Goblin Goon is a nice SB (maybe even MB if you find space) awnser against plague, but in that slot, nowadays, people are running Boartusk Liege instead in monored, since he is better in many situations.
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Goblin Goon is a nice SB (maybe even MB if you find space) awnser against plague, but in that slot, nowadays, people are running Boartusk Liege instead in monored, since he is better in many situations.
I had great experiences with it in a "Big Goblins"-list (that also ran Mogg Fanatic) with Chrome Moxes and Tombs. It truly shoves it to Pyroclasms, 'Goyf, Tombstalker and company. Hell, two trade with PhyrDread. By the way, I hated Flunkies in the deck; I often want to hit with just one guy and often can only resolve few guys through counterwalls, meaning I want everyone do shit alone. Goon was fine as when I'm low on critters, opp is too, but Flunks didn't work out. Having to throw another guy away to block is annoying too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elfrago
That said, standard list cannot really play Goon to great effect due to manacurve considerations. The slots are just a bit too filled. Flunkies I wouldn't play outside much lower-curve version at all, and even then I don't think they cut it for Legacy anymore. But Goon is good, just a bit high in the curve.
I'm just curious... has anyone considered Sensation Gorger in Goblins yet?
Seems like a good way to refuel your hand in this kind of deck.
I guess that, to refuel your hand in this tipe of deck, you can use Matron and Ringleader, but no, I have never tested it.
ringleader and matron are just better then Sensation Gorger. The problem with Gorger is that it is a little to mana intensive, it has to stick around and it dose not promise you the draw. ringleader will get you what you need or get the 4 lands off the top of your deck. I do like Gorger for the fact that if it dose hit and goes off you can make that seven card hand your opponent has go down to 4. but I think ringleader is just better. :smile:
In my book Flunkies is times better than War Marshal. I just won a game with 3 of them through an Engineered Plague and an active Jitte.
Another thought - maindeck single Sharpshooter or Tinkerer? They tend to solve different problems. Tinkerer deals with one of the worst problems - the aforementioned Jitte, while also killing other nasty stuff (not seen in my meta though). Shooter shines agains other tribal, but other than that he doesn't have many uses. Anyone got out of ETW with him?
I also run a single Goon as an additional out to Goyf and I have been really happy with him too.
The synergy between War Marshal and Chieftain or War Marshal and Piledriver is much more impressive than Flunkie's 3/3 body. The difference between a 2/2 and a 3/3 in legacy is honestly not very much. Plus by himself he is terrible which already happens to me enough with my piledrivers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Funky-kun
Goon has been discussed, talked about, dissected, etc. about a hundred times. Yes, he is alright. No, he is not that great. From my personal experience, when I play him he is either ridiculous or horrible.
A singleton tinkerer is not good to me. He cannot serve as a reactive solution to Jitte so he does nothing to solve the problem like Tin Street does. Running him as a 3of though does attract me somewhat sometimes, depending. And with sharpshooter I would say that is meta dependent. I dropped him, I find him to be subpar without fanatic anymore.
post m10, I am removing fanatics and sharpshooters (maybe keep 1 sharp in sb for matron).
Is there any suitable 1/2 drop to replace fanatic?
No. This discussion went on for pages. There are no cards with the Goblin type that don't suck in this slot. Possible 1-drops include Thoughtseize or Therapy in black splashes, Swords to Plowshares in White, and Relic of Progenitus.Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown2
To make up for the curve getting much heavier at 2, I and some other people have started running 1-2 Gemstone Caverns as a supplement on the draw.
I think i'd just replace them with thoughtseizes then and run the whole 4 badlands instead of the 3....
yeah, that's what I will do
As 2 drops there are quite good interesting options, like:Quote:
Originally Posted by Unknown2
- Stingscourger = quite a good replacement for fanatic removal and indeed good against Tombstalkers, Goyf, and the like. It becomes really good with Warchief or Chieftain. Like Fanatic, it's a tempo tool.
- Gempalm Incinerator = you can maximize the number of those, if you already aren't. Can be cycled in a pinch if the opponent is low on creatures. It loses part of its goodness with the loss of fanatics, though.
- Goblin Tinkerer = survives plague, destroys Jittes, Vials, Dreadnoughts, EEs, Moxes and the like.
I don't believe the deck needs non-goblin creature removal. Maybe SB perish or the like, but I would not dilute the deck with MD Thoughtseize, Cabal Therapy, Swords or the like. Relic might be good in some metas, but the other choices don't fit for me.
I'm playing monored with 3 Chieftains MD. They're a godsend. It's like the deck is playing with 2 different speeds. One include the Lackey / Vial (and maybe caverns) openings, that bust your speed a lot.
