Grafdigger's Cage or Ground Seal ?
Ground Seal stops Snapcaster Mage, Life from the Loam, Scavenging Ooze, extirpate, Reanimator and some others. Plus, it gets you a card when comes into play.
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Grafdigger's Cage or Ground Seal ?
Ground Seal stops Snapcaster Mage, Life from the Loam, Scavenging Ooze, extirpate, Reanimator and some others. Plus, it gets you a card when comes into play.
My version is is actually the exact same to meddlingmages with -1 pithing needle +1 candelabra.
Im gonna have to respectfully agree and hope you try out the titans. I cant remember a game I lost after resolving a Titan though it might have happened. Titan forces them to deal with the additional threats of the +2 lands and the titan itself to not get overrun next turn.
I've played a solid 20 real games on Cockatrice. I tried Elephant Grass and Living Wish, but I cut Pithing Needles so I could also run Expedition Map. The purpose of map has been primarily to find a green source with posts. Having additional creature search was nice; when I was ready with the right amount of mana, I could always drop a creature. I decided to try Primeval Titan and see what all the hype was about. Turns out its a utility creature, not a win condition, something easily explained. I found that dropping it leads to a win if you know what you're doing, ie. Glimmerpost tricks to put yourself out of reach spell range, Chasm to close them off from winning with creatures (though this gets tricky if you can't attack), or Tabernacle to wipe their board..
Elephant Grass was completely unnecessary most times when I boarded it in, as was Moment's Peace; Glimmerpost gains you enough life to put you out of reach spell range and Tabernacle keeps them off of their creatures (especially if you get down Needle --> Wasteland). The best of the innovations I tried was certainly Terastadon. Card is a fucking BEAST. If it hit the board, I won. I'm sure you guys have run into Liliana of the Veil. This card is ridiculously good against us. We can't put a clock on Liliana and we can't get rid of it unless we play Needle or All is Dust. Liliana nukes your hand until she gets to 6, and then she can nuke half of your board, which is extremely devastating given that you need every land to drop a dude. Once you drop a dude, she can make you sacrifice him, even Emrakul. Jace presents a similar problem, though not quite as daunting. Terastadon has been dealing with walkers nicely, and equipment. In a few games, my opponent had multiple equipment on the field. Terastadon got rid of all of them and proceeded to take the game. Another game, I was able to completely lock my opponent out of the game by playing Terastadon, destroying his three lands (after one Wasteland on his fourth), and then drop Tabernacle to destroy his team, and my 3 Elephant tokens. Fantastic synergy there. Lighter synergy, but synergy, I've destroyed my Glimmerposts to make 18 power on my side, and then use Crucible to bring them back and gain more life and put myself out of Burn range (against Burn). I think Terastadon is way better than Kozelik. Kozelik draws you 4 cards but thats pretty much only good with Exploration. Terastadon is 2 cheaper than Kozelik, he can actually target the troublesome permanents the turn he hits play rather than upon attack so you still get something out of it even if he eats swords, and Terastadon can put 18 power on the field vs. Kozelik's 12.. though usually you play Terastadon for 15 and destroy one of their troublesome permanents. I tried Kozelik and every time I was wishing it was Terastadon. Give him a try. I've been playing a 7 creature list 2 Emrakul, 3 Titan, 2 Terastadon. I've wanted Kozelik to be in the deck a few times when I had Eye and not enough land to play Emrakul, but the deck pulled its weight without Kozelik and I won those games anyway.
In regards to Living Wish, its good and I think it makes the deck more consistent in some respects, but the deck needs to run Pithing Needle so I dropped Wish. Expedition Map is unfortunately necessary because you need ways to find a Forest for colorless mana.
Also, as much as I like SDT.. I think this deck can make use of Sylvan Library. Against some decks, Glimmerposts leave me with more life than I can use, but I sit on a top drawing one card per turn, and am forced to wait a turn sometimes if I want to keep the top and play the shuffle effect next turn. Library would allow the deck to be really explosive with Exploration. Glimmerpost x2, shuffle effect. Next turn, Vesuva, Titan.. etc. Paying 8 life can go a long way with this deck, and it has the resources to do it more than once.
