[Primer/Deck] Pox

That deck is probably in the wrong forum at this point. :tongue:

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Originally Posted by jredelstein

So I have been trying to come up with a list that uses 4 Chains of Mephistopheles as a central theme. I also like the interaction with Anvil of Bogardan. I tried a more traditional mono black pox list with Chains, Anvil, dark ritual, mox diamond, and Squee, Goblin Nabob to get the chain lock early. The problem I had was I would die to the 1 or 2 drops that made it to the board and since no one draws cards I'd die before finding a Squee.

I am now looking at a GB list that is more similar to Lands than Pox since the interaction between dredge of Life from the Loam and Chains is awesome(since dredge is a replacement effect Chains doesn't trigger!) I also am a fan of being able to run Urborg in lands rather than punishing fire. I've tried keeping Smallpox in but there is just not enough room and it is the first cut if I want to keep the Lands/Chains themes. I think my sideboard plan would be to side in more creature hate and take out the Chains package.

Here is what I got:
4 Chains of Mephistopheles
3 Anvil of Bogardan
2 Bloodghast
2 Raven's Crime
4 Mox Diamond
4 Exploration
3 Life from the Loam
3 Crop Rotation
2 Entomb

4 Dark Depths
4 Thespian's Stage
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Maze of Ith
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Bojuka Bog
4 Verdant Catacomb
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Bayou
1 Forest
4 Wasteland
1 Cabal Pit

Possible Sideboard:
4 Smallpox
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Cabal Therapy
3 Thoughtseize
1 Crop Rotation
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Innocent Blood

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This reminds me of that Combo Loam deck that did well at an SCG several years ago. I need just 1 more Chains and the x2 Word of Command for the board to test it. You don't want smallpox mainboard though? I would likely drop some number of mox diamond, and entomb/crop rotation. Just adds a lot of do nothing air to the deck other than helping to find combo pieces. If your opponent plays pithing needle on stage then those cards are almost dead cards since you wont need to tutor up lands as much. I think for this style deck you are better off running Decay or smallpox in the main board and just play for the long and grindy game. Your opponent won't have brainstorm and ponder to help filter their draws. The list I saw also ran dark confidant for additional card advantage without drawing cards. I think that could be an option as well to get ahead.

This is the link to the deck that I was referring to. It is Jund though
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=54216

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Originally Posted by mykatdied

This reminds me of that Combo Loam deck that did well at an SCG several years ago. I need just 1 more Chains and the x2 Word of Command for the board to test it. You don't want smallpox mainboard though? I would likely drop some number of mox diamond, and entomb/crop rotation. Just adds a lot of do nothing air to the deck other than helping to find combo pieces. If your opponent plays pithing needle on stage then those cards are almost dead cards since you wont need to tutor up lands as much. I think for this style deck you are better off running Decay or smallpox in the main board and just play for the long and grindy game. Your opponent won't have brainstorm and ponder to help filter their draws. The list I saw also ran dark confidant for additional card advantage without drawing cards. I think that could be an option as well to get ahead.

This is the link to the deck that I was referring to. It is Jund though
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=54216

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I think I have most of that maybe I'll try it. Not sure I like burning wish, seems slow and not sure the targets are large enough impact.

I love smallpox, obviously, I just don't think there is enough room and I'd rather have the combo win of dark depths or the combo lock of chains/anvil game 1 then side into a more grindy control deck for game 2 when they bring in their answers for the combo. As it is I am not sure I'm playing enough lands, my first list had 4 smallpox, and they got cut for more lands.

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Originally Posted by jredelstein

I think I have most of that maybe I'll try it. Not sure I like burning wish, seems slow and not sure the targets are large enough impact.

I love smallpox, obviously, I just don't think there is enough room and I'd rather have the combo win of dark depths or the combo lock of chains/anvil game 1 then side into a more grindy control deck for game 2 when they bring in their answers for the combo. As it is I am not sure I'm playing enough lands, my first list had 4 smallpox, and they got cut for more lands.

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You are running 33, plus mox diamond, exploration and loam. It is likely enough/too many lands. You have 8 that don't tap for mana and you have bog which is best crop rotated for when needed. I honestly think it would be better to cut back on the stage/depths combo and maze of ith since you are running 3 crop rotate and 2 entomb. You have enough tutors to make it easier to find these things. You could easily slot a couple decay and smallpox into those slots. I like the burning wish package since it means you can answer more pre-board and you also have access to winds of change to put your opponent in that place where they have 0 cards in hand and the chains/anvil combo literally makes it impossible for most decks to ever actually have cards in hand.

Deepwood Legate have two abilities i like. Against some opponents he is free to cast and versus others he is hard counter.
Right, cc is four which make it harder to remove him too.

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Originally Posted by Hardcore

Deepwood Legate have two abilities i like. Against some opponents he is free to cast and versus others he is hard counter.
Right, cc is four which make it harder to remove him too.

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ha ha ha, cool!..i'm surprised i haven't seen this one..can't wait to drop this on my first turn against a green deck. Don't care if I win I just want to pull it off. :laugh:

personally though i'd rather run nantuko shade or even the classic order of the ebon hand or knights of stromgald(coz o' the protection from white ability)..

the art looks more like a zombie than a shade though..

