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What I learned from splashign another color is that you have to drop 1 mutavault and go to 3 and add another fetchland with a blue source. Having 8 colorless sources is too much and you will not have enough to cast your LOA and coralhelm commander.Quote:
Originally Posted by straca3
I played UB Folks like year with this manabase and its really ok, I wouldnt cut Mutavault EVER! Plus now when you dont have to care about MM, Vial is ussualy going to resolve, so we dont have to care about the double blue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Shadow
True, Problem is, I have had opening hands of 1 vial, 1 wasteland, 1 mutavault, silvergil, LOA, and cursecatcher.Quote:
Originally Posted by straca3
do you keep this hand? Chances are no because you cannot drop 2 things on turn 2. But with one blue source, this hand is playable.
You could have had that hand with the monoblue version too. Mutavault is just too good to run only as a 3-of.Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Shadow
Fortunately, there are other options to solve dilemmas like these: Cut a spell for an extra coloured source, or just, you know, mulligan sometimes.
EDIT: Over the last few pages, people have debated wether to run 4 coralhelm commander OR 4 Reejerey. The answer is almost definitely run both. I see people wanting to run less than 20 actual merfolk, and honestly, that just seems far too loose, too. This is a tribal deck. You need a certain number of merfolk to make Silvergill Adept consistent, and you need a certain number of lords for them to be good.
I would keep this hand on play against unknown opponent. If he doesnt play blue, its nuts and if he does he has to have FoW and still you can rip Island and win the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Shadow
@Penguin, correction: in order to keep Silvergill consistent, you need a Merfolk to reveal or an Aether Vial at 2. The fewer Reejerey you run, the more likely you can keep the Vial at 2 because you'll have fewer reasons to tick it to 3. Ultimately, I want to run Coralhelms, Reejereys, and Images, and they all have upsides and downsides. At this point, I'm kind of thinking three of each. For the purposes of Adept, I'll have 22 cards including Merfolk and Vials. For the purposes of Tribal strength, I'll have 25 cards including Images and Mutavaults.
Tournament Name: StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - AtlantaQuote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Shadow
Number of Players: 249
Position: 2
Merfolks
Phillip Lorren
Sideboard
1 Gut Shot
Maybe it's not doing that bad... ^^
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/dec...7&iddeck=49414
The point still stands and is valid. 1ofs are pretty bad esp without card draw, but I would say it has to do with the 3 dismembers for 4 creature removal or 7 with the submerges. Still seems like 2 shot -1 of the other one would be better
He may have it in there, but is there a report of how useful the card was. Hell, I can put beast from within without splashing green in my deck. And by chance I win, it doesn't mean i used it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NihilObstat
"Phillip Lorren · Snellville, GeorgiaQuote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Shadow
Thanks for the props, bud. Gut Shot was good for me all day, killing multiple lavamancers and drawing a force out of an opponent's hand in a tight race situation. I can only dream that my phrase "it's like a fifth mental misstep" will catch on."
That qoute is the first comment from Drew Levin's article: http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/l...ur_Weapon.html
I personally am trying it as a 1 of md and potentially testing it as a 2 of md or some combo of 2 in the 75.
I actually watched him (Phillip Lorren) play on scglive vs NO RUG with Lavamancer and he used Gutshot on it, the commentators were laughing their arses off.
Assuming you aren't running searches, the opportunity cost of running an additional card in the board is one slot, and the marginal benefit is the access to that one card. This is obviously affected if cards become better the more you draw, or become worse. In the end though, you're still giving up 1, 2, or 3 slots to have access to 1, 2, or 3 cards.Quote:
Originally Posted by SlopeeJ
The case can be made that if a card is good enough to warrant one SB spot, it is good enough to warrant 2 or 3. This is the reason why SBs aren't all 1-ofs, and are mostly 2-4. A second (or third) relic or spell pierce gives more marginal benefit than the other choices. Still, however, there is nothing inherently inefficient or ineffective about running a singleton in your board. If 14 cards provide a clear advantage over all other choices, and the 15th choice (which happens to be a singleton) provides less benefit then the first 14 (yet more benefit than the other candidates) then the best course would be to run the 15th slot as a singleton. Taking out one of the first 14 cards (which all provided a greater benefit than the 15th) simply so you aren't running a singleton would not make sense.
double post
There is also the question of "drawing live". I played one llawan in my gpt sb just because I only had 14 cards i wanted and needed and didnt want to go through the trouble of finding adwarven pony to put there. I figured this card lets me draw live in one mu, in an otherwise already lost situation.