Other than that, this deck is the most fun I've had playing Magic in quite a long time. The deck is easy to play and has a lot of complex interactions for a deck thats seemingly 'just trying to drop a fatty'. I've been able to even race Burn every game, which was surprising to me, but Glimmerposts really kick ass. Crop Rotation into early Tabernacle screwed a lot of decks, destroying acceleration plays like Noble Hierarchs and GSZ --> Dryad Arbor. I had trouble against Sneak/Show. Needle helped but they simply drop Emrakul faster. I played one HILARIOUS game against some scrub but he kicked my ass... with Elvish Piper. Both games.. turn 4 Elvish Piper, turn 5 Emrakul. Couldn't beat it. Laughed my ass off though. I'll be playing this deck on Cockatrice for a while.
Considering this deck has the availability of fetches and crucibles, have splashes been considered? And if so, what colors/cards?
First of all, im really happy you understand the power of Primeval Titan and how useless is Elephant Grass.
About the "Terastodon" issue : Think a little different. No one said that Tera is not a great creature. We just say that is out of the deck's philosophy. It has no synergy with Turbo Eldrazi. His ability is to destroy, and for that we already have All is Dust. If you think 3 All is Dust are not enough, add more. Furthermore, he has nothing to offer to our goal (remember his role in Reanimator and how quickly clears the board in 2nd turn), who is "how to cast Emrakul as soon as possible" Elvish Piper? Great creature too. Why dont we add him too? Mmm... its obviously "out of the philosophy". (first about your games vs Piper, you had to needle him, or if Emrakul entered the battlefield returned him with Karakas)
We dont want to win with Terostodon, or with Show and Tell, or with Eureka, or with Piper, or with Tooth and Nail. We have a purpose, and we must stay strictly to the lines. It was a bad move, you cut Pithing Needles. Needles stop Plainswalkers, and Wastelands among other threats.
Terastodon is no way better than Kozilek. Kozilek is a 12/12 creature with an Ancestral Recall+1 attached to him (Emrakul has Time Walk) and with no drawbacks like Terastrodon. Plus he destroys too, not 3 but 4 permanents (next turn if survives - use Karakas on him). If you love to Destroy pemanents, use Ulamog (+Karakas). But in your games, you focused on Terastodon, you probably have won some games with him forgetting your target, and you thought you found the "golden hen". But you deceived :smile:
"Sylvan Lirary" issue : Not only is slower than SDT, but needs a G mana as well. Searches only in upkeep (that's bad), and is destroyed with All is Dust. With the same casting cost i prefer to play Sylvan Scrying, than Sylvan Library. So, no. Its not a good card for the deck.
Feel free to discuss your thought.
Puzzling.. I must have left Karakas out of the maindeck. That would certainly help against quite a few decks, namely Sneak/Show and Reanimator. Those decks were tripping me up in testing, that should fix that problem.
I still disagree about Terastodon. All is Dust is great and all but remember that it doesn't hit equipment. Also, they can always counter your spells dude. All is Dust and Pithing Needle are great targets. All is Dust gets rid of their clock and Needle stops their Wasteland, equipment, etc. Having more answers to permanents in a deck like this is huge. Annhiliator gets there but you have to attack with it. Honestly I find that my first creature gets killed/removed. Its nice when you know you can blow up your opponents 3 lands and then drop Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, even if you lose Terastodon. That usually leaves them with 1 creature at best by the time I've dropped Tabernacle. Its an excellent play, and you can blow up basic lands with it, leaving the rest to fall victim to Wasteland or Wastelock. I actually make this play more often than making 18 power, or destroying equipment, etc. It just wrecks them.
Its bigger (18/15/12/9 vs. 12) most of the time for 2 mana cheaper (6GG vs. 10). There was one game worth mentioning against Land.dec. I wouldn't have been able to get through with Kozelik because he was Loaming like a bitch with Manabond. He kept Terastodon tied down with Maze of Ith, but my Elephant tokens got through to kill him in 3 turns.
