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Thank you very much, I really appreciate that!Quote:
Originally Posted by Einherjer
Thanks to you too! Picture clearer and project updated. I hope that this pic is better than the previous one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arianeira
http://i57.tinypic.com/2lnffid.jpg
Hi guys. I have a slot in sb and I'm looking for a card that can help in the 12post MU. Blood Moon is a good card, but there are other choices that can help in other hard MUs like Show and Tell and Reanimator. Ensnaring Bridge or Humility for example.
What of those three cards do you prefer? ?
Hi everyone, it's my first time posting here on The Source. Hope i can learn and contribute as much as i'd like.
I think i'd go with either the Blood Moon, as it can be useful against other decks with few basics; or Humility if you are really concerned about Show and Tell and Reanimator. Although it's a bit slower than Ensnaring Bridge, i don't like the latter too much as Griselbrand will be drawing them cards to find the answer they need anyway.Quote:
Hi guys. I have a slot in sb and I'm looking for a card that can help in the 12post MU. Blood Moon is a good card, but there are other choices that can help in other hard MUs like Show and Tell and Reanimator. Ensnaring Bridge or Humility for example.
What of those three cards do you prefer?
That said, i'd like to read your opinions about the Jund MU, as i'll play the final event of our local legacy league this weekend and i expect Jund to be the most played deck. I'm not sure it's a good MU, since Abrupt Decay, Lily and Confindant are good against us, and the Punishing Fire combo can be annoying too. I'll see if i can get my hands on a Counci's Judgement or two to fight Liliana and Sylvan Library. Although i'm not a fan of Misdirection, would it be a good idea to play 1 or 2 replacing some FoW? What would be a good sideboarding advice? Keranos looks strong here as long as he doesn't come down too late. I play a list similar to Einherjer's one, though with just 2 ponders and an extra Vendilion Clique and a land on the mainboard.
Thanks in advance for you help!
None of those cards really stop them because they will just fetch a basics and repeal or kgrip your hate eventually. But ebridge and humility are pretty bad. The still get there etb/when cast triggers respectively. Blood moon is your best bet but even that isn't great. It also wins games to against the greedy GBx midrange decks.Quote:
Originally Posted by lemariont
Of those, Blood Moon is the best; Humility and Ensnaring Bridge do next to nothing. Still, don't plan on beating 12-Post with any consistency. You can play perfectly, draw reasonably well, and still lose. Honestly, your best bet is to add more Cliques and hope to get a Clique/Venser + Karalas lock or an early Entreat that you can guard from Repeals. Pithing Needle can also do a lot of work.Quote:
Originally Posted by lemariont
Oh yeah and nice alters, Andreas-Schnaas! I look forward to seeing the whole deck. Those Tops are particularly nice.
Too bad the new Jace is a "Jace"
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/cards/ma...ving-guildpact
It would have been great as another WC (EOT Terminus, draw, Jace 3.0. 7 cards against 0 and empty board)
too bad TMS is just better
Honestly don't think it looks all that great. I don't think this would be playable even if TMS didn't exist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poron
It doesn't protect itself and doesn't generate card advantage. Its ability is significantly worse than many others. Its Ultimate is powerful, purely because of how quickly it can happen, but TimeTwister/Mindtwist is probably not good enough a lot of the time anyway.
Anyway, went undefeated with only a single unintentional draw in R1 today.Played my previous list making the following changes:
-2 Preordane
-1 Spell Snare
-2 Entreat the Angels
+2 Ponder
+1 Red Elemental Blast
+2 Vendilion Clique
Board:
-1 Red Elemental Blast
-2 Vendilion Clique
+1 Spell Snare
+1 Entreat the Angels
+1 Rest in Peace
Played against Scapeshift Nic Fit (Draw), Smokestacks, Mirror (1-0 with a concession without G2), Shardless BUG, Burn. T4 against Stacks again, split finals with Dredge. (Because I don't care how many RiPs I have, fuck that.) Won a box of Conspiracy and 8 more packs. Got an Exploration. Woop woop. (Usually it's a dual Land. Sadness.) Deck was super sweet. Never cast REB in G1, Snare was particularly underwhelming, only really hitting a Burning Wish in the first round, and a Chalice against Stacks. I had two games where I Ultimated a Jace and then killed them with Angels before they decked. Which was really fucking sweet.
I now agree with the Ponder > Preordane. Preordane is better in ways that really just don't matter for the consistency that Ponder gives at being excellent 100% of the time. I also hate main decked Vendilion Clique, but it seems necessary for just killing people at some point. Won with Jace in around half of my games, the other half were Angels, one game was Clique, shortly followed by a pair of Angels. (Stuck on 4 Lands after being double Armageddoned.)
