Lattice is much better in a list that runs Looting. With Welder active, the cost to get it into play is much more reasonable than six mana.
That being said, I’m going to experiment with a quad LED list at some point.
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Lattice is much better in a list that runs Looting. With Welder active, the cost to get it into play is much more reasonable than six mana.
That being said, I’m going to experiment with a quad LED list at some point.
Are you contemplating 4 Welders then? + some amount of the new one?Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Keller
I've been tinkering with a Painter/Bomberman hybrid quite a bit lately.Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Keller
I will say that having 4 LEDs across the 75 feels super busted at times in conjunction with Goblin Welder.
I've been getting some ridiculous board states and very fast wins.
I'm still tweaking the list and it's still probably not the correct build (yet), but it just oozes raw power.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...36/unknown.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...02/unknown.png
Seems interesting. I do agree with someone in the other thread though that it sucks that painter is really just a combo piece in this version without blasts, but space is tight. Welder LED interaction is definitely something I'm interested in with on board tutors and such.
Are there any other color matters kind of cards that could work with painter that are tutorable with karn (other than grindstone)?
Distorting Lens to be a pseudo painter I guess to turn on blasts.
Hall of Triumph for an anthem
Illuminated Folio as draw
Scrying Glass as an also weird draw
I’m working on a new R/b Karn list with Entomb, Goblin Engineer, Welder, LED, and, of course, Karn. I’m also experimenting with the Tainted Pact interaction with Karn.
Sick. I've been thinking about the possibility of just running like a Singleton big day welder Target to get with engineer. I guess the options are mostly like Inkwell, Sphinx of the Steel Wind, maybe the new Bolas double sphere thing, and I guess there's an argument to a main board Lattice to find too. Battlesphere is also a possibility I guessQuote:
Originally Posted by Michael Keller
It really depends on the meta. But yeah, I'm looking into most likely Inkwell Leviathan. It's absolutely devastating against a variety of decks and puts the clock right on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Megadeus
I also think there's value in cards like Phyrexian Metamorph and Duplicant, to a lesser extent.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who has been brewing.
I've even been working on a UB 2-Card-Monte deck, since we are getting the London Mulligan.
Here is a rough draft:
4-Karn-Monte
Land (16)
4x Ancient Tomb
2x Island
4x Polluted Delta
2x Seat of the Synod
2x Swamp
2x Underground Sea
Planeswalker (7)
4x Karn, the Great Creator
3x Narset, Parter of Veils
Instant (4)
4x Brainstorm
Creature (3)
3x Painter's Servant
Artifact (16)
3x Grindstone
3x Helm of Obedience
3x Lion's Eye Diamond
4x Lotus Petal
3x Mox Opal
Sorcery (10)
3x Echo of Eons
3x Ponder
4x Thoughtseize
Enchantment (4)
4x Leyline of the Void
Sideboard
2x Collective Brutality
1x Engineered Explosives
1x Ensnaring Bridge
2x Flusterstorm
1x Grindstone
1x Helm of Obedience
1x Lion's Eye Diamond
1x Mycosynth Lattice
1x Painter's Servant
2x Perilous Voyage
1x Pithing Needle
1x Anvil of Bogardan
edit: also, @Michael Keller, Tainted Pact + Karn sounds nasty.
What is everyone's SB/Wishboard looking like right now?
My current wish targets with 3 Karn is
Pithing Needle
Ensnaring Bridge
2x Tormods Crypt
Grafdiggers Cage
Mycosynth Lattice
Grindstone
3x Thorn of Amethyst
Obviously the second crypt and thorns aren't strictly there for wishing. I feel like I can probably afford to cut something like Cage maybe? I really just want my wish board to pretty much be at the care minimum and maybe for in a 6th blast in my board to board in
How does the interaction between leyline and grindstone work? I assumed it was that 2 exiles cards can’t share colour, so it’s a bit of a nonbo.Quote:
Originally Posted by 8bit9mm
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Grindstone does only care of the color of the cards, and not if they indeed go to the graveyard. So it does work.Quote:
Originally Posted by schweinefettmann
This has been confirmed many times by judges, alas I'm not able to find a reference right now.