Is drawing 4 cards really that good in this deck? I haven't found it to be as overwhelming as Primeval Titan. Titan gives you card quality. It gives you a combination of 2 lands that manipulates the situation to your favor. Such as.. double Glimmerpost ie. gain somewhere between 7 to 15 life, or Wasteland w/ active Crucible, or Cloudpost/Eye, or Tabernacle, etc. Drawing 4 cards doesn't guarentee you much of anything. Those could be extra Crucibles/Explorations/Candelabras that you don't need after you've resolved a fatty. Even with Eye of Ugin making him 2 cheaper, he's just not the right investment for 8-10 mana that this deck wants to make. Terastodon seals the game with 18 power, destroys lands to drop Tabernacle, or blows up key pieces of equipment and/or walkers. In other words, Terastodon has produced a winning board situation everytime I've dropped him where Kozelik cannot; even if he gets STP'd. He even lays down 4 blockers, a reasonable sized team, for when you really need to hold back and set up your kill. Kozelik cannot do these things. He's purely a fatty that destroys stuff when he attacks, and he refills your hand a little.
EDIT:
More on splashes... has anyone considered a splash? I can't begin to think of what to run but the manabase can already support green. Those could easily be duals. Its not like they are going to gain much out of destroying your non-basics when they lose to Cloudposts.
I don't know what else to say. You are confused between Eldrazi deck and Terastodon deck. You think are the same :( Build a Terastodone deck with 4 of them, drop Kozilek and Emrakul, and create something new :) Probably you win with Terastodone all the time.... but this is not an Eldrazi deck my friend. Open a new threat to find help :)
Terastodone does not destroy permanents if its countered. But with Kozilek you draw 4 cards even if he get. And shuflles back to the library, while Tera is remaining dead in the grave. Thats a big drawback.
Yeah you can stick to Eldrazi as your creatures if you like.. that doesn't mean you are playing the optimal creatures (this argument is pretty bad anyway if you consider Titan). Merfolk didn't decide against Phantasmal Image cause it wasn't a Merfolk. Dragon Stompy plays Gathan Raiders. Who cares what the dam creature type is? Eye of Ugin cutting Kozelik down to 8 mana makes him playable, he's way overcosted at 10 imo. Still, I'm not dropping the Eldrazi entirely just playing better creatures.
Drawing 4 cards for 12 mana is terrible, even if you can't counter that effect. The point is what happens when the creature resolves; this drawback is barely worth noting. If you are really worried about running into countermagic, you drop Emrakul or you play more creatures that can't be countered.
My point is simple; Terastodon has a much stronger board presence than Koziliek. You're putting a game ending amount of power on the board (18), blowing your opponent's land up into Tabernacle, destroying key pieces of equipment and/or walkers, and you have the option of laying down 4 blockers.
Koziliek draws you 4 cards, swings for 12, and destroys 4 permanents of the opponent's choice every time it attacks. But... it loses to an active walker. It loses to a removal spell. It loses to certain equipment. It also loses to a superior board presence on the other side. If they have a bunch of creatures, you'd wish you had the Tabernacle + Terastodon play available, or 4 creatures to hold the fort.
Terastodon can provide a lasting board presence even if it dies. Koziliek will merely draw refill your hand.
It would be nice if you could provide a better counterargument than 'build a Terastodon deck'. I'm actually interested in this deck so it would be nice if you took me more seriously. Stop being a slave to the theme. You don't need to run 6 out of 6 Eldrazi creatures for it to be Turbo Eldrazi.. half the creatures you run aren't Eldrazi anyway.
All is Dust destroying Sylvan Library is pretty imporant. I guess SDT is better.
I tried to explain you step by step, every choice in this deck. Let me do it again one more time, to come to a conclusion : Do you agree that Emrakul is a better win condition than Terastodon? Yes you agree. Why? Because a) Its uncounterable, b) Its untouchable, c) It has continues* time walk, d) it has annihilator e) its flier f) its 15/15 g) its Legendary creature, and that matters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vacrix
Is it worth to built something and win with him? Yes it is. Why? Because by the time you find 20 mana and Emrakul hits the board, he will never leave. *Opponent will never play again. So you will have as many turns as you want, until you leave him without permanents. The combo here is to bring and play again and again Emrakul. Using Eye to fetch the 2nd and cast him, or use Karakas to bounch him. If you use Eye of Ugin, and cast the 2nd Emrakul, you deserve a 2nd turn. By the time he enters the battlefield, both die due to Legendary rule. But you dont care, because you still play again. Its your turn, you play again. Bring him back. Time walk. You play again. Attack for 15 and annihilator 6. Opponent still lives? Bring him again. Legend rule, but you play again. both dies. Eye again, you bring him back, you play again. Attack for 15 and annihilator 6. And thats all.... play again and again.. With that way you just dont win the game with 18dmg... pfff..., but you really demolish the opponent. He loses everything and im not talking about his permanents, im talking about "hope" for the 2nd game. The fascinating about this deck is that breaks down 3 basic rules of magic : a) 1 mana per land, b) 1 land per turn, c) 1 turn per player.