EDIT: Also, VS Shardless, I'm on a plan of just burn out any countermagic they have and let them do whatever they want. If you can untap with Counterbalance for a single turn to Entreat with a Force on top you should be able to end the game swiftly. Though I've had limited testing against someone who's only just started playing Legacy, when we swapped decks I still felt a lot of pressure from Angels constantly threatening to just take the game. Just board in all the Entreats, Cliques, Balances, Jaces, and everything else. Cut your countermagic. I played the Spell Snares, it was not good. The only thing I'd want is REB. G2 is all about just Terminusing and StPing things that can kill Jace, and setting up that perfect Entreat. They also often just don't have a way to kill the Balance. Also if you can find a second Top at any point in the early game you can bait them into killing your other one as if your digging for countermagic. This Decaying a Top is something most people won't turn down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YamiJoey
Well, if you watch SCG Portland Final, it is Miracles vs Shardless BUG. The commentators were correct. It is a contest for resources and they attack Miracles from multiple angles. Their cards are all about values.
I remember Joe once said it on stream that people might consider Ajani before Keranos. Did anyone try Ajani Vengeant? Feels like resolving either one would most likely win the game.
Big grats to Michael for the finish, but I wasn't a fan of how he navigated those games or how he sideboarded. I think Shardless BUG is all about value, but that's only a trap for us. We can't realistically fight their 2-for-1s and gain any value. The way we win is with trumps like Jace and Entreat. Our Jace is better than theirs, although somewhat harder to protect. I can count a full 8 or 9 cards that I'd love to board in from his list against Shardless, I'm not sure why things like Spell Pierce were still there post-board. Also skeptical on how he navigated that game three against American Delver. I don't think there was any reason to run two Plows and a Top all into soft countermagic. Second is still a great finish though.
We don't beat Shardless if we play Magic. My post-board plan may actually just involve getting Force, Force, Blue Spell, Blue Spell, and then casting Terminus into Jace or Entreat. (Or Jace into Terminus or whatever it needs to be.) Get a bomb out there and kill them. They can't actually deal with our bombs if we throw a little bit of umph behind them once they're on the table, so all we need to do is not die.
Also bring in RiP. They will Decay it and you will not care because you will slam your second Counterbalance and ask them how much damn removal they have left, and the answer will either be 'none' or they simply won't be applying pressure, so you're winning anyway. Always just leave a backup plan for yourself somewhere, and you will find an opportunity to resolve it and take the game out from underneath them. Don't let them play real Magic. If they land a Goyf throw a Swords at it, nothing else is fast enough to let them just keep that, so you'll get 3-1's with Terminus, or you just won't care about the cards on the Battlefield.
Except Tar Pit. That's a ballache to deal with when it goes super late.
Not a fan of Counterbalance though, what do you sideboard out if you're leaving that in? RIP and REB alone are 4 or 5 slots, plus Council's Judgment and any extra Entreat/Keranos stuff, maybe a Verdict or two.
I can respect someone who exclusively plays the two best decks in the format, though. ;)
I don't pull in the Verdicts in the MU. My current plan is to cut the other countermagic for those slots, so I'm going to have to do some work on it if I intend to keep Forces in. That said, they do usually pull out all of their Forces, so I can possibly still cut a Counterspell, Spell Snare, and a Force for a pair of REBs and an Entreat to begin with, then we can look elsewhere for the other changes. I think Snapcaster Mage can come out. It's worse with RiP, but also just sort of less useful in the MU. The 2/1 does flat zero against them, but 3 REB/2 Snap does seem like a tasty combo. Like I said, I'll have to do some work on the MU and see if I can make the deck into some kind of "Hardcast Force of Will, untap to kill you" combo deck like it was when I played Helm. (Winning games by simply making a T4 RiP -> Counterspell, T5 Helm and zero other Spells was sweet.)
I think most Shardless players are going to leave in their FoWs (and even bring the fourth in if it's in the SB) precisely because the way we beat them is with haymakers.
I tried Ajani once. He was a little hard to cast at times (maybe I need to try again with a basic Mountain). He can keep cards such as Creeping tar-pit tapped but most of the time he did little more than a couple of Helix's and then died.Quote:
Originally Posted by twndomn
When my meta got saturated with Shardless BUG, I started bringing in 2 Redirect out of the board. It basically won the game any time I cast it. Very rarely did I feel like I wanted another card when I drew it.
Basically, my approach to the matchup is to first not die to Goyf, then just basically ignore anything they're doing. I don't try to fight their card advantage; most of the cards they're drawing simply won't matter--they're just going to draw more CA, or some small bodies, or discard. Early Liliana's have to be countered or answered, but late ones tend to have no text. I look to overload their Abrupt Decays, and seek to play as many 2 for 1s as possible.
