SCG Baltimore in June with Esper and I went 6-3. Granted that was months ago and the meta has changed, but I still love this deck. I replaced my spell pierces back then and I never looked back. I ran 3 FoW and a MD Counterspell and it was never much of a problem. I am considering of making the vindicate into a single Aven Mindcensor. I do like the discussion on the red splash a lot. I do miss Clique in this build as I have won many times due to her.

This has always been my pet deck, and now that I have time to get back into it I am very excited to play this again. Sorry if I'm all over the place. Just filled with excitement to have time to dedicate to MTG again.

Ok, my deck only somewhat resembles the basic Blade Control decks being discussed on this thread, but it has the basic elements. So far I've played it in four local tournaments, and have 3-1'd three times. Maybe it just works with the 20 or so guys who usually play Legacy around here, but I would appreciate outside opinions.

Creatures:
4x Stoneforge Mystic
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Geist of St. Traft

Spells:
4x Brainstorm
4x Ponder
4x Spell Pierce
4x Force of Will
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Stifle

Artifacts:
1x Batterskull
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice

Lands:
2x Rishadan Port
4x Wasteland
4x Flooded Strand
2x Polluted Delta
2x Arid Mesa
3x Tundra
2x Island
1x Plains
1x Glacial Fortress

SB:
4x Supreme Verdict
3x Detention Sphere
1x Surgical Extraction
3x Rest in Peace
1x Sword of Feast and Famine
3x Flusterstorm

Most combo has provided very little trouble. Death and Taxes have accounted for two of the losses in the above 3-1's. RUG got me the other time. I have attempted to compensate with Verdict. I have done well against Jund, as mana trickery is why I built the deck.
Am I on the right thread? Without adding a splash color, any advice on how to deal with D&T?

I guess I will post my list here since Ghost did. Here's what I'm running, and I love it.

15
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Baleful Strix
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 True-Name Nemesis

24
4 Thoughtseize
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection (Heavy discard meta, lotta Hymns around; Call it a meta-slot)
2 Spell Pierce
1 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa’s Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull
1 Vindicate

21
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
1 Marsh Flats
3 Underground Sea
2 Tundra
1 Tropical Island
1 Scrubland
1 Academy Ruins
2 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp

Give it a go on Cockatrice. I'm playing it irl but I don't have Cockatrice. I would like opinions so I can keep refining. Thanks.

-ABC

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee

I guess I will post my list here since Ghost did. Here's what I'm running, and I love it.

15
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Baleful Strix
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 True-Name Nemesis

24
4 Thoughtseize
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection (Heavy discard meta, lotta Hymns around; Call it a meta-slot)
2 Spell Pierce
1 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa’s Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull
1 Vindicate

21
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
1 Marsh Flats
3 Underground Sea
2 Tundra
1 Tropical Island
1 Scrubland
1 Academy Ruins
2 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp

Give it a go on Cockatrice. I'm playing it irl but I don't have Cockatrice. I would like opinions so I can keep refining. Thanks.

-ABC

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Really love your list. It's pretty close to what I test with.
Just my two Pence:
Academy Ruins does not seem to pull its weight. Oh wait: recurring Strix seems beneficial - so nvm.
2 Pierce means the chance to see them early is rather slim and drawing them during the mid/late game is kind of meh, since you don't run any mana denial. I could see Snare/EE/Fluster Storm/Inquisition of K./Clique/Counter Spell/etc. performing better in those slots.

btw, here's a SB I could see working:
3 Rest in Peace
3 Spell Pierce (in certain MUs you really want them indeed)
2 Ethersworn Canonist / Tidehollow Sculler
3 Zealous Persecution/Engineered Plague (MVP against swarm Aggro and TNN)
2 EE
2 Abrupt Decay

Hey Guys a little Post what i think about Esperblade right now:

Esperblade is probably a very good choice right now. Why?
It have a good Match up against 90% of the Meta, when you know, how i Play the Deck right;)

Here is my Current List and i'm very happy with this List:


3 True-Name Nemesis
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Snapcaster Mage
3 Force of Will
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
4 Thoughtseize
2 Spell Pierce
3 Underground Sea
3 Tundra
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
2 Island
1 Swamp
1 Plains
2 Lingering Souls
1 Karakas
1 Scrubland
1 Vindicate
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Academy Ruins
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Marsh Flats

SB: 2 Cabal Therapy
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Force of Will
SB: 2 Nihil Spellbomb
SB: 1 Disenchant
SB: 4 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 Sword of Feast and Famine
SB: 2 Toxic Delunge

Card Choices:

But First a good Question? Why not Deathrite Shaman?