Other examples would be one damnation in UB fae in past extended, one md stifle in merfolk, or just randomly tossing a leyline of the void in your sb, just so there IS a chance you WILL open it against GY decks.
Besides, agaisnt competent opponents it is beneficiary to have slightly different cards with same funcion to make it harder to sufficiently play around them. I.e. I would take disrupt, spell pierce, miscalculation and cancel over 4 mana leaks in UW stoneblade mirror f.e.
I've never heard of the term "Drawing Live". Do you have a link to an article/post that coined the term?
Anyway, I agree with the idea that something useful, even if a totally random singleton, is better than not having that at all. I'm sure the Llawan would have helped more than Dwarven Pony, though I would have used a Bear Cub.
@previous guy: It would be the effective opposite of "drawing dead"; by logical extension. One would assume.
Additional bit:
How does everyone feel about Phantasmal image at 3? Is that too many?
Drawing live normally refers to games that are in a bad position, but can be won (or at least not lost) by drawing an 'out' you have in your deck. It tends to refer to either answers (ie needing to deal with progenitus or something similar) or to 'oops i win cards' - in the example llawan empress against fish.Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
Yeah, I guess I've never heard of that term. Seems like there's yet another way to refer to mising, lucksacking, topdecking like a champ, etc. =)
Re: Images, I've been running 3 and know of people who run 4. Helps keep your vial at 2 when you remove Reejeries and Sovereigns.
I would never remove Reejeries, but ofc Sovereigns
is there a spot for Sower of Temptation? really good with keira:tongue:
Proper capitalization is required. Use it. -zilla
CMC 4 is not nice. New meta doesnt seem that attractive for it either (lots of combo now that misstep is gone).Quote:
Originally Posted by Magic_Shortbus9
Plus, how many such creatures are you running? You can't easily pull off a 2-card combo running only two of each. You'd be lucky to see it once every few rounds. I know the cards are somewhat useful by themselves, but I think Kira alone would be better for the deck.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsck
I just remember seeing Alex B. http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=38055 running both to some top 8's before MM was printed but the meta is in constant shift so u could b right. only time will tell. how about that llist with Phantasmal Image in place of sovereign. merfolk is my pet deck as i dont have alot of money to build multiple decks so i have that and elf combo.Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
Seems fine by me.
Besides, if the first sower sticks, your phantasmals are going to be making you really proud of yourself.
Just try to make sure you dont run too many situational cards with the excuse of "it pitches to fow if it doesnt do anything".
hey saw this list looks solid but just wondering what the Vendillion Clique is for and if its worth consideration? thanksQuote:
Originally Posted by cheerios
:tongue:
I run almost the same list as that but have been using 1 mishra's factory and 1 more island in the spots where you have phantasmal image/sovereign. I've been feeling like I've been getting flooded a lot though so I may try phantasmal images there. My SB is pretty different, I run:
2 Back to Basics
3 Blue Elemental Blast
2 Llawan, Cephalid Empress
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Gut Shot
1 Spell Pierce
1 Dismember
Would you guys replace spell pierce with spell snare?
or how about spell pierces for stifles?
I'm thinking spell snares help against those stupid mystics deck A LOT and goyfs too.
I've actally found that spell pierces to be lackluster after playing it. When I draw it, I never use it. It seems I might have enough counters with the 4 cursecatchers plus the images.
Since I splash white, dealing with combo with ethersworn and null rod doesn't seem too much of a problem.
The stifles might acutlaly help me save some lands from being wastelanded.
What do you guys think?