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Originally Posted by Hardcore

Deepwood Legate have two abilities i like. Against some opponents he is free to cast and versus others he is hard counter.
Right, cc is four which make it harder to remove him too.

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You lost me at "harder to remove him". :really: Might make a hilarious sideboard against anything with forests, but I figure Nantuko Shade would be the automatic go to card for pumpable creatures. He eats Goyfs for a living.

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Originally Posted by OmniStrata

You lost me at "harder to remove him". :really:

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i think he meant its "unabruptdecayeable" or counterbalance doesn't hit it easily..
i like the card but i think its outclassed by many other things that we don't even use..

It is safe from Abrupt Decay because of cc of four. It is also hard to Daze since you cast it for free vs UGR. Basically it is only vulnerable to StP and Terminus. A well timed lightning bolt can mess things up, but then I like to play with Chalice of the Void in the main deck. Chalice and Legate on turn two seems nice:-D

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Originally Posted by zenitramleirdag

i think he meant its "unabruptdecayeable" or counterbalance doesn't hit it easily..
i like the card but i think its outclassed by many other things that we don't even use..

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Yeah, i looked at Nantuko Shade, but think it has a vulnerability window if cast early, because of casting cost.

I see. Sometimes I forget about people and their metas. A meta with plenty o' Green will definitely give that Shady Legate something to work with. I run Innocent Bloods, Smallpox, and 2 POX so normal creatures just can't stick around for me in my games. At times I forget our 'ultimate goal' is card advantage and we shouldn't be losing spells and resources as much as our opponent is.

This is the reason why I dropped some Dark Rituals. Top decking them would have been awesome if there was a Shade version of Nether Spirit but since there isn't, I'm running them less. What's more, I don't fight decks that face blast you in 2 turns. Meta got slower for some reason (MIRACLES cough*).

Only other good Card Advantage spell I've seen is Bottled Cloister. Very tempted to just go "Quad Laser" and run 4 Pox and 4 of the vast majority of cards. Still haven't found a trader for a Tabernacle at Pendrall Vale. Damn it'd be sweet backed by Urborg and Wastelands.

Speaking about card advantage....
Toil // Trouble
I am not much for the crappy black "draw two"'s but i like the Trouble effect (as a novice i tried playing Storm Seeker). But, nah. Not good enough :-/

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Originally Posted by Hardcore

Speaking about card advantage....
Toil // Trouble
I am not much for the crappy black "draw two"'s but i like the Trouble effect (as a novice i tried playing Storm Seeker). But, nah. Not good enough :-/

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wow, storm seeker..haven't seen that in ages, also sudden impact..

its not that its not good enough, the problem is that the "trouble half" is a non-bo with our deck, ahem, liliana, hymn, etc..

this could be nice in a black/red land destruction deck though..just not sure how competitive such a deck would be against the top tiers..

Rakdos Land Destruction Pox has access to Dreadbore which would probably be the most powerful removal in da universe if it was instant speed [lolz]. You also get Terminate and Rain of Salt if you're really gunning for LD. Only reason I don't build it is the dual lands. Mono-B has Smother and Hero's Fall but they're inferior to the ones I've mentioned.

You also get access to stupid strong cards like Goblin Deathraiders

Is Death Raiders that good?

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Originally Posted by Hardcore

Is Death Raiders that good?

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I'd rather play Spike Jester over Goblin Deathraider. But would never play either in a pox deck.

Well, Spike Jester would be nice against Miracles.

The B/R Land Killer deck I had [not pox] used the Death Raiders as cannon fodder for a Mortivore [lolz] and allowed for strong hits by using removal on blockers and letting the trample through.

Granted, I too wouldn't use it in Pox but as example, B/R has some of the best power to toughness for the CMC around. A super aggressive Pox blended with Red lightning could work, but for now, the only splashes that placed are B/G and B/W. I'd laugh if a B/U Pox worked some magic but that's probably the least likely to work.

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Originally Posted by OmniStrata

The B/R Land Killer deck I had [not pox] used the Death Raiders as cannon fodder for a Mortivore [lolz] and allowed for strong hits by using removal on blockers and letting the trample through.

Granted, I too wouldn't use it in Pox but as example, B/R has some of the best power to toughness for the CMC around. A super aggressive Pox blended with Red lightning could work, but for now, the only splashes that placed are B/G and B/W. I'd laugh if a B/U Pox worked some magic but that's probably the least likely to work.

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There's two blue version one: bug basically, shardless pox with abrupt decay, brainstorm and ofc shardless agent as only splash. The other is straight B/U and splashes for snapcaster (3) and jace, vryn's prodigy (4) only for a extra 7 effects of your best current ld spell. I've seen these versions and they are basically much weaker to resolved spells since they play less actual effects of sacrifice effects.

I've seen it 3-1 in our local league but the pox deck with greatest result here is probablly B/G pox.

I like the idea of running UB where you get ancestral, stifle, maybe some force post board if you're against fast combo. Jace, the Mind Sculptor seems like fun in that, but jace, vryns prodigy is likely better for what he does when flipped. Overall I like the idea of Ashiok over Jace if you really want to go UB.