Grindstone says: "If both cards share a color, repeat this process." That condition applies even if the cards were put into a zone other than what Grindstone's ability says, because they retain the "color" property in all zones (and are affected by Painter's Servants ability in all zones).
I'm on 4 Karn and have 4 exclusive wish targets (as in I never plan on boarding them in): Mycosynth Lattice, LED, Grindstone, and Ensnaring Bridge.Quote:
Originally Posted by Megadeus
The rest of the board is:
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Tormod's Crypt (might be 1 Crypt, 1 Faerie Macabre)
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sorcerous Spyglass (might be 1 Phyrexian Revoker, though I do like the ability to name Wasteland or Thespian's Stage)
3 Trinisphere (might go down to 2 in favor of a 4th GY interaction card depending on how the London Mulligan shakes out, probably Surgical Extraction)
1 Blood Moon
2 Magus of the Moon
I have no qualms boarding in all of the graveyard hate, all of the Trinispheres, and all of the Needle effects in matchups that call for them early and where finding them with Karn could be too slow. I think if I do go up to 4 GY hate cards in the SB, I could see leaving a Crypt or Relic to wish for in postboard games.
The consideration for Revoker or Macabre is (obviously) that Recruiter can find them. I think Macabre is a slightly weaker card compared to Crypt or Surgical but having 4 ways to find it does encourage a split. Does anyone have experience on Revoker vs Needle/Spyglass?
Generally, I think having a small dedicated wish package (like 5 or fewer cards) along with artifacts that CAN be wished for G1 but most likely all come in postboard is the way to go in order to maximize the efficiency of SB slots. TES adheres to a similar principle: "We try not to play an entire sideboard full of Burning Wish targets as doesn’t create the greatest value out of our available slots. Generally, I try to have no more than six or seven Burning Wish targets." (from theepicstorm.com). The stock TES list has 5 dedicated Burning Wish targets plus a sixth target in 3 Empty the Warrens, and often will board in 2 of the ETW in postboard games.
@Megadeus - how have the Thorns been? I was considering them over the Trinispheres.
Good thought on not over loading the board with too many Karn targets. Maybe I'll shave mine down a bit. I like Macabre because the recruiter thing. Being able to turn 1 a recruiter for macabre probably makes a number of hands more keepable even though Macabre is a weaker card. Also with the London Mulligan happening for sure it might change my board a bit too we'll see. Thorns have been fine for me. Not much storm around me though so I just generally bring them in against like deaths shadow and show and tell where they're fine but probably would be better off being something else. I just like that we can leverage The fact that a lot of our game plan revolves around creatures, and that I'm more likely to have 2 mana turn 1 than 3 for Trinisphere. I just feel like turn 1 thorn is so important against the decks that you want it against that it's worth the slightly weaker effect. Though I am debating a single 3 ball once engineer comes out just to find off of him to try to have game against Omniscience.
As for Revoker I value the ability to find it off recruiter and also it's ability to shut off artifact Mana like LED and Diamond since I have moons to beat depths stuff
Next weekend is our big local quarterly. Used to be just legacy but it's teams this time. I think this list is what I'm gonna be on. Bolts over clasm might be wrong, but Keller said they've been great in shortcake so I believe him
Imperial Painter:
Maindeck (60)
3 Goblin Welder
1 Goblin Cratermaker
2 Goblin Engineer
4 Painter's Servant
4 Imperial Recruiter
1 Magus of the Moon
2 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
3 Karn, the Great Creator
4 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Lotus Petal
3 Grindstone
3 Smuggler's Copter
1 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Blood Moon
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
2 Great Furnace
10 Mountain
Sideboard (15)
1 Faerie Macabre
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Grindstone
1 Pithing Needle
3 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Mycosynth Lattice
Shared via TopDecked MTG
https://www.topdecked.me/decks/cc879...c-131db3e442b5
I’m honestly only a believer in Bolt in the mono red versions because white opens up more space with combo involved. I think Bolt is fine in either deck, but I like Pyroclasm actually better than Bolt out of the sideboard.