But if Lackey can't connect or vial gets removed, the deck still wants to put some pressure, and go turn 2 drop, turn 3 drop with haste. Chieftain adds consistency in doing this, allowing the deck to have some good pressure by turn 3 even if there's no vial and lackey brokenness going on.
Those starts are acceptable to me:
Tinkerer, Chieftain = 4 dmg on turn 3
Piledriver, Warchief = 5 dmg on turn 3
Piledriver, Chieftain = 6 dmg on turn 3
I suppose you have a point concerning Thoughtseize. I've always been a fan of stingscourger, so I might add those, and I'm content with my 2 incinerators.
I'm playing 3 perish in the side (I'm running 3c), so that's usually plenty of removal against most decks.
I love chieftan, but I can only find room for 1 or possibly 2 in the 3c deck (taking out the 1 wort and 1 sharpshooter). But 4 warchief+2 chieftan is plenty for me.
edit: what do you think of Mogg War Marshal
Mogg War Marchall is great. It blocks Goyf 3 turns, it pumps gempalm and Piledriver like a champ, and with the inclusion of M10, he's gold. I'm currently with 3 in Rb.
I know somebody on here was running Anarchy in the board. How is that going? Is it worth it? I'm thinking of running it because Landstill gives me some problems and it would kill Humility, Elspeth(the whore),Moat, soldier tokens...
Depending on your meta, it can be good. I used to play 2 SB, but never got a chance to side them in.
It is good agains't UWx Landstill and Enchantress only. But is very nice to have agains't not comonly played decks, like AngelStompy, WhiteStax, Soldiers, some Homebrew decks, Quinn and Death and Taxes.
If you have problems with these decks, I sugest it, but 2-3. Think that 4 is too much.
The problem with Anarchy is that it only helps against one or two decks and even then isn't guaranteed to do much, as Enchantress can Replenish out of it and Landstill can just counter it.
Mogg War Marshal is growing on me in RB. I've got two fit in at the moment and am attempting to get a third and possibly even a fourth.
Ok, so I´m going to post my list, for a champ in 2 days.
the manabase is weird, because I don't have all the fetchs.
// Lands
6 [ALA] Mountain
3 [MM] Rishadan Port
4 [TE] Wasteland
2 [ON] Wooded Foothills
1 [TSP] Gemstone Caverns
4 [A] Badlands
2 [LRW] Auntie's Hovel
1 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
// Creatures
2 [SC] Siege-Gang Commander
3 [LE] Gempalm Incinerator
4 [AP] Goblin Ringleader
4 [US] Goblin Matron
4 [ON] Goblin Piledriver
4 [SC] Goblin Warchief
4 [US] Goblin Lackey
1 [LRW] Mad Auntie
3 [TSP] Mogg War Marshal
// Spells
4 [DS] AEther Vial
4 [MOR] Warren Weirding
// Sideboard
SB: 4 [4E] Red Elemental Blast
SB: 2 [SHM] Boartusk Liege
SB: 3 [AL] Pyrokinesis
SB: 4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
SB: 2 [SC] Pyrostatic Pillar
4 Weirdings+3 Incinerators are awesome.
I removed Frogtosser, because they were disapointing me lately.
The SB is open for discussion. I just don't want to lose to TES/ANT again. The big problem is: No grave hate anyhere. I'm just hoping to get lucky and don't face Ichorid/Agroo Loam.
Is there some reason why we are running Gemstone Caverns over Chrome Mox?
Caverns is just a grey land as a topdeck, you can "imprint" lands in it, gives mana of every color (for 3c lists), and actually trades CA for speed when you need it the most, when you're on the draw. Being a grey land half the time, and being legendary, means you can't afford to run more than 2 copies ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by BKclassic
Is it for the synergy with Chieftain?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacosnape
I might retest it in place of Stingscourger (!!!) going to only 1 scourger / 0 Tinkerers MD and 2 War Marshals. But I doubt that even with the pump effect, those are going to be better than the unsummon/shatter effects.
Actually, I'm struggling to make room for Chieftain maindeck. I find myself struggling to give him slots over Frogtosser, Gempalm, Siege-Gang, or War Marshal at the moment.Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenOne
The longer I play with War Marshal, the longer I love him for the Piledriver/Gempalm synergy, and the more games he wins for me by being a pain in the ass for control to remove and by flooding the board with so many 1/1's that I have the chance to catch up with aggro decks' tempo boosts.
EDIT: God, I can't believe I just advocated chump blocking as a strategy, but it strangely works with War Marshal.