Simple Answer. Esper is not a Midrange Deck. Shaman is probably more a Midrange Card than a Card for a Hard Controll deck like Esperblade. A Controll Deck don't Need a T2 Geist or Nemesis.
With Nemesis became all Controll and Tempo Decks(UWR Delver, bUrg Temp) a little Push. I think Esperblade has the most Push with Nemesis.

So Fact is Disrupt and Controll your Oppenent and Play a Stoneblade and a Nemesis to end the Game.

The Choice Nemesis is simply:
A old esperblade list before Nemesis was existing, played 8-9 3cc Drops.(3-4 Souls, 1 Intuition, 1 Vindicate, 1 Clique, 3 Snapcaster yes cc 2 but for Flashback are they probably 3cc too.)
Now with Nemesis, we can cut some Cards. A lot People think we should take out the lingering souls for Nemesis. But i think that's a wrong cut!
Why? Because Souls give 2-4 flying Tokens and are very very good with Equipment too+ Controll Cards. But Fact is we don't deed 3-4 anymore. I Cut 1 Soul and 1 Intuition because we don't want them that much in each Match up.

The last cut was a hard cut. I liked the 3th Snapcaster a lot and he was soo good a lot of time. But i cut him because Nemesis is a new engine of a Controll Card. Anyway we do Play enough Removal and Disrupt.

Now we still Play 8-9 3cc Cards and the same Manabase. + the new Controll Engine True-Name Nemesis.

The Play to win a game is like before. Disrupt+counter+Removal= Controll your Oppenent and Play a Jace, mystic or with the New Card True-Name Nemesis to win.

Other Main Choices:

1 Vendillion Clique: Still a good 1off Card. To cut the Clique is just wrong. Sometimes it can hurts Combo Decks a lot.

2 Snapcaster: With 2 Mages we still have enough Controll engine and a True Name Nemesis can easy Take 1 place instead

4 Thoughtseize: Why not a 2-2 Split off iok and this? Because, We don't care about Life. I think Thoughtseize are better to crap a Batterskull and a Jace in a Controll Mirror and against Combo it's can be good to Crap a 4cc Card or some Griselbrands, Emrakuls or Dreamshalls and a good Stormplayer win the First game anyway when he Play right and we haven't enought hate.
It seems a little bit bader against Tempo. But anyway iok is still bad to against tempo and we would board it out anyway.^^

2 Spell Pierce: I like him a lot and cut a random Counterspell for a second one. Yes in random Situation is a Counterspell better. But the cc2 seems sometimes to bad. I like Pierce more to protect a Jace or a Nemesis or to Counter a BS or a Disrupt spell.

1 Ponder: I think a 5th cantrip is 99% good in each Situation. I like it very well in a Controll Deck.

1 Vindicate: A Removal for Everything and a very good 1 off.

1 EE+Academy Ruins package: I think a removal like EE is too good right now. Nimble Mongoose lose a lot against EE. Academy Ruins is a good Controll Card.

1 Supreme Verdict: 1 Mass removal Main like this is very good Preboard because it cant be counteret and can turn a lot of Games. Why not Toxic delunge Main instead of verdict later in the Sb Post.

The other Main choices should be clear. ;))

The SB:

Now I have 3 Choices that i want to explain you more.

1 Sword of FaF: I think with Nemesis a important Card. I was thinking about to Play it main because it's to good against Controll Decks.