But I’m also working on a Rb build that uses Plague Engineer, Entomb and Thoughtseize. So I’ll keep you posted.
I'm definitely very interested. Welder is the reason I love the deck and Entomb in this build has always interested me. I'm trying not to be too graveyard dependant so I'm only on a couple EngineersQuote:
Originally Posted by Michael Keller
Goblin Engineer has been very good. Currently only testing it as a 1-of. The fact that Recruiter can chain to Grindstone is a big deal. My current list:
Land (22)
10 Mountain
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Great Furnace
Creature (18)
1 Goblin Cratermaker
1 Goblin Engineer
2 Goblin Welder
4 Imperial Recruiter
1 Magus of the Moon
3 Painter's Servant
1 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Spellskite
Planeswalker (6)
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
4 Karn, the Great Creator
Other Spells (14)
4 Blood Moon
1 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Grindstone
4 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
Sideboard (15)
1x Ensnaring Bridge
1x Grindstone
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Mycosynth Lattice
1x Painter's Servant
1x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Red Elemental Blast
1x Surgical Extraction
2x Tormod's Crypt
1x Walking Ballista
UR Delver
-4 Blood Moon
-1 Magus of the Moon
-1 Phyrexian Revoker
+4 Lightning Bolt
+2 Red Elemental Blast
UW Control:
-4 Blood Moon
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Goblin Cratermaker (except Stoneblade)
-1 Magus of the Moon
+4 Lightning Bolt
+2 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Surgical Extraction (except Stoneblade)
DnT/Maverick:
-2 Blood Moon
-2 Red Elemental Blast
+4 Lightning Bolt
Elves:
-4 Blood Moon
-0~1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Magus of the Moon
+4 Lightning Bolt
+1~2 Red Elemental Blast
Storm:
-4 Blood Moon
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Goblin Cratermaker
+1 Phyrexian Revoker
+2 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Surgical Extraction
+2 Tormod’s Crypt
Show and Tell:
-4 Blood Moon
-1 Magus of the Moon
+1 Phyrexian Revoker
+2 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Surgical Extraction
+1 Tormod’s Crypt
Reanimator:
-4 Blood Moon
-1 Goblin Cratermaker
-1 Magus of the Moon
+1 Phyrexian Revoker
+2 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Surgical Extraction
+2 Tormod’s Crypt
Think you just freed up 4 maindeck slots for other cards.Quote:
Originally Posted by L10
Hah, the SB guide only includes the MUs I played most recently, which I admit makes Blood Moon look bad, but here are some examples where I think Blood Moon shines.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaynel
Eldrazi:
-4 Pyroblast
-2 Red Elemental Blast
+4 Lightning Bolt
+1 Phyreian Revoker
+1 Walking Ballista
Grixis Delver:
-1 Magus of the Moon
-1 Phyreian Revoker
-2 Red Elemental Blast
+4 Lightning Bolt
Canadian:
-1 Magus of the Moon
-1 Phyreian Revoker
+2 Red Elemental Blast
Grixis Control
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Goblin Cratermaker
-1 Magus of the Moon
+2 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Surgical Extraction
Lands:
-1 Goblin Cratermaker
-1 Magus of the Moon
-2 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Phyrexian Revoker
+1 Surgical Extraction
+2 Tormod's Crypt
4c Loam
-1 Magus of the Moon
-4 Pyroblast
-2 Red Elemental Blast
+2 Tormod's Crypt
+4 Lightning Bolt
+1 Surgical Extraction
12 post
If you see Emrakul G1:
-1 Red Elemental Blast
+1 Tormod’s Crypt
Else: No SB
And even vs. many MUs where Blood Moon is not great in G2/3, is still fine G1; like vs. Miracles, Blood Moon G1 disincentives BTB.