If I'm on a list that has 3 Entreat in the 75, I doubt I'd bring in REB as we're basically just a combo deck, and I don't want to be wastelanded off of WW. In a 1 Entreat list, I'd consider REB, but again the card's real role in the matchup is to hit Force of Will. We could get rid of that Force of Will just as effectively by playing another threat or more removal. Low-Entreat lists often have Stoneforge+Batterskull, which is extremely strong especially when we're already stretching their removal.
Given this recent successful list, I'd board like so:
-4 Force of Will
-2 Spell Pierce
+1 Pithing Needle (Note this also stops _all_ of DRS's abilities)
+2 Rest in Peace
+1 Entreat the Angels
+1 Vendilion Clique
+1 Supreme Verdict
I would feel very confident with this going into games 2 and 3.
EDIT: So basically I disagree completely with Einherjer. I would encourage you to at least try my plan out.
Lol Ajani. I don't think that was serious. What does Ajani do? Tap down one land and die from one Tarmogoyf hit. Seems great.
yeah, Ajani does require us to be babysitter. However, it does allow us to gain life, which is the difference between a win or a loss sometimes. Furthermore, it costs 1 less than Keranos, sometimes 1 less is the difference between running into a Spell Pierce or not. I'm not saying I favor one or the other. If one does want to add a high impact card, I would say it's between Keranos and Ajani.Quote:
Originally Posted by lyracian
BAD NEWS for all Miracles players.
http://media-dominaria.cursecdn.com/...8309911897.png
Well..., there goes the CB-T against Elves.
Is siding out CB against elves correct if you know for sure they are boarding in 3x Abrupt decays !?
Im with the Snapcaster version
Cheers
Ajani? Really?
But wait, there've been some good arguments made my twndomn:
1) Ajani costs 1 less mana than Keranos, so it can't be Spell Pierced as easy as Keranos, God of Storms can.
2) And as we are still talking about the Shardless-MU, where he has been proposed: Looks like I've forgot that Shardless BUG has all those Spell Pierces.
Seems like a reasonable choice to me. NOT. What the fuck guys? Ajani? Really? He does like everything worse than Keranos, and nothing better than Jace, the Mind Sculptor too... come on. I'd play Elspeth, Knight-Errant over this guy any day of the week.
As soon as my exams are over I'll answer to the answers on my Shardless-BUG analysis in depth.
Greetings
I appreciate your input on Keranos guys but get your facts straight, he does not get spell pierced at all, illegal target. Therefore he costs less than Ajani and plays around Thalia since on the stack he is a creature.
That's what I was saying, just in a more sarcastic way...
Greetings
So we counter their GSZ/NO like we always would, (or this if they cast it) and move on with our lives.Quote:
Originally Posted by twndomn
EDIT: And who cares? If they land this at least we get to look at some sweet artwork!
Yeah, bad news for...magic players worldwide. Terrible frame....card looks terrible.Quote:
Originally Posted by twndomn
But i don't really see why this would be all that bad for miracle control.
Because elves already run Abrupt Decay from SB, now they run Abrupt Decay And that.Quote:
Originally Posted by YamiJoey
If they resolve a tutor (a big if) and it's finding that instead of teeg or hoof I'm happy.Quote:
Originally Posted by twndomn
less and less elf players are running Teeg, since it messes up their own GSZ and NO, just look at SCG Portland and LV.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArchitect
I wouldn't; Elves isn't particularly well equipped to dig for Abrupt Decays and unlike some MUs where Counterbalance is merely good, against Elves it is absurd.Quote:
Originally Posted by janluis1
And I wouldn't be worried about Reclamation Sage... Sure it's good but they already run Abrupt Decay and it's not like we shouldn't already be wary of GSZ.
upQuote:
Originally Posted by janluis1
I believe that between the printing of reclamation sage and council's judgment, the elf MU should not be worse for miracles than it used to be.
The G1 is a bit better for elves now, with a way of dealing with CB; but post SB you have more ways to deal with progenitus, rod, choke and needle...
They dont have the tools to find decay consistently. So i think its not worthing taking out the cbs.Quote:
Originally Posted by janluis1
Changing the subject, anyone having trouble against ub tezzeret? Its a really hard mu. My friend has one and he put a lot of bombs in like 8 walkers beeing 2 jtms, 4 agents of bolas and 2 tezz the seeker plus 4 chalices, thopter combo, ensnaring bridge and transmute artifact.
Basically if he resolves any single spell above he wins the game, instead of bridge. Chalices turn 1 just wins on the spot.
