4 Card Blind

Asthereal's results for round chaos:

1. Asthereal (TO): Khalni Garden, Azorius Chancery, Selesnya Evangel, Esper Stormblade
That's me, borrowing an idea and thinking I had improved upon it. Looks like I haven't.
2. GoblinSmashmaster: Mountain, Rite of Flame, Rite of Flame, Ferocious Tigorilla
I'm fast enough to be able to amass an army to block and kill the tigo and keep a guy that can win it for me. 6-0
3. Reeplcheep: Swamp, Memnite, Mana Skimmer, Culling the Weak
Yeah, I did kinda count on no more land hate. We do, however, need to address the fact that this is an illegal deck... - score t.b.d.
4. dte: Remote Farm, Remote Farm, Battle Screech, Battle Screech
Getting max punished for my slow strat here. Also, Screech is common in Vintage Masters, so I won't be able to play the illegal deck card here. :tongue: 0-6
5: FTW: Swamp, Cry of Contrition, Ornithopter, Kjeldoran Dead
Fast discard is a problem. 0-6
6. alphastryk: Swamp, Cry of Contrition, Fume Spitter, Shamble Back

7. Wrath of Pie: Khalni Garden, Selesnya Sanctuary, Qasali Pridemage, Selesnya Evangel
I was SOOO going to beat the mirror with my flyer, but idiot me had to use a flyer that actually gets killed by the Pridemate. Ugh. Two draws it is. 2-2
8. maxx!: Swamp, Liliana's Steward, Dead Weight, Shamble Back
Discard plus kiling my other threat. Sure. 0-6
9. silkster: Swamp, Fume Spitter, Liliana's Steward, Bone Picker
Two Stewards? What happened here? Did I just completely miss the fact that this card is an option? I thought it was crap. Anyway, that Bone Picker looks problematic. Discarding means I can't stop that flyer... 0-6
10. H: Mountain, Lava Dart, Grim Initiate, Grim Initiate
So you kill my token maker and the two 1/1s are buggers that race my 2/1 or amass to make it look silly. Nice. For you, that is. My deck looks really good on paper and loses the the sillyest dumb crap. Ouch. 0-6
11. Tylert: Forest, Mountain, Bond Beetle, Horned Kavu
Oh good, a match I can win again. I make enough guys to block and kill a 4/5 before I die and keep a threat afterwards. 6-0

Total: 15 points. Well, that went poorly.


About Reep's illegal deck: the entire deck is built on saccing a 0 cost creature without passing priority.
I am willing to let this one slip because there's a pile of cards that could have been played in Memnite's place, like Kobolds or whatever.
But... we do have to consider precedents, and those lean towards me awarding all games to Reep's opponents as wins.
What do you guys think?

Keep in mind that Reep joined later, so he/she isn't a threat to the throne. Also consider he/she is new and deserves a milder treatment.
I am on the fence, and I don't particularly like to be on the fence, as I'm busy and it's quite uncomfortable up here. :tongue:

The procedure for an illegal submission would be to treat it as though it didn't exist instead of awarding automatic wins.

It's an interesting case because it actually makes no difference, though it could have if someone submitted something like Cry of Contrition, Scryb Sprites and two lands. The part of me that misclicked and failed to send in a deck correction properly wants to be strict, but I like being generous to a newcomer. It's also how we can avoid awkward precedents. If a simple card swap doesn't change outcomes and it's the player's very first entry, ...

I was about to say that I'm biased anyway because I beat this deck, but I was confused and actually went 3-3, so it pulls down my round score very slightly.

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Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie

The procedure for an illegal submission would be to treat it as though it didn't exist instead of awarding automatic wins.

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I agree that the solution to an illegal entry should be to pretend it doesn't exist. The one time I've seen an illegal entry, however, it was given losses (Celestial Force single handedly beating the Crow/Pegasus deck in Storm Season).