So, its important to use Emrakul to win, more that any other win condition you have. For example Terastodon is not a good win condition because it gets countered. And even if he enters the board, you re not sure that you win because you give the next turn to the opponent. For example what you do against Humility Nothing. Terastodon is a 1/1 creature that has lost the ability to destroy. And here comes Kozilek AND Ulamog. Kozilek let you draw 4 cards (probably All is Dust inside) and he is still a Legend even in 1/1 form. That means that you may use Katakas for extra 4 cards + 4 cards..... And Ulamog destroy things "straight from the stack". Before enters in.
You must understand that all the deck has designed around Emrakul, and how quickly can get the 15 or 20 mana. Post lands, Candelabras, 11 tutor lands, Explorations, and Titans are here to help you to get 20 mana. Kozilek gives you useful cards, that brings you mana. Kozilek is not a win condition in here. His purpose is to collect cards for mana. His other abilities just help the game as well. And dont compare : "Aaa... Terastodone won me 20 games, and Kozilek 0". You CHOOSE to win with Terastodone. But the plan was to win with Emrakul. For the reasons I wrote on the first paragraph.
So, win with this god dammed Emrakul, you have all the weapons to do so. Drop Terastodon, because its really a shame to this deck. If you dont win with Em, dont win at all...
What.. the fuck...
There's absolutely NO argument here against Emrakul by the way I have no idea how you inferred that. Why would I replace Emrakul? Dudes a baller. Kozelik is the guy I replaced. Thats your whole first paragraph..
Dude. I win with Titan against some decks. I just played a few games against a guy on Discard. He nuked my hand, I managed to land Titan, one swing in and he scooped. Same thing against Burn. Emrakul is great and all, but its not integral to the strategy against EVERY opponent, just opponent's playing countermagic where you have a lot of time to set up a kill, or opponent's who will surely remove your fatty with STP or PtE, etc.
If I can put my opponent on countermagic then I don't bother with Terastodon unless I am in a win now or never situation.. or just have mana to spare. Against Humility? Ok.. and who's playing Humility again? Nobody. Your deck is dead in the water against Humility anyway unless you manage to draw Ulamog and are playing him.
I don't understand this argument... If I have 6GG why should I try mana ramping to 20 to cycle to infinite turns when I can just close the game with some variation on Terastodon? I've mentioned the variations on board position he presents MANY times so I'm not going to go over it again. Are you saying those aren't strong enough for an 8cc creature? You don't need to use another Eldrazi to setup the kill if you can just kill with Terastodon. I just see the play 'LOL GO FOR EMRAKULS""SSSSS' in every single game as win more. For instance, if you can win with Kozelik do you wait and go for Emrakul? Obviously not.. you kill them. If they remove your dude, then you drop Emrakul and kill them.
However, the situations that Ulamog and Koziliek get you out of don't compare to Terastodon. Ulamog gets you out of Humility. Great. I actually like Ulamog way more than Koziliek and have considered running a singleton in place of a Terastodon, but still I think that Terastodon gets you out of way more situations than the other Eldrazi ever could.
What? Who said the plan was win with Emrakul or bust? The plan is win with fat guys whilst setting up the Emrakul kill. Sometimes you have to fetch ALOT of Glimmerposts once you stablize or else Burn is going to get you with reach spells. I'd say I win with Emrakul in less than half my games. Titan pulls its weight and can beast out a win on its own against some decks. I think you give Emrakul too much credit. Honestly, I usually drop a Titan, which gets killed. Then I drop Terastodon and seal the board state. If I get a swing in with Titan then I usually have enough resources to get Eye and another post, and set up the Emrakul kill.Quote:
Originally Posted by MeddlingMageGR
EDIT:
I suggest you test it before you pass judgement on it.