With sol lands and mana artifacts he can land a jtms asa turn 2. Played 6 games pre board and lost 5. Played 10 games sideboarded and lost 8.
anyone have any tips on the Esper Deathblade match-up? I got throughly trounced by it last night, granted the player was very experienced and I've only been playing miracles for about 5 weeks now. It was my first time playing the match-up. I just felt totally on the back foot the whole game, and by the time I got any kind of meaningful top/balance lock going I had so little breathing room that anything he would get through was game over.
my boarding plan was like this:
-4 fow
-2 spell pierce
+1 supreme verdict
+1 EE
+1 wear/tear
+1 councils judgment (I run one main as well)
+1 pithing needle
+1 entreat (2 main)
I dont know if that was correct but I just went with a general miracles policy that I don't want to be getting into counter wars with fair decks.
Also I lost a miracles mirror by via baneslayer angel, now thats some tech right there!
It's hard to say for certain without knowing your full board. I'd bring in a few REB effects, as it counters TNN and Vindicates JTMS. I don't hate Spell Pierce in this matchup either as they are running Liliana of the Veil along with DRS, but it can become an awkward card late game, so I can see why you'd want it out of your deck. Needle isn't 100% necessary, because of all the hate you've already brought in for artifacts and planeswalkers, and generally Needle is a bad way to deal with Planeswalkers, as it is only temporary and they'll likely bring in some form of hate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ltj999
It's not an easy matchup, per say, but you should definitely have the tools to handle it. Cut down on the number of swords and load up on hate. That deck's primary kill con is TNN with something strapped onto it. Don't be afraid to blast their CA cards like brainstorm and ponder as well, but be careful if you see wasteland and aren't running a singleton mountain. It's better in those cases to leave your volcanic islands in your deck until you absolutely need them. Also, if you have it in your 75, blood moon is absolutely amazing in this matchup, and can often serve to lock them out of the game. Just make sure you get your landbase developed enough first.
EDIT. I also am not 100% set on bringing in a third entreat. It's probably fine but in my mind this game is being won with VClique, Venser, and terminus. We are definitely in the control role for this matchup, and being able to efficiently dodge their own verdicts (their only answer to a resolved entreat, besides maybe EE), is very valuable. A bouncy clique backed up by boardwipes seems good vs TNN decks.
I think Elves is still very positive for Miracles. I always side Counterbalance out anyways, because it belongs to the 15 worst cards postboard. Of course it depends on the SB. Reasons:
.) i played a lot against Elves on Modo and i did lose only a few games, so i can remember every loss against them. I never got grinded out or slowly beaten to death. The games i lost were because they comboed off very early or resolved huge bombs like Choke. Counterbalance is very unreliable in stopping them from comboing off early and countering huge bombs (CMC3/4) and i want consistency.
.) Counterbalance can be very dangerous if they have removal for it postboard, because you tap out they remove it EOT and play one of their combo cards. A minor reason to be honest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adryan
glad im not the only one sharing this opinion.
I played a g2 against elves in GP milan side event last weekend siding out all counterbalance and i left my opponent with 2 dead cards in hand.
He eventually died with the usual entreat the angels after i resolves explosived for 1 and terminus and jace the mindsculptor.
I dont like cb post board because you could actually loose the turn you cast it if elves player get a nice draw. Im more concerned in resolving my removals and answering their hate.
Cheers
There's no rule that says Counterbalance has to be played on turn two when they are just sitting there with Abrupt Decay mana up. The best card against Elves remains Terminus, so if you have the option to leave Terminus (or maybe even a Plow/Counterspell up) then that is probably a strong move. Counterbalance is more for stopping them from rebuilding post-Terminus rather than just getting them from the get-go.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adryan
If you're siding out Counterbalances then what are you bringing/leaving in instead? I think Jace is a much riskier card to tap out for and you don't need more than one (maybe two) Entreats since you absolutely don't want to see one early. Rather than siding out Counterbalances, the best thing to do against Elves (and Storm for that matter) is simply to resolve multiple Counterbalances. They can't have all the removal and the ability to combo off.
I sided out 3 counterbalance - 1 spell pierce and sided in 2 explosives 1 council judgment and 1 counterspellQuote:
Originally Posted by Dzra
im with snapcaster flash list
ghost,
You aren't really supposed to be able to win on any sort of consistent basis. The original version was already difficult, and I believe my updates have made it even harder. Tezzeret has a ton of bombs that Miracles cannot easily deal with, any one of which can win the game. And the sideboard is designed to defeat the cards you most need to bring in. It isn't a commonly played deck though, and has several weaknesses. I wouldn't worry about it.
Thanks man. I though i was doing something wrong. Anyway rebs maindeck improves the mu a litle bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by oarsman
Michael Swailes was goaded into writing a tourney report by some of the Seattle Legacy regulars. He penned this very in-depth and thoughtful write up instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dzra
http://www.reddit.com/r/spikes/comme...en_semifinals/
Imagine if that wily wizard wrote an entire report like that! Now you guys get to see the caliber of Control player we have to deal with in Seattle. It's scary!