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Originally Posted by Asthereal

8. maxx!: Swamp, Liliana's Steward, Dead Weight, Shamble Back
Discard plus kiling my other threat. Sure. 0-6
9. silkster: Swamp, Fume Spitter, Liliana's Steward, Bone Picker
Two Stewards? What happened here? Did I just completely miss the fact that this card is an option? I thought it was crap. Anyway, that Bone Picker looks problematic. Discarding means I can't stop that flyer... 0-6

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I was really surprised to see another Steward too. I wasn't confident submitting it. Even on the play it completely fails at disrupting Turn-1 decks like Rite of Flame. But I thought Bone Picker's 3 power would be very effective and it was the only card I found that could enable BP without giving up resources. I felt that BP was risky to set up myself, since a single removal spell could easily 2-for-1 me, so I really wanted two enablers for it. I certainly didn't start my deck thinking "Liliana's Steward is a good card; I should find a way to include it". :tongue:I'm guessing that Maxx! started with Shamble Back as the threat of choice and then found Steward as the best way to enable it without giving up a card.

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Originally Posted by silkster

3.7 points for a round is definitely an edge over the maximum theoretical average of 3. The 7 rounds so far have had averages of 2.63, 2.39, 2.44, 2.32, 2.49, 2.46, and 2.54. 2.92, 2.66, 2.71, 2.58, 2.77, 2.74, and 2.82 (had a wrong denominator; divide by 10 to average points, then divide by 9 because you have 9 opponents).

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That’s true. I can’t really complain about a 4th place finish (only missing a 3-way tie for second by 1 point), but in my head I thought a 1-land black attrition deck with discard and a strong 1-mana threat would catch people by surprise, not be the most popular archetype. :laugh:

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Originally Posted by silkster

I was really surprised to see another Steward too. I wasn't confident submitting it. Even on the play it completely fails at disrupting Turn-1 decks like Rite of Flame. But I thought Bone Picker's 3 power would be very effective and it was the only card I found that could enable BP without giving up resources. I felt that BP was risky to set up myself, since a single removal spell could easily 2-for-1 me, so I really wanted two enablers for it. I certainly didn't start my deck thinking "Liliana's Steward is a good card; I should find a way to include it". :tongue:I'm guessing that Maxx! started with Shamble Back as the threat of choice and then found Steward as the best way to enable it without giving up a card.

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Something like that. I actually started with a Bone Picker deck, and was considering your exact submission, but I thought stronger removal than Fume Spitter might be important. Running Bone Picker with only 1 sac outlet seemed way too shaky, so I swapped to Shamble Back. Steward was just a body I could sac to go 1-for-1 with another card, and seemed like it would still work against slower combo decks (Priest of Titania, Sprout Swarm, Selesnya Evangel, etc).

I don't care if my deck is disqualified, hardly in the running anyways.

My weekend was a mess, so I'll need to get a move on now.
I decided to do the same thing I did the last two times a deck was illegal: just award the wins to the legal decks.
It's the easiest and fastest way, and keeps consistency in the way these things are handled.
Also, Reep was cool with it.

Standings for round 8 look as follows:
1. silkster: 49 - 4,9
2. H: 40 - 4
3. alphastryk: 38 - 3,8
4. maxx!: 37 - 3,7
5. Wrath of Pie: 35 - 3,5
6. FTW: 32 - 3,2
7. dte: 30 - 3
8. GoblinSmashmaster: 23 - 2,3
9. Asthereal (TO): 21 - 2,1
10. Tylert: 9 - 0,9
11. Reeplcheep: 0 - 0

Which leads to the banning of:
Bone Picker
Cry of Contrition
Fume Spitter
Grim Initiate
Lava Dart
Liliana's Steward
Shamble Back

Also, despite strong performances of silk and H this round, FTW keeps a comfortable lead in the season.

I'll build my deck asap. Stay tuned!

ROUND 9 of SEASON 7: PAUPER BANNATHON has started.

I have PM'ed myself my deck for round 9, so you can start sending me your decks.

DEADLINE: Wednesday the 26th of August, at 11:00AM Central European Time.
(That's my time zone. Pacific Time it'll probably be something like Tuesday night a bit past midnight, so keep that in mind.)

PLEASE NOTE:
The way you send your deck to me matters. Please send it in the way described below, so it doesn't cost me an hour of editing before I can post all the decks.
Please send your deck as follows: Swamp, Swamp, Terror, Dauthi Slayer.
So with card tags around each card, and not above eachother, and with your Username and 4CB S07R09 in the topic.
Don't forget to keep an eye on the banned list. You'll find it in the second post of the thread, or in our Google Spreadsheet.