I must first make a disclaimer that I only played a dozen or so games with rocklee's list. It is a complicated deck and there are many lines of play. It would take practice to make better choices. Many small things can make the difference of 1 turn or more, like when to use Expedition Map, what to fetch with it etc. Timing and land decision is everything in this deck. Many times, I find myself missing a better line of play due to inexperience with the deck. You need to be very familiar and very aware to play this deck to the best effects. The mono green version is easier to play and faster but UG has more lines of play with Show and Tell.
I have a question, is Glacial Chasm really necessary for the deck? In the main deck at least? Is it used as an insurance against fast decks?
@Vacrix
I think you missed the boat on Terastodon. The whole point is having tutorable fatties with Eye of Ugin. Terastondon isn't bad, but the fact that it isn't tutorable, makes it a poorer choice than Kozelik or Ulamog. I mean what's wrong with both of them anyway? They are both devastating when casted, removal or not.
Glacial Chasm is a very powerful card. You may bring it into play with Crop Rotation, to prevent something big, or play it alone just to gain 2 maybe 3 turns. Besides that, it makes triangle with Exploration and Crucible of Worlds. Then stays permanent in the game. Its a small combo. You play Glacial, you sacrifise a land, and with Crusible you put it back in the game as a 2nd land from Exploration. This way you dont have to pay every turn the upkeep cost. There are some tricks here... for example you may sacrifise a Glimmerpost, and gain some life when comes back into game. Or if you afraid huge damage (Price of Progress -> instant) while Glacial is in grave you may sac a Vesuva, and bring it back as a copy of Glacial, and then sac Glacial itself. So, you lose only 2 lives per turn, but you're immune to damage.Quote:
Originally Posted by wert
1000+++Quote:
Originally Posted by wert
On the topic of Glacial Chasm.. I had a hilarious game the other day against some sort of Infect pump.dec. It was fast.. but useless once I had Chasm going with a few Glimmerposts to back it up.
I've been playing lately against a lot of decks BW/x running Vindicate, Wasteland, Liliana, Lingering Souls, Swords, and often Loam. These decks have a great matchup against us as they can softlock us with Wasteland (til you find Bojuka Bog) and can Vindicate Cloudposts, Tabernacle, Crucible, etc. stuff that slows us down. Despite ALL that hate, I've actually had a better than 50/50 matchup against these decks, especially once you get more +1 Needle and Cage's postboard. It goes to show how well this deck can play control through hate, despite what seems to be the deck's weak point.
Also.. in all these matchups I've had my creature's Vindicated, Liliana'd, and Swords. In all these matchups, Terastodon was MVP, blowing up Liliana before they can nuke half my board in 2 matches, and in another, taking out his basics so I could wastelock him with Crucible. I know you can't tutor for it, but the issue keeps coming up where I'm sitting on 8-10 mana and Eye.. and I simply don't need to tutor up an Eldrazi. In fact, I usually drop a Titan or Terastodon and then it gets killed. The fact that you can blow up three permanents is so crutch. There's nothing wrong with Ulamog or Koziliek; they simply don't have as much synergy with the rest of the deck as Terastodon does. Blowing up basics into Crucible lock OR Tabernacle has won me too many games to go back to try playing those cards in Terastodon's place. Besides, once I'm at the point where I can use Eye, I 9 times out of 10 have enough mana to lay down Emrakul and force a concession.. so what's the point? The fact that you can tutor for these Eldrazi is meaningless if you are sitting on a top anyway because you can keep manipulating the deck, lay down lands and shuffle til you find a creature. I'm still taking notes on games to see where Koziliek or Ulamog would have been a better choice. There are two games out of maybe 50 in which this is the case and I won those games with Terastodon anyway.
One game.. server crashed but we were at a Standstill. I laid down a Needle to shut of Sneak Attack against Sneak/Show. He plays SnT into Emrakul. I lay down Terastodon and blow up 2 Exploration's and a Candelabra. He's at 15 from Tombs, and I have 6 non-creature permanent's to sacrifice if he swings. You cannot get that board position out of the other Eldrazi in this situation.
