sure it is, but not in this deck. at best you get 2 tokens a turn but will average to 0-1 token.Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Hammer
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sure it is, but not in this deck. at best you get 2 tokens a turn but will average to 0-1 token.Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Hammer
You really shouldn't compare a 3cc spell to a 6cc spell. The vast majority of the games this deck loses are lost well before you get enough mana on the board to cast a 6cc spell.
You're right, it generates only 1-2 tokens a turn, but the token and well as the creature itself gets bigger with each card you cast and its castable atleast 2 and usually 3 turns before Elspeth. And there will be many games that end before you ever get Elspeth onto the board.
Those 3 turns are enough to deal 17-21 points of damage to your opponent. So yes I would vastly prefer this list...
4 Plains
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Wasteland
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
2 Crystal Vein
2 Karakas
4 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Trinisphere
4 Ghostly Prison
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Crucible of Worlds
2 Smokestack
2 Armageddon
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Monastery Mentor
2 Baneslayer Angel
to one playing Elspeth that won't even start to damage your opponents by the time the Mentor will have already killed them.
Any thoughts on Sun Titan as a wincon?
It provides a fast clock, works double duty as a blocker, helps recover from a geddon/smokestack/destroyed/countered permanents.
Titan may provide a quick clock but you need to get to WW4, thats alot to ask for with options like Mentor or baby ElsphethQuote:
Originally Posted by willydoo
With sol lands and moxes, 6 mana isnt out of the question.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nysrol
My problem with Mentor is that it doesnt do anything by itself and has no immediate effect on the board state.
Also, I feel that having many creatures is anti synergetic with magus of the tabernacle. The deck seems to me to be better suited for single quality threats rather than overwhelming numbers.
And I would love to run Elspeth if i had moats, but unfortunately ghostly prison, doesnt protect planeswalkers.
Yeah Elspeth is really good with the Moat/Humility lock, you might want to consider Hero of Bladehold or Baneslayer Angel instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by willydoo
hero of bladehold suffers from similar problems as monastery mentor. While it is a threat itself, it only serves as a kill condition and doesnt really synergize with the rest of the deck.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuke is Good
I understand the argument over the big life swing of the angels being a sort of soft lock, but it doesnt outright provide any sort of prison effect.
Stax operates off its great synergy, however it lacks any sort of real card draw or card advantage. So, every card played has to jive in some way with the rest of them.
Sounds like you want Peacekeeper. Problem is he taxes us to keep it up. The builds I have uses Baneslayer to stabilize life totals because of how ancient tombs hurt/it can take a bit to establish the lock.Quote:
Originally Posted by willydoo
If you want to play the classic Geddon Stax, or other heavy versions of Stax, there-s no need for a creature finisher. Mishra's Factory is more than enough. Dedicated meatsticks have limited utility, are hard to cast and they're easy to kill.
You bring up a good point. Maybe im trying to think too much outside the box.Quote:
Originally Posted by frenadol
Went 3-1 with Angel Prison last night. Same decklist I posted a page ago.
Wins: 2-1 vs U/R Delver, 2-0 vs Storm, 2-0 vs Counterbalance Painter
Loss: 0-2 vs Jund Depths
I think Jund Depths would've been much easier had I drawn my Humility/Graveyard hate. I've been siding in Humility quite a bit, so I may up the count in the board to 2. I also just acquired a Moat, so I'll be making room for that as well. The 3 Revokers in the mainboard are the Sphere of Resistance (don't currently own those, and not much of a fan of them after testing) flex slot, so I may try to play around with different card choices there. Let me know if you want more detail or my sideboarding strategy.
edit Perhaps I posted it in a different thread. Disregard.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNn7oZKWsAEbXZQ.png
Seems even better than Elspeth in this deck? I'd rather get 2/2 Knights than 1/1 Soldiers,. and his +1 ability lets you just swing for the kill if they have no blockers.
Maybe in certain builds of Stax. Dutch Stax uses Humility+Moat with Elspeth ticking up making fliers.Quote:
Originally Posted by MGB
I don't see why this guy isn't just strictly better than Elspeth. Attacking as a 5/5 all by himself is better than requiring a creature in play and pumping +3/+3. Generating 2/2 tokens is generally better than generating 1/1 tokens.
Nuke is Good covered a big reason. Another is that making dudes doesn't actually grow Gideon, so he would just stay at starting loyalty if you're pumping out tokens for permanents to feed to Smokestack. It's not a huge deal, but it's something. After all, "strictly better than" is seldom seen in Magic. :)
Anyway, I do like him in (non-Dutch) Geddon Stax.
Can u guys post a stax list?? A heqvier one u dont want to face.
Hi guys,
looking for a standard Armageddon Stax decklist to start tinkering with. What would be a good starting point ?
Thanks.
When I play Geddon Stax this is the list that I use
Deck: stax geddon (60)
Lands
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
3 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Karakas
4 Mishra's Factory
7 Plains
4 Wasteland
Spells
3 Armageddon
3 Batterskull
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Crucible of Worlds
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
4 Humility
1 Moat
4 Mox Diamond
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Smokestack
3 Tangle Wire
4 Trinisphere
Sideboard
3 Ghostly Prison
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Oblivion Ring
4 Rule of Law
3 Timely Reinforcements
A lot of people opt towards 4 stack, 4 crucible, 4 elspeth, 4 tangle wire and build from there. I like having a couple of oblivion ring as mainboard answers to planeswalkers which can be problematic if we can't control mana early. I don't like having too many Elspeth, but the new Gideon could take her place if you were more interested in him. I had a decent amount of success at my LGS with this list. Humility is a beating for so many decks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mykatdied
I tried a version with 4 moat,I do not play anything in side against reanimator, dredge etc.?
The new Thalia and 2 new Angel's spoiled that meld into a Eldrazi are all perfect fits for Armageddon Stax.
Here's my current list:
4 Wasteland
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Plains
4 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Trinisphere
4 Smokestack
4 Crucible of Worlds
4 Tangle Wire
2 Armageddon
2 Ravages of War
4 Exalted Angel
4 Ghostly Prison
SB: 4 Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 3 Hanna's Custody
SB: 4 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 4 Aura of Silence
The only changes to be made are swapping out Exalted Angel for the new Thalia, Lodestone Golem, or old Thalia(Or the new Angels). Cutting Ghostly Prison for Black Vise, or Land Tax; and swapping out the 4 Plains for 4 Tabernacle at the Pendrill Vale if you use Black Vise or possibly new Thalia or Lodestone Golem. If you use Land Tax I would suggest cutting the Flagstones of Trokair for 4 Plains.
If you add the new Angels I would take out Exalted Angel, and possibly start making cuts across the board to fit 4 of the other angel in or cut Ghostly Prison all together since this other Angel has First Strike.
You could also use Thalia's Lancers in the place of Exalted Angel and replace the 4 Flagstones with 4 Tabernacle at the Pendrill Vale, since it's Legendary.
That's it for cuts and what I suggest in the future, get to Stacking!