As for the SB, I actually think Pithing Needle and Sorcerer Spyglass are slightly better wish targets than Phyrexian Revoker, but Phyrexian Revoker maps out better in a few MUs. The difference in power level are marginal in practice.
I'm also brewing an all-in Welder/Engineer build, but I think the more classic prison approach is still very viable.
PS: I also like Liquimetal Coating, but don't have the space for it. I might replace Lattice since Lattice feels like a win-more a lot of times.
Edit: Fixed some SB numbers.
Haha, I'm right there with you, I definitely agree that Moon effects belong somewhere in the 75. We take very different approaches to the maindeck and SB though. No consideration for any Thorn/Trinisphere effects in the sideboard? It is kind of a nombo with Blasts, but the only matchups where you're bringing in Trinispheres and not boarding out Blasts are like, Miracles, Sneak and Show, ANT, and maybe Delver? Matchups where a resolved Trinisphere is pretty backbreaking anyways and you can still fight with your 1mana counterspells to punch it through. I do see the appeal of Lightning Bolts and would like to slot them in but I think the Trinispheres would have to be cut in favor and I'm not sure if it's worth it or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by L10
I was also toying with the idea of Liquimetal Coating, and like you said, I think Lattice would need to be cut. But I have won about 25% of games with Karn into LED into Lattice. Though Coating seems strong to wish for in the face of walkers and turning off a land for the turn doesn't seem too terrible?
My list for reference is:
4 Ancient Tomb
3 City of Traitors
9 Mountain
4 Great Furnace
4 Lotus Petal
1 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Smuggler’s Copter
4 Imperial Recruiter
4 Painter’s Servant
3 Goblin Welder
3 Goblin Engineer
2 Goblin Cratermaker
4 Karn, the Great Creator
3 Grindstone
1 Umezawa’s Jitte
1 Lightning Greaves
4 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
SB:
1 Grindstone
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Lion’s Eye Diamond
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Blood Moon
3 Trinisphere
7 sol lands, 25 mana sources total, 21 ways to crew Copter (17 men + 4 Karn). I like having as much consistency in the maindeck as possible and let things get a little more toolboxy postboard. Jitte and Greaves are currently flex slots I'm testing out, were previously Karn, Scion of Urza but I'm trying to keep things a little bit lower to the ground. On paper the equipment are solid Engineer targets, strong vs control and can do a little bit better vs Delver than more 4-drops that get Bolted.
I do like Thorn and Trinisphere in the SB, but not for the PW-centric build. I find that most of the time, if I can jam a PW, my chances of winning against both fair and unfair decks rises significantly. Against decks with counter magic, I would ideally have RRR2 mana ready to cast both PW and blast for protection, hence me having access to 8 blasts in the 75. If I play Thorn or Sphere, I would need RRR4 mana, which is harder to manage. My mana base is higher than most builds (14 Red Lands, 8 Sol Lands, 4 SSG) to compensate the higher mana curve.
Chandra alone can carry most games by herself (90% vs. fair decks, 80% unfair decks). Even if my opponent manages to get rid of Chandra, they would have expend so much resource or turns that it gives me to window to set up the combo and win. If I can jam Karn, my chance of winning vs. both fair and unfair decks are around ~85%-95%, which is why I am playing the full set.
The reason why I am considering to swap the Lattice for Coating is because Lattice is harder to jam the same turn I resolve Karn with my build unless I am already flooding out or have Chandra on the field. In your deck, LED/Lattice is better due to welder/engineer/copter shenanigans. Also, I find these cases pretty identical:
Karn -> Wish for LED -> Wish for Lattice
Karn -> Wish for Grindstone -> Wish for Painter
For Lightning Bolt vs. Thorn/3Sphere for my build in particular:
1. Vs. Miracles, it kills PW, Mentor, and Clique, allowing you to save blasts for the combo, CB, or BTB depending on your mana situation.
2. Vs. Stoneblade, same reasoning as Miracles, but also kills SFM.
3. Vs. Delver, it kills Dreadhorde Arcanist, which can carry their game. There are also corner cases where Wasteland can get you.