Spellsnare could be worth a look depending on how the meta shapes up, but it seems that spell pierce is "live" more often then spellsnare is. I would be willing to try it but only after I saw some tournament results and knew the meta was particularly 2 cmc heavy. I'm not sure stifle does what we need it to, protecting our own lands from wasteland seems very mediocre. If anything its best application would be along side wasteland as mana denial to make our dazes more effective. I don't think stifle counters nearly enough of the things we want to be countering in a typical a game to see play right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar of Shadow
I can tell you some things of the future meta:
snapcaster mage will be played
tarmogoyf will be played
stoneforge mystic will be played
some people will even play fire and ice
storm will still play infernals and burning wishes
silvergill adept can be played from your hand also
dark confidant is not banned atm
defense grid is a good sb card against us
jitte is also decent
Proper capitalization and punctuation are required when posting here. Please use them in the future. -zilla
So in other words, yea I can see playing spell snare. It might even resolve once in a while with misstep gone.
Thanks shortbus. It's supposed to be for stoneforge decks and combo decks, particulary tide. The lack of misstep left us with only force of will as a hard counter. I was hoping clique could shore up the defense against tide. I haven't tested it tho, been busy with work the whole week.Quote:
Originally Posted by Magic_Shortbus9
How has Back to Basics been performing?Quote:
Originally Posted by chags
Guys, I'm testing for a 300+ tournament on the same day that Misstep goes away. It's taking place in Spain where there have been some decently big tournaments this months, with this meta:
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/deck.php?id=6848
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/deck.php?id=6759
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/deck.php?id=6694
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/deck.php?id=6668
As you can see Team America and Dredge seem to be some of the most popular strategies, and I really haven't tested much against them. No one seems to play T.Am. online :-/
So fearing these strategies and probably an amazing pop-up of combo decks that same day, I came up with this list:
Maindeck
4x Vial
4x Coralhelm
4x Cursecatcher
4x Atlantis
4x Merrow
2x Image
4x Silvergil
4x Daze
2x Dismemeber
4x Force of Will
3x Spell pierce
13x Island
4x Mutavault
4x Wasteland
Sideboard
2x Pithing Needle / Cursed Totem
3x Tormod's crypt
2x Umezawa's jitte
2x Kira, great glass-spinner
2x Llawan, cephalid empress
1x Dismember
2x Echoing truth
1x Gut shot
So this list, would be in detriment against the aggro pairings to do better against combo/control.
Ideas, thoughts, welcome. Would you guys split the grave-hate? 3 Spell pierce MD enough against Team A.?
really. I saw 3 team americas yesterday.Quote:
Originally Posted by NihilObstat
team america cannot beat you anyways once you get vial in
but if they drop a dead in you are dead. Which leads me to believe that running stifles might be better than spell pierces
thanks for the reply. seems like a good idea and test worthy. i had seen it in SB awhile agoQuote:
Originally Posted by cheerios
Proper capitalization is required on these boards. Please use it in the future. -zilla
Sigh, why gut shot? Just because someone used it to hilarious effect once? Stifles and pithing needles would be great against things like Deed. Gut Shot not so much. For that matter, it doesn't seem good against TA nor combo nor Dredge.
I'd recommend replacing a Reejerey with a third Image. It helps keep Vial at 2 and the downside is hardly a downside against TA's removal ... Anything they target your guys with will kill them anyway.
The TA primer says (said?) that the Merfolk matchup is slightly unfavorable ... How does Merfolk fare against more modern builds of TA, aside from the Vial/Deed comments above?
Alright, that sounds relaxing. I just hadn't face even 1 TA so I was concerned, but anyway MM is going away that same day so I just realized that maybe there won't be so many TAs.
Gut shot is really good and as a 1 of it's never annoying, but it's not a secure side spot anyway, might finally go away.
Maybe 3x Spell pierce MD is too much? What would you guys play? Zoo might be coming back after MM, so what would you guys like to see MD against it?
I'd say you need some MD Kiras against Zoo. It protects our dudes, and it has to be two for oned to be killed.Quote:
Originally Posted by NihilObstat
I actually tried playing more Images over reejeeray. The problem is that you cannot show a merfolk with silvergils.Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
I know that you need to reveal when hardcasting, but between Vials and all the other Merfolk, 3 Images should still be ok. Hell, some folks run four. I'll do more testing to see what happens though.
I'm finding spell pierces to be very very useless. I haven't countered anything thus far.Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
Do you think we should take the 3 spell pierces out for standstills?