4 Cannonist: I like him a lot more than Meddling Mage. He's a better Hatebear than the Mage and can Knock out Storm and Snt Decks can't win a counterwar with him on the field. I think 4 is a good Number in Big Tournaments with a lot Combo Decks.

2 Toxic Delunge: For me the best Card in the new Commander 2013 and still underplayed, maybe best Massremoval ever Printed.
It's so good in the SB and i was thinking about it Preboard. But the Noncounterable Verdict seems main very good to. Anyway this Card hit's so much Decks like Maverick, Jund, Junk or Goblins Etc. Toxing Delunge diserve a Place in the SB! I think it will see more Play in the near Future.



I hope you enjoy my List and Post:)
Feel Free to Post.

Greets from Switzerland Pdingo

Well, I hate Jace in here. I haven't missed him one bit. For those of you on the Delver wagon, I've been testing a Delver version of my above list:

-3 Strix
-1 TNN
-1 Academy Ruins

+4 Delver
+1 Ponder

I know that the Pierces are probably the weakest part of my permission suite (especially in the Strix build), but I think I would be remiss to not include them simply because I wanted to play Esper over Death Blade because of the additional blue it provides. I dislike Snare due to it's constrictions and Counterspell is slow. Being tempo like my list is reminescent of, I don't always necessarily care if they pay 2, as I generally have another answer, or tempo's them long enough for me to win/deal with the problem. I see where you are coming from, but for my playstyle I feel that I benefit from the two Pierce. I keep my 3rd one and 2x Flusterstorm in my board, so I obviously feel pretty safe against all non dredge combo.

Thanks for the kind words, I've been excited since the moment I read TNN, and I gotta say it hasn't disappointed. I love Esper, especially when Patriot is the only real alternative. I'm not a red player. I feel this is better than UWr Delver. I dislike that deck. It feels so easily dealt with.

-ABC

Edit: I hate to disagree with you, dingo, but I'm pretty sure that both Terminus and Verdict are both better. You have to pay life before they get priority. It is this that makes me unable to appreciate Deluge. Pay 3 and X life just to get it countered. Sounds like a bad day to me.

is just good in miracle. Without top is a random removal.
I see verdict bader because it's four mana and ww.
Yes it' can't be countered. Against all non blue decks is delunge a lot better.


-3cc is very different.
-It's faster than verdict, when thalia is on the field.
-can handle a gaddock teeg
-against tempo we need only 3 mana and max. 3-4 lifeand he didn't counter it, when we bring it to the late game.
-Who cares about your own life in a controll deck???
- It kill a emrakul for 3 mana and 15 lifes. ;)) :P

Congrats to Ty Thomason for going undefeated in matches and taking down SCG Dallas with UW Stoneblade

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=60551


Creatures (12)

3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 True-Name Nemesis
2 Vendilion Clique

Planeswalkers (4)

4 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Lands (24)

3 Island
2 Plains
4 Flooded Strand
2 Marsh Flats
4 Mishra's Factory
3 Polluted Delta
4 Tundra
1 Academy Ruins
1 Karakas

Spells (20)

1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Brainstorm
1 Celestial Flare
1 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
1 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Supreme Verdict

Sideboard
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Pithing Needle
2 Meddling Mage
1 True-Name Nemesis
1 Detention Sphere
3 Rest in Peace
1 Flusterstorm
1 Path to Exile
2 Swan Song
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Supreme Verdict

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tormod

Congrats to Ty Thomason for going undefeated in matches and taking down SCG Dallas with UW Stoneblade

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=60551


Creatures (12)

3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 True-Name Nemesis
2 Vendilion Clique

Planeswalkers (4)

4 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Lands (24)

3 Island
2 Plains
4 Flooded Strand
2 Marsh Flats
4 Mishra's Factory
3 Polluted Delta
4 Tundra
1 Academy Ruins
1 Karakas

Spells (20)

1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Brainstorm
1 Celestial Flare
1 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
1 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Supreme Verdict

Sideboard
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Pithing Needle
2 Meddling Mage
1 True-Name Nemesis
1 Detention Sphere
3 Rest in Peace
1 Flusterstorm
1 Path to Exile
2 Swan Song
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Supreme Verdict

---

The Celestial Flare seems weird, maybe he was expecting some amount of True-Name Nemesis and Sneak Show?
Also I have doubts about the Swan Songs in the SB, but overall it looks really strong :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BVB09

The Celestial Flare seems weird, maybe he was expecting some amount of True-Name Nemesis and Sneak Show?
Also I have doubts about the Swan Songs in the SB, but overall it looks really strong :)

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Flare also kills Mungeese and Progenitus, and Thrun and anything with Mother-protection (Marit Lage), i guess it's fine, might be better than Wingshards, who knows.