4. Thorn is a nonbo for my PW-centric strategy of this build in particular, see above.
I will comment on your build in particular when I get the chance after work.
I like the direction of your deck. It's pretty similar to something I am considering to try, now that I have first hand experience of Engineer.
I am not sure about Jitte in the main because most of the creatures we have don't attack well. If I were to choose a creature removal artifact in the main, I'd probably go for Pyrite Spellbomb. Pyrite Spellbomb can also cantrip, so it's not completely ever dead. I think Jitte is better in the SB.
I like the idea of Lightning Greaves for protection, but I think Spellskite works better in that function. If you are primarily using Lightning Greaves to activate Welder and Engineer, I'd actually consider Thousand-Year Elixir. You get immediate value from Welder and Engineer, and can untap them for second activation.
I will also consider to try Filigree Familiar and Solemn Simulacrum as a way to generate raw card advantage like we used to do with SDT. Filigree Familiar can be tutored by both Engineer and Recruiter, and life gain can be relevant. Solemn Simulacrum can only be tutored by Recruiter, but provides more CA than Filigree Familiar.
For the SB, I think I will try 2:1 split between Damping Sphere and Trinisphere. Since you are only playing 2 Moon effects, Damping Sphere can act as additional Moons vs. 12-post and Eldrazi.
Fwiw engineer can find any artifact regardless of Mana cost. He can only get back 3 or less CMC though
That's what I get for posting at 5AM, pre-coffee.
I also like the idea of a minor black splash for Nihil Spellbomb because it can generate CA with Welder and Engineer, is an out vs. SnT, and can be randomly good vs. grave synergies. But I like the stable manabase of mono-red too much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by L10
I don't like Pyrite Spellbomb because 2 damage just doesn't cut the mustard against Arcanist or a lot of other threats. The creatures don't HAVE to be good attackers, that's the whole idea of Jitte imo. And one -1/-1 activation on Arcanist shuts it down for the turn. And I don't really like the idea of paying 2 life for Spellskite in aggressive matches, though it is a nice blocker. Regardless I need to keep testing them. Didn't come up enough in matches. Also still up in the air with Bolt vs Trinisphere. Need to test the 3ball for vs Delver, but imo the Bolts felt low impact in my playtesting yesterday. I think handling multiple threats in 1 card is really necessary. Trinisphere weakens both Arcanist and Young Pyro and is an absolute must counter for them which can open up jamming the combo.
Bolts were nice vs Goblins, but they are like a turn 4 deck at the fastest. Just have to be aware of Wastelands and play around them if possible.
I'm not that interested in grindy cards. I think blasts are enough vs blue decks and Familiar and Solemn are more cute than anything (yeah yeah so are the equipment).
Damping Sphere is not a bad idea and I have considered that before, though in the matches where you want it as Trinisphere, having your Sol lands online is nice.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I’ve on and off tested sword of red and white I think it was. Gain life per card in hand and deal damage per card in opposing hand? The protection colours are relevant, and it racks up damage quick, and moves us away from low life totals. It’s great when I get it, but seemed a bit too niche to be used effectively.
I’ve also been testing coating + shenanigans and have been pretty impressed so far. Super slow though, but much more resilient and flexible than shaman. Can’t be tutored though, so that’s really irritating.
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Seems that we need to shake thinks up here.
what about the new tools for our deck? I already give up on recruiter with the goblin engineer. we can get away of chalice and do some crazy sh3t with welder and engineer.
the new tools
Karn, the great creator and goblin engineer.