EDIT:
Its worth mentioning that I'm 1-3 against TES. Isn't there something better than Trinisphere we can run here? Its great against Burn and all but its really hard to lay down quickly without Exploration or T1 Cloudpost, T2 Glimmerpost --> 3sphere. Leyline of Sanctity might work a little better, as it also has application against Burn. Other than that, I can't think of too many matchups were Trinisphere is relevant.
Snapcaster and ooze dont' give you issues. Extirpate and Reanimator are going to come down faster than you can lay down ground seal. Honestly I wouldn't even SB grafdigger if you aren't running trinket mage.Quote:
Originally Posted by MeddlingMageGR
Faerie Macabre or extraction are far better options, especially since Reanimator's Plan B is go show & Tell, which doesn't work at all versus you.
Glacial chasm is not necessary for the blue deck. My current version only runs tabernacle as its dude-stopping land. If I felt Price of Progress was being played more I would definitely bring it back, but since RuG and Maverick is keeping UR down atm, I'm not as worried.Quote:
Originally Posted by wert
In the Green version, that has smoothing and explosiveness issues, I would absolutely require Glacial Chasm, with Tabernacle being not necessary, but helpful.
@Vacrix
The reason I haven't commented on your statements is you're fundamentally missing the point and power of the deck. Several people have pointed out that you're simply trying to wring a square peg through a circle hole without realizing why it is bad. You aren't reading the previous pages of this thread that addressed these same questions, and you are just looking for the hand-holding avenue of support that is characteristic of inexperienced deckbuilders and poor players.
Dude I read the entire thread the other day. And tried a bunch of things other people suggested. I'm actually quite interested in this deck, I'm not just fucking around.
I'm not the one missing the point here, trust me. I'm the one whose testing and noting plays in which I might fetch an Eldrazi with Eye, and if I natural draw Terastodon would it be better as an Eldrazi. And that hasn't been the case. So maybe YOU should test it instead of telling me that I don't know what I'm talking about. Its won me countless matches that I could not have won with either Ulamog or Koziliek and the occassions in which it might have been a preferable line of play, I top'd into a win condition anyway so it didn't matter. If you think the deck is as fine-tuned as it needs to be as to not take suggestions from other people who are playing the deck.. you're wrong. If you prefer I can just take my innovations on your deck elsewhere since I clearly have no idea what I'm talking about, even though I have over 75 games of testing under my belt already on Cockatrice (not counting people who have no idea what they are doing), and I'm shooting for at least 100 by this weekend.
Especially this comment in a thread called "Turbo Eldrazi" is kind of awkward.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vacrix
What do you want to accomplish with Terastodon that you can't already do with your tutorable Eldrazi?
This deck is not about getting 9 or even 18 power to play. It really isn't.
@Hopo
I disagree. When most of the deck is centered around finding lands, you almost always have access to Eye of Ugin into Emrakul. Also, Titan has nothing to do with the Eldrazi last I checked and thats half of the win conditions. Most decks scope to Titan if you get him online fast enough. By that logic, TurboEldrazi is simply a name, not a defining characteristic of the deck. Eye --> Emrakul is a line of play, its not like storm where that is most certainly what you are going to do every single time you try to win. Emrakul is great in some matchups but often its something you set up because you have the luxury of time. I don't understand this obsession with being a slave to the theme. Quite often I search up some Glimmerposts and/or Tabernacle to put some distance between the opponent and myself, and then I secure the win with Eye. I don't understand why running Emrakul as the only Eldrazi takes so much away from the deck.
I've gone over this before, but yes there are plenty good reasons to play Terastodon. Namely the fact that you can blow up Liliana, Jace, equipment, Ensnaring Bridge, etc. troublesome permanents that you might not get rid of otherwise. Ulamog conveniently does the same thing but only one permanent at a time. This cuts you off from a favorite line of play I've developed in which you play Terastodon, blow up there lands, and then drop Tabernacle to wipe there team. You could, of course, respond that Ulamog's annihilator trigger would do the same thing.. only I've had Terastodon STP'd after I make this play more than once. Another application can be to drop 4 blockers if you are low on life and need a team, while the reverse it to drop a team that can deal 18 damage in one swing. So you have multiple defensive options the turn he hits play as well as offensive options. Ulamog is too linear IMO. He blow up one permanent but what happens if your opponent has a Liliana and a Jace? I've pulled my ass out of that situation before. Jace +2 puts something at the bottom, I happen to topdeck SDT, top into Terastodon, blow up both his walkers. Granted, he killed Terastodon with something but I still had 9 power to close the game in 2 turns.