Swan Song is underrated most of the time, i like it actually.

I think verdict is better in this deck than deluge. The main reason is because deluge will almost always wipe your board since none of your creatures have very large butts. Since this is the case, why not pay the 1 extra and just wipe everything w/o life loss. I understand that the mana for verdict is quite tricky compared to deluge, but a deluge to try and kill a goyf is a pretty big blowout if it gets countered vs tempo. Even if you do wipe their board, you've essentially flung their biggest guy at you, which tempo probably doesn't mind too much.

Glad to see my beloved Stoneblade doing well again in a tournament. Better still, he used the straight UW version that we all started with! True-Name Nemesis seems like a house in this deck, and I'm surprised by stuff like 4x Jace, the Mind Sculptor.

Was it the lack of Shardless BUG that made the Stoneforge decks successful? I don't recall seeing one on coverage and I know that that matchup is dreadful for us.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by somethingdotdotdot

I think verdict is better in this deck than deluge. The main reason is because deluge will almost always wipe your board since none of your creatures have very large butts. Since this is the case, why not pay the 1 extra and just wipe everything w/o life loss. I understand that the mana for verdict is quite tricky compared to deluge, but a deluge to try and kill a goyf is a pretty big blowout if it gets countered vs tempo. Even if you do wipe their board, you've essentially flung their biggest guy at you, which tempo probably doesn't mind too much.

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I think that the 2B mana cost is a huge reason to play it. Verdict's 1UWW is significantly harder to get to when under pressure from Wastelands, Ports, and Thalias.

Looks like there was another identical UW Blade list that finished 14th as well. I'd be interested in hearing/reading how relevant True-Name Nemesis was for 2x Top 16 finishes when traditional Blade Control (UW, Esper, or otherwise) all but fell off the face of planet pre-Nemesis.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HSCK

I think that the 2B mana cost is a huge reason to play it. Verdict's 1UWW is significantly harder to get to when under pressure from Wastelands, Ports, and Thalias.

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That's the first actual relevant reason I have heard to play deluge.

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That the oppenent Counter a Delunge is a bad Argument. The only Deck i see is Tempo RUG maybe UWR delver or bUrg Tempo and Merfolk..But a lot of the time they didn't have the Counter. When you Play correct.
Delunge is better against all shroud,hexproof creatures.
Better against Maverick, Junk, Jund, Elves, Goblins, Bant, Aggro deck like Zoo, BUG Shardless, Death n Taxes and against a lot more Decks. Because of this 1 mana;)
Lifeloss is not relevant.

I will respectfully agree to disagree. I think we should put mass removal discussions aside and focus on a more immediate issue: Is jace good here or bad? I'm aware of the two high placing lists with 4 jtms, but I'm not sold.

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I still like him in this deck, at least of a 2-of (I personally will always run 3 main). It gives us an alternate win condition, stabilizes the board, BS every turn, and takes more pressure off the "Equip a dude" plan.

I think 2 Jace is to less and 4 Jace is interesting but i don't see him as a Four off.
- i dont won't him 2 times in the Hand in the starthand or the Firsts Rounds..
- Sometimes i don't wan't Play a Jace
- 3 Jaces is the right. We have him in each Game.

@Massremoval Discussion

We will see. I think i'm right with that^^

Jace speaks to a much heavier control aspect, something TNN doesn't agree with. I think elspeth is a better choice, but ww is hard to come by when you also need uu for tnn. I actually think if it's warranted to play walkers, elspeth should be included.

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