CalebD used a similar list to mine, but with recruiter. I think that the deck gain a lot of power level with the new goblin and karn.
used this list in some playtesting and 14-2 against dat/miracles/dragon stompy/UR delver
5 mountain
3 Great Furnace
4 ancient tomb
3 Darksteel Citadel
2 city of traitors
2 Cavern of Souls
4 Goblin Welder
4 Goblin Engineer
3 Painter Servant
1 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Lotus Petal
3 Grindstone
1 Ensnaring Bridge
4 pyroblast
4 red elemental blast
4 faithless looting
3 blood moon
3 blood sun
3 Karn, the Great Creator
sideboard
4 Leyline of the void
2 abrade
3 sulfur elemental
1 ensnaring bridge
1 mycossint lattice
1 painter servant
1 grindstone
1 spellskite
1 helm of obedience
1 Racthet bomb
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Liquimetal Coating
3-1 tonight with a fairly standard list. Only deviation was 2 Ensnaring bridge main, 1 side. A lot of depths decks in our area. Beat Dredge 2-0, was lucky game one I blasted a turn 2 breakthrough and slowed him enough to get bridge going with welder and blasted flayer of the hatebound with dread return for grave troll on the stack. Lost to elves. Turn 2 Moon on the play not good enough. Beat lands. Moon game 1, turn 2 combo game 2. Beat sneak n show. Bridge after he show and tells emrakul and I put in recruiter for engineer to get bridge. Game 2 he surgical my engineered bridge but doesn't draw any action and I bring the mediocre beats.
One really interesting thing I saw tonight is how people change how they board against me depending on what they see game 1. Like dredge boarded in leylines because I beat him with welder stuff. And sneak and show boarded in surgical because I was doing welder tricks as well. All of this even though in my personal opinion grave hate isn't really that good against the deck. Maybe with engineer things are a bit different but both times my opponent used their grave hate to slow me down I was totally fine with it because it just meant they had one less good card for their gameplan
This list looks very similar to what I had in mind. Though, I'm wondering why you would play looting over gamble? Looting is not as good a searcher, but granted that you have more control over what you discard. Thoughts?Quote:
Originally Posted by painhomoser
I think that looting in a list with both Welder and Engineer is an excellent idea. Especially looting over Gamble. Wit Looting you at least have some control over what you discard.
The only thing I'm wondering is why Blood Sun? In the current meta with lots of Depths isn't it a liability over Moon?
Blood sun: for depths it does the same as blood moon, except it doesn't affect urborg / make non-basic mana producing lands only produce red. It stops wasteland, fetches, dark depths (in the same way as blood moon), thespians stage, and draws a card.. it's redundancy. I kind of like it.
Another Painter monstrosity brought to you by CalebD:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2170607#paper
Maindeck:
4 Karn, the Great Creator
4 Goblin Engineer
4 Goblin Welder
2 Imperial Recruiter
3 Painter's Servant
3 Punishing Fire
2 Pyroblast
1 Red Elemental Blast
4 Veil of Summer
1 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Grindstone
1 Ichor Wellspring
2 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
3 Mox Opal
3 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Great Furnace
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
3 Mountain
3 Taiga
Sideboard:
1 Painter's Servant
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Grindstone
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Pithing Needle
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sylvan Library
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Trinisphere
2 Walking Ballista
I'm trying to find room in the list for 2-3 Smuggler's Copters as they seem incredibly good with Punishing Fire. How do we feel about -1 Lion's Eye Diamond and -1 Veil of Summer to make room in the main?
Just cut the Ichor Wellspring and one of the LED's for Copter. You only want to search LED to combo or empty your hand, so 1 is enough. And since Copter draws you cards, the Wellspring is not needed. Just my 2 cents.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesture
Seems like the Wellspring is doing something entirely different though, which is generating card advantage when paired with a Welder. Compared to Looter Scooter, which needs a creature in play plus the Punishing Grove setup to net card advantage.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darklingske
Copter is also contingent in a different way by requiring a creature in play. You really don't want to be turning Engineer or Welder sideways to light up a Copter but rather to do more broken things, which is why I've never really been a fan of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesture
I see your point and was only spitballing idea's. As I see the list of Caleb, I'd rather play it as it stands before making changes. And if I make changes, Copter will not be included. I never liked Copter and I don't play it for several reasons, among which the arguments stated by Michael.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesture
That's fair. I'm a complete newcomer when it comes to this deck, so I'm less trying to convince anyone of anything and more just looking to hear why my ideas are wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darklingske