I've been playing this deck for quite a few games now and I'm completely comfortable with it. I rarely lose because its really straight forward and easy to play. The deck has a lot of answers to hate, multiple methods of control, and tends to bail itself out of a shitty situation. Of course the deck isn't about 'lol drop 18 power I win'. Its mostly a control deck. Terastodon only adds to the decks options.
Seriously I wish people would stop bitching about my card choices and just try playing the dam cards for a few games. Thats what I did when I initially questioned card choices like Primeval Titan and Expedition Map and I changed my mind about the cards completely after witnessing them in action.
Vacrix, could you share your latest decklist? :)
@the other guys: stop hating on him, this is a thread to develop the deck & make it stronger
Yes please. a decklist so I could "test" your savage Terastodon tech. Except, you see I tested Terastodon when Worldwake came out, even before Glimmerpost was printed and I was starving for a non-eldrazi method of sealing up the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexeezay
You boast of 100 games played? Try over 10000 matches played bare minimum. I consider playtesting ad nauseam one of my cores of deck design and I have been playing this deck for many years.
If you approached this idea as more of someone with an idea, and were wondering some of the pro's and con's about it, I and others here would gladly give them, but instead you imply that you even have an inkling of what the deck is about and tout your lack of experience as sacrosanct.
I welcome opposing opinions and ideas that merit re-investigation as the metagame and cardpool change, but as your argument for this unnamed decklist of a simple idea is baselessly devoid of logic and insight, I would rather lick the bottom of my shoe over address your opinion
Sure you tested it back before Glimmerpost was even printed. Did you bother to go back to it when the 3rd post allowed the deck to actually be playable?
I don't boast any number of games. I merely would like to be taken seriously because I understand how the deck works. Naturally, I wasn't taken seriously at first and was told to shut up, and go play the deck, so I did. Now that I have, it didn't seem to make a difference because I don't agree with a few card choices. Okay so you've played 10,000 games and are an authority on the deck. Respect to that. However, I spit on your lack of respect for people who do in fact have an inkling about how the deck works and would like to make it better. I don't need to play 10,000 fucking games to understand how a deck works, idiot. 100 games is more than sufficient, especially for a deck isn't hard to play like this one. I've been keeping track of my results and I've dropped no less than 10 games out of 80... and 7 of those were combo decks. Go ahead and insult my lack of experience but I'm not insulted by slander. Unfortunately for you, intimidation is a sign of intellectual impotence. Lick the bottom of your shoe? Is that how you address people who take a genuine interest in your creation? Hmm.. I can only assume that you have really clean soles.
The list I've been playing.. for those interested:
TurboEldrazi
Tech - 12
4 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Pithing Needle
3 All is Dust
2 Crucible of Worlds
Land Search - 10
4 Sylvan Scrying
3 Crop Rotation
3 Expedition Map
Acceleration - 7
4 Exploration
3 Candelabra of Tawnos
Creatures - 7
3 Primeval Titan
2 Terastodon
2 Emrakul
Land - 24
5 Forest
4 Cloudpost
4 Vesuva
4 Glimmerpost
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Eye of Ugin
1 Wasteland
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Glacial Chasm
Sideboard - 15
4 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Trinisphere
4 Moment's Peace
1 Pithing Needle
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Karakas
Once I reach 100 games, I'm going to tweak it again in 20 game intervals to test a few different things. Namely, alternative Eldrazi in place of 'dons', -2 Moment's Peace +2 Surgical Extraction, +1 Crucible post-board for matchups like BWx control w/ Vindicates, Wastelands, Loam, etc. and a few others I can't remember but I have them written down somewhere.
One thing I've liked about my current list is the extra forest as its helping me get the green source to play all the key green spells, especially with GG casting costs like Titan and Terastodon.