After the deadline has passed, I will post all decks on the forum here, and you can start puzzling out your scores.
If you have any questions, please read the first two posts of this thread first. If you can't find the answer there, drop a message here. We'll answer a.s.a.p.

Also, if you've been lurking on this thread and looking to join, you can step in anytime, any round. That's no problem at all. Just send me your deck before the deadline, and I'll add you to the competition. :smile:

Happy deck designing everybody! :cool:

At the end of this we should have a vote for the worst card to get banned, winner gets brownie points

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Originally Posted by Reeplcheep

At the end of this we should have a vote for the worst card to get banned, winner gets brownie points

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I'd like a brownie. Oh wait. :rolleyes:

I would like to congratulate H on banning Lava Dart. Our game moderator should be proud of this.

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Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie

I would like to congratulate H on banning Lava Dart. Our game moderator should be proud of this.

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I am. Lava Dart is awesome. :smile:

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Originally Posted by Reeplcheep

At the end of this we should have a vote for the worst card to get banned, winner gets brownie points

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Sea Drake must take the cake.

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Originally Posted by FTW

Sea Drake must take the cake.

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Sea Drake isn't banned... yet? And now I'm gonna be worried about you playing it for the rest of the season.

edit: It's not even a common lol

Also even though Reep's deck was illegal, it gets my vote for most creative this round. Really interesting idea

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Originally Posted by maxx!

Sea Drake isn't banned... yet? And now I'm gonna be worried about you playing it for the rest of the season.

edit: It's not even a common lol

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No, it's a throwback to an older found.

Asthereal managed to get it banned in the first round of our Vintage Bannathon, while Black Lotus+Laboratory Maniac+Force of Will was still legal. Sea Drake got banned before any Moxes, Mishra's Workshop, Balance, or Burning Inquiry. I still think that's the most impressive worst card banned.

Sea Drake is really worse than something like Mark of Fury?

Getting Sea Drake banned in that context is pretty impressive.

The list of cards we'll end up with from Pauper will have a lot of cards that seem really weak, will be interesting to see the final list. I'd say that so far, Mark of Fury and Soldevi Sentry stand out to me as weaker looking cards that have been banned.

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Originally Posted by FTW

Sea Drake must take the cake.

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That round was so broken that I was the only one who submitted a land card.

(Although Lab Maniac isn't even first-round material anymore, thanks to Thassa's Oracle.)

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Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie

That round was so broken that I was the only one who submitted a land card.

(Although Lab Maniac isn't even first-round material anymore, thanks to Thassa's Oracle.)

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Yeah, I kinda forgot about Lab Man that round and needed a solid wincon in blue. Sea Drake looked appealing. :laugh:

Fun fact: the more I think about Laboratory Maniac, the more I think it doesn't actually do anything in 4CB.
According to the wording of the card, I think its effect is a replacement effect for losing the game, causing you to win instead.
But in 4CB we don't actually lose the game for having to draw when we can't, so the effect shouldn't fire anyway.
I might be wrong in this though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Asthereal

Fun fact: the more I think about Laboratory Maniac, the more I think it doesn't actually do anything in 4CB.
According to the wording of the card, I think its effect is a replacement effect for losing the game, causing you to win instead.
But in 4CB we don't actually lose the game for having to draw when we can't, so the effect shouldn't fire anyway.
I might be wrong in this though.

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Well, I personally don't think we should be drawing cards for turns in 4CB, but that is neither here nor there. Lab Man likely "works" fine, because it is just conditionally replacing the card draw from an empty library with winning the game, it isn't conditional on replacing losing the game.

You can look at Pyramids Oracle text to see a creative use of replacement effects too, but Lab man isn't really do anything like that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Asthereal

Yeah, I kinda forgot about Lab Man that round and needed a solid wincon in blue. Sea Drake looked appealing. :laugh:

Fun fact: the more I think about Laboratory Maniac, the more I think it doesn't actually do anything in 4CB.
According to the wording of the card, I think its effect is a replacement effect for losing the game, causing you to win instead.
But in 4CB we don't actually lose the game for having to draw when we can't, so the effect shouldn't fire anyway.
I might be wrong in this though.

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It works just fine, it is replacing the card draw from an empty library, and card draws still happen.